Return to Transcripts main page
American Morning
Blackwater Shootings; Donda West Autopsy; Officer's Third Wife Exhumed
Aired November 14, 2007 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR (voice over): Unjustified. This morning, the FBI on the deadly Blackwater shooting in Iraq.
There goes the neighborhood. Think the mortgage crisis isn't your problem? How your home might be losing value, too.
Plus, ruffling feathers. Too many pigeons, too much mess. Looking for the best way to clean house on this AMERICAN MORNING.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHETRY: Welcome back. It is Wednesday, November 14th.
I'm Kiran Chetry.
T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm T.J. Holmes. And I am paying attention.
CHETRY: No, I wasn't worried you weren't.
HOLMES: Yes. We've been hanging out here for a little while, a couple of hours so far this morning, sitting in for John Roberts. He's up to something in Vegas. He's supposed to be preparing for the Democratic presidential debate, which I'm sure he'll be ready for tomorrow in Vegas.
CHETRY: Of course.
And we begin with breaking news this morning and a bombshell report for one of America's biggest security contractors in Iraq, Blackwater. Two months after employees shot and killed 17 civilians on a busy Baghdad street, word from the FBI that the majority of those victims should not have been targeted. All of this coming to light in a "New York Times" story out this morning.
CNN's Barbara Starr joins us live from the Pentagon with more details on that.
Hi, Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Kiran.
"The New York Times" is reporting that the Justice Department has found in its investigation of that Blackwater incident in September in Baghdad in which 17 Iraqi civilians were killed, 14 of the killings were not justified under the rules of self-defense, under the rules of using deadly force for contractors in Iraq. They may only use it in self-defense when they see an imminent threat. That, according to "The New York Times," which also says these findings are now under review by the Justice Department.
Now, Blackwater had said when the incident happened in September it was acting in self-defense, that it did feel there was an imminent threat from Iraqi civilians, from people in that area of Baghdad that they were operating in. The FBI says, no, perhaps three of the killings may have been justified, according to "The New York Times," because they may have perceived a threat from passing cars, but 14 of them, the FBI says, simply were not justified killings.
The question now, of course, is whether there will be evidence and witnesses able to come forward in a U.S. court to enable prosecution of this matter, if that's what it comes down to -- Kiran.
CHETRY: And then at the same time, you know, there have been promises to fix the problem, maybe some more oversight for contractors. Where do things stand?
STARR: Well, you know, Defense Secretary Gates here at the Pentagon and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice are still talking about how to fix all of it, working with military commanders in Baghdad. The idea is to give the military more coordination, more control over how contractors operate day to day on those very dangerous streets of Iraq. But they've been talking about it for quite a while, and while they're talking, the Iraqi government is passing new laws to restrict the ability of contractors and to bring them under the possibility of Iraqi law enforcement. And that the end of the day, that may be the real problem for American companies, whether they can find contractors who want to work in Iraq and be possibly subject to Iraqi law -- Kiran.
CHETRY: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon for us.
Thank you.
HOLMES: And a breaking story out of New York this morning. A plan to give drivers' licenses to illegal immigrants not going to happen. Governor Eliot Spitzer expected to officially drop the proposal today while he's in Washington meeting with his state congressional delegation. One Republican member of that group says it is good news.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. VITO FOSSELLA (R), NEW YORK: We cannot issue unsecured drivers' licenses that can be easily tampered with.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Well, the decision comes after weeks of intense attacks by critics, including our own Lou Dobbs, who said that the relaxed license requirement could produce voter fraud and raise national security issues. The governor responded to those attacks right here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. ELIOT SPITZER (D), NEW YORK: This has absolutely nothing to do with voting. This is something seven other states do for security. The director of Homeland Security has said we improve security by knowing who is there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: According to a recent poll, about 70 percent of New Yorkers were opposed to the license plan. It also became an issue during the last Democratic presidential debate. You may remember this.
Opponents attacked New York Senator Hillary Clinton for playing both sides of this issue. It may be a moot point now, just in time for the Democrats' next debate in Las Vegas, live tomorrow night right here on CNN.
And there will be elaborate swearing in ceremony at the Justice Department for Attorney General Michael Mukasey this morning. Mukasey officially took the oath Friday in a private service, so he is already on the job. And he did that so he could get security briefings. Mukasey is President Bush's third attorney general.
And prosecutors in Los Angeles say they will not file charges against a 10-year-old boy who admitted to starting a massive wildfire in southern California last month. They say the boy was playing with matches outside his house and accidentally ignited some brush. They say there is no evidence he did this on purpose.
The resulting Buckweed Fire burned 38,000 acres and destroyed 21 homes.
CHETRY: Well, it's time now to check in with our AMERICAN MORNING team of correspondents for other stories new this morning.
And stocks making a comeback yesterday with one of the best days this year for gains on the Dow.
Ali Velshi joins us now with more on whether this is just a one- day thing or whether we're seeing a little bit of an upturn.
ALI VELSHI, CNN SR. BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's a good question. We had a massive rally on the Dow yesterday, up 319 points, roughly. Take a look at how the major markets did.
The Dow had its second best day of the year. The best day of the year was when the Fed cut 50 basis points -- interest rates. So, you know, without that kind of catalyst to be up over 300 points is something.
The Nasdaq had a very strong say day. The S&P 500 had a very strong day. And it's nice to see this sort of in November, so that there's some chance that this could be an up trend toward the end of the year.
Another contributor to that was the price of oil, which as you can see behind me settled at $91.17. It was -- what is it today, Tuesday -- a week ago we were -- we were all looking at oil that was just about at $100, just within a couple bucks of a $100 a barrel. It's since been going the other direction.
We're still expecting gas prices to go up though over the next week and a half or so, just to catch up with the run-up in oil prices that we've seen over the last month and six weeks. So, you know, it's still doubtful, Kiran, whether this is the answer, whether one strong day on the markets is going to be the solution.
As of now we don't even know really how today is going to look. A lot of economic reports today. Ben Bernanke is testifying today. In about a half an hour we'll get inflation numbers and we will get, you know, other things that will contribute to the mix. But for now, investigators got a bit of a break yesterday and some nice big green arrows.
CHETRY: All right. Sounds good, Ali. Thanks so much.
Also new this morning, news about the death of Donda West, the mother of hip-hop star Kanye West, and also the doctor who performed her cosmetic surgery before she died.
Our Lola Ogunnaike joins us now with more on what we've learned this morning.
Hi there, Lola.
LOLA OGUNNAIKE, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Kiran. How are you?
So, we -- the autopsy report came in yesterday. The report is inconclusive as of now. We won't know exactly what killed her -- in only about six to eight weeks. That's when the toxicology report is due out, and then we'll know exactly what killed her.
Preliminary reports right now say that it appears to be that she may have perished because of a cosmetic surgery, but we do not know for now. It's inconclusive.
Meanwhile, information is coming out about the doctor who performed the surgery. His name is Dr. Jan Adams. He says that he is the one who gave Dr. Donda West both a tummy tuck and a breast reduction.
He is saying that she was fine when she left him. He released a statement yesterday and he's saying that -- you know, he expresses his condolences to the West family, but he's unable to talk about exactly what happened because of client confidentiality. But his record is being called into question right now.
Apparently, according to TMZ, he has had six malpractice suits filed against him since 2001. In 2001, he actually paid over $500,000 in medical fines. So -- and he also has two DWI convictions on his record as well.
And so it's not looking really good for him but, again, we don't know. We still have to wait for all of the facts. Everything is still inconclusive up until this point. We do know is that Dr. Donda West will be buried next Tuesday in Oklahoma City -- Kiran.
CHETRY: Lola Ogunnaike, thank you.
And Rob Marciano off today. We have Jacqui Jeras with us at our Weather Update Desk tracking extreme weather in the Midwest this morning.
Hey, Jacqui.
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hey, Kiran.
It's those winds again. The same pesky storm that brought all those winds to the Pacific Northwest is now hitting the Midwest with some incredible gusts.
Fifty to 60 miles per hour can be expected today. And take a look at all these advisories that are in effect.
You know, it doesn't include you here in Minneapolis or in the Des Moines area, but you still could see some gusts around 35 miles per hour. And that is enough to cause some delays potentially at the airport, so call ahead if you have some flights.
There you can see the winds across the region right now in the teens and 20s. So already starting to pick up.
All courtesy of this strong cold front that's on the move for today. And this is really going to be advancing throughout the day today.
As it does so, it's going to start to pick up a little bit of moisture from the Gulf of Mexico. And look at those warmer temperatures. We're looking at 60 right now in Indianapolis, and you can see we've got a little bit of cold air kind of lingering into the northeastern corridor.
Where those two meet we have got some fog, and that is in the Philadelphia area and also Newark. So we've got some ground delays.
Late today, that's when we're going to see the rain coming into the Southeast. And we sure do need it.
We'll talk more about that coming up at the bottom of the hour.
Back to you guys.
CHETRY: Jacqui, thanks a lot.
HOLMES: A police sergeant's fourth wife is missing. His third wife suffered a mysterious death. Now investigators have exhumed the body of that third wife, Kathleen Savio. CHETRY: And she was married to Drew Peterson until she drowned in a bathtub back in 2004. So will the body that has been exhumed now yield any new clues?
CNN's chief medical correspondent, Sanjay Gupta, also a certified medical examiner, joins us now with more on this situation.
It was ruled an accidental drowning back in 2004, but in light of the recent developments, which is that his current wife is missing, investigators want to re-examine whether or not she died -- and whether or not it was foul play.
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And, you know, exhuming a body is costly. It's rare. There's no question about it. There's only three reasons why it happens.
One is because there is some suspicion of foul play which didn't come to light in the original examination of the body. Two, are paternity issues. And three is for a transfer of remains.
This is not something that's commonly done, but, Kiran, we actually got our hands on the autopsy report, on the death certificate as well. And I've been looking at this, sort of taking some glances at it.
It was ruled a drowning. You know, that's the bottom line. But there are comments also made, official comments made on this particular autopsy report saying, for example, there was a laceration on the back of her head. But she was found face down in the tub.
There were some things that just didn't even seem to fit at the time of the original autopsy, which is why they probably decided to go ahead and do this to sort of find some more information if they can.
HOLMES: And what is that information? What exactly are they looking for this time, and why weren't they looking for it in the first place?
GUPTA: Well, there are certain things. I mean, when you examine a body second time, you might look for things like skeletal fractures, for example, trying to get a sense if there was trauma to this body, in addition to the fact that she may have drowned. Could two things have happened at the same time?
So, for example, if someone had a broken arm and a broken leg or something like that, you might see that on x-rays. So trauma.
Also something known as defensive injuries. Let's say someone is being attacked and they actually defend themselves, they stick their nails into somebody's skin. You might find some of that skin.
Now, if you weren't suspecting that this was trauma in the first place or some sort of homicide, you may not have necessarily looked for that. Also, some toxicology again.
They did do toxicology the first time around which I have here as well which was all negative. She didn't seem to have any of these substances in her body, but they can do some more detailed examination.
CHETRY: Bottom line, do you think they're going to get to the bottom of this or be able to prove anything at this late stage?
GUPTA: It's been three years, so the body has decomposed a fair amount, obviously. Soft tissue injuries are going to be almost impossible to find.
Some of those skeletal findings, actually looking at the bones, looking at the x-rays even on some of these bones, you might find something there. It's very hard, as you can imagine, three years later, but sufficient evidence -- or sufficient suspicion, I should say, to go ahead and do this anyway.
CHETRY: Sanjay, thank you.
GUPTA: Thank you.
CHETRY: By the way, if you have a question for Sanjay, e-mail us, CNN.com/am. Sanjay answers your questions every Thursday. That's tomorrow on AMERICAN MORNING.
HOLMES: All right.
You're making your mortgage payments. No problem. So the subprime crisis is not your issue.
Actually, it may be. It could take some money out of your pocket.
Our Gerri Willis tells us how. That's next on this AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Well, a second wave of damage is spreading out from the subprime mortgage failures.
CHETRY: Yes. Economists are predicting that millions of people will lose their homes to foreclosure and all of their neighbors will actually be hurt in the process as well.
HOLMES: Yes.
CNN personal finance editor Gerri Willis here now.
Always good to see you. Hello.
GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR: You know, I wish I had better news today. I really do.
HOLMES: Yes.
WILLIS: This is kind of -- this is disturbing, the numbers that we're seeing here. Some 45 million homeowners are going to find that their house is losing value because their neighbors have been foreclosed on.
You know how this works. A house goes into foreclosure, the maintenance is delayed. And before you know it, it looks bad and nobody wants to buy it in the neighborhood.
So 45 million homes are going to see some loss of value, as much as $223 billion all told. Now, you're probably wondering, what does that mean for the individual homeowner? Five thousand bucks off your home price if you live in one of these foreclosed neighborhoods.
CHETRY: So that really affects you if you're thinking about selling now. I mean, there is something to be said for waiting this out and hoping that we turn the corner?
WILLIS: Yes. Well, let me show you a couple of markets here that aren't doing so well.
The hardest hit will be California, New York, Florida. Look at the decrease in values here.
But to your point, Kiran, let's see, California, prices have gone up 90 percent in the past five years. So we could be crying over spilled milk. But the end of the day, sort of the unintended effect here, the thing that you might not think about, as these homes lose value the contribution to the local tax base also declines. That means not as many services.
Education not as good. Businesses may not want to come to these communities. People may not want to come to these communities. So it has a sort of rolling effect that becomes bigger and bigger like an echo.
HOLMES: And are you just stuck? There's really nothing you can do to combat it if your neighbor is not making their mortgage payment. You are -- you're stuck.
Is there anything you can do to combat this?
WILLIS: I don't think so. You know, look, you have to make sure you're making the right kinds of investments in your house and you're not over-investing, obviously.
But for a lot of people who have seen their values go up so much in a short period of time, it's not a terrible thing. It's not great, obviously. You don't want to see that happen, but it's not the end of the world.
HOLMES: Well, you've warned us that you didn't have better news.
We appreciate you, Gerri. Always good to see you.
WILLIS: Thank you.
HOLMES: Personal finance editor Gerri Willis. We'll see you again soon.
CHETRY: And your "Quick Hits" now.
The newest estimates says it will take five years to clean up that massive Black Sea oil spill. Thirty thousand birds have died since Sunday, when a tanker broke apart in a fierce storm. Eleven ships sank in that storm and more than 60 people died. Twenty others that are missing are presumed dead.
Also, in San Francisco Bay, radar failure may have caused a freighter to crash into the Bay Bridge last week, dumping the 58,000 gallons of fuel into the bay there. The pilot of the ship is saying that the radar "conked out" and that he turned to the Chinese ship captain to help him with a backup system.
He testified that instead of guiding him to aim for the center of the bridge span, the captain pointed him straight for the bridge tower. When a lookout called "Bridge tower" -- when a lookout called "Bridge tower dead ahead," they say it was too late to avoid that collision.
Well, a fake marriage takes down a former FBI and CIA agent. It turns out she faked the marriage to become a U.S. citizen, and investigators say that the law breaking did not stop there.
We'll have more details for you ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Five years ago, Megan Schank and her family did a reverse "Green Acres," leaving the country for the big city.
MEGAN SCHANK, RESIDENT: It was a drastic change, but we've really enjoyed it. We don't have to deal with traffic.
O'BRIEN: Megan lives in the heart of Atlanta in a place called Atlantic Station. Only 10 years ago it looked like this. The old abandoned Atlantic steel mill was a big eyesore and an environmental nightmare. Developers call sites like these brown fields.
JIM JACOBY, CHAIRMAN, THE JACOBY GROUP: This is the largest brown field redevelopment in the U.S.
O'BRIEN: Developer Jim Jacoby led this urban transformation, creating a 138-acre city within the city that not only cleaned up a big mess, but is designed with current and future environmental concerns in mind. He built residences in place where the soil was not contaminated.
Elsewhere, they hauled the tainted dirt away and brought in clean topsoil. They recycled what they could, including all the old concrete. And then they built a place where people live, work, shop and play. JACOBY: So it really is a gathering place, and I think people like the -- you know, the ability to have a place that we can go and gather and meet new friends.
O'BRIEN: That's what Jennifer Parrott likes about living here.
JENNIFER PARROTT, RESIDENT: Well, obviously it's close to everything. We can walk to the grocery store. We can walk to restaurants, movie theater. My fiance can walk to work.
O'BRIEN: Atlantic Station is proving there is a way to walk away from our car culture, and people who live here say they don't miss the alternative.
Miles O'Brien, CNN.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Here is a fishtail you've got to see to believe. This is our morning "Hot Shot."
A Louisiana medical student has some major bragging rights after catching this 359-pound grouper. He even laid down and posed with it.
It took him 15 to 20 minutes to reel in the fish. It set a state record, they say, but the world record is actually 436 pounds.
Either way, hats off. That will feed a lot of people this holiday season. Fifty-three pounds was the first filet they cut from that humongous fish.
So...
HOLMES: Blackening seasoning.
CHETRY: How about it?
Congratulations, by the way.
And if you've got a "Hot Shot," send it to us. The address is AMHotshots@CNN.com. Include your name, where you're from, a little bit about the picture or video, and please make sure the image is yours.
HOLMES: Yes. That's just a little detail, but it would be nice.
All right. We've been talking about this one this morning. A lot of us have been talking about it -- Kevin Colvin (ph), the college intern who got busted on his own Facebook profile.
CHETRY: Yes, because he told his boss that he had a family emergency and that he wasn't going to be making it into work.
HOLMES: Yes. CHETRY: Instead, he was at a Halloween party. And little did he know that his boss found this photo.
HOLMES: Oh, the picture tells the story.
CHETRY: We just lost the picture.
HOLMES: We just lost the picture.
CHETRY: No, it's back.
HOLMES: We got it back.
CHETRY: There it is. We just wanted to really make you wait. It was worth it, wasn't it?
HOLMES: I bet he wished we lost the picture.
CHETRY: Tinkerbell, what were you doing?
HOLMES: Yes.
VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is the money shot, and this guy is a huge fish on the Internet now. This picture is all over the Internet. This poor guy, Kevin Colvin (ph), 25,000 hits if you search under Google already.
We found it on a blog in Australia. That's how far this story has gotten. It definitely has some legs. Great stuff.
HOLMES: Oh my goodness.
CHETRY: So he's in trouble, huh?
DE LA CRUZ: And not a lot of sympathy out there for Kevin (ph). A lot of people think that he is getting his just desserts.
Our question to you this morning is, have you ever pulled a Kevin (ph)? Have you ever lied to get out of work?
Well, these are some of your e-mails. This one form someone who wants to remain anonymous.
This email writing, "My boss..."
HOLMES: Yes.
DE LA CRUZ: I know -- "... has let us know that if we are sick of working, than he would rather have us call in sick."
And then from Mark in Oklahoma City, who says, "I haven't called in sick, but I did call my boss one morning and said, 'I'm well today, and I won't be in.'"
So there you go. I guess that is the way to do it.
CHETRY: Honesty policy, right?
DE LA CRUZ: Yes. That's probably -- he is better off.
Checking the Quick Vote now, we asked, "Should your boss be able to fire you for something posted online?" Seventeen percent of you say yes, 83 percent of you say no.
And you can keep on sending us that email to am@cnn.com.
But like I was saying, you've got to feel sorry for Kevin Colvin (ph).
HOLMES: No.
CHETRY: Well, no.
DE LA CRUZ: No?
CHETRY: I mean, he posted the pictures on his Facebook profile, right? And then his boss did some checking, saw them. And...
(CROSSTALK)
DE LA CRUZ: What was his boss doing on Facebook?
CHETRY: Maybe seeing what Kevin (ph) was up to on Halloween.
HOLMES: Come on. Look at this. We can leave this up the rest of the show.
CHETRY: His boss (INAUDIBLE) a nice wand.
HOLMES: Just put a small box at the bottom of the screen and leave that the rest of the show.
DE LA CRUZ: No. Leave the poor guy alone.
CHETRY: There he is. Hey, it was just an internship, right?
DE LA CRUZ: He's just an intern, yes.
CHETRY: He'll do better when he's actually getting paid for his job maybe.
DE LA CRUZ: There you go.
CHETRY: Veronica, thanks.
Here's a quick look at a story coming up that you can't miss.
If you live in New York City you're probably used to dodging pigeons. You see them all over sidewalks, parks.
Do they have them in Atlanta?
HOLMES: We don't have this problem in Atlanta, no. CHETRY: Well, that's quite a problem, isn't it? They say that because people tend to overfeed the pigeons, they produce more waste and that it really is actually a health hazard for the city.
HOLMES: OK. And the city has a new proposal now to control the pigeon problem and scare them away.
What are they going to do?
CHETRY: We're going to find out in a second.
HOLMES: Just put up a big picture of Kevin (ph) -- I'm on this kid, I know. I'm sorry.
All right. That story and headlines coming your way when AMERICAN MORNING returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: A live picture of my current hometown, Atlanta, Georgia.
I'm missing Atlanta right now, but you all have got nice digs up here. This is nice. Look at this.
CHETRY: So you could get used to this, huh?
HOLMES: I don't want to get back.
Yes, Atlanta, mid-50s right now. Nice and sunny, expecting mid- 70s, I believe, today. We don't necessarily need that, because we need it to be cloudy and rainy there in Atlanta with the water shortage. An emergency going on really there with the water problems, but expecting possibly some rain tonight, over the next day or so hopefully.
And they've been praying for it, Kiran.
CHETRY: That's right, they've been praying for it.
HOLMES: It's that serious.
CHETRY: And it looks like there are some thunderstorms in the forecast this evening. So keep your fingers crossed.
HOLMES: Yes. Prayers being answered.
All right, folks. It's Wednesday, November the 14th.
John Roberts on assignment, getting ready for the Democratic presidential debate in Las Vegas.
So in the meantime, I'm keeping the chair warm. I'm T.J. Holmes.
CHETRY: Well, good to have you with us today, T.J.
HOLMES: All right. CHETRY: And I'm Kiran Chetry.
And new this morning, keeping the pressure on Pakistan. The White House says it will send Deputy Secretary of State John Negroponte to Pakistan on Friday with a message -- end emergency rule and hold free and fair elections. Right now the vital ally in the war on terror is under martial law. President Pervez Musharraf has suspended Pakistan's constitution and is refusing calls to step down.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERVEZ MUSHARRAF, PAKISTANI PRESIDENT: That I should stay at all. That option is available it me, but should it be given up now and we will have better Pakistan or a stabler Pakistan? And we can have very good elections without me, very good. Maybe I made that decision.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: Police have tossed lawyers and critics behind bars and Musharraf's most prominent political opponent, Benazir Bhutto, is barricaded in her home still.
Well, democrats say they will put a stop on payments for the war in Iraq if troops don't start coming home by a certain time. Congress could vote by the end of the week on a $50 billion proposal to fund the war with strings attach and would require the war to be over by next Christmas. The latest fight comes over money as a new report is out that puts $1.6 trillion price tag on the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. Those are numbers the White House says were tallied by partisan democrats on the joint economic committee.
HOLMES: The former CIA and FBI agent resigned after she was caught faking a marriage to get U.S. citizenship. Nada Prouty came to the U.S. from Lebanon in 1989 and then a year later she paid a man to marry her so she could become a U.S. citizen. She joins the FBI in 1999 and moved to the CIA in 2003. While working for the FBI, Prouty improperly searched a computer database for information about her relatives, links that they may have had to Hezbollah but the FBI says there's no evidence Prouty was working as a spy.
The search for a police officer's fourth wife has led investigators to his third wife's grave. Authorities exhumed and conducted and autopsy on the body of Kathleen Savio. Her death was ruled accidental when she was found in a bathtub in 2004. Last night on "Nancy Grace," family and friends said Kathleen Savio's relationship with Drew Peterson was an abusive one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOICE OF SUSAN DOMAN, KATHLEEN SAVIO'S SISTER: We told our ourselves, you know, we told our sister we're bringing you back again. Hopefully we're going to be getting peace and find out what happened to you but it's so hard, so hard.
MIKE: Has the family always thought that her death was no accident?
DOMAN: Yes, Mike, we have always thought that. And just with everything going on with Drew and my sister and my sister telling me also all the time that, you know, like everyone has heard before that it was going to look like an accident and he was going to kill her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Well, the Illinois police sergeant is now considered a suspect in the disappearance of his wife Stacy, a mother of two young children, who vanished October 29th. He told police that she left him for another man.
CHETRY: The story - first of all, we're going to talk about a case of a border security that was brought, taken a little bit too far. A Canadian fire truck responding to a fire in New York from Quebec was stopped at the border for eight long minutes while the fire burned. U.S. border authorities were trying to clear up a concern about one of the firefighters. The border agency could not elaborate on what the issue was. Two other fire trucks responding did make it through the border checkpoint in about two minutes. No one was seriously injured in the fire but the restaurant that was caught fire ended up being destroyed.
A federal appeals court telling the navy to soften the effect that sonar has on whales and other marine life. A lawsuit by the Natural Resources Defense Council claim that high powered sonar causes whales to beach themselves. The navy says it needs the high-powered sonar because more nations are requiring quiet, hard to detect submarines.
HOLMES: All right. Listen to this one, folks. Former Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, of course, she stepped down from the bench to care for her husband who suffers from Alzheimer's disease. CNN affiliate KPNX reports that John O'Connor now in love with another woman at the residential care facility where he lives and that his wife is happy for him.
CHETRY: Yes, they described it as a feeling of relief after a lot of pain for her husband. Well, what causes Alzheimer's disease to forget their spouses and actually fall in love with someone else? We're joined by chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. And this really does shed some light, Sandra Day O'Connor's family being public about this, about, you know, the emotional toll that this devastating disease takes on families.
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's one of those things, I don't think there's a lot of data on this sort of thing, Kiran. But essentially, if you look at dementia overall, ravaging of the brain in terms of Alzheimer's, in terms of memory, what exactly does it do for your overall quest for intimacy? It's a much more primitive area of the brain and is that preserved in some way even though there's a loss of memory? That's what a lot of people speculate, we don't know for sure but there is a lot of evidence that dementia for example, you sort of you start anew. For example, you might star your life anew with regards to overall thinking. You know, you have remnants of your old life but you're starting a new life. Your residential care facility is now your entire new world. So, you know, this new person in his life, it could be just that is his new world and he has forgotten his old life altogether.
CHETRY: Shocking though, you know, you spend all this time with a spouse years and years together. I can't imagine how painful it must be that they have no memory of you and just sort of move on to someone else.
GUPTA: And you know, exactly as you guys said, Sandra O'Connor says she feels relieved in a way. We do know some other things with regard to John O'Connor, he was depressed. He was even suicidal according to his son and then he found this new love in his life, so much so it improved his life that maybe that is the why the former supreme court justice is relieved for him. I never recommend movies at all but there was a movie I watched once called "Away from her," which is almost this exact story line. It was at the Vancouver Film Festival. It's about the exact situation where it was a gut-wrenching decision to move this woman into a care facility and she falls in love with somebody else and her husband finally comes to terms with it. It's art, you know, imitates life here.
CHETRY: It is. It's unbelievable. And as we said, she is publicly talking about this and all too common, apparently among Alzheimer's patients.
GUPTA: (inaudible) I mean, Alzheimer's is something that's obviously increasing in numbers and we may see more things like this and there'll be more studies on this for sure.
CHETRY: Sanjay, thank you.
HOLMES: All right. Sanjay, thank you.
CHETRY: Well, if you have a question for Dr. Gupta, e-mail us Noncom/am. Sanjay will answer your questions when he opens up his mailbag tomorrow on AMERICAN MORNING.
HOLMES: And it comes at you from all directions in New York City. I'm talking about pooh. You got to watch where you step and look out what is flying overhead. That is what we're talking about right there. There is a proposal to make pigeons less active in that pooh department. Why feeding them could cost you. That's ahead on this AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: 20 shots fired. And an unarmed teen dead in New York City. New controversy swirling around this story this morning. 18- year-old Khiel Coppin had no weapon on him and had a hand brush. The city's police commissioner was quick to defend the officers involved yesterday. Some including, his family saying it was just too quick. Coppin's stepfather, Reginald Owens joins us now along with the family attorney, Paul Wooten. First, thank you all for being here. Sorry for your loss, sir. Tell me, just the reaction. What possibly could go through the family's mind when they first heard 20 shots, teen dead unarmed and then, I guess 24 hours later, to have the police commissioner come out and say the officers acted in a reasonable fashion?
REGINALD OWENS, STEPFATHER OF KHEIL COPPIN: Well, since I've accepted Jesus Christ as my lord and savior who is my rock and my salvation, my chief cornerstone, I teach my children likewise. When I heard about the call, I was at work and I work with those who are so- called developmentally disabled and they have problems mentally like Khiel has. We are taught and trained not to use excessive force in dealing with them and that is why I was so and I am still upset by the use of excessive force in this situation.
HOLMES: Is that something the police just did not know? Do you think they should have...
OWENS: No they knew because we called. His mother called the mental health emergency unit to come out to the house so that is why she was on the phone with 911. Prior to that, when she called the unit, the mental health unit, they came out. But Khiel has stepped out of the house and they were not patient enough to wait.
HOLMES: You mentioned the call that his mother made. Let's take a listen to the 911 call and what police say can be heard and what some of the officers were thinking certainly when they got to the scene. Let's take a quick listen.
(BEGIN AUDIOTAPE)
911 OPERATOR: What happened there?
BACKGROUND MALE VOICE: I've got a gun!
FEMALE CALLER: This, you know ... this kid is a problem. You can even hear him?
BACKGROUND MALE VOICE: Take that, I've got a gun.
911 OPERATOR: Who is that?
FEMALE CALLER: That's supposed to be my son.
BACKGROUND MALE VOICE: I've got a gun.
911 OPERATOR: That's your son?
FEMALE CALLER: Got no respect. You know, I can't deal with this tonight.
BACKGROUND MALE VOICE: I gotta gun.
HOLMES: All right. Attorney, Mr. Wooten here, the police arrived. They hear there is someone there with a gun, they have a young man, who by many accounts, witness' accounts is coming out. He has something, they can't tell what and going towards police and he is not obeying their commands. Is that not reasonable for the police to believe that their lives are in danger?
PAUL WOOTEN, ATTORNEY FOR OWENS FAMILY: Now, there are two very important points here. Because what the police commissioner has done is he has taken the 911 tape. He has blared it in the media. That is only a very, very small portion of this investigation. The fact remains is that Mrs. Owens told the police officers on at least two occasions, which she put in her statement that she gave the police that night that she told police officers that her son was unarmed and didn't have a gun. When police officers came to the home that night and she met them at the door with her daughter, she told the two officers at the door when they arrived my son does not have a gun. That was in her statement that night. The police commissioner didn't say anything about that.
HOLMES: But should they ...
WOOTEN: No, let me just make ...
HOLMES: Go ahead.
WOOTEN: Second point, on the 911 tape, OK? She was clear in telling them that when his son said he had a gun, she said he's being silly, that's not true. That doesn't come through in the commissioner's investigation. So our concern is is that there has been a rush of judgment by the police commissioner. The D.A. has an independent investigation. He hasn't made any statements. He is going through the motions. And he is trying to do this in a very, very clear and thorough manner.
HOLMES: OK. I'm going to have to wrap up here with you all but is a lawsuit here in the future for the family?
WOOTEN: There is a very, very distinct possibility that a civil lawsuit will be filed but, nonetheless, what we've been waiting for is to see what the criminal justice system is going to complete here. And our most important concern is is that if the police is not going to cooperate with the D.A., then perhaps we're not going to get a thorough investigation on the local level and perhaps we need to talk to the governor about appointing a special prosecutor or even suggesting that the Justice Department to an independent investigation.
HOLMES: All right. No matter what, there is a young man who is dead here and a tragic story. Sorry for your loss and for your family's loss, but Reginald Owens, Paul Wooten, thank you all for coming in. Sorry I had to see you under these circumstances. Thank you so much for being here.
We want to point out as well that we did invite the New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly to come on to discuss this case but he declined our invitation.
We will turn to CNN NEWSROOM, coming up in just a few minutes.
My man, Tony Harris at the CNN Center.
TONY HARRIS, CNN, ANCHOR: That's what I'm talking about.
HOLMES: A look at what is coming up at the top of the hour. Tony, good morning. Good to see you.
HARRIS: Good to see you, T.J.. These stories coming up in the NEWSROOM for you.
New York's governor walking away from a controversial plan he wanted to give illegal immigrants driver's licenses.
Did airport screeners know ahead of time undercover security checks are coming? Congress asking that question today.
And we talk with a professor who is making his dream happen. Laptops for every child across the planet. A hand crank is available if there is no electricity. Let's see. Ghosts, crashes, fist fights, we'll even work in some breaking news. NEWSROOM gets started at the top of the hour, just minutes away, right here on CNN. T.J., back to you in New York City.
HOLMES: The fist fight sounds like a typical day there in the CNN NEWSROOM.
HARRIS: That's it.
HOLMES: Tony, good to see you.
Rudy Giuliani coming out with his first TV ads that promote his work as mayor of this city, New York City.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUDY GIULIANI (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: By the time I left office, New York City was being proclaimed as the best example of conservative government in the country. We turned it into the safest largest city in America, the welfare to work capital of America and most importantly the spirit of the people of the city had changed. Instead of being hopeless the large majority of people had hope, so I believe I've been tested in a way in which the American people can look to me, they're not going to find perfection, but they're going to find somebody who has dealt with crisis almost on a regular basis and has had results.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: That ad will be running where else, New Hampshire, this week. All democratic candidates for president are heading to Las Vegas for the next CNN democratic debate. And our very own John Roberts is asking the questions. He will be back reporting live from Vegas tomorrow right here on AMERICAN MORNING and you can watch the democratic debate hosted by Wolf Blitzer and it kicks off tomorrow night at 8:00 p.m. Eastern time.
Well, the big shopping day known as black Friday just around the corner. If you want to stick around, we're going to tell you how you can find out which stores are offering the best deals ahead of time.
And it's been a past time in Central Park for decades. But, soon, feeding the pigeons could get you into a lot of trouble. Kiran has made her way outside to the park to hear the new pigeon plan up ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Welcome back. We're standing right outside here of the Time Warner Center in one of the most popular places of New York City, Columbus Circle. Central Park right over there. And of course, what would Central Park be without pigeons, right? There are pigeons everywhere in the area. And there's a look right now just a few feet away from me. Well, you know the humble pigeon is now the target though of a proposed feeding ban in New York City and if it goes through, anyone who is caught feeding the pigeons will get a thousand dollar fine. Joining me now to talk more about it is Councilman Simcha Felder, you're the man behind the ban. Thanks for being with us.
Thanks for having me. Good morning.
CHETRY: Why did you make this proposal? What is the problem with pigeons?
SIMCHA FELDER, NYC COUNCILMAN: I think people are sick and tired of having to be pooped upon, walk in the stuff and make sure to clean their cars and just the quality of life. Besides the health hazards that are involved, the damage to infrastructure, and so on and so forth. It's a simple thing. You like pigeons, take one home and let it crap all over your living room. If you like to feed them, don't do it on the city streets.
CHETRY: Now, first of all, how would this ban work? The city would ticket people?
FELDER: The simple ban. If you're feeding pigeon on the city streets you would be fined a thousand bucks. I don't think that we're going to have hundreds of tickets. Once the word gets out, then we issue a few summonses. People will feed pigeons elsewhere and not in the middle of places where children and adults walk by on a regular basis.
CHETRY: You know, I don't live far from here. We do see people that are feeding the pigeons on a pretty regular basis, they appear to be homeless, actually. How would you, you know, I guess collect on that or how would you enforce it when some of the people feeding pigeons may not have the means to pay a fine?
FELDER: Excuse me but if they are homeless people they deserve to have a place to live. The ban on pigeons will have a multiple purpose, we'll get them someplace to live. The issue of the pigeon feeding is generally throughout the city, people feed pigeons all the time. They never feed them at their own homes, they feed them elsewhere and they're really driving people in the city crazy. CHETRY: You can see on this statue alone there is a little guy perched right there or maybe it's a big guy because he is getting feathers bread all over the place and pigeon droppings. It's not the most sightly thing. And there are other big cities that have dealt with this as well. I think Los Angeles proposed some sort of plan to try to do birth control for the pigeons. There was another city that talked about trying to do things like stealing eggs and replacing them. I mean, what do you say to the critics who say we have so much more to worry about in New York City than some pigeon poop?
FELDER: Well, I would say that the city council has to deal with the things we can deal with and what we can deal with is improving the quality of life for people throughout the city. It's a great city. People go through a lot to live here. They don't have to succumb to pigeons pooping on their heads and walking into this stuff all the time. It's just not the way it should be.
CHETRY: So, let me ask you a question. Is this still going through, this is a proposed ban, right?
FELDER: We're going to have a hearing and the hearing will cover wastebaskets as well. I know you can see that pigeons at night, if they want to go out for a date, they don't have to go to Radio City, they just go to the corner garbage fan to have a feast! That's not the way it should be.
CHETRY: All right. So, you're going to make sure that you offer people fair warning. Don't feed the pigeons or you're facing a thousand dollar fine, if this thing passes here in Manhattan.
FELDER: Absolutely.
CHETRY: Simcha Felder, councilman, thanks for joining us to talk more about it. We appreciate it.
FELDER: Thank you for having me.
CHETRY: All right, T.J. There you have it.
HOLMES: All right. He didn't want to do the pigeon birth control? Huh?
CHETRY: No. And don't even think about feeding the pigeons out here as you're visiting New York City this week.
HOLMES: I will not. Cannot afford the fine. Kiran, thank you so much, kind ma'am. And now, we do have a quick look at what CNN NEWSROOM is working on for the top of the hour.
HARRIS: See these stories in the CNN NEWSROOM. No justification for the deaths of 14 Iraqi civilians. The reported FBI finding in its Blackwater shooting investigation. New York governor dropping his plan to give illegal immigrants a driver's license.
A Las Vegas judge expected to decide today whether O.J. Simpson will stand trial. And a blue blob haunts a gas station. NEWSROOM, just minutes away, at the top of the hour, on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Yes, it's time to think about holiday shopping. Veronica de la Cruz and I, we already have our plans.
VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: We do?
HOLMES: On black Friday.
DE LA CRUZ: Oh, on black Friday. Well, you know, Christmas is 40 days away. So, if you want to start thinking about your shopping.
HOLMES: You've got a countdown already.
DE LA CRUZ: 40 days away. I've got it on my calendar, you know. Crossing off the dates.
HOLMES: All right but there are other ways, the other things people need to know about?
DE LA CRUZ: Yes, nine days until black Friday. It's the day after Thanksgiving, our retailers try to lure consumers in with those super low prices. Head to the web to get the scoop on all the deals. Because some of the info is leaked ahead of black Friday. You can actually sign up to get e-mail alerts when stores post new bargains. Getting a heads up obviously on which store has the best prices can help you T.J. set up your plan of attack at the mall because I know you're going to the mall, November 23rd.
HOLMES: I will, always.
DE LA CRUZ: One of the most popular black Friday website, bfads.net, which has created a version that sends alerts to your mobile device. It also lets you filter and search for sale items and view and edit your shopping lists, all of many while you're on the go. So, pretty handy. Some retailers aren't too happy about it. Lawyers for Wal-mart have sent several web sites warnings that early ad postings will result in criminal penalties. So, bfads.net, a good web site that you want to check out.
HOLMES: All right.
DE LA CRUZ: And another story we've been following T.J. ahead of the holiday season reports of some retailers taking advantage of consumers. People have been blogging about this switch.com report. A Best buy in New Jersey has been faking a Nintendo Wii shortage. Apparently, an employee walked through the store, T.J., announcing their holding the last Wii so people rush to buy it and then with this, and then they do the same thing 30 minutes later.
HOLMES: Why? It's not like you have a shortage of people who want these things.
DE LA CRUZ: I'm trying to sell the Wii. I do have to say that Best Buy didn't return any of our calls or e-mails.
HOLMES: No kidding?
DE LA CRUZ: The bottom line here is we're going to try to help you get your shopping done with tips from the web. This holiday season we're going to be talking about it on AMERICAN MORNING. You can also head online to get all the info, that address is cnn.com/am. And I have to say it's been good seeing you.
HOLMES: Good to see you again. Good to work with you again.
DE LA CRUZ: Good to see you in the Big Apple.
HOLMES: It's been a while but, yes, enjoying the Big Apple.
DE LA CRUZ: See you this weekend.
HOLMES: Yes, we are working together this weekend in Atlanta. I have only two minutes left here in New York on the air. So let me try to do a good job on this last story.
Some people like the fumes of the gas station may be a bit too much? Inhaling a little bit too much of it? Witnesses at Ohio pump say they really saw a ghost and they say they have the surveillance video to prove it. Is this proof? Is that evidence? Anybody? A blue cloud. Nobody knows exactly what this is. But people there have their theories.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I watched it for half an hour. And then actually I see it move and that is when I really got freaked out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, is that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It actually looks like a plastic bowl to me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Angels. There is an angel here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This was like an old Indian reservation from what I understand.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Well, not clear whether people actually saw it with their own eyes. Just on this videotape, who knows. I know who is not a believer, Kiran Chetry, who is outside with the pigeon poop. Are they still pooping out there, Kiran?
CHETY: Well, yeah, probably. Let me check. No, they seem to have left for a while. By the way, I say, I do believe. I do believe, it was a blue plastic bag. How about that one? But hey, before we leave you, T.J., drum roll, please.
HOLMES: All right.
CHETRY: This one's for the ladies. "People" magazine out with the cover of the sexiest man alive. That's of course the huge issue.
HOLMES: I'm not interested in this.
CHETRY: And the winner this year. Let's take a look at the cover. Well, OK, maybe not you but I know the ladies are. Matt Damon taking on the top prize. "People" staff writers say Damon turned them down at first. How humble? See, that's sexy. He said he got a huge kick out of the nod. He said that the magazine "gave an aging suburban dad an ego boost of a lifetime." Some of the runners up, David Beckham, Brad Pitt, and Patrick Dempsey. So, hat's off to you, Matt Damon.
And that's going to do it for us. T.J., great seeing you today.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.voxant.com
