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Travel Update; Trouble in Toyland: Protecting Littlest Consumers; A Pastor's Dark Secret; Heart Disease Warning for Women Under 45; Called to Account: Khmer Rouge War Crimes Hearing
Aired November 20, 2007 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon, live at the CNN world headquarters in Atlanta.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Kyra Phillips.
You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.
LEMON: And all that weather we told you about could make things much worse for travelers as more planes fill the sky and more cars hit the road.
Let's go straight to the CNN weather center, where Chad Myers and our Jacqui Jeras are teaming up to bring you the very latest on this.
Hello there, tag team.
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hey.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hi, Don.
(WEATHER REPORT)
MYERS: There was some airport delays this morning because of fog, Jacqui, and I think they're still there, aren't they?
JERAS: Yes. There are, particularly in the east.
The western delays, however, for the most part, have cleared up.
MYERS: Right.
JERAS: So let's go ahead and show you what we've got going on airport by airport, where the delays are at this hour. And the worst of it really has been concentrated in the Northeast and the Midwest.
Right now, Chicago, O'Hare, you're dealing with delays of about an hour and 30 minutes. New York City, LaGuardia, about an hour and 25, an hour and 20 minutes. For Newark, Philadelphia, an hour an 25 minutes. And you can see here over an hour now, and those delays are increasing for you, unfortunately, in the Richmond area.
Yes, we've got to use two pages of delays to get through them all today. Boston, 40 minutes. Kodiak, yes, in Alaska...
MYERS: I've never ever seen Kodiak, Alaska, on the map, ever! JERAS: I haven't either. We're covering everybody though. We don't want to forget our friends in Alaska and Hawaii. We are watching things for you as well.
Las Vegas, that's your only western delay other than Alaska at 45 minutes. JFK, ground delays at 15 minutes.
And I love it when I see a delay of only three minutes, Teterboro. Now, that's something I think most people could handle.
OK. Delays expected again tomorrow in the big metro airports across the Northeast. Also, those of you heading to Montreal or Toronto can expect delays. Problems could be rough going again in Chicago, Detroit, rain changing to snow -- Cleveland, Cincinnati.
The southeastern quarter, mostly good, but you get to the Gulf Coast states there and you're looking at 30 minutes to an hour. Denver, delays at 15 to 30 minutes because of snow tomorrow. And those fog delays you were talking about, Chad, in Los Angeles this morning, we could see those again tomorrow morning, about 15 to 30 minutes, and, you know, say by noonish you're looking a lot better.
MYERS: You know, I'm noticing for that, too, for tomorrow, the hubs. How are the hubs going to do?
You know, Houston a big hub, rain there. Atlanta looks OK. Atlanta -- Delta is going to be OK getting in and out.
JERAS: Right.
MYERS: But it depends on where your plane transfers and where it connects, whether you're going to have a plane or not.
JERAS: Chicago, Detroit, both big hubs. And we think there will trouble there tomorrow, too.
MYERS: OK.
Guys, back to you.
LEMON: Don't call...
MYERS: Us?
LEMON: ... Jacqui and Chad. Call your carrier.
JERAS: Just the messengers, by the way.
PHILLIPS: Doesn't it look like Chad is, like, bellied up to the bar there, ready to order a Thanksgiving cocktail? There you go.
Jacqui, you want to shake him one up?
JERAS: Here's a salt shaker. How about that?
(LAUGHTER) LEMON: All right, buys. Nice work though. Thank you very much.
MYERS: You're welcome, guys.
PHILLIPS: All right. Chicago O'Hare's International Airport is one of the world's busiest airports, and it's expected to be pretty packed through the holidays.
We want to check in now with CNN's Susan Roesgen. She is there.
It was pretty calm for a while, Susan. What do you think? Is it picking up?
SUSAN ROESGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, it's still pretty calm. You know, here I am in these long, you know, kind of cattle ways that you put you to feed you through the security lines, but it's moving pretty quickly.
So quickly, in fact, that I've been going up and down taking this informal poll.
Stuffing or dressing?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Huh?
ROESGEN: Do you say stuffing or dress in your turkey?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dressing.
ROESGEN: Dressing. OK.
You must be from the South. Stuffing or dressing?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stuffing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stuffing.
ROESGEN: Stuffing.
I think this is a northeastern crowd, Kyra.
Do I hear another dressing? I heard another dressing, all right. Some more southerners.
Stuffing or dressing?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What?
ROESGEN: Stuffing or dressing in your turkey?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, actually, I'm a vegetarian. So...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stuffing.
ROESGEN: Stuffing. OK.
(LAUGHTER)
ROESGEN: Kyra...
PHILLIPS: What did she say?
ROESGEN: Can you imagine -- you know, usually if a reporter came up to me in one of these lines, I would be like, get away, you know, I'm so busy here. I just -- you know, these lines, you've just got to keep moving, moving, moving or you miss your plane, but you can see that they are moving really well today.
They've got lots of extra space. They are expecting 200,000 passengers to go home for Thanksgiving to eat stuffing or dressing, but, again, in spite of the flight delays that we've talked about all day today, the lines at security, at least here at the American Airlines terminal where I am, Kyra, are moving pretty well.
Dressing. What do you think, Kyra?
PHILLIPS: I was just going to ask you, stuffing or dressing?
ROESGEN: Hey, you know, my New Orleans roots come through. I'm afraid it's dressing for me, oyster cornbread dressing.
LEMON: There you go. All right.
PHILLIPS: All right. Very good.
I'm actually -- my stuffing -- I call it that -- has a little bit of a New Orleans flavor to it, so I'll give you...
ROESGEN: OK.
PHILLIPS: You probably already know it, but I'll forward the recipe to you.
ROESGEN: Well, you know, as slow as it is out here, I'm going to start asking people for the recipes. So I'll check back with you later and let you know if it picks up.
PHILLIPS: Sounds good. I can just see you'll have a feast in about five minutes.
Susan, thanks.
LEMON: Does it include shrimp or crawfish or gizzards?
PHILLIPS: No, I would love to get -- I can't find good crawfish in Atlanta.
LEMON: Really?
PHILLIPS: Yes. Any advice?
LEMON: I'll get my mom to hook you up.
PHILLIPS: There we go. Get your mom to send us some from Baton Rouge.
LEMON: We certainly will. We're going to get -- send some hot ice -- what do you call that, dry ice?
PHILLIPS: Dry ice.
LEMON: Yes, that's it.
All right. Let's turn now -- we're going to turn the tables here and talk about kids in danger. Millions of toys recalled, but one state has decided that's not good enough.
CNN's Alina Cho has more on how California is looking out for the littlest consumers.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: California is the first state to take action. Its attorney general says toys companies knowingly exposed children to lead and failed to warn them about the risks. Now, that warning is actually required under the state's Safe Drinking Water and Toxic Enforcement Act, otherwise known as Proposition 65.
It says that businesses cannot expose people to hazardous chemicals without posting a warning. Now, among those named in the suit, 20 companies in all, including Mattel, the nation's biggest toy company, and retailers including Wal-Mart, Target and Toys "R" Us.
ROCKARD J. DELGADILLO, LOS ANGELES CITY ATTORNEY: This lawsuit I think will allow us to put in place procedures, protocols that will work to keep our kids in a safe place and out of harm's way with respect to lead.
CHO: The suit comes on the heels of what some have called the year of the recall. Millions of toys have been called back this year and parents say they're pleased with this latest action.
BETH COFER, SANTA MONICA, CALIFORNIA: As a parent, you know, there's no level of safety that you won't take for your child, and so I think it's really good. I mean, the toy companies might feel like they are going a bit overboard, but I think that it's absolutely necessary for the safety of our kids.
CHO: In a statement to CNN, Toys "R" Us said the company shares the California attorney general's commitment to product safety and that it's put in place what it calls a no-quibble return policy, taking back toys regardless of whether or not they were bought at Toys "R" Us.
Now, if the suit is successful, the companies could each be fined $2,500 per toy sold per day. It could amount to millions of dollars in fines.
Alina Cho, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE) PHILLIPS: And before you buy any more toys you might want to take a look at this list. It's the annual 10 worst compiled by the toy safety group World Against Toys Causing Harm.
Here's the list: Go Diego Go. It's Animal Rescue boat by Fisher- Price. It's been recalled because of the lead paint. Sticky Stones, that group points out that if the magnetized stones are swallowed they could stick together inside a child's intestines.
Jack Sparrow's Spinning Dagger. It's seen as an eye hazard. Listen to the title. That's a no-brainer.
The group found that Dora the Explorer Lamp by Funhouse could cause electric shocks and burns.
And Lil "Giddy Up" Horse -- Lil "Giddy Up" Horse -- all right, I'm sorry. These are kind of funny -- contains fibers and small parts that could be a choking hazard. That's not funny.
Spider Man 3 New Goblin Sword by Hasbro is made of rigid plastic which the group worries might cause injury. The same with Hip Hoppa by Spin Master. It's a combination foot board and bouncing ball that children jump on.
Then there's a balloon-like toy that children blow up out of a tube. It's called B'Loomies Party park. The group put (INAUDIBLE) on the list also because its tiny pacifier could be swallowed.
And the Rubber Band Shooter. Hey, we used to do this in grade school, Don, because it could cause eye injuries.
Sorry. It's really not a funny story.
LEMON: What happened to Easy Bake and Barbie, right?
PHILLIPS: Just the titles. Yes, really, what's happened to the Easy Bake Oven and the Burping Baby and, you know, simple...
LEMON: Absolutely. OK.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: OK. We're celebrating a holiday here, but there's lot's happening over in the Middle East...
PHILLIPS: Operation.
LEMON: ... a security situation in Iraq, apparently. It will draw the United States and Iran into another round of face-to-face talks. The U.S. has accepted an Iraqi proposal for the talks to be held in Baghdad. The proposed meeting would be between the U.S. ambassador to Iraq, Ryan Crocker, and his Iranian counterpart.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEAN MCCORMACK, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: Iraqis approached both sides with the suggestion that it was -- would be the appropriate time to get together once again via that channel that is opened between Ambassador Crocker and his counterpart. We said yes, that we would agree to that.
We have communicated to the Iranian government that we are agreeable to that. We have not yet received back a reply either directly or via the Iraqis. As we said, we are open to using this channel as a way of talking directly about important issues concerning security in Iraq.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: In previous rounds of talks between the two sides, Iran rejected U.S. claims that it is supporting insurgent groups in Iraq with bomb-making materials that kill American troops.
PHILLIPS: Most days people call him "Senator," but today he's more like the Maytag repairman. Virginia Democrat Jim Webb briefly sat in the Senate chambers all by himself while his fellow lawmakers enjoy the long Thanksgiving weekend somewhere else. It was Senator Harry Reid's idea.
The majority leader wants to prevent President Bush from filling any vacancies without Senate approval. Anyone remember John Bolton?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JIM WEBB (D), VIRGINIA: The Constitution allows the president under certain circumstances to make appointments when the Congress isn't in session in order for the government to function, but that this president has abused the intentions of that provision in the Congress, just as this president has pushed the envelope with respect to executive power in areas like the Iraq war and wire tapping and a lot of other areas. So it's totally appropriate for me to have to get dressed up this morning and come in here and bang a gavel and preserve the constitutional process.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Webb's explanation was longer than today's 30-second session. Other senators will assume guard duty on Friday.
LEMON: His nephew is really his son. A well-known preacher's family's secrets come to the surface.
PHILLIPS: They should be in the prime of life, but more women near 45 are falling prey to a deadly predator.
LEMON: And she mentored him, managed him, made him what he is. Now Kanye West says a final good-bye to his mom.
You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK) PHILLIPS: Well, a mega church here in Atlanta shaken to its core by a sex scandal. A court-ordered paternity test has now revealed a secret hidden for decades.
LEMON: That's absolutely right, Kyra. The church's 80-year-old leader, Archbishop Earl Paulk, slept with his brother's wife and fathered a child by her. It's not the first sex scandal involving Paulk, but this time he could be in trouble with the law for lying under oath about that affair.
Well, the child, D.E. Paulk, who's now the 34-year-old head pastor of the church is actually Paulk's son, not his nephew, as earlier claimed.
He joins us now live.
And I guess the first question both of us want to know, oh, my gosh, what happened and how did you find out?
REV. D.E. PAULK, SR. PASTOR CATHEDRAL AT CHAPEL HILL: Well, I found out through a court-ordered DNA test, and I promise you it's not the way you want to spend a summer afternoon in Atlanta at the GBI headquarters, but it's something that we're working through. And I believe it's something, strangely enough, that God is using.
LEMON: God is using how? How do you say that?
PAULK: You OK? You need a...
LEMON: No, I'm just wondering.
I'm shocked when you said God is using -- how is he using this?
PAULK: As much as I'm completely concerned for the families that have been involved in this, there is a real rash of Hollywood -- gospel (ph) Hollywood right now in the church, whether it's mega stars -- there's several preachers right now under investigation from a congressman in Iowa -- and there's a real dysfunctional, enabling society in churches where they see their preacher as God, they see him as sinless. And we even create doctrines and different codes to keep us that way, to keep us perfect and sinless and away from our humanity in front of the people's eyes.
And that's why you see, I think, people's faith is shaken so many times when their preacher or their preacher's humanity is exposed.
LEMON: What does have to do with God, though? Why -- how is God using this? Are you saying that the people in your father, uncle's church, whatever, used -- or thought that he was God and so they treated him that way?
PAULK: Close to that, and it's that way in many churches, especially southern Pentecostal churches that are considered mega churches.
PHILLIPS: I think you bring up a good point. I mean, we all fight our own demons whether we are pastors or journalists or whatever we do, and there is a certain expectation I think from a congregation when they look to their pastor as, OK, we expect this person to be perfect.
PAULK: Right.
PHILLIPS: So my question to you is, in a situation like this, I can see where this can be used as an incredible teaching tool, but let me just go a step further -- and is it OK if I say your father? I guess you can say your dad, it's not your uncle.
PAULK: He's my uncle but he's my biological father.
PHILLIPS: OK. There we go.
To be a man of God, a man that's supposed to teach the truth, for so long though to not confront those demons, I guess that's where the question lies.
PAULK: Sure. Yes.
PHILLIPS: Where is -- for you, is this a man of faith or is this someone who didn't live by the truth for so many years? And that's even harder to grapple with?
PAULK: Well, I would I guess that you bring up the idea of truth that you're a believer, you're aware of the truth?
PHILLIPS: There's a lot of things that I believe in. It's a constant search for me.
PAULK: That's good, I think. I'll hope for you.
PHILLIPS: I've experienced many different...
LEMON: I don't think you have to be a believer to be aware of the truth. I think the circumstances sort of speak for themselves.
PAULK: Truth is relative. It's relative to all of us. The truth of our war right now is relative.
I'll tell you where I am. We're not trying to skirt any issue. Blame and shame is a human response to sin, whether it's Adam blaming his wife, or his companion, Eve. Eve blames the serpent, the devil made me do it.
The only response to this situation is that we're human. We have made mistakes. There were indiscretions. But in the process God has the power to turn evil into good.
He takes all things and works them together for our good, and I think what is happening right now is that religious conditioning of America is being exposed. And we had a chance to learn in the '80s with some of the big scandals in the '80s concerning large churches. We had a chance again in the early '90s to learn, and we haven't learned our lesson yet, and that is that man is not to be worshipped. Man is to be seen just as he is. We're broken, we're frail. You know, we are earthen vessels that God chooses to use for his glory.
PHILLIPS: So, should you get away from the whole mega church? Because when you have the money and the TV shows and the fame and the fortune...
PAULK: Absolute power.
PHILLIPS: ... you have this kind of power and you don't live that life that Jesus led without all the extras. Doesn't that contribute to the lack of discipline or temptation?
PAULK: Well, none of us can live like Christ lived. He was sinless. You know? But the interesting thing is Christ spent most of his ministry arguing with religious people and caring for sinners.
And probably the church is one of the only organization that I've seen that really turns out to be hypocritical. And it teaches restoration yet it doesn't know how to restore.
I'll give you an example. The denomination that my uncle was raised in, my biological father was raised in, if you went through a divorce they took away your minister's license. And so you couldn't admit that you had marital problems because you were in jeopardy of losing your ministry, losing your minister's license, so you learned a pattern of hiding.
You covered the things that you struggled with instead of being translucent, transparent, saying, look, I struggle just...
PHILLIPS: Just like everybody else does.
PAULK: ... the teachings of Paul. The things I want to do I don't do. The things I should do I don't -- you know, I don't get around to.
LEMON: Whose fault is that? Are you saying it's the church's fault, or is it the person...
PAULK: I think it's an enabling society.
LEMON: It's society. So it's not the people behind the pulpit who are telling people that this is the way that you should act and what you should do?
PAULK: Well, if you're familiar with any type of addiction, there is the person that is addicted and there are the family members that enable him.
LEMON: No, I understand that. I understand you're talking about addiction, but I'm talking about the person who is at the pulpit every Sunday. That's the person who is telling the flock what they should do, how they should think, and how they should run their lives. So you can't then in turn put it on the congregation and say it's the congregation's fault. PAULK: No.
LEMON: It's the person who is telling them how they should lead their lives, according to this is what God says, this is what the bible says. And that's what those people...
PAULK: I would love to sit down and take it verse by verse with you.
LEMON: No, it has nothing to do with verses. It just has to do with right and wrong. I mean, I think that...
PHILLIPS: Discipline. Discipline.
LEMON: ... that is the issue, that people are always saying it's God, God does this, God does that, but I think it just has to do with right or wrong.
PAULK: In general it's wrong. There's no way to justify a wrong.
LEMON: Right.
PAULK: That's the problem, is that we can't just look at it and say it's wrong. And men are wrong, women are wrong, men of God, women of God, we're all wrong.
Now, can we put this on the church that it's their fault? It's absolutely not their fault. Leaders have an extra responsibility...
LEMON: Right.
PAULK: ... as I think the movie "Spider Man" says, with great power comes great responsibility. Also with great power comes great temptation. We have got to learn to walk in our humanity very delicately.
PHILLIPS: That's what you hit on. You hit on temptation.
PAULK: Wield our power very, very carefully.
PHILLIPS: Have you forgiven him? Are you working on that?
PAULK: Well, if I'm a follower of Christ, he says, if you want to receive forgiveness you have to give forgiveness. So, I want forgiveness. I've forgiven him.
LEMON: We have to move on now.
Thank you.
PHILLIPS: We appreciate you spending time with us very much.
PAULK: Appreciate being here.
LEMON: We have some important health news for women if you're under 45. It could help you protect your heart and your health.
CNN NEWSROOM continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BUSINESS REPORT)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Let's get straight to the news room. T.J. Holmes with details on a developing story around Michael Vick -- T.J.
T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Well, hits just keep on coming from him, and not on the field this time around.
Michael Vick now -- an order has been put in by federal prosecutors who now are asking the court to force him to hold on to almost $1 million. The reason they are doing this, the federal prosecutors, is a part of his plea deal. Of course, he pled guilty back in August on these federal dogfighting charges. As a part of that plea deal, he agreed to pay to take care of the dogs that were found to be involved this whole dogfighting, the dogs that were found on his property, about 50-something dogs.
Well, fellow prosecutors say that's going to cost about $920,000. Well, Michael Vick right now has several lawsuits pending against him. You have the Atlanta Falcons, for one thing, going after some $20 million in his signing bonuses. They're trying to recoup that money. And several other banks trying to recoup millions and millions of dollars in defaults on loans by Michael Vick.
So federal prosecutors have recognized that we don't know what's going to happen to his financial situation. We know he has money now, so please force him, is what they are asking the court, to hold on to $928,000, the amount is, to pay for and essentially do what he said he was going to do in the plea deal, which was take care of these dogs, to pay to have these dogs taken care of.
So now they are asking the court to force him to at least free some of that money. So -- and, again, we know, we saw this week, just yesterday, Michael Vick reported to prison before he was even sentenced, Kyra. That sentencing is coming up in about three weeks, but he's doing this ahead of time. He's anticipating going to jail for a while, so he's pretty much getting a jump-start and voluntarily going to prison right now.
So some more -- I guess really the hits just keep on coming for Michael Vick. And we'll see what happens. But they are asking him to hold on to about $928,000 of his money so he can pay for these dogs.
PHILLIPS: T.J., thanks.
HOLMES: All right.
(WEATHER REPORT)
PHILLIPS: Well, there's a bit of a troubling turn for younger women in the battle against heart disease.
CNN Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen here to explain.
I'll put my computer down here.
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Sure.
PHILLIPS: I'm looking at your notes.
Where do we begin?
COHEN: Well, we begin by talking about how women often don't have the right idea about heart disease. They think that, A, it's a man's disease, and, B, they often think that it's an older man's disease. They think of sort of what people call that Hollywood heart attack, where a man in his 50s or 60s clutches his heart and falls to the ground. And you don't usually think of a woman as having a heart attack.
However, what this new study shows is that women between the ages of 35 and 44 are dying of heart disease more every year. A hundred more young women die every year -- again, between 35 and 44, so we're talking pretty young. So if you add that all up, it's 8,200 women died in 2002 alone from heart disease.
PHILLIPS: Why young women? Why is it young women that are dying?
COHEN: Well, this is sort of Generation XL, right? So you've got more women and more men, too, but more women also who are obese, have high cholesterol, have blood pressure issues.
Now, it's not so much that women are any fatter than men. Probably some of the issue here is that women and their doctors aren't really focusing in on heart disease. They are focusing in on other things, especially in their 30s and 40s.
So what women need to remember is that they need to think about heart disease and they need to talk to their doctor, even in their 30s and 40s, and say, are there any tests that I should be have? Is there something I should be doing, particularly if there's a family history?
PHILLIPS: Well, what are some of the warning signs and how can you manage it?
COHEN: Right. There are certain warning signs that women need to watch for, sometimes even more than men. So let's go through this list of things -- chest pain, nausea, fatigue and heart palpitations. Now, those two middle ones, nausea and fatigue, are especially common in women.
For example, in men you'll find they'll just have the chest pain and not necessarily much else. But women often won't have much chest pain at all. They will have, for example, nausea as their biggest symptom or fatigue or just feeling really horrible as their biggest symptom. So when a woman has those symptoms, she can go to the doctor and say, doctor, don't think I'm crazy, but could you check for heart disease? I know I'm only 40, but could you check for it?
PHILLIPS: That's good advice.
Thanks, Elizabeth.
COHEN: Thanks.
LEMON: They ran Cambodia for just -- for four years but managed to kill millions of their own people. Almost 30 years later, surviving members of the Khmer Rouge are finally being called to account.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Well, Germany had the Nazis and their death camps. Cambodia had the Khmer Rouge and their killing fields, where millions of Cambodians were starved, tortured and killed. Today the U.N. began formal hearings into the genocide that came on the heels of the Vietnam War.
CNN's Hugh Riminton has more on the allegations and the former prison chief who's the first defendant.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HUGH RIMINTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The dead of the Cambodian genocide do not sleep easy. The killing fields outside the capital of Phnom Penh contain the most compelling witnesses for the prosecution as the five most senior surviving leaders of the Khmer Rouge face, at last, a day in court.
Even though he was always blindfolded back then, Cham Mai (ph) still remembers exactly his prison cell -- five steps on the left from the door. Here, during Cambodia's self-destruction, he lay, naked, shackled at the feet, hearing the cries of tortured prisoners and the nightly trucks carrying the doomed away to execution.
"It was very painful," he said, "because through all of it, I never knew what I had done wrong. What mistake could I have made that they could hit me and torture me? I still don't know."
The Cambodian nightmare remains inexplicable, a nation that destroyed itself. As the U.S. was scrambling through neighboring Vietnam, Pol Pot, Paris-educated, but inspired by Maoist China, seized Cambodia in a civil war. His vision was of a purified peasant state. His Khmer Rouge fighters, often children, emptied the cities, killed professionals, intellectuals, anyone who wore glasses. Purged with such numbing ferocity, in four years almost a quarter of the population was slaughtered.
This was Tuol Sleng, prison S-21, the largest and most notorious torture center of the Khmer Rouge. Seventeen thousand people came through here -- men, women, children. Only seven emerged alive.
Cham Mai's (ph) photo is here, one of those seven. One of only three still alive today. He was tortured in this classroom, beaten once for 12 days straight. His toenails were torn out. But he says there was something worse.
"They put electricity through my ears," he says. "I heard a noise of a machine. I felt like fire was exploding out of my eyes. I was unconscious for a long time after that."
His torturers wanted to know of his links with the CIA and the KGB. He was a simple mechanic, he says. He has never even heard of them. He told them anything, anything he could think of.
And he focused his thoughts on his beloved wife, Sawar (ph), pregnant when he had last seen her. And he prayed.
(on camera): In early 1979, as Vietnamese forces were moving in, Cham Mai (ph) and the few other remaining prisoners who could still walk were ordered to move to another prison. As they were moving through the city, they linked up with another group of prisoners from another center. And incredibly, among their number was Cham Mai's (ph) wife and the baby son he had never seen. It was 7:00 in the morning.
(voice over): At midnight that night, he says, he learned the guards had orders to shoot them all. He and his wife made a run for it. In a burst of fire, his wife and their son were killed.
He wants the United Nations now to bring him justice, but he doesn't trust the process. And he's outraged at the pampered conditions the accused enjoy at the (INAUDIBLE) court.
"I heard on the radio," he says, "that these five now awaiting trial have mattresses to sleep on and air conditioning and medical care and television. I didn't even have trousers. I had nothing at all."
"The government has always looked after these people, always protected them. These people have never accepted responsibility for what they did. They just lie."
"My family, my wife, my child died. Nobody cared about them. Nobody cared for them."
The dead don't sleep easy in Cambodia, and nor still do many of the living.
Hugh Riminton, CNN, Phnom Penh.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: A fourth arrest has been made in the murder of a British college student studying in Italy. Twenty-year-old Rudy Guede was picked up in Germany. Italian police say that they found his bloody fingerprint at the crime scene where Meredith Kercher was found stabbed to death earlier this month. Police believe that she may have been sexually assaulted first. Kercher's American roommate, Amanda Knox, was quickly arrested, along with Knox's Italian boyfriend. Knox's boss was also picked up but was reportedly released from custody today.
LEMON: Could a person's own skin cells be used to regenerate failing tissues? We'll ask our medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen, about intriguing new research.
KAREEN WYNTER, ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: I'm Kareen Wynter in Hollywood.
As Dr. Donda West is being buried today, we're finally hearing from the doctor who many people think was responsible for her death. You won't want to miss this. What he has to say, next in the NEWSROOM.
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PHILLIPS: As we've been reporting, Donda West, the mother of hip-hop star Kanye West, is being buried today, and for the first time we're hearing from the plastic surgeon who operated on her the day before she died.
CNN Entertainment Correspondent Kareen Wynter is here to tell us what the doctor is saying.
Kareen, does he have any explanation as to why Donda West died?
WYNTER: Hi there, Kyra.
You know, he does, actually. Donda West could have been killed by a heart attack, a pulmonary embolism, or a drug overdose. At least that's what Dr. Jan Adams told the "L.A. Times." Now, this, of course, all comes out as Dr. Donda West is being laid to rest today in Oklahoma.
Adams performed a breast reduction, liposuction, and a tummy tuck on West on November 9th, and a day later she was dead. But despite the timing, Adams told The Times that he had nothing to do with her death and that she was fine when she left his office.
Now, according to The Times article, he was willing to speculate about the possible cause of death here with reporters but was unwilling to go into specifics until that coroner's report, Kyra, is finished.
Now, in the aftermath of West's death, it came to light that Adams had lost several, several malpractice suits and that he was under investigation by the medical board after several DUI arrests. Now, he denied that he has any problem with alcohol and said that the malpractice suits against him have mostly been nuisance suits. But he did tell the paper that after the publicity, more than 10 patients had canceled their scheduled procedures with him which is no surprise there.
And tonight we'll be seeing Dr. Adams for the very first time in his extended interview with our own Larry King, so we'll see, Kyra, what else he has to say.
PHILLIPS: All right. Well, an interview that I'm sure will get a lot of attention.
WYNTER: Of course.
PHILLIPS: Now, what's going on with the writers' strike?
WYNTER: Well, there are some latest developments, and that being that some writers at -- get this -- CBS may be joining the Writers Guild picket lines. The 500 news writers who work at CBS locations all across the country, they voted to authorize a strike, but they have not actually walked out yet. The news writers have been without a contract since 2005, and the sticking points here being salary increases and writing jobs being assigned to non-union workers.
Now, CBS News says that they are ready to continue working even if they are hit with a strike. This possible walkout, however, is not directly related to the larger Writers Guild strike that has lasted for about three weeks now.
In the larger WGA strike, the work stoppage has started to impact movie projects, believe it or not. Directors Ron Howard and Oliver Stone both have had to delay the start of their newest projects because of that strike.
And coming up after you watch Dr. Adams on "LARRY KING LIVE," watch "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT," "Praying for Hollywood." Can Britney Spears be saved with prayer? What about other stars in trouble?
The controversy over a prayer group trying to save some of Hollywood's biggest stars on TV's most provocative entertainment news show. That, of course, "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT," 11:00 p.m. Eastern and Pacific -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right, Kareen. Thanks.
LEMON: All right. Take a look at this. It's one bird you won't see on any Thanksgiving table, but you just might see it on TV on turkey day on Thursday.
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LEMON: Well, lucky birds indeed. This healthy gobbler and a buddy have been spared the carving knife, as is tradition. The president delivered a full pardon to the national Thanksgiving turkey and its alternate. Then he revealed the names chosen by people who voted online.
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GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm pleased to announce the winning names. They are May and Flower. They are certainly better than the names the vice president suggested, which was Lunch and Dinner.
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LEMON: That was funny.
From now on, nothing but first class for these turkeys. They are on their way to Disney World, where they will be grand marshals of the Thanksgiving Day Parade there. They will spend the rest of their days in Magic Kingdom Park.
PHILLIPS: Well, did Franklin really want the turkey to be the national bird? And what happens to turkeys granted a presidential pardon?
The answers are part of the history and lore of the gobbler.
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PHILLIPS (voice over): Those two turkeys receiving a presidential pardon every year aren't your ordinary gobblers. Along with several others, they are raised in an air-conditioned barn and fed high-quality food.
The two who best handle large crowds of people and don't bite are crowned the president and vice president turkeys. But life isn't golden after they are officially pardoned. Because of their huge size and giant breasts, most die within the year.
Wild turkeys are a totally different bird. They are tough and lean and they can fly for short distances up to 55 miles per hour. And they can run 20 miles an hour. Wild turkeys, native to the U.S. and Mexico, were possibly first domesticated by Native Mexicans.
As for the story that Ben Franklin vigorously lobbied for the turkey to be the national bird, here are the facts. He wrote his daughter expressing disdain for the bald eagle after the great seal had been adopted by Congress. Several years earlier, he actually suggested that the rattlesnake was an apt symbol of the temper and conduct of America. At the end of the day, with little debate, Congress approved the eagle design on the same day it was submitted, June 20, 1782.
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PHILLIPS: The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts right now.
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