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New Info Revealed on Omaha Mall Shooter; Mitt Romney Speaks Out on Faith and the Presidency

Aired December 06, 2007 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: A news conference happening right now in Lincoln, Nebraska, from the Health and Human Services. They are talking about Robert Hawkins.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

TODD LANDRY, DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF CHILDREN AND FAMILY SERVICES: ... are in the state, in state custody.

At this time, I can confirm that Robert became a state ward on September 17, 2002, through Sarpy County Juvenile Court at the order of Judge O'Neil (ph) as a 3-A, meaning it was through no fault of the parent, but that Robert was in need of services.

Our custody ended on August 24, 2006, when department custody was terminated by the court. Parental rights are intact, and no other children in the family have been or are currently state wards.

Last night, we retrieved our records from storage and have been reviewing them. This morning we also reviewed court records. Information in the court record is public unless the record has been sealed. In this case, the record has not been sealed.

I will, however, not be able to discuss protected health information, as that information cannot be released. Through the court records, I can share that Robert was receiving services before the court placed him in our custody. Our goal was to expand and build on that.

Robert's case was managed through the Integrated Comprehensive Care Unit, ICCU, meaning he was served jointly by DHHS' central or eastern service area and Region Six behavioral health services. Robert received services through several residential treatment centers, a group home, day services, and an agency-based foster home.

He also received inpatient hospital treatment. Providers included Piney Ridge Center Incorporated in Waynesville, Missouri, Cooper Village in Omaha, Nebraska, Lutheran Family Services of Nebraska, located in Omaha, Nebraska, and Addiction and Behavioral Health Services Incorporated, also in Omaha, Nebraska.

I'm unable to provide specific information about treatment because that is protected health information.

This tragedy was not a failure of the system to provide appropriate quality services for a youth who needed it. Again, based on our review, we believe that this tragedy was not a failure of the system to provide appropriate quality services for a youth that needed it.

The provision of services was significant, exceeding $265,000 during Robert's time as a state ward. In addition, we are aware that private resources were also used to access services.

LEMON: Todd Landry, director of the Division of Children and Family Services, holding his press conference from Lincoln, Nebraska, talking about Robert Hawkins, the young man who sadly went on a shooting spree yesterday in Omaha, Nebraska, at a shopping mall, killing eight people and then himself, giving us some new details, saying that he was a ward of the state since June of 2002. Their custody ended in 2006.

He had been receiving services. As I said before, he was a ward of the state. He had received services from several organizations, services which included addiction and behavioral services. Again, he's saying this was not a failure of the system.

The person who is on the ground for us at the Westroads Mall is our very own Sean Callebs. He is standing by.

Sean, you were listening to this. Talk to us about what you're hearing and what you have discovered since you have been there.

SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, I think everybody here in Omaha, across the country, really looking for answers. Why did this massacre take place? What triggered this?

And pretty much everybody right now is focusing on the apparent tortured mind of the suspect, Robert Hawkins. Now, authorities are still inside Von Maur department store you see behind me. They have been working that crime scene since last night. They interviewed as many witnesses as possible. They, of course, identified all of the victims, the eight people that Hawkins apparently killed before taking his own life. All of those families have been notified as well.

But what about Hawkins? What makes him tick? This is someone who has clearly struggled with mental illness for years and years. We know that he has been treated for depression. He's been on medication for some time. His family kicked him out about a year ago.

And as if that wasn't bad enough, at this holiday season, he apparently also just broke up with his girlfriend and was fired from his job. People want to know, how was he able to take an assault rifle inside a crowded department store during busy shopping hours and not be seen?

Well, authorities talked about that weapon and how he got it earlier this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THOMAS WARREN, OMAHA, NEBRASKA, POLICE CHIEF: It appeared that the shooting victims were randomly selected. It did not appear as if anyone was specifically targeted. Certainly, there were several people who fled immediately once the shots were being fired. Unfortunately, many of the store employees kind of remained in the area.

And as he proceeded to the rear of the store, that's when he encountered the individuals by the customer service area.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CALLEBS: And police have also walked us through a timeline, those last few minutes before Hawkins took his own life.

They say he went in the department store, then came out for a short period. Surveillance cameras apparently show him going back in, tucking something or hiding something underneath a hooded sweatshirt. He got on an elevator on the second floor. And, immediately, as though elevator doors open on the third floor, he opened fire, killing a number of store employees, as well as holiday shoppers.

Don, one other item, too. Apparently at some point Hawkins thought that perhaps the U.S. Army could be his ticket to a better life, his ticket out of Omaha. He tried to enlist at least once, perhaps on two separate occasions. Both times, the Army rejected him -- Don.

LEMON: Sadly, he probably thought he had no hope.

You were going through, Sean, the timeline in all of this, talking about what investigators released, what the surveillance pictures showed. The big question, though, is whether he knew any of those people or if this was random. Talk about whether or not he spoke to anyone at this mall before he opened fire on these folks.

CALLEBS: We have not been able to determine if he actually spoke to anyone. Apparently, the first time he went in, his activity at least garnered some kind of attention from the security officers.

But police said they simply did not have enough time to react. Apparently, the whole process only took about six minutes. And from the time that the police were first dispatched and when they got here was only four minutes. But the police have said time and again, they don't believe that anyone was specifically targeted. They believe this was random.

A lot of people want to know about Hawkins' former girlfriend. Where is she? Did she have any kind of role in this? We know she was mentioned apparently in the suicide note that Hawkins left behind. Police are also poring over that.

And we know, Don, a very difficult thing to hear. Apparently, Hawkins thought that by committing this act, it would bring him some kind of notoriety, become famous. Well, certainly, people in this area will not forget his name, but for clearly the most horrific reasons.

LEMON: Yes, just a horrific act by a very disturbed young man. Thank you very much for that, Sean Callebs, reporting from Omaha, Nebraska.

A mall shooter in Nebraska, a fake bomber in New Hampshire, and that's just the past few days. A mental health thread runs through all of this, through both. We will talk prevention and treatment in just a few minutes here.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: White House hopeful Mitt Romney says he's a man of faith. What he's not, he says, is a spokesman for his Mormon beliefs. As you may have heard live here on CNN, Romney told an audience in Texas the Mormon church would never dictate his decisions as president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Let me assure you that no authorities of my church, or of any other church, for that matter, will ever exert influence on presidential decisions. Their authority is theirs within the province of church affairs, and it ends where the affairs of the nation begin.

As governor, I tried to do the right, as best I knew it, serving the law and answering to the Constitution. I did not confuse the particular teachings of my church with the obligations of the office and of the Constitution. And, of course, I would not do so as president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: A recent CNN/Opinion Research Corporation research poll found 19 percent of Americans said they are less likely to vote for a Mormon for president; 77 percent said it would not matter.

If you want the most-up-to-the-minute political news, you can go to CNNPolitics.com, CNNPolitics.com, the Internet's premier destination for political news.

LEMON: Help is on the way for some struggling homeowners. The White House has brokered a deal with the mortgage industry. It's meant to buy time for thousands of homeowners who face rising mortgages in the new year. The president says it's not a perfect solution and is not -- is not -- a bailout.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: To provide relief to these borrowers in one of three ways: by refinancing the existing loan into a new private mortgage; by moving them into an FHA secure loan; or by freezing their current interest rate for five years.

Lenders are already refinancing and modifying mortgages on a case-by-case basis. With this systematic approach, Hope Now will be able to help large groups of homeowners all at once. This will bring more relief to more homeowners more quickly. Hope Now estimates there are up to 1.2 million American homeowners who could be eligible for this assistance.

Public awareness is critical to this effort because the group can only help homeowners who ask for it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: The president also urges homeowners in trouble to call a new hot line. Here's the toll-free number for you. It's 1-888-995- HOPE, 1-888-995-HOPE.

And we have had our eye on our CNNMoney.com Web site to see what some of you think of this plan. So far, most don't think it is a good idea.

Here's what's Dan from North Reading, Massachusetts, wrote: "The federal government should not discriminate on those who are responsible in taking out a mortgage they can afford. Let the market play itself out without denying the inevitable."

On the other hand, Tara from Levittown, New York, says: "This seems like a good idea because it doesn't use government money to either help homeowners or the banks, but rather gives each side more time to work out the issues between them."

But Raj (ph) of Virginia calls it a Band-Aid solution and wonders how long it will help. He says: "It's just a political solution and not a market solution."

If you would like to sound off, go to CNNMoney.com.

(WEATHER UPDATE)

LEMON: Back to our top story at this hour, a mall shooter in Nebraska. And remember the fake bomber in New Hampshire? That's just the past few days. A mental health thread runs through both. We will talk prevention and treatment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Seventeen past of the hour. Three of the stories we are working on for you right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Two people in still critical condition, another person is still being treated after yesterday's deadly shooting at an Omaha shopping mall. Police say 19-year-old Robert Hawkins killed eight people before killing himself.

A parcel bomb kills a secretary at a law office in Paris and injures one lawyer. It's not clear who the target was.

And floodwaters recede in the Pacific Northwest, leaving plenty of mud and plenty of destruction. Washington's governor says the damage could be in the billions.

PHILLIPS: People who knew Robert Hawkins say he was not stable. His own words in a suicide note support that. Unfortunately, we will never know the depth of Hawkins' illness, pain or frustration.

Let's bring in Jeffrey Lieberman. He's the chairman of the psychiatry department at Columbia University.

I'm having a hard time getting that out today, Doctor. But let's get right to it.

Looking at the just the background of Hawkins, what we found out, that he was living with a family friend. They describe him as like a puppy that nobody wanted. He was ward of the state nearly four years. He had emotional problems. He was rejected by the Army for recruitment. He had lost his job the day of the shootings, and his girlfriend broke up with him.

All of these things put together, does that lead to what we saw Hawkins do, or is there something else we are missing?

DR. JEFFREY LIEBERMAN, PSYCHIATRIST IN CHIEF, NEW YORK PRESBYTERIAN HOSPITAL: You're not missing anything, Kyra.

This is the classic example of a young man who has been suffering for some period of time for a clear emotional disturbance and mental disorder that has gone inadequately treated and finally because of the hardships that has befallen him in life, he's pushed to the brink and he acts out in some misguided act of desperation in a way that has these tragic consequences. It is completely understandable and it's completely predictable.

PHILLIPS: All right.

Let me -- and with that said -- and you're straight to the point -- just moments ago, we heard from Todd Landry, who is the director of the Division of Children and Family Services. And he simply said, Doctor, the system didn't fail him.

Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LANDRY: ... but that Robert was in need of services.

Our custody ended on August 24, 2006, when department custody was terminated by the court. Parental rights are intact, and no other children in the family have been or are currently state wards.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: What do you make of that?

LIEBERMAN: Well, clearly, this person was mentally ill. He had sought treatment. He been in treatment. He had drifted downward and been cast out by his family, was taken in by a friend to live there.

But clearly he was in distress. Is there a mental health care system in Nebraska and Missouri that he was involved with? Yes. But did he engage in treatment in a way that adequately controlled his illness and sustained his involvement in treatment? And the answer is no.

Where the fault lies is a matter of judgment and decision. Either he did not want to follow through in treatment, he did not like the treatment that was being given to him, or the treatment was not proactive enough to go seek him out when he did not show up for his appointments and find out why.

PHILLIPS: And let me ask you about that, because as you are -- as I'm thinking about, I'm thinking of people even in my life, people that I know, friends of theirs that have shown signs like this, whether as a teenager or even someone in their 20s and 30s, the exact signs that Hawkins shows.

When do you know or when can you figure out or at what point do you decide, OK, I have got to take some sort of action and intervene in this person's life, because they are ready to go crazy?

LIEBERMAN: Well, mental health professionals observing somebody who is having that kind of pattern of behavior that you're describing would know when it looks like it's over the extreme of beyond the norms of social behavior and is indicative of the person suffering from a mental illness.

But the average layperson, a family member observing their family member, may not know exactly when they should push this person to go get help, and if the person doesn't agree to go get help, when they should take matters into their own hands and force them to get help.

PHILLIPS: So, Doctor, let me ask you, then, if your child or friend is having -- is showing signs of depression or extreme unhappiness, should you just force them in one way or another to go see a psychiatrist or a psychologist? I mean in a loving way, obviously, but is that what where we should take more action when we do see signs like this?

LIEBERMAN: I think answer to that is yes. From my perspective as a psychiatrist, as somebody who has worked for over 25 years with severe mental illness, I think that when you see a relative or a family member or a close friend who looks like they are struggling, and this is not just a momentary thing and it's beyond the bounds of what their life circumstances are, you should push them. You should not feel like you're intruding on their privacy.

PHILLIPS: How do you do that, though? How do you do that? Because I have seen this in a number of my friends' families. They fight it. They're like, no way, I'm not going. I am going to run out of there. I am not going to participate.

I have watched them fight. How do you make them do it?

LIEBERMAN: Well, the first thing you have to do is to engage them and say, I think you need help. Let me help you find help. And this is what we should do.

If they agree, you take them to see a psychiatrist or your primary care physician for a referral. If they won't accept this, then you call yourself a mental health care program or the local department of psychiatry at a hospital, and you say, this is the situation. I have a brother or sister or daughter or son. He's suffering from this kind of problem. I think he needs help. How can we get that?

They will suggest strategies. If, however, the person is imminently threatening to themselves or others, then you should call and see if there is a way that either a mobile crisis team can come to your home or some outpatient assistant treatment team can come to your home and see the patient, or, if not, you have to make the decision whether you seek a court order to have them committed and forcibly hospitalized.

PHILLIPS: It's great advice. It's a tough thing to deal with, no matter what.

Dr. Jeffrey Lieberman, you're the chairman of the psychiatry department there at Columbia University. Always great to talk to you. Thanks so much, Dr. Lieberman.

LEMON: On the launchpad, fuelled and ready for liftoff, but not today. Find out why in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, no spaceflight for the crew of shuttle Atlantis.

NASA engineers say, maybe tomorrow. It all depends on what they find. This morning, two of the four sensors in the shuttle's external tank went off, indicating the tank was dry. Actually, it's full of fuel. Engineers are trying to figure out whether the sensors are faulty or if something else is wrong. Three sensors have to be working for a shuttle to launch.

(BUSINESS REPORT)

PHILLIPS: All right, we are getting a live news conference from Omaha -- you want to go to that, out of Omaha, Nebraska?

OK. And I'm -- OK. We're going to go to Nebraska. I believe this is the doctor that was working on that injured -- one of the injured from that shooting in the mall. You guys let me know if that's right.

I'm looking at his name here. Is that right?

All right. Let's take a -- listen in because he did some operating on the one critically man who was -- survived, Fred Wilson, age 61.

DR. JOSEPH STOTHERT, NEBRASKA MEDICAL CENTER: Which brings up what we actually do here in Omaha, which is a little different than most other cities. The two medical centers in town actually cooperate in the care of trauma patients. It's called the Omaha Trauma System. And so, on any given day, we have one institution that's up and running and able to handle all forms of trauma. When a mass casualty situation such as this occurs, we have the ability to open both trauma centers and take care of whatever comes our way.

What initially occurred was after the call went out and the fire department and police responded to this area, these patients were brought to our institutions by the Omaha Fire Department. We are very fortunate in this town to have a fully professional fire service which covers both fires and ambulance transport and care. We have paramedics which actually went in and rescued these people as best they could after the scene was declared safe. They stabilized the patients as best they could and ran with the patients that were alive to our various institutions.

The first two patients -- both of which were undergoing cardiac arrest at the time -- were brought to Creighton because they were the lead trauma center for the day. I believe they then got another patient and they called over to our institution to see if we could handle the patients, which we said we will be able to take as many as they want to send us. And three patients were seen in our institution.

Two were minor injuries. One was a major injury. I've talked to the family. They have allowed me to communicate to you what the injuries of that patient were. They included a posterior gunshot wound to the right arm, which exited through the arm into the axilla and out the front -- essentially blowing out the entire axilla. This took a fair number of the blood vessels that go down the arm.

When the patient initially came to us, being stabilized by the medics by direct pressure to the wound, he essentially had bled out his entire blood volume and had no discernible pulse. We continued the resuscitation effort, put some big lines into him and gave him blood -- which is what he need. And we were able to re-establish a blood pressure. And once we had a satisfactory blood pressure, to the point where we thought we could get him to the operating room, he was taken up to the operating room.

We then spent the next five hours reconstructing as best we could the blood vessels and the injured nerves and bone to the right shoulder. Currently, he still has an arm. We are in the process of trying to determine what the function of that arm is going to be. I suspect he'll have significant disabilities, but his life is saved. His limb is still present and hopefully will remain so as time goes along.

I think it's through the grace of the fire department of the Omaha Trauma System -- that we were able to handle these patients well. All patients that were alive when they made it to the hospital are still alive, both at Creighton and the University of Nebraska Medical Center -- and we intend to keep them that way.

Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're going to open it up for questions now.

You can ask both the Dr. Stothart and the family members questions.

QUESTION: Dr. Stothart, what was the -- what was Fred Wilson's condition at the time of surgery?

Was there -- was it precarious?

You were reconstructing a lot of really instrumental veins and blood vessels.

STOTHERT: Yes. Well, essentially when you've lost your entire blood volume, which is between four and five liters of blood -- you're in horrible shape. He essentially still had a little bit of brain function when he arrived. However, he basically -- we couldn't feel any pulse, although we know he had a heart rate, because we were watching it on his heart monitor.

The medics were keeping him alive simply by providing pressure against the arteries that had bled out. So he was in very critical condition.

We got him a little more stable after pumping in a whole bunch of blood into him, which, thank goodness, we have a wonderful blood bank here. And they provided just about everything we needed, including the kitchen sink. And we were able to successfully get his blood pressure up and stop all of the bleeding after a few hours and then proceed with trying to repair the arm.

So I -- you know, it was just a fortuitous juxtaposition of a bunch of people that do this on a regular basis and it came together and saved this guy's life. And we're all very grateful of all of the things that we have in this town that allowed us to do that.

I think the mayor, the city council, the CEO of both hospitals, should be very proud that we have this type of system that can allow us to care for these sorts of injuries without any confusion. These people were brought to us very quickly and in many -- in many jurisdictions, they wouldn't not have been alive, for the ones that made it to our institution.

QUESTION: Dana (ph) and Virginia, can you tell us where you were at this point and how you were informed of Fred's whereabouts?

DANA: Well, I was on my way home from work. I actually had just arrived home. And my sister called me on the phone to tell me the news. That's how I learned of it.

QUESTION: And where did you go and how did you respond to something when you hear of such a massacre going on -- how do you respond to something like that?

DANA: Well, it was quite shocking to me and the rest of my family members. We were trying to get information from the television, as well as each other. And I was out of town so I immediately started looking at flights to come out here to Omaha and arrived here this morning.

QUESTION: What about you, Virginia?

VIRGINIA: I was in a car taking my grandson to a cello lesson in Chicago when it came over the radio station that there had been a shooting in Omaha. And the mall was named. And, of course, my first thought was for Fred. But nothing was said until later about it being actually the Von Maur store.

And as time went on and we began hearing this, then I had a message from Jane on my cell phone. And we immediately began making reservations so that we could come this morning. We were shocked, frightened and very eager to be with our family.

QUESTION: How is the family (INAUDIBLE)?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're doing well. We're very grateful for the paramedics and the doctors and nurses who worked so quickly and diligently. And we're thinking of those who did lose their lives and their family members and friends and just hoping for best for them.

QUESTION: How is your uncle doing today?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's improving and I think that he will continue to improve.

QUESTION: Have you had conversations with him today?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not today.

QUESTION: Have you been able to get any sort of indication as to what -- I know you can't talk about (INAUDIBLE) action, what he saw, what he might have heard?

And has he asked you any questions about what's happened to his coworkers?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not as of yet. We haven't had conversations like that.

QUESTION: Has he asked you anything?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Actually, he has a breathing tube and so he's not really in a position to verbalize much. We have touched him and talked to him, because the nurses tell us that although he is asleep, that it's a very light sleep and that we can wake him. And we believe we do wake him a little bit. And I've asked him if he knows where he is and what happened. And he responds very slightly. I think he does. But mostly he's resting. And we're just wanting him to know that we're nearby and just waiting until he's in the position where he can talk with us for a little more.

QUESTION: When I've talked with people who know him, they say what a positive person...

PHILLIPS: You're listening to the niece and cousin of 61-year-old Fred Wilson. He was the man that was brought in yesterday in critical condition. He had gunshot wounds to the upper left chest and shoulder. You heard from his doctor there, Joseph Stothart, that he was lacking five liters of blood or had lost five liters of blood. He had no pulse. He had a heart rate, but medics were truly keeping him alive from the minute they started working on him all the way up into the hospital, where they were able to stabilize him and finally start working on his shoulder and upper chest. But, boy, what a scenario to go through.

But the good news is he's surviving. It sounds like he's in better condition. These were the scenes yesterday when that 19-year- old, Robert Hawkins, opened fire on the innocent people at this shopping mall, inside the Von Maur store. Fred Wilson was one of the unlucky ones that was in that store. But the good news is right now he's holding onto his life and his family is there supporting him all the way.

He says he wants to be president, not a spokesman for his faith. Hear what Mitt Romney to say about politics and religion in America.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

MILES O'BRIEN, CHIEF TECHNOLOGY & ENVIRONMENT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Real life just isn't what it used to be. Welcome to the world of augmented reality.

BLAIR MCINTYRE: What we wanted to do was explore if actually being physically in a big space like this -- you know, if the holodeck could be created, would it matter?

Would it create a better experience?

O'BRIEN: The technology blurs the line between what we see and what we can imagine. This gives you an idea of what the players sees through these goggles. The room is set up to allow a game player to step go through the screen, if you will, using stereo vision and a computer backpack to interact with characters in three dimensions, who, in this case, happen to having a domestic spat.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sometimes I feel like our whole marriage is just for show. I don't know what you really feel.

O'BRIEN: Maybe it's too real. All right. Matt, that's it. You've got to leave.

GEOFFREY THOMAS, PH.D. (PH) STUDENT, GEORGIA TECH: And there was this moment at the end where they were kind of breaking up and you were sort of thinking -- you were looking back and forth and you felt like you shouldn't be there anymore.

O'BRIEN: But what happens when someone combines augmented reality with a violent game, like, say, Grand Theft Auto?

HANNAN FIGBEE, GAME PLAYER'S MOTHER: Putting people in these situations where it was like anesthetize them or kind of like, you know, numb their senses to those kinds of situations, especially with a gun -- and I think it would just be way too normal. O'BRIEN: Actually, augmented reality is more normal than you think. Those first down lines that they insert into football telecasts and head-up displays used by pilots are both examples of the technology. It's just a matter of time before we all get into the augmented act.

Miles O'Brien, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: John F. Kennedy was a Democratic senator from Massachusetts. Republican Mitt Romney is a former Massachusetts governor. Both men launched White House campaigns and both face questions about their religion -- Kennedy as a Catholic and Romney a Mormon.

Today, Romney outlined his views on religion in public live. He said if he's elected, the Mormon Church will never dictate his actions.

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Let me assure you that no authorities of my church -- or of any other church, for that matter -- will ever exert influence on presidential decisions. Their authority is theirs within the province of church affairs and it ends when the affairs of the nation begin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: A lot of people are comparing Romney's remarks to the speech on religion given by then candidate John F. Kennedy in the final months of the 1960 race for the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, COURTESY JFK PTL LIBRARY, SEPTEMBER 12, 1960)

SEN. JOHN F. KENNEDY (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I do not speak for my church on public matters and the church does not speak for me.

Whatever issue may come before me as president, if I should be elected -- on birth control, divorce, censorship, gambling or any other subject -- I will make my decision in accordance with these views, in accordance with what my conscience tells me to be in the national interests and without regard to outside religious pressure or dictation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, those sound bites sound pretty similar. But our Bill Schneider says there were some key differences in those speeches.

And there he is.

Bill Schneider joins us now from Washington -- Bill, how were those speeches different? WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, the first difference is pretty clear. When Kennedy spoke, he said I believe in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute.

In Romney's remarks today, he talked about people taking the separation of church and state well beyond its original meaning. He was speaking, remember, to an audience of Republican primary voters. Kennedy spoke in September before the November general election in 1960. But this is long before the primaries have chosen a candidate. So his audience are Republicans, many of whom are deeply religious, and many of whom believe, with Romney, that the separation of church and state may have gone too far and violated some people's private religious liberties.

LEMON: This is going to be a very interesting election. We have an African-American candidate a serious contender, a woman who is a serious contender and then a Mormon, as well. So a large majority of the poll says they have no problem -- when you poll people -- with a Mormon, Bill, in the White House. But we know people don't always vote the way they say they will.

Do you think America is ready for a Mormon president?

SCHNEIDER: Well, as you can see here, 19 percent said they would be less likely to vote for a candidate who is a Mormon. That's a little bit higher than the percentage who say they wouldn't vote for an African-American or a woman or an Hispanic -- Bill Richardson is Hispanic -- or Catholic. There are five Catholics running -- or an Evangelical Christian like Mike Huckabee, who's running also and running neck and -- (AUDIO GAP)

LEMON: OK, Bill -- lost Bill Schneider.

We're obviously having a little bit of technical difficulties there. That was Bill...

PHILLIPS: A little teaser for "THE SIT ROOM".

LEMON: Yes, a little teaser for "THE SIT ROOM".

Bill Schneider, we'll see you in "THE SIT ROOM" a little bit later on.

Thank you, sir.

SCHNEIDER: Sure.

PHILLIPS: Well, for months, we've been telling you about everyday heroes. And tonight, 18 of them will be honored at an All-Star Tribute. And we'll have a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the help of the Afghan government and the people (AUDIO GAP) and I want this country -- besides that...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, for months we have been asking you to nominate CNN : ...ordinary people whose extraordinary accomplishments have made the world a much better place for all of us. And in just over five hours, 18 of those heroes will be honored in an All-Star Tribute.

Our Brooke Anderson has a preview -- hi, Brooke.

BROOKE ANDERSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Kyra.

I'm right outside the American Museum of Natural History in New York City, where it will take place a little later on this evening. But you're right, 18 finalists will be honored tonight. Those finalists were selected from more than 7,000 online nominations that CNN received this year. Those nominees from 93 countries.

Those finalists fall into groups of three and six different categories, including the category of Young Wonders -- those under 18 years old who have made a tremendous difference. And let's take a look now at a sample of the three honorees in that category.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

KAYLA CORNALE, CNN HERO: My cousin, Lorinna (ph), she's 11 years old and she's diagnosed with a form of autism. I knew that at sometimes at family gatherings she would not want to talk to others or she'd be to herself or just little things like that. But I just saw that she had an interest in music. She might not necessarily remember something that you say to her, but she'd remember song lyrics.

(BEGIN GRAPHIC)

About one child out of 150 is born with autism.

Source: Autism Society of America

(END GRAPHIC)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You remember this song?

We've listened to that before.

CORNALE: So I thought if she likes music, why don't I create something that she likes already and then she can build upon that?

JOSH MILLER: During my sophomore year, one of my good friends, Eddie Lopez (ph), was shot and killed in a drive-by shooting by gang members in a case of mistaken identity. He was an honor student. He was supposed to be the first in his family to go to college.

And he talked a lot about how in his honor and A.P. classes as Santa Monica High School, there weren't a lot of minority students. And so after he died, I worked forced hard and really focused on trying to solve the problems that me and Eddie talked about. DALLAS JESSUP: I am a certified Filipino street fighting instructor. The idea to create Just Yell Fire came from the video footage of a girl name Carly Brucia in Florida, who was walking home from a parking lot one day. A man came up to her and said something -- we have no idea what -- and she went away with him willingly. Four days later, she was found dead.

And I just remember thinking she could have been alive if she had done two to three techniques.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

ANDERSON: Now, a winner will be selected in each of the six categories. Those winners will receive tens of thousands of dollars to go to his or her cause.

It will be a star-studded event, as well. Mary J. Blige, Norah Jones, Wyclef Jean and Sheryl Crow are set to perform.

Also, Kyra Sedgwick will be here, as well as Glenn Close, Tyra Banks and Harry Connick Jr. to present.

Kyra, it really is a special event because these honorees are people who rarely, if ever, get the recognition that they deserve, but that all changes tonight here with the CNN : Tribute.

PHILLIPS: This is what it's all about. This is why we get into the business.

Thanks, Brooke.

PHILLIPS: An All-Star Tribute" featuring big names like you heard -- Mary J. Blige, Wyclef Jean, Norah Jones, Sheryl Crow and many more. It's tonight at 12:00 Eastern right here on CNN.

And if you'd like to meet the 18 finalists up for that grand prize plus the panelists who will decide the winner, just log onto CNN.com/heroes.

LEMON: And time now to check in with CNN's Wolf Blitzer.

PHILLIPS: He's standing by in "THE SITUATION ROOM" to tell us what's coming up at the top of the hour -- hey, Wolf.

WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Thanks very much, guys.

Coming up, Republican candidate Mitt Romney makes a passionate speech about his faith, only uses the word Mormon once. Coming up, the best political team on television will analyze how he did, what it means and whether the Christian base will be convinced.

President Bush announces a sweeping fix for some people caught in the mortgage crisis. We'll explain who it impacts and why people on both sides of the issue are criticizing the plan.

Plus, the House passes a major energy bill aimed at helping you. But will it really?

We're going to have a Fact Check right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Guys -- back to you.

PHILLIPS: We'll be watching.

Thanks, Wolf.

LEMON: Old Saint Nick -- a virtual naughtier than nice version. That's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Are you still with us?

LEMON: Yes, I am.

PHILLIPS: All right.

LEMON: The closing bell is about to ring on Wall Street. (INAUDIBLE).

PHILLIPS: Stephanie Elam standing by with a final look at the trading day -- hey, Steph.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm with you, too.

I'm here, too.

(LAUGHTER)

PHILLIPS: You know how we are?

We get all ADD with our computers and our e-mails...

ELAM: Yes. It happens. It happens.

Let me tell you about what's going on with Santa.

Microsoft has apparently clamped down on Santa's Web privileges after the company's virtual Kris Kringle was more naughty than nice. Children were able to message Santa through North Pole Live, but it turns out some people were putting Santa in situations that prompted him to say some very inappropriate things. You know what I mean.

Despite engineers' efforts to clean up their potty mouthed Santa language, it didn't work. So Microsoft has chosen to take this version of Santa offline.

But while that is kind of naughty, there's some nice things happening here on Wall Street.

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