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No Comment from Bush on CIA Tapes; New Orleans Protesters Angry Over Proposed Housing Demolition

Aired December 20, 2007 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: A trip to the woods to cut down a Christmas tree, what could go wrong? Three days later we know, in the family's own words.
Words can't describe the chamber of horrors U.S. troops turned up in Iraq. You're going to see these pictures this hour.

Hello, everyone. I'm Kyra Phillips at the CNN world headquarters in Atlanta. Don Lemon is off. And you're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

First up, a setback today, minor we hope, for a California family stranded for three days in a snowstorm. Fifteen-year-old Lexi Dominguez is back in the hospital after complaining of pain in her feet. She suffered frostbite in her toes when she and her father and two brothers got lost while looking for a Christmas tree.

Hope was fading fast, but today they're celebrating their almost unbelievable rescue by the California Highway Patrol.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTOPHER DOMINGUEZ, SON: We all heard the helicopter. I -- wee were all yelling or we were all sitting down at the time. We all had each other's feet and such inside each other's jackets, trying to keep our feet warm, because they were all frozen, and just trying to keep our feet warm. We heard the helicopter.

And I told my dad, "The helicopter, the helicopter." Josh saw the helicopter. My dad, he just ran out there and started waving his arms, screaming, "Help, help." And that's -- that's when they started circling and going down and going down. And we were all just happy, happy to be rescued.

ALEXIS DOMINGUEZ, DAUGHTER: It was really, really scary, like I remember going under the tree and just -- we were all trying to, like, be next to each other. The shelter wasn't very big. So Chris and my dad weren't, like, really in the shelter. It was really just me and Josh in the shelter. And so it was just really, really scary. The most scariest thing that could happen.

FREDERICK DOMINGUEZ, FATHER: My youngest boy is like, "Dad, are we going to make it? Are you sure we're going to make it?"

I said, "Son, I would tell you what I bought you for Christmas if I thought we weren't going to make it." C. DOMINGUEZ: I didn't want them to really lose hope. Whenever they would freak out, I would just be like it's all right; we're going to make it through this. This is nothing. Like, we've been here a couple days. What's a couple more days?

F. DOMINGUEZ: You know, when it boils down to it, you have your faith, you have family, and you have your friends and that's it. And you know what? When you're in a place where you think wow, we may not make it, all you want to do is tell those people how much you love them, how much you miss them and how much you respect and love them. And you know what? I probably do a little more now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: The family survived on their instincts, that's for sure, eating snow and spelling out "help" with twigs and branches.

Frederick Dominguez says that next year there will be no hike in the woods. He plans to buy a plastic Christmas tree.

We're going to hear more from the kids' interview with CNN's Anderson Cooper coming up just a little bit later in the NEWSROOM.

Let's bring in Chad Myers in our weather center. He's keeping an eye on some of the violent weather patterns this afternoon. Well, earlier on this morning and now heading into the afternoon.

Hey, Chad.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hi, Kyra.

(WEATHER REPORT)

PHILLIPS: All right. We'll keep tracking them with you. Thanks, Chad.

MYERS: You're welcome.

PHILLIPS: President Bush said that he's reserving judgment on the destruction of CIA videotapes showing the interrogation of terror suspects. At his news conference today, Mr. Bush repeated that he had no prior knowledge the videos were made or, three years later, destroyed.

A federal judge, the Justice Department, Congress and the CIA are all trying to trace events that led to the tapes' destruction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Sounds clear to me when I say I have the first recollections when Mike Hayden briefed me. It's pretty clear.

Secondly, I am confident that the preliminary inquiry conducted by the A.G. and the I.G. of the CIA, coupled with the oversight provided by the Congress, will end up enabling us all to find out what exactly happened. And therefore, over the course of these inquiries and oversight hearings, I'm going to reserve judgment until I find out the full facts.

I know I'm going to be asked about this question a lot as time goes on. I'm just going to prepare you, until these inquiries are complete, until the oversight is finished, I will be rendering no opinion from the podium.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Joining us now with more on this story from Washington, CNN justice correspondent Kelli Arena.

Kelli, we're expecting some movement, aren't we, about some documents?

KELLI ARENA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, officials say that the CIA is going to start making documents accessible to the House Intelligence Committee, possibly as early as today. The hearing here, as you know, is scheduled for mid-January after the holiday break.

And Congress says that it wants to see all of the documents relating to those tapes, dating all the way back to the decision to make them in the first place.

So far officials say that the CIA's general counsel has agreed to testify at those hearings, but we haven't heard yet from the man who made the decision to destroy the tapes. It's Jose Rodriguez. Congress stands ready with a subpoena, though, if he doesn't volunteer to go to the Hill, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well, didn't the Department of Justice ask Congress to stall this?

ARENA: They did. They did. But you know, that's because the DOJ is conducting its own investigation. You heard the president talk about a preliminary investigation, that along with the CIA's inspector general.

Now, of course, public hearings and statements are going to complicate that. For example, a lot of criminal lawyers say witnesses can be influenced by what others are saying publicly or stories can change.

But Congress was intent. They say, "Look, we were blind-sided. We want to get to the bottom of this. We want to do it in our own way."

PHILLIPS: And what are they -- so what are they saying now?

ARENA: Well, the Justice Department still would prefer if Congress waited and let them do their investigation privately. You know, Congress heard that plea and said, "Thanks very much. We're going ahead."

PHILLIPS: All right. We'll track it. Kelli Arena, thanks. ARENA: You're welcome.

PHILLIPS: And we expect to see Rudy Giuliani walk out of a St. Louis hospital any moment now. These pictures are from yesterday, actually, in Missouri, just a few hours before he checked in, complaining of flu-like symptoms.

And a spokesperson says the Republican presidential candidate didn't feel well enough to continue on a flight to New York, but doctors found nothing alarming and cleared Giuliani to fly home today. We don't know why he still hasn't been released, but when we see him or get more information, you'll be the first to know.

U.S. troops uncover a hideout just north of Baghdad. They're calling it a torture complex. Wait until you see what they found.

And why it may be dangerous to have too much information. A report on cybercondriacs.

You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Got a situation happening right now in New Orleans, Louisiana. You're looking at New Orleans police officers trying to contain protesters just outside city hall.

Here's the situation. For years the housing developments in New Orleans have been just an incredible place for crime, drugs, murders, some of the highest rates in the country. And so there is a move to actually demolish the housing projects.

But see, people in New Orleans are saying, "Why demolish these housing projects when so many of us don't even have a place to live?"

So, you've got crime-infested housing projects. They want to finally tear them down. But you've got people in New Orleans saying, "We need some place to live. We can't afford to buy a home. Our homes have been demolished. Let us live in these housing developments."

So, while the vote is supposed to take place, the protesters actually tried to charge this gate at city hall. And you're seeing what broke out. About 300 protesters, we're told. Police had to get involved with stun guns and pepper spray.

And we just got to report minutes ago from a WDSU reporter, Travers Mackel. Here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRAVERS MACKEL, WDSU REPORTER: The protesters are here. They're chanting; they're cheering. Let's take a look.

You have a lot less standing at the gate right now. Once again, security is much more tighter. You have the mounted patrol here now. You have members of the SWAT team here. Now, they were here before. They have, it looks like, used two or three chain and padlocks for this fence. So, it's a lot -- it will be a lot more difficult to get in.

But we talked to Bill Quigley, one of the people who is leading this protest, as well as that man you saw in the video who was being tackled in a melee, if you will, with police. They told us there is no guarantee that, when the council votes, they won't try to break back in this gate and get inside.

So, still very chaotic, very heightened out here, if you will, when it comes to alertness and awareness. The protesters are on that side. We're over here with the police.

You can see it is a definite show of force by the police department. And they had that chaotic scene just about an hour ago that happened about five feet away from our camera, where protesters busted through, and the police had to use an extreme show of force.

Now, since that happened, it probably added 20 to 25 sheriff's deputies, police officers, out here to the scene to try to make sure that everything is safe. They have also closed off parts of Loyola Avenue right in front of civil district court and the council chambers -- Bruce (ph).

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: That's Travers Mackel, with our affiliate WDSU out of New Orleans. This video just coming in to us, as well, thanks to our affiliate there.

He was actually behind the city-hall gate. He's in a safe place, whereas the protesters, you can see, are on the other side of that gate there in front of city hall.

We're going to monitor this situation and let you know how it continues to develop throughout the afternoon. We're getting information by the minute right now. We'll let you know if things have settled down.

A long road trip for an Obama supporter right after the new year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSH MAHONEY, UNIVERSITY OF NORTHERN IOWA STUDENT: I'm going to drive 4 1/2 hours from Sioux Falls, South Dakota, in my Toyota Camry 1993 model. It's terrible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: We're going to tell you how thousands of college students are being courted in Iowa.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: One-fourteen Eastern Time right now. Here's some of the stories we're working on right now in the CNN NEWSROOM.

We're keeping a close eye on potentially violent weather in Mississippi and Louisiana. Chad Myers is all over it for us. There's already been a report of an apparent tornado near Brookhaven, Mississippi.

And a 15-year-old girl is in the hospital today, one day after she was rescued from the California wilderness, along with her father and two brothers. Lexi Dominguez woke up in the middle of the night, complaining of foot pain.

Republican presidential candidate Rudy Giuliani expected to go home today to New York. He was hospitalized for flu-like symptoms in St. Louis overnight, but doctors say that they found nothing of concern.

Now, before his trip to the hospital, Giuliani spoke with our Wolf Blitzer aboard CNN's Election Express. And among the topics, those tapes the CIA made and later destroyed of terror suspects being interrogated. Giuliani says the investigation should be on a few -- be on as few tracks as possible.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUDY GIULIANI (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you start taking away situations like this from the attorney general, then you end up in special counsel for this, independent counsel for that, special counsel for this.

I think this is one where we're going to get a pretty clear exposition of the facts by a Justice Department investigation. I do think you have to preserve for the president, and you have to preserve for our intelligence people at a time of grave national emergency, a certain amount of discretion to do what's necessary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Well, with Iowa caucuses only two weeks away, a new CNN/Opinion Research poll shows that Hawkeye State Republicans like Mike Huckabee. He leads the field with 33 percent, with Mitt Romney 8 points behind. Then grouped in a tight battle for third, Rudy Giuliani, John McCain and Fred Thompson.

On the Democratic side in Iowa, Hillary Clinton holds a slim lead, but the margin for error makes it a virtual three-way tie among Clinton and Barack Obama and John Edwards.

It's an irony of politics. The group with the biggest stake in the future is often the least likely to vote. In Iowa, with the caucuses now exactly two weeks away, all the presidential hopefuls want all the support they can get, and that includes the under-30 crowd.

One candidate in particular is counting on a big caucus turnout from college kids. Here's CNN senior political correspondent Candy Crowley. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Josh Mahoney, a junior at University of Northern Iowa, is caucusing for Obama. It's a logistical nightmare.

MAHONEY: I'm going to drive 4 1/2 hours from Sioux Falls, South Dakota, in my Toyota 1993 model. It's terrible. And I'm embarrassed. I'm going to come all the way down here, and I'm going to caucus.

CROWLEY: If they'll be 18 by the 2008 election and are registered to vote where they will caucus, Iowa college students, regardless of where they're from, can participate.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you're going to be out of state for the holidays, come back on January 3.

CROWLEY: Counting on students to trek back to college in the middle of winter break, two days after New Year's, is an iffy proposition. Even in-state students who can caucus at home are a tough get.

PROFESSOR ARTHUR SANDERS, DRAKE UNIVERSITY: You have to identify where they're going to be on January 3 and somehow communicate that to your field offices there: here's some people who you won't be able to contact now, because they're not there yet, but they're going to get there soon.

CROWLEY: Barack Obama is a hit on college campuses. He's young. He's new. He campaigns against status quo politics. More than any other campaign, Obamaville counts on the Joshes of Iowa.

MAHONEY: And I think we're, you know, at the right age. We're kind of get on board with, you know, a new strategy.

CROWLEY: One Obama strategist says the under-30 crowd is possibly the most highly-motivated bloc of Obama supporters. The campaign has spent the better part of the year collecting cell numbers and e-mail addresses.

John Edwards is targeting proven caucus-goers. Hillary Clinton aiming at middle-aged women, considerably safer bets than the under-30 set.

KRIS HASSTEDT, IOWA STATE UNIVERSITY STUDENT: I just called to invite you to a...

CROWLEY: Twenty-two-year-old Chris Hasstedt, an Iowa State senior, is a Clinton man himself, but he does sense that maybe the younger vote is coming of age.

HASSTEDT: I work at one of the grocery stores, which is mainly college students. And a lot of them, every time I go in there, it's a buzz about the candidates: who they're supporting, why -- where they're going to caucus and stuff like that.

CROWLEY: Some Iowa colleges are planning to open up part of campus over the break so students can caucus.

OBAMA: Thank you so much, Cornel.

CROWLEY: At Camp Obama, they believe -- they hope -- if college is open, they will come.

(on camera) A cautionary note of which the Obama campaign is well aware. In 2004, just 17 percent of caucus-goers were under 30.

Candy Crowley, CNN, Des Moines.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: And for all the day's political stories, including the close three-way race for Democratic votes in Iowa, log onto our special political news Web site. It's at CNNPolitics.com.

She welcomes most sex offenders to her mobile park.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would you rather that I let my men go live around the bridges of Pinellas County? Are you going to feel safer if I do that?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Giving the unwanted a second chance.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Holiday sales may be a little sluggish, but gadgets are flying off the shelves. Imagine that.

Susan Lisovicz, on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange with that and a look at the market.

It's true, boy. That's the hottest -- you go into these technological-type stores, I can't even keep up with everything, Susan.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's absolutely true. I've had to ask my producer about some of the gadgets that are on the hot list. What can I say? I mean, it is really -- there's just more and more out there on a daily basis.\

(STOCK REPORT)

PHILLIPS: We know that investors are concerned that the retail sales might be sluggish. But what items are so hot this year?

LISOVICZ: OK. Well, you know, you know that electronics are hot. Let's just establish that's one year -- area we're seeing a lot of strength.

Well, flat-screen TVs, again, the hottest item overall. We know what they are. We've also got digital camera, OK? We've got those. Notebook computers. Digital picture frames are seeing a big increase. And that's like a mini-computer where you can have lots and lots of pictures in there on display to show off baby pictures or whatever. That unit of sales saw a 500-percent increase from last year.

But we also want to tell you about a very unique gift, Kyra. And that is the health-care gift card. It is a gift card for prescriptions, paying off anything from co-pays to gym memberships. And we went on the Web site. It also says it will help you pay off elective procedures, including Lasik and cosmetic surgery.

So if somebody is looking for a little help, I guess you'll get it on this gift card. You can put up to $5,000 on it.

But on a serious note, health care is one of the biggest causes of personal bankruptcy. So it's...

PHILLIPS: Pretty creative.

LISOVICZ: It is creative and perhaps it's something that will, you know, be standard in the next few years.

PHILLIPS: All right. We'll talk a bit -- what have you got coming up in the next hit, more -- more creative technological ideas?

LISOVICZ: I think we're going to be talking about the housing sector once again.

PHILLIPS: OK, good.

LISOVICZ: Yes. I mean, that's -- that's pretty much an issue that we cover on a daily basis at this point.

PHILLIPS: Isn't that the truth? All right. Susan, we'll see you in a little bit.

LISOVICZ: You got it.

PHILLIPS: Well, it's just four walls and a floor, but what happened in this Iraq building will make your blood run cold.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: All right. We've got live pictures now coming out of New Orleans. This is via our affiliate WDSU. They're chanting "stop the demolition now."

And just to give you a little perspective of what's going on, these protesters are just outside city hall gates right now, and this is actually pretty calm, compared to the way it was just a little while ago. We're going to give you an inside look on that in just a second.

It actually got pretty crazy there. About 300 people tried to charge that gate into city hall, and New Orleans police right here had to respond with pepper spray and stun guns. Some of the protesters even kind of dropped to their knees when that happened. But they were pushing the gate, trying to get inside because there is a move now to demolish some of the housing projects there in New Orleans.

Now for years if you're familiar with the city, those housing developments have just been crime ridden. Murders were very high in those housing developments, a lot of the crime, a lot of drug running. It's been an ongoing problem for that city.

But at the same time, it's been home for hundreds and hundreds of people in that city. And so you have protesters saying don't tear them down. There are people that are living here that don't have homes that want to come back. Let them live in the housing developments. Meanwhile, you've got city officials saying no, there's too much murder, too much crime, we've got to tear them down.

So, that's the result is what you're seeing here. About 300 protesters outside city hall.

And just a little while ago Travers Mackel with our affiliate WDSU filed this report when it started getting a little hairy.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRAVERS MACKEL, WDSU REPORTER: Well, the new information I just spoke to a city hall spokesperson here, a lot of people have been asking, where is Mayor Ray Nagin? Is he going to make a comment. That city hall spokesperson told me moments ago in a text message that it's to be determined, that the mayor is around and there is a chance that he either could come down and make a statement or make one later in the day. But a lot of the people have been asking, where's the mayor in all of this? You can see the crowd again mounting up here toward the fence.

And that city hall spokesperson told me that it's still to be determined. The mayor is here. It's not known yet if he will come down, or if he will make a statement on the whole situation later in the day. You have to believe that there will be a comment from the mayor's office and from city hall with what is happening here at city hall in the council chambers and outside.

And these people are standing, I should point out, that you're looking at live in a storming rain. It's raining pretty hard outside, and they are rallied back up against the fence, obviously it's very peaceful. It doesn't look like it would be physically possible for them to break through the amount of chains and padlocks they have on these gates, but I don't know, you never know, enough people get behind it. Maybe so.

And as you heard from Bill Quigley in our live interview that we did, he can't promise that that's not going to happen.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Once again, that's Travers Mackel, a reporter there with one of our affiliates, WDSU. Now we're getting live pictures from our other affiliate WWL. These are live pictures right in front of city hall, a couple hundred, a few hundred actually, protesters saying they don't want those housing developments to be torn down. There are people that need those homes, and meanwhile city officials are saying no, they're full of crime, murder, drugs; they've got to go.

So we're going to continue to follow what's happening here in New Orleans, these protests outside city hall that turned a little violent just a little while ago. Police had to respond with pepper spray and stun gun, some of the protesters getting tagged with that. But we'll follow the protests, let you know how this all pans out, and exactly what happens with the vote as well, if those housing developments are going to be demolished.

(NEWSBREAK)

PHILLIPS: Many places won't let sex offenders live near schools or parks, or anywhere that kids might gather. But when they get out of prison they have to live somewhere. In Pinellas County, Florida dozens live at the palace, which is not what it sounds like, but CNN's John Zarrella reports, it is home.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Neatly kept, quiet, inconspicuous. At a glance the Palace Mobile Home Park on the outside of St. Petersburg looks like many in Florida. But look a little closer. There's a man carrying a battery pack for a tracking device under his arm. Another wears an ankle bracelet. Ninety-five men, nearly half the residents, are convicted sex offenders out on probation. Mike didn't want us to use his last name.

MICHAEL, SEX OFFENDER: Out there it's like the rest of the world, it's a jungle. In here, it's you our own little piece of paradise. I mean, we're safe here.

ZARRELLA: Along with many of the others in this adults-only park Mike was convicted of a sex crime against a child. He knows much of society has no stomach for what he did.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is in a confined area.

ZARRELLA: Sergeant Judy Vovan heads the Sheriff's Office Sexual Predator and Offender Tracking Unit. They are here constantly patrolling, going door to door, making unannounced checks.

SGT. JUDY VOVAN, PINELLAS COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE: We make sure that they know that we are going to be -- we're going to be an influence in here and that we're going to be -- they're going to see us in here, and very, very frequently.

ZARRELLA: The Palace was not always a kind of halfway house for sex offenders. The transition began when Nancy Morais came in to manage three years ago.

NANCY MORAIS, PARK MANAGER: If you could file that for me.

ZARRELLA: State and local restrictions make it difficult for sex offenders, like Bill, to find a place to live.

BILL, SEX OFFENDER: Nobody wants us out here. We're sex offenders, you know, and we are the bottom of the barrel.

ZARRELLA: Morais, who says she was sexually abused as a child, felt the mobile home park not near a school or a playground would be ideal, keeping them away from kids and giving them a chance to get back on their feet.

MORAIS: My question to my people in my community around, would you rather that I let my men go live around the bridges of Pinellas County? Are you going to feel safer if I do that? Or would you rather I keep them together in a closed community that is tightly watching.

ZARRELLA: Morais rents to offenders with the blessing of the park's owners. They would not talk with us. But Morais will not rent to men designated by the courts as sexual predators, the worst of the worst, those convicted of the most heinous and violent crimes. Nor does she volunteer to prospective renters that sex offenders are living here.

Teresa Atkins had no idea when she moved in a year ago. Did it bother her?

TERESA ATKINS, PARK RESIDENT: I'm very safe here. None of these men want to go back to jail. They will do anything to keep from going to jail.

ZARRELLA: Others are less than thrilled. One woman, who refused to go on camera, told me, quote, "They never told us nothing. My place is worth nothing now," end quote.

But so far, the palace's track record is good. Only one man in nearly three years has been re-arrested, and it was another offender living here who turned him in.

John Zarrella, CNN, Pinellas County, Florida.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Days before Christmas they were lost in a blinding snowstorm, not sure that they'd make it out alive. Well, they did. We're going to hear from a California family about their terrifying ordeal.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: We're going to take you back to New Orleans right now, getting these live pictures from our affiliate WDSU. These are protesters. Actually it's coming from WWL. I apologize, Both of our affiliates there are bringing us great live pictures out in front of city hall. These are protesters who do not want the housing developments to be destroyed.

There's a number of issues going on. Obviously after Katrina hit there are a lot of people suffering in New Orleans, lost their homes, haven't been able to come back. And so there are still people living in these housing developments that need to live there, obviously, because they have no other place to go.

And at the same time there are people that say, don't demolish these, we could live there, we could have some sort of home in New Orleans. But on the other side of things some of the worst crimes take place in these housing developments in New Orleans, murder, drug running, gang activity. It's been an ongoing problem for decades in the city of New Orleans.

And someone who knows about that crime all too well, retired New Orleans police Major Howard Robertson.

Howard, I appreciate you calling in, and I wanted to talk to you about this when I heard about these protests. I mean, back when I worked in New Orleans you were head of the SWAT team and you were getting called out to these developments a lot because of the crime. Kind of put in perspective what you dealt with and what the city has been dealing with, with regard to these housing developments for years.

HOWARD ROBERTSON, FMR. NEW ORLEANS POLICE MAJOR: Good evening, Kyra.

Well, Kyra, you know, it's kind of amazing to me, because long before the storm, the housing developments were falling down. They were -- half of the places were boarded up, they were vacant, and that's why a lot of the crack dealers were using the vacant apartments to sell drugs.

Murders were happening every day in the housing project because this was the main place for selling of narcotics. Now, they tore down the St. Thomas Housing Project way before the storm and rebuilt really nice condos. And the same people are occupying those condos. And crime went down when they spread the housing out, built some parks for the children to play in and put up nice homes.

And that's what they are attempting to do now. Nobody's trying to, like, get rid of the people who were in the housing projects. All they are trying to do is make the living, actually, better for them. And if you would see the condition of the buildings that they are trying to move back into, it's deplorable. No one would want anybody to live in those kind of conditions.

PHILLIPS: And just describe those for us, Howard. Because I remember when I was there 10 years ago, going into some of these projects, like the Desire Housing Development. And I remember just how dirty and run down -- there were rats, I mean, it was -- I couldn't believe that people actually lived in these developments. Explain to our viewers how bad they are, some of them.

ROBERTSON: Well, you just (INAUDIBLE) solid brick buildings, brick steps. When you walk into the hallways of these buildings, there's graffiti all over the stairways. Every door has to be a solid metal door, other wise the burglars would kick the door in and break into the people's apartment when they're not there. So there's solid metal doors in every apartment. There's -- plumbing leaks in most all of the places. The sewage is out in the courtyards. These buildings are really dilapidated and need to be torn down. You wouldn't want anyone to live in that kind of condition. This is all prior to the storm.

Since the storm they are even in worse condition. Windows are broken, more than a fourth of all of the buildings are boarded up where you can't even go in. So all the city is trying to do is actually improve the living conditions. But I think too many people are afraid that they tear the housing down there will be nowhere for them to go or it would take too long for them to build new housing. And they haven't been able to come to a compromise.

PHILLIPS: And that's interesting what you said about how some of these have been torn down and they've actually put better apartments in place of those. I'm just now getting a letter sent to me through my e-mail here, Howard. Stay with me a second.

ROBERTSON: All right.

PHILLIPS: It's actually been made out to all of the councilmen and councilwomen, and it's from the mayor. And it says, today you're planning to act on a critical issue that affects every resident of this city. Most directly impacts are public housing residents who, like other citizens, have been struggling to rebuild their lives and return home.

His memo goes on to say, just like restoring the city's infrastructure, reconstructing facilities for our first responders and rebuilding houses within our communities, the redevelopment and restoration of quality, livable homes for our resident who is live in public housing has been a top priority for this administration and city.

It says here, in the weeks following Hurricane Katrina, I, along with many of you, began working with the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development, HUD, under one principle. That every resident has the right to return to better living conditions and we must make it possible for them to do so. This principle must continue to guide every decision that is made today in the future.

And he is going on saying that they've agreed to -- or they asked HUD to agree to following. Place 1,000 units in service immediately, place an additional 1,000 units in service within another 90 days and target scattered site development for redevelopment using modular technology, providing an additional 750 units.

So it sounds like what you're talking about, Howard, if I -- correct me if I'm wrong -- that they want to tear down the old buildings and then put better, more operational units in those same areas. Is that right?

ROBERTSON: Absolutely. Absolutely.

PHILLIPS: OK. And so why... ROBERTSON: I was trying to...

PHILLIPS: Yes...

ROBERTSON: Go ahead...

PHILLIPS: Well, why would we see so many protesters trying to charge the gates of City Hall? This sounds like a win-win for all people involved.

ROBERTSON: There's a real fear factor in that the people living in the housing community feel that it may take a couple years to build these new homes. And they're like, where are we going to go for these couple years until we can come back? And they think that they can move right back into the housing projects tomorrow. And stay there until they have these new buildings erected.

PHILLIPS: Got it. So they want some sort of sense of security that if they are going to tear these down to rebuild, they want to be able to have a place to go.

ROBERTSON: Correct.

PHILLIPS: Yes.

ROBERTSON: They don't want to be displaced. And they are afraid that the city is trying to tear down their housing so that they cannot come back to New Orleans. And that's not the case at all. HUD was trying to tear down the housing projects way before Katrina ever hit New Orleans. HUD was trying to rebuild these into better living conditions for all of the people in New Orleans.

And they thought that it would stop crime, it would give people a better place to live. No one in New Orleans wanted people living in those housing projects. They were somewhere that you would just not want any human to have to live. And they are fighting to go back there. I don't understand that.

PHILLIPS: Retired New Orleans Police Major, Howard Robertson. You always help put things in to perspective, no matter what the story is. Coming out of New Orleans, Howard, thanks so much for your time.

ROBERTSON: Goodbye, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: We're going to follow, of course, those protests outside city hall.

Meanwhile, another story that we've been following. Chad Myers, boy, we got this video from another one of our affiliates. What would we do without our affiliates? WJTV, out of Lincoln County, Mississippi, right?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Right.

PHILLIPS: Actually showing us this storm damage from the severe weather today. What do we know about what's causing this? MYERS: Well there was a system there with a warning on it, with a tornado warning on it. Now, there is no way to know whether this is tornado damage or not. There's not really a building, per se, that I can say took a direct hit. And we could say that literal stick building, two by four structure, was knocked down by an F1, F2, F3. We see a lot of damage, we see a lot of metal pieces picked up and thrown into the trees, trees knocked down.

It appears that all of this was going in one direction. But obviously that's tough to see from video. The authorities will be out there looking to see if there was any spin to this, whether this was a tornado. But this is one of the storms earlier today, about 9:30 in the morning local time.

And this, about -- Brookhaven -- about four miles North of Brookhaven, into Mississippi. The storm here, there's Baton Rouge, there's New Orleans and Brookhaven right there, that possible storm into Mississippi. That cell, though, is now long since gone. There is Brookhaven Proper. But that cell has long since gone. Right now there are no warnings at all --Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right Chad, thanks so much.

Well the Internet can be a great tool if you're looking for information about what ails you. But beware of turning into a cyberchondriac. We'll explain.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: You can get all kinds of information from the Internet. But you have to be careful. Sometimes too much information can actually be unhealthy. Medical Correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen, here to warn us about becoming cyberchondriacs.

I have to admit, my entire family does this, friends and family. You start having these ailments, and you go on the Internet and you try to figure out what it could be.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: You think oh my God, I have cancer.

PHILLIPS: Yes, exactly. Meanwhile, it's a bad case of the flu.

COHEN: Right. And this is happening so much that people really have coined the term cyberchondriacs. It's just like being a modern day hypochondriac. And there's a great irony here because the Internet is full of great information and people should go searching to learn more about their diseases. But there is a point when you cross the line. So, how do you know when you've crossed over to the dark side and become a cyberchondriac? We have some hints here.

If you feel worse after surfing, if you go online and you're feeling pretty OK but you think, oh I've got a cold or a this or that and then afterwards you're like, oh my gosh this -- I'm really worried now, bad sign. You go to your doctor and say, doctor look at all of this stuff I printed out, I'm sure I've got a rare pancreatic tumor. And the doctor does tests and says no, sweetie, you're fine. And that doesn't help you, that's probably a sign that, you know, you should have a little talk with yourself.

And another sign that something might be wrong is if you diagnose yourself over the Internet. If you get on the Internet and you find symptoms that match up with yours and you're sort of curious, that's fine. But if you say oh my gosh, I'm sure that my shaky hand means that I have Parkinson's, you're sort of treading into some dark waters there.

PHILLIPS: All right, so if you think you're a cyberchondriac, what do you do?

COHEN: There's a couple of things that you can do to sort of do safe surfing without becoming a cyberchondriac. So, here are some hints that experts gave me. They said surf with clear objectives. If you want to find out what it means if you have a terrible sore throat and what are some treatments, stick to that. Don't sort of go freelancing into other kinds of symptoms.

Also, trust your intuition. As one hypochondriac said to me, I became convinced that I had a rare kind of brain tumor, but then when I really sat down and talked to myself and said, do you really think these headaches mean you have a brain tumor? She said her intuition told her no, she really just had headaches. So, trust your intuition.

PHILLIPS: Well, I'm lucky because I can e-mail you or Sanjay Gupta or my friend ...

COHEN: Yes, right.

PHILLIPS: ...who's a medical reporter in Texas, right, and I can get all this great information. But there's a lot of health information on the Internet. So, how do you know what's good information, bad information, besides going to your column at CNN.com?

COHEN: Right, of course, of course. CNN.com/health of course has fabulous information.

Studies have shown that people actually don't often look at the sources of information. And that's so important. If you're curious about heart problems and you're with the American Heart Association site, you're on safe ground. If you're at a site that's run by the government, you're probably on safe ground.

But if you're at a site that you know, Bobby wants to give all of his opinions about what to do about toe fungus, well, who's Bobby? What does he know about toe fungus? So, consider the source. That is so crucial. And if you go to CNN.com/health right now, you can see my column that talks about this.

PHILLIPS: Why did you pick toe fungus?

COHEN: Oh, I just -- because ...

PHILLIPS: I just pulled it out of a hat. COHEN: It just came to me.

PHILLIPS: OK, Elizabeth, thank you.

COHEN: Thanks.

PHILLIPS: Well, straight ahead, bumpers barely getting by on new crash tests. New results that you're going to have to hear, especially if you drive a minivan.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, a toy our consumer reporter Greg Hunter warned us about earlier this week has been recalled in Connecticut. State officials say that they're pulling the popular "CSI" Fingerprint Examination Kit from the show, but it's probably under Christmas trees already. The state says that fingerprint dust in the kit contains asbestos. And so far, Connecticut's the only state to recall the product. The state is sending its information to the Consumer Product Safety Commission in Washington.

And when they decided to call them minivans, well, they weren't describing the cost of fixing their bumpers. It turns out that those minor dents and scratches could put a major dent in family finances.

Our Greg Hunter shows us why.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GREG HUNTER, CNN CONSUMER CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These bumper tests replicate a front and back collision at six miles per hour, as well as front and rear corner bumps at three miles per hour. Low speed crashes represent an estimated 80 percent of property liability insurance claims. The damage to this Nissan Quest may not look bad, but the Institute says there's $3,500 damage.

JOE NOLAN, INSURANCE INST. FOR HIGHWAY SAFETY: The Nissan Quest was the worst performer in our tests. It failed miserably in our full-width, six mile an hour rear impact.

HUNTER: The Quest had more than $8,000 worth of total damage from the combined front, rear, and corner bumper tests. Nissan told CNN the Insurance Institute's tests are quote "not related to safety," adding, "The Nissan Quest performs competitively in terms of cost of repair."

Five other minivans racked up similar damage in the combined tests. Even the top performer, the Honda Odyssey, needed more than $5,000 worth of repairs. Honda told us quote "We're very pleased to have the lowest repair costs within the group of tested minivans. Honda continually is striving to improve our vehicles -- to keep crash repair costs in check."

The Institute says car makers could easily design better bumpers.

NOLAN: There's plenty of room under the bumper cover to make bumper bars wider, taller and stronger to protect the expensive parts, like hoods, fenders, and headlamps.

HUNTER: Greg Hunter, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: The politics of Christmas, 'tis the season for ho-ho- ho, vote for me.

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