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No One Can Hide Forever; After Years As Rebel Hostages, They Walk Out Of The Jungles Of Colombia As Free Women; No Red Carpet, No Acceptance Speeches, No Best And Worst Dressed, Could This Really Be The Golden Globes
Aired January 13, 2008 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: No one can hide forever. Tonight a sighting of a man wanted in the horrific murder of a pregnant marine in North Carolina. How close are the cops?
After years as rebel hostages, they walk out of the jungles of Colombia as free women.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A thousand thank you to all my friends and my fellow countrymen. You don't have to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: We'll bring you their heroine tales.
People in the northeast are going to bed tonight in one world but they may wake up tomorrow in a very different one. That's because a nor'easter is blowing their way.
He was a top executive at Microsoft. He could say he had it all, but he turned his back on the good life. Why?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How can you live in a world with so much abundance and have something is lacking in books on children's lives.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: For this man, it's all in a book.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the Golden Globe goes to.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: No red carpet, no acceptance speeches, no best and worst dressed, could this really be the Golden Globes? It is and we've got the winner. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.
And good evening, everyone. I'm Tony Harris tracking tonight what may be a key moment in the nationwide hunt for suspected killer. The victim you'll recall, a 20-year-old active duty marine. She was 8 months pregnant. The body found burned and buried is believed to be her. Then today, the man police think murdered her may have popped up on the radar. I say again, maybe. Do this for me here.
Draw a line from Camp Lejeune, North Carolina to Shreveport, Louisiana. It is about 1,000 miles. But it's where more than one person has reported seeing a man who fits the description of the Marine Corporal Cesar Armando Laurean. They saw this man at this bus station. Coming or going, no one's sure. But tonight, as far as leads go, it's the only one murder investigators actually have. So we wait for word, any word from the marines, from police or from anyone in the country who may see this desperate man charged with murder and on the run.
We just learned of this awful crime a few days ago. But the events leading up to it go back almost a year. Here's CNN's Rusty Dornin.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): April 2007, Lance Corporal Maria Lauterbach tells her superiors at Camp Lejeune she was raped by Corporal Cesar Laurean, a fellow persona clerk. She's pregnant. An investigation begins. That's also when her family says her nightmare really began.
PETER STEINER, MARIA LAUTERBACH'S UNCLE: She was scared and didn't know what was going to happen to her. And so during this process, after she eventually did report it she was consistently harassed by other marines.
DORNIN: In May, a protective order is issued by the marines against Laurean. Then in October Camp Lejeune marine commanders request the military version of a grand jury investigation. In December, Lauterbach was due to testify. On the 14th is the last time her mother speaks to her by phone. The same day a woman believed to be Lauterbach buys a bus ticket to El Paso, Texas, for the following day. The ticket was never used.
On December 19th, Lauterbach's mother calls police and says her daughter is missing. After she disappeared the marines listed her on unauthorized leave. The day before Christmas, police say Corporal Laurean uses Lauterbach's ATM card. On January 9th, the marine corps at Camp Lejeune says it's cooperating with the Onslow County Sheriff's Department. There was speculation that the pregnant marine might be alive.
But then on January 11th, a break in the case. Laurean's wife Cristina notifies the sheriff's department that her husband gave her a note. In the note, Corporal Laurean claims the pregnant marine committed suicide and he buried her.
SHERIFF ED BROWN, ONSLOW COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA: Mrs. Lauterbach is dead and has been buried here at Onslow County. The suspect in the case is the marine accused by her for assaulting her.
DORNIN: But Laurean fled four hours before his wife notified authorities. Something that surprised military investigators.
PAUL CICCARELLI, NAVAL INVESTIGATOR: He was considered not a flight risk. There's a lot of factors in this investigation that obviously I can't divulge. It's still an active investigation as far as this rape complaint that I can't share with you at this point in time.
DORNIN: His wife said Laurean left their home at 4:00 a.m. that morning. The search was on to find Lauterbach's remains. They find blood spattered on the walls and ceiling at the marine corporal's home and a grim find in the backyard fire pit.
BROWN: The body was much charred. It appeared that the body of the adult was lying over on the side with the facedown in the bottom of the pit.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: Man, these are just gruesome details. Our Rusty Dornin joins us now from Jacksonville, North Carolina. And Rusty, you know, there seem to be a lot of excitement about the reported sighting in Shreveport and now questions.
DORNIN: Well, it just -- we've heard these witnesses saw -- purportedly saw Laurean at the bus station in Shreveport. But now law enforcement officials went at Shreveport and here are a little bit skeptical. U.S. Marshal's office is saying there are no confirmed sightings. And they're also saying the person who bought the bus ticket, apparently these people saw bought a ticket from Dallas to Shreveport and was seen there at some point, which is a little bit confusing.
We did speak to the sheriff here a little earlier and he's saying, well, you know, we're going through this all now. He hadn't even spoken to investigators in Shreveport, but there are some things that may be contradicting that sighting. So there are still a manhunt on. The FBI announced today that they are also joining in investigating the case. In the meantime, of course, the circumstances surrounding Maria Lauterbach's death remain and her body will be taken to Chapel Hill, North Carolina, presumably tomorrow for the official autopsy.
HARRIS: OK, Rusty Dornin for us in Jacksonville, North Carolina. Rusty Appreciate it. Thank you.
North Carolina police believe the Louisiana suspect sighting is credible, their word. But really, in the time since Laurean was named suspect, the entire country is now a search area. Mike Brooks is on the phone with me right now. He is our security analyst, a former detective, former FBI agent.
Mike, let's be clear about this. This is absolutely national manhunt. And if we're looking now, Louisiana, possibly Texas, we also need to think about Mexico, don't we?
MIKE BROOKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, Tony. You know, when people are on a run, where do they try to go? They try to get over the border to Mexico, you know, because -- because you get down there and the authorities are not so, you know, they don't want to get you back to the United States so much. Well you know, but when we hear what Rusty just reporting, is you know, they're not so sure.
Well, the FBI right now, they have UFAP warrant. It's Unlawful Flight to Avoid Prosecution. Now, that is so if anybody anywhere in the country happens to find this guy, they can snatch him up and say, yep, we're holding you. And that's basically a holding charge. Now, the U.S. Marshals, you know, they usually get their man or their woman. But, you know, in this particular case, this guy, you know, he's not stupid, Tony.
HARRIS: Right, right.
BROOKS: He knows, you know, he's Latino, you know, he's Hispanic. He speaks the language. He can get around if he has to get down into Texas, get down towards Brownsville, that kind of way. But again, you know, they're looking at the video because most of the bus stations, Tony, they have video. And they can take a look and say, OK, is this the guy or is it not the guy? Now, you know, there's been a lot of -- there's been a lot of criticism of the investigative part, why didn't they hold this guy?
HARRIS: Yes.
BROOKS: You know, well, if you look back, the sexual assault, the alleged rape against her happened on the base. So, you know, a lot of people say, oh, why didn't Onslow County hold this guy? Well, Tony, when it happens on the base, it's the Marine Corps, military police, and the NCIS. They were criminal investigator service, they were doing the initial investigation. So, you've got that and there were in the initial report that we've talked about over and over again, in the last four days, they said there were inconsistencies in her statement. Even her mother said, oh, you know, she's a liar. Well, you know what, that's out of the window right now.
HARRIS: Yes.
BROOKS: But when you look at the reports, law enforcement, the local law enforcement, Onslow County, Sheriff Brown, all his people can do is go on what they have. Now, you know, I think there was a little bit of problem, what I'm seeing as a former investigator, Tony, I see that there was a little bit of problem on communication between the Marine Corps, NCIS and the local authorities when she was reported missing.
Her roommate who found a note, there was a note there that said, you know, I'm going to leave, I'll be -- you know, I'm going to leave for a while, I'm happy with the marines, you know, he reported her as missing. They reported -- the Marine Corps said, she's now U.A., Unauthorized Absence. She wasn't reported as AOL.
Now, did the local authorities know about this former sexual assault, you know, back when they first started the investigation? I tell you what, I'm a little troubled, Tony, about the communication. HARRIS: Well, Mike, I got to tell you something, this is a real reporter story right now because there are so many. You just listed another set of questions to be answered. A real reporter story right now and perhaps we'll get some clear answers here in the days to come. Mike Brooks on the line with us this evening. Mike, appreciate it. Thanks.
BROOKS: Thank you, Tony.
HARRIS: As if this case wasn't complicated and twisted enough, there's also a gray area when it comes to who's in charge. A military victim, civilian jurisdiction, and if the suspect fled the state, well, there's the FBI. Tonight we brought in a military legal expert to help us sort it all out.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS (voice-over): The murder victim and active duty member of the United States Marine Corps. The murder suspect, an active duty member of the United States Marine Corps. So far, the only public face of the investigation belongs to a civilian sheriff. So where's the Marine Corps? What are they doing to bring in their fugitive corporal? And who gets him when or if he's eventually arrested?
GWEN LINDSAY-JACKSON, FORMER PROSECUTOR NEW YORK NATIONAL GUARD: When the authorities catch him, and I presume that's going to be is civilian authorities because the civilian authorities is -- they're the authorities that have jurisdiction over this investigation with the murder and with the investigation in the beginning with finding the whereabouts of the young lady and now enforcement turns out to be a murder investigation.
It is their primary jurisdiction. This is something that was said by, you know, the military investigator, that primary jurisdiction does rest with the civilian authorities with this particular case.
HARRIS (on-camera): But you said something interesting, that he is likely to be captured by the civilian authorities. That makes me wonder if the FBI, if NPs (ph) are involved in helping to find him?
LINDSAY-JACKSON: Well, I think we heard in the beginning when the sheriff first put out his statement, he said that he got cooperation from various law enforcement officers. Now that doesn't mean that, you know, the jurisdiction changes. It just means that everybody is trying to put their arms around this and cooperate. So if he moves across state lines, obviously the FBI would be involved with trying to seek and find him. Obviously the military would want to help in any way they're can because here we're talking about one of their marines. But primary jurisdiction, it's important to remember this, does rest with the civilian authorities for the murder investigation and for the seeking of this marine that's on the lamb.
HARRIS (voice-over): And then there's the question of whether this suspect, Corporal Laurean, should have ever been allowed to come and go as he pleased. He was, after all, accused of a very serious crime, a sexual assault. Our legal expert says an accusation and a formal charge are two very different things.
LINDSAY-JACKSON: We hadn't gotten to the point where this person was even officially charged with the sexual assault. We were just in the investigation. He was entitled to due process. Now, with the civilian authorities, it sounds like when they got a hold of the case, I don't know how many days late it was, it sounds like when they got a hold of it, they were obligated to go ahead and move forward with the investigation.
And there are a couple of things that, you know, they could have done and maybe they had done it, perhaps they could have monitored the coming and goings of the marine when he left the base. Now, these were not recoups. These were people, again that were, you know, they were already trained. They were performing their jobs. And they were allowed to leave the base. So my understanding is that both of these parties live off-base. So again, without a formal charge with all this murkiness with the military, I'm not really entirely sure, you know, if they had any obligation to hold him on the base in light of what was happening.
HARRIS: Of course, we'll never know what the investigation would have found. The body with unborn baby believed to be Lance Corporal Maria Lauterbach was found just this weekend, buried in Laurean's backyard.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: Now, just in the past few minutes really we did get an official statement from the U.S. Marine Corps at Champ Lejeune, North Carolina. It's says, the corps quote, Collecting information and conducting a review to determine what information was available to commanders -- it goes on -- "We understand the press and public desire to know what happened, but we want to ensure whatever information we release is accurate and that our release of information would not adversely impact any on going investigation and/or future judicial proceeding."
Change gears here. Let's talk about the weather. Boy, a big winter storm is rumbling into the northeast and New England tonight dumping a lot of snow and threatening to make a real mess of tomorrow's commute. Let's check in now with meteorologist Jacqui Jeras in the CNN severe weather center. Are we talking nor'easter here, Jacqui?
(WEATHER REPORT)
HARRIS: And the show did go on. Can you really call it a show? The 65th Annual Golden Globes Awards was the shortest, that's not bad, and certainly the least glamorous ever because of the Hollywood's writer strike. It was essentially a news conference. Categories were read, winners were announced and folks went on their way. CNN's "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT" anchor Brooke Anderson and our Kareen Wynter were there. Ladies good to see you.
Hey Kareen, you know I love you but I want to toss this first question to Brook, as we see the video of Brooke Anderson sashaying across the stage as a presenter.
KAREEN WYNTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Give it up for her, Tony.
HARRIS: Wow, let's give it up for Brooke Anderson. Hey Brooke, what was that like for you tonight?
BROOKE ANDERSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, I have to tell you, my heart was beating so fast, Tony. I was a little bit nervous. And the other announcers and I were sitting up there on stage. And I kind of looked at Jim Moret and Lara Spencer and we said, this is so bizarre, this is so surreal, what are we doing here? This is the Golden Globes announcement, you know.
And I know, you can say it, it was dull compared to ceremonies in the past. It was. It was a straight news conference. But at the same time, we all know these awards are very important to the performers and the nominees. And a lot of them have told me over the past couple of weeks that they weren't going to be watching, whether it be at their homes or a private dinner with the cast and crews. So, you know, people still were paying attention, I'm sure.
HARRIS: Well, Kareen, I got to tell you something. I love you tonight on "LARRY KING." You were trying to defend the show and defend Brooke.
WYNTER: Yes, it was just me alone.
HARRIS: Yes.
ANDERSON: Thank you, Kareen.
HARRIS: Against the swings and arrows of Debbie Matenopoulos, I can't remember her name there, sitting up there with Larry.
WYNTER: (INAUDIBLE) good.
HARRIS: I'm sorry. I'm picking a fight here and that's not fair. But I got to ask you. I don't know who won in the major categories. You got a bit of a rundown for me? Who was the big winner tonight?
WYNTER: I actually do but who cares. It's all about the presenters on stage, Tony. My goodness. Well, I'll give you one category. OK? In the best motion picture, musical or comedy, well "Sweeney Todd." Let's go back to the interesting stuff. All the other presenters. And this really -- I feel, we are success because it was a last minute scramble to really get this event on, can't even call it a show. The phones are ringing on Friday. They were looking for people to represent on the stage. And you know, I had an interesting conversation with the after rehearsal today.
It lasted 28 minutes. And Brooke has said, you know, it was really impromptu. That it want to be scripted. They ran through it quickly. And the fact that this went off, you know, without any snags, any kind of interruption. It's great. ANDERSON: I have to say thank you for trying to defend us. Me, participating. I really appreciate that change. And you know, one thing that stood out to me, Tony, is that the awards were kind of swift. They were given out kind of evenly between the movies "Atonement" was the leading nominee coming in here tonight and walked away with two Golden Globes. The "Diving Bell and the Butterfly" two, "No Country for Old Man" two, "Sweeney Todd," two.
So there were a lot of excited people out there hoping to move forward with Oscar nominations as well. We'll just have to see if the Oscars suffer the same fate as the Golden Globes.
HARRIS: Sure and to that point, I'm wondering whether or not, and I'll throw this out to both of you, whether or not the fact that this big night, I mean let's face it, they are two big nights for Hollywood, this one and the Oscars, the fact that this one is truncated and looks like a news conference, could that have the power of bringing new sides together? But I got to tell you, if you look at it, it feels like the writers may be are feeling a little victorious tonight.
WYNTER: Well, absolutely. This is a huge victory. I have to agree with this, for the writers. It took a lot to really bring things down the way they did. You know, the bet went on but it feels (INAUDIBLE). It's not the same. We love Brooke but there was no Angelina Jolie in the crowd.
And interestingly enough, Tony, I attended an Oscar meeting last week about the balloting process. Hey, people were so nervous. I asked them; will the show go on, what are your plans? And they even were skeptical about even saying no comment. They have to be shaking in their boots when the academy awards.
ANDERSON: And they say that the show will go on with or without writers. But you know, the writer's guild will picket if they don't give the academy awards a waiver to go on without the show. So who is going to attend the show from the Screen Actors Guild because they have been showing solidarity with these writers from the very beginning of this strike, November 5th. And I have to say, the writers really made a statement tonight. They demonstrated their power by bringing this show down to its truncation that it was.
HARRIS: Yes and you two made strong statements tonight as well. Brooke, great job tonight and Kareen, outstanding in defending our colleague. Good to see you both. That was a lot of fun. Thank you ladies.
And still to come in the NEWSROOM tonight, they are free and they are talking.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): There are people who are ill. And all the soldiers and policemen, the fact is they're in chains. It's painful. They have them 24 hour as day that way. And to live in that situation is very difficult. (END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Two former hostages are released after years in rebel captivity. We take you through their dramatic ordeal.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Former hostage Clara Rojas is back in Colombia's capital for the first time in nearly six years. Rojas return to Bogota today after being released by leftist rebels who held her hostage all that time. On Thursday, the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia or FARC handed over Rojas.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARA ROJAS, FORMER HOSTAGE (through translator): A thousand thank you to all my friends and my fellow countrymen. I feel to return to my country, I come from Venezuela but I feel happy to be back here and being reborn.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Well, the rebels still hold dozens of other hostages including three U.S. contractors. Rojas is release capped weeks of drama that began back in early December. That's when the rebels announced they would free Rojas and her 3-year-old son along with former Colombian congresswoman Consuelo Gonzales. It was all part of a deal that Venezuela's president Hugo Chavez helped to broker.
Isha Sesay of CNN's international has closely followed this story. I talked with her about why it took so long to get the hostages freed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ISHA SESAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The stumbling block, at least widely believed, is that they didn't have the 3-year-old child. The 3-year-old child was in the possession of child services in Bogota. And that's what grounded the halt.
On Thursday, we hear that they were told (INAUDIBLE) where to go deep in the jungle to take along some Red Cross helicopters to get these women. We have the video of the moment when they handed over to these Red Cross officials. They're so clearly relieved. They're thin but they look apparently healthy. And there you have it. More than a five-year ordeal brought suddenly to an end.
HARRIS: What did they say? I know they've been talking to the media. Any allegations, ill treatment, abuse, torture at the hands of these rebels?
SESAY: No explicit allegations of abuse. But it has to be said as Consuelo Gonzales says -- Consuelo Gonzales is the former congresswoman -- the 57-year-old that was held hostage. She says, you know, being keep away from your family could be consider torture. I mean, these women that were living deep in the jungle, they're forced to deal with the insects, the diseases, rudimentary health care.
They described how the male hostages that FARC hold, some of them chained by their neck to post. And at night they're chained by their feet. You know, they see the fear of being in the jungle while the Colombian military conduct these military operations and constantly being in fear for their live.
HARRIS: Well, tell us about FARC. I mean, my goodness. Who is this group and what is the beef ultimately with the Colombian government. And I got a quick follow up, about the fact that there are a number of hostages. We focused on this group here but there are a number of hostages in the 700 range?
SESAY: Well, FARC are the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia. They are Colombia's oldest enemy. Considerably, they're most able in terms of rebels that are challenging the government. FARC is essentially a Marxist group. They want to overthrow the Colombian government. They've been trying to do so since the 1960s. They have been taking hostages. According to Colombian authorities, they have at least 700. And they're taking them for ransom and for political leverage.
HARRIS: Among them, Americans as well.
SESAY: That's right. That's right.
HARRIS: At least three contractors?
SESAY: Three contractors that were taken when their plane went down during a drug eradication flight. They are held by FARC rebels. Now, you know, the thing to point out here is, with these two women walking to freedom. You know, the real hope is that what we're going to see is more of these kinds of episodes, more people, you know, walking out -- walking out of the hands of rebels.
There's no sign of that. Americans, we don't know how they're doing. Another high value prisoner they have, Ingrid Betancourt, who is French Colombian presidential candidate. In fact, she was seized when Betancourt and Clara Rojas were campaigning. That's why they were taken hostage. And Rojas said she hasn't seen Betancourt for over three years.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: And you know we have a happy update on this story tonight. Clara Rojas has been reunited with her son in Bogota.
Coming up, "Dog Bone Politics." A lot of the presidential hopefuls are tightening their belts but most of them are still paying their staff, all except one. So what's up with Rudy?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Here doing a little "Dog Bone Politics" here? Well, call it the ultimate insult for a Republican, getting compared to a Democrat that tops tonight's "Dog Bone Politics."
This is what Republican Mitt Romney told our Wolf Blitzer today, that his rival, Mike Huckabee stump speech reminded him of a certain Democrat who is running for president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MITT ROMNEY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This kind of divisive populous approach is like he's channeling John Edwards. It's not working for John Edwards. It's not going to work for Mike Huckabee. He said he cut taxes. How disingenuous could that be?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Huckabee later fired back at Romney accusing him of raising billions of fees while serving as Massachusetts governor.
Kind words for Hillary Clinton from what you might call an unlikely source. Former Republican House Speaker Newt Gingrich credits her victory in New Hampshire to her willingness to change course after Iowa in a podcast to his supporters. Gingrich says, Clinton, quote, "I fought back with greater and greater intensity and she opened herself up." In his words, "She talked as a person without all the protection, without all the discipline and she became more and more appealing."
Some of Rudy Giuliani's top lieutenants are volunteering to work without pay. About a dozen top advisers to Giuliani won't get paid this month. A sign the campaign is a little concerned about the cash flow. A campaign spokesman said, quote, "We want to make sure we have enough to win." He also says, none of us joined this campaign for money.
Racial slice or misinterpretations? That's the issue at the heart of a dust up between the Clintons and Obamas. And the hits keep on coming.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Barack Obama's wife is supporting and defending her husband. Michelle Obama was in Atlanta tonight speaking at the Annual Trumpet Awards ceremony. She talked about her husband's work as a community organizer in Chicago and his achievement at Harvard. She also made reference she might say indirectly, to these comments by Former President Clinton.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL CLINTON, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: You said in 2004, you didn't know how you would have voted on the resolution. You said in 2004, there was no difference between you and George Bush on the war. And you took that speech you're now running on off your website in 2004, and there's no difference in your voting record and Hillary's ever since. Give me a break. This whole thing is a biggest fairytale I've ever seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: OK. Now, since his original remarks Bill Clinton said his fairytale comment has been misinterpreted. He says, he was only referring to Barack Obama's Iraq views, not his overall message or his campaign to be president. But tonight, Michelle Obama, well, she doesn't see it that way.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHELLE OBAMA, SEN. BARACK OBAMA'S WIFE: Sometimes we feel its better not to try at all than to try and fail. These are complicated emotions left in our heads and our hearts from years of struggle. Emotions we must face if we're going to overcome as a community, if we want to lift ourselves up. We must do it in the face of those who will attempt to play on those emotions for their own purposes, to discourage us from believing what is possible, to dismiss this moment as an allusion, a fairytale.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Huh. CNN contributor Roland Martin joins me tonight. All right, Roland, you were there tonight listening to Michelle Obama. Help me understand. What's going on here, the Obamas and the Clintons.
ROLAND MARTIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A vicious and intense battle for the Democratic nomination.
HARRIS: Yes.
MARTIN: And obviously...
HARRIS: So we shouldn't be surprised.
MARTIN: No, we shouldn't be surprised.
HARRIS: That it gets a little chirpy.
MARTIN: We shouldn't be surprised. You should expect the fact that the Clintons are going to play rough and tumble. I talked to a couple of members of Congress tonight who have not endorsed anyone and they said they are going to play rough and tumble.
The Obama folks said, we know that's going to happen. They say they plan on throwing sharp elbows as well. Here's the real interesting part. Clinton goes on "Meet the Press" today. Senator Clinton, she says that it's the Obama campaign pushing this issue. But in reality they haven't been. This issue really heated up among black talk shows, among blogs, and these kinds of discussions. In fact, when Andrew Cuomo made a comment about "Shuck and Jive".
HARRIS: Shuck and Jive, yes.
MARTIN: I -- you know, I had made comment about it. When Shaheem (ph) made his comment...
HARRIS: On your nationally syndicated radio show.
MARTIN: On the essence.com and my blog, I didn't want to say anything. I got tons of e-mail saying, why aren't you saying something? And I was going, OK, what's going on here? The Obama campaign was being pushed to respond. Trust me, I was calling and saying, hey, got a statement?
HARRIS: Yes, that's right.
MARTIN: The Obama campaign does not want to have this conversation. They do not want there to be this focus, because they don't want there to be this focus on race because, again, here's a biracial candidate who wants to run a more uplifting campaign, who wants to say forget divisiveness, it's about bringing us together. But, the feeling --
HARRIS: Push back.
MARTIN: But the feeling that's out here is that the Clinton campaign wants to bait them into talking about race. Now that's what folks are saying, is this whole interesting dynamic, because, well, if we bring up race, he has to respond. But he doesn't want to respond, so what do we do? It's wild.
HARRIS: It's OK to want Barack Obama to talk about if you're an African-American, if you're white in this country, if you're Hispanic in this country, you're Asian, it's OK to want Barack Obama as this black candidate, running for the highest office in the land, to want to talk about race in this country.
MARTIN: Not necessarily true. Because again, it's just like the question, do you want Senator Clinton always talking about gender? No. You obviously want to appeal to male voters as well. So there's a balance then. Obama, what they're saying is look, we recognize where America is. And that, if you have an overt campaign by race, all of a sudden people say, well, is this a Jesse Jackson campaign? Is this 84-88? He is trying to say I'm running a different kind of campaign. And so even when you get...
HARRIS: Is that a different kind of campaign that ignores race?
MARTIN: No, no.
HARRIS: Because as an African-American, don't you -- don't you want to know what he thinks about affirmative action, don't you want to know whether he believes in set asides -- minority set asides for government contracts? Don't you want to know?
MARTIN: But first and foremost, those are different than what these particular issues here on.
HARRIS: Yes.
MARTIN: Like for instance, we're talking about the whole point on about the LBJ and King, she says my comments were being distorted. Now if the Obama campaign really wanted to hit hard, they could have said well, Senator Clinton your real choice for president than he was Barry Goldwater. She's a Barry Goldwater girl and if he was president, there have been no civil rights laws.
I mean, that could have been won the response. Their deal was we don't want to get involved. We really don't want to talk about it. In fact, they have tried to have these very, you know, nice little interesting little comments. Again, the Obama campaign does not want to go down this street because they know how volatile the race is. And if you are an African American candidate, do you really want more white voters saying here they go talk about race. No, that's the whole back of report.
HARRIS: Wow.
MARTIN: Then of course, the Bob Johnson's comment today, takes it to a whole different level.
HARRIS: Yes, yes. I got it here somewhere.
MARTIN: All right. Because what I saw it, it was a talk all tonight.
HARRIS: Well, hang on a second. Do we have it? We've got a cued up on it? All right, let's listen to it. They'll show it.
MARTIN: Sure.
HARRIS: OK.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT JOHNSON, FOUNDER BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION: And to me as an African American, I am, frankly, insulted that the Obama campaign would imply that we are so stupid that we would think Hillary and Bill Clinton who have been deeply and emotionally involved in black issues, when Barack Obama was doing something in the neighborhood, but I won't say what he was doing, but he said it in his book.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Put the blackberry down.
MARTIN: No, no. I'm pulling out this because this is what happened. After that comment, the Clinton campaign sent a statement out from Bob Johnson saying, quote, "My comments today were referring to Barack Obama's time spent as a community organizer and nothing else. Any other suggestion is simply irresponsible and incorrect."
HARRIS: Because folks thought he was referring to the mention in the book.
MARTIN: I met Bob Johnson. I interviewed and respect him. I think Bob Johnson is flat out not telling the truth. I think there was no doubt he was making a reference to the issue of drugs. Because if you're part of community organizing, what wouldn't you just say. HARRIS: Why wouldn't you say it?
MARTIN: And this is one of those gray areas that, well, I didn't say it, because Mr. Hanes (ph) said it. And Clinton apologized. He got fired.
HARRIS: And Roland, you don't like, here's what you don't like this in back and forth. You don't like, if the Clinton folks believe it, say it. Own it.
MARTIN: Right.
HARRIS: You don't, right?
MARTIN: Yes, right.
HARRIS: Not the surrogate.
MARTIN: I don't like dancing. In my view is, if he says it, again, it's like, well, he said it, but then now he's -- he makes a statement, he gets picked up, put on associated press that he was referring to the drug story. Then he come back and says, no, in the statements, I really wasn't referring to that. Well, I don't get. This is just me. (INAUDIBLE). Tony, if I want to say something and I was referring to community organizing, I will say it. But when you listen to it, it's a reflection in how he actually said it, we know what he was implying.
HARRIS: Now, in the final analysis, Roland, is this much ado about nothing? Will we eventually get back to real issues?
MARTIN: This is...
HARRIS: Economy, healthcare?
MARTIN: Well, first of all, those issues obviously are not really talked about in this whole back and forth, back and forth. What this is about, pure and simple, is South Carolina. This is about the campaign. Obama right now, various polls says he's leading by 13. And Clinton wants to knock him out of the top spot. Obama wants to win it.
This is the battle for South Carolina. Right now, 40 percent of black women in South Carolina are undecided. There's this back and forth between the both. And trust me, you know, I think what's going to happen is, personally, I think this is where Howard Dean head of the DNC, should come out and make a statement and say, hey, enough of this. Clinton camp, Obama camp, enough of this. Let's go about the issues. This is ridiculous. Our top two candidates are having take and take back and forth about this.
But it may not be, you know, go on because tomorrow morning, Tony, at 7:40, I will be interviewing Bill Clinton on my radio show and I'm going to ask him out right.
HARRIS: Good. MARTIN: Because I'm just sorry.
HARRIS: Yes. Clear it up.
(CROSSTALK)
HARRIS: Let's move on, if we can.
MARTIN: Let's get back to people not having jobs, manufacturing jobs being lost, both issues, education. That's more important than all this drama back and forth.
HARRIS: CNN contributor, there he is, Roland Martin, on the radio tomorrow here and CNN every other day.
MARTIN: Not sure (INAUDIBLE). Clinton people are saying I'm a Obama supporter and Obama is saying I'm a Clinton supporter.
HARRIS: Exactly.
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: And so my whole deal is (INAUDIBLE) exactly where you suppose to be. Be honest and truthful. That's what it's about.
HARRIS: Good to see you, Roland.
MARTIN: Appreciate it.
HARRIS: All of you in the northeast, whoa, brace yourself. When you wake up in the morning, it might look a lot different outside.
Jacqui?
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Absolutely, Tony. Winter is back with a vengeance after record highs. We're talking about heavy snow. Find out who is going to be shoveling in the morning. The forecast is coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: OK, what do you say we got another update on the nor'easter that is very down on New England? Jacqui Jeras on the severe weather center. Jacqui, this could be a real mess tomorrow for a lot of folks.
(WEATHER REPORT)
HARRIS: You know, there's plenty to see on the bus or the train, not all of it entirely welcoming. In this case, we'll let you be the judge. Subway cars full of pantless riders. Would you get on? "You've got to be it kidding."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: You know, we've been doing these "You've Got To Be Kidding" segments for a while now, but this one truly has got to take the top prize. Two roommates in New York try to cash their other roommate's social security check. Sounds like a typical fraud case, right? Well, get this.
Along with the check, they brought his lifeless body, turns up the roommate died earlier in the day. And police say the other two got the bizarre idea to bring him along to the check cashing store. Sorry. They wheeled his body in an office chair down the street and left it outside while they inquired inside. The clerk realized something was wrong, so did the police officer having lunch next door. Tonight, the men faced check fraud charges.
Not a bird, not a plane, its Tata, the world's cheapest car, the Nano. And you can order this Indian-made cutie for a mere $2500. Sure, it's a pretty much no thrills. Manual transmission, no AC, no electric windows or power steering but it's getting rave reviews. The cars maker wants to get millions of people in India and around the world who are middle class into a vehicle and this may be the way to do it.
And finally, if you decided to take the train in the Boston area, you might get goosed. That's nasty. About 100 people showed up on the metro without their pants on Wednesday. No, make that yesterday. It was all part of a little prank. The founder of an Improv group thought up he organized the pantless ride on the social networking Facebook. Wondering why no one was arrested. It's not illegal to go pants-free as long as you have on underwear. No matter how grimy it appears. You got to be kidding. OK. Some people see a problem and do nothing, while others.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This village's school has about 135 students in grades 1 through 5. As you can tell, it's not a very good environment for learning. He saw a problem and gave up the good life to help fix it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Just imagine this for a second. You're an executive for Microsoft and one day you up and quit your job after finding a whole purpose, the purpose that doesn't pay anything. Here's CNN's Asieh Namdar.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN WOOD, FORMER MICROSOFT EXECUTIVE: Do you Franklin the Turtle. Turtle, yes. Franklin could slide down a river bank all by himself.
ASIEH NAMDAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): John Wood is not a teacher or an aid worker. He's a former executive at Microsoft. At the height of his career he walked away from a six-figure salary to change the world one book at a time. His quest started eight years ago, during a vacation to a small Himalayan village and a visit to a remote school. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOOD: 150 students with no books. And this is the problem you see throughout the developing world. And to me it just seemed cruel. How can we live in a world with so much abundance and have something is lacking as books in children's lives.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOOD: This village's school has about 135 students in grades 1 through 5. As you can tell, it's not a very good environment for learning.
NAMDAR: The year later, Wood quit his job and went back to the same village. This time with donkeys and yaks loaded with 3,000 books.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOOD: The kids just got these excited looks on their faces. And I thought, this is a great moment. Why can't I do this hundreds if not thousands of times across the poorest parts of the world.
NAMDAR: So he sent a simple e-mail to friends asking for books. His efforts turned into "Room to Read," a global organization that has built thousand of libraries in schools in Africa and Asia.
WOOD: And I just thought it would be a crisis to not follow my passion.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Do you miss your old life and your old job.
WOOD: You know what I really miss, I miss having that credit card where the bill went every month to Bill Gates and I didn't have to pay it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NAMDAR: Still, Wood has never look back.
WOOD: Maybe I would rather do that, than spend the rest of my life selling software.
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