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Election Coverage Continues

Aired January 26, 2008 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DANA BASH, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Welcome back to CNN's "Ballot Bowl." I'm Dana Bash in Miami, three days ahead of the Florida Republican primary here. A primary that very well could be a game changer in this topsy turvy Republican race for president.
Here's the game plan for the next hour. We are going to hear live from one of the Republicans trying to win here in Florida. Somebody who's been here for a very long time. It's his 55th day campaigning here. That is for the former mayor of New York City, Rudy Giuliani. We'll hear from him at the bottom of the hour. But as we are reporting from Florida, voting is actually going on in South Carolina. The Democratic primary is there today. We're going to hear from Candy Crowley there in a bit. But first, let's go to my colleague, Suzanne Malveaux, who is at Obama headquarter. Hi Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Dana. Obviously, South Carolina is a must win for Barack Obama. His aides acknowledge that. They are somewhat optimistic but a little bit nervous about it. If he won this state, it would put him in equal footing with Senator Hillary Clinton. And it would prove that the Iowa victory was not a fluke. That is something that they need to show with voters. They need to build back on that momentum that they had leading into this contest.

Now, there are a couple of things that are working for him. The fact that 50% of the Democratic voters are African-American. We're seeing the turnout numbers in counties and areas where they're predominantly there, quite high. That would work well for him. And also those absentee ballots, close to 38,000. But Barack Obama, making no mistake, campaigning till the very end.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: In Washington, we play these games where what you say is twisted and distorted in ways that leads us not to make progress. So, when people start, when you start hearing some things about me. I know that some folks have the email sent out that I'm a Muslim.

Now, I've been a member of the same church, Christian church, praying to Jesus Christ, our lord and savior. I've been praying - I've been in church for almost 20 years, same church, church where I was married to Michelle, church where my children were dedicated. So when you read an e-mail like that, you know they're trying to bamboozle you. They're trying to hoodwink with you, mess with your mind. That's what they're trying to do. That's what they're trying to do. You can't let them do that. You can't let them do that. When they say, oh, he doesn't pledge allegiance to the flag. I've been pledging allegiance to the flag of the United States of America since I was three years old, since I could talk. Don't let them bamboozle you with these dirty tricks. If you're ready for change, we can go ahead and bring about change. If you're ready for change, we can win here in South Carolina. If you are ready for change, we can go ahead and fix our healthcare system and fix our schools. But it won't be easy.

So, the last point I want to make is this, and then I'm going to take some questions. The last point, don't let people make you afraid. Don't make people feed your doubts. You know, I talk about hope a lot in my campaign. And you know why I talk about hope is because I wouldn't be standing here if I wasn't hopeful. I was born in 1961. My father left when I was two. So I was raised by a single mother and my grandparents. I didn't have a lot of money, and I didn't have a lot of privilege. So what I got when I as a kid, I got love, I got an education, and I got some hope. So I talk about hope a lot. I put hope on my signs.

I gave a speech at the Democratic convention called "The Audacity of Hope". I wrote a book called the "Audacity of Hope." I believe in hope. But sometimes I get criticized on the campaign trail. Senator Clinton said I'm pedaling false hopes, false hopes. The idea is that I am somehow naive. I'm engaging in wishful thinking. I'm a talker and not a doer. I'm not willing to fight for anything. I'm just sitting back and waiting for stuff to happen. That's not what hope is.

Hope is not blind optimism. Hope is not somehow being ignorant of the challenges and the road blocks and the hurdles and the hardships that stand between you and your dreams. Hope is just the opposite. I know how hard it is -- it's going to be to bring about change in America. It will not be easy to provide healthcare to every American because the insurance companies and drug companies, they don't want to give up their profits. I know it won't be easy to change our energy policy because the oil companies like all that money they're making. It won't be easy to rebuild our schools because too many folks, if their kids are OK, they don't worry about somebody else's child.

It won't be easy to alleviate poverty because too many people who have don't want to reach back and bring those have-nots up that ladder of opportunity. I know it's hard. I know because I fought on the streets as an organizer for folks who have lost their jobs. I fought in the courts as a civil rights attorney. I fought in the legislature to pass legislation. Sometimes I've seen good legislation die because good intentions were not enough. But I also know this, nothing in this country worthwhile has ever happened except for some hope, except somebody somewhere decided to believe. That's how this country was founded.

All those patriots who decided to declare independence from the British empire, nobody gave them a chance, but they had hope. That's how slaves got through those wicked times. That's how a president chartered a new course to ensure we would not remain half slave and half free. That's how the greatest generation defeated Hitler and lifted ourselves out of a great depression. That's how women won the right to vote. That's how workers won the right to organize. That's how people stood up all across the south and young people came down on buses from the north, and they marched on the streets and they sat at lunch counters and they suffered fire hoses and attack dogs. And some went to jail and some died for freedom's cause. That's what hope is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: And there's been really a kind of a nasty back and forth between Senator Obama and Senator Clinton over the use of race in this particular race. They point to phrases - they say that he links his success to the civil rights movement, that he uses phrases like bamboozled and hoodwinked, a very popular phrase from the '98 movie "Malcolm X" to exploit that issue of race. The Obama campaign is especially turning to the former President Bill Clinton. They have accused their side, also, of trying to paint him as a, "black candidate." One who doesn't have broad appeal. We saw he had broad appeal in Iowa. It will be very interesting to see how this vote breaks down when it comes to race. Candy.

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Suzanne, hi. We're out here outside the state capitol in Columbia. I know you're at Barack Obama headquarters. I want to take you back to the beginning of that speech, about the e-mails that circulate that have been all over the internet about Barack Obama being a Muslim, about Barack Obama turning his back to the flag, about not saying the pledge of allegiance. All of which he denies very publicly here. Now, these e-mails have been around for months and months and months and it seems to me they've just started addressing him publicly. Why is that, do you know?

MALVEAUX: Well, actually here they've really kind of caught on. There were some voters, a woman who I talked to by chance who said, well, she had problems with Barack Obama because she said, well, you know, the things that people say about him, isn't he a Muslim? I mean, it really was something that kind of caught fire. And there's also the concern as well when you look at the demographics here, 50% of the Democratic voters, African-American, many of them evangelical, many of them church-going, not Muslim. And that is something that he is trying to appeal to that particular group as well, Candy.

CROWLEY: You know, the other thing that sort of strikes me about this is talking to Obama the other day, he was talking to a bunch of reporters and said that he sees sort of an up tick in these e-mails, particularly after Iowa. So I'm assuming that they think there are a lot more people like the lady that you talked to.

MALVEAUX: Well, you know, I think what's happening here is that they are seeing perhaps a racial divide. He won Iowa, Iowa overwhelmingly a white population. What they're seeing here is that there really does seem to be, at least when you look at the polls, some split here, perhaps white voters going to Hillary Clinton, to John Edwards, that he is losing some of his support from that group, and that that is important to address some of those misstatements. Now, we know that the Hillary campaign denied any part of it. But there were many other things that came up that he accused Hillary Clinton of being dishonest. There was a radio ad that he came out saying that she will say anything, kind of this back and forth between whether or not they're misrepresenting his record. So it has been a dirty, nasty kind of fight here in South Carolina. It is somewhat of a tradition here in this state, but clearly what we saw that on that debate on Monday, there was a lot of tension that both of these candidates had to release a lot of issues that they've been clashing on. And they just hope that the voters will make sense of it all and stick with the issues. Candy.

CROWLYE: Suzanne, you're right. Tense and complicated here in South Carolina. Thanks so much Suzanne Malveaux at Barack Obama headquarters here in Columbia.

"Ballot Bowl" is moving right along. And we're going to move back to Florida after this break where you will hear from John McCain and Mitt Romney. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Welcome back to CNN's "Ballot Bowl. I'm Dana Bash in Miami and Florida holds its Republican primary in just three days. And one of the most fascinating dynamics that has been changing even as we've been speaking here has been between the two men who seem to be vying for the top spot in Florida, John McCain and Mitt Romney. They have really been going after each other on an issue that we haven't heard a lot about on the campaign trail, but it is back, front and center, and that is the war in Iraq.

Mary Snow, my colleague, is in Sun City, Florida, was just with John McCain where he really went after Mitt Romney on this issue of the war. Mary, bring us up to speed on what's going on there.

MARY SNOW, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Dana, this has been intensifying by the hour. And Senator John McCain just spoke to a group here at Sun City Center here in Florida. And here he talked about Governor Romney. He is claiming that Governor Romney actually supported a troop withdrawal pointing to an interview done back in April of 2007. Governor Romney has said this is blatantly false. And he asked Senator McCain that is for an apology. Let's take a listen to hear how Senator McCain addressed this issue just a short time ago here in Sun City, central Florida.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I understand that Governor Romney has changed his position again as he has on several other issues. But my friends, I was there. He said that he wanted a timetable for withdrawal. That would have meant disaster. That would have meant that Al Qaeda would now be telling the world that they defeated the United States of America.

Now, Governor Romney has said that maybe that he thinks that I should apologize for saying what is clearly on the record, is his support for timetables for withdrawal. I think the apology is owed to the young men and women who are serving this nation in uniform, that we will not let them down in hard times or good. That is who the apology is owed to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Now, the Romney camp is firing back, calling this in their words, "a stunningly false statement." And when asked about this earlier on the campaign trail, Mitt Romney suggested that Senator John McCain, using his words, is desperate to bring Iraq back into the forefront and not the economy. Dana, as you just mentioned a couple of minutes ago, the economy really has been taking center stage in these last few days, a very heated race. And we see this sharp language back and forth today over Iraq and who said what. Again, Governor Romney saying he did not support troop withdrawal, but Senator McCain saying he should apologize to no one besides the troops. Dana.

BASH: Absolutely, Mary. In fact, what the two of them are essentially fighting over is the heart and soul of the Republican party here when it comes to the issue of national security. Senator McCain's campaign, as you know, is making clear that what he's trying to do here is say that he and only he should be commander in chief because he and only he unequivocally supported the Iraq war even at a time where is you looked at public opinion polls, it wasn't very popular to do so.

You mentioned, Mary, the fact that Mitt Romney earlier today defended himself and demanded an apology from Senator McCain. Mitt Romney's campaign is actually going so far right now as to call Senator McCain unhinged because they say he is absolutely distorting Mitt Romney's record. Let's listen to what Mitt Romney said earlier today about this issue of the Iraq war.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Senator McCain has said that he's the only Republican that can beat Clinton and Obama. And he said that you supported a withdrawal from Iraq.

GOV. MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know, I don't know why he's being dishonest, but that's dishonest, to say that I have a specific date. It's simply wrong and it's dishonest and he should apologize. That is not the case. I've never said that. And you know, it's fine for him to express his view on different topics, and I know he's trying desperately to change the topic from the economy and trying to get back to Iraq. But to say something that's not accurate is simply wrong. And he knows better.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: There you heard Mitt Romney absolutely denying what Senator McCain is charging. In very stark terms saying that Mitt Romney supported a timetable for withdrawal, even saying that he raised the white flag of surrender just like Democrat Hillary Clinton did. And May, you remember back in April 2007, and that is the interview that Senator McCain and his campaign said that they're pointing to, from Mitt Romney, an interview that he did with ABC News. You remember back then how different the world looked in terms of the political debate over the Iraq war.

And in that interview, Mary, as you know, in April, former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney did say that perhaps it would be okay to have a private timetable, not to be made public, but a private timetable for the Iraqi government and for President Bush to know about, at least to give some sort of definitive answer to when troops could start coming home.

SNOW: And, Dana, he was reasoning or he reasoned at the time that timetable would not be public because you wouldn't give an enemy your game plan, so to speak. So that is the interview, as you said, from the April of 2007. And you know, one other note worth pointing out is that, you know, just this week in the Republican debate, the headline that came out of it was just how well everyone got along. It was not contentious like the Democratic debate earlier this week. It was very calm. Yesterday there were a few barbs changed about the economy between Senator McCain and Governor Romney. Senator McCain saying what you need is a leader, not a manager. Governor Romney saying look we don't need a Washington insider. But it was pretty tame. And as we get closer to Tuesday, we can really see it intensified today.

BASH: You certainly can, Mary. Just is another example of how high the stakes are, particularly for these two men in the state of Florida, how much it could change both of their face when you're talking about their ability to capture the Republican nomination. So, we're going to be watching the back and forth between those two men on this issue and a whole lot more right after the break. And after the break we're also going to see a bit more from our CNN "Election Express" yourself. That is in Santa Monica, California. We'll tell you a lot more about that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CROWLEY: Welcome back, and welcome to CNN's continuing "Ballot Bowl '08." We are, of course, watching the voting here in South Carolina. Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, John Edwards all looking for those 45 delegates up for grabs here in this state, and of course the Republicans all going through speeches and rallies in Florida for that upcoming primary Tuesday.

But right now, we want to go out west, California, of course, having its primary on February 5th. But right now what we want to do is give you a look at the "Election Express Yourself" tour. We have John Dance on hand who is going to give us a walk-through. John.

JOHN DANCE, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Candy. Thanks a lot. We are out here in Santa Monica as you mentioned on the (inaudible) Promenade on a naturally beautiful afternoon. I think the small window of beautiful weather before the rain starts again. We are at the "Election Express yourself," which is we're calling the little brother of election express that Ali is with today. And what we've done here is we decked out an air stream and we're asking this across the country to get a feel for the voters, let them express themselves in various ways about their political views and whatever else they want to really want talk to us about. And we got really interesting ways that people can express themselves.

One of them is our button-making station, which is a very popular place for kids and adults. And we got many different ways they can do that. Like I'm anti, I'm pro, so and so for president. Of course, CNN equals politics. And I'm going to show you how a button is made. I fill out one myself, I'm pro CNN "Ballot Bowl" because we should be because it's a great thing today.

So, we'll go over the button making station and see who that's done. So we've got Ryan right here. We'll get that done real quick. As you can see, he's an expert, been making thousands of them as we've been on the road this year so far. There it is, I'm pro CNN "Ballot Bowl." As I said, anyone can make these. It's a really fun thing and it's a way people can express their political views.

We're going to walk you through a little bit and take a quick peak at the actual "Express Yourself" vehicle, part of the CNN election vehicle fleet. Like I said, it's a decked out air stream that when it's heading down the road, really it's an eye-catcher. It's a beautiful thing. It's a lot of fun and gets a lot of attention as we travel across the country.

Another stop on the CNN "Election Express Yourself" tour is our polling station where anyone can answer some questions about candidates, their issues and what their views are for politics. And after they're done, a little political cartoon to print out for them over the button-making station. They can make that button and wear it around as well.

And our last stop is, play the highlight of the "Express Yourself" tour is what we call the graffiti wall. And what this is a place for anybody to write whatever they want about their political views. What we like to think is this is a chance for people to write what their family won't let them talk about at the dinner table. As you can see, we get a lot of interesting responses and some passionate voters out there which is really what this "Express Yourself" tour is all about. It is getting that passion out and hearing from the voters.

And it's a lot of fun and like you said, we're going to be traveling across the country. We're in Santa Monica today. And we'll be at the Reagan Library for the debate and we'll also be at the Kodak Theater for the rest of the week in California. And after this week the tour continues across the country. So stay tuned to find out where we're going to be next. We've got really fun things coming up later on in the tour - a video kiosk, we're going to post your I- reports, really a lot of fun stuff.

We're hearing from a lot of interesting people. It's really fun to see the passion for this election this year. And we're getting a little taste of it with this.

CROWLEY: John Dance in Santa Monica. Swag and a chance to get involved in the election. It can't get better than that. As you mentioned, there will be some CNN debates next week, Wednesday, 30th 8:00 p.m. Easter time, there will be both a Democratic and a Republican debate on Wednesday and Thursday.

Now back to "Ballot Bowl." There will be upcoming a Rudy Giuliani event, women for Rudy Giuliani. We will have that live for you from Florida. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Welcome back to "Ballot Bowl '08." I'm Candy Crowley here in Columbia, South Carolina, where the voters are voting in the Democratic primary here. They have until 7:00 p.m. tonight.

Right now we want to show you a picture out of Florida -- Orlando, Florida, where we are awaiting a Women for Rudy event. Rudy Giuliani, that is, the former mayor of New York. We are expecting him to speak soon. We will, of course, be there because we are bringing you these candidates, live sometimes, taped sometimes, but always raw and unfiltered.

Right now let's talk about a fellow New Yorker, that is Hillary Rodham Clinton, who has been campaigning here in South Carolina this morning. After all, candidates don't have a lot to do on election day, a couple of diners for Hillary Rodham Clinton, where she shook hands, obviously, with those who were there, chatted them up.

I suppose if some of them forgot it was voting day, she's a reminder that, indeed, now is the time to get out and go. Yesterday, she was in Columbia, again, giving a speech, talking a little about energy and health care. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have proposed a strategic energy fund, a $50 billion fund to put to work new forms of energy technology. Here is how we would fund it, take the tax subsidies away from the oil companies. They do not need your money to make a really big profit anymore.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

CLINTON: And of course, we've got to become more energy efficient. This is the best way to save money. If we put people to work weatherizing homes, particularly for seniors on fixed incomes, we'd lower their utility bills, we'd have people working, and we'd begin to prevent the greenhouse gas emissions that are causing all that global warming.

So there's a lot we can do to have a different energy future. Now I know we can't do any of this until the two oil men leave the White House. But as soon as they do, we can get started to have a better, better future for America.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE) CLINTON: Because my goal is a strong and prosperous middle class. It is the middle class that built America, with all due respect to wealthy Americans. And we're impressed by everyone's success and that's part of the American dream. But it is not the rich who made America great. It is the people who built this building, who did the work, who taught our children, who took care of the sick.

It is the middle class and working families in America. And we want to give everybody a chance at upward mobility. What's happening now after we saw the creation of 22.7 million new jobs in the '90s, we lifted more people out of poverty in those eight years than any time in our recent history. And we did it the right way, we did it through jobs and opportunity so people could work and set an example for their kids.

So we've got to rebuild a strong and prosperous middle class. Because the building blocks, good jobs with good wages includes health care. I think health care has got to be available and affordable to every American. It is the right thing to do, and it is the smart thing to do.

And when I think about how we're going to do it, I believe that my plan is achievable. Here is how it would work. It's called the American health choices plan. If you have health care and you're happy with it, nothing changes. You keep what you have, there are no disruptions, nobody has to move anywhere.

Because a lot of people do have plans they like through their employer or through a labor union or through some other source. But if you are uninsured, or if you have insurance but it doesn't pay for what you need, we're going to give you some new options.

And I'd like to ask, how many of you know somebody who is uninsured? Yes. And how many of you know somebody, maybe you, yourself, who have insurance, you've paid your premiums, you've done everything you were supposed to do and then your family needs it and they won't pay your doctor or the hospital. and you have to argue with them?

See, we've got two problems. We talk a lot about the first problem, 47 million uninsured. That's a big problem. But we forget about the tens of millions who have insurance policies that end up not being worth the paper they're written on. And I can tell you, I have been, as you know, traveling around this country and had so many heart-felt conversations with people.

About a week ago I was in Reno, Nevada, talking to some local folks. And this man was so emotional, and I understood why, he was waiting to talk to me. And you know, you can tell when somebody is just hardly able to keep it in.

He said to me, I want to tell you what happened to me. He said, I had an insurance policy. I had it through my work. I paid for it. I got diagnosed with prostate cancer in August. In September they canceled my policy. He said, that's what they do. And this man said to me, what am I supposed to do? He said, the operation is $50,000. I've been saving money to send my daughters to college. So what's my choice? Deny my daughters a college education or have the operation?

He said, that's not right. Well, it's not. And we could probably stand here 'til the cows come home telling stories about what you've heard from people who have been in the same situation. So what I want to do is to open up the congressional health plan to every American.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CROWLEY: Senator Hillary Clinton in Columbia yesterday afternoon. You will note the use of the word "we" when talking about the accomplishments of the late '90s. She's talking, of course, of her husband's administration. When we come back after the break, we're going to talk about Bill Clinton and his considerable effect on this election down here in South Carolina and elsewhere.

Also, back in Florida, in Orlando, we are waiting the Women for Rudy event. We are expecting the former New York mayor to speak there shortly. All of it coming up after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CROWLEY: Welcome. This is what we're looking at right now, Orlando, Florida, where we're expecting Rudy Giuliani to come and speak. We're, of course, watching that and we'll bring it to you live.

Now back to the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CROWLEY: I'm Candy Crowley in Columbia, South Carolina, where the voters are voting and the candidates are waiting, along with their spouses, which brings us to the subject of former President Bill Clinton. He more than any other spouse, of course, has stolen the headlines here in South Carolina for many different reasons.

Part of it is an ongoing discussion about race and its place in this election. Obviously Barack Obama, an African-American, Hillary Clinton, female, both of them going for this vote. I want to bring in our Jessica Yellin, who had a chance to be up close and personal with the former president.

And, Jessica, it was quite a discussion.

JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It was quite a discussion and it was unexpected from my point of view. You know, Candy, we've all been getting on the receiving end of complaints from the Obama campaign that they think the Clintons have been running an unfair, what they've called divisive campaign that's based on distortion, and even race-baiting, some have said. So I asked President Clinton when I had a chance to talk to him if he would respond to these accusations, particularly from one prominent South Carolina Democrat who is an Obama supporter, who called it reprehensible, the campaign they have run, saying that it's reminiscent from some of the Republican tactics they saw from Lee Atwater.

And President Clinton had a very animated response. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL CLINTON, 42ND PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I never uttered a world of public complaint when Mr. Obama said Hillary was not truthful, had no character, was poll-driven when he had more pollsters than she did. When he put out a hit job on me, at the same time he called her the senator from Punjab, I never said a word.

They are feeding you this because they know this is what you want to cover. This is what you live for. But this hurts the people of South Carolina, because the people of South Carolina are coming to these meetings and asking questions about what they care about.

And what they care about is not going to be in the news coverage tonight because you don't care about it. What you care about is this. And the Obama people know that. So they just spin you up on this and you happily go along.

The people don't care about this. They never ask about it. And you are determined to take this election away from them. And that's not right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YELLIN: Now, Candy, you know since that happened, the media in general have sort of played it like that was a Bill Clinton explosion, the former president out of control. My read on it at that moment was that this was a very considered effort by him to take the attention away from the Obama campaign's attacks and focus it on something else.

We're still talking about race, but we're talking about it in the context of Bill Clinton. And we'll see if that was a distraction for us, we'll see if it worked for the Clinton campaign today -- Candy.

CROWLEY: Jessica, I think you're absolutely right. What seems to have happened here in South Carolina is Bill Clinton has been able to knock Barack Obama off stride and off message. I want to bring in Suzanne Malveaux.

Suzanne, you've been around with the Obama campaign. Is it your sense that they have been sort of caught off guard by this in some sense and certainly knocked off track?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, insiders who I talked to simply say that this is something that they are concerned about because what has happened here is that they have allowed to a certain extent Bill Clinton to define their candidate. And what they say now, it is all about message control. You're going to hear lines from Barack Obama where he clearly defines who he is, what he is.

But here is what they're expecting today. They say, if they win, they believe that Bill Clinton is going to basically treat this and paint this as a victory but non-victory, that they are going to claim or dismiss the fact that, well, perhaps, he just won because he was African-American and he got the black vote.

They do feel that he is painting him as a black candidate. They are particularly reacting to something that Bill Clinton said when he said, they're getting these votes to be sure of the race or gender, that's why they tell me Hillary doesn't have a winning chance here.

Barack Obama taking on much of this. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There are some good folks out there. They may disagree on some things, but it doesn't mean we can't work on some things together. Teamwork. So don't be confused when you start hearing a whole bunch of this negative stuff. Those are the same old tricks. They're trying to bamboozle you. It's the same old okey-doke. You all know about okey- doke, right? It's the same old stuff.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: And, Candy, the Clinton campaign says it's just that kind of language that they believe that Barack Obama is also exploiting the race issue here. So you have this back and forth. It will be very interesting to see just how it breaks down in terms of the 50 percent of African-Americans who are expected to vote today, and the other 50 percent white, whether or not he gets broad support, wide support.

If he does not get wide support within the white community, some polls suggesting that it has dipped, he will have some problems heading into those states like California, New York, if it's perceived that he cannot broaden his base a bit and be the non-racial candidate -- Candy.

CROWLEY: Suzanne, I'm sure you and certainly I have gotten e- mails from people saying, you all are making this about race. This is not about race. We had the woman famously getting up and addressing the crowd at a Hillary Clinton event -- I'm sorry, addressing the media at a Hillary Clinton event, saying, listen, you all, this is not about race. But that's not how these campaigns look at it, is it?

MALVEAUX: Well, you know, both these campaigns do see the advantage of focusing on it when it is to their benefit. But what we've seen -- I've been in South Carolina for a good week-and-a-half or so and talking to voters, there is a certain sense that it does matter.

Now, it may not be the prominent and the number one factor, but it seems to matter to certain people, kind of in a personal way, some people saying they would like to vote for Barack Obama out of a sense of racial pride, and that they feel he is also qualified.

There are others who are feeling a sense of loyalty to Hillary Clinton because of the policies of her husband as well as her work in the civil rights movement. So you have a lot of people who are just trying to make personal decisions, and it's somewhat of a struggle.

CROWLEY: Suzanne Malveaux at Barack Obama headquarters, thanks.

I want to go back to Jessica for a second. Because, you know in politics there is this old saying that if A and B go at it, C is definitely the one who comes out looking better. And I want to bring you back to John Edwards and ask you how he has played off this whole dispute between the Clinton camp and Barack Obama.

YELLIN: As you know, Candy, he has played off of it marvelously well. In the last week he has actually released a new ad saying that he represents the grown-up wing of the Democratic Party, essentially saying the other two guys are too busy squabbling with each other and throwing mud at each other, that they're not paying attention to the needs of the real people, the voters, and he's the guy who can ride in on -- you know, the knight in shining armor who is really concerned about the people.

So he has in a lot of ways benefited, at least in terms of the media coverage for being outside of this personal spat. But it will be interesting to see if that translates into more votes for him today.

CROWLEY: Thanks so much, Jessica Yellin, at Barack Obama headquarters. Also again, to Suzanne -- I'm sorry, Jessica is at a polling place, Suzanne is at Barack Obama headquarters. Thank you both, wherever you are.

We're going to go to break now. But much like Godot, we are waiting for Rudy Giuliani, who is supposed to appear soon in Orlando. We'll be back right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CROWLEY: Welcome back to "Ballot Bowl '08." I'm Candy Crowley here in Columbia, South Carolina, where the voters have 'til 7:00 p.m. Eastern time to vote. This, of course, the Democratic primary.

In Florida, they are listening to the Republican candidates. There, of course, is a primary there for the those Republican candidates Tuesday. Not to sound like a broken record, but we are still waiting for Rudy Giuliani. We will bring to you live, because we still have faith that he is going to show up.

Right now, we want to take you, though, back to Jessica Yellin, because, Jessica, we have been talking about John Edwards. I know you have been with him, and have a sense of that campaign.

YELLIN: Yes, Candy, we actually spent a day -- we were at an event with him in Columbia, South Carolina, yesterday, and I'll tell you, there is a lot more energy around his campaign right now than I've felt in some recent days, weeks.

He seems to be energized and focused, really, on getting as far as he can -- as close as he can, I should say, to Barack Obama in this contest. They are really hoping to narrow that gap and get -- well, they say they'd like a first place finish, but even a second place finish here would do them well.

Senator Edwards is still continuing to emphasize his message that he is the guy who is going to stand up for the little people and fight the special interests harder than anyone else.

But he has also introduced a new line of attack here in South Carolina after that very contentious debate, saying that while the other have introduced what he is calling their New York and Chicago style of sharp-elbowed politics, he is staying focused on the needs of the people, on their economic concerns, on their need for health care. And he is saying he'll be that kind of president who will be focused on Americans, not on himself.

Let's listen to what he had to say yesterday in Columbia, South Carolina.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN EDWARDS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am so for voter empowerment. I think if the American people demand more, if you demand better, if you demand better behavior from your candidates, I mean, if you say -- if you say, we're not interesting in all of this petty fighting between you and trying to tear each other down, we deserve better than that, they'll respond. I assure you, they'll respond. And that's what creates the kind of substantive, meaningful dialogue that allows voters to be educated and make real informed decisions.

(APPLAUSE)

QUESTION: OK. I'm just going to ask two questions and that will be last one because we really want to give you guys a chance to get as many questions in as you can. There are a lot of young voters here today. There is also a lot of real grown-up voters. And I think this is an issue that is relevant for all of us.

In the next few years a lot of us are going to be entering the job market. The economy is the number one issue in the polls right now. It is all they're talking about on the news. I know you've been talking about it a lot. Can you give us some examples of what you would do as president in terms of the economy and the job market?

EDWARDS: Yes, I'd be glad to. We'll try to make this answer shorter, because this -- you could spend an hour on this.

QUESTION: I know.

EDWARDS: Here are the things that I would do. First of all, we need to stimulate the economy right now. We should have not waited this long to stimulate the economy because it was obvious things were going down as early as six weeks to eight weeks ago.

So a little over a month ago I proposed a set of ideas to stimulate the economy. Here's what I'd do. First, I'd invest in building green infrastructure so that we can create jobs and at the same time move America in a serious way in the direction we need to move on the issue of the environment and global warming, huge economic opportunity, building our green infrastructure. We can create, by the way, a million new jobs in America as we make this transition, great opportunity.

Second, we've got to modernize our unemployment insurance laws, they don't cover enough people. And what that means is when the unemployment rate goes up, as it did here in South Carolina just last month, 6,000 jobs were lost in this state in the month of December, what that means is less people are eligible for unemployment, so they're out of money, they can't put money into the economy. It drags the economy down. So we want to expand unemployment insurance for those people who haven't done anything wrong and have lost their jobs.

The third thing we need to do, we need to give more help to the states whose budgets are in trouble. And then last, we've got to deal with the mortgage foreclosure crisis. And what I'd do is create a national home rescue fund so that we get transitional help to people who are in danger of losing their homes and that we restructure and refinance some of these loans and change the laws to permit that.

(APPLAUSE)

EDWARDS: Now let me say one last -- those are all short term except for the green infrastructure, which is long term. But the other thing we have to do is we have to strengthen and grow the middle class in this country.

What's happening, if you just picture America's economy as a pyramid in your head, then the foundation of that economy are middle class workers, middle class families. Whenever the middle class is strong, the foundation is strong, and the economy sustains growth over the long term.

The problem we've had in this country over the last couple of decades is we've had a lot of growth at the top and no meaningful growth at the bottom. So it has become top-heavy, it's very unstable. The economic growth that you see today is almost entirely among the wealthiest Americans and biggest corporations.

The benefits of that growth are not getting to the middle class and to working people and it creates this unstable economic environment that allows this economic downturn that we're seeing right now.

So all the things that I've already talked about, greening the economy, universal health care, a trade policy that actually looks after American jobs, all those things are very important to creating a strong economic foundation. QUESTION: Thanks.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

YELLIN: That was John Edwards yesterday in Columbia, South Carolina. And, Candy, if I can make one other point, today the polls close here in South Carolina about two hours from now. I'm in a Democratic stronghold, at a polling place. It was expected that there would be record high turnout this year. That's what the Democratic Party had predicted. And I'll tell you, we have not seen that here where I am.

I spoke to the polling manager here who tells me he has covered polling places for 20 years and the turnout he's seeing today is average, not higher than normal, just what they would expect in any other year. We'll see if that bears out state-wide -- Candy.

CROWLEY: Absolutely. Thanks, Jessica. I know you and the team are packing up from the polling place and headed over to Edwards headquarters. So we will see you over there, thanks again.

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