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Press Conference on Oil Refinery Blast; Democratic Presidential Candidates Focusing on Upcoming Primaries; Biggest Beef Recall in U.S. History

Aired February 18, 2008 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon, live at the CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Brianna Keilar, in for Kyra Phillips, who is on assignment in Iraq.

You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

LEMON: And we start with black smoke choking a Texas town this morning after an explosion at an oil refinery. Homes and buildings in Big Spring shook from the shocks waves, and the fire that broke out closed down Interstate 20. Nearby schools evacuated students and canceled classes.

Four refinery workers were injured in the explosion but all others are safe and accounted for. Big Spring's mayor says it is a miracle no one was killed.

Early on we got some great pictures of the scene from our I- Reporters. Mike Roth lives about five miles from the refinery. He says the blast shook his house and everything in it. He grabbed a camera and got within a half mile of the plant, beating even EMS crews there.

Cody Jones was driving on I-20 about 10 miles away when he suddenly saw a giant plume of black smoke. A couple minutes later he says he felt the blast wave and the shock. Well, Cody shot this picture on his cell phone. We want to thank everyone who sent us photos and video from Big Spring today.

KEILAR: Picking up the pieces in Prattville, Alabama. That community is shattered today after tornadoes took direct aim yesterday. About 200 homes and businesses are damaged or destroyed. Nearly 30 people are hurt.

Survivors say warning sirens sent them diving for cover wherever they could, in grocery store coolers, laundry rooms, store bathrooms, even. Governor Bob Riley is among those trying to take stock today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. BOB RILEY (R), ALABAMA: The damage here is extensive, but one of the great things about living in Alabama, and I say this to every major emergency we have, it truly is amazing to see what's happening out there with all the families in this state. We pulled up to one family that had lost their home. We counted 23 different volunteers that were in the -- in the yard just cleaning up, trying to help them get their lives back in order.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: While Prattville was hardest hit, cities across Alabama, Georgia, and Florida also saw tornadoes. Thirty-four, if you can imagine, reported in all.

Tornado warnings also sounded in Selma, where I-Reporter Lorraine Alexander sent us these photos of the damage done by 70-mile-per-hour winds. She saw, as you can see there, a lot of vehicles upended, also a couple of houses blown apart. Authorities say incredibly no deaths have been reported from any of these storms.

And those storms but not only those storms, the tornadoes, are also contributing to snow piling up in the Midwest. We've got some winds that we're talking about. Let's get now to Chad Myers in the CNN weather center.

It's basically just a big travel mess, right, Chad?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: It is, no matter where you go. Whether you're on the south side of the storm, Brianna, down into Florida now, the east side, which would be really the coastal areas of north Carolina, or as far north even as the Poconos, we are seeing a lot of weather today.

I'll zoom you in all the way down to about the palm coast. Had some storms earlier now just to the north of Daytona Beach, but moving offshore and a little bit farther close to Kissimmee, St. Cloud. Had a storm, now that's gone. And then on up into the Northeast, where the airports have really gone downhill quickly -- quickly today.

The storms just approaching the north side there of New York City. Now planes are gong to have to fly around that line of weather, and La Guardia and Newark, you're going to start to go even farther back than where you are right now.

It's an extreme wind event across the Northeast. Winds are 30, 45 miles per hour. They have to separate the planes significantly. When that comes in, you can't take as many planes off as you'd like, you can't land as many planes as you'd like, and you don't get as many on the ground or off the ground, and so, therefore, the planes just back up.

Rack 'em and stack 'em we usually call this. La Guardia now just all the way up to 2:45, ground stop until 3:00. That means planes can't even take off in a surrounding area of New York, can't even take off to get up in the air to get to JFK or La Guardia because, well, there's just no place to put them.

So, they're just stopping. This whole traffic mess up in the Northeast isn't getting better. Boston down to about an hour. Chicago, an hour and 45 minutes at O'Hare. But the big three in New York City are basically at a standstill. But you'll get off if you can wait, but you have to be patient -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Yes. And we know there are a lot of patient folks at airports all across the U.S. watching sort of bad news that you have, Chad. But thanks for it anyway.

MYERS: About two hours -- you start losing your patience at about two hours.

KEILAR: Yes.

MYERS: And if you have a 3-year-old, you lose it in about 30 minutes.

KEILAR: Yes. And you lose your mind at two hours.

MYERS: That's it.

KEILAR: Maybe four hours. Thanks, Chad.

LEMON: All right. Some developing news we want to get you to real quickly in Big Spring. We told you about that refinery fire and blast. They're holding a press conference. Let's listen.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

MAYOR RUSS MCEWEN, BIG SPRING, TEXAS: At this point in time, Mike, it's four injuries. Actually, there'd be five if you counted the lady who was in the car. So -- and none of them are life- threatening. As a matter of fact, I can't remember whether it was Congresswoman Neugebauer or someone with the representative's office talked with the gentleman who was taken up to Lubbock, and he's lucid, talking with people. So it really is a miracle. The lord has really blessed us today in Big Spring in that no one was killed or hurt very, very seriously.

QUESTION: What happened to the lady in the car?

QUESTION: (OFF-MIC)

MCEWEN: Yes, there's no traffic going down Interstate 20 at all through this area.

QUESTION: Is this something that fire officials can put out or will it just have to burn out?

MCEWEN: Yes. I'm sorry.

Some of it, they're still fighting some fires, but some of it will take a while to burn out. And my understanding is some of the -- we're going to have some black-type smoke for a -- for a period of time.

QUESTION: Are we talking days?

MCEWEN: I do not have estimates at this point in time. We will have estimates later.

QUESTION: The plant produces 70,000 gallons -- or 70,000 barrels of oil a day. That's a lot of barrels that are not going to be in circulation starting today. How soon can this plant be back on line?

MCEWEN: That's a question for Alon. I have no earthly idea.

QUESTION: Are we going to get a chance to hear from Alon?

MCEWEN: Yes, you will. Yes, you will.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIC)

MCEWEN: I do not know at this point in time. They're trying to -- you know, they have been so involved with making sure that that plant is running properly and are taking care of their people inside that plant, they haven't had time to make those types of estimates at all. They're -- they're doing their job right now.

QUESTION: Do you know if any part of the plant is actually safe (INAUDIBLE)?

MCEWEN: We have no earthly -- we have no earthly way to know. Nor do they at this point in time. They have to go -- they'll have to go in and evaluate it, and then they'll know exactly what they're going to need to do to bring it back into production.

QUESTION: What happened to the lady in the car?

MCEWEN: My understanding is some debris hit her windshield, and, you know, there was some debris that came into the car, just as far as windshield shattering. But she's at home. I mean, it was not bad at all.

QUESTION: How far did the debris spread?

MCEWEN: Well, I guess my own observation was across the interstate highway. I mean, it wasn't, like, four miles or anything like that.

QUESTION: Are you still asking the public to avoid this area?

MCEWEN: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes, because if there were a case for emergency vehicles going around, we want to make sure that they can get access to the hospitals as quickly as possible.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIC)

MCEWEN: I've heard various numbers, but I'd rather you ask those questions to Alon.

QUESTION: Has anyone been forced to leave their home?

MCEWEN: Not at this point, no, sir.

QUESTION: So what's your next step? MCEWEN: Listen to the people in Alon, continue to pray, as we'd ask all of you to do. And just make sure that everything's done properly. We are going to make sure that the safety of the people is paramount in everything we do.

QUESTION: How are we doing on resources as far...

LEMON: All right. You're listening to a press conference now, the mayor of Big Spring, Russ McEwen, holding a press conference there, talking about exactly what happened. Obviously, he said he's going to listen to the people to figure out exactly what to do next.

At last count, the last we heard in an interview from the plant spokesperson, he said four employees were injured. The mayor also there saying that one person, a woman, was injured in a car on the interstate. They have since shut down I-20 in that area.

But, again, 70,000 barrels a day of oil that usually comes out of this place, 170 people, employees there. Not exactly sure how many were in the plant at the time. But the blast was so big it shook homes and businesses from miles away. We'll continue to update you on this plant blast in Big Spring, Texas, as we get more information here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

So, let's talk politics now. The Republican Party's top elder statesman throws his support to John McCain. Former President George H. W. Bush and the Arizona senator appeared today together in Houston.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE HERBERT WALKER BUSH, FMR. PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And at this critical time in history, the key point I want to make is, the United States of America cannot be permitted to falter. Part of our Republican creed is a prevailing sense of duty, and in the coming election, we do not have the luxury of taking a pass on our unique role and responsibilities in the world. And the indisputable fact that unites the greatest number of Republicans, the most Independents, and many good Democrats as well, is the fact that no one is better prepared to lead our nation at these trying times than Senator John McCain.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Former President Bush says charges that McCain is not a true conservative are absurd, but he says McCain is not above reaching out to Democrats.

KEILAR: The race for the Democratic nomination is focusing on some key states coming up. Senator Barack Obama is campaigning this hour in Ohio, which holds its primary on March 4th. Both Obama and Senator Hillary Clinton are hoping for a boost from tomorrow's contest in Wisconsin, and Obama's native state, Hawaii. And our Suzanne Malveaux has the very latest for us from Honolulu.

Such a rough gig that you have there. Aloha to you, Suzanne.

LEMON: Nice shirt, Suzanne.

(LAUGHTER)

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey, I had to do it. Aloha. You know, I've gotten so many e-mails and phone calls from you guys volunteering to help with this assignment. I've got it under control. Somebody has to do Hawaii duty here. But there really is a story here. It's quite amazing.

Barack Obama, he was born here. There are 20 delegates that are at stake. Neither one of the candidates have come here, but they are certainly not taking this for granted here.

Barack Obama advertising here. Senator Clinton putting out her solutions for Hawaii plan. And we saw everything yesterday from Chelsea Clinton doing the hula dance, to Barack Obama's sister passing out this kind of pork dish, calling an Obamasada (ph).

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX (voice over): Aloha. Think Hawaii? You normally envision moonlit luaus, sun-kissed bodies, monster surf. Yes, there's that. But think again. In the frantic race for the Democratic nomination, where every delegate counts, Hawaii matters.

This is Senator Barack Obama's home turf. He was born in Honolulu and spent much of his childhood here. His secret weapon on the campaign trail, his younger sister, Maya Soetoroing.

MAYA SOETOROING, OBAMA'S SISTER: Hey, people, how is it going? I am an Obama mama.

MALVEAUX: Maya lives in Honolulu, where politicking nearly 5,000 miles away from Washington has a different feel -- rallying supporters with a potluck in the park.

SOETOROING: I'd like people to understand that he is, without a doubt, precisely what he says he is. He really has the power to do this.

MALVEAUX: But lest you think Hillary Clinton is giving up on Obama's back yard, think again. Daughter Chelsea was dispatched for three days to campaign across the island. While she refuses to talk to reporters, she spends hours greeting and answering supporters' questions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She's going to do for us women what nobody could.

MALVEAUX: For many Hawaiian voters, this election is giving them a real role in the politics of the mainland.

TERRI PINTACURA, CLINTON SUPPORTER: I know that Barack Obama is for (ph) homeboy, and Hillary -- but I'm for Hillary. I believe she has the experience and all the things that are needed to be a president. I just am so inspired by all of this. It's overwhelming for me. It's hard for me to even talk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think he's -- he represents kind of like an image of my family, because he -- I see my kids' future in his eyes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hawaii's a very special place, and we have something here called the aloha spirit, and I really think that Obama embodies the aloha spirit.

MALVEAUX (on camera): Do you think that Senator Clinton has that same aloha spirit?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely not. No. I don't -- I don't see that at all.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: And Brianna, it's really interesting what people have been saying here. They talk about this aloha spirit, the sense of community, of getting along, and they feel like they're really unique from voters in the mainland, and they also believe that because Barack Obama kind of grew up in that culture, this aloha spirit, that he's a unique candidate as well -- Brianna.

KEILAR: And, most importantly, Suzanne, how did you get this assignment?

(LAUGHTER)

MALVEAUX: Everybody wants to know that, you know. I was like, I'm ready for this assignment on day one, that's what I told them. I said, "Yes, we can." You know, come on. Let's use this to our advantage here.

KEILAR: Yes, we can. No pun intended.

MALVEAUX: Yes, we can.

KEILAR: And I know that you're terribly busy. I know you're terribly busy, but I think there's a pink hotel near you where you can get a drink and a big pineapple. And since you are working, they can make a virgin Mai Tai for you. But very yummy. I know you are working hard out there.

All right. Mahalo to Suzanne Malveaux. Thank you.

MALVEAUX: You know, there are a lot of stories out here.

KEILAR: Yes, of course. Of course. All right. Thanks, Suzanne. Have some fun out there.

And in addition to tomorrow's coverage from Hawaii, we are also looking ahead to the big races here on the mainland. Texas and Ohio voting on March 4th. And you can track all of the campaign action at CNNPolitics.com, plus get analysis from the best political team. All of that and more at CNNPolitics.com.

LEMON: Beats standing in the cold in a big old fluffy...

KEILAR: Parka.

LEMON: ... parka jacket, doesn't it?

KEILAR: Yes, it sure does. Rough gig.

LEMON: I wonder if she was wearing shorts. We should have asked her that.

KEILAR: Yes. She probably was.

LEMON: OK. She probably was.

Where is the beef? Well, that question from schools from across the nation after the biggest beef recall in U.S. history. They want to make sure it's not -- it is not in your kids' lunch.

KEILAR: Plus, would more guns lead to fewer campus shootings? One group thinks so, but it's catching a lot of flak.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. And we're going to take you live right now to Youngstown, Ohio, where Barack Obama is on the trail stumping. A very pivotal race coming up March 4th. Let's listen in.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: ... that there's such a thing as being too late. And that hour is almost upon us. You don't have to take my word for it. You see it in your own lives. We are in a defining moment in our history. Our nation is at war. Our planet is in peril. And the dream that so many generations fought for feels like it's slowly slipping away.

Everywhere I go, not just here in Youngstown, but all across the country, people are working harder and harder just to get by. They've never paid more for college, never paid more for gas at the pump, never paid more to heat their homes.

Our health care system leaves millions of people without insurance. And if you've got health insurance, you've seen your co- payments and deductibles and your premiums going up and up and up. It's harder to save. It's harder to retire. And despite the slogans, our education system leaves millions of children behind, unable to compete in a new global economy.

(APPLAUSE)

In such circumstances, we can't afford to wait. We can't wait to fix our schools. We can't wait to fix our health care system. We can't wait to bring back good jobs and good wages. We cannot wait to bring an end to global warming. We cannot wait to end the war in Iraq. We cannot wait. We cannot wait.

(APPLAUSE)

We can't wait. And so when I decided to run this race, it was because I believed that the size of our challenges had outstripped the capacity of a broken and divided politics assault. And I was betting that the American people were looking for something different, that they were look for something new, that they were tired of a politics that was all about tearing each other down. They wanted a politics that would lift the country up.

(APPLAUSE)

I believe that people were tired of spin and PR and negative attacks, that they wanted truthfulness and honesty and straight talk from their elected officials. But most of all, I was betting on you. I was betting on you, the American people.

Some of you know I now live in Chicago, but I didn't originally grow up in Chicago. I moved there...

KEILAR: All right. You're taking a look there at Barack Obama in Youngstown, Ohio. Ohio going to have their primary coming up March 4th, and you can tune into CNN election center tonight and tomorrow at 8:00 p.m. Eastern for coverage of Tuesday's primaries.

If you want to watch any of the candidates today, because they're all over the place, you can just go to CNN.com/live to watch their rallies and events live and unfiltered. Again, that is CNN.com/live.

LEMON: OK. If you have children at school, if you eat at a fast-food restaurant, if you eat meat, then you want to the pay attention to this.

We want to get back now to the biggest meat recall in U.S. history. It was triggered by the graphic scenes at a California slaughterhouse. Disturbing images, take a look at them, which are -- which we're showing you now.

Undercover investigators were sent to the plant and came away with this videotape, suggesting abuse. The cattle you see here had been approved by inspectors and were on their way to slaughter, even though -- even though they appeared to be ailing. The probe was undertaken by the U.S. Humane Society. Joining us now from Sacramento, Humane Society president Wayne Pacelle.

Wayne, that video is disturbing. This all brought about by the Humane Society. Am I correct that this video is four months old?

WAYNE PACELLE, PRESIDENT, HUMANE SOCIETY OF THE U.S.: Well, we started the undercover investigation in October. It went through mid to late November.

LEMON: What took so long to get that meat recalled, then?

PACELLE: Well, the investigator was embedded, and he was really gathering information day to day. When the investigators are there, they don't pull out immediately. He needed to complete the investigation to get the facts here. We then started to knit together that this particular supplier, producer, was the second largest seller to the national school lunch program -- 27 million pound of beef a year.

LEMON: Man.

PACELLE: Once we -- once we pulled it all together, we gave it to the San Bernardino County district attorney to initiate a criminal investigation for animal cruelty abuses, for violation of the state's Downed Animal Protection Act. And last Friday, the district attorney, Michael Ramos (ph), did file charges against some of the employees at the plant.

LEMON: Again, I think two employees so far, at last count, charges have been filed against them. But here's what I want to ask. You said you're concerned is twofold, not only for the animals, but you're concerned for citizens as well. Explain that to me.

PACELLE: Well, downed animals are literally animals too sick or injured to walk. They cannot get up. And all of the data from Europe, where they've had an outbreak of Mad Cow Disease in the last decade, showed that downer cows are 50 times more like to have Mad Cow Disease or Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy.

Also, because they are down, they are wallowing in manure and fecal matter. It cakes to their hide, and when they go for slaughter, it cross-contaminates the machinery. It then gets mixed in with other ground beef. And you can really have an outbreak of E. coli, salmonella. It's just too risky to be slaughtering...

LEMON: Well, the government is saying also, too -- and I do have to say this -- that the mad cow outbreak that we saw in 1997, most of these cows were born after that. So the chances of that they're saying are slim. Do you disagree with that?

PACELLE: I don't disagree that the chances are slim, but I am concerned that USDA is always trying to calm the public largely -- you know, for the meat industry's well-being and welfare. I think that there are tangible violations of their policies that occurred at this plant, and it was only because the Humane Society of the United States chose to investigate this plant have these abuses been uncovered.

They have food safety rules out there for a purpose. And they were being violated. And I think the public should be concerned about the level of oversight...

LEMON: Are you saying that the U.S. government, the USDA, they violated these -- the rules on purpose?

PACELLE: I'm saying that the plant violated the rules, and USDA inspectors did not catch the violations. That it took a third party intervener like the Humane Society of the United States to uncover this gross mistreatment of downer animals.

LEMON: And you think the USDA was aware of this, aware of what they were doing and that there were violations there?

PACELLE: No, I'm not saying they were aware. I'm saying it was happening under their noses and they should have been aware. If they had a rigorous inspections program, they should not have tolerated these abuses at a plant.

I think it really calls into question the vigorous nature of their investigations inspection program. We've got to have a stronger program to prevent downer animals from being processed for human consumption.

LEMON: All right. So, do you agree people should be prosecuted for it?

PACELLE: Oh, there's no question. These people, you know, rammed cows with -- with forklifts. They applied electricity to their eyes, and even some of their other sensitive body parts. They put hoses with high-pressure water in their mouth and nostrils to simulate drowning. They did awful things. This violates the California anti- cruelty statute.

LEMON: Oh, OK. What do you want done from this?

PACELLE: Well, we now -- obviously, the recall has occurred and people need to be, you know, observant of what they're consuming.

LEMON: How concerned should people be, maybe is a better question?

PACELLE: I'm not sure they should be enormously concerned about the food safety issues. I think there's always a risk. You know, we're slaughtering 10 billion animals in this country a year, literally 10 billion. The food safety mechanisms are really not that strict that the public can feel absolutely sure that there are not going to be pathogens in the food supply.

So I think, you know, parents and all consumers need to be concerned, but I think we need to look to USDA to have more rigorous enforcement mechanisms at the plant and we need to close gaps in policy. The country is still allowing some downers to be slaughtered for human consumption. That is unconscionable in this day and age.

LEMON: And Wayne, real quick, because we want to get some perspective from our medical correspondent here, but you are saying this is only the tip. This is only one example in what you believe is a much larger story here?

PACELLE: We selected this plant at random. So the fact that we got this one hit at this plant and uncovered these terrible abuses, it would be remarkable if this were the only problem if we selected this at random.

LEMON: Wayne Pacelle, the Humane Society in Sacramento. We thank you for joining us.

PACELLE: Thank you. KEILAR: And as Don said, this is the biggest recall in U.S. history, 143 million pounds of beef. The Agriculture Department declared it unfit for human consumption, but some of it has been eaten already. And here to talk more about potential health concerns, medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen.

And we just heard Mr. Pacelle from the Humane Society -- president of the Humane Society, saying, you know, you don't need to be enormously concerned, but he said there is always a risk. And of course people are going to wonder about that.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Right. It sounds to me, from what he said, is that this is sort of a proof of principle, the principle that the Humane Society and others have, which is that the USDA is not doing its job.

What he was trying to say is, how did this happen? There's a USDA inspector at this plant. How did this happen to those animals and how did those animals get slaughtered?

It is a big no-no to just automatically slaughter these downer animals, these animals that are unable to walk. And the reason is very simple. If an animal is unable to walk, it might mean that they're sick, and it might mean they even have Mad Cow Disease. And you certainly don't want to slaughter a cow that has Mad Cow Disease.

Now, Brianna, the chances that those cows actually had Mad Cow Disease are really quite small. That's what the USDA keeps saying over and over again, because we have rules about how to feed animals and other kind of rules that would make that possibility quite limited. But the facts are is that -- the rules are you're not supposed to be slaughtering those animals. That wasn't supposed to happen.

KEILAR: Sure. And understandably. And this recall goes back so far, that's what's interesting. Maybe if some of this meat was consumed, it could have been consumed a really long time ago. But what if you think that you ate some of this?

COHEN: Right. And I bet some parents are concerned -- and so much of this millions of pounds of this meat went to schools. What if your child ate it? The simple truth is, is that if it was already consumed, there is nothing you can do about it. It has been done.

And also, people should know that the symptoms of Mad Cow Disease take years to show up. So, there's no reason to be vigilant at this moment and keep watching for it. It can take years and years for these signs to show up. So, if there is a concern, you can certainly talk to the school and see if they even use this vendor. And I want to get in here what the company has to say about all this, because they do have an official statement.

And this statement says from the president of the company, Westland Meat Company, Hallmark Meat Packing Company, "I want to reassure our customers and consumers that our company has met the highest standards for harvesting and processing meat under the Federal Meat Inspection Act."

KEILAR: Always good to get that response in there. And, of course, I think people out there want to know where they can go to figure out what's been recalled. Is there a resource for them?

COHEN: There is. Now, usually we try to read these on air. We try to say what the lot numbers are and describe the products, but the list is so incredibly long, we could never do that. Two years for the product. So what you want to do is go to CNN.com. There is a link there on our beef recall story, and you can see all the -- see the long list.

Because you know what, Brianna, some of this might still be in people's freezers. It is possible -- quite possible that not all of this was consumed and that it's sitting in freezers. So, it's important to look.

KEILAR: Yes, you should look. Actually, the last time -- on of the last times there was a meat recall, I had some of it in my freezer. I was so surprised.

COHEN: There you go. You never know.

KEILAR: Yes. You got be careful.

LEMON: The scary thing about mad cow, is that there's no treatment and no cure. It's fatal.

COHEN: It's not like a bacteria, where you can take an antibiotic.

LEMON: That's the scary part.

KEILAR: But, of course, that's not necessarily --

COHEN: Everyone keeps saying tiny probability.

KEILAR: Tiny probability. OK, Elizabeth Cohen, thanks so much.

HOLMES: It's a showdown that hearkens back to the days of VHS and Beta remember that in the '80s? Well, who is going to win, Blu- ray or DVD? Susan Lisovicz has the latest round in this digital world battle. Who is going to win? Who do you think? Don't say anything. You're watching CNN, the most trusted name in news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right, like Betamax before it, HD DVD risks becoming the latest digital dinosaur. Susan Lisovicz is in New York with the very latest on this. And, you know what?

There was kind of a clue here, I kind of got the feeling that the one who won out was going to win out, because there was so much talk about it so --

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's a lot -- LEMON: Did you have a Betamax, by the way?

LISOVICZ: No, no, I didn't.

LEMON: My uncle had one actually, I remember when I was a kid. And with the projection screen that you had to pull out, like you opened it, you remember that?

LISOVICZ: You know, barely. Barely, Don.

LEMON: You were just a babe in the woods.

LISOVICZ: My memory bank is so full at this point. Well, while we're talking, we're going to fast-forward to high-definition DVDs, the latest generation of DVD players, and who will win that lucrative format war. This is a battle that has been raging between Sony and Toshiba.

Sony's product is the Blu-ray, Toshiba's in the other corner, HD DVD, it now appears that Toshiba is ready to throw in the towel on its HD DVD business. A decision could come tomorrow. Both formats deliver high-quality audio and video, but they are not compatible with each other. Just last week, Wal-Mart said it will exclusively sell Blu-ray, not HD DVD, and Netflix, no longer rents HD DVDs. So, it was -- those were two big strikes against HD, that's for sure, Don.

LEMON: So the big winner, Sony.

LISOVICZ: Well, yes, you would think so, with some -- some of the things that have been going against Toshiba. It not only sells, by the way, Sony, Blu-ray players, but its PlayStation gaming console also plays Blu-ray disks, so all of those customers are big winners as well.

It could also be a big victory for the industry, because many consumers, like Don Lemon, who are so into their gadgets, they follow it so closely, they hold off purchases until these kind of squabbles are resolved. Who loses? Well, the estimated one million people who already bought HD DVD players.

Their systems could soon be obsolete, joining an illustrated list, that includes the Betamax, Don's uncle, the eight track, the two-way pager, remember that?

LEMON: I still have one.

LISOVICZ: You just can't part with them.

LEMON: I'm kidding. Doctors still wear -- some professions still wear pagers, which is interesting. I guess, the simple, the better, you know what, call this number and it --

LISOVICZ: If it works I --

LEMON: You lose all the clutter. Yes, yes, yes. I remember that. It was a projection screen, I think it was a front-projection screen television, the three big -- like a red, blue, and yellow thing on it. You had to open the front of it. You don't remember it.

LISOVICZ: It must have been some media room.

LEMON: They are telling me we got to go. But, I'm going to find a picture of it, Susan, and then you'll remember it.

LISOVICZ: OK. We can talk about that in the next hour.

LEMON: Thank you, Susan.

KEILAR: Would more guns on campus prevent future massacres? One group says, yes, and they're taking some heat for it. You are going to hear the debate in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: A boyfriend, a roommate, a nice, caring person, that's how Steven Kazmierczak's girlfriend is remembering him, not as a man who killed five students and himself at Northern Illinois University last Thursday. In an exclusive interview with CNN, Jessica Baty says she still loves Kazmierczak and that he was, quote, "anything but a monster." But she knew something was wrong the last time she talked to him.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JESSICA BATY, KAZMIERCZAK'S GIRLFRIEND: He called me before he was going to go to bed. And he said that, you know -- he told me not to forget about him. And he told me that he would see me tomorrow, and then when he got off the phone, he said, good-bye, Jessica. And he never said good-bye, Jessica. He always said, you know, see you later, Jessie. Or -- it was never good-bye Jessica. And I just thought that was strange.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, at least one group wants more guns on campus after the Northern Illinois rampage, and others like it. The Internet-based lobbying group is called Students for Concealed Carry on campus. It was formed after last year's massacre at Virginia Tech. And it's pushing to overrule college officials who ban guns on campus.

One of its members spoke to CNN's Betty Nguyen earlier in the NEWSROOM, along with a Virginia Tech survivor, who says more guns are not the answer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARRETT EVANS, VIRGINIA TECH STUDENT: Students are not old enough and mentally responsible enough to deal -- to deal with having guns on campus. Because, you know, concealed weapons, because they act on impulses because of raging hormones, instead of the use of logic.

BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: So you think as we see all of these shootings -- EVANS: Third of all --

NGUYEN: ... that the last one being at NIU -- that if a student didn't have a handgun, that student wouldn't have been able to take out the shooter before he hurt so many people?

EVANS: Well, that brings me to the third point. The third point is, it doesn't matter how trained you are, you look what happened to Jim Brady, President Reagan and two secret serviceman. Bought -- a Saturday night special, got -- shot them, got all six shots off before he was detained. And you look at the St. Louis, Missouri situation.

That guy brought in his gun, shot the officer, grabbed his gun, killed five secret councilman -- and city councilman and then shot the mayor, OK? It doesn't matter how trained you are.

W. SCOTT LEWIS, STUDENTS FOR CONCEALED CARRY ON CAMPUS: All we're talking about is allowing the same individuals who are trained and licensed, and we're talking about individuals age 21 and above in most states, to carry concealed handguns virtually everywhere else. These people are already carrying at movie theaters, office buildings, grocery store, shopping malls, churches, banks, et cetera.

NGUYEN: And, in fact, you carrying a gun? Are you carrying one today?

LEWIS: Well that's the beauty of concealed carry, you'll never know. But the fact of the matter is, individuals have used concealed handguns under very intense circumstances, individuals with concealed handgun licenses, to stop crimes in progress, to mitigate shootings. And -- although we can't say that a concealed handgun can be used in any particular instance to stop a particular shooting, we can definitely say it would even the odds.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, Lewis says his group's membership went way up in the days after the Northern Illinois campus rampage.

KEILAR: The man who killed this college student -- I think we have, this is Brianna Denison. The man who killed her is considered a serial rapist, and police in Reno, Nevada, are warning that he may strike again. Today the town is reacting to the death of Denison with a mix of sadness and fear.

Missing for nearly a month, the college freshman was found dead on Friday in an overgrown field. The cause of her death is ruled strangulation. And yesterday, authorities announced that tests have linked the unknown killer to two of three rapes committed in Reno late last year. Women are being urged to take extra safety precautions and the public is being asked to help in the search for the killer.

The state of Connecticut is considering a new move to keep closer watch on sex offenders. The governor wants to put the designation on their driver's licenses and also on state I.D. cards. But some state lawmakers are questioning whether the plan could hurt sex offenders' efforts to find jobs and housing after they leave prison.

LEMON: Have you seen this man? Well, police hope someone has. More than two weeks after a deadly shooting rampage in Tinley Park, just outside of Chicago. They've just put out an updated sketch of the gunman who killed five women at a Lane Bryant clothing store. The new sketch shows a front view of the man, without his hat, and with his braids showing. The sketch is based on descriptions from the lone survivor of that attack.

For the best crime coverage on the web, check out CNN.com/crime. It is a new effort from our friends at truTV and CNN.com. Go behind the police tape and into the courtroom like never before -- CNN.com/crime.

KEILAR: A crucial election in Pakistan. The votes of these folks could shape the political fate of a key U.S. ally.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Security was extremely tight. The voting, at first, a bit light. It is the first time in six years that Pakistanis have been to the polls to choose a Parliament. And even though his name wasn't on the ballot, the political future of President Pervez Musharraf hinges on who is elected. If the two leading opposition parties win two-thirds of Parliament, they'll have enough votes to impeach him.

Mr. Musharraf says whichever party wins will have his full cooperation. President Musharraf also promised free and fair elections, among those on hand in Lahore. To see if that was the case, U.S. Senator, Joe Biden. I spoke with him shortly after the polls closed.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. JOE BIDEN (D), CHMN., FOREIGN RELATIONS CMTE.: We went to one polling place early in the day, prior to 10:00 in the morning. Very low turnout. By the time the polling was about to close, around 4:00, we visited another polling place, much -- much more brisk turnout.

And I think it is exactly as you characterized it. To the extent that people began, it appeared, you can't make -- I can't make an overall judgment. At least in Lahore, it appeared as there were not a great deal of violence, that people were more encouraged to come out and cast their vote.

LEMON: Well, as you know, the concern early on, especially when Benazir Bhutto was assassinated, was that Musharraf was head of the military and also the president there. The military has so much power and has so much force there. Do you think that even with this election, no matter which way it turns out, that the violence -- that there could be the possibility of violence, and that this election won't mean anything with the military being essentially the fifth estate? BIDEN: Well, I -- I -- look, I think it depends on how it turns out. If Musharraf's party, the Q (ph) party, beats all odds and ends up being the winner here, I think it will be viewed as a totally discredited an undertaking. And then I think you'll see some movement in the street here. And the question will be whether or not the military moves on the population. My overwhelming instinct is the military does not, does not, want a confrontation with the population.

LEMON: Yes.

BIDEN: My hope is that -- that the polls indicate turnout is essentially what was indicated. And everybody here seems to be prepared to make some compromises to have a step forward in this process.

LEMON: After the assassination of Benazir Bhutto, you sent out a statement saying this fall, "I twice urged President Musharraf to provide better security for Miss Bhutto and other political leaders." And then you went on to say, "the failure to protect Miss Bhutto raises a lot of hard questions for the government and the security services that must be answered."

Have you met with Musharraf, and what is your relationship with him now?

BIDEN: I have spoke with him several times on the telephone. I will meet with him tomorrow. And -- and I think that -- that there was a game of chicken, essentially, played between Mrs. Bhutto and -- and Musharraf. She wanted to get out and actively campaign, and they did not provide the security, sufficient security in my view, thinking that that would, in my view, keep her from being aggressive, as aggressive as campaigning outside of her constituency.

LEMON: And you believed that she -- she was on the way to winning an election if she had not been assassinated, you 100 percent believe that?

BIDEN: I do believe that. And I do believe her party is on their way to winning by a plurality.

LEMON: You have threatened to cut off the money --

BIDEN: Sure.

LEMON: ... and funding --

BIDEN: Sure.

LEMON: ... from the U.S. if the election does not turn out the way that you think it should. Do you think that that is a smart idea --

BIDEN: Well, no.

LEMON: ... when it comes to the U.S., our relations? BIDEN: I know it's a smart idea, or I wouldn't have said it. Look, here's the deal -- the deal is that if the Pakistani people accept the results of this election which took place today, then everything is going to continue to move forward positively. If the Pakistani people and the international community conclude that this election was rigged, then the only pressure point that the United States has to deal with Musharraf is through the military. That's the only pressure point.

LEMON: Obviously for the people of Pakistan --

BIDEN: Sure.

LEMON: ... this has to do with oppression. What is in it for the United States? What does the United States get out of this?

BIDEN: The United States benefits for the stable Pakistan. Not just as it relates to terror, as it relates to the subcontinent of India, as it relates to 160 million people deciding to move toward a robust democracy. I for one believe we should not have a Musharraf policy, we should have a Pakistani policy.

I have proposed that we lay out to the Pakistani people, the vast majority of who are moderate, that we will significantly increase economic assistance. I propose we triple it. And I propose there be a democracy dividend, because you need economic development here in order for a democracy to thrive. And this is the first step toward that, hopefully.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Senator Joe Biden from Islamabad.

Senators John Kerry, and also Chuck Hagel, observed the first voting. Election officials say it will likely be two more days before the final official results are known.

KEILAR: A daring high-seas rescue, sailors overboard. A shot at a world record, just plain over.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: A world record attempt interrupted in the worst way. We want you to take a look here at these photos off the -- these pictures, rather, off the coast of New Zealand. That is a capsized trimaran. Ten French sailors went overboard. Rescue helicopters reached them this morning, pulled them out of the ocean. So that's the good news, as well as the fact that there were no serious injuries.

But here's the bad news. These sailors were about halfway through their attempt to break the around the world speed record, which is just more than 50 days. So, a few weeks there down the drain for them unfortunately.

LEMON: Food safety at issue. An animal cruelty case leads to the biggest beef recall in U.S. history.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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