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Gunman Holds Hostage; Should Senator Clinton Drop Out?
Aired March 29, 2008 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: It plays out on the streets of Miami. A masked gunman with a hostage. You will see how it unfolds for yourself, from beginning to end.
Reverend Jeremiah Wright makes his first public appearance. Surprise. And listen to the pastor who invited him.
If she can't beat the man, should she quit? Another Democrat says yes. Mr. President, what do you say?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We just need to relax and let this happen. Nobody's talking about wrecking the party.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: And Chelsea, back on the stump for her mother. But don't ask about...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHELSEA CLINTON, HILLARY CLINTON'S DAUGHTER: I do not think that's any of your business.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: I told you not to ask that. The student who got slammed joins me live.
Judge to these suspects. You're in America, learn English or go to jail.
Hummer gone wild.
And erectile dysfunction. Every time you turn on the tube. Are you sick of it? Thank you, Viagra. Oh! And happy birthday.
Weekend rundown now.
Hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez. We are live. Let me set this up for you, because this is the type of video that you're going to want to see again and again. What's interesting about this story is that it will have you probably asking why. On several counts. Here we go. Police say that a gunman tries to rob a Walgreen's and ends up taking the manager as his hostage. Shots are fired. There's a struggle. There's a chase. Here it is. First, I want you to see this. Just uninterrupted as it happens.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: Put your hands up!
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: Give it up! Just give it up! Just give it up!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: What you just heard there just before the siren, by the way, was about 18 rounds fired by the police. We understand they did hit the suspect a couple of times, maybe more. Really a lot of questions left in this case and so much to talk about. As we look at this amazing video play out. Let's go to Miami live. CNN's Susan Candiotti is following the story for us.
Set this up for us, Susan. Take the viewer back to how we got to that point where they start to see that video.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: OK, Rick. All this started before sunup today, about 6:30 in the morning. And here's the kicker and we learned this only just tonight. Turns out the suspect was actually hiding in the store. He didn't bust in. He was there all night long.
So that when the store manager and the employees came in this morning, opened up the store, started to have a meeting, the suspect popped up out of nowhere, took the store manager hostage, forced him to get some money out of the back and then made their way out the back door. The suspect using the store manager as a hostage to try to make his escape. But the cops were waiting.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDIOTTI (voice-over): At gunpoint the store manager is forced outside by a masked man. Cops start yelling at the suspect.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: Give it up! Just give it up!
CANDIOTTI: WPLG-TV's Fabrissio Lopez is the lone photographer. He zeroed in on the action.
FABRISSION LOPEZ, WPLG PHOTOGRAPHER: With a (INAUDIBLE), they're grabbing right here and then they're gone in a half.
CANDIOTTI: And you're thinking?
LOPEZ: I'm thinking, wow. In that moment I say, am I rolling?
CANDIOTTI: He was. The suspect yells at police, who have him in their sights. UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: Get back!
LOPEZ: I wait for him. But you see, the guy's crazy. He got a weapon.
CANDIOTTI: The manager won't give in.
LT. ROBERT WILLIAMS, MIAMI-DADE POLICE: Pushed him, the subject's pushing. There's a little tussle going on.
LOPEZ: The guy's screaming, help, help, help!
WILLIAMS: I guess when, you know, your adrenaline's flowing and the way it was flowing, you have somebody that's there, that's armed. This manager did not want to go with that subject like that.
CANDIOTTI: Incredibly, the shaken hostage escapes, barely injured. And within seconds, bullets start flying. WPLG-TV estimates at least 18 shots are fired. The suspect takes off in the same car. About three hours later, he's caught, shot more than once, and survived.
Back at the drugstore police count bullet casings, interview store employees, and confiscate every police gun fired. As for the store manager's heroic escape, cops say fighting back was risky but give him credit for guts.
WILLIAMS: He didn't know what mindset this guy was in. And he just wanted to get away and he did and I'm very happy that he saved himself.
CANDIOTTI: Lucky man?
WILLIAMS: I would probably say God is looking out for him, yes.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: It's amazing. And you say the store manager's OK?
CANDIOTTI: He's OK. He's obviously still shaken up. According to police tonight, he is resting at home and doesn't want to talk about it to anybody for now.
SANCHEZ: Do we have any idea why he put up a fight? I think we're going to be getting with that video here in just a moment. When I first watched this, I was shocked to see this guy fighting with a man who has a gun.
CANDIOTTI: Well, he really was taking a chance. As you know, you're oftentimes told by authorities not to put up a fight, to go along with it. However, in this case, the police say he just saw an opening and he decided to take it even though that man had that gun practically at the back of his head.
SANCHEZ: Yes. It's interesting that he took it just as he got to the vehicle. I mean, the last thing he probably wanted to do was -- he was probably thinking, once this guy gets me in this car and drives away with me, I could be in big trouble, so if I'm going to put up a fight, I'm going to do it right now.
CANDIOTTI: He took a calculated risk and it paid off for him, thank God.
SANCHEZ: Lucky. Why did this man take a hostage? Why didn't he just take the loot, many would ask?
CANDIOTTI: Well, I think in this case, the silent alarms were set off. He might not necessarily have known that. But when he got outside, maybe not wanting to take a chance, we're about to speculate at this time, we can only think that he was using it as cover to get to the car to make his get-away.
As soon as he hit that doorway, he could see that there were cops outside waiting for him. And with that hostage, he also knew that they probably couldn't take a shot at him.
SANCHEZ: Yes but it -- that's just it. If there were cops outside waiting for him, why did this thing end up going to another location where he actually got in the car and then drove away? Maybe the question should be asked this way -- why were police so hesitant?
CANDIOTTI: Well, because they didn't want to injure the store manager, of course. This guy was right in front of him. And you have to make sure that they could get a clear shot at him. It appears as though they couldn't, and they had to wait until they could get a clear shot at him. Otherwise, the store manager could have been hit.
SANCHEZ: All right, Susan Candiotti thanks so much.
All right. I'm told now we've got somebody who's standing by who might be able to fill in some of the blanks on this story for us. Detective Robert Williams, spokesperson for the Miami Dade Police Department. My old stomping grounds.
Detective, thanks so much for being with us, sir.
WILLIAMS: Thank you for having me.
SANCHEZ: You know, we're still trying to figure out, as we look at the video, and Roger, if you could put that video up again. I'm amazed that there was such a perfect shot that this photographer had of this scene as it unfolds. And I'm thinking that the photographer had a great shot. Didn't one of your police officers have a great shot as well? And why didn't he take it?
WILLIAMS: Well, you've got to remember that we have a victim here that's being taken hostage. We do not want to try to shoot that subject through a victim and injure that victim at that particular point. A camera and a firearm are two different tools here. A firearm is more deadly there, Rick.
SANCHEZ: When do you make the decision? Because look, I'm thinking down the line, if this guy gets this guy in his car and he gets away and he's already threatening bodily harm, he's got a gun to his head, when do you take the risk and say, look we've just got to take this guy out, because he's going to get in the car, he could do a lot of damage to pedestrians, he could kill the man he's got as his hostage.
Take me through the thought process.
WILLIAMS: Well, the thought process here is any time we have a situation like this, what we're trying to do is keep that person here. We do not try to let anybody leave with a hostage. Until our special response team gets here with negotiators in order to negotiate the return of that individual safely without any incident here.
In this particular case, as you see from the video, the manager was able to fight off the subject and be released before the officers opened fire on that subject there.
SANCHEZ: Let me ask you the question that I think our viewers are asking, because, they, like me watch a lot of television and they watch movies.
And it seems to us that when you have a clear shot, you should take it. Am I wrong and why?
WILLIAMS: Well, like I said before, Rick, you're talking about a firearm. And taking a shot like that, unless you're a sharp shooter, you run the risk of hitting that victim, possibly. Or you run the risk of that subject who had that victim at such close quarters to accidentally pull that trigger and kill that victim instantly there on the scene.
SANCHEZ: I get it. I get it. It's all about, you know, playing the odds and sometimes a chance that you don't want to take. One final question, Detective, if you would. Were you surprised when you saw this guy, this store manager, suddenly start fighting this guy with a gun?
WILLIAMS: It was quite a surprise. And we're very happy that he was able to get away without harm, except for a couple of bruises. A little caveat to this, Rick, is that one of the questions might how did that subject actually get into the store? It appears that subject hid himself the night before inside the store as the manager opened up, that's when the subject came out of hiding from there and took him out there.
SANCHEZ: Making news as well. Detective Robert Williams, my thanks to you, sir, for taking time to join us and take us through this.
WILLIAMS: Thank you for having me, Rick.
SANCHEZ: As we continue to run down the stories for you tonight, there he is. The Reverend Jeremiah Wright. He's made his first public appearance since the controversy over his sermons blind-sided the Obama campaign. And you're never going to guess what a white pastor of a church nearby had to say when Wright showed up at his church. We'll have that for you.
And then, Bill Clinton says everyone should just relax. Chelsea Clinton is anything but relaxed when asked about her father's affair. She is out campaigning again today. We'll show you what's happened.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back to the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Rick Sanchez. Should Senator Hillary Clinton just quit? Barack Obama says no. Surprisingly, he says that she should stay in the race. But another top Democrat says that she should get out because the math just doesn't seem to add up for her. And then there's Bill Clinton. He's in this report, too.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ (voice-over): It wasn't my idea, says Barack Obama, the day after one of his prominent supporters, Senator Patrick Leahy, called for Hillary Clinton to drop out of the race.
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My attitude is that Senator Clinton can run as long as she wants. Her name's on the ballot. And she is a fierce and formidable competitor.
SANCHEZ: Marching in a Pennsylvania parade Saturday, Bill Clinton had his own message for Leahy.
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: People should just relax and let this process go on. It's good, it's exciting, it's good for democracy.
SANCHEZ: Hillary Clinton delivered her own defiant message as well for the second day as she campaigned through Indiana and Kentucky Saturday.
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There are some folks saying, well, we ought to stop these elections. I didn't think we believed that in America.
SANCHEZ: With polls showing some Obama and Clinton supporters threatening to vote for John McCain. The candidate who losses is in increasingly bitter race. Former rival John Edwards Saturday reminded young Democrats either choice beats electing a Republican.
JOHN EDWARDS (D), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We'd be a lot more blessed to have either one of them as president, not have John McCain as president of the United States.
SANCHEZ: Obama says he doesn't believe that will happen. But he says the candidates and their supporters need to avoid giving Republicans more ammunition for the fall.
OBAMA: We do want to make sure that to the extent that I can control it, that we show some -- some restraint and that we're measured in how we present the contrast between myself and Senator Clinton. We have not been blameless in this process.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Chelsea Clinton was back on the campaign trail today. She was in North Carolina stumping for her mom. But earlier this week when asked by a 20-year-old college student about her mom's handling of the Monica Lewinsky affair, she cut the guy off right at the knees. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHELSEA CLINTON: Wow. You're the first person actually that's ever asked me that question. In the -- I don't know, maybe 70 college campuses that I've now been to. And I do not think that's any of your business.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Here's my question. We know that mom and dad have always asked that the media handle their daughter with kid gloves. And leave her alone. And I believe that for the most part the media has been very respectful. But if the former first daughter is going to be campaigning for mom, and, by the way, she's now 28 years old, she's not 12 years old anymore, shouldn't she be covered just like any other campaign surrogate?
First, let's do this. Let's go to the young man who actually asked the question. Joining us now is Evan Strange from Butler University in Indianapolis.
Were you taken aback by her answer to you?
EVAN STRANGE, BUTLER UNIVERSITY STUDENT: Absolutely. The question focused on Monica Lewinsky. I just want to clear this up. The question focused on the criticism that she may not be a strong enough leader. So, I think she just took the question wrong and that's why she answered the way she did.
SANCHEZ: Yes, but wait a minute. Let's be fair. You didn't ask that. You did mention Monica Lewinsky in the question, didn't you?
STRANGE: Absolutely, but whether or not I mentioned the name the question would still remain the same, it was about her strength.
SANCHEZ: So you think that it was a fair question. You were basically saying did her experience in the way she handled Monica Lewinsky show that she was credible enough to have the job? And by the way, you're a supporter of Hillary Clinton, are you not?
STRANGE: I was. I'm going to wait until she addresses the question before I say anything else. But I mean I was just asking the question to address the strength, not necessarily the credibility.
SANCHEZ: I was somewhat taken aback by the way she responded to you. Because she could have just as easily said, you know, I'm not comfortable talking about that, thanks for coming, but you know, I'm just not going to answer that.
When you say to someone, it's none of your business, sounds to me like it's very confrontational. Did you take it that way?
STRANGE: Yes, I really did. Because I mean, my first reaction was, we're the voters in America, and I feel like the president of the United States is the most important enough position to be able to ask that question. And ultimately, I feel like it is our business.
SANCHEZ: Were you insulted?
STRANGE: No, I wasn't insulted. As I have the right to ask the question, she has the right to decline to answer.
SANCHEZ: Did you go there in a capacity as a member of the general public or were you there in some journalistic or informative capacity?
STRANGE: I was there with a mass communications class and I asked on behalf of myself and other college students.
SANCHEZ: Because there was a story out earlier this week that said that you were writing for the school newspaper?
STRANGE: No.
SANCHEZ: You don't write for the Butler Newspaper?
STRANGE: No, I'm not affiliated with the Butler school newspaper at all.
SANCHEZ: Do you believe that she's ever -- when she said to you, you know, I have been traveling to like 70 different schools and I've never once been asked this question, did you buy that?
STRANGE: I mean, I found it hard to believe, because people on our campus are asking that question. So I mean, it's definitely hard to believe. So I mean, if she says that no one asked her that, then I guess no one asked her.
SANCHEZ: Evan, stay right there. We might want to bring you back. Some of the fellows we have here might have some questions for us.
You know who's joining us tonight? Neil Boortz. He wrote "The Terrible Truth About Liberals." Who is it? OK, he's a firebrand as you can already tell. John Sugg is right next to him. He's a witty writer of a column, wrote for "Creative Lofty." Now he's actually a fellow for...
JOHN SUGG, SENIOR FELLOW, THINK ATLANTA: Think Atlanta.
SANCHEZ: Think Atlanta. And also Shelley Wynter. He's a conservative talk show, it's called "The Right Side." Neil, go ahead. What do you think of this?
NEIL BOORTZ, RADIO HOST: I think Chelsea should have invited Evan Strange up on the stage and slapped the dog squeeze out of him.
SANCHEZ: Really?
BOORTZ: And then kicked him in the groin and sent him back into the audience. I think that the question to bring up the Monica Lewinsky situation, with Bill Clinton's daughter, is absolutely beyond the pale. He ought to get a failing grade in that mass communications class and ought to be laughed off the campus. That totally out of line.
SANCHEZ: Whoa, Neil!
SUGG: No! I mean, Chelsea is fair game.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Absolutely.
SUGG: OK. She's, you know, if she wants to go out there and shill for her mom's campaign, she's a target, OK? And you know...
SANCHEZ: Neil, Neil is what...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's still a daughter.
SUGG: Neil is one of these guys that didn't let up on Bill Clinton during the last years of his presidency, OK? It was all the conservative talk shows could talk about was the stain on the blue dress and all this stuff.
SANCHEZ: But listen, you have to admit, And I think you'll agree with me, maybe you won't. But the media really has been pretty respectable and kind to her all these years. Right?
SUGG: And that's wrong.
SANCHEZ: Really?
SUGG: Yes.
SANCHEZ: Do you think we've taken it too far now?
SUGG: No. I don't think that she should be attacked and I don't think she was attacked, but she's fair game for tough questions.
SANCHEZ: Let me go -- Neil, let me go back to you. Why do you think that's so horrible a question?
BOORTZ: Because first, it was -- it had to be -- and I've met Chelsea Clinton. I think she's absolutely delightful.
SANCHEZ: Most people do.
BOORTZ: And I think that her father does not deserve a daughter like that, OK? But that had to be a just horrendous time in her life, and I think Evans -- I think that the question was more of an attack than it was...
SANCHEZ: Well, let's take that back to Evan then, to be fair.
Evan, he says it was probably more of an attack. Can you answer that charge?
STRANGE: I mean, I think everyone's looking way too far into this. I asked the question because whether people think they are or not, they're asking this question. College students, people around the world are asking this question.
SANCHEZ: Tell Mr. Boortz how you phrased the question.
STRANGE: I asked her what her opinion was on the criticism that Hillary may have showed weakness during the scandal. And that she may not be a strong enough leader for the United States.
SUGG: That's a fair question.
BOORTZ: There are plenty of occasions where Hillary Clinton had showed weakness, OK? You don't have to take the daughter and in front of the nation and in front of that campus say, I'm going to ask a question now that's going to remind you of this horrible time when your father was being serviced by some young bimbo in the Oval office.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But when do you ask the question?
BOORTZ: While you and your mother were upstairs...
SANCHEZ: Gentleman, go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When do you ask the question? I mean...
BOORTZ: You don't ask it of her.
SHELLEY WYNTER, RADIO HOST, THE RIGHT SIDE: But she's out there. She's -- the campaign put her out there specifically to reach 18 to 30-year-olds. That's why they're going to college campuses...
BOORTZ: Am I the only one up here with a daughter?
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: If you put her in Bosnia and say it's a dangerous place, she's in harm's way. If you put her in front of a bunch of college students who may ask a persnickety question, you've got to deal with the consequences.
I think that's what Shelley's saying.
BOORTZ: That's exactly the kind of question you'd expect out of a college student. You know, that magic age. That's too bad. That magic age when they know everything. Why don't we just turn over the whole operation of this government to college students for a couple of years and see how well -- they know it all anyway.
SANCHEZ: I know you did when you were that age, right, John?
SUGG: I think college students are the hope of this nation. And I hear a lot more intelligent questions from college students than I do on the radio a lot of times.
WYNTER: Or that I hear from White House press officers that ask questions of the president. I mean that was fair question. You put her out there. It was a fair question. I think the missed opportunity really was the campaign wasn't prepared for that question because the right answer from Chelsea, I believe, that would have helped her mother more, and not that I'm a Hillary Clinton supporter by any stretch of the imagination.
But I think the answer would have been, that my mom in that situation showed loyalty, commitment to family, and these are the kind of attributes that you want to see in your president. So I think that was a golden opportunity missed. I think she was too smug and I think that -- Evan, good job.
SANCHEZ: Interesting conversation. Evan, you're getting the good, the bad and the ugly here, my friend. But my thanks to you for joining us.
BOORTZ: Evan, become an accountant.
SUGG: Become a journalist.
SANCHEZ: More topic as we continue. Stay with us.
Here's the interview that everyone would love to get. But the Reverend Jeremiah Wright hasn't emerged since his controversial sermons made big news. Guess what? He's emerged.
Also this. We're so provincial when it comes to sex in this country, except when it comes to commercials for erectile dysfunction. Why is that? Happy birthday, Viagra. Stay there. This gets good.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Viagra. Hard to believe it's now been around 10 years. Uplifting so many -- spirits. Even Bob Dole. Remember this?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Like erectile dysfunction, E.D., oftentimes, impotence. You know, it's really embarrassing to talk about E.D. But it's so important to millions of Americans and their partners. That I decided to talk about it publicly.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Let's go to our talkers now. OK, you guys. I want to talk to you about this but there's something I want to share with you. I think we've got this graphic that we can put up. We looked this up. In the last election cycle, the pharmaceutical industry gave about $19 million in campaign contributions to politicians. Check this out. While 31 percent of that windfall went to Dems, 67 percent went to GOP candidates. Now, we checked and apparently they've been doing this for many, many years.
Here's what I'm thinking, is somewhat ironic. You guys tell me if I'm wrong. The same people in this country who are for family values and get offended when somebody shows something sexual, have been all for these companies that are talking about men's -- you know what's -- every five seconds on TV. Irony?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not at all.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, not at all.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't see it.
WYNTER: Not at all, because you're -- the money that you're saying is being spent -- you're making the assumption that it's going all for Viagra.
SANCHEZ: No, what I'm saying is -- that it's perfectly fine to talk and complain about sexual innuendoes in this country, unless somebody's giving you a lot of money to put on a commercial that embarrasses a lot of guys when they're watching TV with their kids, like me.
BOORTZ: That embarrasses you?
SANCHEZ: Yes, it does.
BOORTZ: Why?
SANCHEZ: Because I don't want to see somebody talking about, with my 4-year-old or 5-year-old daughter sitting on my lap and I'm watching TV, I don't want to watch somebody talking about this.
BOORTZ: About what specifically? Sex? Or about this Viagra stuff that I'm not really familiar with?
SANCHEZ: About erectile dysfunction.
BOORTZ: Before we get any further, can somebody explain this Viagra thing to me? I'm not -- what does it do?
SANCHEZ: Apparently it cures erectile dysfunction.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that is what?
SANCHEZ: A problem -- would you stop it? The point is...
BOORTZ: And this is the problem for who?
SANCHEZ: Apparently, it's a problem for many Americans because every five seconds you turn on your TV or the Neil Boortz radio show...
(CROSSTALK)
JOHN SUGG, COLUMNIST, CREATIVE LOAFING: They talk about electile dysfunction?
SANCHEZ: No, it erectile dysfunction.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: But I'm serious.
BOORTZ: (INAUDIBLE), the pharmaceutical companies, let me ask you this.
SANCHEZ: No, I'm not. They're doing whatever they can to get their money into politicians.
(CROSSTALK)
BOORTZ: All this E.D., would you like to -- let's just say, Rick, God forbid, all of a sudden you should suffer from this. Would you want to depend on the government to come along with a cure?
SANCHEZ: No, here's my point. We had a tizzy because Janet Jackson showed a little bit of her breast to the point where we were talking about it in this country, and conservative politicians were standing up there and saying, this is disgusting. And yet, we're watching people talk about their penises every five minutes.
SHELLEY WYNTER, RADIO HOST, THE RIGHT SIDE: It's two different things. Because, I mean, you might be offended by the erectile dysfunction commercial. I'm offended by Vagisil commercials in the middle of breakfast.
SANCHEZ: Oh, you had to go there.
WYNTER: So, you know, these are all things that people use. Janet Jackson's breast is not something I'd like to use.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: What I'm saying is you're only offended until the money comes into play, and then the offensive goes away. There's a hypocrisy to this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, not at all.
SUGG: If I have a medical problem, my doctor can tell me about it. I do not need to see the same commercial 30 times in an evening about pushing Viagra or all the other stuff that they push. Which drives up the cost of medical care. And why do we need it? I mean, America has...
SANCHEZ: We need it because pharmaceutical companies are making a killing on it. SUGG: We repress sex like crazy.
SANCHEZ: Right.
SUGG: Religious values and all that. And at the same time, we throw sex at people constantly. And of course, I'm surprised we're not all nuts, you know. Not just a few of us who are.
WYNTER: But the people that repress sex are not the people that are throwing sex at, you know -- throwing it around.
SANCHEZ: No, they're not throwing it around. They're just taking money from the people who are putting these commercials on TV while saying they're disgusted when anybody else talks about sex.
WYNTER: No, I don't think anybody has ever...
SANCHEZ: You don't see the hypocrisy there?
WYNTER: No, not at all. Because I don't see anybody that's being disgusted when someone talks about it. I think people have discussed it -- for instance, let's talk about Eliot Spitzer. This sexual scandal.
SANCHEZ: Right.
WYNTER: We're not disgusted that he had sex. We're disgusted that he's an elected official who lied to his wife and spent overpaid for sex. That's what we're discussing about. And you're supposed to be doling out the government money and you're overpaying for sex that you don't even need.
SANCHEZ: Boortz, close this out on this.
BOORTZ: Well, you talk about hypocrisy. Here's something that really bothers me. You get a yellow front bookstore, or a video shop in your community, oh my goodness, they're selling videos where people are having sex. And everybody goes nuts. Until they get that place shut down. Then you go to blockbusters and you can buy video after video after video, where people are killing each other, gutting each other, cutting off heads, cutting off limbs...
SANCHEZ: Great point.
BOORTZ: That's great entertainment. But for God sakes don't let anybody have sex because that's going to destroy our value system.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: We're going to pick it up in just a little bit. You guys stay there. We've got plenty of more conversations coming your way.
Like this one. He's been out of the public eye since his sermons hit the news cycle. But the Reverend Jeremiah Wright was in church today. We're going to tell you what he did, what he says, where he was. Learn English or go to jail. That's a choice of Pennsylvania judge is giving four defendants. Justice served? Or justice ridiculous? Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: We're back on CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Rick Sanchez. Tonight another preacher is blasting those who blast Barack Obama. The difference between Reverend Jeremiah Wright, who have made the earlier controversial comments we've all heard many times by now. And this minister -- is that this minister is white. Does it matter? Should it matter? Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED PREACHER: It is unacceptable and it is patronizing to call the best hope we've had in America for a mighty long time. A kid with a fairy tale. Calling in 2008 a black man a kid is like 1958 calling him a boy. If that was unacceptable, then this is unacceptable.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: What do you think this guy's doing? Let's go back to our talkers. Jumping on a bandwagon, being an opportunist? I see heads shaking. Go ahead, gentlemen.
SUGG: I agree with him.
SANCHEZ: You agree with what he's saying?
SUGG: Yes, I mean, you know, I mean, I don't know anything about him beyond what I just heard. But I think that this whole issue of Jeremiah Wright has been overblown to the max.
SANCHEZ: Does it prove that this story still has some serious legs and that in the end, it's not going to end up hurting Obama as many thought it would at the beginning?
SUGG: I don't think it had serious legs from the beginning. I think it's a non-issue but it's the best that the press could grab.
SANCHEZ: But wait a minute, John, when this story first broke there were people out there demanding that Barack Obama make an apology, stand up, defend our nation.
SUGG: Sure. Another network was demanding it every day. But that doesn't mean that Barack Obama deserves to do more than he did.
SANCHEZ: So you think what he did was enough, and apparently the polls seem to indicate that it wasn't...
SUGG: I think it was absolutely the right thing to do. It's one of the greatest speeches that I've heard.
SANCHEZ: Do you agree with that as a conservative? WYNTER: Absolutely. I'm a conservative that supports Barack Obama. And it's the greatest speech I've ever heard, just like John Sugg said. And the proof in the pudding that this story had no legs, the people are pushing this story with Jeremiah Wright are not the people who are going to vote for Barack Obama or Hillary, or anybody with a "D" after their name.
So when that said, we already know that it's not going to be an effective story.
SANCHEZ: Neal, your take on this.
BOORTZ: Well, the polls showed that it didn't hurt Barack Obama.
SANCHEZ: In part because of the way he handled it? Is that fair?
BOORTZ: Well, I think the speech was well delivered. It was a great speech. As for this guy, this guy's piggy backing. And he's trying to make a name for himself and there's no way that church should have a tax exemption. That guy is a -- he's a political commentator.
SANCHEZ: If you look at that video right there, you see that's Jeremiah Wright right there. He invited him to his church, even asked him to get up and speak. There he is right now. It wasn't his typical Jeremiah Wright self. But he obviously has been unwinding himself with Jeremiah.
BOORTZ: My question in this whole thing is, I do not believe for a minute that Barack Obama did not know what this guy -- you cannot be a dedicated member of a church for 20 years, and even if you aren't in the pew on a certain day, to not know what this guy is up there saying.
WYNTER: So would a catholic parishioner with a priest in Boston who molests little kids, should he have left his church that he didn't leave?
BOORTZ: If you knew the priest was molesting little kids, get rid of the priest or leave the church. One or the other.
SANCHEZ: I'm not sure that's a fair comparison. I think what Barack Obama was trying to say is, there are people in our culture who we know say things that are questionable, and we excuse them.
And then he said in his speech, like white people who are always trying to scapegoat Hispanics and African-Americans and don't understand the real enemy is their jobs are being taken overseas by corporations. And black people -- and wait, black people, he went on to say, who all too often are stuck in the -- mired in the '50s and '60s and aren't looking toward the future. So he gave it to both sides.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know he did. BOORTZ: There's no qualm with the speech. He did a good job in the speech. But I don't buy for a minute that he didn't know what kind of a man Jeremiah Wright was.
WYNTER: He did know what kind of man Jeremiah -- I think he did know what kind of man Jeremiah Wright. I think he knew that Jeremiah Wright was a man that saved many of thousands of lives, helping HIV children -- a marine, a dedicated marine. He knew that Jeremiah Wright...
SANCHEZ: What's he saying and how did he get out of this? Because he basically said, he's a conflicted man who may not have the same opinion I have or many other Americans have, and he probably screwed up by saying what he said, but I'm not going to turn my back on him.
WYNTER: Look, all preachers have problems.
SANCHEZ: Wait but Neil is saying he needed to know what this guy said and that he was deceitful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So the guy made thousands of sermons.
SANCHEZ: Isn't that what you're saying? That he was somewhat deceitful in saying look, I didn't know. I never heard him saying that.
BOORTZ: I don't believe that Barack Obama was not aware of what this man was saying in that pulpit. I don't believe that.
SANCHEZ: OK.
WYNTER: And whether or not he did know or not, is not the issue that he should have left the church because he did or didn't know. The fact of the matter is he know that the man was bigger than those sermons. And I think that's the key.
SANCHEZ: And when we get into the general, I guarantee you this is a story that if it goes away, will be brought back.
So is this one. Four men beating and robbing a man and the judge says, you've got to learn English or go to jail for this. Something missing here. We'll take to it the panel.
And then imagine if, Pele, weighed 4,000 pounds. Would he be able to do this? Boom! And so well and so consistently. I mean, you should see -- look at that. We'll be right back. We're going to have some (INAUDIBLE), too.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back to the world headquarters of CNN. You want pics? We've got them. "Rick's Pics."
The bigger the vehicle, the greater the potential for any damage when it crashes. So that brings us to this story. Follow the video. This is Toronto. Folks there first saw first-hand when a hitchhiker stole a stretch hummer limo. Not just any limo. And he drove it right through the front yard of somebody's home. Slamming right into a snowbank. Whoops.
Now, let's take you to Glenwood Canyon, Colorado. Some pretty pictures. It should be a great season for white water rafting on the Colorado River. But the runoff from melting snow has many homeowners worried this year about a little bit of rafting.
And then, this is the one that was sent to me by a friend. It's an e- mail that I thought was quite spectacular. Not everybody agreed but then again it's a guy who's never been able to play soccer well. I was amazed by what this elephant can do. Consistently. Time and time again. Kita (ph) would absolutely hate it, but you can't take away the fact that this elephant is talented. Maybe as good as Pele. Behind the back.
Also, judge. He says, learn English or go to jail. Suspects, they say, OK, we'll learn English. Audience. Is it a proper sentence?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's an unusual condition. I've been doing this well over 25 years and I've never had that type of condition.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: An odd condition, yes, but for whom?
And the world got a little darker tonight. But that's a good thing. We think. The weekend run-down, back in two.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: And we welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez. Here's a sentence for the record books. Are you ready? Learn English or spend about two years behind bars. That's a ruling this week from a Pennsylvania judge known for his, shall we say, creative adjudications.
The four defendants accused of a violent crime, beating two men in the streets of Wilkes-Barre at Wilkes-Barre apartment. They needed a translator just to enter a guilty plea. And that's what set off the judge.
The judge tells them, return to court in one year to take an English test. And if you don't pass that test, go directly to jail. Was justice served here?
Our talkers are going to take this one on now.
And here's a judge who's willing to say, you know what, I'll give you guys a break if you're willing to learn to speak English because it bothers me that you don't.
SUGG: Rick, You and I are Miami boys, OK? And how would that have played in Miami?
SANCHEZ: Not well.
SUGG: 50 years ago. And look how great the Cuban community has been for Miami. You know? I mean, this country is built on immigrants. I think, as a matter of convenience, everybody should speak English. But Neil, I know, comes from German ancestry.
SANCHEZ: Right.
SUGG: At one time, America, considered making German an official second language.
BOORTZ: Yes. I'm the first -- first generation in my family that does not speak German.
SUGG: I mean -- so I think that the judge is way out of line.
SANCHEZ: But if -- for going into the language thing, why didn't you just -- I mean, what they did seems to be a pretty bad offense. You should have thrown them in jail. That was a fighting; he's giving them a break.
WYNTER: Yes, not because he's telling them that they should learn to speak English because they're not in jail. And I don't want to be a racist but, I mean, Hispanic grown men that can't speak English, I don't want to assume they're illegal immigrants because I...
BOORTZ: Right, they are legal.
WYNTER: They're legal. They are legal. So then they -- jail time. I mean, you committed -- it was a felony charge.
SANCHEZ: But you raise an interesting question. Here's something where I need to challenge you as a Hispanic-American, I suppose. With parents who don't speak a lick of English, who are probably watching me right now and don't understand what I'm saying. They sacrifice. They're not being able to become really successful Americans who speak the queen's English because they knew we had to.
So my dad worked two jobs, came home at something like midnight, and he didn't have time to go learn English.
WYNTER: You went to school though.
SANCHEZ: I did. Not him.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: No, what I'm talking about -- you said the adults who are here. If they come as adult they never get a chance to truly simulate. But second generation, all the studies show, do.
I'm second generation.
WYNTER: Then the sentence is fair. Teach them learn to speak English or you go to jail.
BOORTZ: I think he's actually giving them a break. I think they should be thrown in jail, right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Go ahead, I'm sorry.
SUGG: To punish the crime, yes. But you know, behind all this English language first here, the official language, all this certain stuff, you have an undercurrent of racism that is just reprehensible. And the judge may not be intending to reflect that. But that's what he does.
SANCHEZ: But that's what it sounds like to you. Go ahead, Neil.
BOORTZ: Well, I would say the undercurrent is bigotry, not racism. But that's an argument...
SANCHEZ: Probably a better word choice, my professor of English would say.
BOORTZ: But there are two points. First of all, on Buford Highway in this city, we have the Latin American association, Hispanic association. I'm perplexed by the sign that's been hanging out there for years. English classes. I mean, excuse me, Spanish classes.
These people are given Spanish classes? How about giving English classes? One more thing about the sentence. Why is it perfectly OK for a judge to tell some men, you're going to spend 500 hours picking up garbage by the roadside as punishment for your crime, from which they will learn nothing except how to pick up garbage.
And then this judge sentences them to something that undoubtedly will enhance their job prospects and better their life. And we're sitting around questioning the sentence?
SANCHEZ: And which they appreciated, by the way. They said, thank you, your honor. We'll come back here after we've learned English. I think the point is, John, making as though, when you go into language you're saying to somebody, you need to get just like us in this country, or you're not as worthy. Am I right, John?
SUGG: Yes, I fought the English only stuff in Miami for years. And I just -- I think -- I just think it divides society, divides cities, divides the nation. And the judges pushing that divisive...
SANCHEZ: Maybe without knowing it? Maybe without knowing it? Go ahead, Shelley.
SUGG: I don't think the judge -- the judge I'm sure thought he was doing a very good thing.
SANCHEZ: Right. And maybe he is. And it's not fair for to us judge the judge.
WYNTER: We're in an English speaking country. I think it's fair to ask people to learn the language. SANCHEZ: Yes.
WYNTER: And I think it's fair for a judge to say, I like creative sentencing. I mean, my community is affected by these draconian sentencing guidelines. So I like creative sentencing.
BOORTZ: And remember the other part of the sentence was to get their GEDs also.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
BOORTZ: So it's all about education. It's all about enhancing their chances to succeed in our culture and our society.
SANCHEZ: I agree. And in the end, there's nothing wrong with that. I believe he's doing them a favor.
BOORTZ: I think it will turn out that way. These men can say, give me the money in English the next time.
SANCHEZ: (INAUDIBLE). There you have it. Thanks, gentlemen, appreciate having you here.
It is lights out around the world. That's what earth hour was all about today. Was your neighborhood any darker?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez. For one hour tonight, the world came together and in the process millions of us were left in the dark. Exactly. All right, turn it back on, will you?
An estimated 30 million people turned off their nonessential lights tonight to observe earth hour. Even Google, the almighty search engine, joined in. Its own page today sporting basic black. The World Wildlife Fund orchestrated the event. Here's how it played out by the way from Sidney, Australia, to the Golden Gate Bridge.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROWD: five, four, three, two, one.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're asking people to turn out the lights for an hour. Replace all the light bulbs in their house, in their building with compact fluorescent, the squiggly bulbs.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then we're asking them to think about things they do the rest of the year. Whether it's the way they commute, the energy they used, turning out the lights in the building after people go home from work, and the energy savings from that is substantial.
WWF started this in Sidney a year ago. And we got the mayor, Cate Blanchett, and other celebrities involved. We ended up having two million people engage in that effort and it was so successful that actually we've now been beseech with offers to participate.
We actually have 400 cities around the world participating. We've got students playing Frisbee in the dark. We've got people sitting around with their families and thinking about commitments they can make. But the interesting thing is we actually, if you go around the world and starting in Christ Church, going to Sidney and going to Copenhagen, going to Buenos Aires and Atlanta, San Francisco, they're going to see landmarks like the coliseum in Rome go dark. The Golden Gate Bridge, the Coca Cola sign in Times Square. It is symbolic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: And there you have it. I'm Rick Sanchez, thanks so much for being with us. And thanks again to our guest for joining us here.
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