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Campbell Brown
Clinton Attacks McCain on Economy; The Union Vote
Aired April 02, 2008 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAMPBELL BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, new alarm bells about the economy. One of the nation's top money men tells Congress flat out a recession is possible. The Democratic candidates are promising big labor they're going to rise to the economy's rescue. But what is up with John McCain? Why is he sticking to his biography and not the issues?
We are starting tonight with issue number one, the economy in crisis.
Both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are telling working-class voters in Pennsylvania they can make it better.
We have got senior political correspondent Candy Crowley, who is keeping track of what they're saying. And she's joining us from the National Constitution Center in Philadelphia. In Washington is Eamon Javers, the financial correspondent for the political news Web site Politico.com. And with me here in the ELECTION CENTER is CNBC on-air editor Charles Gasparino.
Welcome to everybody.
Oh, I should mention, Charles, you're also...
CHARLES GASPARINO, CNBC ON-AIR EDITOR: Thank you. Please.
BROWN: I know.
(LAUGHTER)
BROWN: Get the book plug in. He's also the author of "King of the Club: Richard Grasso and the Survival of the New York Stock Exchange."
Welcome to all.
GASPARINO: Thank you.
BROWN: Candy, I think I'm going to with you on this.
The 3:00 a.m. ad is back, this time Hillary Clinton attacking John McCain.
Everybody take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, CLINTON CAMPAIGN AD) NARRATOR: And your children are safe and asleep. But there's a phone call in the White House. And, this time, the crisis is economic: home foreclosures mounting, markets teetering. John McCain just said the government shouldn't take really action in the housing crisis. He would let the phone keep ringing.
Hillary Clinton has a plan to protect our homes, create jobs. It's 3:00 a.m. -- time for a president who's ready.
SEN. HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm Hillary Clinton, and I approve this message.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: OK. So, the first that strikes me about this, is there really an economic crisis that would prompt waking up the president at 3:00 a.m.? I don't know about that. But...
GASPARINO: Lower interest rates, please, real quick.
BROWN: Now. Do it now.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
BROWN: Candy, this is fascinating to me in so many ways. First of all, Hillary Clinton ignoring Obama and attacking John McCain. But, also, you know, is there real vulnerability here? John McCain is not out there talking about the economy, and everybody else is.
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: He isn't at the moment.
Look, they have got a plan at the McCain campaign. And he is on this bio tour. Now, he does talk about the economy when asked. I mean, but, obviously he's not giving big economic speeches. Let's face it. The Democrats are here in Pennsylvania, where the economy is the number-one issue, where the working-class vote is the premier vote at this point, the one that they think can sway the election here one way or the other.
It is totally fascinating that she goes after John McCain, rather than Barack Obama. I think it's kind of a twofer. First of all, what happens here is that she placates the Democratic Party members, as has Barack Obama been doing, by going after McCain, rather than Obama, because, as you know, they have been very upset thinking that they were getting a little too bitter. So, it satisfies that.
But it also brings up that whole electability thing. She's kind of going past Barack Obama, going, hmm, who is the best one to handle the economy? Well, that's me. See, I'm already taking on John McCain.
So, there's a couple of messages in that ad. BROWN: And, Charles, let me ask you. She may not be off base suggesting we're at a sort of crisis moment here. Ben Bernanke on Capitol Hill today...
(CROSSTALK)
GASPARINO: Or recession, not necessarily a depression.
(CROSSTALK)
GASPARINO: We're in an economic slowdown.
BROWN: Let me put it this way. A lot of the country views us as being in a crisis moment, whether it technically meets the definition of the Wall Street guys or not.
(CROSSTALK)
GASPARINO: I think we're clearly in a recession. There's no doubt about that. But there's a difference between a recession and a depression that might occur if you follow some of her policies.
What's fascinating -- and the press really hasn't picked this up -- what did Herbert Hoover do after the '29 crash? And we have kind of a '29 crash going on in the subprime market right now. He raised taxes. He clamped down on trade. That's essentially what Hillary Clinton wants to do. It's essentially what Barack Obama wants to do.
That's what will lead to possibly a depression. Listen, there's always economic cycles. And, by the way, I love that ad. That is actually a funny ad.
BROWN: The 3:00 a.m.?
GASPARINO: Yes.
BROWN: Eamon, let me ask you, let me ask you, you had Clinton out there, as we mentioned, talking about the economy. She's pumping up this jobs plan. Obama criticizing NAFTA. John McCain on this biography tour.
Who of the three candidates -- you're following them all -- from an economic perspective, who is the most on this issue, at least politically, maybe not to Charles' specifications in terms of what they should be talking about it, but who is on it politically?
EAMON JAVERS, "THE POLITICO": Well, look, I mean, the time frames are totally different for these three candidates. And so the strategies really reflect the time frames that they have got.
Both Clinton and Obama are just desperately focused on April 22, that primary in Pennsylvania. John McCain is thinking long term. He's thinking about November. He's thinking about reintroducing himself to voters and a gradual buildup of his campaign going into the general. Hillary and Barack really can't think too much about things that are going to happen even in May at this point. What they have to be focused on right now are those blue-collar white voters in Pennsylvania.
BROWN: In Pennsylvania.
JAVERS: And they are very, very worried about the economy right now. And that's why they're talking economy and McCain is not.
BROWN: Candy, do you agree with that? Is this all about Pennsylvania, or is this more -- are they looking a little longer term?
CROWLEY: Absolutely, because, without Pennsylvania, there's no Indiana, there's no North Carolina, particularly for Hillary Clinton. So, they know they have to win here. They want to win big here.
Barack Obama knows he has to keep her from winning big here. No, it is totally about Pennsylvania at this point. They really can't think much beyond the next primary, because that's where they are, delegate by delegate. And, as I said, it's one of the reasons why they now are kind of going after John McCain to -- kind of each positioning themselves as the person who can best take him on, that whole electability.
BROWN: And they're also doing it, Charles, in populist terms, Democrats.
GASPARINO: Very populist.
BROWN: In terms of how they're talking about it, it's the little guy vs. big money Wall Street. How is that playing on Wall Street?
GASPARINO: Well, I mean, listen, Wall Street guys are used to getting beat up. I have been beating them up for years.
Here's the thing you have to realize. They're running in Pennsylvania. They're not running in Texas. This economy is big. It's diverse. I just came back from Dallas. You know, there's 3 percent unemployment. Texas is doing very good. Pennsylvania isn't. So they're just playing to that working-class, that white working- class vote, as you keep saying.
BROWN: So, Wall Street sees this as politics?
GASPARINO: Well, it's all politics, isn't it, don't you think?
JAVERS: Yes.
GASPARINO: Where is McCain doing in the polls right now? He's actually not doing so bad by not -- by avoiding the issue.
BROWN: All right. We have got to end it there.
Charles, it's good to have you here in New York, Candy and Eamon out there on the trail for us. Appreciate your time tonight.
JAVERS: Thank you.
BROWN: And pain at the pump, strain on your wallet. Pennsylvania union workers square off on which of the Dems has the keys to the relief.
That's coming up next in the ELECTION CENTER.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: It's less than three weeks to the Pennsylvania primary. And, in large measure, it's come down to this, a battle to win the hearts and votes of blue-collar and union workers, who want to know what the Democrats would do about disappearing jobs and the ailing economy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What most people are really looking for is how you're going to benefit us.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To stand up for the working man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have a choice. Do I give my kids breakfast, or do I put gas in the car to go to work?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you're talking about unions in general around here, it's kind of a mixed batch. Half of the unions around here are with Obama's camp. Half of the unions are with Hillary.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: With me now, Pennsylvania union representatives from both sides of this issue, Tom Fullard, who is southwest Pennsylvania district leader for the International Association of Machinists. His union supports Hillary Clinton. And an Obama supporter, Wendell Young, who is president of the United Food and Commercial Workers Local 1776.
Welcome, guys. Appreciate you being here.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: I know you're divided in terms of the candidates and who you support.
But talk to me first, and, Tom, you go first, on the issues. Is it the economy? What are your guys most and girls most worried about?
TOM FULLARD, INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF MACHINISTS: Oh, it's most definitely the economy. It's the future security of jobs. It's the security of pension and retirement savings. It's today's dollars. It's tomorrow's security.
BROWN: Wendell? WENDELL YOUNG, UNITED FOOD AND COMMERCIAL WORKERS: Same issues. Our members are no different.
I'm one of the change to win unions and with the United Food and Commercial Workers. They're concerned about the gas they put in the car, how much it costs, their mortgages, the food shopping, the bills every week.
BROWN: Right.
YOUNG: But, more importantly, it's their job security. This economy has got a lot of people scared about their jobs. And when we look at the amount of jobs that have been moved overseas, the incentives to do so, the cost of the war weighs heavily, not only on the lives that it's cost, and the position it puts us in internationally, but also on this economy, the drain on this economy.
They want health care. They want secure pensions. They want a job. They want a good job and they want a better life for their children. And that's what it is.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Then let me ask you this. Wendell, you support Obama, Tom, Hillary.
They're not that different or that far apart on the issues on the economy or any other issues, frankly.
I mean, Wendell, why are you with Obama? What differentiates it for you?
YOUNG: Campbell, great point.
For me, the difference is, when I started to see last summer and through this winter the amount of people that Barack Obama has brought into this process, not just at the rallies, but in the primaries that have been held, that amount of people to come to the polls, to engage in the process, the vote is what is going to be need to make a change in this country, to change the Congress. The Senate, and to get somebody like that in the White House really can change the direction of this country.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: So, it's unity and it's not necessarily issues.
But, Tom, what about you? Why are you backing Clinton?
FULLARD: Well, absolutely, it's -- we talked about the same issues. Wendell and I are in agreement on the issues.
But I think where our candidates differ is on their track records. Change to win or change that you can believe in, change for the sake of change without some substantive discussion on the issues, such as trade agreements, and such as a recent award for a foreign aircraft, for an Air Force new tanker.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: OK. Hold that thought for a second, Tom, because I want to go back to trade agreements and ask you both about this.
NAFTA is a huge deal with your membership. And both of these candidates have said they're against it.
Let's listen quickly to what they were saying. This is to the Pennsylvania AFL-CIO.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
H. CLINTON: I did speak out and oppose NAFTA. The president made a different decision. I raised a big yellow caution flag. I said, I'm not sure that this will work.
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: What I opposed and what I will always oppose are trade deals that put the interests of Wall Street ahead of the interests of American workers. That's why I oppose NAFTA.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: So, my question to both of you guys is, do you believe them when they say this?
And the reason I ask is, Tom, you know there's been a whole lot of debate over whether Hillary Clinton supported NAFTA when her husband was in the White House.
And, Wendell, you know that a member of Obama's campaign allegedly met with the Canadians and said, wink, wink, if elected, he's not really ever going to repeal NAFTA.
So, when you hear them saying these things, do you guys believe them?
Wendell, you go first.
(CROSSTALK)
YOUNG: I don't believe someone raising a caution flag goes far enough. We need more than just a caution flag.
And a staffer getting out of line is one issue. I believe Barack Obama -- my UFCW counterparts that have known him and worked with him in Chicago for many years now, as a community organizer, as a senator, as a representative, stand by his commitment on this. And his actions certainly speak louder than a caution flag.
BROWN: OK, Tom?
FULLARD: Well, we're very familiar with -- our members are very familiar with Senator Obama in northern Illinois as well with regard to the shutdown of Maytag plants in that area and the impact of 27,000 jobs, which -- and request for help fell on deaf ears.
Senator Clinton has given this organization her commitment to redo NAFTA, to reexamine the trade agreements that are in place, and take a time-out, put a moratorium on any future trade agreements, such as the one we heard about earlier today with Peru, until these agreements can be looked at. And we're going to talk about insuring that these agreements are pro-labor, that they're pro-American, and that the -- that they're vigorously enforced.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: All right, Tom Fullard and Wendell Young, we have got to end it there. Appreciate your time tonight. Thanks, guys.
(CROSSTALK)
YOUNG: Good seeing you, Tom.
FULLARD: Good seeing you, Wendell.
BROWN: Well, at least they get along, right?
OK. Ahead, while the Democrats are talking about saving people's jobs, we're going to ask why John McCain is still telling us about his misspent youth. That is coming up.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: While the Democrats were in Pennsylvania today pounding the drum of jobs, jobs, jobs, John McCain spent a nostalgic morning at his old school, the U.S. Naval Academy. And then he turned up at the Pensacola Naval Air Station in Florida, reminiscing about learning to fly jets, among other things.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I wanted to live the life of a daring, brash, fun-loving flyer. I thought that image, which I doubt I ever quite perfected, would prove irresistible to everybody I knew, and especially so to girls whose attention I sought.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: McCain's going to be telling us his life story for two more days out on the trail.
And here to talk about the political wisdom of this is Joe Conason. He's a columnist for "The New York Observer" and the left- leaning Web site Salon.com. We have got CNN senior political analyst Gloria Borger joining us from Washington, as does Jonah Goldberg. He's editor at large for the conservative "National Review Online" and the author of "Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, From Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning." Welcome to everybody.
GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Thanks.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Gloria, let me start with you.
And I just -- maybe it's me. I find it kind of amazing, given that we're all talking about the economy, given where the country's head seems to be right now, that John McCain is out doing this biography tour, not to take anything away from his biography. It is impressive, absolutely. But doesn't he seem a little off-message right now?
(CROSSTALK)
BORGER: I think you could make the case that he is and that he ought to be talking about the economy.
On the other hand, this is sort of a point in his campaign where he's running unopposed, and he's trying to reintroduce himself to American voters, while Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama continue to bicker at each other.
So, this is a moment when he can take a step back and tell Americans just who he is, and what he came from, and start building his case for becoming president, block by block. And, as you know, Campbell, from covering all these campaigns, as you have done, it starts with your biography, and then you move on from there.
BROWN: Jonah, do you agree with that?
JONAH GOLDBERG, "THE NATIONAL REVIEW": Yes, I think Gloria has got it basically exactly right.
John McCain is in the general election now. Hillary and Barack aren't. So, he's doing what candidates do at the beginning of a general election, is they introduce themselves to the voters. They put out their positive message about themselves.
And I think it makes total and complete sense for him to do it. And simply because the media and the Democrats and frankly this network, which is big on this issue one, or whatever you guys are calling it these days, are pounding the drums on the economy...
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Come on, Jonah, it's not like we're making it up.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: It's a huge issue. Ben Bernanke was on the Hill today. I mean, come on.
GOLDBERG: No, no, I agree with that entirely. That's fine. I'm not saying it's an illegitimate thing to cover.
My point is, is that McCain -- you know, the economy is not his strong suit right now. The Democrats are desperate to call him running for a third term for Bush. And a day where John McCain gets to talk about his biography and seem like a charming guy that you would like to have a beer with is a good day for John McCain, and it makes total sense for him to do it.
BROWN: Joe?
JOE CONASON, COLUMNIST/POLITICAL EDITOR, "THE NEW YORK OBSERVER": Well, we had a president that we wanted to have a beer with the last two terms, and look where it left us.
And I think the problem that McCain has and the reason that he's focused on his biography is, he doesn't have anything appealing to say about the economy to most voters at this point. The Democrats are All already calling him McSame, which means somebody who is going to continue policies that most Americans now see as failed.
And unless and until he can come up with some ideas for coping with the problems that people feel they're facing right now, he's better off for a little while talking about the Naval air station and learning to fly.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: I think Joe is making a fair point here.
Gloria, what is he going to say? Is there like some hidden economic plan in the McCain, you know, pocketbook somewhere he's going to pull out later on that I'm missing?
(CROSSTALK)
BORGER: Well, there might be.
But I think the problem for him right now is that, quite frankly, he may disagree with the president on, for example, a bailout. He's expressed concerns during this campaign about bailing out those who need help with their mortgages.
He's expressed concern about the tax refund checks that people are going to get. So, in a way, at this point, unless he decides that he's going to take on the Bush administration on how it's handling the economy, maybe it's good for him to stick to the biography right now, and then, in a general election, distance himself from Bush on the economy.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: OK. I quickly want to get to this issue with you, Jonah, because it's a separate issue on McCain. He's had some problems with conservatives.
James Dobson, maybe the most influential conservative Christian leader out there right now, said to "The Wall Street Journal" today this: "I have seen no evidence that Senator McCain is successfully unifying the Republican Party. To the contrary, he seems intent on driving them away."
How big a deal is this?
GOLDBERG: I don't think nearly as big a deal as James Dobson wants to make it.
Dobson is basically asking that, you know, McCain kowtow a little bit more to him and that maybe McCain has to do that as a political thing. But there's an interesting irony here. McCain has earned the ire of a lot of Republicans for exactly -- for actually appealing to Democrats and moderates and middle of the roaders. That's why "The New Republic," a liberal magazine, touted him for president a few years ago, why "The Washington Monthly," another liberal magazine, did.
And so you can't really have it both ways. You can't say on the one hand that he's turning off all these Democrats by not talking about the economy and all these other things, and on the other hand saying that he's unappealing to the rank and file of the conservative party.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Quickly, Joe.
(CROSSTALK)
CONASON: The Dobson comment is symptomatic of other difficulties that McCain has with conservatives.
In other words, he went before the Council on National Policy, made a speech. And it was a disaster, apparently. It's very rare for them to come out and say anything about it at all. But the reviews were very poor. And Dobson's comment is just a reflection of that. So, it's actually wider than just Dobson.
BROWN: All right, wait, Gloria, hold that thought. I know you want to jump in. We have got to end it there.
You guys are coming back in a minute. Joe, Gloria, and Jonah, hold on.
We're going to move on. On the trail today, there were hints of a role for Al Gore in the Obama White House. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would you, as president, consider putting Al Gore in a Cabinet-level position to lead worldwide effects -- efforts to reverse the trend?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: The candidate's answer when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: The battle for Pennsylvania is getting tighter.
The latest Quinnipiac poll shows Hillary Clinton's double-digit lead over Barack Obama is shrinking. They are now nine points apart.
We are going to bring back our political panel, Joe Conason here with me in here, Gloria Borger and Jonah Goldberg from Washington.
Welcome back, everybody.
I'm going to talk Pennsylvania in just a second. But I have to ask you guys just a little news from today that I found very striking. Bill Clinton in a speech today said that Hillary Clinton apparently tried to join the Army at one point.
Listen to this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: She's always been interested in this. I remember when we were young right out of law school, and she went down and tried to join the Army, and they said, your eyes are so bad, nobody will take you.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BROWN: So, Gloria, have you -- I had never heard this before. Had you ever heard any mention of Hillary Clinton ever attempting to join the Army?
BORGER: No. I vaguely remember some story of her trying to join the Marines, actually, but no story about her trying to join the Army.
But this is part of Bill Clinton's spiel about his wife, trying to say how much she loves America. Patriotism going to be a very big issue in this campaign, and it's one way to talk about it.
BROWN: Right.
OK, on to Pennsylvania, and let's talk about Barack Obama. Both of the candidates are there. And they're working-class voters in Pennsylvania. That's who everybody is targeting. And take a look at these pictures. Here's Barack Obama on the trail, hopefully, if we can get it up there. He's in an Italian meat shop or something.
You know, that's following up like the last couple of weeks where he was, you know, drinking beers, going bowling. He's like your average working-class guy.
But this is how Maureen Dowd described him: "His strenuous and inadvertently hilarious efforts to woo working-class folk in Pennsylvania have only made him seem more effete."
Joe, is this working for him?
CONASON: Well, it doesn't seem to be working for him at "The New York Times." I have no idea yet whether it's working for him in Pennsylvania.
I think, there's a limit to the sort of pandering photo-op. In other words, you go in -- and this is true of any politician -- you go and you try to be part of the scene.
BROWN: Right.
CONASON: And, if you don't fit in well, you order the wrong thing the way John Kerry ordered the wrong type of sub at some point in 2004...
BROWN: Yes, it was like a Philly cheesesteak.
(CROSSTALK)
CONASON: ... which was in Philadelphia, actually, right.
BROWN: Right. Right. Right.
CONASON: So that stuff can go terribly wrong.
And I think, also, voters really want to hear what you're going to do about their problems, more than they want to know how good a bowler you are. or whether you -- what kind of sub you want to order. At least it gives something for people to cover in the news media on a day-to-day basis, but it's not I think what will turn voters in that state.
BROWN: Jonah?
GOLDBERG: Yes, I think that's basically right. I think that if you're going to go bowling, bowl better than a 37, or don't go bowling.
(LAUGHTER)
GOLDBERG: But, beyond that, you know, clearly, Obama's doing something right, right? I mean, he's gaining on Hillary. Hillary has to win this thing by double digits, or I think she's in real, real trouble. And, so, he's doing something right.
BORGER: Well, I think Maureen's whole point, though, is well taken in the sense that Obama, ironically, the African-American candidate, is the candidate of the elite, and the woman on the Democratic side in this race seems to be the candidate more of working-class Americans, which is very interesting, and, in fact, unexpected.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Go ahead.
GOLDBERG: Obama in many ways is a black Howard Dean. He gets the Howard Dean vote, plus the black vote.
And that's proving to be surprisingly formidable in Democratic politics.
BROWN: OK. This is a little out of left field, but I'm bringing it up anyway. Al Gore, probably the most important Democrat not in the middle of this race. Obama said today, he was asked I think if he would put Gore in a cabinet post to deal with global warming. Let's listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would. Not only will I, but I will make a commitment that Al Gore will be at the table and play a central part in us figuring out how we solve this problem. He's somebody that I talk to on a regular basis. I'm already consulting with him in terms of these issues.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: So Joe, that's actually what I found most interesting about this. The fact that apparently they are talking to each other all the time.
JOE CONASON, COLUMNIST, "SALON.COM": Well, they're both -- they've both been running in the Gore primary for a long time.
BROWN: Haven't they, though.
CONASON: First, Hillary hoping that Gore would not run for president and she got what she wanted. And now, Obama trying to, I suspect, lure Gore into endorsing him at some point down the road, perhaps in June when the superdelegates make their move.
BROWN: All right, guys, we got to end it there. Joe, good to have you here in New York.
CONASON: Good to be with you.
BROWN: And Gloria, Jonah, as always, thank you guys from Washington tonight. Appreciate it.
GLORIA BORGER, SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Sure.
GOLDBERG: Thank you.
BROWN: And coming up, do you smell the bacon? The pig book is out today which, as you know, chronicles expensive congressional pet projects. We're going to tell you if the candidates indulged in any pork barrel spending coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: A check of more political news happening now. Former Indiana Congressman Lee Hamilton endorses Barack Obama, saying that Obama will transcend divisions within this country. The endorsement from the co-chair of the respective 9/11 Commission may help bolster Obama's foreign policy credentials, and the fact that Hamilton hails from Indiana won't hurt in that state's upcoming primary.
And it's April, which means the nonpartisan group, Citizens Against Government Waste, is rolling out its annual pig book. The book attempts to shame lawmakers by meticulously listing the year's spending on personal congressional projects, also called earmarks or pork. Among the projects singled out, $180,000 grant for Maine's Lobster Institute.
And then there's South Carolina Congressman Jim Clyburn's $3 million earmark for the First Tee program set up to build young people's character through golf. As for the presidential candidates, Barack Obama spent $97 million on pork. Hillary Clinton spent $296 million, and McCain, who has long fought earmarks, had no pork.
And finally, will they or won't they seat the Florida delegates at the Democratic Convention this summer? After some hand wringing, party leader, Howard Dean, affirmed his commitment. Here's what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD DEAN, DNC CHAIRMAN: We are committed to making sure that we do everything in our power to seat the delegation in Florida, and we believe we will seat the delegation from Florida. And I might parenthetically add that hotel rooms are reserved for a delegation from Florida. So we expect to succeed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: But no specifics on how they will be seated or whether it could help Hillary Clinton. Stand by. There are going to be a lot more twists and turns in this story, I think.
Coming up next, behind the scenes for a Bill Clinton explosion reportedly? Well, reports are that the one-time chill Bill apparently blew up in a meeting of superdelegates. We've got that. And the question that sparked what some are calling a Bill Clinton meltdown when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: The Democratic race shaping up for a photo finish going into the convention, possibly even a delegate stalemate. Well, Obama now leads Clinton by only a handful of pledged delegates. Clinton is ahead in superdelegates, 243-212, leaving some 300 uncommitted superdelegates yet to choose. For their part, party leaders appear unconcerned. Nancy Pelosi addressed an issue on ABC's "Good American America."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, ABC's "GOOD AMERICAN AMERICA")
REP, NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), HOUSE SPEAKER: These superdelegates have a right to vote their conscience, and who they think will be the better president or who can win. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: And this from Howard Dean today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD DEAN, DEMOCRATIC PARTY CHAIRMAN: I'm not here to tell the superdelegates what they have to do. I'm just asking them to make their preferences known before the convention starts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Joining me now, two uncommitted superdelegates. Christine Pelosi, who is attorney and activist and author of "Campaign Boot Camp." She's joining us along with political consultant Edward Espinoza, former field director for Bill Richardson. Welcome, guys.
CHRISTINE PELOSI, AUTHOR, "CAMPAIGN BOOT CAMP": Welcome. Thanks for having us.
EDWARD ESPINOZA, POLITICAL CONSULTANT: Good to be here.
BROWN: Let me ask you both this question. You've probably heard this. It was reported that Bill Clinton, in a private meeting with superdelegates, basically went off on Bill Richardson for endorsing Barack Obama. And some people who were there described it as an explosion. He was furious. And I know you're both California superdelegates. What are you guys hearing about this, Christine?
PELOSI: Well, President Clinton was with us this weekend in California when we had our state convention. And at the meeting, when I spoke with him, he complimented me on my recent marriage to my husband Peter, who was there. And later in the meeting, I did ask him a public question. I said, what is the take-away you want us to share with our good friends in the media who are asking us about this meeting?
And he made the case that we should let the process play out. Let the voters have their say in all of the 50 states and the territories. And, of course, the importance of beating John McCain if we want to change the course of the war and the economy. And naturally, his choice for the candidate to do that was his wife Senator Clinton.
BROWN: But Christine, did you witness this so-called explosion?
PELOSI: Well, now, Campbell, as I told your bookers when we talked earlier today, I'm not going to comment on a private meeting except as I say, the public part of that when I directly asked the president what we should be sharing with the media regarding the meeting and his very firm statement that he feels that it's essential to elect a Democratic president in November.
And I certainly echo his sentiments. And although he made a good case for his wife, I'm committed to voting for the person who wins the pledged delegate count. And that come June, that's exactly what I'm going to do.
BROWN: So your view on this, and Edward, I'm not leaving it out on this, but I just want to be clear about where you both of you stand in terms of how you're going to make your final decision, I guess. You know, lots of people are viewing this differently. Is that your view, Christine, that whoever is ahead in terms of the pledged delegates after voting is over, that's who you'll go with?
PELOSI: That's right. I feel it's important to listen to the American people, and once they have spoken to honor that voice. You know, I did a training for my book "Campaign Boot Camp" at the convention, and I had people get up and pretend they were running for delegate. And the Hillary delegate got up and told us how in the high-tech community, she raised $1 million. And the Obama delegate got up and said she started Obama mama.com. And so, you know, after Denver, we're going to need the high-tech Hillary supporter and the Obama mama to beat John McCain.
BROWN: Right. All right, Edward, what about you? What's your view on how you should make this decision?
ESPINOZA: Well, you know, Christine, first of all, congratulations on your marriage.
PELOSI: Thank you.
ESPINOZA: Second of all, how we should make our decision. There's a lot of things that we do need to consider here, and I do believe that we should support the will of the people. But we're not going to know what that will is until the primary process runs its course.
You know, somebody said to me the other day, why schedule all these primaries if we're not going to wait until the end of them to see what all the people have to say? I completely agree with that. Let the voters have their say. And if the superdelegates are even necessary at that point, then we can come in and not be necessarily be the deciders, but provide a decisive margin for the person who's ahead. Now, does that mean popular vote, pledged vote, most states?
BROWN: Right.
ESPINOZA: That we won't know until June 4th.
BROWN: But Ed, if that's your view in terms of waiting it out, I mean, I know that, you know, that's fine. But I also know what you guys are probably going through right now. What we're hearing that you're going through, which is enormous pressure is being put on you.
And you've talked about that. I mean, you're getting phone calls from the highest levels of both of these campaigns, are you not?
ESPINOZA: Not just the highest levels. But I get letters, e- mails and phone calls from regular people who I've never heard from. I don't know how they got my information. It freaks me out a little bit, but that's OK, because I want to hear from them just as much as I want to hear from the big names.
And I'll tell you, I think that I would be less of a representative if those big names had more of an influence on me than average Joes out there, and I weighed all of them equally and I'll take them into consideration when I make my decision public.
BROWN: All right. Everybody's waiting. Christine and Ed, appreciate your time tonight. Thanks, guys.
ESPINOZA: Thanks for having us.
PELOSI: Thank you.
BROWN: And "LARRY KING LIVE" gets started at the top of the hour. Larry, who's joining you tonight?
LARRY KING, HOST, "LARRY KING LIVE": Oh, we've got a great guest this week and this day especially. Jenny McCarthy is with us tonight. She's never given up in the quest to help her son who has autism. She's among our guests on this World Autism Awareness Day. We're going to have lots of helpful information about the mysterious condition and the controversies surrounding it. All at the top of the hour, dear.
BROWN: All right, Larry, thanks very much. An important issue we're going to be talking about at the end of the show as well. We'll see you at the top of the hour.
Coming up next, the McCain anger management issues that just won't go away. Up next, that and other issues that apparently are burning up the airwaves these days. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: It's all the talk on talk radio. John McCain's anger issues, Democratic infighting, and the superdelegates. Joining me right now, two radio hosts. We've got liberal Ed Schultz of the nationally syndicated "Ed Schultz Show" with me here in New York. And conservative Darrell Ankarlo, who's the host of a show on Phoenix's KTAR FM. Welcome to you both. Good to have you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you.
BROWN: So we asked you both earlier to tell us kind of what your listeners were into, what you're hearing about. And I was a little surprised that you both had to say, a lot of people were talking about John McCain and his anger management issues. He talked about that yesterday. Let's listen to what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As an adult, I've been known to forget occasionally the discretion expected of a person of my years in station, when I believe I've been accorded a lack of respect I didn't deserve. Self-improvement should always be a work in progress all our lives, and I confess to needing it as much as anyone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: So Ed, let me start with you. He's got a temper. So what? What's the big deal?
ED SCHULTZ, "THE ED SCHULTZ SHOW": Well, it's a little more than that, Campbell. You know, I asked Barack Obama today on the program if he's ever seen John McCain lose his cool and he said yes. I said, do you think he's got issues? And he wouldn't go there.
But I keep hearing this from fellow senators in the Senate that I know that are concerned about it. And I think the American people are on point here. They want to know, does possibly the next president of the United States have a short fuse? And he admits that he's had to work on his anger.
What kind of work? Counseling? Yoga? Meditation? We could have fun with this on talk radio. You know, I'm curious of it.
BROWN: You know what he said is, look, there's a lot to get angry about. You know, that he's fighting for people and the issues that he cares about.
SCHULTZ: Well, there's a difference between having passion and really wanting to get something done, and constantly flying off the handle, and being a little tough to work with. I mean, don't confuse leadership with an anger problem. And the fact that he's admitting it, I think the American people want to know a little bit more about this. And I found it out on my program, they certainly do.
BROWN: Darrell, you're from Phoenix. You, you're listeners, you guys know John McCain better than anybody. Does he have an anger problem?
DARRELL ANKARLO, KTAR-FM, PHOENIX: Yes. I'm a little frightened here that I am completely agreeing with Ed. I'm in a tenable position to have to somehow support John McCain's anger issues when I've seen it firsthand back in November in Iowa. I asked him a question about illegal immigration. And he shot. I mean, I thought he was going to bounce off the walls, off the roof and come on back. And I've written about it, blogged about it and talked about it on the show.
What he's doing right now, though, Campbell, I think is brilliant because he's redefining himself. He's on this week-long tour, this biography tour to say, all right, I've had some problems in this area. Give me a break. Cut me some slack. I'm working through this like everybody needs to. And I did he did strike a chord in that area.
BROWN: Well, you mentioned the biography tour. We talked about this a little earlier in the show. I want to get both your take on it because, you know, the Democrats are very focused on issues right now, on the economy. They're talking about it every day out on the stump. And he's out on this economy tour talking less about issues, be it the war in Iraq or foreign policy or the economy. SCHULTZ: Well, he's talking about something the American people don't care about right now. They don't care about his biography. They care about gas prices. They care about this foreclosure issue. They care about the stability of Wall Street, jobs, outsourcing.
We had a report yesterday about education in America and who's not graduating, and he's out talking about himself.
BROWN: Yes.
SCHULTZ: If he calls that brilliant campaigning, bring it on.
BROWN: Darrell?
ANKARLO: No, no. Brilliant and that he can redefine himself. While you have the two Democratic players going at it, he can sit back and say, let me tell you where I've come from and here's what I'm going to do. And Ed, you're wrong on that. He talked about the economy today in no uncertain terms, and I thought he struck some chords there, too.
On the foreclosure issue, he's saying, look, if you made a stupid decision to get into a bad loan, why should the government bail you out? Meanwhile, back at the ranch, if you've been flirting with an area because it was, you know, small print or whatever, that's a different story. So McCain is trying to redefine himself there, and it's a good move.
BROWN: Let me change the subject because I do want to run out of time with you, guys. They do want to ask you about the superdelegates. We were just talking about it a minute ago. Ed, a hot topic also on your radio show right now.
SCHULTZ: Sure.
BROWN: Is there any consensus out there in radio land among your listeners about how this should play out?
SCHULTZ: Don't override the popular vote.
BROWN: Really?
SCHULTZ: Don't go strong arming people and calling in favors and past relationships and such stuff as that.
BROWN: It's the fat cats making a deal in the background on this topic.
(CROSSTALK)
SCHULTZ: There's a lot of new people in the democratic process. They're going to feel disenfranchised if the popular vote is pushed aside.
BROWN: What are your folks saying, Darrell? ANKARLO: Yes, I completely agree and that's what our people are saying, too. The superdelegate thing is starting to scare a lot of the folks on the liberal or the democratic side.
BROWN: How much are your listeners enjoying the Democratic infighting right now?
ANKARLO: Oh, my gosh. Again, conservative talk, this is a party. We could pay for this. But I'll tell you what's going to be interesting on talk tomorrow, Campbell, is Stephanopoulos. George Stephanopoulos is quoting Bill Richardson as saying he was told by Clinton, Barack Obama cannot win. You can't make this mistake. That's going to be the huge issue tomorrow...
BROWN: OK.
ANKARLO: ... because that's what Hillary is running on.
BROWN: All right. We got to end it. We're out of time. But maybe come back tomorrow night? We'll talk about that.
SCHULTZ: I'll be glad to do it.
BROWN: Thanks, guys. Thank you so much.
ANKARLO: Thank you.
BROWN: A surprising John McCain endorsement, and you'll be shocked to find out what he's watching on television.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Now, some more politics. Bowling-gate won't go away after taking some April Fools' ribbing from Hillary Clinton about his bowling skills, today Obama had a response.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm going to tear up the bowling alley in the White House. We're putting up a basketball court.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: While Obama actively courts the youth vote, today John McCain got a surprise Hollywood endorsement from the young star of MTV's mega popular quasi-reality soap opera "The Hills." We get a glimpse into McCain's TV taste when he responded, I'm honored to have Heidi's support and I want to assure her that I never miss an episode of "The Hills."
I think he's kidding there. I hope he's kidding there.
Finally, who are the listeners of popular music voting for? Well, according to Jacobs Media technology web poll, it found that listeners of alternative music tend to vote for Barack Obama. McCain is the choice of fans of classic rock.
And coming up next, presidential politics and autism. What the candidates say they are prepared to do to make it easier for families to cope. We'll talk about that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: It's estimated that autism affects one out of every 150 American families with children. And that could include your family, or your friends. Today is part of World Autism Day.
CNN is probing different aspects of this complex and mysterious brain disorder, and our focus tonight is where each of the presidential candidates stands on this challenging issue.
Joining me now with details is CNN senior medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay, you know, autism has become an issue on the campaign trail to some extent, hasn't it?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Oh, absolutely. I mean, you know, they're talking about autism like in no election past. And Senator McCain, for example, in 2006 sponsored the -- co-sponsored, I should say, the Combating Autism Act, that was almost $1 billion over five years. Senators Obama and Clinton have supported that. They talked about this very publicly.
It's interesting that putting real teeth behind this, real money behind it as well. Campbell, I'll tell you, we've been investigating this all day. Autism is expensive. In terms of diagnosis, in terms of treatment, in terms of lost productivity, about $35 billion a year is what they say it costs. So this is still a drop in the bucket. But yes, you're absolutely right, they talk about it like never before.
BROWN: Senator John McCain though did get into some hot water. This is back in February on what causes autism. Listen to this, Sanjay.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think it's indisputable that it's on the rise amongst children. The question is is what's causing it. And we go back and forth. And there are strong evidence that indicates that it's got to do with the preservative in vaccines.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: So pretty controversial statement, right?
GUPTA: Yes. I mean, it goes against probably what every other governmental organization and most mainstream scientists say. Most people are saying, look, you know, they've taken the preservative out of vaccines and the autism rates still continue to go up. It's out of all childhood vaccines, except for the flu vaccine, and autism rates go up. So they say how could it be the preservative that Senator McCain is talking about?
You know, he has not specifically recanted that. And we've talked to his campaign, his staff about that. He has not specifically recanting. Senator Obama and Senator Clinton say for their part, they believe that the science that the CDC puts forth, saying that there is no link as things stand now between vaccines and autism.
BROWN: But it does sound like they're dancing around the issue a little bit. Why?
GUPTA: You know, that's a good point, and we've talked a lot about that as well. And I think it has a lot to do with the fact that the politics of it, if you look at the fact people who are pro- vaccine, they're also labeled as being pro big pharma and pro big money. It's very interesting, but, you know, on the other hand, there are so many Web sites, so many books out there that have written about the fact the vaccines may be dangerous. It's almost a third rail of at least medical journalism, Campbell.
BROWN: All right. Sanjay, thanks so much.
GUPTA: Thank you.
BROWN: Larry King's got a lot more on this starting right now.
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