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Nancy Grace
Neighbor Arrested for Murder of Missing Utah 7-Year-Old
Aired April 02, 2008 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight: Amber Alert, the desperate search for a beautiful little South Salt Lake girl still missing her two front teeth. The search called off, ending in heartbreak. Hundreds of volunteers join U.S. Marshals and police. Little Sury (ph) found just yards away from where she went missing, that apartment the very last unit to be searched. Why the delay? Five men tonight taken into custody on suspicion of homicide. In the last hour, four of them released, one charged with aggravated murder.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The body of a 7-year-old South Salt Lake girl missing just one day was discovered last night in an apartment in the same complex where she lived. Police say Hser Ner (ph) Moo`s body showed evidence of trauma, but they did not give a cause of death. The police have a 21-year-old Esar Mhet in custody. He admitted he tried to forcefully keep the little girl in the apartment.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At approximately 7:00 PM, the body of Hser Ner Moo was found. Throughout the course of the night, we conducted several interviews and have gotten a little further into this investigation. The gentleman that we arrested, his name is Esar Mhet. We know that he was at home at the time. We do not believe that the other four residents were home at that time. Sometime while they were in the apartment, a physical altercation did occur. Again, I can`t get specific on that, other than to say that evidence at the scene and after retrieval of the body, that it was apparent that there was inflicted trauma on her body.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: A physical altercation with a 7-year-old girl?
And tonight: The mystery surrounding missing 23-year-old mother Stacy Peterson, vanishing from upscale Chicago suburbs, husband/cop Drew Peterson the prime suspect in his fourth wife`s disappearance after a suspicious dry bathtub drowning of wife number three ruled homicide. Tonight: The search heats up. No volunteers looking for graves. And what -- what exactly -- did Stacy`s priest tell a secret grand jury?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are starting our search again for my sister, Stacy. Drew Peterson believes that my sister left and we should be searching in other towns or Thailand and Jamaica, and she left on vacation.
DREW PETERSON, MISSING WOMAN`S HUSBAND: All these people are conducting searches in fields and bushes and streams and rivers, but I have no belief that she`s there. She`s off with somebody at some beach or living life in some home anonymously, you know, in another part of -- could be another part of the world, could be the next town over.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The reason we are searching bushes and under rocks, and basically, we`re going to turn Bolingbrook inside out, is because my sister did not leave willingly. She was taken.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: State police told me they`ve known from day one Stacy didn`t leave willingly. So they have evidence. My main goal right now is to bring her home and find out who did whatever they did to her and bring them to justice.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. First: Amber Alert, South Salt Lake, called off in a heartbreaking ending.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A tragic ending to the search for a little girl from South Salt Lake, the body of a 7-year-old Hser Ner Moo found Tuesday night in an apartment in the same complex where she lived. She was last seen leaving her apartment Monday afternoon. Cause of death not known, police only confirming signs of trauma on the little girl`s body. Twenty- one-year-old suspect Esar Mhet arrested, charged with aggravated murder and kidnapping.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She went directly over to the suspect (INAUDIBLE) We do not know how she got in, whether or not she was invited in or whether or not she asked to go in. What we do know is that four residents who lived there do know the family and do know her. So she has been over to that apartment before.
The gentleman that we arrested, his name is Esar Mhet. He`s 21 years old. We know that he was home at the time. We do not believe that the other four residents were home at that time. Sometime while they were in the apartment, a physical altercation did occur. Again, I can`t get specific on that, other than to say that evidence at the scene and after retrieval of the body, it was apparent that there was inflicted trauma on her body.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Who has a physical altercation with a 7-year-old little girl? We now learn, contrary to reports we heard last night, the little girl was simply outside playing. She had been in and out of the apartment all day, playing on the grounds of the apartment complex. This is an apartment that many children went to. Four gentlemen lived there. And children would watch TV and play games. This guy had just moved there. I want to get to the bottom of it.
Let`s go out to Jim Kirkwood with KTKK, news show host. Jim, what do we know tonight?
JIM KIRKWOOD, KTKK: Well, we know that this young man that has been charged, this Esar Mhet, had only lived there 30 days, and that the other four gentlemen were family friends of the little girl`s family. And so it kind of explains why she would go to that apartment.
GRACE: What I don`t understand -- if this was an apartment, the little girl -- and maybe I`m looking for something or somebody to blame tonight, Jim Kirkwood. But if the little girl often played in the apartment and the family knew that, then why didn`t they go there first? It`s my understanding that I think maybe the aunt goes to the apartment and somebody says, Nobody`s home, and she turns around and left!
KIRKWOOD: It`s amazing, but the suspect -- even though he`s confessed, the suspect lived in the basement and that was his domain, and the other four roommates never went down there. It was kind of something they didn`t do. They respected each other`s area. So they didn`t know what was going on. And this guy had this little area where he did this horrible thing.
GRACE: I guess I`m asking -- and I`m going to go out to the source. chief Chris Snyder is with us, South Salt Lake City Police Department. Chief, thank you so much for being with us. And I know your people ran themselves ragged looking for this girl, joined by other police, joined by volunteers, hundreds of volunteers looking for little Sury. My question is, if everybody knew that she played in this apartment quite often, why didn`t people go there at the first hour she was gone?
CHIEF CHRIS SNYDER, SOUTH SALT LAKE CITY POLICE DEPT.: Well, thanks for having me, Nancy. You know, as I talked to the father a little bit, he did make contact over there prior to our arrival. During the course of that time, the suspect had already left that apartment. The other four weren`t there. When they had gotten home, he asked one simple question, Have you seen my daughter, and they said no.
You know, as we arrived -- and this is some time later, by the time the call was actually reported and we started organizing search efforts -- we weren`t able to establish contact again yet. So you know, there was no suspicion or any reason to believe that, you know, any light should be shed on them, from what we understand. You know, they -- she would go over there, and I don`t think there was any suspicion at all that was from the family.
GRACE: Chief, I`ve got a question for you. There`s been a lot of anger, a lot of questioning -- with me is Chief Chris Snyder from South Salt Lake City Police Department -- Chief, because the Amber Alert was not issued until, I believe, 9:00 or 9:30 the following morning, when the little girl didn`t show up for school. And I mean, my question is, if she had been gone since 2:00 PM the day before, why wasn`t an Amber Alert issued immediately when her dad called police and said, She`s missing?
SNYDER: Well, you know, the criteria is in place for one reason, and that`s -- I guess it`s been coined as abuse of the Amber Alert system. But the reality is, to not desensitize the public at large. When the Amber Alert comes out, the idea is that it`s, you know, taken very seriously and people understand the graveness of that matter.
GRACE: Well, what was the criteria?
SNYDER: There are very specific criteria that are required to issue that Amber Alert and...
GRACE: Right. What`s the criteria?
SNYDER: Well, you need to be able to confirm that there was an abduction, first of all. And we simply didn`t have that. We had a little girl that -- that just kind of disappeared.
GRACE: A 7-year-old little girl has disappeared.
SNYDER: And the reality is, is we go on a lot of these calls where the kids have gone to a neighbor`s house or a friend`s house, have gone to a park. We`ve actually calls where they`ve spent the night at a friend`s house without telling their parents. That happens, and those circumstances in this case...
GRACE: As young as 7?
SNYDER: What?
GRACE: As young as 7 years old?
SNYDER: You know, it certainly -- it can happen. And in this case, we...
GRACE: Have you seen cases...
SNYDER: ... had to rule out some of that...
GRACE: ... at 7 years old go spend the night somewhere else and the parents don`t know?
SNYDER: You know, unfortunately, sometimes things like that do happen. We have to rule those things...
GRACE: So you`re saying you have seen that?
SNYDER: You know, it`s -- can I tell you specifically when I`ve seen that exactly? No, I can`t, Nancy.
GRACE: Out to Marc Klaas, the president of Beyond Missing. Marc, I`ve got to tell you, we were all on pins and needles, hoping so hard this little girl was going to be found. Weigh in.
MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM: Well, first of all, it`s unconscionable that in a community where a high-profile missing person seems to be an annual rite of passage, that they would take a situation where a little girl who was a stranger in a strange land, doesn`t have a lot of friends, they would wait 19 hours to activate an Amber Alert. This little girl had asthma. It was cold at night. She didn`t have a lot of friends. She was very young. She had very limited language skills.
They should have activated that Amber Alert almost immediately, and then they should have done an investigation that starts from the center and works its way out, and that would include searching all of the residences within that apartment complex, including the residence where that young man lived who apparently kidnapped and did whatever he did before he murdered that little girl. It`s absolutely unconscionable this action was not followed!
GRACE: You know, I want to go back to Chief Chris Snyder, South Salt Lake City Police Department. I agree with Marc Klaas. The reality is, though, Chief, was the little girl already dead, regardless of -- are we just fighting about it, when the reality is it would not have changed anything?
SNYDER: Well, we think it happened probably within an hour of her leaving that apartment.
GRACE: Oh.
SNYDER: I think the whole thing was a done deal by the time the parents even knew that she was not coming home or missing, and certainly by the time we got there.
GRACE: Marc Klaas, I agree with you. It is wrong and it is unconscionable that the Amber Alert did not go out immediately. But I`m hearing Chief Snyder. It wouldn`t have made any difference.
KLAAS: We don`t know that! I mean, that`s -- that`s speculation! The things I was talking about...
GRACE: You know what? That`s a good point.
KLAAS: ... are about -- about good investigation and about activating an alert that was created for specifically that reason.
GRACE: You know what? You`re right.
Let`s go out to the lines. Let`s see what everyone else has to say about it. To Edward in Texas. Hi, Edward.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How`re you doing, Nancy? How`s everything?
GRACE: Well, Edward, I`ve go to tell you, I read about this at about 1:00 AM last night, and my heart has been broken ever since, the thought of a 7-year-old little girl still missing her two front teeth, just playing there in the apartment complex.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) The gentleman that they caught, is he a registered sex offender?
GRACE: I don`t believe he is. What about it, Jim Kirkwood?
KIRKWOOD: ... been in the country 30 days. He`s had no involvement with the police.
GRACE: And we have no idea what his criminal history is from his country of origin, right?
KIRKWOOD: Right.
GRACE: So we`re basically bringing people in, letting them in. This guy I believe was here under political asylum. We have no idea what his criminal history is in his birthplace.
Out to the lines. Mary-Anne in Nevada. Hi, dear.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Congratulations on your twins.
GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I`m a mother on four daughters, and I`d like to know why we can give criminals that are on house arrest trackers to keep track of them and we can`t do it for our children.
GRACE: You know, to Stephen Daley -- he`s a perfect person to answer this question. He`s the executive director of Radkids. You can find it on line. And it`s basically all about how children can defend themselves. You think it`s impossible? It`s not. What about it, Stephen Daley?
STEPHEN DALEY, RADKIDS: Well, one of the things that we`re hearing tonight, Nancy, is that the system is set up to respond after the fact. It`s time to teach our children, and we can teach our children some skills to help them be safer. And I think that`s what we need to do, is work at options for our children. There`s no guarantee, but it would really be nice if our children had some choices against the people that are doing this to them.
GRACE: To Mary-Anne in Nevada, who just made that call. There actually is a device currently on the market, and it`s used at places like Disneyland and Six Flags, where it is a GPS-type monitor that fits in a lunchbox or a knapsack, and parents can keep up with their children in that way. It is not unheard of. The technology is out there and it is available right now.
I want to know who this guy is. Out to Chief Chris Snyder with South Salt Lake City PD. Who is this guy, this 21-year-old? Where did he come from and why is he here?
SNYDER: You know, we don`t have a whole lot of information on him. We know he is a refugee. He is from Burma. And as the other guest said earlier, he`s been here 30 days and actually been in that complex for about 30 days. We have no prior activity or involvement with him, and he has no criminal history in the United States.
GRACE: Chief, the only -- are you telling me the only criteria that was not met in order to issue an Amber Alert was that you didn`t know she had been abducted?
SNYDER: That was one element. The other one that was discussed was sufficient descriptive information. A lot of that is tied to the natural (ph) suspect, a vehicle license plate, things that will help the public to identify a potential abductor. Certainly in this case, we had a photo and a very good description, clothing description. But that`s something that helps build that criteria.
GRACE: Well, I`m not understanding what exactly was missing, then, other than not knowing whether she had been kidnapped.
SNYDER: Well, as I said before, you try and put the entire thing together, the totality of everything. In most cases where an Amber Alert is issued, there is some type of information on a suspect. A witness saw something or something that gives the public...
GRACE: Well, do you have to have that?
SNYDER: ... -something to look for. You know, whether or not you have to have that, I don`t know. I didn`t define the protocols on the Amber Alert. You know, it`s an interpretation, but it`s pretty clear on what the expectation is.
GRACE: So you`re telling me that`s one of the reasons you didn`t issue an Amber Alert on the little girl?
SNYDER: Combined with the fact that we had that (ph) and we didn`t have true evidence of an abduction.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Rosita in Wisconsin. Hi, Rosita.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I love your show.
GRACE: Thank you. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They already answered most of my questions, Mr. Klaas (INAUDIBLE) Why didn`t they search the entire unit immediately?
GRACE: What about it, Chief? Why was that the last unit searched of the entire complex? And why hadn`t the basement been searched already?
SNYDER: Well, you know, as we eliminated units -- obviously, our focus was on that complex. We were able to make contact at every single unit in that complex, which is fairly large. There`s about 100 units in there. There were three that we were not able to make contact at , which basically, there wasn`t a resident home. We don`t have the legal authority to just go into somebody`s house without something else, some sufficient evidence there. We got the other two. That was just the last one where we were able to get in touch with somebody.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s very hard because right here, we`re all in our own little communities. There`s a lot of different nationalities here. And regardless of what you are, we all still come together. I have a 3- year-old, and (INAUDIBLE) it could have been any of our kids, and so we`re all out here supporting the family.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hundreds of people searched for a 7-year-old Utah girl who disappeared Monday. And sadly, they didn`t even need to look very far. Hser Ner Moo`s body was found in the same apartment complex where her family lived. Police say a 21-year-old man has confessed now to killing her. He`s charged with aggravated murder, kidnapping and evidence tampering. Police have not yet said how the girl died, but say there`s evidence of trauma.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We don`t know yet what that trauma is. We do not know if the little girl was sexually molested. We do know, according to sources, that the perpetrator, the alleged perpetrator that is now in custody on aggravated murder, claims he tried to apprehend the little girl, that there was a, quote, "physical altercation" with the 7-year-old girl found dead in the basement.
I want to go out to the lines. Let`s go to Chastity in Kansas. Hi, Chastity.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I must say, I don`t watch your program all the time, but I was flipping through and noticed the story and was listening to this Utah chief of police. And the Amber Alert system that he`s talking about, our protocol in Kansas is as soon as you have a missing person, you can enter them into our national crime database. You can issue an Amber Alert as soon as you have a police report of a missing person. You do not have to wait 24 hours. You do not have to wait for any of that.
And I`m just a little, I guess, confused about Utah and what their policy is because we have been taught through our NCIC training that as soon as a missing person has been brought up to our attention, you enter them.
GRACE: Let`s go out to Mike Brooks. Mike, what about it?
MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, Nancy, there are criteria for the Amber Alert in most states. You know, here in Georgia, it`s called a levis (ph) call (ph). But in most states where they do have the Amber Alert, the chief is absolutely right. There are certain criteria. Now...
GRACE: Just because you don`t know if the child has been kidnapped, you don`t issue an Amber Alert? Are you kidding me!
BROOKS: No.
GRACE: That`s why you have an Amber Alert! Of course you don`t know if they`re kidnapped yet!
BROOKS: Well, as we heard the caller say, you know, it`s entered into the NCIC, the National Crime Information Center. That is the lookout that all law enforcement throughout the country has access to. But there are certain stringent rules, unfortunately...
GRACE: Oh, really?
BROOKS: ... and very frustrating...
GRACE: Oh, really? Not according to...
BROOKS: ... for the Amber Alert...
GRACE: ... Chastity in Kansas! That`s not what Chastity says.
BROOKS: Well, I`m telling you what I know from other states, and the District of Columbia also, Nancy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police have taken one suspect, or they had several suspects in custody, released several. But one suspect is being charged, and supposedly, according to charging documents, admitted to the crime, kidnapping 7-year-old Hser Ner Moo, murdering her and trying to cover up the crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At approximately 7:00 PM, a team of four FBI agents made contact at 471 East 2250 South. They obtained consent to search the apartment from the occupants. Once inside the apartment, they interpreted (ph) some evidence that led them to the bathroom of the apartment, where they discovered the body of Hser Ner Moo. She was deceased.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: This little girl just yards away from her apartment. That is where her body was found. Would issuing the Amber Alert in a timely manner have saved this little girl`s life?
Out to the lines. Lisa in Idaho. Hi, Lisa.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. Well, I have a question. Well, he was a refugee from another country. Do they have to do background checks for him to come here legally?
GRACE: Excellent question. What about it, Jim Kirkwood?
KIRKWOOD: Well, they`re supposed to, but we`ve seen situations in another part of the country where that`s obviously not so.
GRACE: I find it very difficult to believe, Dr. Jeff Gardere, that this is his first offense. Usually, you work up to murder.
JEFF GARDERE, PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes, absolutely, Nancy. A lot of the information that I`ve seen on people who have committed these sorts of crimes, especially sort of like a pedophile kind of crime -- we don`t know for sure yet -- these people have had a prior experience with crimes.
GRACE: But we let him into the country anyway, and now this little girl is dead!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHIEF CHRIS SNYDER, SOUTH SALT LAKE CITY P.D.: What we believe at this point is that after she left that apartment she went directly over to that apartment. We do not know -- to the suspect`s residence, excuse me. We do not know how she got in. Whether or not she was invited in or whether or not she asked to go in. What we do know is that four residents who live there do know the family and do know her. So she has been over to that apartment before.
The gentleman we arrested, his name is Esar Met. E-S-A-R, M-E-T. He`s 21 years old. We know that he was home at the time. We do not believe that the other four residents were home at that time. At sometime while they were in the apartment, a physical altercation did occur. Again, I can`t get specific on that other than to say that evidence at the scene and after retrieval of the body, there was apparent that there was a inflicted trauma on her body.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: If statistics hold true the little girl was already dead. But we don`t know that. We know she walked out of her apartment to go play. Her aunt was there babysitting at 2:00 p.m. When her dad got home at 6:00 p.m. he called police. An AMBER Alert was not issued until the next day around 9:00 to 9:30 a.m. when the little girl didn`t show up for school.
Could she have been saved?
And don`t get me wrong. It wasn`t the police force that didn`t issue the AMBER Alert that killed the little girl. It was the guy in our country that should not have been here. But would the AMBER Alert have saved her life?
Out to the lines, Linda in Texas. Linda, hi.
LINDA, TEXAS RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. Thanks for taking my call.
GRACE: Yes, ma`am.
LINDA: I would like to know why the police chief called that child murder a gentleman. And also one of the callers spoke of him as a gentleman.
GRACE: Chief Snyder, why?
SNYDER: I don`t know when I referred to him as a gentleman. You know, you do these press conferences and statements and you`re just trying to find words to explain the situation.
GRACE: Well, chief, you know what? You can`t win for losing. If you had referred to him for what he really is, we would have had to bleep you out. OK? So you call him a gentleman, now we`re mad at you about that, too. So it`s a very thin line you`re running here.
I still -- I`m going to come back to it again, chief. I disagree with the way you guys did the AMBER Alert. I know, I know, even though you may not admit it, that you`re wondering about it, you`re thinking about it. But in hindsight everything`s always so much more clear.
Out to Trish in Kentucky. Hi, Trish.
TRISH, KENTUCKY RESIDENT: Nancy, I am absolutely appalled. I believe that first responsibility here is parents need to be held accountable for where their children are. This day and age you cannot trust anyone. You need -- just know where your children are and stay with your children. If that`s not possible, leave them in the company of someone that can be trusted.
GRACE: You know, in this case, not only were some of the siblings home, but the aunt was there babysitting. The mother had just had a baby and was at the doctor`s appointment with the brand new baby. She left an adult in charge. And I don`t know what it means in this day and age -- let`s unleash the lawyers, Susan Moss, Renee Rockwell, Alan Ripka -- that your child cannot just go right outside and play.
And Elizabeth, could you please show the viewers how close the little girl`s apartment -- is to where she was murdered. She was found in the basement. And still tonight a lot of questions about why that AMBER Alert was not issued until the next day. Overnight passed. How long did the little girl survive in that basement before she was killed? See those two red dots? That`s just how close the two apartments were. A little less, I believe, than 100 yards. One football field away.
Susan Moss, weigh in.
SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: The reason why so many of us are crazy about the whole AMBER issue is that the whole purpose of an AMBER Alert is to have an immediate response. It`s to get this little girl or the next little girl`s picture out there so that she can be spotted, so that we can help our law enforcement, and we can work as a team.
Maybe we couldn`t have helped this child, but for the next child. So many hours passing without alerting the media, it`s a huge mistake.
GRACE: To you Renee Rockwell, with a guy who`s not even supposed to be in the country, clearly this is going to be a death penalty case.
RENEE ROCKWEELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Oh, Nancy, maybe, maybe not. I see a mental -- maybe a mental defect defense. And also I see because you know.
GRACE: Based on?
ROCKWELL: Well.
GRACE: Based on?
ROCKWELL: I don`t know. But Nancy you`ve got a confession. Here we go.
GRACE: That makes a lot of sense.
ROCKWELL: No, you have a confession, Nancy.
GRACE: I don`t know why I`m saying it.
ROCKWELL: Nancy, you have a confession.
GRACE: It`s like a bubble gum machine. It just dropped down and it just comes out.
ROCKWELL: This guy has already confessed and the question is going to be, is this lawyer going to let that confession stay in or is he going to get it tossed. How did this guy.
GRACE: Well, I have very seriously.
ROCKWELL: OK.
GRACE: It`s up to the lawyer.
ROCKWELL: It is.
GRACE: Last time I looked there`s usually a judge sitting up on the bench.
ROCKWELL: But Nancy, he`s going to argue that this guy didn`t have any way to understand what he`s -- he was waiving rights, that he was waiving rights that he was advised of. But the last thing, Nancy, the reason you have AMBER Alerts, because AMBER Alerts equal community action. What happened here was the police could not enter this apartment but who knows neighbors might have had this AMBER Alert been issued.
GRACE: Out to Alan Ripka, I hardly believe that we have the responsibility to give a course in American history to everybody that gets their Miranda Rights. If he said, yes, I understand. If he signed that waiver, it`s over. That statement is coming in, Alan Ripka.
ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, if he understood that statement is coming, it`s going to be up to the police force to show that he understood the language and if he didn`t they had an interpreter that gave him his Miranda warnings because he if he didn`t understand that statement`s down the drain and they`re going to have to have some sort of corroborating evidence to convict this guy of murder.
GRACE: To Chief Snyder, did this guy have a job?
SNYDER: I don`t know what his employment status was.
GRACE: Could he speak English?
SNYDER: I don`t know how well he spoke English. I do believe we used an interpreter.
GRACE: Did he agree to his Miranda Rights.
SNYDER: You know, I can`t really get the specifics of the actual interview.
GRACE: OK. Chief, did he make a statement before he was given his Miranda Rights. A spontaneous statement.
SNYDER: That I can`t tell you. I can`t tell you that, either, Nancy.
GRACE: Chief, was the little girl molested?
SNYDER: You know, that`s something that we can`t really talk about now. It`s important to remember this is still an active investigation. We`re still trying to.
GRACE: OK.
SNYDER: .get all the evidence secured.
GRACE: Chief, why is he charged with aggravated murder? What makes it -- in my mind I believe I know why it was aggravated, but why has he been charged by police with aggravated murder as opposed to simple murder?
SNYDER: Well, that`s the evidence that we currently have. You know more details would come out when formal charges are filed by the district attorney`s office.
GRACE: What are the criteria for aggravated murder, chief?
SNYDER: You know there are certain extenuating circumstances that will heighten that. So that`s what we`re dealing with in this situation.
GRACE: Like what? What are some of the criteria not just about this case but about any case? What makes it aggravated?
SNYDER: You know, it can deal with things such as, you know, weapons, kidnapping charges, there are forms of assault. Sexual assault is one of those as well.
GRACE: Let`s go back out to the lines. Cherie in Kansas. Hi, Cherie.
CHERIE, KANSAS RESIDENT: Hello. I was wondering, does Utah have the death penalty?
GRACE: To my understanding, yes, it does. Liz, let`s see the death penalty map.
Jim Kirkwood, you guys do have the death penalty, right?
JIM KIRKWOOD, NEWS SHOW HOST, KTKK: We do, but in Salt Lake County usually you have to kill two people or more to get it.
GRACE: Say what?
KIRKWOOD: That`s the history here. Yes, believe it or not.
GRACE: The history, the history but not the law.
KIRKWOOD: Yes, the law is he`s eligible.
GRACE: Can you still get the death penalty by shooting? In Utah?
KIRKWOOD: It`s an -- I believe it is an option but they all pick lethal injection.
GRACE: I want to go back out to Dr. David M. Possey, medical examiner, forensic pathologist. You know this AMBER Alert issue is very, very troubling, doctor. And I`m just wondering if a doctor would be able to place a time of death on the little girl. Did it matter police failed to issue the AMBER Alert?
DR. DAVID M. POSSEY, MEDICAL EXAMINER, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Well, time of death is an often asked question and when you have a missing person you can only take the time when they`re last seen alive and then when they were found, and then any evidence that might be at the scene or on the body to help you try and establish the time of death.
Usually when you get out past about 24 to 48 hours it makes time of death very, very difficult. Sometimes if you do some chemical tests on the eye fluid you can often get a better, better idea, but I think in this case it`s going to be difficult to get an exact time when she died.
GRACE: Joining us Dr. David M. Possey out of L.A.
Everyone, I want to thank you tonight from my heart for all of your prayers and your kind words for the twins. These are a little fuzzy. I took them. This is Lucy and John David. And the importance of the photo is they are wearing two beautiful homemade sweaters from friends of the show, Lynn, Donna Kay, Sue and Kathy.
Ladies, I can`t tell you what this meant to me that you made these with your own hands. I`m going to post these on the Web for you tonight. And I hope you like them.
As we go to break, please continue your -- thoughts and prayers for defense attorney and friend Sandy Schiff, one of the best lawyers in New York. Sandy is in the fight of a lifetime.
Everyone, when we come back, the search heats up for missing 23-year- old mom Stacy Peterson. Tonight searchers looking for graves. Why? And what does Stacy`s priest tell a secret grand jury?
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The search resumes for Stacy Peterson. Over 50 volunteers are searching the Bolingbrook area for the young mother of two, while one and only suspect Drew Peterson sits at home on his couch still claiming Stacy ran away with another man. The searchers working closely with Illinois State Police say they`re looking for a body or possible gravesite, refusing to reveal where they`re searching (INAUDIBLE) evidence will be moves. As the grand jury reportedly continues to hear witnesses, police are combing for clues saying Stacy`s disappearance is a potential homicide.
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GRACE: Now the search apparently for graves.
I want to first go out to Joel Brodsky. He is the defense attorney for Drew Peterson, now a suspect in his fourth wife`s disappearance especially after the dry bathtub drowning death of his third wife was ruled homicide.
Joel, welcome. You are a veteran trial lawyer in your jurisdiction of Chicago. I`m just wondering why your client keeps saying over and over that it`s a waste of the searchers` time and energy to look for his wife.
JOEL BRODSKY, ATTORNEY FOR SUSPECT DREW PETERSON: He says he knows that Stacy called him the night she left and told him she was leaving. So with this knowledge that he has he knows that they`re not going to find her in some bush or some pond or stream in Bolingbrook, that they`re going to have to look elsewhere. But for some.
GRACE: OK. Joel, do the police have evidence of that phone call? Was it from her cell phone?
BRODSKY: Yes. The cell phone records are -- is well known. They have the records. They have the towers that the transmissions took place. So they do. Yes.
GRACE: Where did she call from?
BRODSKY: She was -- I don`t know exactly the location.
GRACE: Well, if they got the location then you would know, right?
BRODSKY: Well, no, they haven`t disclosed the evidence to me.
GRACE: Why wouldn`t they tell her husband, Drew Peterson?
BRODSKY: That`s a good question. But the towers were in the Bolingbrook area. So I know that it wasn`t.
GRACE: Really?
BRODSKY: It wasn`t from another state. It was from the area.
GRACE: So Drew Peterson could have made that phone call, couldn`t he?
BRODSKY: Well, he couldn`t have called the phone and answered at the same time. So -- because they would have been -- then it would have been off of the same tower. So they were off of separate towers. And -- I mean that`s what we know.
GRACE: So you don`t know where the phone call came from exactly, but you do know it was from separate towers. How do you know that?
BRODSKY: Yes. That`s what the Illinois state police have disclosed in media, in press disclosures or the media.
GRACE: Well, wouldn`t Drew Peterson have a right to know this information because he is her husband?
BRODSKY: You`d think so. You`d think he`d have a.
GRACE: Has he tried to get it?
BRODSKY: Yes. We did try to get the phone records from the telephone company since actually the bills were in Drew`s name but they`ve been sealed and they`re not disclosing to us.
GRACE: Sir, isn`t it true that your client continues to state it`s a waste of time to search for Stacy where you`re searching for her because he knows where her body is? I`ll spit it out there.
BRODSKY: No -- I mean go ahead and put it out there. But no, that`s not the case. Listen, we have no problem whatsoever if the -- if this finds Stacy Peterson, I don`t know, organization, whatever it may be, wishes to go and look. I can`t stop them. As a matter of fact.
GRACE: It doesn`t even make sense, Joel.
BRODSKY: Why, why not?
GRACE: That she would disappear and not stay in touch with her children.
BRODSKY: Well, that`s not true. It happens. Wives sometimes run off especially when you have a situation like this. You have a younger -- a young woman.
GRACE: OK.
BRODSKY: With two children and an older husband. Sometimes it happens.
GRACE: All right. Never heard of it myself. But OK.
To Kathy Cheney with the "Chicago Defender," what`s the latest on the search? Why are they searching for graves?
KATHY CHENEY, REPORTER, CHICAGO DEFENDER: They`re not necessarily searching for graves. But I mean her family remains optimistic. However they are coming to the conclusion that they will not find her alive. So they`re searching an area where there it`s like, you know, padded down bushes, just like a wooded area where anything could be buried. So they`re searching there.
GRACE: Well, according to all the research, they are, in fact, searching for graves.
To Roy Taylor, leading the search for Stacy Peterson, are you, in fact, searching for graves?
ROY TAYLOR, LEADING SEARCH FOR STACY PETERSON: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for having us on.
GRACE: Thank you for being with us.
TAYLOR: Yes, without going too far into exactly what we`re searching for, I would like to put out there that we would like to refer back to Cassandra`s statement at our press conference last Wednesday. And that is that we were informed by Illinois State Police that Stacy never left 6 Pheasant Chase Court under her own free will.
So with that statement put out at hand Drew is in a fantasy land thinking that she ran off with someone else. He obviously made this illusion up on his head now. So they have evidence that she never left. So that`s why we`re out looking for a gravesite.
GRACE: Roy, you state that police have stated she never left the home willingly. Why do they say that, Roy?
TAYLOR: Well, obviously, you know, we`re right in the middle of a really big investigation so I really can`t say too much about that. And that will all come out again.
GRACE: Joining me tonight, Mike Brooks, former cop with D.C., former fed with the FBI. Weigh in, Mike.
MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: I`ll tell you what, Nancy. It`s been a long time but I still have faith that something will come of this, because the grand jury is still empanelled. We did -- they just had her minister talking to him. I`d be anxious to hear what he had to say.
The possible gravesites -- they also went to the trouble, Nancy, which I though was also very, very smart, they took -- they made a training video for these volunteers so the volunteers -- if they did come across something of potential evidence that they would know how to handle this. I think that was a very, very smart move by Will County to do that for the volunteers so they wouldn`t mess up any evidence should they find it.
GRACE: Back out to Kathy Cheney, with the "Chicago Defender."
Kathy, what did the minister say to a secret grand jury?
CHENEY: We don`t know exactly what he said to the grand jury. But I`m sure that he repeated what he said in published reports about a month or so ago, about Stacy did come to him, confided in him that Drew divulged that he had something to do or killed Kathleen Savio. And he also repeated a month ago that there was no inappropriate relationship that he had with Stacy.
GRACE: You know I find that very interesting.
Back to Joel Brodsky, Drew Peterson`s defense attorney, that your client, Drew Peterson, as soon as he finds out that she had consulted with her minister, he starts casting aspersions on her, saying, oh she was all thwarted up every time she saw her minister. She had a crush on him. You know that`s pretty sick to suggest she had a thing going on with her minister. Will he say anything to drag her through the mud?
BRODSKY: It wasn`t necessarily Drew that said that. It was also a neighbor, Steve.
GRACE: It was Drew.
BRODSKY: Well, it was Drew and also was confirmed by his friend, Steve, who also would observe this behavior.
GRACE: That carries a lot of weight.
BRODSKY: Why would you ask?
GRACE: I mean, how far will your client go to drag her through the mud?
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GRACE: Today is Autism Awareness Day. Autism affects one of every 150 births. I was honored to speak at an autism school here in New York and to meet 15-year-old student Sam Baum. He says more right now than I could ever say.
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GRACE: Knowing who you are, listening right now, I truly believe that there is that one moment in life that defines you. That moment when you go to the plate and hit a homerun.
DANNY MIXON, SAM BAUM`S PIANO INSTRUCTOR: He might not be able to communicate with people through talking one-on-one, from time to time, but his music, his jazz, he communicates with the whole world.
JEFFREY NUSSBAUM, SAM`S FATHER: Picture a future for Sam as a musician. And it`s really a beautiful thing. (INAUDIBLE) Music, I think, will carry him through.
MIXON: That`s why I say Sam is a power of example.
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GRACE: Tonight let`s stop to remember Army Captain Adam Snyder, 26, Fort Pierce, Florida, killed, Iraq. Graduated 10 percent at West Point with studies in Arabic and Middle Eastern history. In high school he was crowned homecoming king and earned huge reviews for his role in "The Music Man." Survived by mother Fran, father Joe, step-father Larry, younger brother Evan, grandfather Bob.
Adam Snyder, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you. And tonight, a special good night from winners of the Christ the King School Auction, Tamara, Janine, Jenny, Diana, Karen and Casey.
Aren`t they beautiful?
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern, and until then, good night, friend.
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