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Rising Food Prices and Rising Concerns; Pennsylvania Primary: Democrats Get In Last Minute Campaigning; U.S. Military Forced to Dig Deeper for New Personnel

Aired April 21, 2008 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Counting down to a crucial contest, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama scrambling for votes ahead of tomorrow's Pennsylvania primary.
VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN ANCHOR: After weeks of back and forth battling, they're still on the stump, still on the attack and hoping to drive voters to the polls.

LEMON: Speaking of driving, how about driving to the polls or anywhere else, it's costing everybody a lot more. Another day, another record at the gas pumps.

Hello, everyone. Sorry for that bit of bad news, I'm Don Lemon live at the CNN World Headquarters here in Atlanta.

DE LA CRUZ: And I'm Veronica De La Cruz in for Kyra Phillips. It's nice to see you here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

LEMON: New poll numbers top our political ticker today. A CNN Poll of Polls shows the Democratic race is still tight in Pennsylvania, among likely Democratic primary voters Hillary Clinton leads Barack Obama 50 percent to 43 percent. That is a seven-point lead. Seven percent say they're still undecided here.

And perhaps a most crucial campaign stretch for Hillary Clinton, she's run into some debt, financial reports show the campaign owed more than $10 million at the start of the month, and only about $9 million on hand for the remaining primaries. Her rival's war chest looks more like a jackpot. Barack Obama reports having $42 million available to spend on the primaries.

In Selma, Alabama, today, presumptive GOP nominee John McCain praised civil rights workers who were brutally beaten on a bridge in 1965. He spoke to a mostly white crowd in the mostly black community but said he would be president of all of the people.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My concern about America has not got to do with party identification. My concern about America today is that Americans are hurting. Americans today are sitting around the kitchen table and saying, how can I keep my home? How can we make next month's mortgage payment? How are we going to keep my job? How are we going to give our kids an education? That's the challenge. (END VIDEO CLIP)

DE LA CRUZ: Young, old, blue collar, white collar, rural cities, big towns, Pennsylvania has it all. Who's voting for who and where?

CNN's John King breaks down the political landscape.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: One of the things that makes Pennsylvania so fascinating, not only in this Democratic primary, but as we look for lessons heading forward to the November battleground, not only in Pennsylvania, but across the country is the diversity of this large state.

You start here in Philadelphia, it is an Eastern city. A large African American population. Much more like New York than, say, Pittsburgh to the west. Philadelphia is the critical city in Pennsylvania, because of the population and because of the Democratic turnout inside the city.

Pittsburgh out here in the west, once the capital of steel, the gate way to the Midwest, Pittsburgh much more a Midwestern city as Philadelphia is an Eastern city. Still a critical battleground for the Democrats here, an area where they must run up big numbers in the general election.

Then you get into the central part of the state, which is fascinating. This area here from Lancaster, all the way here is what locals call the T, they come up through the central part of the state, and across to the New York border. This is the culturally conservative agricultural area, rural area, a much more Republican, almost like a southern vote in its voting patterns. We can show you what we many by going back to 2000. You see the results in 2000.

Al Gore is blue, he wins big in the blue collar corridors in the east and the west, and the heartland, middle of the state, overwhelmingly for George W. Bush. Not enough for Bush to carry the state. He lost it both in 2000 here and again in 2004, but you see where the culturally conservative voters are in the middle of the state, you see where the blue collar turnout is in the eat of the state, this is worth remembering as we head forward November if John McCain is going to make this a red state come November, he not only has to do what George W. Bush did in the middle, but has to do better than George W. Bush in the east, especially in the suburban collar just around Philadelphia.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DE LA CRUZ: That was John King there in New York with that magic, really cool technology. Don't forget all the latest campaign news is available for you at your fingertips. You can always head to the Web site, CNNPolitics.com. We also have analysis from the best political team on television, which John King is a part of. That and much more, all online at CNNPolitics.com. LEMON: Here's today's broken record. For the first time ever we're up to $3.50 a gallon average for regular unleaded gasoline. That's according to AAA. The cost is up nearly a quarter per gallon in just the past month. Rusty Dornin is standing by at a pump in suburban Atlanta to tell us what folk there's are saying.

Hey, Rusty, it seems like just in -- I drove by a gas station the other day, and gas prices, it was one thing, then like 10 minutes later I drove by and it was like ten cents higher, just in a few minutes.

RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Exactly. Exactly. I ended up filling up my car here because the one near my house is a lot more expensive. It's $3.44 here in Doraville, which is just a suburb in Atlanta, that's a little below the national average. But just look at it across the country. You've got Atlanta is $3.49, you've got San Francisco at $3.97, it's all over the map. I was in San Diego over the weekend, it was $3.89.

It's all over the map. Above and below that national average, but everyone knows this is an all-time high. Here to talk with us a little bit, some of the customers here who are faced with it. Lila Clanski (ph), you were just saying you have a remodeling business.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

DORNIN: And you have three vehicles that you have to fill. How hard has it been impacting you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, we have to add on with our estimates and contracts, a fuel surcharge because it's just ridiculous.

DORNIN: So your customers are already feeling the pinch because you have to pass on your cost to them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Exactly.

DORNIN: How about personally? Are you doing anything less or something in your life?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I plot my strategy and where I'm going a lot more carefully so I don't backtrack, et cetera.

DORNIN: Also, Chris Holland here with Southern Seasons Lawncare. You were saying that it's very expensive, you've got to fill also lawn mowers and that sort of thing.

CHRIS HOLLAND, SOUTHERN SEASONS LAWNCARE: I've got four trucks and about nine or 10 walk-behinds that we need to fill with fuel.

DORNIN: Have you passed it on to your customers yet?

HOLLAND: I'm starting to. I went up ON some last year and the ones I didn't do last year I have to hit this year.

DORNIN: How about personally? Is it affecting you? Are you changing your lifestyle a little bit?

HOLLAND: I don't go out as much. I try to stay around the house. Like Lila, if errands have to be ran, I try to bunch them together, and try to do them when traffic's not bad, get there quick.

DORNIN: OK, great, thank you both for joining us. You can see, a lot of Americans changing little things in their lives. I talked to one guy who has cut Starbucks out. We talked to a couple earlier, when they drove from Nashville, they decided to rent a car.

It was cheaper to rent a compact car to drive to Atlanta than to drive their own car. So you can see people are just figuring out little ways to change their lives to save a little money -- Don.

LEMON: Let's hope it gets better soon. We're hoping that. But doesn't look like it's likely with the price of gas and oil keeps spiraling. All right. Rusty Dornin joining us from suburban Atlanta. We appreciate that report.

As Rusty's been saying, gas prices are up. We've been talking about food prices, they're up as well. Our pocketbooks are certainly feeling the pinch, and we'd like to know, what are you doing to save money? What are you doing to save money? You can send your ideas to cnnnewsroom@cnn.com, again, cnnnewsroom@cnn.com and we'll pass them along, just a little bit later on.

DE LA CRUZ: We've been getting some pretty good tips so far. A lot of people definitely making some life changes, that's for sure.

Well, China says deadly problems with the drug heparin may have their roots in the U.S. The Food and Drug Administration says at least 62 deaths are tied to allergic reactions to contaminated batches of the blood thinner much. The FDA says traced the problem to China, but Chinese officials say the factory that shipped raw heparin was managed and overseen by an American company. They plan to visit a New Jersey plant where the final product was made -- Don.

LEMON: Well, who belongs to whom? Authorities in Texas are trying to answer that question with DNA tests on 416 children from a polygamist ranch.

CNN's Susan Roesgen is following the chaotic custody case, she is in San Angelo, Texas.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN ROESGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: To protect the privacy of the children we won't be able to see the actual DNA testing going on behind me in the San Angelo Coliseum. This is where some 400 children have been living since being removed from the ranch three weeks ago. They will undergo the DNA testing there. The men and women from the ranch must go into Eldorado and submit to court authorities to get a DNA swab to get their testing done.

The judge has ruled that she's got to have that, because she wants to determine the paternity and the maternity. Because no one right now is sure which children block to which parents. Even the lawyers, the 350 lawyers who have been volunteering to represent the children, say they don't know who the parents are.

SUSAN HAYS, ATTORNEY FOR ONE OF THE CHILDREN: Anytime there's a question of parentage in Texas you're going to have a DNA test, and that's what's going on. There's no way that was going to be avoided, particularly in this situation when there's so many questions about parentage.

ROESGEN: The results of the DNA testing could take a couple of weeks. In the meantime, there is the strange twist to the story. Texas Rangers are investigating a woman in Colorado, a 33-year-old woman named Rosita Swinton. They say she is a person of interest in this case.

They believe that she might have been the person who made the initial phone call tipping law enforcement to the allegations of child abuse at the ranch. We don't know why she might have done that or what her connection might have been, but they are looking at her as a person of interest in this case.

Susan Roesgen, CNN, San Angelo, Texas.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DE LA CRUZ: Why is the Pentagon putting some of the most sophisticated weaponry on the planet in the hands of convicted felons? A story you won't believe in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Recruiting shortfalls and pressure from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have led the U.S. military to dig deeper for personnel. Senior Pentagon correspondent, Jamie McIntyre, joins us now with the very latest on this.

Jamie I understand, are we talking felons here?

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Don.

These are waivers. We have statistics just released from the House oversight committee it got from the Pentagon on the number of waivers granted to new recruits in order to fill out the ranks of in particular the Army and the Marines which have the biggest pressure on them because they're fighting the ground wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

These are essentially exceptions for a wide range of criminal offenses that would otherwise disqualify someone from service. You can see the numbers there, they've jumped dramatically. In the Army, they've more than doubled the number of these waivers they've given out, this, last year compared to the year before, and the marines almost doubled, going up to 350.

Now if you look at the categories they give these waivers for, and look at the number of waivers, for instance burglary, 248 waivers. Narcotics and various drug offenses, 130. Aggravated assault, 87 people got waivers for that. Grand larceny, 96. Even some sexual offenses, 11, and terrorism and bomb threats, seven waivers.

Now each one of these waivers is a story in itself. What the Army, what the Pentagon says, is this is a case where recruiters are using judgment about whether something somebody did long in their past is going to disqualify them for service. Take some examples, for instance, take the burglary example.

One of the examples we have is from an applicant who was 23 years old, had a college degree, was applying to go into the Army, but when he was 14, he and a couple of friends broke into a shed at a country club, stole a golf cart, went on a joyride, and was convicted of burglary.

That's the kind of case where the recruiters can use their common sense to say, look, we think that was long enough ago, and not that serious now. But again, you look at some of these offenses and they look pretty serious. Take the aggravated assault category.

That sounds pretty serious, not necessarily you want to have somebody who is convicted of that in the Army, but again, in an example they gave us of that, if I can find it here in my notes, is a 12-year-old who -- two kids got in a fight when they were 14, both charged with aggravated assault. Again, the Army says, this is a case where they can use judgment.

Now, of course, the question is are they lowering standards and what the Army says is there's still a wide range of offenses for which you can never get a waiver for, that includes very violent sexual offenses, and things like alcoholism, and by the way, they don't take anybody who has not already been rehabilitated or who is still on parole or something like that. So that's the situation we're facing, Don.

LEMON: Yes, it just shows how tough a time they're having filling the ranks is becoming. All right. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon.

Jamie, thank you for much for that.

DE LA CRUZ: A crucial contest in an historic race. Clinton, Obama. Pennsylvania, we're counting down to the state's presidential primary and talking to two Democratic strategists on two different sides.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Are we there yet? Gas prices set another record surging to an average of $3.50 a gallon for unleaded regular, $3.85 if you're into premium in today's AAA survey. And oil, well it tops $117 bucks a barrel. It's issue number one and some economists say we've finally reached the tipping point, that's when gas costs to much consumers start to cut back. Prices are up 16 cents a gallon in the past two weeks. That's according to the Lunberg Survey. We're paying 60 cents more a gallon than last year and analysts predict summer demand could drive prices even higher than that, Veronica.

Well, a lot of you are sharing your money-saving ideas with us here today in the CNN NEWSROOM.

DE LA CRUZ: We've gotten some great tips. Take a listen to this. This is from Chris in Kansas who really focuses on the big picture here. He writes, set up a budget, find out what you're spending money on and that makes it easier to cut unnecessary spending.

We were talking about the latte factor earlier. Also consider setting be up a monthly automatic transfer from a checking to a savings account, because that will force you to save money. A lot of us don't take the time to ever draft out a budget.

LEMON: This is one that's very interesting one. Hannah from California. She wrote this, Veronica. She says: "When I get solicitations I send the envelope back with a note apologizing for no check enclosed. I further suggest they request a donation in my name from Mobil Exxon or Standard Oil, as that is where their usual donation has gone this year."

Ouch, right?

Charities, we've been talking about that, charities, food banks, anyone who does those sorts of services.

DE LA CRUZ: It's all coming full circle.

LEMON: People who don't usually need services from food banks and that kind of thing, people with jobs are having to go there. I just did a story the other day in Atlanta.

All right. Well, we thank you for sending those to us. Our address is cnnnewsroom@cnn.com if you want to send a comment to us.

DE LA CRUZ: Well, no toying around. Mattel says it is raising prices. Susan Lisovicz is at the New York Stock Exchange with details of the price hike and how investors are reacting.

Susan, if it's not one thing, it's another.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. You know, it's cause and effect, that's for sure. The maker of Barbies, as well as Hot Wheels, says it will raise prices for its brand in the mid single digits in June. Mattel blames the cost of materials as well as weakness of the dollar, which make it's more expensive to import toys, as well as litigation expenses related to the recall of all those toys last year for lead paint and design flaws. Mattel shares are down eight percent.

But its arch rival, Hasbro, is jumping 10 percent on stronger- than-expected earnings thanks to growth in brands such as Transformers. Overall, financial stocks leading the market lower, National City getting a $7 billion cash injection, Bank of America reporting a sharp drop in profits, B of A is a Dow 30 stock. Right now the blue chips are down 35 points, but the NASDAQ is hanging in there, let's go uptown to the NASDAQ market site where CNNMoney.com's Poppy Harlow is standing by. Hi, Poppy.

POPPY HARLOW, CNNMONEY.COM: NASDAQ is the only winner right now. A few gains here in large part to big cap technology. Look at Apple, it is up better than four percent. It reports earnings on Wednesday. Investors looking forward to that. But the story today is Yahoo! Because the search engine comes out with their results tomorrow and all eyes are on Yahoo!

Of course, especially because of Microsoft's more than $44 billion bid. Shares of Yahoo! are seeing some gains today. Google saw big gains on Friday after their report that not only does Yahoo! want to compete with Google, they want to come out with strong earnings and be able fend off the Microsoft bid or ask for more money. Saturday is the three-week deadline since Microsoft CEO sent that letter saying, talk to us in three weeks or this is going to get hostile. We'll have Yahoo!'s numbers tomorrow.

Susan, this is a story you and I will both be following very closely.

LISOVICZ: A lot of drama there. But techs have been holding up pretty well, the new economy as opposed to the old economy.

Poppy, talk to you later, thanks so much.

HARLOW: Sure.

LISOVICZ: Coming up for the closing bell, be very sure when you book your flights with the dates you want to fly because that could be going up as well. Veronica and Don, back to you.

DE LA CRUZ: I was hoping you were going to have some good news for us, at some point?

LISOVICZ: Book the flight, but be certain.

DE LA CRUZ: All right. Susan Lisovicz at the New York Stock Exchange.

We'll see you then.

LISOVICZ: You've got it.

LEMON: Here's a self-made millionaire, he wrote a best seller and he's friends with Donald Trump. Today, he's got financial advice that's right on your money.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Robert Kiyosaki took what he learned as a kid and then taught others with his No. 1 best seller "Rich Dad, Poor Dad."

ROBERT KIYOSAKI, ENTREPRENEUR: My dad taught me to be a rich man playing monopoly. So as a little child, I got the formula. I understood financial responsibility, discipline, cash flow. I learned so much just by having fun.

ROMANS: But teaching kids about money isn't always child's play. Kiyosaki says it's important to give them some real world lessons.

KIYOSAKI: A thing a parent might do is ask them to write down everything they spend their money on. So they can see where it goes. It's a great way to teach them what money is for, what they're doing and to learn their spending habits.

ROMANS: Kiyosaki says children's financial education is the key.

KIYOSAKI: I suggest, you know, be forthright, be frank. Teach kids the vocabulary of money. Do you know the difference between an asset and a liability? Cash flow versus capital gains. It's not that hard to understand, and that's what my rich dad taught me.

ROMANS: Christine Romans, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DE LA CRUZ: Well, on the global food crisis, some parts of the Earth are driven to desperation, hungry parents versus police. We'll look at the tense situation growing more so every day.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon live at the CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta.

DE LA CRUZ: We're down to the last 30 minutes so I wanted to thank you for being such a gracious host. I don't know what that was, but thanks.

LEMON: Come on. You're quite welcome. Good to have you here. Always a pleasure.

DE LA CRUZ: Thank you. I'm Veronica De La Cruz in today for Kyra Phillips and you're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

It's now 3:30 on the East Coast, here are three of the stories we're working on in the CNN NEWSROOM. In court today, an 18-year-old accused of plotting a Columbine-style attack on his South Carolina high school. Ryan Shallenberger was assigned a lawyer during a brief appearance. The teen's parents called replies because he ordered bomb-making material that was delivered to their house.

A grim search going on right now in open waters near the Bahamas. Searchers have found 20 bodies and are looking for more after a boat carrying migrants apparently capsized. Three people have been rescued. Most of the victims are Haitian.

The Supreme Court is setting the stage for executions to resume nation wide. They've denied the appeals of more death row inmates. This follows a ruling last week that Kentucky's lethal injection procedures are not cruel and unusual punishment. LEMON: Well, today we have tried to explain the cause and effects of the worldwide rise in food prices, right now we're going to look at how the crisis is playing out in a single developing nation. Senegal, on the coast of West Africa.

Here's CNN's Christian Purefoy.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTIAN PUREFOY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Beaten over the price of bread. Here in Senegal and all over West Africa, frustration over high food prices is spilling into street protests. Consumer rights advocate, Momar Ndao, was one of several beaten and arrested, as authorities tried to contain the growing frustration and hunger. But he says he won't be silenced.

MOMAR NDAO, PRESIDENT, CONSUMERS ASSOCIATION OF SENEGAL: The thing that's getting wrong in Senegal is the high prices. Every time the prices are rising, the Senegalese are unreachable because of the poverty. And the government doesn't do the real job to put the prices down.

PUREFOY: A staple food in Senegal -- people complain the price of bread here has almost doubled in the last year. According to the World Food Programme, Senegal imports over 60 percent of its food. But as global supply is stretched by demand, the price of these imports are rising.

(on-camera): A few simple ingredients -- flour, water and yeast -- to keep these people's stomachs full. But add in the dramatic rise in the global population of wealthier and hungrier Chinese and Indian middle class, and these bustling but tranquil streets are turning into scenes of demonstrations and violence.

(voice-over): Across West Africa, in Burkina Faso, Ivory Coast and Cameroon, people have taken to the streets, demanding governments do more to protect them from the rising food prices. It's estimated that in Africa, a 10 percent rise in food prices pushes two percent of its population below the poverty line.

And in Senegal, prices have risen much more than that. And now opposition parties in Senegal are turning food into a stick with which to beat the government.

BARTHELEMY DIAS, SOCIALIST YOUTH PARTY: We are trying to let the government know that the Senegalese people, they are hungry.

PUREFOY: The Senegalese government admits mistakes were made in the past. But partnered with an Indian company, it now plans self- sufficiency in rice production within five years.

MAMADOU DIOP, SENEGALESE COMMERCE MINISTER: There was no vision about agriculture issues in Senegal. But now we understand what's happening.

PUREFOY: But down on the streets, the answers are long-term, the hunger is now.

Christian Purefoy, CNN, Dakar, Senegal.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DE LA CRUZ: Iraqi forces again clashing with Shiite fighters this weekend in the Sadr City part of Baghdad. An Iraqi official says three police officers and three militiamen were killed. U.S. drones also took to the skies, firing missiles into the neighborhood. The military says it targeted five "Iranian-supported group criminals". That's believed to refer to members of Muqtada al-Sadr's Mahdi Army, who have refused his call for a cease-fire and the government's demand to disband.

LEMON: Crowds of people are fleeing Somalia's capital after a violent weekend that left dozens dead. Somalis describe streets filled with bodies after clashes between government and Ethiopian troops and Islamic militants. A human rights group says at least 81 civilians were killed. It accuses the militants of using civilians as human shields and the troops of shelling residential neighborhoods. The militants are trying to seize control of Mogadishu from Somalia's shaky transitional government.

Meantime, just off the coast, pirates are crew members from a Spanish

Fishing boat. Now, Spanish state radio says it reached the pirates by phone and they want money for the crew's freedom. A senior Spanish official says the government hasn't received any demands. It sent a ship to the area and reached out to the African Union and NATO for help.

DE LA CRUZ: A crucial contest in an historic race -- Clinton, Obama -- Pennsylvania. We're counting down to the state's presidential primary. And we're talking to two Democratic strategists on two different sides.

LEMON: Yes. They say, you know what, you may be surprised when we talk to them. I'll let them say it.

Chicago up in arms over this weekend's barrage of gun violence. The police seek to put an end to the trend.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right. Finally, it's here. After weeks of harsh words and attack ads, it could be make or break time in the Democratic presidential race. Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama spending a final day on the stomp, on the attack ahead of tomorrow's crucial Pennsylvania primary.

We have new poll numbers for you. CNN's Poll of Polls in Pennsylvania suggests Clinton has 50 percent support, seven points ahead of Barack Obama. But seven percent say they are still unsure.

So let's very quickly bring in our roundtable -- two Democratic strategists, two sides. Julian Epstein, a Clinton supporter. Jamal Simmons is an Obama supporter.

Hey, Julian, I want to ask you real quick, do you think most people have made up their minds?

JULIAN EPSTEIN, CLINTON SUPPORTER, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think most people have. But I think there are enough undecideds so that you could either have a narrow win for Obama or a very significant double digit win for Clinton. So most have, but there's enough that could make the difference right now that haven't made their minds up.

LEMON: All right, well, Jamal, you saw that the poll of polls, Clinton, 50 percent, seven points -- seven percentage points ahead of Barack Obama.

Do you think at this late time that people have made up their minds and do you expect an upset when you see these poll numbers?

JAMAL SIMMONS, OBAMA SUPPORTER, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I don't really expect an upset. Senator Clinton is pretty far ahead. She's been bouncing around between a five point lead to a 10 point lead, really, for the last two weeks, the last 10 days. So they'll probably finish somewhere inside of that bandwidth. The closer it is to five points, though, the more troubling it is for Senator Clinton and I think we'll be taking a look to see which populations turned out for which candidate.

Barack Obama has got a very strong ground game, a very strong turnout operation. But Senator Clinton, you know, will most likely catch the break on late deciding and undecided voters.

LEMON: OK, Julian, we have seen -- and I've heard from people in Pennsylvania, mostly in Philadelphia. They say you cannot turn on the television without seeing an -- ad an attack ad, usually, but especially an ad for Barack Obama. He's spending a lot of money there.

Do you think that this is -- especially the attack ads -- has this helped or hurt any one of the two candidates?

EPSTEIN: Well, I think, you know, the old expression, politics ain't beanbag. I think that the longer the race goes on, the more excitement there is, the higher the turnout is. But I think the negativity is hurting both of them, at least on the margins. Barack Obama...

LEMON: But do you think the negativity, though -- I've got to jump in and ask you. Do you think the negativity is hurting -- and this is what the polls are showing -- Hillary Clinton nationally.

But what about in Pennsylvania, where these ads are running? Do we know that for sure, if it's helping or hurting her?

EPSTEIN: Well, she actually popped up ahead on Democratic voters over the weekend at the Gallup Poll. I think that the negatives for both of them have gone up as a result of negative campaigning. As you point out, Barack is spending -- outspending Hillary Clinton three to one and previously had really foresworn negative campaigning. But over the weekend, as you see not just with the ads, but the robo-calls and the campaign call on Saturday where they wanted to raise -- re-raise these issues about Hillary Clinton's trip to Bosnia.

I think what you're going to see as a result is that there -- this election tomorrow is going to be a referendum mostly on Barack Obama. There have been a lot of questions -- some of them unfair -- raised about his statements and associations. He's now taken on negative campaigning, which Jamal said last week was not -- was something that he stayed away from.

I think if he wins the race in Pennsylvania or comes very, very close, then I think he might be able to argue that he has been able to withstand those attacks...

LEMON: OK.

EPSTEIN: If Hillary Clinton wins, I think people will say, look, we're really -- and if she wins big -- we're really beginning to have second thoughts about Barack Obama's electability.

SIMMONS: Don...

LEMON: OK, Jamal, wait. You heard that, but I want to ask -- I've got to ask you this. I mean he talked about the attack ads. Let's talk about the debate which just happened. I mean a lot of criticism from everywhere, you know, what ABC did, Barack Obama's performance.

As a Barack Obama supporter, what do you make of his performance?

SIMMONS: Well, I don't think that Barack Obama would ever make Denzel Washington's "Great Debater" team from that movie that came out last year. But I think that...

LEMON: Do you think, though, his -- I mean, and I get what you're saying.

But do you think his performance in that debate hurt him?

SIMMONS: Do I think it hurt him?

No, I don't think it hurt him. I mean, listen, presidential campaigns are -- I think Obama says it -- Senator Obama says it himself, they're like decathlons, not like marathons. There are all sorts of different events you have to be competitive in.

LEMON: Right.

SIMMONS: He's not that great at debates. But he's a very good speech maker. He's an extraordinary writer. He's great one-on-one with voters...

LEMON: OK.

SIMMONS: But aren't his forte.

LEMON: OK...

SIMMONS: But I don't want to leave this negative ad thing, because -- all right, let's just go to this one second. We did see Senator Clinton do something today which is really appalling. She put an ad up with Osama bin Laden in it to try to scare voters in Pennsylvania. We all saw this in 2002, when they did this against -- when the Republicans did this against Max Cleland. And even people like John...

LEMON: Jamal...

SIMMONS: ...and even people like John McCain said it was too much. I think that the negativity on behalf of Senator Clinton is going to have to stop after they get out of Pennsylvania...

EPSTEIN: Well, but, to be fair, Jamal...

SIMMONS: ...or else she's going to be dinging up the ultimate nominee.

LEMON: All right, that's...

EPSTEIN: To be fair, Jamal. To be fair, Jamal do you think...

LEMON: Hey, I'm sorry.

That's going to have to be the final word. We're out of time. I'm sorry to both of you.

EPSTEIN: Well, there's negativity going on on both sides.

LEMON: Yes.

Julian and Jamal, thank you both, but we've run out of time. I could talk about this with you guys all afternoon.

It's going to be pretty interesting to see how it plays out. And regarding those ads that both of you are talking about, I'm sure "THE SITUATION ROOM" will be taking care of that.

Thank you both. Have a great day.

EPSTEIN: Thanks for having us.

SIMMONS: Thank you.

LEMON: I'll see you tomorrow, maybe.

And you can join the league of first time voters at CNN.com. Get accurate, easy to find information about voting, express yourself and connect with others. Check out CNN.com/league right now and become a member.

DE LA CRUZ: A powerful wind followed by a dramatic rescue on Lake Michigan. The latest on the victims in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DE LA CRUZ: Guns and gangs -- police say they were at the root of a violent weekend in Chicago. At least six people were killed, two dozen hurt in a blur of drive-by shootings and other attacks.

We get more now from reporter Michelle Gallardo of our affiliate, WLS.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MICHELLE GALLARDO, WLS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The victims of this weekend's gun violence range in age from 12 to 65. Police say they include gang members and innocents alike. Of the more than 26 injured since midnight Thursday, six have died, including 34-year-old Marcus Hendricks and 65-year-old Ricardo Sanchez.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And it's very alarming. When I -- I just got back from out of town. And to hear that number over a weekend. And we're not even -- summer has not hit yet. So we can just imagine what the summer is going to look like.

GALLARDO: Police Superintendent Jodi Weis responded to the numbers and put them into context compared to the same weekend for the previous two years. They are, in fact, pretty similar.

SUPERINTENDENT JODY WEIS, CHICAGO POLICE: In 2007, during the same weekend period, there were 19 shootings. Four of them resulted in homicides. In 2006, during the same weekend period, in April, there were 21 shootings.

GALLARDO: To get an even better perspective on the gun violence in Chicago, we've taken a look at the number of homicides citywide, most of which are gun-related. Put into context, it is true that the number of murders has declined significantly over the last 10 years, from a total of 761 in 1997 to 443 last year.

However, compared to the nation's two largest cities, Chicago doesn't fare too well. New York had 496 murders in 2007, L.A. 349. Both New York and L.A. have significantly larger populations, so that proportionally speaking, Chicago has a homicide rate three times higher than New York and nearly 70 percent higher than L.A.

WEIS: You know, you just have too many guns and too many gangs and too much drugs on the street. And I don't really like to compare that many different cities because we can find different ones that will have a greater murder rate per capita than Chicago has. I think we need to focus on Chicago and do whatever we can to take the weapons off the streets.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DE LA CRUZ: And that was reporter Michelle Gallardo, of our affiliate, WLS.

LEMON: A hate-filled diary and a frightening plot add up to tight security at a South Carolina high school today. Eighteen-year- old Ryan Shallenberger is accused of plotting to blow up his classmates. He was arrested on Saturday and today he was given a lawyer at a hearing. The first call to police came from Shallenberger's own parents after bomb making materials arrived at their doorstep.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF SAM PARKER, CHESTERFIELD COUNTY, SOUTH CAROLINA: He's admitted to some of our investigators and myself that he's -- in the past, he's experimented with pipe bombs and trying to -- in the experimental stage of making explosive devices. The community right now is devastated. This is one of these young guys that it just doesn't happen. We just don't see it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, police say Shallenberger's journals suggest he planned a Columbine-style suicide attack. He's expected in court tomorrow for a bail hearing.

DE LA CRUZ: The victim of a freak accident in Lake Michigan is reportedly doing better. A powerful gust of wind sent a 2-year-old boy in the lake on Friday, while strapped in his stroller. The boy's grandfather jumped in the 42 degree water, trying to save him. By the time both were rescued, the boy had been submerged for at least 15 minutes. A witness describes the frantic scene.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CEDRIC RAMOS, WITNESS: We saw this man floating in the war. And first I was just -- I thought, you know, he got hypothermia. He was confused. But he was saying there's a child in the water, there's a child. And I saw the sippy cup, you know, a child's sippy cup.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DE LA CRUZ: The grandfather is in stable condition and the child is improving. According to his grandmother, though, the hospital won't comment.

LEMON: Wow!

We wish them the best.

DE LA CRUZ: Yes, we do.

LEMON: Walking on shaky ground -- another earthquake rattles the Midwest, the 18th in three days.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DE LA CRUZ: Here we go again. That's probably what some folks in Southern Illinois were thinking early this morning when the ground started shaking early this morning. It was one of the strongest aftershocks so far since Friday's earthquake. This one, a magnitude 4.5, was just five miles from Mt. Carmel, where the quake was centered.

Aftershocks, drenching rains, snow -- it's a bit of everything on this spring day.

LEMON: Yes.

DE LA CRUZ: Chad Myers joins us now from the CNN Weather Center.

So, Chad, it's kind of this weather potpourri, if you will.

(WEATHER REPORT)

LEMON: All right.

Let's talk about a winner here -- smashing barriers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Boys, move over. The lady is coming through. Danica Patrick wins a Twin Ring Montegi.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, there you go. He told the story. Over the weekend, Danica Patrick became the first female ever to win an IndyCar race. Patrick grabbed the checkered flag almost six seconds ahead of the pole sitter.

On "AMERICAN MORNING" earlier today, she talked about those tears of joy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "AMERICAN MORNING")

DANICA PATRICK, FIRST FEMALE INDY CAR WINNER: I was really happy and then I just kind of let it all out. And I didn't let it all out as loud as my mom did, but I let it all out and in a different way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So how did Patrick do it?

Well, while everyone else was making last minute pit stops to refuel, Patrick pushed her car to the limit on her last gallon of gas. Good for her. Congratulations.

DE LA CRUZ: Congratulations.

LEMON: Yes.

Well, he took a commanding lead at Boston's Heartbreak Hill and never looked back. Kenyan Robert Cheruiyot won his fourth Boston Marathon today. On the women's side, Ethiopian Dire Tune took top honors.

Why couldn't they have names like Bob Jones? Took top honors. Some 25,000 athletes are taking part in today's 112th running of the marathon. And it's the richest purse ever, with nearly $800,000 up for grabs.

Congratulations to all of them.

DE LA CRUZ: Yes, congratulations to all them.

LEMON: Robert Cheruiyot and Ethiopian Dire Tune.

DE LA CRUZ: Dire Tune. Yes.

LEMON: Yes.

DE LA CRUZ: There you go.

LEMON: Very exciting.

DE LA CRUZ: Congratulations

Well, the closing bell and a wrap of all the action on Wall Street. It is all straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Wow! A royal 41-gun salute at London's Hyde Park in honor of Queen Elizabeth. The British monarch is 82 today. She's 82, which makes her the oldest person ever to reign in Britain. The queen is spending her birthday at Windsor Castle, where she's having a private celebration with some family members.

She's 82-years-old.

DE LA CRUZ: Eighty-two years old. And I thought you were going to tell us the story with a British accent.

LEMON: I -- no.

DE LA CRUZ: Did you pass on that?

LEMON: I'll leave that for...

DE LA CRUZ: For Wolf, maybe?

LEMON: No. Not for Wolf. I'll leave it for Susan Lisovicz.

Time to check in now with CNN's Wolf Blitzer. I wouldn't put that much pressure on him.

DE LA CRUZ: Yes. Well, we'll see. He's standing by in "THE SITUATION ROOM" in New York to tell us what's coming up at the top of the hour -- hey, Wolf.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, guys, thanks very much. And thanks for not putting me under that kind of pressure. Countdown to the Pennsylvania primary -- 28 hours to go until the polls close. One-on-one with Hillary Clinton's campaign chairman, Terry McAuliffe. That's coming up -- what keeps her in the race and whether some of their tactics might be helping Republicans. We'll discuss.

Former President Jimmy Carter talks with CNN about his meeting with Islamic militants and what Hamas says it will take to take to create a lasting peace in the region.

And she's known for her moves and now she's shaking up world leaders when it comes to global education. Today, we're talking to the pop star, Shakira.

She's here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

All that guys, coming up right at the top of the hour.

LEMON: Uh-oh, Wolf and Shakira. I can't wait to see that.

Do you know which hour that's going to be in, Wolf?

BLITZER: You're going to have to wait and see.

(LAUGHTER)

BLITZER: We've got three hours of excellent television coming up.

LEMON: I will be watching, Wolf. That's a great tease.

OK, thank you, sir.

DE LA CRUZ: Thanks.

All right, a final check at what's on CNN.com.

Nothing like a moonlit walk on the beach when the fish are out spawning. Take a look at these pictures. Some nighttime strollers shot video of this strange sight. You can take a closer look for yourself at CNN.com.

And Prince William has stirred up a fuss by making personal use of a military transport helicopter. He used it to take his brother, Don, to a party. He later touched down in his significant other's backyard. Some are suggesting the chopper might work equally well in Afghanistan.

Also of interest today, a woman who lost nearly 250 pounds. Dr. Sanjay Gupta has the story of the surgery that may have saved her life.

You can check out all these stories and much more at CNN.com.

LEMON: Wow! Interesting stuff at CNN.com.

DE LA CRUZ: Well, the closing bell is about to ring on Wall Street.

LEMON: Susan Lisovicz is standing by with a final look at the trading day.

Susan, good or bad news?

LISOVICZ: Oh...

LEMON: A mixed bag.

LISOVICZ: It's challenging. It's...

LEMON: Oh, man.

LISOVICZ: These are tough times.

LEMON: Yes.

LISOVICZ: I thought -- I thought you were going to ask me to speak the queen's English.

DE LA CRUZ: A British accent, please.

LEMON: Can you do it?

LISOVICZ: Hello, love.

(LAUGHTER)

LISOVICZ: I think that's cockney. I don't think -- I don't think that is queen approved.

LEMON: I'm embarrassed for you, Susan.

LISOVICZ: Yes, I'm embarrassed for...

(CROSSTALK)

LISOVICZ: I'm embarrassed for me, too. It just shaves off a few seconds of the painful reality of crude oil settling at a new record high, just under $117.50 a barrel.

Which brings us to United. It is changing the change fee to $150 from $100, also two thirds of its routes will now require a Saturday night stay over. Who is that going to hurt the most? Business travelers. And they are the most lucrative aspect of travel for most airlines.

There's the closing bell. Kind of a mix day for the markets. Tomorrow is Earth Day. We're going to talk about a lot of new energy sources that hopefully will take all the pain away.

See you guys then.

DE LA CRUZ: See you then, Susan. Thanks so much.

LEMON: Now it's time to turn it over to "THE SITUATION ROOM" and Mr. Wolf Blitzer.

Take it away, Wolf.