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Ballot Bowl 2008

Following the Campaigns as They Prepare for Indiana and North Carolina

Aired May 03, 2008 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN CENTER: Well, you may have heard about the big race in Kentucky, or maybe not. For some, it's bedtime, but don't try and get a nap, or you just might wipe out. Yes, seeing is believing here -- 50 teams took part in the derby week bed races in Louisville, Kentucky. It's the 19th annual running of this event. The team from the Ford Assembly Plant posted the best times. No one was asleep at the wheel and yes, there is a race of another kind later on today for horses, of course, it's the 134th running of the Kentucky Derby.
All right from the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Fredricka Whitfield. Watch the bottom of your screen. That's where we are tracking the caucus results from Guam. Next, the latest numbers and the candidates unfiltered, CNN's BALLOT BOWL begins right now.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: Welcome to another round of BALLOT BOWL '08. I'm Jim Acosta in Mooresville, North Carolina, coming to you from the North Carolina Auto Racing Hall of Fame where Hillary Clinton will be holding a rally in about a couple of hours from now. She is speaking live in front of supporters in Gastonia, North Carolina; you may be wondering why she's hitting the North Carolina voters so hard this weekend. That is because the race according to the polls out there, showing that Hillary Clinton has at least narrowed the gap somewhat.

Barack Obama had a sizable lead in this state but Hillary Clinton has managed to cut into that. And we're going to get to that event in just a minute here. But just to let you know what's coming up here on BALLOT BOWL, I'll be getting to my colleague, CNN senior political analyst Bill Schneider in just a moment, but first, we want to take you live to Gastonia, North Carolina, where Hillary Clinton is talking about the issues that are facing the voters in this state. She's been talking about the economy at many of her campaign stops and the issue of the gas tax holiday has been the hot issue, the hot button issue out on the campaign trail throughout this week.

Hillary Clinton in favor of a gas tax holiday to take effect this summer for hard-hit North Carolina and Indiana voters and folks across the country for that matter. Without further adieu, let's get to Hillary Clinton talking about these issues right now in front of supporters in Gastonia, North Carolina

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDIATE: And then we've got to take on OPEC. We have been acting like we have no control over our future. Because we've gotten our selves in this position. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, three times, four times, shame on me. We've had plenty of opportunities, none of which we've been willing to take. Other countries have. So I would file a complaint against the OPEC group, WTO, I would also change our laws so that we could sue them for antitrust, because it's not a fair fight. If you can get into a room a couple of times a year and decide how much oil you're going to produce and what you're going to charge for it and nobody has any control over there, no regulation over that, no free market supply and demand over there, that's a pretty sweet deal.

So we've got to stand up and fight back here. I think it's important to look at what other countries have done. Other countries are way ahead of us. You know, a decade or so ago, Iceland, a small island nation in the north Atlantic, one of the poorest places, why? Because they had import all of their oil, their gas and their coal for electricity, one day they woke up and said wait a minute, there's got to be a better way. Too much of our economy is going into paying for stuff that comes from somewhere else. So they got to work. And they discovered they had geothermal energy under Iceland and they tapped into it.

Between geothermal and hydro, they're 100 percent free from importing oil and coal. They're now moving towards hydrogen to fuel their vehicles. You go to Brazil, you would buy an American car, American brand car that was flex fuel, you would pull up to any gas station in Brazil, and you would fill it up with a combination of sugar cane ethanol and gasoline. They are now energy independent. We need to act in the short run to deal with these outrageous gas prices. I would give you a gas holiday and we need to deal in the long run to get ourselves energy independence.

Now, I know, look, I understand my opponent disagrees with me, he doesn't want to give you a gas holiday, he doesn't want to go after the oil companies, he wouldn't vote against them with the 2005 Dick Cheney energy bill and I did. So that's a big difference. I tell you another difference. When people have been hurting all year because of home foreclosures, a year ago, I said let's go after these unscrupulous mortgage brokers and then I said let's freeze, let's put a moratorium on home foreclosure, let's freeze interest rate, let's try to help people stay in their homes instead of being forced into foreclosure, which is not only bad for them but the neighborhoods they're part of.

Empty houses attract crime; it lowers house values for everybody. I said freeze those interest rates and moratorium I asked for. My opponent said no, won't do that either. The biggest difference is on health care. I think every American is entitled to quality affordable health care. So I have a plan that would cover everybody. If you have health insurance and you're happy with it, nothing would change. But if you're uninsured or your insurance costs too much or it doesn't cover you, you're going to have the same opportunity those members of Congress and federal employees do.

They go into a real good plan. It covers 9 million of your fellow Americans and you pay 75 percent of the cost. I figure it if it's good enough for members of Congress its good enough for you. And we are going to make that available to you. Well, my opponent doesn't want to give you universal health care, he leaves 15 million people out. That is not a smart idea because it continues to drive people to emergency rooms. That means those of us with insurance pay a hidden tax to take care of those who finally get taken care of because there's nowhere else for them to go.

So on important issues like how much it costs at the gas pump, how much it costs in health care, whether you can get some relief from the unscrupulous predatory lending practices of the mortgage brokers. I think I'm on your side and I think you can count on me to fight for you. I believe we need a president starting in January 2009 who's going to be there for the American people again. Now there's a lot we have to do. And I am well aware it's a tough job. Toughest job in the world probably. It's going to be especially hard after President Bush and Vice President Cheney leave. You know, I tell you what; the world is going to breathe a big sigh of relief when that moving van pulls out of the back of the White House.

Oh, I love campaigning. I love being out here on a spring afternoon talking about what's important to us. Because you know, the real strength of America is in our people. But it does matter who our president is. If anybody ever doubted that, the last seven years should have convinced you otherwise. You know, occasionally during this campaign, I hear people; my opponent and others criticize the 1990s. That's fair, in a campaign you can say anything, whether it's actual or no. But during the 1990s, we created nearly 23 million new jobs. We had more people lifted out of the poverty than at any time in our nation's history and we ended up with a balanced budget and a surplus that was going to get us through a good positive fiscal responsible future.

So when I hear people criticize the '90s, I always wonder, what didn't they like, the peace or the prosperity? Because I thought we were on the right track with both. So we've got to start solving our problems. On the economy, I'm absolutely confident we can start creating jobs again. We lost 20,000 more jobs last month. Some of the editorial writers and the newspaper columns, they said that was so much better than anybody thought. I tell you what, losing 20,000 job, when that's seen as a good sign, that shows you how much trouble we're in. Here's what I would do. We need to play both defense and offense. On defense, we have to go through that tax code and get rid of any of those remaining benefits that exports a job out of North Carolina to a foreign country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: So there you have it, Hillary Clinton standing there with North Carolina Governor Mike Easily. If you just noticed there as that picture zoomed out, Hillary Clinton standing in the back of what we understand as a red 1956 pickup truck. Emphasis there, I suppose you might say, on her campaign issue, her top campaign issue this past week in North Carolina and in Indiana, the high gas prices. And her solution for that temporarily which would be to have a gas tax holiday. So there have you Hillary Clinton offering a vigorous defense of that policy proposal as well as others there in Gastonia, North Carolina. We'll check back in with Hillary Clinton in just a few moments, but I want to bring in my colleague CNN senior political analyst Bill Schneider who is standing live in Indianapolis as we speak. Bill, we just saw Hillary Clinton standing in the back of a red pickup truck there in North Carolina. That's not a bad platform there.

In the old days, I guess, they used to stand on actual stumps, but the back of a pickup truck is not bad when you're campaigning in North Carolina. Bill, what do you make of the race as it stands now? It is tightening in North Carolina. And I suppose that explains why she's in this state this weekend.

BILL SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: That's right. She's not conceding anything. She is campaigning tirelessly. Her voice is about to give out. In North Carolina a state where Barack Obama has been leading in every single poll, but that lead seems to be very slowly diminishing. This lead has gone into single digits. Our poll of polls shows him now with a nine-point lead it had been ten points and higher. It's very slowly diminishing.

She sees an opportunity there if she were to win the primary on Tuesday in North Carolina and here in Indiana where it's very, very close. The poll of polls shows it neck and neck in Indiana if she were to win both races, that's what she meant when she said next week's primaries could be a game changer. That would shift everything because then it would demonstrate coming out of Ohio and Pennsylvania, she really has momentum, the super delegates that would give them a lot of pause; they might start jumping over to her side. It could create a crisis in the party because Obama still leads in pledge delegates, but it would be the game changer that she's been talking about.

ACOSTA: We've heard Hillary Clinton go back to this issue again of the gas tax holiday. And what is your sense, Bill, as to how that is working with voters? Barack Obama has held firm to his opposition to the gas tax holiday. Is this a proposal that might do well for Hillary Clinton in these two primaries coming up?

SCHNEIDER: Well, I'm not sure it's going to make a huge difference because we're not talking about a permanent change or a vast amount of money, but it might do her some good in sewing up her support among those working class voters. Particularly white working class voters who are very much in contest between Obama and Clinton. She did well with them in Ohio and Pennsylvania. She hopes to do well here in Indiana. Her answer is the populous answer as it is for John McCain, because he takes the same position in favor of a gas tax holiday.

Obama's position is the one that most sophisticated analysts and economists would support. Namely that it won't mean much, it won't work at all. They'll just jack up the prices and at best, it's a temporary fix, not a real solution to the problem. But for those voters really being hurt by these gas prices that issue our polling shows is the number one issue. It shows I'm going to deliver for you, I'm going to do something and you're going to feel it right now. So it communicates a very powerful message to that constituency that's hurting. ACOSTA: As you're standing on the back of the pickup truck there to deliver that message, in a couple of hours from now, she'll be in the North Carolina Auto Racing Hall of Fame, I think there's a theme emerging here this weekend for the Clinton campaign, we'll get back to that later on here in on BALLOT BOWL. Bill Schneider thanks very much. Joining us live from Indianapolis in front of the CNN Election Express.

We want to get you caught up to speed now on what is happening out in Guam. As far as we know, those results are still coming in with 79 percent of the returns in so far, Barack Obama is still holding on to a lead in that state. It appears that he has 43 percent of the vote right now to Clinton's 47 percent of the vote. Barack Obama holding a bit of a home field advantage there or a least a home ocean advantage having grown up in the Hawaiian Islands, not too far as the crow flies from Guam. Fairly far, but not that far. For Barack Obama, he's looking to wrap up a victory there with four delegates at stake there in the territory of Guam.

Coming up after a break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN, we will check in with the senator from Illinois as he is campaigning this weekend hard, trying to pull out a victory, an important victory in the state of Indiana. Stick with us this is BALLOT BOWL on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Welcome back to BALLOT BOWL '08. I'm Jim Acosta in Mooresville, North Carolina, home of the North Carolina Auto Racing Hall of Fame where Hillary Clinton will be speaking in a couple of hours.

We want to keep you up to speed on the returns coming in from Guam. As every delegate counts, this U.S. territory is going to be not -- we shouldn't say significant, but is certainly going to be a factor in this campaign. Because obviously one of these candidates would like to have a delegate edge in Guam. It's uncertain whether or not that will happen. Barack Obama leading at this point, 53-47 with the returns coming in 79 percent of the returns coming in. So keep an eye on the bottom of your screen as you're watching BALLOT BOWL, you'll get to keep up on the latest returns coming in from the territory of Guam. So we will keep an eye on that as well.

We now want to switch gears to Barack Obama, who is in Indiana this weekend, he is spending much of his time in the Hoosier state because obviously he is doing reasonably well here in North Carolina from a campaign standpoint, and the polls generally show him ahead. Our CNN poll of polls as Bill Schneider just mentioned a few moments ago, shows Obama with a nine nine-point lead. In Indiana, had it is a dead heat, as Bill Schneider mentioned, Barack Obama would definitely like to pick up a win in that state, it's the neighboring state to his home state of Illinois.

We expect to see Barack Obama sort of reintroducing himself to voters throughout the weekend here. He talked about his humble upbringing earlier today in a speech in Indianapolis. We will be getting to that in just a moment. He is also expected to speak live at another event in just a few moments here. We'll get to that shortly but we want to mention that Barack Obama as he's out on the campaign trail this weekend, you're going to see something we haven't seen in some time, since Iowa, according to our embedded producer Chris Welsh, with the Obama campaign. Barack Obama will be campaigning with both of his daughters, Melia and Sasha this weekend, we saw them coming off the Obama campaign in Indianapolis earlier today.

But now we want to get to Barack Obama campaigning in Indianapolis earlier today he gave his what he called his closing arguments speech. During that speech, he touched on a lot of things, but was hitting the issue of the economy hard, talked about gas taxes, so let's get to that right now. This is Barack Obama talking about the big issues facing voters in Indiana. This is from his speech earlier today in Indianapolis.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Those special interests that keep us from bringing down the cost of our premiums and our prescriptions. Keep us from investing in renewable fuels. We can't afford to settle for a Washington where politicians only focus on how to win instead of why they should. Where they check the poll before they check their gut. Where they only tell us whatever we weren't to hear whenever we want to hear it. That kind of politics may get them where they need to go, but it doesn't get America where we need it go. It won't change anything.

Some of you might have seen that Senator Clinton is spending a lot of money on a television ad that attacks me for not supporting her and John McCain's idea of a gas tax holiday for the summer. Mike mentioned this in his introduction. Now, keep in mind this is an idea that will save you altogether half a tank of gas, 30 cents a day for three months. That's if the oil companies don't simply jack up their price to fill the gap as they've done when this was tried before. Does anyone here really trust the oil companies to give you the savings when they could just pocket the money themselves?

There's not an expert out there who believes that this is going to work. There's not an editorial out there that has said this is actually the answer to high gas prices. In fact, my understanding is today Senator Clinton had to send out a surrogate to speak on behalf of this plan and all she could find was, get this, a lobbyist for Shell Oil. To explain how this was going to be good for consumers. It's a Shell game, literally. In a moment of candor, her advisers admitted it wouldn't have much of an effect on gas prices but they said, it's a great political issue for Senator Clinton. It's not about getting you through the summer, it's about getting elected. This is what passes for leadership in Washington, phony ideas, calculated to win elections, instead of actually solving problems.

Now, Senator Clinton and Senator McCain have been using this idea to make the argument that I'm somehow out of touch. Well let me tell you, only in Washington can you get away with calling someone out of touch when you're the only one who thinks that 30 cents a day is enough to help people who are struggling in this economy. So let me tell you what I think. I think the American people are smarter than Washington gives us credit for. I think, I think the American people are smarter than Washington gives them credit for. I mean, yes they are hurting. I mean folks every day, seeing $100 out of their monthly income because of these rising gas price, yes, they want some relief, but they understand that we've got to fix this problem once and for all.

I wish I could stand up here and tell you that we could fix our energy problems with a holiday. I wish I could tell you that we could take a time-out from trade and bring back the jobs that have gone overseas. I wish I could promise that on day one of my presidency, I could pass every plan and proposal I've outlined in this campaign. But my guess is you've heard those promises before. You hear them every year and every election. And afterwards, when everyone has gone back to Washington, the game playing and the influence peddling and petty bickering continues. Nothing gets done.

And four years later, you're right back, making the very same promises about the very same problems. I mean this isn't the first time this gas tax holiday has come up. It comes up every two years right before election time, because somebody thinks this is going to be good politic, but it doesn't solve the problem. Well, this year, you have a choice. If you want to take another chance on the same kind of politics we've come to know in Washington, other candidates to choose from. But I still believe we need to fundamentally change Washington if we want to change America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: So there you have it. Barack Obama sharpening the rhetoric, talking about Senator Clinton's proposal about a gas tax holiday. Barack Obama slamming that proposal noting that Hillary Clinton has had one of her surrogates out there, Steve Elmendorf, a lobbyist who was a supporter of her campaign, he was on CNN this past week, touting that proposal. Elmendorf, who is also a lobbyist for Shell Oil. And Barack Obama noting that there may be some hypocrisy there.

We've noted that the Clinton campaign has already responded to that attack coming from Barack Obama. An e-mail coming to us here at CNN from Phil Singer, a spokesman for the Hillary Clinton campaign, noting that Barack Obama has supported a gas tax holiday in the past but is not doing so this time around.

I want to bring in CNN senior political analyst Bill Schneider who is joining us live again from Indianapolis. We heard Hillary Clinton also sharpening the knives there at that event in Gastonia, North Carolina, Bill, we saw this pattern emerging right before the Pennsylvania primary, I guess the expression since I'm in a NASCAR Hall of Fame building here, the expression in NASCAR is rubbing is racing, suggesting that it is a contact sport. So is politics. I guess that's what we're seeing this weekend, Bill.

SCHNEIDER: That's right. It is very much a contact sport. And it couldn't be any closer here in Indiana, where the latest polls show a tie between Clinton and Obama. This is a state right next to Illinois. His home state where he's a senator. A lot of Indiana voters, particularly up in the northwestern part of Indiana watch Chicago television. He's a very familiar figure almost a local. So that is making this state extremely competitive.

ACOSTA: Bill Schneider thanks very much. Joining us live from Indianapolis. Bill, we'll check back in with you later, we're going it take a quick break now, but coming up after the break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN, we'll switch to the Republican side of this race and check in with John McCain. And his proposal on health care. That is coming up after a break; this is BALLOT BOWL on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Welcome back to BALLOT BOWL '08. I'm Jim Acosta in Mooresville, North Carolina, where Hillary Clinton will be speaking to a big crowd of supporters here at the North Carolina Auto Racing Hall of Fame we weren't to switch gears and head to the Republican side and check in with John McCain who has been spending a considerable amount of time in recent days hitting some battleground states. He's been campaigning in Pennsylvania and Ohio, and Iowa and we have some sound now from Senator McCain hitting the campaign trail in Cleveland, Ohio, where he talked about his proposal for health care.

Senator McCain has come under some criticism from Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, as not showing enough detail when it comes to his healthcare proposal. But John McCain says not so fast, he also is concerned about this issue, he says, and he's got some solutions for it, according to his campaign. So, here's John McCain talking about the issue of healthcare in Cleveland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There are those who are convinced that the solution is to move closer to a nationalized healthcare system. They urge universal coverage with all the tax increases, new mandates and government regulation that come along with that idea.

But in the end, this will accomplish only one thing, we will replace the inefficiency, irrationality and controlled costs of the current system with the inefficiency, irrationality and controlled costs of a government monopoly. That's what we will do.

(APPLAUSE)

And by the way, the next time you think that the government should take over the healthcare system in America, go to our airport and go through security. Anyway -- we have...

We have all the problems and more of private healthcare. Rigid rules, long waits and lack of choices and risk degrading and great strengths and advantages including innovation and life saving technology that makes American medicine the most advanced in the world. I have a different vision.

The key to real reform is to restore control over our healthcare system and restore it to the patients themselves, which is what you are doing here at Cleveland Clinic. Right now, even those with access to healthcare often have no assurance it's the appropriate care, too much, too much of the system is built on getting paid just for providing services regardless of whether those services are necessary or produce quality care and outcomes.

American families should only pay for getting the right care, care that is intended to improve and safeguard their health. When families are informed about medical choices, they're more capable of making their own decisions, less likely to choose the most expensive and often unnecessary options and are more satisfied with their choices.

But for every American who wanted it, another option would be available. Every year, they would refer a $5,000 tax credit directly, directly with the same cash value of the credits for employees in big companies, in small business or self-employed. You simply choose the insurance provider that suits you best. By mail or online, you would then inform the government of your selection and money to help pay for your healthcare would be sent straight to that insurance provider.

The healthcare plan you choose would be as good as any that an employer could choose for you, it gives you the choose, it would be yours and your family's healthcare plan and yours to keep. I have also pledged to meet with the governors to solicit their ideas about the best way to provide insurance to those who are denied coverage under current practices.

I'll build a guaranteed access plan, or GAP, that will reflect the best experiences of the states. I'll work with Congress, with the governors and industry to make sure that it's funded adequately and has the right incentives to reduce costs such as disease management, individual case management and health and wellness programs.

My reform will change the practice of medicine in America. We know from experience that coordinated care, providers collaborating to produce the best health outcome, offers better quality and certainly costs less.

We should pay a single bill, a single bill for high quality disease care, not an endless series of bills for presurgical tests and visit, hospitalization and surgery and follow-up tests, drugs and office visits. Paying for coordinated care means that every single provider is now united in being responsive to the needs of a single person, the patient.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: So there you have it, John McCain on the issue of healthcare rejecting proposals for a government-run universal healthcare system. John McCain talking about his healthcare plan there is in front of a big crowd there in Cleveland, Ohio.

And coming up after a break, here on BALLOT BOWL, on CNN, we'll check in with Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and their plans for the economy. More on that, as I'm joined here by 500 of my closest friends, here in Mooresville, North Carolina, including this woman here, who found this pink Hillary Clinton t-shirt outside this event, here.

How much did you pay for that?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fifteen dollars.

ACOSTA: Fifteen dollars. And you're here to see Hillary Clinton, why?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because I think it's time for a woman to be president.

ACOSTA: There you go, simple as that, a little North Carolina straight forwardness, coming up after a break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN. Stick with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Welcome back to BALLOT BOWL on CNN. I'm Jim Acosta in Mooresville, North Carolina. We want to switch back to the Democratic side now and get back to those bread and butter domestic issues that are defining this campaign. We've talked a lot about the economy and healthcare in this hour, but now we want to get to the ever-increasing costs of higher education and we have some sound now from Hillary Clinton. She was campaigning earlier today in Wake Forest, North Carolina and she went right after those companies that offer student loans to students in college saying that many students today, and Barack Obama has also touched on this, that both of these candidates have both said that students out there today are getting gouged by these companies that provide student loans, so here is Hillary Clinton talking about making college more affordable on the stump in Wake Forest, North Carolina.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're also going to make sure education remains the passport to opportunity, starting with preschool and I commend the governor for his emphasis on, you know, "More by Four" and all of the work that's been done.

The evidence is overwhelming. If you have good quality preschool programs, you will cut the achievement gap by 50 percent by the time someone gets to the end of high school. It is not even debatable any longer. It is one of the best investments we can make. And I know that it's manage that as president I would help states do, because I'm going to end No Child Left Behind and that unfunded mandate.

(APPLAUSE)

You know, the federal government only pays 10 percent of the cost of public education, 90 percent is the states and local governments, right? So why don't we use that 10 percent to actually produce better results, like helping with preschool education, kindergarten. We could do all of that.

We're also going to make college afford affordable again. It is not affordable for most middle class families right now. The cost of college has gone up 70 percent in this decade. Student loan burden has gone up 50 percent. Kids are being shut out of going to college. They're being forced to quit because they can't keep up with the costs. And they are facing incredible debt if they do graduate. So, let's double the college tax credits, so you have more of your money to invest in your child's education, let's expand the Pell Grant and tie it to the increasing cost in higher education. Let's make sure that we end that financial aid form known as FAFSA one of the cruelest hoaxes that families have to face. Let's offer national service and greater quantity so young people can do a year of national service and earn up to $10,000 that goes right into their college costs, but then we got to take on the student loan industry because they are charging outrageous rates of interest.

We went around yesterday, the governor and I and people were calling out 22 percent, 25 percent. That's not unusual at all. When I went to college, 100 years ago, my dad could pay for that with room, board and tuition, but I had to work to earn the money for everything else. And then when I went to law school, my dad said we can't do that, so I kept working, got a little scholarship, but I mostly got through by borrowing money from the federal government at two or three percent interest, it was low interest rate and it had a contingency repayment feature. In other words, you paid back as a percentage of your income. So, when I graduated from law school, I could go to work for the Children's Defense Fund, as a lawyer working for abused and neglected kids and kid without healthcare or education and kids in the foster care system, because I could pay back a contingent percentage of my income. I want to offer that to everybody.

And for people who graduate with debt, we're going to help you pay that debt off. We'll help you refinance your debt...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And so there have you it, Hillary Clinton on the subject of making college more affordable. Coming up after the break here, on BALLOT BOWL, on CNN, we'll switch back to the Barack Obama campaign and check in with senior political analyst Bill Schneider. That's after a break. This is BALLOT BOWL on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCHNEIDER: I'm Bill Schneider in Indianapolis, Indiana, where this race is hot and heavy. All tied up. And tonight, Hillary Clinton, whose, during the day today, in North Carolina, she will be back here in Indiana tonight with a big rally here in Indianapolis.

The big issue in the debate in this campaign, the gas tax. Hillary Clinton, and for that matter, the Republican candidate, John McCain, both favor a gas tax holiday. Barack Obama opposes it. He says it's a gimmick, it will not fix the problem and it won't mean much to the ordinary driver who will only save about 30 cents a day. Let's listen to what Barack Obama said yesterday in Munster, Indiana, as he criticized the Clinton proposal for a gas tax holiday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Make no mistake about it, this is more than just a paycheck at stake, it's whether we as a country are going to just honor wealth or whether we're going to honor work and workers who create work.

(APPLAUSE)

Now, a big part of the reason so many Americans are struggling is that the rules of the game have been rigged against ordinary Americans. For too long, through Democratic and Republican administrations, we've seen corporate lobbyists use their clout to get their way no matter what the costs in places like Munster. They've stopped Congress from passing measures that might have pr prevented the housing crisis. They've blocked universal healthcare, they've pushed lopsided trade deals that hurt American workers even if they're good for corporate profits. They've written our energy laws to keep us dependent on foreign oil.

That's why I fought to rein in the power of lobbyists throughout my career by passing far reaching ethics reform in Illinois and in Washington. That's why I'm the only candidate who doesn't take a dime of money from Washington lobbyists. They have not funded my campaign, they will not run our White House. They will not drown out the voice of the American people when I'm president of the United States of America.

(APPLAUSE)

But understand, the problem in Washington isn't just the undue influence of lobbyists. It's that our politics has become more about scoring points than solving problems. We got a good example of this lately, some of you may have been following if it in the news with the so-called "gas tax holiday" that Senator McCain and Senator Clinton have proposed.

At best, this plan would save you 30 cents a day, temporarily for three months. A quarter and a nickel can't even buy a cup of coffee at the 7-Eleven, 30 cents a day for three months for a grand total of $28 in savings. And you would only get those savings if the only companies don't decide to go ahead and jack up their prices to fill the gap of whatever was left after the tax was suspended.

Which, by the way, is exactly what happened in Illinois when we tried this a few years ago. I know because I voted for a bill to suspend it for a while. We had to repeal it six months later because the savings hadn't been passed onto you.

Just this morning, there was an article in the newspaper showing how the real beneficiaries of a tax holiday would be the oil companies who would walk away with billions more in profits, this is at a time when Exxon mobile made $11 billion in profits last quarter and $11 billion in profits the quarter before that. Meanwhile, unless you can magically impose a windfall profit tax on oil companies overnight to pay for the tax holiday, it would take money out of the federal highway trust fund that we use to rebuild roads and bridge, which by the way, is the thing that Jean (ph) says we need to do if we want to keep people working here at Munster Steel, rebuilding the infrastructure of this country, our road, our bridge, our lots, our dams, that uses steel, that puts people back to work.

(APPLAUSE)

We could lose 6,000 jobs if our highway trust fund wasn't in place. Right here in Indiana, the two Washington candidates in the race have been attacking me because I don't support their idea. In fact, yesterday Senator Clinton demanded that everyone go on the record on this issue. That's what she said. She even borrowed one of Bush's favorite phrases. She said every member of Congress needs to tell her whether you're with her or against her, that's what she said.

Well let me tell you, the people have weighed in. You know what? It turns out that the people want to be on the side of the American people, they don't want to be for some political gimmick.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHNEIDER: That was Barack Obama talking about his opposition to the gas tax proposal made by Hillary Clinton. He was speaking in Munster, Indiana, yesterday. He'll be back here in Indiana, Monday evening for a big rally right, here on the grounds of the War Memorial in Indianapolis, where I am now standing. The primary in Indiana is on Tuesday, but there is a caucus going on right now, today, in, of all places, Guam, just 9,000 miles away from here. I don't think our Election Express bus is going to make it in time for dinner, but we'll be back to talk about it just a few minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Welcome back to BALLOT BOWL on CNN. And for those political junk it's out there who thought that the next contest coming up were on Tuesday in North Carolina and Indiana, surprise, you may have woken up today and found a different contest at the bottom of your screen. Yes, Guam is weighing in, the territory out there in the Pacific that does get to vote in the Democratic nomination process. And let's go back out to Bill Schneider, our CNN senior political analyst.

And Bill, why does Guam matter?

SCHNEIDER: Because of momentum, not because of its delegates. It's only got four pledged delegates, plus a few superdelegates and it's a very small delegation to the convention, but each candidate wants to show that he or she has momentum. Hillary Clinton won Pennsylvania last week, if she were to win Guam, she'd say the momentum is with her going into those big primaries on Tuesday. Barack Obama needs a comeback, he lost Ohio, he lost Pennsylvania, and he believes if he wins Guam, that at least that will be a sign that he's on the comeback trail.

ACOSTA: And Guam being a caucus, they can participate in the nomination process, but can't vote in the presidential election. Does Barack Obama, and this is somewhat facetious here, Bill, have a home ocean advantage being from Hawaii. SCHNEIDER: He from Hawaii and people think Guam, Hawaii the same neighborhood. They are thousands of miles apart. It is 3,000 or 4,000 miles from Hawaii to Guam. They are nowhere near each other.

But it's an interesting thing, people are asking all the time, places like Puerto Rico and Guam, they can participate in the nomination process, in both political parties, because Guamanians, that is what they're called, are in facts American citizens. So, they get to participate in the nomination of the candidates, but they're not a state. Only states have electoral votes, therefore in November, when it comes time to elect a president, Guam is not a state and it doesn't have a special exception, like the District of Columbia, which is treated like a state, so people who live in Guam, while they're American, they cannot vote in the presidential election. They can, however, participate in the primaries in both parties.

ACOSTA: Bill Schneider, thanks very much. All we needed to know about Guam and then some, including what they're called in Guam, I wasn't quite aware of that. Bill Schneider, thanks very much. We appreciate it.

SCHNEIDER: Sure.

ACOSTA: And coming up after a break, we have CNN NEWSROOMS coming up at 4:00 and then in the 5:00 hour, more BALLOT BOWL, so you'll want to come back to us as we are keeping track of the two candidates out on the campaign trail -- Hillary Clinton here in North Carolina. Barack Obama in Indiana. Stick with us for all the political coverage you need right here on CNN. Thanks for watching.