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American Morning
Growing Humanitarian Disaster in Myanmar; Both Campaigns in Full Force to Get Votes; Senate Hearing Looks at Mortgage Lenders
Aired May 06, 2008 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL BENNETT, HOST, "BILL BENNETT'S MORNING IN AMERICA": But if were a Republican had said that, if McCain had said that, we'd be hearing about cowboy diplomacy and the Ronald Reagan bombs away and all that kind of thing.
It's very strong but she said if they invade Israel, this is the consequence. I think it was actually not a bad thing for her to say. I've been arguing all along, John, that she should have moved to the center-right of her party, been a moderate throughout and hawkish on foreign policy. But I think that might have helped her.
They've discovered that route but it maybe -- it maybe too late. What it does to ask certain other elements in the party, obviously, is not going to be good. I doubt that those comments went over in Capitol Hill.
But remember how many rural white voters there are in North Carolina. People think all white folks in the south have emigrated to the Republican Party. They haven't. There are still a lot of people there. And I think Bill Clinton's talking to them as well as Hillary. So, that might have worked in gathering the numbers up.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: And Bill, as it is every year, this again in November is going to be a battle for independents for those swing voters. John McCain has got a lot of appeal with those independents.
BENNETT: Right.
Who do you think is better positioned on the Democratic side to attract those independents, Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama?
BENNETT: I think Hillary Clinton. And John, you and I have been talking all year, you know, three, four months ago, we wanted to run against Hillary Clinton. Now, I think the Republicans would prefer to run against Barack Obama partly because of the appeal there. Yes, I definitely think so. I think he's been wounded.
And if the elections are decided by those swing voters, John, you just described, that's what's brought Hillary over the finish line in Ohio and Pennsylvania. And I think this is what will bring her over the finish line in Indiana.
North Carolina is a different story. I think he got 35 -- 35 percent of the North Carolina Democratic Party is African-American. That's too big a hill for her to climb. ROBERTS: And Bill, give us a little bit of a look-ahead of what's going to happen in the fall. And we talked about this bruising primary season on the Democratic side, but many people say, hey, this is nothing compared to what's going to happen in the general election.
Give us some of the issues on which Republicans will attack either Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama come the general election.
BENNETT: It's a great question because they live in different universe. Let's just start with the issue of life -- the abortion question. John McCain is pro-life. Both of these candidates are pro- choice. Talked about taxes. McCain is for extending the Bush tax cuts. They want to get rid of the Bush tax cuts. Big difference there.
Foreign policy. Well, maybe Hillary is to the right of John McCain on Iran. But I think on other things. Now the war is obviously a critical issue. McCain wants to stay until it's done. And Hillary wants to pull the troops out as does Obama. So, big, big differences. The two galaxies collide this summer.
ROBERTS: All right. Bill Bennett for us this morning. Host of "MORNING IN AMERICA." Great to see you, Bill. Thanks very much and I guess we'll be seeing you later on tonight on Election Center, right?
BENNETT: Bring the coffee.
ROBERTS: All right. We'll see you tonight. Bill Bennett, thanks very much.
ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's going to be a long day for all of us. Well, it could be a brand-new race at the end of the day if Hillary Clinton can sweep both North Carolina and Indiana. And both candidates are out trying to close the deal with voters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've offered specific solutions about all the issues we are facing because I want you to join with me in helping to solve America's problems. It's time to quit wringing our hands and start rolling up our sleeves.
And we can do that once we have a leader back in the White House who says, you know what, America? There's nothing we can't do. There is no problem we can't solve if we start acting like Americans again. That's who we are. And let's go do it.
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Don't buy into this electability argument. You know, go with who you think best represents your vision of where America needs to go. And if you do that, I'm absolutely confident that that person will win. I think this is our opportunity to make a clean break from the past.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHO: Almost four minutes after the hour. And Jessica Yellin kicks up our coverage this morning, live from Indianapolis, Indiana.
Hey, Jessica. Good morning. So, both candidates have taken populist tones, as you know, but slightly different than what we heard in Pennsylvania for example. Have they tried to close the deal with Indiana voters?
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, Alina, you're exactly right. In both Pennsylvania and Ohio, remember we heard so much about NAFTA. Their populist message there was about reforming America's trade and keeping jobs here at home. That has changed.
You do not hear NAFTA nearly as much on the trail anymore because here in Indiana, folks have benefited in some places from NAFTA. Also in North Carolina. So instead, we're hearing the candidates hit much more on these things of jobs, bringing jobs to the country, bringing jobs to this region. And on the gas tax, getting into incredible detail.
Hillary Clinton, as we heard Bill Bennett and John, talking about threatening to break up OPEC. And voters here are paying attention. They are incredibly tuned in to the policy specifics both candidates are offering. And so far, they seem to like what both Obama and Clinton are saying.
Alina?
CHO: Jessica, I know that you know that Clinton has a slight edge in Indiana. Our latest poll of polls saying 48 to 44 percent. So, what would it take for today's primary there to change this race?
YELLIN: Well, I heard you say that (INAUDIBLE) if Clinton were to sweep in both North Carolina and Indiana, that could be a game- changer because she has to win both states for her to really say she has dealt a very significant blow to Barack Obama.
Still, if she were to win in Indiana, that does dent his momentum. She has won -- you know, after Pennsylvania, if she wins here again, she can continue this argument that she is doing better with working-class voters and that propels her argument to stay in the race.
But without winning both states, Senator Clinton does not have a stronger case to say that really she needs to be the nominee. But we expect no matter what happens today, she will stay in at least through the last primary on June 3rd, whether the momentum is with her or not.
Alina?
CHO: Jessica, as "The New York Times" puts it, it's almost over. Well, not quite. Jessica Yellin, live for us in Indianapolis, Indiana today.
Jessica, thanks.
John? ROBERTS: Breaking news this morning from a growing humanitarian disaster in Myanmar after that killer cyclone hit over the weekend. State radio now says the death toll has soared to more than 22,000 people. Thousands more are still missing. As many as a million people now homeless in that country. Much of the nation is without food and water.
The United Nations says it has been given the green light to provide aid. However, so far, we've heard from the State Department here in the United States that the borders are not yet open to allow that aid in. So, we'll keep watching that for you and tell you how things are going.
CHO: Food and water is so scarce there. Hopefully, that aid will come soon. The people there badly need it.
Of course, this is a primary day here at CNN. We're watching it very closely. The polls are open in both North Carolina and Indiana. Some long lines in North Carolina that we saw. So, we're watching that very closely.
Something else we're watching -- high oil prices. A hot issue in the run-up to today's primary. One candidate threatens to take on OPEC if elected president. That's ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHO: Take a look at the wall there. Welcome back. We're following crucial Democratic primaries today, both in North Carolina and in Indiana, voting either way in both states. The last poll is close at 7:30 Eastern Time. And there you see the countdown clock there. About 11 hours to go in North Carolina. A little more than 10 hours in Indiana.
ROBERTS: Nine minutes after the hour. The "Hairless Prophet of Doom" here again with us this morning.
There are two things, my friend, that you need to revise.
ALI VELSHI, CNN SENIOR BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: One of them is my prediction that all of this oil price stuff will stop on June 8.
ROBERTS: Right. And the other thing is -- that this -- this thing right here is ever going to go back to this.
VELSHI: You know what happened the last time you touched the barrel, right? We broke records all morning because we touched the barrel. You can't touch the barrel.
ROBERTS: You have been for months saying this is worth $60.
VELSHI: I will tell you and Hillary Clinton said it yesterday. Economists who tell you, well, you know, 120.93 this morning, this is why my barrel is back.
CHO: You better change that, you scare people. VELSHI: Economists who talk about just supply and demand -- this is not true.
Economists who talk about just supply and demand say that the price per a barrel of oil should be somewhere between $55 and $80 a barrel. But instead, it is, as John will show you -- here, which is what Goldman Sachs has just come out.
See this is a very interactive board. John, John King in a fancy schmancy (INAUDIBLE) whatever. You know what, this does the job just fine doesn't need batteries.
Goldman Sachs has just come out and said that some time between the next six and 24 months which is a fairly broad window, oil will go to $150 to $200 a barrel.
I don't think that's entirely out on a limb. My assistant John Roberts will now show you how that looks. $120 is where we are right now. Now, we ask you how you feel about that because while your all out there buying --
ROBERTS: Can you spot me a two.
CHO: It's his best (INAUDIBLE), everyone.
VELSHI: There's a 208 there.
ROBERTS: It's a 208 there.
VELSHI: While you don't buy a barrel of oil on the way out, yes a $150 to $200 is what's John says.
So you are just not good with that. We need your people on that.
CHO: Maybe you need the magic board.
VELSHI: We ask you what you think about whether gasoline is going to go to $5 a gallon. It's $3.61 a gallon. Here's what you told us.
44 percent of you said very likely to happen this year. 34 percent of you said somewhat likely. Only 22 percent said not likely.
Now, what that that do for you. What does that do to you? Are you able to manage under these prices? Well, we ask you that as well. A CNN Opinion Research Poll asks respondents have rising gas prices cause hardship for you.
60 percent said yes. 19 percent saying severe hardship. 41 percent saying moderate hardship. 39 percent saying no hardship at all. So the issue now is is this a bubble, this oil thing, that is driven by speculators that could come down at some point and not be at this ridiculous levels which are double what some people think they should be.
Or do you listen to Goldman Sachs thinking $150 to $200. Then we heard from CIBC a few weeks ago. Lots of people are predicting that oil goes higher. Remember, these are investment houses who make investments or whose clients make investments on the basis of these decisions.
ROBERTS: You know what --
VELSHI: Take the whole thing away. You guys are, you guys are, you're disrespecting my barrel.
ROBERTS: Get rid of this darn thing.
CHO: You won't see me doing that.
VELSHI: It's gone.
CHO: It's way too heavy for me.
VELSHI: The barrel is gone. All is well on the world. Does he have anything he has to do on the show?
CHO: We're very busy. Yes. It's a very busy day, Ali. All right, thank you.
VELSHI: Why don't you take it up for him?
CHO: Hey, you want to stick around for this. They are so good, we decided to bring them back. They talk to Indiana voters every morning on the radio. John is back. Talk show host will tell us what Hoosiers are saying about the candidates in Indiana.
We're going to hear about their own interview this morning, too, with Hillary Clinton.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(WEATHER REPORT)
CHO: What are they saying about Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama on talk radio? We're going to hear from two Indianapolis radio hosts who are about to interview Hillary Clinton. We'll talk to them after they talk to her. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHO: On Capitol Hill today, a Senate hearing looks at whether mortgage lenders are abusing the bankruptcy court system adding additional fees on troubled borrowers. The hearing is designed to protect homeowners from abusive practices.
CNN's personal finance editor Gerri Willis joins us with details on that. And you actually talked to somebody who is personally affected by this.
GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR: You bet, Alina. You know, this is really adding insult to injury for folks who were in foreclosure and forced into bankruptcy. Now sources telling us that those folks are encountering incredible fees levied by lenders when they are already in bankruptcy and they have already set up a repayment plan to get rid of their debt. Now we spoke to one woman, Robin Atchley, who told us her story.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBIN ATCHLEY, FORMER COUNTRYWIDE BORROWER WHO LOST HER HOME: My husband and I filed for bankruptcy shortly after the death of my sister. I missed some work. We got behind on our payments. So we filed the bankruptcy. When we sold the home they added a lot of fees that were unexplained.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIS: So Robin says a lot of fees. In fact, these fees can total $1,000, $7000 according to the folks that we've talked to. Her lender was Countrywide. A company that's really in focus with this problem right now. They responded to these allegations. Here's what they had to say.
"Countrywide is committed to cooperating with its borrowers who seek protection through the bankruptcy process. Accordingly, Countrywide has always strived to accurately report and reflect the amounts due from borrowers."
And Alina, Countrywide additionally said, you know, they conducted their own internal investigation and only about one percent of these situations occur. They describe them as errors.
CHO: Well, but it's incredible. I mean, this woman we heard from, if my memory serves me, when they filed for Chapter 13 Bankruptcy Protection, they owed $180,000 on their home. After all the fees, they owed $195,000, and they couldn't come out from under that mountain of debt.
So what do we expect in terms of changes that may come out of this hearing?
WILLIS: Well, Senator Chuck Schumer who is holding this hearing today is hoping to maybe introduce some legislation that would curb these problems. But I have to tell you, it's excessive, it exists in a lot of states. Bankruptcy trustees are complaining about this. They think these fees are excesses and as you pointed out costing people who can ill afford it lots and lots of money.
CHO: Well, let's hope there are some changes to resolve this. Gerri Willis, our personal finance editor. Gerri, thank you.
Of course, the economy is issue no.1 for Americans, so join Gerri, Ali Velshi and the entire CNN money team for "ISSUE #1" today and every weekday at noon Eastern right here on CNN and online at cnnmoney.com.
John? ROBERTS: Coming up on 22 minutes after the hour. This morning, we've been asking for your thoughts on any plan for a gas tax holiday. So far 13 percent of you say it's good economic policy and a whopping 87 percent think it's nothing more than political pandering.
Head to cnn.com/am and keep those votes coming. Also, we want to hear your thoughts via e-mail. Go online at cnn.com/am and follow the links that say contact us. We love to hear what you think.
You're watching the Most News in the Morning. Both campaigns in full force hoping to get voters out to the polls. Coming up, we talk to both sides. The governor of North Carolina and the mayor of Evansville, Indiana.
And breaking news from Myanmar. The death toll climbing after the cyclone there over the weekend. CNN is the only network inside the country. And we'll bring you the latest information, just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Welcome back to the "Most Politics in the Morning." We are following the crucial primaries today in Indiana and North Carolina. North Carolina today's big prize with 115 delegates up for grabs. They've been voting there for nearly two hours now.
And if you're away from the television today and you want to know more about what's going on, just log on to cnn.com/live for streaming political coverage. It's available all day long and best part about it, it is free. Again, that's cnn.com/live.
ROBERTS: North Carolina's governor and Clinton superdelegate Mike Easley has been campaigning hard across the Tar Heel State. He joins us now live from Raleigh.
Governor, good to see you this morning.
GOV. MIKE EASLEY (D), NORTH CAROLINA: Good to be with you, John.
ROBERTS: You said in recent days that Hillary Clinton is a fighter to the point where she makes Rocky Balboa look like a pansy, though a lot of people are thinking after her comments on Iran and Israel, she's looking more like Rambo.
Did she go a little too far? Should the presidential candidate be talking about nuclear annihilation during a presidential campaign?
EASLEY: Well, you know, that's not all she is talking about. What she said is diplomacy is important and that's what she would start. That's what she would continue. And the military would be the last option.
But I do think it's important that they understand in Iran that if they take a shot at Israel, that's going to bring us into it. And a whole lot of other people. It's not just the United States. Israel is a friend to a lot of countries over there. And Iran needs to see the light or feel the heat. And they need to know from somebody in the United States that we are very serious about this.
ROBERTS: And how --
EASLEY: (INAUDIBLE) she sent a pretty clear message on that.
ROBERTS: And how is that whole issue playing there in North Carolina.
EASLEY: Well, I don't think that issue is playing by itself in isolation. I think in general people are seeing especially downscale voters, and our sort of Reagan Democrats. They are seeing that Hillary Clinton is different than they thought.
She's a lot tougher than they thought. Her policies are better. They feel like she's really good on the economy. And the economy is getting weaker and they're getting more nervous. And they want to get somebody in the White House that can turn this economy around right away and believe Hillary is the one who can get it done. That's why you're seeing these numbers change.
ROBERTS: She is also talking tough about OPEC. She suddenly went down that road last night. Barack Obama immediately leapt on it and criticized her. Here's what he had to say last evening on that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You say you've been in the White House for eight years, you've had two terms as a United States senator and haven't said a word about OPEC.
(APPLAUSE)
And now suddenly you're going to take it right to OPEC. When you have opposed fuel efficiency standards that would actually reduce demand for oil and put OPEC in a bind? That's not being straight with the American people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: Governor, Senator Obama is charging political opportunism here. And she did not explain last night what she would do to try to break up the OPEC cartel and so far legislation that she said she was going to introduce on this gas tax holiday has not gone anywhere and there's only three weeks now until Memorial Day when this holiday is supposed to start.
EASLEY: You know, when she's been talking about OPEC a lot while she's here, she has been very clear about what she would do. You know, the World Trade Organization is now in place. All of the countries are part of it, so we have a forum to go to. It's kind of like -- think of it as a big court that we can go to.
So now we know OPEC is a bunch of price fixers, they sit down, decide how much oil they're going to produce and what they're going to charge for it. And what she wants to do is let's go to the World Trade Organization, let's see what we can do with antitrust which is price fixing and try and do something by getting that price down.
Now the Gas Tax Holiday is something different. We got a lot of people who live out in the country in North Carolina and have to drive into the cities for work. And this price of gas is getting too high and it's really making a big difference on what they can afford to buy.
It may not sound like a lot to some people, but $70 for somebody in North Carolina with average income is a lot of money. And she's willing to tax the big oil companies to make up the difference so we don't raid the highway trust funds, so it's pretty simple. Either we pay the gas tax or big oil companies pay the gas tax. And down here we're for the big oil companies paying it.
ROBERTS: Right. You said $70. Again, many economists think that the number would be much lower than that, only about 28 to 30 though individual consumers would experience more or less of a break under that plan. Let me ask you about superdelegates here. Of course 2025 --
EASLEY: Yes. But you know, that's a pair of shoes for a baby. If you're in a low-income that $28 can help you dress your child for school next year.
ROBERTS: Right. It wasn't necessarily the figure, it was the disparity that I was getting at. But let me go to the idea of superdelegates here. In 2025 delegates, super and pledge to win the nomination, Barack Obama needs 280, Hillary Clinton needs 423.
Between all of the contests that are left, there are 404 pledged delegates, and then 223 uncommitted superdelegates. So if they keep splitting up the delegates the way they have been, Hillary Clinton would need an overwhelming majority of those superdelegates to carry her to that 2,025 mark. Is that something she can do?
EASLEY: Well, neither one of them are going to have the delegates they need when they get to the convention. We know that. So the superdelegates are going to have to look at a lot of different things.
And I'll tell you, one of the things they are going to look at is who has the most caucus delegates. Another thing they are going to look at who has the most popular vote. And when they get through the day, we'll have a good sense of how that's going. And then you got West Virginia, you got Kentucky. You got Oregon out there. And then the superdelegates look at that and will make a decision who can win and who will be the best president. And I can tell you how I got there. I think she's the one who can turn this economy around the quickest. The economy gets weaker and more and more of these conservative Democrats that we need to win in the fall are moving towards her. So, superdelegates weigh all that. That's part of the responsibility of being a superdelegate. You know, we just have to wait and see how it goes. ROBERTS: All right. Governor Mike Easley from the state of North Carolina. Love your state, sir. I vacation there every year. It's good to see you on.
EASLEY: Come on back, spend lots of money and we'll give you a break on gas.
ROBERTS: I'll hold you to that. Thanks very much. Alina.
ALINA CHO, CNN ANCHOR: Always a politician. All right.
72 delegates are up for grabs in Indiana meanwhile today. And we want to know what voters there are saying? Jake Query and Terri Stacy host the WIBC morning news radio program in Indianapolis. They just signed off for the day. They just finished interviewing Hillary Clinton. They join us again. Hey guys, good morning again.
TERRI STACY, CO-HOST, "WIBC MORNING NEWS": Hi.
JAKE QUERY, CO-HOST, "WIBC MORNING NEWS": Good morning.
CHO: You talked to Hillary Clinton a couple of minutes ago. Any headlines? Any surprises from her?
STACY: No I don't think there were any surprises. It was a very quick -- actually she was very gracious to Hoosiers, and thanking them for their hospitality and for getting to know her a little bit more. And told us to get out there and vote. It was just that quick and just that simple.
CHO: Really. Jake, nothing that was said that surprised you by Hillary Clinton? She make a final push to voters I would imagine?
QUERY: Well she's - yes. And then she told us she had a major, surprising, earth-shattering announcement, and we said well would love to hear that but we have to talk to CNN now. So I don't know exactly what that was although I asked her a question about Reverend Wright. I had asked her if indeed her situation with the Monica Lewinsky deal was a private situation, then why should Barack Obama's situation with Reverend Wright also not be private?
CHO: Wow, what did she say?
QUERY: ...when her campaign has made it public. She essentially said I think when you run for president you expect questions from all angles, although I thought it was interesting because when's she's been asked about it, when her daughter was asked about the Monica Lewinsky situation, her answer has always been that that is private. So, she gave a very diplomatic answer. And again as Terri said, she asked that people go out and vote and she was very gracious towards the treatment she has gotten from the people of Indiana over the last month or so.
CHO: Hey, Terri. I know you guys are so excited because Indiana is typically the reddest of red states in the Midwest. Only supported a Democrat four times since 1900. So much excitement surrounding this Democratic primary, what are listeners saying about what's important to them?
STACY: What's important to them? I think we're pretty much like everybody else around the country. Right now, gas is very important. The economy, and also health care is important, education s important. I'm not sure that we're different than anybody else. We are in the heartland. We are a little bit country, we are a little bit city, manufacturing, agricultural all are very important to this state. Female voters of course a key here in the great state of Indiana. And those are their important issues as well.
CHO: Hey, Jake, Indiana has an open primary, as you well know, which means that Republicans can vote in this Democratic primary. A lot of people have called some of those Republicans, Obamakins. The one who support Barack Obama. I know you had Barack Obama on the air yesterday. What did he say?
QUERY: Well, Barack Obama yesterday when he was on was very similar to Hillary Clinton today. Just talking about exactly what he wants to do as far as his ideas, his platforms, but more so just thanking Hoosiers. These are two candidates that have really blanketed the state of Indiana. Senator Obama talked about that. He also touched on his relationship with Reverend Wright and continued to distance himself a little bit. There's no surprise there.
But I think that certainly Barack Obama knows that Indiana is a bit of a dangerous area for him because there is, indeed, the ability for Republicans to cross over and most of those Republicans have talked about the fact that they will cast a vote for Hillary Clinton in this primary because they feel they would have a better chance with John McCain against Hillary Clinton than Barack Obama. And early reports are here through people that have polled long lines here in Indiana very active and indeed it would appear that there are a lot of Republicans voting Democratic in this primary.
CHO: Jake Query and Terri Stacy, hosts of "WIBC Morning News" radio in Indianapolis. Hey, thank you. We'll talk to you again tomorrow morning.
STACY: OK.
QUERY: All right, guys. Sounds good, looking forward to it.
CHO: They're great. They are a great couple.
ROBERTS: Love them. They're a great couple.
Democratic superdelegates watching carefully today. They could make the call on who's going to be the nominee based on what happens in North Carolina and Indiana. That's ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Live pictures this morning as voters go to the polls in Indianapolis. 72 delegates at stake there. In North Carolina, e polls have been opened for about two hours now. North Carolina the biggest prize of the day with 115 delegates. Of course, the Democratic superdelegates are the ones who look like they are going to decide who is going to be the Democratic nominee. And how is that all going to shake out? CNN's chief national correspondent John King here at the lovely -- I love this thing. The magic wall will tell us how it's going to work. So, how could they possibly break down the remaining delegates in the White House? And what happens after that.
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'll put some wheels on this. Let's just take it home. Let's look first at the pledged delegates. As you look at the map it's filling in. Because there are not many contests left. And that's the problem for Senator Clinton. Even though she has a bit of momentum right now. Time is running out. So, let's, John, for the sake of argument, say we're going to give Senator Clinton ten-point victories, 55-45 in Indiana. She's ahead there, maybe she'll win by 10 points. That's a stretch but let's give it to her for a hypothetical. Let's even give her North Carolina. If she wins both contests tonight what would have happened in the race? Obama is still ahead, Clinton is starting to close the gap. Well, watch this even if we gave Senator Clinton everything left - again, no reason to believe she's going to do that. Let's give her West Virginia, let's give here Kentucky. Let's come down here and give her Puerto Rico, let's go out west here, states where Obama has done well --
ROBERTS: This is the same 55-45 margin?
KING: 55-45. So they're splitting the delegates roughly 55-45. If Senator Clinton runs the board and wins the rest, what happens, she narrows the gap, John. But Obama is still ahead out here. Neither one makes the finish line. If Senator Clinton wins the rest among pledged delegates, gets roughly about 55 percent, she gets closer but she does not catch up which leads to you that thing you were talking even if she runs the board this becomes a superdelegate question.
ROBERTS: And there are currently about 223 superdelegates that are still undecided at this point. So, she would have to win over about 80 percent, almost 90 percent of those unpledged superdelegates. Is that something that she can do? And what would she base that argument on?
KING: Most people believe now. They believe the only way is to pretty much run the board, win all, or almost all of the remaining contests and go to the superdelegates and say look Barack Obama is very, very weak. And let's look at it. Here are the pledged delegates we were just talking about. So, again, about 400 left. Let's split them roughly. So, she gets more than 200. Put that up for Senator Clinton. I gave here a little more than 50 percent. We give the rest to Barack Obama. Where are we? The red is the finish line. The green is where we started today. If we're at the end of the process and no more superdelegates make their announcements and they weigh, it would be about 277 or so left.
If they split these, to your point, let's give 100 to Senator Clinton. Let's give her 90 more, 60 more. Look what happens down here, she now has two-thirds of them. Barack Obama is still your nominee when you run up the rest. He makes the finish line. When I get those final 10 out there, he gets to the finish line. So, she has to win 80 percent of more, you're right of the superdelegates. How can she do that? Most say she can't unless there is a dramatic stumble by Barack Obama to the finish line. But it so difficult but not impossible which is why Senator Clinton says she will fight on. And then remember, the Florida and Michigan question, if nobody makes this finish line, we not only are going to have a fight about Florida and Michigan, but courts.
ROBERTS: But if the finish line moves as well if we include Florida and Michigan, right?
KING: If we include Florida and Michigan, if those delegates were seated, a lot of ifs, a lot of lawyers will be involved in that which is why you have leaders in the party saying the superdelegates to make their decision after we get through the remaining contests in early June. The math is daunting for Senator Clinton even if she wins 60 percent the rest of the way out, which is unrealistic based on how she has done so far. Barack Obama is the Democratic nominee.
ROBERTS: Is it possible for neither one of them to reach the finish line?
KING: It's absolutely possible for neither one to reach the finish line under almost any scenario if the superdelegates hold. If the superdelegates say - we're not sure at the end, Barack Obama...
ROBERTS: What if they're all allocated? Is there a way that they can literally come up with a tie?
KING: Could they come up with the tie, yes. If the superdelegates click perfectly -- it could go to the convention.
It is unlikely based on how this is broken out but this has been a wacky campaign year. I wouldn't bet the ranch on it or that free gas, Governor Easley is going to give you but, yes, it is possible. But because we're about these what-if scenarios, that's why Senator Clinton is staying in. because, she can say, sure, it's hard for me to get to the finish line, more difficult but it's hard for him too. So, I'm going to find out.
ROBERTS: You wonder if these things every going to end. John King, as always thanks. Look forward hearing from you tonight. Alina.
CHO: All that math makes you dizzy. Well, they know the beltway like the backs of their hands. So this morning, we hail a cab to get the inside scoop on today's primaries. That's next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: 43 minutes after the hour. Voting in the crucial North Carolina and Indiana primaries has been under way for a few hours now. 187 delegates up for grabs. These states are the two biggest left in the primary season. And we're going to have the complete coverage tonight on the "Election Center" as the returns come in.
CHO: And an early morning tomorrow. 5:00 a.m. start.
ROBERTS: Oh, can you quit thinking about that.
CHO: I know.
ROBERTS: Don't roll in it.
CHO: I'm not rolling.
As the road to the White House now winds through Indiana and North Carolina, we want to give you a front seat view of the campaign from the political pundits who hear it all, we are talking taxicab drivers in the nation's capital. CNN's Zain Verjee joins us live with details.
Hey, Zain, good morning.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Alina. Politics is a hot topic in any of these D.C. cabs. We hopped in a few of them, they took us around town and gave us some pretty interesting political analysis.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Taxi! The best pundits in Washington, D.C. maybe behind the wheel. It's a United Nations of political opinion. From Nigeria.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In this country?
VERJEE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 28 years.
VERJEE: Ethiopia.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 16 years.
VERJEE: Pakistan. To right here at home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In D.C., I've been a cab driver for 30 years.
VERJEE: How much do you talk politics with your passengers?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, a lot. This is a political city.
VERJEE: Do you ever change anyone's opinion?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Absolutely.
VERJEE: Then news junkies.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm on NPR. I read the paper. "Washington Post." UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If I'm not going to watch the news, I'm missing something.
VERJEE: And the marathon Democratic race.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very exciting especially this time but it takes too long.
VERJEE: Are you getting tired of it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm getting tired of it because they're not saying anything. They're not really sticking to the issues. You know, talking about this Reverend Wright. It doesn't have anything to do with the family when you go to the store.
VERJEE: What are some of the big issues in this campaign that are important to you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Especially war on terrorism or whatever is going on in Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the main thing is healthcare. You got millions of people who don't have healthcare.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've never had health insurance. You know, I can't afford it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The economy, number one. The dollar falling.
VERJEE: His passengers are mostly Democrats.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It goes between Hillary and Obama.
VERJEE: But even some Republicans.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They don't want to vote Republicans. They want to change.
VERJEE: Having eavesdrop on secrets?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, when Ronald Reagan was president. I had some guys, I don't know who they were but they said the president - the (passes)ph was being released. They were talking about it.
VERJEE: Any little nuggets you're picking up now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. I don't know a thing.
VERJEE: Thanks a lot.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VERJEE: Cabbies say talking politics with their passengers is actually good for business. They say sometimes it gets them bigger tips. Alina. CHO: Nothing like a State Department correspondent trying to get a state secret out of a cabbie. Zain Verjee. Zain, great story. John.
ROBERTS: CNN NEWSROOM is just minutes away now. Tony Harris at the CNN Center with a look at what's ahead. Good morning to you, Tony.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, John. Good morning to you. Deciding on a Democrat in the NEWSROOM. Voters at the polls today in Indiana and North Carolina, 187 delegates on the line for Clinton and Obama. Live coverage throughout the day on CNN. Aid workers struggling to get food and water to storm victims in Myanmar. More than 22,000 - can you believe that number, may have died in the giant cyclone.
New savings at the pharmacy. Wal-mart expands its discounts on generic prescriptions. 90 day supplies, $10. Stay on top of the breaking news. That's what we do here in the NEWSROOM. Top of the hour on CNN. John, back to you.
ROBERTS: Tony, looking forward to it. Just 13 minutes away now.
The wrong name game. What happens when a candidate's mental Rolex fails them? The answer, Hilarity. Jeanne Moos takes a look at past and present mix ups next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Some spectacular pictures to show you this morning. This is from about 800 miles south of Santiago, Chile. This is this volcano that erupted over the weekend. It's been pretty quiet for about 9,000 years and suddenly erupted into huge clouds of ash and molten rock. It forced the evacuation immediately of one town, the town of Chaiten, 4,000 inhabitants were taken out of the town. Well, apparently now it's forced the evacuation of a second town. This is quite a large volcano. It's about 3,200 feet high. But obviously you can see the dramatic power coming up from under the earth there as this volcano is now unleashing its fury after being quiet for so long. We'll keep watching those pictures for you this morning. We'll bring you the latest just in case lava flows happen to endanger any of the nearby towns. So far only evacuations have been ordered.
Right now, more breaking news, the death toll climbing from Myanmar after that devastating cyclone over the weekend. State radio is reporting more than 22,000 people are dead, 41,000 people are missing. 1 million may be homeless. And many of them have no clean water or medicine. The nation's military government has now OK'd international aid. The U.S. has already promised $250,000 in aid and has a relief team waiting now to get into that country. CNN is the only network with a reported inside Myanmar. Dan Rivers filed this report from southern Myanmar earlier this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAN RIVERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This family is typical of those who've survived cyclones. They are living in what remains of their house but as you can see it's completely destroyed. A lot of their possessions got swept away. They have some food. You can see they got some eggs and some rice that's been handed out by people in the town but not very much. They say only it this can allow them to eat for a few days. But just have a look at the level of destruction over here. This is typical right across this region that we've driven through. (Bugale)ph district is one of the hardest hit. There's talk of 10,000 having been killed in this district. Many of the houses are made of this very flimsy material which is no match for cyclone Nargis. We have passed quite a lot of army convoys coming down here. Obviously, the authorities are doing what they can. The Red Cross has been out here as well. But generally every single house that we pass pretty much has been like this for the last, I guess, 30 kilometers, just total destruction almost 100 percent of the houses completely flattened. The weather is still pretty bad. There have been some pretty heavy rainstorms. So it's just miserable for these people having to survive under a bit of tarpaulin and gather what food they can. Dan Rivers, CNN, southern Myanmar.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHO: And stay with us, because coming up a lighter look at politics. The wrong name game. What happens when a candidate's mental Roladex fails them? We'll explain. Jeanne Moos with a look at past and present mix ups, next on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Welcome back. We're following the crucial Democratic primaries today in North Carolina and Indiana with voting underway in both states. The last polls close at 7:30 Eastern tonight. And our apologies, we wanted to have the mayor of Evansville, Indiana, who is a Barack Obama supporter on this morning, Jonathan Weinzapfel but unfortunately we had a - we have like been beset with technical problems this morning. Our audio on our main CNN channel for 45 minutes went down the tubes, and apparently we've had a catastrophic failure of the satellite truck that was supposed to bring us Jonathan Weinzapfel. Unfortunately, we're not the mayor. Now we are not going to be able to get him on this morning. And for the conspiracy theorists out there who think we did this intentionally, we did not. Believe me. And Jonathan Weinzapfel is going to be on "Larry King Live" tonight.
CHO: Oh, good.
ROBERTS: So we will make sure that we get plenty of input from his side.
CHO: Well, good. It'll be nice to hear from him.
ROBERTS: Our apologies for that. Nothing nefarious. Simply just bad luck.
CHO: Well, they are battling each other, and exhaustion, by the way. ROBERTS: Yes. Absolutely. And sometimes the long road to the White House is -- makes it hard to keep track of everybody's name. Just ask Tim Lauer. It's the "Moos news" in the morning for you today.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT; Senator Obama, we would like to introduce you to "Today" show host Matt Lauer. Matt, the guy that you called Tim three times.
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, Tim, I think -- what it is, Tim. Well, Tim, first of all.
MOOS: Finally, Matt couldn't take another Tim.
MATT LAUER, HOST, "TODAY": I just want to say I know you had a very long week, and so have I. You're saying Tim, it's Matt Lauer. But believe me, I completely understand. I completely understand.
OBAMA: Matt, I'm sorry.
MOOS: But it's no wonder Obama has Tim on the brain. Less than 24 hours earlier he spent an hour with Tim Russert and never once called him Matt.
OBAMA: As I said, Tim -- You are right, Tim.
MOOS: But the Tim-Matt thing is nothing compared to the time Jimmy Carter paid tribute to Senator Hubert Humphrey at the Democratic convention.
PRES. JIMMY CARTER, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: It would have been one of my greatest presents in history, Hubert Horatio Hornblower.
MOOS: Horatio Hornblower is a fictional naval officer. It turns out Hubert Humphrey's middle name is Horatio so you can see how Carter made the connection.
CARTER: Hubert Horatio.
MOOS: The guy trying to blow Fred Thompson's horn ended up blowing it all right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Senator Fred Roberts from Tennessee.
MOOS: Sometimes they get it half right. For instance, when senator Harry Reid tried to say happy birthday to Wolf Blitzer.
HARRY REID, NEVADA: Well, first of all, Blitz --
MOOS: Blitz, Blitzer, who cares as long as they don't do what Ross on "Friends" did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I Ross, take thee Emily --
CHARACTER OF "ROSS": Take thee Rachel --
MOOS: Rachel was the one he really loved. Then there was a time I personally called Richard Nixon President Reagan. The question is a little tough to hear but the response is clear. I was a rookie reporter back in 1984.
MOOS: President Reagan. Sorry, President Nixon. Sorry.
PRES. RICHARD NIXON, FMR. U.S. PRESIDENT: I have been called worse than that.
MOOS: Well, it is hard to call Barack Obama worse than Obama Bin Laden.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And Obama Bin Laden is still at large.
OBAMA: I think that was Osama Bin Laden.
MOOS: We can all use assistance just like in the obnoxious editor had in "The Devil wears Prada" whispering helpful hints.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's Ambassador Franklin. And that's the woman he left his wife for, Rebecca.
MOOS: Our favorite faux pas goes to the mayor of Canonsburg, Pennsylvania, introducing Bill Clinton recently.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our first president of the United States, President Jefferson William Lincoln.
MOOS: Next thing you know, we'll be celebrating the birthday of Abraham Clinton. Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.
CHO: They are so tired on the trail. You know, you can't blame them.
ROBERTS: I would think that Barack Obama was so sleep deprived yesterday when he called Matt Lauer, Tim. He fully believed -
CHO: Well, Matt Lauer handled it graciously. So anyway, hey, we want to get a final check of our "Quick Vote" now, 13 percent of you saying a gas tax holiday is good economic policy but the flipside is that an overwhelming 87 percent of you call it political pandering. We've been reading your e-mails all morning long, too. And David in Seattle writes "the gas tax holiday is like bringing a knife to a gun fight. Short, not necessarily sweet."
ROBERTS: Sandy of Rosiclaire, Illinois writes this morning, "Obama says it won't save us very much. In rural areas it will save a lot and we don't have public transit." And that's the reason why.
CHO: That's right. Jim in Tampa sent us this "we are already leaving our children and grand children a disaster with the federal debt. Now we want to take away the highway funds to make that worse for our children also. One of these days, these bills are going to come due and someone is going to have to pay it." ROBERTS: Thanks so much for all of your e-mails and we'll do it again tomorrow with our special coverage.
CHO: And thanks so much for joining us on this AMERICAN MORNING. We'll be back tomorrow.
ROBERTS: Yes, bright and early. 5:00 a.m., we'll start.
