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CNN NEWSROOM

Hillary Clinton Wins Puerto Rico; Barack Obama Quitting Trinity Church; Hollywood Studio on Fire; Politics and Internet as a Campaign Tool; Meet the People Behind the Candidates

Aired June 1, 2008 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, Hillary Clinton wins Puerto Rico. Is it enough, though, to say I won the popular vote?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I lead in the popular vote.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: OK, but don't the rules say it's about who has the most delegates?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sometimes you revisit the rules.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Then why have rules? We'll ask.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am deeply sorry.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He best be because Obama is hurting and now quitting Trinity Church.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have drawn down the pre-surge levels.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Oops wrong by tense of thousands on Iraq. His strong suit. Speak of strong suits, the president shows off his.

And an Amazon tribe that knows nothing, but their own. Look at this. What is that and that? Experts weigh in. A jam-packed hour starts now.

And hello again, everybody, here from the world headquarters of CNN in Atlanta. I'm Rick Sanchez. Tonight, Puerto Rico has spoken. The Democratic Rules Committee has spoken and now Hillary Clinton is speaking out.

She says she deserves the presidential nomination based on the popular vote. There's also big news tonight on Barack Obama and John McCain. But let's start with Jessica Yellin. She's been standing by, following these stories since early this morning out of San Juan, Puerto Rico.

Good evening, Jessica. How will Senator Clinton use this win in Puerto Rico?

JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, she is going to take it all the way to the superdelegates, Rick. And we already heard her make her case tonight in its more subdued form. She will say two things to the superdelegates. Puerto Rico proves that, one, she has the popular vote. This is Clinton's argument and so she can match up against Barack Obama's delegate league.

And two, she will make the case that this shows she can turn out the Latino vote in November which would make her in her argument the more likely candidate to win against John McCain come the general election.

Let's listen to some of her comments at her victory speech. You can hear she's directing them to the superdelegates.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When the voting concludes on Tuesday neither Senator Obama nor I will have the number of delegates to be the nominee. I will lead the popular vote. He will maintain a slight lead in the delegate count. The decision will fall on the shoulders of those leaders and our party, empowered by the rules to vote at Democratic convention. I do not envy the decision you must make.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YELLIN: Now, one thing you won't hear from the Clinton camp today is that turnout in Puerto Rico was exceptionally low. They're not talking about it, but it's true. Usually for a general election, you hear about 80 percent turnout. For a primary election, you'll see 70 percent. Today, approximately 20 percent turns out, that's all. And that is hard for the Clintons because they were hoping that a huge turnout here would really pump up that popular vote total.

Still the Clinton campaign bragging about this landslide win and another one for her. She's already on her way to South Dakota camping for those next two primaries. And then we're told she's going Washington D.C. to make her case to the superdelegates. She says it's not over.

Rick?

SANCHEZ: We'll begin to watch it. We're going to be watching this thing. Jessica Yellin, thanks so much for bringing us up-to-date on that. There's a new ad, by the way, from Senator Clinton that we're going to be showing in just a little bit where she makes the argument about the popular vote and the key word, electability.

We're going to have that for you in just a little bit. But first, let me bring in our own Bill Schneider on this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: The delegates determine the nominee and he's likely to claim at end of the day, Tuesday, that he is either at or has surpassed the threshold proclaiming the nomination.

She says she has more popular vote that proves she's more electable. She sites polls across the country but the polls are not that clear cut. Our latest poll of polls shows that in a contest with John McCain, she leads McCain by three points. And how does Obama do? He leads McCain by three points. There are some swing states where she does better than Obama against McCain, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Florida.

There are other swing states where Obama does better than she does against McCain like Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, and Washington. So it is very unclear that either one of them has a decisive advantage of electability.

SANCHEZ: Explain to our viewers this idea that she would go further beyond Tuesday to the A credentials committee and possibly all the way to the convention. Using what argument and what's the expectation, Bill, that she's going do this?

SCHNEIDER: Well, she was more conciliatory than some of her supporters like Harold Ickes at the rules committee yesterday. She didn't make threats today. She sounded very reasonable. She said this would all be resolved. The Democrats will be united. And remember, she didn't say I threatened or people didn't say she's threatening to go to the rules committee. All she said is she reserves the right to do that.

What could she do? She could appeal the decision of the rules committee. Take it to credentials, have them decide it. She claims it was decided unfairly, and if she's dissatisfied with that, she could take it to the floor of the convention. But if she doesn't have more delegates than he does, it's hard to see how she would get anywhere by taking it to the convention.

I doubt she will do that and there will be enormous pressure brought after the -- someone has a majority of delegates, most likely Obama after the primary's end. There will be huge pressure from the superdelegates to shut this thing down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: All right. Our thanks to Bill Schneider for joining us this evening. Now the thing is Mrs. Clinton is not backing down. And just for a moment, forget about the DNC and the decisions. This weekend, forget about Puerto Rico and focus on Barack Obama picking up two more superdelegate just today.

Yet, Senator Clinton's key argument right now continues to be the popular vote. An argument that Barack Obama is making as well, though. Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Today, I lead in the popular vote.

I lead in the popular vote.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We've won twice as many states. We've won the popular vote by a fairly substantial margin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: All right. So who's really won the popular vote?

Republican strategist Cheri Jacobus has worked with several congressional leaders. And Democratic strategist Keith Boykin is our former aid to President Clinton.

Boy, we've got a lot to talk about here especially with this argument that's been going on throughout the course today.

Keith, I'm going to start with you. Is the popular vote -- should the popular vote be barometer as to who is going to be the nominee?

KEITH BOYKIN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: No, it's not, because we have rules in the Democratic Party. The rules said that delegates decide the nominee. And the delegates are clearly lined up for Barack Obama. He's ahead in pledge delegates, he's ahead in total delegates, he's ahead in superdelegates and quite frankly, if truth be told, he's probably ahead in the popular vote.

A, if you don't include Florida and Michigan, which I think is what some people in the Obama camp would argue, he's ahead based on that count. B, if you do include Florida and Michigan then you have to include all the caucus states that have not yet been counted as well.

SANCHEZ: Cheri Jacobus, (INAUDIBLE). Hold on just a minute, Keith. Cheri Jacobus, he makes an interesting point that you really shouldn't count Florida and Michigan. After all, everyone undecided going into this thing that they weren't going to count. So how could we count the popular votes and states that weren't going count?

CHERI JACOBUS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, the practical problem is that regular American people that are out there voting don't even know what the DNC and RNC is, and they don't care. They like to think that they're in charge. So it's really a political problem. And that's why Hillary Clinton really does kind of have a point.

Why should you punish the voters of Michigan and Florida? So, you know, obviously, she's not going to be the nominee.

SANCHEZ: So, wait --

JACOBUS: But it's difficult here to say she has to surrender. She's not really losing and that's a real problem for the party.

SANCHEZ: So, wait -- you just made the argument that the reason we should count Michigan and Florida is because many Americans don't understand the system?

JACOBUS: Well, I'm not making an argument either way. I don't make the rules and make the decisions in the Democratic Party. But just in terms of analyzing what the real political problem is long term, regular voters really don't care and they like to think that they're the ones in charge.

And so they see people getting in a room in Washington, D.C. and making all these rules that don't make sense to them. Yes, they understand the system, but for the most part -- for the most part, I think people like to think that the voters are in charge. And so this is jarring to a lot of people. This is why there is this controversy.

SANCHEZ: Go ahead, Keith.

BOYKIN: Because the voters are in charge in this process. The voters have spoken and the delegates are the representative of the voters. The delegates have indicated that they are supporting Barack Obama. The superdelegates have indicated they're supporting Barack Obama.

And the popular vote, again, if you count every vote which is the Hillary Clinton mantra now then you have to count the caucus states where Barack Obama has done well.

And we don't have the tallies for those. And CNN's own estimates show Barack Obama is leading in the popular vote even if you include Florida and Michigan with those caucus states.

SANCHEZ: But here's the argument. You guys tell me if the people who say this are wrong. That if you go into something like this and you've got somebody saying two and two equals four which we all know, and then you have another party saying no, no, no -- two and two equals five.

That somehow if you just get people to start arguing that maybe that's a possibility then you've won. Many on the Barack side say that that's exactly what the Hillary camp has done by saying that Michigan and Florida suddenly need to be included and all of the television networks and newspapers are covering it as such. Are they wrong?

JACOBUS: You know what, as Republicans, we're happy to see the Democrats fight over Michigan and Florida because I think there's a real opportunity for John McCain to do very, very well in those states since he always has in 2000. He appealed to a lot of Democrats and independent Democrats whenever they could.

We've crossover and vote for him. So I mean, as a partisan, certainly we want them. But just, I think the way regular Americans think they don't understand why their vote doesn't count. And so that's why this process is confusing, and where there's a lot of hurt feelings.

SANCHEZ: You know, I got to tell you. If there's one thing that I think you're underestimating about Americans, Americans are a couple of things. And one of the things Americans are is extremely fair- minded, extremely rule-oriented and let me throw in something else.

Most of them follow sports. And in sports you go into the season with a set of rules and the rules don't change either A, in the middle of the game or B, in the middle of a season.

Most Americans get that, don't they, Keith?

BOYKIN: Absolutely, they get that. That's why I think the Clinton campaign argument is so outrageous. The idea that somehow -- like Donna Brazile said, the idea that you change the rules at the end of the game, in the middle of the game -- my mama would call that cheating, too.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

BOYKIN: I don't think you can get away with that. The American people understand that as well. I'm actually very encouraged in response to what Cheri said. I'm encouraged that they were able to reach a solution yesterday in the rules committee on Florida, which was the unanimous decision because Florida will be pivotal.

I'm not as worried about Michigan because I think Barack Obama would easily carry Michigan. But Florida is an important state that the Democrats need to win.

SANCHEZ: Sheri Jacobus, you're still wonderful even though we disagree.

JACOBUS: Well, thank you.

SANCHEZ: And Keith, great to have you as well. I appreciate it.

Listen, we're going to come back in just a moment. We're going to be continuing on a couple of other hot topics going on, tonight.

Coming up, Barack Obama makes a major and no doubt personal decision about his church. We're going to tell you what it is. How he came to it and what it could mean for his campaign as well.

John McCain (INAUDIBLE) that Barack Obama is clueless on Iraq, and soon after that, he makes a mistake on the facts on the ground on Iraq.

A lot of conversation about that. We'll get into it. Also, these are not special effects. This is a real Hollywood studio on fire. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Tonight, the Obama Family is looking for a new spiritual home. They are parting ways with their church of 20 years. This is a major decision. We're going to have both the decision, why it was made and the reaction. That's ahead.

Welcome back. Los Angeles, home of Hollywood and the land of movie make believe. But today's three alarmer at Universal Studios was no special effect. And nobody was acting, either. Take a look at these pictures. This is the blaze, the fire completely engulfing a movie set backlot.

Those buildings look familiar there. The well-used mock up of the big city street neighborhood that you've seen in countless movies and the television shows. New York Street is what it's called. Yes, (INAUDIBLE) is what we should say because it was called in the past.

Tonight that backlot is destroyed. CNN's Thelma Gutierrez has been following the fire all day long for us. She just filed this report.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Shortly before dawn, a spectacular firelights up the sky above Universal Studios, Hollywood.

JOHN HARTMAN: It was nasty. Very nasty.

GUTIERREZ: John Hartman awakens to several explosions and grabs his camera.

HARTMAN: With the sound of automobile tires exploding on trucks. Whatever it was, it was loud.

GUTIERREZ: A dark plume of smoke shoots hundreds of feet into the air as flames raced through the backlot of Universal, consuming famous city facades on New York Street and the Courthouse Square we remember from "Back to the Future."

This is what happened to the King Kong attraction. Part of the tram ride at Universal, completely destroyed.

CHIEF MICHAEL FREEMAN, LOS ANGELES COUNTY, FIRE DEPARTMENT: We had essentially two city blocks on fire at the same time.

GUTIERREZ: 400 firefighters attacked the flames from the ground. From rooftops and ladders, trying to keep the fire from spreading through the park.

FREEMAN: They were flowing in excess of 18,000 gallons of water per minute.

GUTIERREZ: Firefighters and studio employees carried boxes of recordings to safety before the video vault burned down. A huge relief for Universal president Ron Meyers because the main vault of the motion picture negatives was not affected.

RON MYERS, PRESIDENT, UNIVERSAL: Fortunately, nothing irreplaceable was lost. We have duplicates and obviously there's a lot of work to replicate what's been lost, but it can be done.

GUTIERREZ: How it started is still a mystery, but before it was over, arson investigators began to sift through the damage.

As for the thousands of tourists who came to visit, the gates remained closed as clouds of smoke billowed into the air.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GUTIERREZ: More than 14 hours after this fire started, you can see it is still smoldering. That is because there are combustibles down there, plastics, heavy timber and all that videotape and some metals, fire chief says is very difficult to put out.

And Rick, just to give you an idea of the scope of this fire, the fire chief says this is the equivalent of two city blocks that are actually burning.

Rick, back to you.

SANCHEZ: Yes. And you know, what's amazing is this is a tourist attraction. This is the place where people by the thousands come and visit on a daily basis. And I imagine from what I heard you say toward the end of your report is none of those tourists were in the facility yet. Right? They were lining up to get in as this happened?

GUTIERREZ: Yes. Correct, Rick. That's exactly what happened. Thousands of people started showing up at the park when they realized that it was on fire. There was this big, black plume in the air.

Now the problem is that the folks here at Universal Studios told these people that it would be open. That they could stay. The people stayed. Then they postponed the opening until noon and the people waited. And then they told them to come back at 1:30. They came back. And then about an hour after that they told them it's not going to open. And so you had all these frustrated people.

But the good news is that this park will open tomorrow and they will come back and flood this park.

SANCHEZ: Yes. The real good news is if they had been let in to this facility, they probably would have been in a whole lot of trouble given from the pictures that we've been looking at tonight. I think it was a wise decision. Thelma Gutierrez following this for us all day long. Thanks so much for that report.

Coming up, this priest right here used the pulpit for politics and hurt Barack Obama's candidacy and in so doing. We're going to tell you what he, this priest is saying this morning.

And then John McCain, he gets it wrong on Iraq. Iraq!

Also this, is a tribe in the Amazon that's never been exposed to the outside world. We know a little bit more about them now from anthropological writings. We're going to share that with you and go in tight on some of these pictures to describe it. Wow! What a story. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) SANCHEZ: You see those people down there, they look surprised, right? They look like they have weapons with good reason. This may be the first time in their entire lives that they've ever seen anything other than themselves or members of their group.

They're looking at an airplane. Supposedly they've never even seen people other than what they have grown up with, ever. There's new information coming in about them and we're going to be sharing it with you, that's ahead.

Welcome back. First, though, let's talk about this breakup that many would argue is long and coming. Barack Obama is cutting his ties with his church of 20 years because, again, comments from the church have impacted his campaign.

Here's CNN's Christian Farr reporting from Chicago.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

He's a free man. He can do what he wants to do.

CHRISTIAN FARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As they file into the church, many walk past the stand selling Obama '08 merchandise.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

FARR: Everything from hats and T-shirts to buttons with Obama and the pastor whose comments first put this church under the microscope. Jeremiah Wright.

REV. JEREMIAH WRIGHT, FORMER PASTOR, TRINITY CHURCH: No, no, no, not God bless America, God (BLEEP) America!

FARR: But what may have triggered his ultimate decision to leave Trinity were remarks made by visiting priests and community activists, Father Michael Pfleger who mocked Obama's Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton, a week ago.

REV. MICHAEL PFLEGER, VISITING CATHOLIC PRIEST: I'm white! I'm entitled! There's a black man stealing my show!

FARR: At his own church today, Pfleger made a public apology.

PFLEGER: I am deeply sorry, and I pray that my apology will be accepted even by those who have told me they won't accept it.

FARR: For many, Obama had no choice.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: But it's clear that now that I'm a candidate for president, every time something is said in the church by anyone associated with Trinity, including guest pastors, the remarks will be imputed to me even if they totally conflict with my long-held views, statements and principles.

KEN DANIEL, CHURCH MEMBER: It's the decision he had to make. I mean, he's running for president of the United States. And these things are happening and it causing him issues he has to make the decision to extricate himself from the situation that causing those problems.

FARR: Is that disappointing that he had to -- did he sell out by having to --

DANIEL: No, he didn't sell out. For me, he didn't sell out. He was put in this position by somebody else.

FARR: During today's service, the loss of Obama and his family was not the subject of Trinity senior pastor Reverend Otis Moss' sermon.

REV. OTIS MOSS, PASTOR, TRINITY CHURCH: I have some good news that we'll not be printed in the paper. I have some good news that we'll not be on the television. I have some good news that we'll be passed down from generation to generation. I have some news about a loving God who cares about and love people.

FARR (on camera): Reverend Moss did issue a statement which said in part that "We are saddened by the news. We understand that this is a personal decision." Obama is in search of a new Church home, one which he says he hopes he can sit quietly in the pew and have a nice reflection.

Christian Farr, CNN, Chicago.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: There's obviously a lot to talk about here. But let's bring in our Republican strategist Cheri Jacobus, and our Democratic strategist, Keith Boykin. My thanks to both of you. Let me do this.

Those of you who are watching this right now at home, I want you to watch Reverend Pfleger's comments once again. And as you're watching it, and I want Keith -- you and Cheri to do the same -- watch it and tell me or think through what he did wrong. What's wrong with it? How it affects you as you watch it. Roger, hit it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PFLEGER: And then out of nowhere came, hey, I'm Barack Obama and she said oh, damn! Where did you come from? I'm white! I'm entitled! There's a black man stealing my show!

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Keith, how does that hit you?

BOYKIN: Well, you know, two things he did wrong. First, he knows Barack Obama. And second, he went to Barack Obama's church and he gave that speech, that sermon. Had he gone to any other black church in American and said the same thing, I quite frankly don't think we would be discussing it. But they know we would not be discussing it.

And part of the problem is that the black church has a tradition and Cheri and I have talked about this before and debated in other shows. The black church has a tradition of speaking out and calling out injustice. Even when white pastors commonly do that.

SANCHEZ: But it's beyond the injustice. Let me bring Cheri into this. And I don't mean to interrupt but there was something about the dramatics. There was something about --

BOYKIN: But let me just say something --

SANCHEZ: All right, go ahead. And then I want to bring, Cheri. I want to hear Cheri's comment on this.

BOYKIN: Yes. It's not just about the dramatics; it's the way that people speak in the black church. I've been to a number of black churches throughout my entire life and quite frankly, they're always like that.

They always speak that way. (INAUDIBLE) people are unfamiliar with and that's the problem.

SANCHEZ: Let me just cut to the chase. A lot of people would look at that and say it's showboating at the expense of another human being. In this case, a standing senator running for the presidency of the United States.

Cheri?

JACOBUS: Look, the whole performance from that reverend -- that priest was abhorrent. And I think a lot of people can look at it as racist. I think the problem for Barack Obama is when he said was -- gee, it's because somebody else went to that church, because I went to that church, the comments are associated with me. That's really not it.

I mean, he can quit the church. He can give the wonderful speech on race and all these things that he's done. But the question that American people still have and what we've seen in this Democratic primaries is (INAUDIBLE) is that the big question is how could he have sat in that church for 20 years and listened to sermons like these. So when this keeps coming up it's a reminder to people.

And then, we're told --

SANCHEZ: But do you give him points for quitting today? The news today is he's leaving the church. He no longer wants his name associated with it.

(CROSSTALK)

JACOBUS: I'm sure. You know what? I think he had no choice. I think he probably should have done long time ago. But the real question has not been answered and maybe there isn't an answer. But I think America is just kind of -- the voters can't get their head around the fact that this post-racial candidate who was supposed -- he was so attracted to so many people from all walks of life, from all different backgrounds.

Suddenly they see this and he doesn't have an explanation for what he did for 20 years of Sundays. And I don't think we're going get one and it's going to continue to be a problem for him for the privacy of the voting booth and they vote their conscience.

SANCHEZ: (INAUDIBLE).

BOYKIN: I have an explanation, Cheri. Go to a black church. Don't talk about black churches and before you actually go to one, spend a moment, and find out what goes on in the black church.

I'm quite frankly disgusted and disappointed by the media pundits who go around criticizing everything that goes on in the black church without understanding the context in which these conversations are going on.

Yes, what this guy said was not something that anybody would want to be associated with who is running for president. No doubt about this. But let me tell you something. There are a lot of people out there in the black community who say things like this on a regular basis, irrespective, whether it's about Hillary Clinton or not.

There are lot of people in the black community who are used to going to a church and hearing people who speak this way. And the white community is uncomfortable when black people who speak this way or with white people who speak this way in front of black people.

JACOBUS: Keith, if I may, when I do these shows I get an awful lot of emails from people or they contact me through other people, rather. And the African-American people that say that I do not find that in my church. So to say that this happens in all black churches, I'm not black, so I can't speak to that directly.

But I have gotten a lot of feedback from people who are African- American who don't like being lumped into that category.

BOYKIN: I understand, you've got emails.

JACOBUS: There's also -- again, and then, whenever this is brought up as a plain of discussion that people are concern about, there is this angry hysteria from Obama supporters that we can't talk about this, that it shouldn't be an issue. But what we're finding is that American people still wonder about those 20 years of --

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: 30 seconds. Guys, guys, guys, 30 seconds left. I want to get this other issue in there because a lot of people have been talking about this as well. This is John McCain talking about Iraq -- the one thing that his people say he is most dominant on. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I can tell you that it is succeeding. I can look you in the eye and tell you it's succeeding. We have been drawn down to pre-surge levels. Basra, Mosul and now Sadr City are quiet.

(END VIDEO CLIP) SANCHEZ: He says we've drawn down the pre-surge levels and we have looked at the record and, Cheri Jacobus, he's wrong. In fact, not even close. He's off by tens of thousands of troops.

JACOBUS: Well, I think a better way to say it is that he was off by a month or so because this is going to be happening next month. And that's the difference. It's not that he just completely had a fact on, but he was off on his timing by a number of weeks.

SANCHEZ: Actually, no, Cheri. We looked at the record and in July he'll still be off by about 8,000.

JACOBUS: By the end of July?

SANCHEZ: Yes, because of not just the brigades, but other troops that have been added. We carefully looked at the record before going on the air with these things.

JACOBUS: I was mystified why he didn't say -- OK, I misspoke or I was off on the timing about this. But then I thought another thing that we've seen this before when it comes to other shows you've hosted on this network. This does get us talking about the surge and the fact that the surge is working. Then, we will have troops coming home. So, I'm not so sure it's a bad thing.

SANCHEZ: That's a good point. No, no. You know what --

(CROSSTALK)

JACOBUS: If he hadn't dug his heels in on his mistake we wouldn't even be talking about it. So, we're still talking about things on John McCain and we've seen this before.

SANCHEZ: That's a great point.

JACOBUS: We've seen this on your show last summer.

BOYKIN: Sherry, stop the filibuster. Let me speak please.

SANCHEZ: All right. No. But she makes a good point about the fact that John McCain makes a strong point about the surge suddenly being more effective than it has been in the past. Unfortunately, the facts were wrong.

Keith, go ahead, finish this off.

BOYKIN: Let me just say this, Rick. The reality is, if Barack Obama had made the same mistake that John McCain had made, the same series of mistakes that John McCain had made, we'd be saying he's unfit for the office of commander-in-chief.

If Barack Obama had not once, not twice, but three times gone to Iraq and confused the Sunnis with the Shiites, as John McCain has, we'd be saying he wasn't qualified to be president of the United States.

(CROSSTALK) BOYKIN: Let me finish this, Cheri. Let me finish this, Cheri. No, let me finish this, Cheri. If Barack Obama had gone to a marketplace and claimed that it was a safe place to be, while he was escorted by Humvees and Blackhawk helicopters and dozens of Americans troops --

SANCHEZ: All right, Keith.

JACOBUS: And as we know, Barack Obama won't do that because he won't go to Iraq. So I guess we'll never have the answer to that question.

SANCHEZ: You've made your point. Thanks to both. We appreciate you guys being on. Really interesting discussion. I'm sure the viewers enjoyed it as well.

Coming up, Barack Obama's campaign has made ground breaking use of the Internet as a campaign tool. For younger people, the question might be -- what took you so long?

Tonight, a "League of First Time Voters" exclusive on young people who are tuned in and turned on by the Internet and how they're using it for politics for the first time ever. Stay with us. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We've got a special report tonight on the people behind the candidates, the one who gave Hillary Clinton a makeup, comb John McCain's hair and provide Barack Obama with his Nicorette gum. We're going to profile these body people. That's coming up just ahead.

Welcome back, everybody, to the world headquarters here of CNN. I'm Rick Sanchez. There is a political movement under way in this country as we speak. It's something a lot of you probably don't know about. It's about people who are into the political process who in the past just could have given a flip. Many of them are very young and they're fueled by something that many of us who are not so young don't get or understand quite that well -- the Internet.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ (on camera): Our parents, which would be people like me, we basically got the news. We sat there and we listened to Walter Cronkite give it to us. Today, you guys talk to each other about the news.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we break the news.

SANCHEZ: Right. You guys are into this stuff. I mean, head first and all the way, right? What is that?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, we grew up in a much different era. I mean, I think every one of us has had a computer or been near technology since we were very young. It's just a way of life and sometimes there's a digital divide between young people and older people. SANCHEZ: Usage of technology has given you all access to each other, in sharing information, which has manifested itself into energized electorate, a youthful electorate.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In this election, part of what makes it so different is that there are these unifying experiences, where the online world has brought a lot of the youth vote together.

SANCHEZ: So, it's a grassroots effort that now can connect with each other.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

SANCHEZ: It's different.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) the electorate and that's notable because we see record unprecedented turnout. With the Internet and technology bubble, they're expanding the electorate and we're seeing it in real tangible numbers.

SANCHEZ: Because they're connecting with each other --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Exactly.

SANCHEZ: In ways that young people in the past could not connect with each other.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now, it's the youth voters who are e-mailing their parents these articles and these YouTube links. And they're googling things that they want to share with their family and their friends. And they're suddenly becoming the feeders of news in a way that they've never been before.

SANCHEZ: They went to the website. They looked at it themselves and they drew their own conclusions.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then they send it to their friends.

SANCHEZ: That's what the "League of First Time Voters" is doing?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that the internet and technology in general have just become such integral parts of our lives. I know if I go a day without looking on the computer, I have withdrawal. It's horrible.

SANCHEZ: Really?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's easy to go online and go to all these various media outlets and get different sides of all the stories. I think it's easier to shape your independent political view.

SANCHEZ: Would you say that that is the driving force behind the youth vote and the energized voting -- voters that we see out there? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's one of the driving forces and it allows us to network and communicate and then actually make it a reality by going to the polls. But at the same time, people are discontent. People want policy solutions. They're craving them on all different fronts, whether it's the Iraq war, health care, immigration.

And that's what we try to do. We try to report different angles and different beats on (INAUDIBLE) and allow young people to observe the news in all these different directions. But I think it's more than just the accessibility of the Internet. They're craving solutions.

And I think Barack Obama or John McCain will have to bring them in a bipartisan way, a new majority. And that's what they're both promising. And that's why people find them feeling. They're promising a new congressional majority as they step into the White House in January of next year.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: That is "The League of First Time Voters" with scoop '08 students from Massachusetts. The term scoop students refers to young people -- many of them are aspiring journalists, by the way, who get their news and information from the web, share it with one another and they are politically energized.

I really love doing this. Going all over the country and talking to people who are part of an uprising. Speaking of the word uprising, there's a new book out written by David Sirota, who's been a guest on this show on a bevy of occasions.

David Sirota is joining us now from Philadelphia.

I saw you on "Colbert" the other day. And he said this is -- what did he say? He said you're like Che Guevara talking or leading a revolt. Is that what's going on in this country with all these people who are newly energized, who haven't been before?

DAVID SIROTA, AUTHOR/COLUMNIST: I certainly think so. It's a convergence of people's anger at the current establishment and all of these new technologies which allow them to vent their anger. What we saw on the last piece about the Internet is absolutely right. People are able to connect together without the permission of an intermediary, without the permission of an establishment.

SANCHEZ: But you know what this -- you know what this makes me harken back to? I remember when -- I think it was Clinton that was running for office, maybe even before Bill Clinton. And we'd see young people on MTV and the candidates would go there and play their saxophones and everybody was talking about how young people are really into it.

This is different, isn't it? Because that really didn't muster up any big, energized support.

SIROTA: That's right. This is about organizing. What's going on across the country, and I reported this book for about a year going all over the country. What I saw is that technology is bringing people together. It's allowing them to organize, whereas before, the young people were brought into a broadcast medium.

This is allowing young people to talk to each other, people from all over the country, to talk to one another, and most importantly, organize around issues. They can organize around health care. They can organize around fighting the war. So, that's what is really, I think, converging here.

SANCHEZ: And it's really happening all over the country and I can almost hear viewers who are watching this conversation that you and I are having right now. And the question that they would want me to ask is the following. To who's benefit? What will be the fruit of this in the end?

SIROTA: Well, look, I say in the book that this uprising can go in a progressive direction or it can go in a more conservative direction. What it is, I think, though, at its core needs to be a small "the democratic uprising." That democracy is fueled by people being involved. You know, as the great organizer Saul Linsky, who said the great objective of any movement is to let the people's will become the determining factor.

And so all of this technology, all of this organizing, ultimately, you'd hope helps better express the public will. Because the problem we have in this country right now is that the establishment is not representing the will of the people on all sorts of issues. The country wants universal healthcare. The country wants out of Iraq. The country wants a different energy policy. And we're getting none of that.

SANCHEZ: So, these issues are then being reflected by groups on the outside. And, by the way, immigration is another big one that people are dealing with as well. They don't feel the government's dealing with it so they're dealing with it in their own way and they're matching their own concerns and wits. This is fascinating. Again, the book is called the "Uprising." David Sirota joining us from Philadelphia.

David, be good.

SIROTA: Thanks for having me, Rick. All right, man.

SANCHEZ: Coming up, the President of the United States doing this at the Air Force Academy. Why? We figure because he can.

But first, there are actually people who are paid to give Obama Nicorette, comb McCain's hair and do Clinton's makeup. That's what they do. They are the "body people," when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: How about this now. When John McCain needs his hair combed, who takes care of him? When Hillary Clinton needs a little powder because she's shining, who takes care of her? And when Barack Obama needs that Nicorette gum, who takes care of him? This is an amazing story. Josh Levs joining us now.

These are called "body people." They actually hang around with the candidates and -- can we go to your report?

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, sure. Let's take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEVS (voice-over): As the candidates scurry all over the country -- talking, shaking hands, and posing for pictures -- who makes sure all the right people get talked to, the most important hands get shaken, the best photos snapped? That often falls to the top personal aide known as the "body person."

HUMA ABEDIN, CLINTON TRAVELING CHIEF OF STAFF: Right here. OK.

LEVS: For Clinton, it's Huma Abedin, traveling chief of staff. Her work catching every detail for Clinton over the years has helped turn into what the "New York Observer" called a mythical figure in New York and Washington politics.

Amid campaign chaos, it's up to her to make sure everything runs smoothly.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA, (D-IL) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Mr. Reggie love. Give it up for Reggie Love.

LEVS: At a rally in Charlotte, Barack Obama recently thanked his body man, a 26-year-old former Duke basketball player, whose duties include playing with the senator and other tasks.

OBAMA: Come on up here, because I want to get rid of my jacket. Reggie! Reggie!

LEVS: "The New York Times" reports that Love carries a tide pen to wipe spills off the senator's tie, saying he, quote, "has turned himself into a dispensary of sharpies, stationery, protein bars, throat lozenges, water, tea, Advil, Tylenol, Purell and emergency Nicorette."

John McCain's campaign has sometimes has a double up on how many tasks one person takes on. The "New Yorker" reported in February, "In a campaign that has been forced to do more with less, his press secretary, Brooke Buchanan, also served as his "body woman," taking care of everything from spraying down stray strands of hair, to making sure that he's well caffeinated."

As the campaign wears on, having a body person lets the candidate know someone's got his or her back, often literally.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: These are important people. I imagine that --

LEVS: Yes, they are.

SANCHEZ: They serve them well. These people get to the White House. They -- imagine -- do they keep them?

LEVS: Yes. Oh, it pays off. Yes, yes, they get to go to the White House with them if they want to as a rule. In fact, we have some video here. Let's take a look at this Blake Gottesman.

He was the body man for President Bush back in the 2000 during that race. He then became a part of the administration, special assistant to the president. He still remained the body man. Then I was reading a line, in 2006, he left the administration, went to Harvard Business School even though he didn't have a college degree.

SANCHEZ: So, this isn't new. I mean, to have other people running for office. You know, by the way, it makes sense.

LEVS: Yes.

SANCHEZ: I mean, you know, you've got to make appearances all the time. You might as well make sure you don't have some sticking out of your hat or something.

LEVS: Look, and if you're out to campaign trail, you go to all these different states to the point that you don't even know what state you're in sometimes. You need someone who knows absolutely everything you need and you have to look your best at all times. Sure. I would love to have one. You're a big anchor. You should have one.

SANCHEZ: But yes -- I do, I do. In fact, they're right over here somewhere.

Wait, wait, the name, the body people. It sounds like something out of a science fiction thing.

LEVS: People think it's either like a body double or it's just something scary involving an alien.

SANCHEZ: It's really more like an image consultant/handler.

LEVS: Slash a lot of things, yes. Slash walking grocery store.

SANCHEZ: Slash, slash, slash. You're the best. Thanks, Josh.

SANCHEZ: If I had one I would haven't worn that sailor suit to do that interview earlier.

By the way, look at this. What do you call a group of people who have never been seen before? It's the lost tribe of the Amazon revealed and we are going tight on that picture.

And then, you've seen it in sports arenas, but who knew. You were allowed to chest pump -- the president. Oh, God. We'll be back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Let's go to Jacqui real quick and find out what's going on with some storms that have been barreling across the United States.

What do you got, Jacqui?

(WEATHER REPORT)

SANCHEZ: We are going to show you some people who no one knows much about -- language, identity, but we do have some new anthropological information. We're going to go in tight. Stay with us. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHYMEAN NOUN, CHAMPIONING CHILDREN (through translator): We're standing on the big dump site. The scavengers are collecting cans, plastic bags and other things that can be sold to buy rice. There are a lot of children here. I have seen many kids get killed by trucks. They work here for about 10 to 12 hours a day, and they make about $1.30. Sometimes they don't make any money at all.

One day at lunch I was eating chicken. And when I threw it away, 10 children ran straight to the trash to collect the bones. I wanted to do something to help them.

My name is Phymean. I recruit children from this dump to attend school at my organization. I want them to have an opportunity to learn.

NOUN: Good morning how are you?

UNIDENTIFIED CHILDREN: Fine, thank you.

NOUN (through translator): Some kids in my school collect trash until late at night. And they fall asleep in the classroom. If they don't have an education, some kids will collect trash until the day they die. It continues from one generation to the next.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): When I was at the dump, sometimes I was speared by broken glass, needles and razor. The school provided me education, materials and a place to eat.

NOUN (through translator): These children are our next generation, and our country depends on them.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: There's good pictures, then there is sequential good pictures. This is the president of the United States. You saw sequence number one. And there is how it ends.

By the way, the presidents of the United States doing the chest thump at the Military Academy Air Force, right? Air Force. Thank you very much.

All right. And this is the picture that everyone's been talking about. We've got some new information. We've been checking some anthropological websites and here's what we found.

All right, this right here, all right. You see that right there. Roger, take it back if you would. You went a little too soon for me, baby. Take it back and you put that other picture.

Anyway, that other picture we were showing you right there. OK, that was a Malocust (ph) hut. There it is right there. You see the distance between that and the ground. That's used as a community gathering for these people. This is where they cook. This is where they prepare their dyes. These are the men. They're wearing red dye which is a sign of aggression.

This is their settlement which is not too far away from it and we are out of time. My goodness. I wanted to show you more on that. I wish I could. We'll do it next week. No problem. Amazon jungle, a group of people that they think has never seen anybody else before.