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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Floods in the Midwest; Mortgage Questions; Amnesty Agenda Groups Embrace Hate Speech; Obama Pushes for Latino Votes; Outsourcing Safety; Salmonella Outbreak; Expired Medicine; Violent Weather; McCain Challenges Obama; NBC's Tim Russert; CNN Heroes
Aired June 13, 2008 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KITTY PILGRIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Wolf.
Tonight floods in the Midwest kill at least five people, towns and cities under water. One of this country's leading authorities on extreme weather will join me.
Tonight the pro amnesty open border lobby using nasty and aggressive tactics. Some illegal immigration advocates saying Gestapo-like tactics.
And tonight rising anger over the outsourcing of aircraft maintenance to cheap, overseas labor markets, all that and much more from the independent perspective straight ahead tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion for Friday, June 13th. Live from New York, sitting in for Lou Dobbs, Kitty Pilgrim.
PILGRIM: Good evening, everybody.
The flood crisis in the Midwest tonight is worsening. Officials have ordered thousands of people to leave their homes. Some of the region's biggest cities are under water or at risk. In Iowa flood water is threatening to overwhelm the levee system in Des Moines. The flood waters are expected to peak tonight. Dan Simon is in Des Moines with the very latest. Dan?
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi Kitty. Iowa State Capitol in a state of emergency tonight. City officials are concerned are that the levee system is in danger of failure. You can see the State Capitol behind me, but you can also see the Des Moines River and you can see that it's dangerously close to topping that bridge over there.
We're in downtown Des Moines and this area is under a voluntarily evacuation order. Same goes for some of the other neighborhoods in low-lying areas. All day we've been watching people fill up sandbags, do whatever they can to try to protect their property. The next 24 hours are said to be critical because the river is expected to crest sometime tonight.
About 8:00 tonight so officials say we should know by tomorrow morning how the city will do. Meanwhile, Kitty, as you can tell, it is a very nice day out and city officials are concerned that people may have a false sense of security but bottom line all the rains that we've seen over the last few days have taken their toll and it has taken its toll on the Des Moines River which, again, is expected to crest sometime tonight. Kitty?
PILGRIM: Dan, have the emergency crews been able to get in to help people?
SIMON: Well, right now, it is a voluntarily evacuation order, so no real flooding to speak of in the neighborhoods but the concern is, is once the river continues to rise, that they actually may see some flooding but they're prepared. They have a good infrastructure in place to help folks if necessary, Kitty.
PILGRIM: All right, thanks very much -- Dan Simon.
Well, the center of Iowa's second biggest city, Cedar Rapids, is already under water. More than 3,000 people have fled their homes. Four hundred city blocks have been flooded. Sean Callebs reports from Cedar Rapids. Now, Sean, how serious is the situation in Cedar Rapids tonight?
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, it's very serious. Kitty, because you can see here the Cedar River jumped its banks. That's a pretty good slice of what suburban neighborhoods and much of the city look like this evening. Again, you heard Dan talk about this weather out here, beautiful, sunny day, blue skies, clouds.
We have seen a lot of people out trying to get to their homes. Many are concerned that they may have animals in there. They're trying to get back. It is a big problem for the National Guard. I can see a National Guard boat coming toward us now. They were trying to keep people out of this water.
That is the major concern. Just a horrific flooding here in this area, this is historic flooding. Cedar River has never been higher, above 31 feet. You mentioned the 400 downtown blocks, they are under water. The big problem there, Mercy Hospital (ph), it had to be closed. It's been evacuated.
They have moved other patients to other hospitals. We have seen that mirrored at nursing homes in the area, as well. But Kitty, if there's one thing you want to take away from this, the emergency officials, the police, fire department, National Guard, they have been out here ahead of this flood and telling people to evacuate their homes.
Three thousand people evacuated, there have been no serious injuries. There have been no deaths because of this flooding and that's a real testament to how well this area was prepared. How well they got the word out and how well people followed it, but the big concern is the fact that this river has crested.
It is now moving back a little bit. If you look up there, there's one pink mark there. That was the high point about three or four hours ago, so it has come back very significantly in a short period of time. However, the authorities tell us it is going to be until June 18th before it goes back to a safe level and June 24th before the river retreats back to where it was. And that is, Kitty, of course, if they get no more rain here in the interim -- Kitty, back to you.
PILGRIM: Sean, this sounds like a very orderly progression on planning here. What's the prognosis on the water? And when might people get back?
CALLEBS: That's a great question. No one knows exactly when they are going to be able to get back in and that is a problem. Because you can see these houses that are barely under water, some have cats and dogs in them and people have tried to get out there to get to them and the Guard who came up here a while ago said they aren't doing any animal rescues right now.
There's apparently one boat that has been designated to do animal rescues, so there are people who are concerned about that and the last thing anybody wants is the fact they have avoided the worst, someone to wade out in this now, step into a manhole that may have lost its cover or a storm drain, stumble into something even worse, lose his or her life, so they're really trying to stress safety. You may lose some property, some property damage, but please use your head in a case like this and don't do anything silly.
PILGRIM: Well absolutely, Sean, and that's a very stressful situation for any family to be having their pets at risk like that. Also, Sean Callebs thanks very much for your reporting. Thank you, Sean.
We do have severe flooding. It is causing chaos in other parts of the Midwest as well. Let's tell you about it. One person killed by flooding in Minnesota. One in Michigan. Three in Indiana. Now tornadoes also ripped across the region, four teenagers killed at a Boy Scout camp in Iowa Wednesday night. Two people killed when tornadoes touched down in Kansas.
Residents of the town of Chapman (ph) tonight trying to clear up debris. A tornado there cut a wide path through the center of town. We also have severe weather in the Midwest. It is taking a very heavy toll on farmers.
Thousands of acres of farm land are under water and that means that working men and women could face higher food prices. Corn, wheat, soybean prices all up sharply on the commodity markets. Corn prices risen 22 percent rise since the end of May. Wheat is up 15 percent. Soybeans up 7 percent.
Governor Chet Culver of Iowa says he's extremely concerned about the damage to the agricultural sector. Crop damage could also drive up fuel prices. The Midwest is a big producer of corn that is used to make ethanol.
Now later in this broadcast, NOAA meteorologist Greg Carbon (ph) will give us his assessment of what's next for the Midwest.
And still ahead, new efforts on Capitol Hill defy the will of the people and to ram illegal alien amnesty down the throats of the American people.
Also, a revealing comment about Senator Obama's view of our illegal immigration crisis -- you do not want to miss that. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: There are questions tonight about mortgages given to at least two influential senators. Those mortgages coming from a company at the center of the housing crisis. Brian Todd reports from Washington.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, Chris Dodd has tried to crack down on companies accused of predatory mortgage lending at the center of the home foreclosure crisis. He's pushed for more regulation and even criminal charges against some lenders.
SEN. CHRISTOPHER DODD (D), CONNECTICUT: Obviously, they've been engaging in practices in some instances where they knew the borrowers were incapable of meeting their financial obligations.
TODD: But one company being investigated for fraud in the mortgage crisis, Countrywide Financial Corporation, reportedly gave Senator Dodd cut rate deals on two loans. Deals not available to the general public. According to a report in "Conde Nast Portfolio" (ph) magazine, Dodd's fellow Democrat Kent Conrad, chairman of the Senate Budge Committee, got similar deals.
The magazine cites internal documents and e-mails saying "Countrywide CEO, Angelo Mazzulo (ph), directed staffers to give lower interest rates and points to influential people." Countrywide didn't return our calls and e-mail. Contacted by CNN, Dodd and Conrad reacted with outrage to the report.
They acknowledge they got competitive rates, but both say they never sought favorable treatment and were not aware they were getting it. Records from Conrad's office show he got below market rates for one property on at least two occasions but in a telephone interview Conrad said this about Countrywide's loan for another property, an apartment building in Bismarck, North Dakota.
SEN. KENT CONRAD (D), NORTH DAKOTA (via phone): With respect to the Bismarck property, which was a loan of less than $100,000, that I actually paid above market rates.
TODD: There's no evidence of anything illegal here. And one watchdog group says Dodd and Conrad may not have violated Senate ethics rules if they didn't know they were getting loans not available to the public but...
MELANIE SLOAN, CITIZENS FOR RESP. & ETHICS: Particularly I think for Senator Dodd being on the Banking Committee and then getting a loan that is at such a better rate than what is generally available, I think that's going to be a tough sell politically. How did he really not know this loan was on such better terms?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: Melanie Sloan says her group is calling for a Senate ethics investigation of these deals but the two senators are hammering home the point they believe they did nothing wrong. Senator Conrad says he's never met Angelo Mazzulo (ph) in person, says he has only spoken to him once over the phone. Kitty?
PILGRIM: Brian, other than Dodd and Conrad, are there any other prominent names that are being mentioned?
TODD: There are. The magazine "Portfolio" reports that former HUD Secretary Alphonso Jackson (ph), former Health and Human Services Secretary Donna Shalala (ph), and former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. Richard Holbrook (ph) also got favorable treatment in the so-called VIP program at Countrywide. We tried to contact all three of those people. We did hear from Holbrook's (ph) attorney who said he didn't get any favorable treatment, didn't seek it, and didn't have contact with the people at Countrywide in question here.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much -- Brian Todd. Thanks Brian.
Well, more open borders and amnesty advocates are comparing immigration law enforcement efforts with Nazi Germany's Gestapo. Now these groups have accused Lou of lowering the level of the debate on illegal immigration, but in point of fact, they are the ones using hate speech to cloud the issue. Casey Wian has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): California officials Thursday shut down Merced (ph) farm labor. The company that employed 17-year-old illegal alien Maria Isabel Vasquez Huminez (ph). She died last month of suspected heat exposure suffered on the job.
Company attorney Jim Gumberd (ph) told the "Sacramento Bee" the state was using Gestapo-like tactics. That phrase may sound familiar. A year ago as the Senate prepared to reject legislation granting amnesty to illegal aliens, Senator Ted Kennedy said this of the bill's opponents.
SEN. EDWARD KENNEDY (D), MASSACHUSETTS: Try and find them. Develop a type of Gestapo here to seek out these people that are in the shadows. That's their alternative?
WIAN: Since then, nearly a dozen lawmakers, activists and commentators have compared efforts by federal immigration agents to enforce the law to the Gestapo, Nazi Germany's secret police. California Congressman Sam Farr (ph) accused Immigration and Customs Enforcement of Gestapo-type tactics, so did an attorney suing the government for allegedly detaining temporarily some legal residents while it arrested 138 suspected illegal aliens at a Los Angeles technology company.
One organization devoted to tracking down former Nazis and educating about the horrors of the holocaust says the Gestapo operated as judge, jury and executioner in Nazi Germany's genocide against Jews.
RABBI ABRAHAM COOPER, SIMON WIESENTHAL CENTER: Gestapo is the ultimate terror arm of a terrorist state that committed genocide and mass murder.
WIAN: The Wiesenthal Center does not take a position on the illegal immigration debate but says the Gestapo comparisons are inappropriate.
RABBI COOPER: Not every human rights violation or controversy should be put into the context of Nazis, Nazism, mass murder, genocide. When we do that, we demean history and we debase the discourse on very critical social issues of the day.
WIAN: The lawyer for the company that employed Huminez (ph) told LOU DOBBS TONIGHT his remarks were quote, "probably taken a little out of context", though he didn't deny using the word Gestapo.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: Mr. Gumberd (ph) says there was no evidence Merced (ph) farm labor presented any sort of imminent threat to other workers and he accuses the state of quote, "shooting first and asking questions later." In a statement California Governor Schwarzenegger told companies obey the law or be shut down. He said worker safety from heat illness must and will be protected in California, hardly Gestapo- like tactics, Kitty.
PILGRIM: That's absolutely right. Thanks very much -- Casey Wian.
Well the alleged leader of a Mexican crime ring is in California and in jail tonight. He is awaiting extradition to Mexico. The FBI arrested the man outside a DMV office in Riverside (ph), California last week. He is accused of running a gang suspected of trafficking drugs and committing kidnappings and murders in Mexico. At least 1,400 people have been killed so far this year in Mexico's rapidly escalating drug violence.
Some members of Congress are renewing their call for amnesty for illegal aliens. The Congressional Hispanic Caucus is warning Senator Obama he could lose the Latino vote if he doesn't continue to support amnesty. Meanwhile, Senator Bob Menendez is stepping up the rhetoric again. Senator Menendez is accusing the Immigration and Customs of racial profiling. Lisa Sylvester has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Senator Barack Obama has been struggling to win the Latino vote. During the Democratic primaries on Super Tuesday, he received only 35 percent of their vote; Senator Hillary Clinton 63 percent.
ARTURO VARGAS, NAT'L ASSN. OF LATINO ELECTED & APPOINTED OFFICIALS: There really wasn't an opportunity for Barack Obama to introduce himself to Latino voters. He needs to get out there and do that. He needs to listen to Latino voters and understand what they care about.
SYLVESTER: Many Hispanic political leaders want an explicit amnesty pledge, leading to citizenship for illegal aliens. The Obama campaign supports comprehensive immigration reform. In a statement it tried to clarify the position stating quote, "It's not that we will grant citizenship, but we strongly support requiring them to legalize their status and allowing them to earn their right to commit to this country and eventually become citizens."
Latino groups see with a new administration an opportunity to tilt the immigration debate in favor of an amnesty agenda. And they have been vocal. The Congressional Hispanic Caucus recently blasting opponents of a path to citizenship for illegal aliens as promoting fear mongering and intolerance and Senator Robert Menendez this week sharply criticizing recent raids by the Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
SEN. ROBERT MENENDEZ (D), NEW JERSEY: Our legitimate desire to control our borders has too often turned into a witch hunt against Hispanic Americans and other people of color.
SYLVESTER: The Center for Immigration Studies, which favors a tighter immigration policy, does not believe the outspoken approach of Latino leaders will carry much weight with voters weary of the nation's broken borders.
STEVE CAMAROTA, CENTER FOR IMMIGRATION STUDIES: Most Americans recognize the United States should have some immigration, but that there are real problems of enforcement and control and numbers and so I think that although they can say these things in efforts to silence their opponents, it is not clear that it's all that effective.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Now with Clinton out of the race, Obama has been trying to win some of her Hispanic supporters, but Obama's opponent Senator John McCain has been popular among some Hispanics as one of the original authors of that comprehensive immigration bill in the Senate. Kitty?
PILGRIM: Thanks very much -- Lisa Sylvester.
Well a revealing quote tonight about Senator Obama's views on the illegal immigration crisis and that quote from Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean. Dean said this week that, quote, "Obama believes we need to have some enforcement of the law, but does not believe we ought to scapegoat people."
Now, the phrase "scapegoat people" usually precedes a call for amnesty. In fact, Senator Obama is a supporter of the amnesty agenda. And he voted for the so-called comprehensive immigration reform bill, which if it had passed would have given amnesty to millions of illegal aliens. He supports handing out driver's licenses to illegal aliens and the senator says if elected, he will review the government's plan to secure our southern border by building 700 miles of new border fence. So that brings us to our poll tonight.
Do you believe enforcing the law is "scapegoating"? Yes or no? Cast your vote at loudobbs.com. We'll bring you the results later in the broadcast.
Coming up, federal lawmakers want to make sure our airlines don't put profits before safety. But what if they have been waiting for? We'll have the independent perspective in a special report.
And rising flood waters, violent weather continue to threaten America's heartland. A leading government meteorologist will join me here, so stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Coming up, Indian outsourcing firms seem to think Senator Obama would be the outsourcer in chief. We'll have that story and a great deal more straight ahead, stay with us.
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PILGRIM: Gas prices hit another new record high today. The national average for a gallon of regular unleaded is $4.06 a gallon. This is the sixth consecutive day of new record highs. Gas prices are more than $1 higher than this time last year.
AAA reports gas prices averaging more than $4 a gallon in 27 states and the District of Columbia. The cheapest gas in the country is in Missouri, $3.84 a gallon. The most expensive in California, $4.56 a gallon.
There is a new effort tonight on Capitol Hill to stop an airline industry practice that could put passengers at risk. Many U.S. airlines have their maintenance work done outside the country, in uncertified facilities. The new legislation would require that U.S. aircraft maintenance be performed at a federally certified facility. Bill Tucker reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's a flier's nightmare. A plane exploding in flames like this China air flight last year, the result of an error in maintenance. Critics of the U.S. airline industry worry that the industry's trend to outsource the maintenance of its planes in particular the outsourcing of work to foreign repair shops is compromising safety, even though there are no studies to support that.
According to a 2005 Federal Aviation Administration Inspector General's report, half of the maintenance of domestic carriers was being done at facilities outside of the United States. More recent numbers are not available. There are roughly 4,200 FAA certified domestic repair facilities and the FAA says there's just over 700 outside of the country which are inspected once a year. But there's a big difference.
JAMES HOFFA, INT'L BROTHERHOOD OF TEAMSTERS: In the United States, people have to be certified. The mechanics have to be certified. They have to be drug tested. They have to have basically all kinds of background checks and in these foreign repair stations, they don't.
TUCKER: To eliminate the double standard, Senators Claire McCaskill and Arlene Specter have introduced the Safe Air Act of 2008. The legislation would significantly change the rules governing the way maintenance is done overseas.
Currently, it is legal for carriers to have work done at non- certified shops. The bill would require those shops be identified and then require that U.S. aircraft use only FAA-certified facilities, that foreign facilities be inspected twice a year, once by surprise.
Comply with TSA security standards and directives and subject employees to drug and alcohol testing. The primary sponsor of the bill calls it simple common sense.
SEN. CLAIRE MCCASKILL (D), MISSOURI: We have foreign repair stations in countries that our own State Department has recognized as havens for terrorist activity. We actually found a member of al Qaeda under the hood of an airplane a number of years ago. The GAO Office and auditor found that.
TUCKER: The Teamsters and the International Association of Machinists both support the bill.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: The Air Transport Association says air travel is safer now than ever, but despite repeated efforts the ATA did not respond to our request for comment on the bill as to whether they supported it or didn't. There is no question that outsourcing of maintenance of aircrafts is now the industry standard and much of that work if not all, most of it is done overseas. From 2000 to 2007, the seven major carriers have slashed their maintenance employee payrolls by more than 42 percent, Kitty.
PILGRIM: That's an unbelievably disturbing story. Thanks very much.
TUCKER: Yeah.
PILGRIM: Bill Tucker.
Well India's high tech industry tonight is jumping on the Barack Obama bandwagon and it believes he will support the outsourcing of American jobs. Now Obama has said that he would end tax breaks for companies that send jobs overseas, but Indian executives say it is inevitable that Obama will support the outsourcing of jobs. Indian business interests have begun a lobbying campaign to influence American lawmakers about, quote, "the positive impact of growing Indian investment in the United States."
Coming up, the Food and Drug Administration says it's closer to finding the source of a deadly salmonella outbreak in tomatoes. We'll have a special report on that.
Also, violent weather causing chaos in many areas of the country and one of the world's leading authorities on extreme weather will join us.
And independently-minded voters are angry, frustrated with McCain and Obama. Three top political analysts will join us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion and independent view. Here again, Kitty Pilgrim.
PILGRIM: The Food and Drug Administration tonight says it is closer to finding the source of the salmonella outbreak that has sickened more than 200 people, but the FDA says it still cannot confirm where the contaminated tomatoes came from and as Louise Schiavone reports, the FDA still has not sent any inspectors to any farms.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Health officials know the timeframe -- the illnesses began in April, continued into May and June. They know the type of produce, roma, plum and round red tomatoes, all of the vine, but as to where the produce was from.
DR DAVID ACHESON, ASSOC COMMISSIONER FOR FOODS, FDA: We are getting closer, but as of yet, there is no specific geographic location identified.
SCHIAVONE: There are so many states on the government's all clear list, we can identify the 14 states the FDA has not cleared from Oregon in the northwest, to Arizona in the southwest, parts of the Plains, new England and Florida. The Food and Drug Administration confirms that nationwide, the vast majority of tomatoes consumed at the time of the outbreak came from Florida and Mexico. And yet...
ACHESON: We have not sent investigators into any farms yet because we don't know where to send them.
SCHIAVONE: With one death and more than 200 illnesses, including at least 25 hospitalizations, associated with the salmonella outbreak, farmers, consumers and lawmakers are demanding answers.
REP DIANA DEGETTE (D), COLORADO: My constituents are, frankly, mystified why in the 21st century the United States does not have a food safety system on a par with Europe and many of the other industrialized countries where the FDA has the authority to recall bad food products, where we can trace where the food products came from. SCHIAVONE: Last year, Mexico dominated the U.S. tomato import market, shipping in more than two billion pounds of tomatoes, both field and hothouse, far outpacing Canada's quarter of a billion pounds.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
And so, Kitty, this week draws to a close with a no resolution and a perplexing new question: Nine of those affected had eaten at a restaurant chain. The FDA says it will not identify the chain because this piece of the puzzle is still part of an open investigation.
PILGRIM: You know, Louise, this is unbelievable. This is not a minor outbreak, this is for two weeks now and it is not a minor thing and yet, no information is coming forward.
SCHIAVONE: That's right, and now we are up to just a little bit more than a dozen states that we know there's a possibility that the source could be -- that the tomatoes could be from and we don't know about Mexico, whether or not Mexico is a source. Florida and Mexico the two big suppliers of tomatoes, for April to May, in this country, and we don't know whether or not those tomatoes came from Mexico or Florida.
PILGRIM: It's incomprehensive, this little information that is known about this big of a problem in this country.
SCHIAVONE: And you know what? It's maddening to the FDA, too, to the investigators, themselves. And as we have discussed many, many times on this program, they have not had the infrastructure to be able to handle this.
PILGRIM: Clearly not. And this is clear evidence. Thanks very much, Louise Schiavone.
Well, salmonella is the most common cause of food poisoning, 76 million Americans have food poisoning every year, according to the Centers for Disease Control -- 300,000 people are hospitalized with it. And 5,000 Americans die each year from food borne illnesses.
Well, our government, tonight, is also failing to assure the safety of our medicine. There are stunning new reports tonight that hundreds of drugstores in New York State sold expired food, baby formula and medication and some of that medicine was years pasted its expiration date when it was sold.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice over): Thousands of products, over the counter drugs, infant formula, eggs, milk, some are expired for months or even years, sold at hundreds of Rite Aid stores and CVS stores in the New York area.
ERIC CORNGOLD, DE PATTY GENERAL, NEW YORK: Disturbingly, what our investigation has found at Rite Aid and CVS is not a few isolated problems -- 60 percent of the CVS stores visited and more than 43 percent of the Rite Aid stores visited sold expired products.
PILGRIM: This is not the first time legal action has been taken against Rite Aid. Further investigation, by LOU DOBBS TONIGHT, reveals that in 1999, Rite Aid settled a similar suit in California and agreed to hire someone to oversee FDA compliance. Rite Aid also a defendant in a 2006 lawsuit filed in the state of New Jersey. The suit is ongoing. That same year, New Jersey sued the Duane Reade chain for selling expired products.
New York State caught CVS doing the same thing in 2003. This week, in New York, CVS issued the following statement:
"We will work aggressively to ensure that our review and removal procedures are followed consistently in all of our stores."
The New York attorney general accuses CVS of economic fraud.
ANDREW M CUOMO, NEW YORK ATTY GENERAL: The law says you can't sell expired products to consumers, period.
PILGRIM: Rite Aid says the company policy is not to sell the products and will start a nationwide investigation. Officials issued a warning to consumers to be vigilant, but some say the burden should not be on the consumer.
CHARLES BELL, CONSUMERS UNION: There are pretty strong, firm FDA guidelines about the expiration for over the counter medications. The question is really what sort of oversight do you have at the state and local level and how consistently is it applied?
PILGRIM: And the cautious consumer is no substitute for enforcement of existing laws.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Now, the FDA, today, told us that it has not initiated any cases against large chain drugstores involving expired medications in the last five years. The FDA said, "We applaud what New York is doing."
Still ahead, extreme and deadly weather across the country, this week. A leading weather expert tells us what to expect in the months ahead. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: As we have been reporting, here tonight, the toll of the severe weather in the Midwest continues to grow. In Iowa, up to 10,000 people have been forced from their homes. Flood waters along the Cedar River continue to rise. In the city of Cedar Rapids, more than 400 city blocks are under water. Greg Carbin is a meteorologist at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, and he is the Storm Prediction Center. He joins us from there and he joins me now from Norman, Oklahoma.
Greg, thanks so much for being with us.
GREG CARBIN, NTL OCEANIC & ATMOSPHERIC ADMIN: Good evening, Kitty.
PILGRIM: You know, I have to say, we have seen extraordinarily severe weather all week and we have a map where we can see the areas of major flooding. Now, one meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Iowa called this a historic event. Would you agree with that assessment?
CARBIN: Well certainly, the Midwest is being besieged by flooding, rains and heavy -- heavy winds and tornadoes over the last week and the conditions there are certainly unusual and extreme, certainly using the word historic is not out of the question.
PILGRIM: Yeah. You know, I have looked at some of the statistics. Now, the river levels are expected to peak tonight at 32 feet in the Midwest. In the worst flood in recent history, in 1993, the peak was just under 20 feet and that was the record. These are extraordinary conditions, aren't they?
CARBIN: Well, '93 is the last time we saw flooding across Iowa of this magnitude and the problem now becomes, as that flood crest moves downstream and into the Mississippi River Valley, and if we continue to see widespread thunderstorm events and heavy rains in these areas, flooding is going to be a problem for weeks, not just days ahead.
PILGRIM: I guess people really want to know how much more of the severe weather can we see. And I know you don't have a perfectly clear crystal ball, but you know patterns and you are able to project a bit. What are we looking at, coming forward, here?
CARBIN: Well, we are looking -- often we look at persistence as being a good forecast tool, especially when we go out beyond about a week or so. The pattern has very active throughout the first half of 2008. And there's really no reason to see or expect a dramatic change. We're in the peak of severe weather season, now, we should expect to continue to see strong and severe thunderstorms in the weeks ahead.
PILGRIM: When does it abate, Greg? When does the peak of severe weather season end?
CARBIN: Well, we tend to get into weaker winds and weaker weather systems as we go into July and August. That doesn't rule out the possibility of locally severe storms, but the widespread nature of the weather we've been seeing should begin to slacken and let up a bit go into summer.
PILGRIM: Let me talk about tornadoes. Now, this year's on track to be the deadliest in a decade from tornadoes and we've seen some just heartbreaking damage of late, 120 deaths. Why have we seen so many tornadoes this year? Is there an answer to that?
CARBIN: Well, there's no easy answer to that. Tornadoes are violent storms that hit very rapidly. And often depending on where they hit. The toll could be high and tragic, like we've seen in Iowa this week, or remain in relatively open country and affect very few people, so it's been a busy year and a very active stormy year and that unfortunately looks like it's going to continue at least in the short term.
PILGRIM: You know, as you're talking we're looking at pictures of tornado destructions. The Midwest seems particularly prone to tornadoes, and in particularly this year. Any thoughts on weather systems in the Midwest, at this point?
CARBIN: Well, again, we're in the peak of the season. May and June are usually the most active months across the Plain states and as we go into July, that zone of intense weather tends to translate north, tends to migrate towards the northern border states, but remains essentially located from the northern plains across the Midwest, so we have a few more weeks of this, at the least.
PILGRIM: Greg, thanks very much for your assessment. Greg Carbin, thank you, Greg.
CARBIN: Thank you.
PILGRIM: Well, the heat wave in the northeast, this week, is being blamed for more than 30 deaths. Officials in Philadelphia say 15 people died of heat-related causes. Another person died in Philadelphia's suburbs. New York City's medical examiner said the heat wave killed at least seven people, there, and another seven heat- related deaths were reported in Virginia.
In California, firefighters say strong winds are making it difficult to tackle the wildfires that are burning out of control in that state. One fire in northern California has burned more than 30 square miles. Thousands of people evacuated from their homes. Temperatures in the area expected to rise as high as 100 degrees, today. Further south, another fire scorched more than 25 square miles in a national forest.
Coming up, John McCain challenges Barack Obama to town hall meetings, again. Three of the best political analysts in the country tell us why Senator Obama won't accept.
And later, "Heroes." And tonight we introduce you to Army Staff Sergeant Rob Henline; he's braving tackling the physical and mental scars of the war. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Senator John McCain renewing his challenge to Senator Barack Obama to join him at 10 town hall meetings. So far, Senator Obama has not accepted the offer. Joining me for more on that story, all the day's political news, three of the best political analysts and CNN contributors in the country. We are joined by Republican strategist Ed Rollins. Ed also served as White House political director under President Reagan. We have Pulitzer Prize winning columnist at the "New York Daily News," Michael Goodwin. And Democratic strategist, Robert Zimmerman. And Robert is a national Democratic committeeman. And gentlemen, thank you for joining me. What about this gauntlet that goes down. McCain wants 10 town hall meetings. Obama says one July Fourth, and McCain calling that a disappointing response. What's the dynamic, here, Robert.
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: You know, strategically, McCain play's a very obvious one and I can't fault him for tying. The truth is, he wants to avoid the scrutiny of the media throwing tough debate questions at them in a formalized presidential debate. These town hall forums sound terrific on the face of it, but who's going to be there and how do you choose the audience that's going to really reflect the independence? And the devil's in the details here and we've seen from past McCain town forum that there is a lot of details that have to be worked out and a lot of partisanship the way he does them.
MICHAEL GOODWIN, NEW YORK DAILY NEWS: Well, one of the things that strikes me about town hall forums, they do in some ways remind me of New Hampshire and Iowa, the first states. And I think Americans have come to like that, the idea of retail campaigning gets lost in the general election. The candidates really only go to the states that are toss-up states, big events and there's no real retail aspect left, so I think the town hall format, clearly is a strategic point for McCain, but I think the format could work in a number of areas and it could bring a local feeling to the campaigns.
PILGRIM: It is a very nice intimate setting. It tended to work well in the primaries. Ed, thoughts?
ED ROLLINS, : Well, Barack Obama hasn't had any intimate settings...
PILGRIM: That's right.
ROLLINS: ...gigantic crowds, so for him dealing with a small audience may not (INAUDIBLE) -- you know, the bottom line is that you always want to control your own campaign and I think McCain obviously, this is his forum, he'd love to drag Obama in, but I'm sort of reminded by a candidate that challenged an incumbent governor to 20 debates, after he got clobbered in the first three debates, didn't want to do anymore debates -- my candidate. So, I think to a certain extent, you know, McCain does well one-on-one in these debates -- or forums, he may not do as well head-to-head, but I don't think -- I think you're going to have a couple of them, but you're not going to have a bunch of them.
PILGRIM: Let's talk about Obama, today. He was before an audience of senior citizens in Wisconsin and he, of course, saying that he would like to increase taxes, which has been is position on America's making more than $250,000 a year. He also said this, let's listen for a second.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If we don't act, the promise of Social Security will grow harder to keep. And that's why I fight every single day to extend the promise of a retirement that's dignified and secure as a United States senator and that's why I'm going to fight to make sure that a secure and dignified retirement is there when I'm president of the United States of America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PILGRIM: Social Security, not an easy issue ever for any politician -- Robert.
ZIMMERMAN: Well, of course, his proposal really only impacts three percent of the American population, but the bigger story is each candidate is trying to make a play for middle income workers and middle income voters, that's the goal, here. And the Obama strategy is he is now introducing himself to the American public, really, for the first time, and now that the general public's watching him, he is trying to show an economic program that's going to protect the middle income community. The Center for Tax Policy, said that basically, his program provides three times as more protection for middle income voters than the McCain program does. That will be the debate.
(CROSSTALK)
GOODWIN: Well, I think Obama has to be careful about all of the tax hikes promising and threatening, because I think this is clearly one that doesn't bring you any immediate benefit in terms of the economy, takes money out of the economy, I think we're probably in a recession. He's going to want to do other things with taxes. I'm not sure that's a great one to be pushing right now. I also, if I could, just, in terms of that snippet there of him, twice he used the word, "I fight, I fight." It sounded like he picked up a little bit of Hillary Clinton's language, there. Maybe it's appeal to Hillary voters. Maybe there's a magic word there, "fight, fight."
PILGRIM: What do you think, Ed? You were on the campaign trail...
ROLLINS: In the middle of a recession, I mean, I think both campaigns are trying to have an economic plan, but they're not thought through, and I think the key thing here is how much -- you know, Democrats, historically, have always kind of had a "Robin Hood" strategy of take from the rich and give to the poor, but in this particular case, you know, how many more burdens are you going to put on well to-do Americans and what impact is that going to have on the economy? I've always found well to-do Americans or well to-do anybody always ends up doing well to-do. And I think at the end of the day what happens when you take that money out of their income and basically what does that do to the economy overall? It will only be three percent, as Robert said, but that three percent drives a very big, mighty engine and a lot of jobs.
PILGRIM: Small business owners, really.
GOODWIN: He also wants to raise income taxes on that group and cut dividend -- raise dividend and capital gains taxes, primarily, on that group, as well. So, he's talking about taxes on a fairly small group of Americans. ZIMMERMAN: But, let's also be realistic about the economic situation. The next president inheriting the legacy of George W. Bush, is inheriting truly a fiscal calamity by every measure and the notion of the Republican Party is the party of fiscal conservatives, that brand has been destroyed under this administration, so I think realistically he's providing at least a philosophy and an agenda that is designed to provide some balance -- some resolution of our deficit.
ROLLINS: I repeat, the philosophy is to take the money from the rich and give to the poor. Its called a -- you know, it is a shift of -- to those who work and produce to those who don't quite as hard.
ZIMMERMAN: Can we agree on this? Take it to the very affluent and give it to the middle class?
ROLLINS: No, what I would argue is that the people who are productive, whether middle class or well to do, have a right to certain segments of the money that they earn and the idea that you are going to -- the whole concept of Social Security was to have a supplemental income. It's become all things to all people and the bottom line, if it's got a short fall today, then all Americans who are going to benefit from it should participate in it.
PILGRIM: You know, let's move on, because we have some interesting polls and this is registered voters choice for president and this is the split out: we have Obama at 49 percent, McCain at 46. I think that's statistical dead heat, right? And then we have another interesting poll that I would like to get to and this is enthusiastic -- registered voter who are enthusiastic about voting this year, and in the mishmash of numbers, there, you have Democrats -- 63 percent of Democrats extremely enthusiastic about voting, and 36 percent of Republicans are extremely enthusiastic about voting, so you have a lot of Democratic rah-rah going on here. Not a surprise...
GOODWIN: But one thing that struck me, though. Those numbers seem to conflict in some way, because you would think that Obama, with a generic Democratic support, would be further ahead of McCain in a head-to-head matchup. And I think that's the problem. We were speaking before that, you know, just given how Obama just clinched and Hillary Clinton folded, that you would think he might have gotten a bigger boost.
PILGRIM: A little boost, yeah. No boost, right?
ZIMMERMAN: A minimal boost. But, I'll tell you something, it's -- that poll should be a great source of concern. When you see great Democratic enthusiasm, as that one poll reflects, and a virtual tie between Barack Obama and John McCain, the message there is that Democrats have really got their work cut out for them, they've got their homework to do.
PILGRIM: Ed.
ROLLINS: McCain has not made the sale, yet. I mean, there was a poll last week -- CNN poll, 55 percent of Republicans for McCain another 45 percent wanted somebody else. They don't have a choice of anybody else. He's our nominee and I think, by the end, people will get more and more enthusiastic. They are not today, and I think at the end of the day, you know, you got to make a choice, it's like a game of two-handed poker, you know, your twos may not look like much, but it beats one of a kind and I think that's -- we're down to two finalist today, people are going to make judgments. There's five months to go in this election.
PILGRIM: Do you know...
ZIMMERMAN: Exactly right. That's what's confronting the Democratic Party. They are -- it's certainly not -- although the efforts are being made to unite them, the Democratic Party is far from being united at this stage, and you're seeing that amongst suburban women, you're seeing it among working class voters, so there's a lot to do to unite the Democratic Party, as well.
PILGRIM: You know, I would like to touch on some very sad news that we heard today for all of us who cover politics and part of it, the death of NBC's Tim Russert. I know all of you gentlemen knew him. Roberts, any thoughts?
ZIMMERMAN: It is such a tragedy. I mean, here is man who, in his prime, living life to the fullest, not just a great success and an historic figure in terms of broadcast journalism and politics, but also as a family man. My last conversation with him about "Big Russ" and he was just talking about his son graduating. This is a -- such a terrible loss because to see a man of that stature leave us in his prime is a loss for all of us.
PILGRIM: Michael.
GOODWIN: Yeah, I knew Tim for 25 years and what amazed me is how he came out of politics and became a terrific journalistic. I mean, he really mastered the art of the TV interview. I think the "Meet the Press" interviews were kind of -- were classics. I mean, they were sort of old fashioned in the way he would post the quotes, and yet it was a very skillful use of medium and I thought, you know, politicians kind of quaked when they went on there. This was the hot seat and if you didn't do it right, it could be a career ender. So, he's going to be missed.
ROLLINS: I knew him even longer; I knew him in the partisan days and when shifted, as Democrats sometimes get to do. He never showed his partisan edge, he always was a first rate journalist, first rate professional, a man who also loved the game, as we all love the game, and I think the amazing legacy of Tim is there are no enemies. Anybody who's been in this business as long as he as, he has nothing but friends and they're at legions and they're saddened, today.
PILGRIM: Deeply sad event and I know you join me in extending condolences to his family. Thanks very much for being with us, Ed Rollins, Robert Zimmerman, and Michael Goodwin, thank you. And we'll be right back, stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PILGRIM: In uniform. Tonight, we introduce to Army Staff Sergeant Robert Henline. Sergeant Henline is not only struggling with the physical scars of being burned in a roadside bomb attack, Sergeant Henline is also fighting to recover from the affects of brain injury and Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder. Barbara Starr has his story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Last April, Staff Sergeant Robert Henline's Humvee hit a massive roadside bomb, north of Baghdad.
STAFF SGT ROBERT HENLINE, U.S. ARMY: The vehicle flipped upside down about 15, 20 meters from the blast. I was the sole survivor of the five of us in the vehicle.
STARR: Once the picture of health, the 82nd Airborne paratrooper now struggles all the time. His scull was burned down to the bone. His facial injuries require more surgery and now Henline has to make an almost unfathomable decision. Whether to allow doctors to amputate his badly damaged hand.
HENLINE: It's a faster route to get function out of my arm and get healthy and get moving back in life again.
STARR: But Staff Sergeant Henline is courageously acknowledging a deeper fight, his fight to recover from brain injury and post traumatic stress. Some days are so bad it's hard for the whole family.
HENLINE: They like to go places without me. With them there, I'm on the guard even more. When you go to restaurants, you got to sit in an area where you can see the door, you can see everybody else. You don't want nobody behind you. And I'm never happy or comfortable...
STARR: Henline knows exactly how uncomfortable some people are around him. But if you see Sergeant Henline on the street, he says, please stop and say hello.
HENLINE: That, I like. I'd rather have someone come up to me and just ask me what happened. I think a lot of guys feel that instead of just staring.
STARR: Barbara Starr, CNN, Brooke Army Medical Center, San Antonio, Texas.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PILGRIM: We wish him the very best. A study released in April by the Rand Corporation found nearly one in five of our troops returning from Iraq and Afghanistan reported symptoms of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or depression. One out of five service members said they may have experienced a traumatic brain injury.
Well, now the results of tonight's poll: 95 percent of you do not believe enforcing the law is "scapegoating." And we have time for some of your thoughts.
John in North Carolina wrote to us, "Lou, I'm outraged. Saying that the FDA is run by baboons and fools because of their handling of this tomato situation is an insult to all of us baboons and fools."
And Carl in Arizona wrote: "The FDA's resistance to reveal what it knows about Mexico's tomatoes shouldn't be a surprise, we have bowed down to Mexico repeatedly on the illegal immigration issue, why not bow down on the food safety issue?"
Do send us your thoughts as loudobbs.com. Please join Lou on the radio Monday through Friday for THE LOU DOBBS SHOW. On Monday, investment strategist and market veteran, Harvey Eisen will join Lou for the latest on the economy. And Nan Mooney, author of "Keeping up with Our Parents," will also be Lou's guests.
Thanks for joining us, tonight. For all of us here, good night from New York. The ELECTION CENTER starts right now.
