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Nancy Grace
Remains Believed to Be Missing Vermont Girl Found
Aired July 02, 2008 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. The desperate search for a beautiful 12-year-old Vermont girl, Brooke Bennett, has ended. Twelve- year-old Bennett vanishes into thin air after reportedly being dropped of at a local convenience store to meet up with a little friend. Bennett then captured on grainy surveillance video just moments before she vanishes.
As we go to air, police announce they have discovered what they believe to be the remains of little Brooke. And tonight, a stunning twist. Now charged with Brooke`s kidnapping, did Brooke`s own uncle force another little girl to help lure Brooke to his home for sex, all part of an underage child sex ring? Shocking evidence of child porn emerges. And how is Brooke`s own stepfather connected? Tonight, an autopsy on 12-year-old Brooke set to determine cause of death.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s with a heavy heart, deep sadness, that I announce we have located what we believe to be the remains of Brooke Bennett.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police just announced they have found remains believed to be missing 12-year-old Brooke Bennett. Police say the body was discovered tonight after Vermont`s search and rescue teams discovered recently disturbed ground on Crocker Road in Randolph, Vermont. Police reveal found the body based on information developed at Brooke`s uncle, Michael Jacques`s, residence. And now the U.S. attorney`s office has announced they are charging Jacques with kidnapping Brooke Bennett. Jacques remains in a Southern State Correctional Facility and is expected to face the death penalty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Breaking news tonight. The search for a beautiful 12-year-old Vermont girl, Brooke Bennett, has ended. As we go to air, police announce they have discovered what they believe to be the remains of little Brooke.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some tragic news to report. Brooke Bennett, the 12-year-old missing Vermont girl, has been found dead, and found near the home of her uncle, Michael Jacques.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We remained optimistic that we would find her alive. Investigators worked swiftly and diligently to uncover information and evidence that was leading us in the direction of locating Brooke. The painful discovery of Brooke`s body today is tragic and heartbreaking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news. Police believe they have found the remains of Brooke Bennett. Police say the body was found based on information developed at Brooke`s uncle, Michael Jacques`s, residence, which then led them to the specific location of the body. Vermont search and rescue teams discovered recently disturbed ground yesterday, and the body was found just hours ago. The body will be transported to the medical examiner`s for an autopsy to determine cause of death and official identification. In other breaking news, the U.S. attorney`s office has announced that they have charged Michael Jacques with kidnapping Brooke Bennett.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Her own uncle now charged. And how is her stepfather connected to the whole thing? Straight out to Michelle Sigona with "America`s Most Wanted." Explain.
MICHELLE SIGONA, "AMERICA`S MOST WANTED": Well, her stepfather, Nancy, has been a part of Brooke`s life for six years. Although he did move out of the home in Vermont and move back to Texas about a year-and-a- half ago, he still kept in regular contact with Brooke. And what police believe is that Gagnon, her stepfather, has been in touch with Jacques through this time. And what they believe is that there could possibly be an alleged sex ring that went on and that Gagnon, the stepfather, was changing some MySpace information to help, basically, Jacques frame this to make it look like Brooke left with a boyfriend.
GRACE: It`s incredible, Michelle, that the stepfather is somehow connected to this.
Out to Adam Silverman, joining us from the "Burlington Free Press." Explain to me what you have gleaned from that affidavit.
ADAM SILVERMAN, "BURLINGTON FREE PRESS": Well, there`s several points, I think, that are kind of highlights today. The first is that authorities no longer believe that Brooke and her uncle parted ways at that convenience store a week ago today, last Wednesday, as they previously believed. Instead, according to that affidavit, what they say is that he took her home and planned to initiate her into this purported sex ring that was allegedly going on between adult men and underage girls.
The second thing we learned in that affidavit is that a posting was made to Brooke`s MySpace page some 10 hours before she disappeared, in which the -- whoever was writing that post said that the girl was going to be running away. It was written in the voice of that girl, like she planned to have some kind of liaison with an unnamed man and then run off to Texas. But authorities now tell us that they believe that was an apparent attempt to mislead police into believing that Brooke planned to run away.
GRACE: You know, Adam Silverman, that`s pretty incredible because that suggests -- and of course, this will go to court to be proven. But that suggests that the uncle had been planning this for quite some time, if, in fact, it is shown that he`s the one that went in and altered her MySpace. Did he have access to her MySpace?
SILVERMAN: Yes, he did, Nancy. He had Brooke`s password and user name and actually told authorities that he occasionally would log into that site and monitor it, although he didn`t make any sort of admission...
GRACE: Why? Why was the uncle, Adam, getting all up in her MySpace? Wouldn`t that be something for the mother to do, the parent to do? Why is the uncle involving himself in this child`s MySpace account?
SILVERMAN: Like the authorities, I wish I could answer that question for you.
GRACE: OK. Let me cut to what`s happening right now, Adam Silverman. Tell me about the discovery of these remains. And why do we believe that they belong to 12-year-old Brooke?
SILVERMAN: Well, the remains were found on this rural, pretty remote country road, not far from the uncle`s home. But beyond the information, you know, that we all saw this afternoon of Colonel Baker`s press conference announcing the preliminary identification, I`m not necessarily sure that we have any independent means to confirm that that is Brooke`s body. But if you notice in that news conference, Colonel Baker repeatedly referred to the remains as those of Brooke Bennett and said that she was -- that that body was being sent to the state medical examiner`s office for an autopsy to confirm identity and cause and time of death.
GRACE: Adam, how far from the uncle`s home were the remains discovered?
SILVERMAN: It was -- it was right nearby, a matter of a few miles at the most.
GRACE: Out to Marc Klaas, president of Beyondmissing. Everyone, we are taking your calls live. Marc, you called it last night. The uncle, I believe you said, was the one last with her. The uncle was the one that found the clothing in a very remote area. Who would have known to look for the clothing there? And now this.
MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM: Well, and also that they have to find where he`s comfortable with these kids and then redirect their investigation there, and that`s exactly what they did.
Nancy, I think at this point, it`s incumbent upon everybody in the Northeast to start investigating the other missing child cases that go all the way back probably -- probably, you know, for the last 20 years, with the exception of the three years that he was in prison. This is a bad, bad man who had no compunctions about doing what he was doing. He did it in a very -- in a very deliberate and planned way. And you know, he deserves whatever death he gets.
GRACE: Adam Silverman with "The Burlington Free Press," he only did three years behind bars. That was on a child rape case.
SILVERMAN: That`s correct.
GRACE: And I don`t understand why he only did the three years on a much longer sentence. But why would the mother -- has the mother given any statement as to why she would allow her daughter, her 12-year-old little girl, to be with a convicted child sex predator? Now the girl`s dead!
SILVERMAN: I think the only way we can answer that is to kind of assume or put ourselves in the mother`s position. I haven`t spoken with her. A number of other reporters, both locally and nationally, have spoken with her, and I haven`t heard that question asked. The only thing I know was that he was her brother by blood.
GRACE: I thought he was her brother-in-law, married to her sister?
SILVERMAN: I`m sorry, Nancy. You`re correct on that. You`re correct.
GRACE: So that makes it even more tenuous. This is not a blood relative she`s trusting. And bottom line, I don`t care if it is a blood relative!
Out to Caryn Stark, psychologist. Blood relative-shemlative! You`ve got a child sex history, you are a predator, and she let them with her child?
CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, this is a mother who obviously is caught up in this. And what you see all the time in these kind of cases, Nancy, is that it is an uncle, a stepfather, a father, a brother. That`s the first place you have to look. So something was really off about this mother.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Brenda in Arizona. Hi, Brenda.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I am so happy. I`m finally able to talk to you!
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I love your (INAUDIBLE) I love your children. I love you.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I -- my question -- I`m very appalled. I cried when I heard this. This poor child had no chance whatsoever in life. I -- I have a theory. And my question is, Could this mother be a part of this sex ring?
GRACE: Let`s take a listen to what the mom had to say. But very quickly, to Gloria Allred, joining us out of LA. Gloria, what about it? I just don`t see that the mom is involved in that fashion. I think that she is responsible for sending her kid out with a child sex predator, though.
GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS` RIGHTS ADVOCATE: Well, Nancy, we don`t have any evidence whatsoever at this point that the mother was involved, and there may be no such evidence. And I`m very loath to beat up on the mother. After all, her child has been murdered and...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Yes, and why, Gloria? Why was the child murdered? The child was murdered because she was alone with a child sex predator. That`s why she was murdered.
ALLRED: Right. And you know, there are some mothers in this country who are in denial, and that is dangerous. It is dangerous because we all have to protect our children. We can`t afford to be in denial. Apparently, she did know that the uncle was a convicted sexual predator. And there`s just no taking risks where children come -- are involved and because those risks can lead to something very, very dangerous for those children.
GRACE: Alison Arngrim is joining us out of LA, spokesperson for National Association to Protect Children. Alison, when I think of what this girl, 12 years old -- that`s the 5th grade -- let`s just pause and remember what we were doing in the 5th grade -- what she went through before she was murdered.
ALISON ARNGRIM, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION TO PROTECT CHILDREN: Well, as you know, Nancy, you know what my childhood was like, so you know how angry I am right now. I mean, I`m so mad, I can`t even think straight. These guys were child pornographers. These guys were trafficking. The reason they found out that the whole thing about MySpace was a crock was the Internet Crimes Against Children Task Force and the FBI were able to find that out. That`s what they do. They catch people like this. And they are totally underfunded.
We need Senate bill 1738. Senator Leahy of Vermont, I am begging that he ask for the immediate passage of Senate bill 1738 to fund the very teams that are cracking this case so they can catch the next child traffickers before the next little girl is dead.
GRACE: You know, what`s disturbing to me is you can all give the mom a free pass -- not here because I hold her responsible for letting this child be with a convicted child sex predator!
Out to the lines. To Delores in Florida. Hi, Delores.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I agree with you. I just want to know -- we haven`t heard from the mother. And it seems odd to me, the mother -- was she aware that both her ex-husband and her brother-in-law were convicted sex offenders?
GRACE: Let`s take a listen to her. This is Brooke Bennett`s mother.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CASANDRA GAGNON, BROOKE`S MOTHER: She likes doing somersaults and cartwheels.
I love you, Brooke. I`m not mad. I just want you home!
I am very concerned. I just hope that her wellbeing is still fine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casandra, authorities say there may be some involvement with the Internet here, something about strangers she might have been speaking with on the Internet. Do you know anything about that or what might have transpired?
GAGNON: I don`t know a whole lot about that. I am hoping and praying that she was not talking to anybody regularly. I`m hoping that this was something that just came up, that somebody out there thought that my daughter would be of interest in some really awful thing. And I just hope that they bring her home safe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is video from CBS "Early Show." That`s Brooke Bennett`s mom, seemingly in shock, pleading for the return of her little girl.
Out to the lines. Elaine in Florida. Hi, Elaine.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I watch you every night.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I love what you`re trying to do because I have an adult daughter killed by her husband, and I really -- I know what you feel when you`re a victim`s family. But my thought is about this family. There`s something nobody seems to have mentioned -- it`s sort of alluded to, but not really -- the fact that the mother and her own sister, the mother`s sister, were both married to these men. Two sexual predators are married to two sisters. What is with those two sisters that they have these kinds of men in their lives?
GRACE: Let`s throw that to a professional. Now, the husband has not yet been convicted on molestation, but the reality, Caryn -- how do they manage both of them, to get ahold of guys like this?
STARK: We have to assume, Nancy, that they were brought up in an environment where they were sexual things going on that they shouldn`t have been exposed to because it`s more than coincidence that something like that would happen. And the fact that she didn`t understand that a predator is a predator is also a problem.
GRACE: Out to Adam Silverman with "The Burlington Free Press." Adam, what more can you tell us?
SILVERMAN: Well, Nancy, I think that it`s interesting in this discussion about what the mother knew. There`s not a lot of information that we can rely on in court papers about that. However, in some of the information in the affidavit that was released yesterday, about the uncle`s arraignment on the state charges, it seems clear that -- that his wife was well aware of what was going on inside that house, and to the best of our knowledge, never reported that to the authorities.
GRACE: Why do you say she was aware, Adam?
SILVERMAN: There are indications that she frequently observed things that were out of place, sexual interactions between her husband and -- and teenage girls. And she essentially just turned -- turned the other cheek.
GRACE: And as a matter of fact, right now, there`s an allegation pending regarding a little girl who claims the attacks on her started when she was age 9 -- age 9 years old. And this is the guy that Brooke Bennett was alone with.
Let`s go out to Dr. Joshua Perper, renowned medical examiner and author. Dr. Perper, thank you for being with us. At this juncture, with the time that has elapsed since Brooke went missing, why do they have to do a DNA test? Is the body decomposed to a point where they cannot make a visual identification?
DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER: That`s my understanding because they didn`t identify the victim specifically. They thought, We believe. Therefore, I would assume that the stage of decomposition is advanced.
GRACE: But Doctor, can`t they make immediate identification with dental records?
PERPER: Well, assuming that she had dental records. She might not have any dental records, and that`s the reason why they may need to do the DNA final identification. But they are going to see that`s the girl of the same size, the same age. So there are a lot of circumstantial factors.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the discovery of Brooke, our investigation has now narrowed and focused. All the investigators and support staff in this investigation are committed to closing this investigation out successfully. Our thoughts and prayers are with Brooke`s family, with Brooke, and her friends.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Breaking news tonight. As we go to air, we are learning that police announced they have discovered the remains of who they believe to be 12-year-old little Brooke Bennett. The search for her has been desperate and frantic, the remains found not too far from the suspect`s home, her own uncle. Her mother allowed her to be alone with the uncle, a convicted sex predator. The victim that we know of in that case, 18. And currently pending, a sex attack case on a girl starting when she was 9 years old. We are taking your calls live.
Adam Silverman with "The Burlington Free Press," explain to me again how her own -- Brooke`s own stepfather is tied into all this?
SILVERMAN: Well, her stepfather, who lives in San Antonio, apparently, according to the affidavit that was released today after that man, Mr. Gagnon, was arraigned -- that affidavit says that Brooke`s uncle contacted him, provided him with the password and user name for Brooke`s MySpace page and asked him to get in there and make a few changes. According to the affidavit, the only thing that he altered was -- was some of the timestamps on when earlier posts were made.
GRACE: But why? Why, Adam, would her own stepfather go along with this zany plan to cover up?
SILVERMAN: Well, according to that affidavit, the stepfather is a connoisseur of child pornography and had a good bit of it on his computer and in a safe, including pictures of -- of Mr. Jacques`s alleged victim.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s been agonizing, frustrating. You know, we just want our little girl home. We love her very much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brooke`s family`s been notified. And on behalf of all the investigators, support staff and others who have worked tirelessly on this case, I offer the family our deepest regret.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Police nearly breaking down in tears when they announce they have discovered the remains, they believe, of this little girl, 12-year-old Brooke Bennett. The search for her has been fast and furious, ending just as we go to air with the remains discovered, believed to be her. And the kicker is this. The uncle, now the suspect in this case, graduated in Vermont from sex offender school. I guess he got an A-plus. And then he was left with no supervision whatsoever.
To Kari in Ohio. Hi, Kari.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I just wanted to ask, could the mother be charged with endangering a child after this?
GRACE: Excellent question. To Paul Batista and Alex Sanchez. Alex, shouldn`t it be against the law to knowingly allow your child to be with a sex predator?
ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, maybe it should be against the law, but it is not currently against the law. The woman made an independent judgment on her own that she allowed her daughter to be in the presence of this person, whom she obviously must have trusted. And therefore, I don`t believe there will be any charges against the mother here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: Brooke was located as a result of information developed during a search of Michael Jacques` residence. The information developed led investigators to Crocker Road.
A team of specially trained FBI agents and members of the Vermont State Police search and rescue team discovered ground that was recently disturbed. This discovery happened on July 1st, 2008. The scene was frozen. And a thorough search was conducted today.
Brooke was found at about 4:45 p.m. this afternoon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Back out to Michelle Sigona with "America`s Most Wanted." They seem very clear in their announcement that the remains are those of little Brooke. But her clothing had been thrown away, had been found by the uncle, he said, on a remote rural road.
How could they make that identification if the body is really decomposed?
MICHELLE SIGONA, CORRESPONDENT, AMERICA`S MOST WANTED: Well, here`s what we do know, Nancy. We do know that that clothing was sent away to the DNA lab and that it was tested and that the DNA on it did, in fact, come back to Brooke.
So the uncle actually led them to the clothing and then the uncle also led them to her MySpace account as well according to the affidavit that came out. So inside of that, you know, there`s a couple key clues here that the uncle seems to be leading on the investigation.
GRACE: Right. You know, to Detective Lieutenant Steve Rogers, Nutley New Jersey Police Department and former member with the FBI -- Detective, it`s -- the uncle`s always there right on the scene. He`s there with her when she`s dropped off here in this convenience store video. He`s the one that finds the clothing. He`s the one that directs police to her MySpace account.
How -- it`s crazy that they could actually think they could go into her e- mail and tamper with dates and made-up e-mails. When you read this e-mail it sounds like an adult trying to write like a child. How can they go back and prove she did not enter it on her own account and how can they forensically show that?
DET. LT. STEVEN ROGERS, NUTLEY, NJ P.D., FMR. MEMBER, FBI JOINT TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Well, they`re going to, no doubt, have forensics experts look at the style of writing, the temper of the writing. I mean there are experts out there, Nancy, that are going to be able to clearly define who wrote those letters on that MySpace.
And I`ll tell you something else that they`re going to do. They`re going to expand this investigation. They`re going to look at more MySpace accounts. And don`t be surprised if we find more victims.
GRACE: You know, another thing -- out to Paul Batista, defense attorney and author, they can also show where the uncle and the stepfather had been logging on via their own computers to get into Brooke Bennett`s -- 12-year- old girl -- MySpace.
The uncle 10 hours before the incident and then the stepfather trying to do a cover-up. That`s why he most likely is charged with obstruction of justice. It`s all going to weigh in. But the bottom line, Batista, he can`t get the death penalty in Vermont.
PAUL BATISTA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, AUTHOR OF "DEATH`S WITNESS": No, he can`t. But there are potential federal offenses here, too, Nancy. He`s got -- he`s got two sets of problems to deal with.
GRACE: Come on, please.
BATISTA: The federal side and the state side.
GRACE: Don`t even say federal to me. When was the last time you heard about the federalists giving the death penalty to anybody and making it stick.
BATISTA: Well, there was Tim McVeigh, Nancy. It does happen.
GRACE: Yes, and how along ago was that?
BATISTA: Well, about three years ago.
GRACE: No. The McVeigh case was not three years ago.
BATISTA: Nancy, the feds usually defer to the states in matters like this. And you`re right, this offense.
GRACE: He`s not going to get the death penalty.
BATISTA: . occurred in the state of Vermont.
GRACE: He`s not getting the death penalty. The feds are not going to -- let`s just accept it. The feds do not seek the death penalty, and Vermont statute is impotent. They graduate this guy from the sex rehab. I`d like to know what that is. And now we`re going to -- the taxpayers are going to have to pay for him to live and eat and have therapy and a law library and a rec room if he`s convicted for the rest of his life.
The rest of his life.
BATISTA: Nancy, that`s -- that`s our system of justice. The people of Vermont.
GRACE: Well, if that`s the law, Paul Batista.
BATISTA: . they do not want the death penalty.
GRACE: . then the law is an ass.
And I want to go back, back to Adam Silverman. What is the sex offender program this uncle graduated from?
ADAM SILVERMAN, REPORTER, BURLINGTON FREE PRESS: Well, the sex offender program here is supposedly a very intensive treatment and then, you know, leading to some sort of graduation on whatever measures and qualifications they use. Its advocates touted very highly.
GRACE: Really.
SILVERMAN: Although, you know, we clearly see here that not every case is successful.
GRACE: Well, I don`t know what the panel lawyers have to say about this.
Gloria Allred, Paul Batista, Alex Sanchez joining us tonight.
But Gloria Allred, this is purely anecdotal. I guess, maybe in 10 years, I handled about 10,000 cases and that is not a lot of cases. It`s about 1,000 cases a year. Plea deals, trials, that`s typical. All right?
I quickly learned after about two or three years, sex offenders don`t get rehabbed. I don`t care what some Park Avenue shrink wants to tell me or write in his journal or get published in some obscure, you know, publication. They don`t get rehabbed. There`s no such thing.
GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIM`S RIGHTS ADVOCATE: Well, I agree, Nancy, that there seems to be very little evidence that they are rehabbed. And, in fact, it seems that a lot of people at least suspect that they will repeat their sexual offenses. And this is a big problem.
I`m dealing with a case right now where a young college student is missing and she was last seen with a convicted sexual predator who failed to register. And so this is a very big problem. And -- but we can`t keep the sexual predators in jail forever.
BATISTA: That`s exactly right.
GRACE: Oh, really? Why not?
BATISTA: We can`t do that, Nancy.
GRACE: Why? Why?
BATISTA: The society is not organized that way.
GRACE: No.
BATISTA: There aren`t enough prisons. And not everyone is a recidivist, Nancy. It doesn`t happen all the time.
GRACE: We can.
BATISTA: That`s what the system of justice says.
GRACE: Yes, and so the alternative, the alternative, Sanchez, is to allow them out so we can have Brooke Bennett dead, buried near her uncle`s home. That -- those are my choices?
ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Look, this is a very tragic case. But you know.
GRACE: Don`t start, Sanchez.
SANCHEZ: You said a little while ago, sex offenders.
GRACE: Don`t start.
SANCHEZ: Sex offenders cannot be rehabilitated, which raises the question: then how come Vermont was not monitoring this fellow.
GRACE: You know what?
SANCHEZ: . and sending officers to go see him and keep an eye on him to make sure that he maintained his control.
GRACE: I absolutely agree with you. You are dead on, Alex Sanchez. But don`t try to shift blame to Vermont, all right? Yes, they were doing nothing. But they didn`t kill the little girl.
To you.
SANCHEZ: Well, they have -- they didn`t, but they bear some responsibility. Let`s face it.
GRACE: Yes, they do. And I wonder what, if anything, they`re going to do about it. Probably nothing.
Caryn Stark, please enlighten the viewers. With sex offenders how often do they re-offend?
CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Sex offenders re-offend, Nancy, because they cannot be changed. Sexual orientation is fixed. Once you have a sexual orientation you can do nothing about it.
GRACE: To Alison Arngrim, weigh in.
ALISON ARNGRIM, SPOKESPERSON, NATL. ASSOCIATION TO PROTECT CHILDREN, SEXUAL MOLESTATION VICTIM: Yes, Vermont is one of -- they`ve made the top five before with their horrendous attitude towards sex offenders.
GRACE: The top five what?
ARNGRIM: Top five worst states. They`re notorious for their attitude towards sex offenders, giving people ridiculously low sentences. Not providing any kind of controls or proper probation. This guy did what, four years for kidnapping?
GRACE: Three.
ARNGRIM: Kidnapping -- three. Since when is kidnapping -- isn`t that like a major felony? Don`t people do 20, 25 years (INAUDIBLE)?
GRACE: And right now there`s a charge, Alison -- everyone you may recognize Allison as being Nelly on "Little House on the Prairie," one of everyone`s favorite shows.
The whole time she was acting out on air she was covering the secret and responding to the secret that she is a victim of child molestation. So believe me, she knows what she`s talking about and that is why now she`s with the National Association to Protect Children. To Adam.
ARNGRIM: And.
GRACE: Go ahead, dear.
ARNGRIM: And Nancy, as you were saying, the problem with these people -- what you were saying about the mother, the families are so often tied into this and in denial and aiding and abetting.
GRACE: Enabling.
ARNGRIM: Couey who killed little Jessica Lunsford, his entire family knew what he was and they covered for him.
GRACE: They certainly did.
To Adam Silverman with "Burlington Free Press" -- Adam, what`s the next step?
SILVERMAN: Well, the next step is it kind of depends on which kind of case you`re looking at. The first thing that we know about is that the U.S. attorney and the Vermont attorney general are going to hold a news briefing tomorrow morning at 10:00 where they`re going to discuss the federal kidnapping charge against Mr. Jacques. And they`re going to unseal the affidavit and the criminal complaint.
I ought to correct -- you said a few minutes ago that it`s unlikely that Mr. Jacques will receive the death penalty. However, the federal government most recently obtained the death penalty here in Vermont. A man convicted of a carjacking with death resulting, named Donald Fell, was tried in Burlington, Vermont and sentenced in 2005 to receive the federal death penalty.
GRACE: So Adam.
SILVERMAN: He`s currently incarcerated in Terre Haute so.
GRACE: . there is a light at the end of the tunnel. What were -- that was the -- what were the charges there?
SILVERMAN: Yes, that was a carjacking with death resulting. There were two young men, you know, about 18 to 20, who killed two people in Rutland, Vermont. And then in searching for a getaway car they abducted a supermarket worker and killed her.
GRACE: Adam, thank you for telling me that. I`m glad to hear it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: We have located what we believe to be the remains of Brooke Bennett on Crocket Road and Randolph.
Brooke will be transported to the chief medical examiner`s office in Burlington. An autopsy will be scheduled to positively identify her and to determine the cause of death.
This death is clearly suspicious. It appears to be foul play.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Out to the lines, Leslie in Florida, hi, Leslie.
LESLIE, FLORIDA RESIDENT: Hi, love your show. Love you.
GRACE: Thank you.
LESLIE: How did this woman ever get custody of this child?
GRACE: I don`t know. I don`t know.
Michelle Sigona, what can you tell us?
SIGONA: Here`s what I can tell you. I did speak with the stepfather`s sister earlier today. And what she tells me is that they did split up about a year and a half ago. They are divorced at this time. And that`s when he moved to Texas. But the family stayed in Vermont.
Now, having said that, at that point I would imagine that since he`s not her biological father he didn`t have any rights to the children. She also has a brother and another sister. So there`s three children in the home all together.
Now, although he lived in Texas, from what I learned from the aunt is that he kept a very close relationship with all three of these children even while he was gone over the last year and a half. So that`s why the mom still had custody of the children.
GRACE: How did she get custody originally from the biological father who seems to be very involved in the lives of the children?
SIGONA: Yes. Absolutely. That part, I do not know because I did not get a chance to talk to the mom today.
GRACE: At least we know about the stepfather. And I`m -- you`re looking at the mom right now, Cassandra Gagnon. And I noticed there are absolutely zero tears coming from her, could be because she`s just exhausted after the search for her daughter. Or -- I wonder if it dawned on her at the get-go, gee, I let my little 12-year-old girl be alone with a convicted sex offender.
Out to the lines, Rob in Michigan, hi, Rob.
ROB, MICHIGAN RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. Love your show. Thanks for let me call.
GRACE: Thank you, dear. Thank you for calling in. What`s your question?
ROB: My question is about the 14-year-old that supposedly lured the 12- year-old to the uncle`s home.
GRACE: Yes.
ROB: Will she be convicted or can she be convicted of a crime?
GRACE: I doubt pretty seriously she is going to be prosecuted. If it weren`t for her, Rob, I don`t believe the case would have been solved so quickly.
To Michelle Sigona, how exactly was the little 14-year-old used to lure Brooke?
SIGONA: Well, from what we learned from the, you know, the documents that have come out is that what she claims is that her -- excuse me. I should say that Jacques, in fact, had her lure Brooke back in by telling police lies.
So basically she gave them one story. Then she came back and said, you know what, that was untrue. He didn`t want me to tell the truth because he didn`t want to make it seem like Brooke was left at the convenience store by herself.
So at that point they were somehow able to get both of them back to the house. And then the victim was mentioned in the affidavit left. And that`s when Brooke and her uncle were left alone inside the home. And that`s the last time that she was seen.
GRACE: And finally, the little girl came forward and spoke to police.
To Caryn Stark, psychologist, what do people say to these children to get children to go along with them?
STARK: Well, they`re adults, Nancy. So children trust adults. They`re in a position of authority. So all they have to do is be close to the children and they usually come across as very caring and sincere. They`re wonderful at doing that.
GRACE: To Tammy in Pennsylvania, hi, Tammy.
TAMMY, PENNSYLVANIA RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy how are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
TAMMY: I got -- I want to know what we can do as a society to stop these repeat offenders. Can we print out pictures of them on the Internet and hang them on every telephone pole? I`ve had it.
GRACE: Yes, we can. I just want to point out, Tammy, that Vermont has been alerted to its sorry performance by parents for Megan`s Law. I`m sure you remember little 3-year-old Megan Kanka who was murdered by Jesse Timmendequas.
Timmendequas claimed the little 3-year-old was flirting with him. And he raped her and murdered her. Megan`s Law regarding sex offenders has been passed. And parents for Megan`s Law rate every state in the country. Vermont got an F, an F as in flunk.
What did they do about it? Nothing.
We are taking your calls live. I want to go back out to Marc Klaas.
Marc, it`s just one layer upon the next of wrong doing. You`ve got the uncle and the stepfather collecting child pornography. All right? You`ve got the uncle planning this 10 hours in advance and going into the girl`s MySpace account, making it look as if she`s running away to Texas.
You`ve got the stepfather out in Texas agreeing to doctor the computer records. Now you have the mother allowing the little girl to be with a sex predator. And you`ve got the little girl`s remains just now being found.
I mean, it`s layer upon layer upon layer of evil.
MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM, FATHER OF MURDER VICTIM POLLY KLAAS: It is layer upon layer of evil. And the sad reality is that when Polly was kidnapped in 1993 we had no Megan`s Law. Their rights superseded ours.
We had no AMBER Alert. Law enforcement didn`t share that information. We had no truth in sentencing. So punks like Uncle Mike were able to get three years out of a 20-year sentence.
We had -- you know, none of the systems in place that we have now. Yet, look what happens. Now little girls still fall through the cracks. They still are -- they still are victimized in the worst way.
So I think what that suggests, Nancy, is that, as strong as we make our legislation, the final responsibility still has to rest in the family unit, and we have to be on the lookout and we have to be vigilant for situations like this where perverts like Uncle Mike are able to have access to children, and to understand that never in the history of the world -- and this has been repeated more than once -- never in the history of the world has a pedophile or a psychopath ever been cured.
And that`s been demonstrated no less than time after time the pre-scandal, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So, I think we have to take a multilayered approach to this issue. That begins at the president`s Cabinet table.
GRACE: I agree. I agree.
KLAAS: All the way down to the family kitchen table.
GRACE: But you know, I can dream about the White House and Congress right now but I`m concerned with 12-year-old Brooke Bennett.
To the lawyers, Gloria Allred, Paul Batista, Alex Sanchez -- Alex, when you hear that there is such a thing as rehab, how do you bring yourself to defend someone like a child molester?
SANCHEZ: Well, you know, under the United States constitution, everybody, as repulsive as their behavior is, is entitled to have an attorney, at least, speak for them, hear what they have to say, present whatever legitimate arguments can be presented, and, you know, represent them in a proper manner. And that`s what I would do.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Some tragic news to report. Brooke Bennett 12- year-old missing Vermont girl has been found dead and found near the home to of her uncle Michael Jacques.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRACE: Straight out to Dr. Joshua Perper -- Dr. Perper, if the body of the little girl is so decomposed, how can they determine if there was a sex assault?
DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER, AUTHOR OF "WHEN TO CALL THE DOCTOR": Well, in some cases, in spite of the decomposition, you can take samples from the vagina and prove the presence of seminal fluid and connect it to DNA testing to the assailant.
GRACE: It`s really hard to reconcile all these happy pictures of little Brooke with the fact the she`s undergoing autopsy.
Out to the lawyers, Gloria Allred, Paul Batista, Alex Sanchez.
To Gloria Allred, is there anything we can do to stop these continued crimes on children, especially by convicted sex predator?
ALLRED: Well, Nancy, I think the main thing we have to do is to educate our children, and let them know that, in fact, they have to be aware that most sex abuse is actually by somebody they know. Could be an uncle, a stepfather, a father. Somebody that they know, not a stranger.
GRACE: You`re so right, Gloria Allred -- Gloria Allred, a victim`s right advocate.
And Paul Batista, what is the reality about the fed`s really seeking the death penalty on this guy?
BATISTA: I think there`s a serious chance that that may happen, Nancy. The -- it is very unusual for the feds to be involved to the extent that they are right now. Most of the investigation was done by them on the computers, and they brought this investigation to a conclusion. I think they are very serious about this.
GRACE: We`ll see.
Let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Michael Matlock Jr., 21-year-old, Glen Burnie, Maryland, killed, Iraq. Awarded the National Defense Service medal, Army Service Ribbon, and Iraqi Campaign medal.
Loved boating, dancing, basketball, late-night talks with a sister over Whoppers and Cokes. Leaves behind parents Sheena and Michael Sr., sister Tiffany, widow and high school sweetheart Breon, 1-year-old son Byron.
Michael Matlock Jr., American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern, and tonight our thoughts and prayers with the family of little Brooke.
Good night, friend.
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