Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Pakistan Suicide Bomber Targets Police; Another Investigation of Afghan Civilian Casualties

Aired July 06, 2008 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): Honestly, my heart was set on fire. I swear to god, it was so painful. My children were crying, but I told them it is for the best.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD LUI, CNN ANCHOR: Next in the NEWSROOM, families separated by war. UNICEF steps in to bring them back together.

Plus, a nation with few handgun homicides sees a sharp rise in knife attacks.

And our top story will take us to Pakistan where a suicide bomber apparently targeted police. A very good Sunday to you. Hello, I'm Richard Lui. Fredricka Whitfield joins us live from New Orleans in just a few minutes.

But first for you. A jolt today to a fragile ally of the U.S. war in terror. In Pakistan, a suicide bomber killed at least 16 people. Most of them police officers in the capital city Islamabad. This blast went off as thousands of protestors marked the anniversary of a government siege at a mosque. Live for us right now from Islamabad is CNN's Reza Sayah who has been watching the story and is on the ground. Reza, did you have the opportunity to hear from any of the witnesses and what they may have said?

REZA SAYAH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, witnesses described just horrific scenes. They say a suicide bomber came on foot. They heard commotion. A number of security officers rushed to a particular spot and moments later the bomb went off. Government officials say the suicide bomber was targeting police officers and he was successful. Here are the latest numbers. 12 police officers killed, another four individuals killed and more than 50 injured. This suicide bombing happened at 7:45 p.m.. Why did it happen? Government officials say it's too early to tell. But what is significant is exactly when and where it happened. The suicide bombing took place just blocks away from a very large rally commemorating the one year anniversary of a deadly raid on Islamabad's controversial Red Mosque.

Many of you will remember last July, the government of Pakistan then led by the military rule of General Pervez Musharaf raided the Red Mosque because the government accused the Red mosque of training radical militants. The Mosque defended itself saying that there was only teaching the pure teachings of Islam. That raid turned deadly. More than 100 individuals died. That incident ratcheted up tensions between radical Islamic groups here in Pakistan and the government. This weekend was the one-year anniversary of that deadly raid. Was this reprisal for that raid? It is too early to tell. But again, a suicide bombing on Sunday night, 7:45 p.m., local time, killing 12 police officers and four others. Richard.

LUI: Reza, we are only five hours into this so far. But any indication about who is behind this specifically?

SAYAH: No. Nobody has claimed responsibility. One thing that's difficult about Pakistan is there are so many militant groups with so many different motivations. You have the possibility of the link between the suicide bombing and the Red Mosque. Keep in mind, just last week the new civilian government here in Pakistan launched a massive offensive against militant groups in the tribal region here in Pakistan bordering Afghanistan. This could also have been reprisal for that, Richard.

LUI: All right. Reza Sayah live in Islamabad with the very latest for you. Reza, thank you so much for that.

We mentioned the siege last year at that mosque in Islamabad that infuriated Pakistan's Muslim radicals and sparked howls from Al Qaeda along the way. Reza gave us a bit of a background.

With us right now, CNN's Josh Levs with us now. And Josh, refresh our memories, we are talking about the Red Mosque and what is key about this?

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This place and we just have, you know, micro report on this. What are going to do now is take a step back. I'm going to show you why this mosque is important to the international battle against terrorism. Let's start with a few basics here that Reza touched on. But I want to trace you through this history. Jump back a year ago to July of 2007. That is when the Pakistani government took on this raid into the Red Mosque. And what they did was trying to route out these Islamic militants that are holed up in there. And what people were doing was trying to pursue Taliban rule, Taliban rule inside Pakistan. That's what they wanted.

And Taliban is the group in Afghanistan used to house Al Qaeda. Now, nearly 100 people died there. And this is the key. As a result of what happened there, a truce that the Pakistani government had struck ended with its people in the north who were basically sheltering Al Qaeda in the north. So, you have these troops right, now all of a sudden Al Qaeda after that mission starts taking all these new actions. You have all these new violence inside Pakistan. And that is a tremendous concern to the United States.

LUI: Concern to the United States. Put it into context for us, if you will, the battle against terror, Pakistan, what this means and what is happening right now.

LEVS: That's right. OK. We care a lot about this for a number of reasons. First of all, a lot of people consider Pakistan the central grounds in what some people call the war on terrorism. Certainly, the international battle against terrorism. A lot of people say that's where you start. Because after the U.S. attacked Afghanistan in 2001, a lot of people fled into Pakistan. And we're looking right there at where it is. It's right next to Afghanistan, right next to India. That's the view of Pakistan. It's central to the battle against Al Qaeda. And Richard, there's always something to remember anytime we talk about Pakistan, nuclear nation. They are in nuclear power.

LUI: Right.

LEVS: Now, obviously, you don't want Al Qaeda to every get anywhere near nukes. This is a nuclear nation. No one is saying Al Qaeda has them, but it is a critical context for any discussion we ever have about Pakistan.

LUI: Geography, nuclear power.

LEVS: Yes.

LUI: Take us now into what we have been following within the last six months, very acutely and that's the presidential election.

LEVS: Oh, yes. This is critical. And I'm glad you brought it up because when you look at these two candidates, these major candidates, McCain and Obama, where they stand on Pakistan, they are going to talk about that a lot. This awaits the ultimate test on foreign policy. Because this is a really tricky context for them. On the one hand, the U.S. has a lot invested in helping this government in Pakistan fight Al Qaeda. On the flip side, this government in Pakistan have taken a lot of steps that are not in keeping with our view of democracy. How do you balance that? How do you get tough with them but still tries to support them in the fight against Al Qaeda? Watch what these two men say. That's judgment. That's experience. That is one of the biggest foreign policy tests they'll face.

LUI: Great context, sir. Thank you, Josh Levs, with that.

LEVS: There you go. Thanks a lot.

LUI: Now, Pakistan's neighbor Afghanistan, another allegation today that a coalition military aircraft bombed civilians. Afghan officials say an air strike Sunday morning killed about two dozen members of a wedding party and wounded several others. A U.S. official says he did not get any reports that civilians were killed there. There was a similar incident just two days ago prompting Afghan President Hamid Karzai to order his own investigation in that.

Well, to the latest on the fire danger out west for you now. Cooler temperature and fog are giving crews in the Big Sur area a break, much needed but the massive blaze had already charred more than 100 square miles and is not expected to be contained before the end of this month. Now, just to the south, winds that fan the flames of the gap fire near Goleta have died down, but it's still threatening some 2,700 homes. That blaze has top priority right now. You can see a DC-10 here dropping red fire retardant on the fire there. Well, one of the takeoff points for those air tankers is the Santa Maria Airport. Our Kara Finnstrom is live there with the latest and has been following this whole story for us throughout the recent day. Hey, Kara.

KARA FINNSTROM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi. Well, this is about one of the dozen bases across the state for refueling for those firefighter planes. You can see some of them lined up on the tarmac right behind me. And with the more than 1,000 fires that have been burning across California this past month, this has been one busy place. We want to show you some video of some of the spectacular air drops that we've been watching in the gap fire near Goleta during this past week. Firefighters tell us that thousands of pounds of fire retardant actually rain out of these planes when they make this drop. They tell us their job is to take the hear out of these intense fires, to slow down the advance, so that crews on the ground can actually get in there to put them out.

Now, the planes that have been flying missions out of here have been doing 11 drops a day near Goleta. And they tell us that they come back here for their pit stop. We caught up with one of these crews, they say there's an knack, kind of an art, if you will, to knowing just how to allow for the winds and all the other forces out there and to get that fire retardant to go right where you want. And here's how they describe the actual drop.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BORK HINDMAN, AERIAL TANKER CO-PILOT: there are two doors here, two clam-shell doors that just open up and the retardant has air that comes in the front of the tank that adds a pressure. And so as the doors open, it helps force the retardant out onto the fire line.

FINNSTROM: What does it feel like inside the plane, inside the plane with all the retardant left in it?

HINDMAN: It's not - we don't really feel much of a change. The captain, he kind of holds a little forward pressure down on the yellowings, but normally we really don't feel too much. We get a lot lighter because we lose about 23,000 pounds rather quickly.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FINNSTROM: And 23,000 pounds, just to give you an idea, that's the weight of about three SUVs. A lot of fire retardant coming out of those planes. Here's a look at what's actually pouring out of them, the red fire retardant. You see it kind of sprayed and discoloring the hillsides there near some of these wildfires. Just behind me here in this huge red tank we're going to give you a look of this in a second is where they keep this in a condensed form. Then they mix it up with some of the water in these water tanks. They pump it into the bellies of these planes. And Richard, the planes are then ready to go on their next mission.

LUI: Interesting stuff there, Kara. And the question might be, they get very close to these flames, do they reflect to you the danger that they encounter in each and every drop?

FINNSTROM: You know, they were actually quite humbled, so to speak. I asked them about that. They said they're a little bit higher than the helicopters. The helicopters which are mainly the water droppers, are lower. They feel a little bit more of the heat and the turbulence, but these planes can feel it as well and can actually jar them. So these pilots have a lot of training, a lot of experience and they do put themselves into some dangerous situations.

LUI: Great work by them and by you, my friend, Kara. Thank you very much. Kara Finnstrom from there in the south of California watching the wildfires there. Have a good one. Thanks.

You know, the Essence Music Festival wraps up later today in New Orleans. Folks have been enjoying a whole lot of good music and good food. Our Fredricka Whitfield is in New Orleans and doing that too. And Fredricka, the festival is being called a party with a purpose right? But some serious issues certainly on the table there. Right, Fred?

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR; Exactly. You get a little bit of everything. This is the final day of the three-day festival. And we are saving some of the best for last when it comes to talking about issues. We've got broadcaster Ed Gordon coming up, actor Hill Harper and media mogul or the man of all media I should say, Tom Joiner, all of them joining me to talk successes, setbacks, and some solutions straight ahead. Richard.

LUI: You know, Fred, you have been there since what Tuesday. You've spoken to so many people and have done some really great stories. What sort of stood out to you in the last five or six days?

WHITFIELD: Well, this is a city I love and a city that so many people love. And to see how, despite the hardships of this city, and to see that there are so many economic setbacks still for the city, it's remarkable the resolve that so many New Orlenians have and to have an event like this, this Essence Music Festival which is sure to bring a great economic boost to the city. It also kind of a morale boost, if you will, for a lot of the folks who are here in New Orleans sticking it out, waiting for their city to be rebuilt, waiting for it to recover, return to what it once was.

LUI: Really great stuff there, Fred. Again for our viewers, she has several special reports coming up in the next couple of hours. Thanks, Fred. Looking forward to that.

WHITFIELD: OK.

LUI: London police working to counter a troubling trend, teens carrying and using knives in violent attacks. This year's murder rate is way up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: London police going from one suspect to none. They have now released one man arrested in connection with the stabbing deaths of two French students. For Londoners, it's a worrying trend. There have been so many stabbing attacks in the city this year, police say knife crimes have past terrorism as their top priority. CNN's Owen Thomas has the latest from London. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OWEN THOMAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A nighttime vigil for Ben (). He was 16. He was killed last Sunday. He died of multiple stab wounds. Flowers for Shakilus Townsend. He, too, was 16. He was stabbed and beaten with a baseball bat on Thursday. Two of the latest victims of knife crimes. With 18 murders of teenagers this year alone in London, authorities appeared to be powerless to stop a growing trend of young people going out regularly armed with a knife. Shakilus appeared to be a victim of gang violence killed over a girl.

SHARON SIMPSON, RESIDENT: Mummy, mummy. I love you mummy. He said, I'm going to die. I said, no, you're not going to die.

THOMAS: Just hours after the attack, Shakilus did die, leaving yet another family to grieve for a life not yet lived. A neighbor summed up what many people here in Britain are thinking?

METELVA HIGGINS, NEIGHBOR: Why? What did he do that was so bad that you couldn't just come to an agreement on a friendly basis? Why? Why kill him? He didn't deserve to die like that? He was somebody's child.

THOMAS (on-screen): That is why the deputy commissioner of London's Police Service says knife crime is now their number one priority. The problem, of course, for the authorities, how do they tell a teenage boy that he shouldn't carry a knife when he thinks he needs it for his own protection? Or that he thinks it makes him look cool or tough.

THOMAS (voice-over): There's now a dedicated empty knife task force being set up by the police to try to tackle the problem.

CMDR. MAXINE DE BRUNNER, METROPOLITAN POLICE; You'll be seeing wide spread of stop and search through searches. You'll be seeing a lot o more police on the streets of London.

THOMAS: The extent to which law enforcement can combat this complex issue though is limited in many people's eyes. More questions are being asked as to what social and economic factors are pushing young people into thinking carrying and using knives as weapons is not only acceptable but necessary. Owen Thomas, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LUI: The Essence Festival is winding down today. It's the last day. So, let's hurry down to New Orleans and CNN's Fredericka Whitfield who has been watching this all week long. Hey, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Hi, Richard. All right. You know, Hill Harper from "CSI: New York," you know Ed Gordon from B.E.T. NPR and now "Black Enterprise." Well, we had a candid discussion about black men's successes and setbacks in the NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: They have had it all. Multi-platinum singer Rihanna you see right there rocking the stage at the Essence Music Festival in New Orleans. Quite a sight it has been. Well, this weekend's festival has given New Orleans a chance to celebrate its musical heritage, no doubt. It has also given folks a chance to talk about some serious issues. Our Fredericka Whitfield is in New Orleans. And Fred, one of those issues is the state of the black man in America, right?

WHITFIELD: That's right. From happiness to heartache, black men, fathers, brothers, role models, not enough can be said. However, we caught up with actor Hill Harper as well as broadcaster Ed Gordon who has started an initiative called "Daddy's Promise" initiative. These are the things that are near and dear to their hearts.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ED GORDON, HOST OF NPR'S "NEWS AND NOTES": For a myriad of reasons, black men are not in the home. And we have to bring them back, whether it is specifically in the home or just in the lives of the people who live in a particular house. And as a community, we have to demand that if you have children, if you have a family, there's a responsibility that comes along with that. That's part of why we created "Daddy's Promise."

We have a website, daddyspromise.com. 97,000 hits in two weeks. We started it this past Father's day. There's a pledge that you can download to give to your daughters, very symbolic. We have asked men to upload pictures and women, fathers and daughters. We have 600 pictures uploaded already. Men want to do the right thing. Often they lost their way. So, we are saying and Hill is saying through his book, come on back, come onboard and join our team. We are going to start to do the right thing.

WHITFIELD: When you talk about losing your way, or losing one's way, and in your book, you really were inspired by a number of letters. You were hearing from young fans, boys and girls, but particularly the boys touched your heart initially because many of them had lost their way.

HILL HARPER, ACTOR: Absolutely. And what's amazing is that there are so many young people out there that want a mentor, want a positive person, want someone in their life to help them navigate that journey from young adulthood to adulthood. The thing is that we as adults aren't doing it, whether we want to talk about the biological parent issue or just us taking responsibility for young people. You know, I do a lot of work with Big Brothers, Big Sisters. It's a great organization and been around since 1904. In every chapter, get this, in every chapter of Big Brothers, Big Sisters across the country, there's a waiting list of young people waiting for mentors.

Now, you would think that based on what the media tells us, that the young people are you know, they're out there. They don't care. They are playing video games. The last thing they want to do is a mentor. No, it's actually quite the opposite. The last thing we as adults are doing are mentoring and taking responsibility for our kids. And the kids are saying, I want someone to exchange letters with, I want someone to help me make decisions.

WHITFIELD: I want somebody to guide me.

HARPER: Absolutely. And we're not doing it as adults. And I believe and Ed puts it really very nicely, but you know, I'm a little more forceful about my points in terms of - you know, Ed talks about inviting them in. Yes, we invite them in but some of us have to actually to grab them and say, look, I'm not going to hang out with you unless you call your daughter and say I love you today.

WHITFIELD: And that means, we have to grab these kids, grab our children and say, you know what education is first. You know, don't be mesmerized by wealth first, because a lot of young kids are saying, you know I want the stuff, and they are not thinking about how to get that stuff by way of education.

HARPER: I approach it a little differently, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: How?

HARPER: I tell, I think part of the problem is going straight to these ideas, these future-based ideas of education, you got to start with self esteem first. Because people always talk about you got to get education but you never tell the children why. The why is more important because they actually start to realize the reason why is because you're magnificent, you're brilliant and you can achieve anything you dream if you use this as a tool for achievement. And then they start making the connection between their own success and the tool, which is education.

GORDON: And I think, I'll take it a step further. I don't think we are at a point where you grab the kids anymore. You have to grab the parents because what's happening is the parents are not providing the children with what is needed to foster a lifestyle, a safe haven, and just at the end of the day when it is your time to check out is here, you look back and say, I had a good life.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right. I know you want to hear more from these gentleman. So Ed Gordon once again, it's "Daddy's Promise" initiative, and Hill Harper have two best-selling books delving into these very issues right here. "letters to a Young Brother" and "Letters to a Young Sister." And of course, there's so much more about the Essence Music Festival at essence.com. You can actually go to their website and get a chance to hear all the music. So many musical artists that have been brought through for this 14th annual Essence Festival. And of course, as you know, Richard, this festival will end up having the largest number of African-American artists of any venue at one time. So, a lot all jammed into three days here in New Orleans.

LUI: And you were there wall to wall for that certainly. All right. Fred, we'll talk to you in a little bit. Thank you for that.

Down our next half hour, Fred will talk to radio talk show host Tom Joyner about how black Americans are struggling in these economic hard times. Stay around for that. It's being asked, Big Bertha. And how big is Bertha right now, Chad?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Bertha is a little Bertha right now. It's a fairway wood. He is certainly not a driver yet, but there's a tropical storm Bertha out there right now. 45 to 50 miles per hour, kind of wavering back and forth in the middle of the ocean. Literally, the middle of the ocean. Because that's Africa and they're way, way up there is North America. A look at it on the map and it right there just a small tropical storm. But what could it do, where could it go? That's a big story. Right now it's a fish storm. It doesn't hit anything at all. But we'll show you that cone again in a little bit.

Denver, you're seeing delays because of thunderstorms. Atlanta has storms coming through here now. This is a get-back home kind of Sunday. And a lot of you are not getting back home. JFK, Newark, Philadelphia all now with significant delays across the state and across the country now. Sacramento, you are about to get hot again. What does that matter? Well, Big Sur is about to get hot again, too. Big Sur is where all those fires are going on, have a little bit of relieve, a little bit of a marine layer and a bit of nice cool and some fog coming in. But that's about to all be done.

So here we go. Back to Bertha. Where does it go? Well, it misses everything so far. There's not one computer model that has this storm hitting anything, but because we begin to color that in and then put a one in there, it does turn into a hurricane. And hurricanes can have minds of their own. They can make their own wind path. This thing was already supposed to be turning by now on up into the middle of the Atlantic. Well, about Friday afternoon, the computer said, whew, it's not turning? And is it going to turn. Well, we'll see. The cone, we have to watch the cone that could still take it to the U.S. by sometime, not this week but literally next week. That's how far it is away.

LUI: And as you told us many times, they do start to have a mind of their own. They will waggle whenever they want to. OK. Thanks, Chad.

MYERS: Sure.

LUI: Hey, let's talk Wimbledon for you. It was a squeaker. Rafael Nadal against Roger Federer. And what happened in the end. It was a five-setter. Rafael Nadal took home the trophy at Wimbledon. It lasted almost seven hours, a little bit more than seven hours today as they both fought through some rain delays as well. Now, yesterday it was the Williams' sisters. It was a ratings' coup, but guess who won? Venus took it home in two sets. It was the seventh time that those two met. So a great weekend at Wimbledon, if you are a tennis lover.

The Olympic porch on the way to Beijing and President Bush asked today why he'll be there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: And here's what's happening for you now. At least 16 people were killed, most of them police officers, in a suicide attack in Islamabad, Pakistan. The officers were stationed near a rally protesting last year's raid on a mosque. Then in Afghanistan, another allegation today of a military aircraft bombing civilians. Afghan officials say an air strike killed about two dozen members of a wedding party and wounded several others. A U.S. official says that strike was aimed at combatants.

And exhausted fire crews are chipping away today at that wildfire near Santa Barbara. They have gotten some help from cooler weather, but that fire still threatens though more than 2,500 homes.

You know, the summer Olympic Games begin in barely one month and President Bush's decision to attend the games in China was topic number one today as he arrived in Japan for the group of eight summit. Elaine Quijano reports for us.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In his first public comments on the issue since the official announcement, President Bush at a news conference in Japan defended his decision to attend the opening ceremonies of the Beijing Olympics next month.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I view the Olympics as an opportunity for me to cheer on our athletes. It is an athletic event.

QUIJANO: Amid sharp criticism and pointed suggestions that the president boycott the ceremonies to protest China's dismal human rights record, Mr. Bush insisted he's already raised those issues in the past and will again in the future.

BUSH: I don't need the Olympics to express my concerns. I've been doing so.

QUIJANO: President Bush added that a boycott would be viewed as an affront to the Chinese people. But mindful of China's deadly crackdown this year on Tibetan demonstrators, he also reminded reporters he is the first sitting U.S. president to eve appear publicly with Tibet's exiled leader, the Dalai Lama.

President Bush will sit down for talks with China's president Hu Jintao on Wednesday, where the packed agenda will reflect a complex political and economic relationship between the two countries. Elaine Quijano, CNN, Japan.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LUI: For the last few days, we've been showing you this video of the hostage rescue in Colombia. Our Josh Levs joins us again and has been looking at the military video from the Colombian government with a fine-tooth comb and found some pretty fine details in there. Hey, Josh.

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, there. As you know, you and I got to talk about this a little bit yesterday. But what's been happening is a lot of people checking out the video with a lot of questions about it.

The more we look at it, the more we discover we want to show you. Let's start off with the very beginning of it. I want to set the scene of it for you. It's on the screen right behind me. I'm going to step out of the way now. Now everyone you're seeing in fatigues, we're told by the Colombian military, everyone in fatigues like that is a member of FARC. That is the revolutionary group in Colombia that has had these hostages for years.

Let's skip ahead now to the next section of video I want to show you, because what we're going to see here are the first images of hostages. There are several hostages here. That is Ingrid Betancourt. You are about to see one of the Americans as well, Keith Stansell. A lot of people are remarking that they look relatively healthy. We have yet to learn a lot about what they've been through and what they were like. Let's turn up the sound a little bit for just a moment, let's hear what he says.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEVS: OK, I'm going to jump back in here. It's very difficult to hear what he says here. You hear his voice for just a moment. What we do hear him say is "amo mi familia," I love my family.

Now these hostages, you might wonder, why do they think there's a video camera there? This is the scene. We're told that FARC believes that there's a humanitarian group that's going to be moving all these hostages, including this fellow right here, from one area to another area. And FARC has agreed to that. And along with the humanitarian mission came video cameras. That we're told is the ruse.

Let's skip ahead now to see where these hostages are taken. These, right here, are the last steps they are ever taking as hostages. They are entering this helicopter, again the military in Colombia provided this video. They enter this helicopter here and I want you to notice all those people from FARC watching this chopper. They are watching the chopper take off. So they are right there.

Now these are the first images after the hostages have been told, "you're free." Let's listen in. So you can hear the celebrating, you can hear some tears. You see Ingrid Betancourt up there. We also want to show you one image in here that we created a freeze frame of. Let's skip up to that because this is really critical. And I'm going to step back into the picture here. I want to point to it. This right here, you can see it is someone's knees. We believe, we can't be sure, but we believe that's one of their captors. Their lead captor, Cesar.

The reason we believe it is this. Ingrid Betancourt said that when she stepped on the plate she saw her lead captor Cesar had been naked and bound. And boom, at that point, she knew she was free. But if you think about it, you have all of those people from FARC outside with weapons, he must have been subdued in some quiet way, as well as another FARC person on that.

And it must have been after they took off that they were informed, yes you're free. You see the celebration. So what we want to know right now, we're looking into this. Is this Cesar right here? How did they subdue these people? What happened to them? And obviously Richard, a ton of questions about the whole scenario I just showed you. Who did they pull it off? What did FARC believe and what really went into this?

LUI: Still so dynamic there and a great autopsy of what we do know so far. Josh Levs, thanks again.

LEVS: Thanks a lot.

LUI: All right, from that angle now, we want to take a look at the psychological angle - the toll that years of captivity can take on hostages. Joining us right now by phone is Dr. Gail Saltz, she's an associate professor of psychiatry at New York Presbyterian Hospital and an expert on trauma bonding. Dr. Saltz, good day to you.

DR. GAIL SALTZ, NEW YORK PRESBYTERIAN HOSPITAL: Good day Richard, how are you?

LUI: Very well. Dr. Saltz, let's start with what I read in the "New York Times." It says, when her handcuffs were removed, Ms. Betancourt looked down at her former captor, their roles now reversed and felt a mix of emotions." Quote, "I saw him on the floor," she said, "I did not feel happiness, but what a shame."

Now what this might bring to some people's minds is the Stockholm syndrome. Explain that to us.

SALTZ: Well, the Stockholm syndrome is really a descriptor for situations where someone has been taken captive, when they've been kidnapped and at the end when they are released, they develop over the course of their captivity feelings of potentially affection, certainly an identification with their perpetrator. And it leaves them feeling bonded, which is why it is really, the defense we are looking at is called trauma bonding.

It is bonding during a trauma to the person who is in the position of authority or power. It actually is a healthy defense mechanism in children. You know, you bond to your parent or to the authority figure because evolutionarily, it will help you survive.

LUI: But not in this case.

SALTZ: This is where defense runs amuck where unfortunately they bond to their captor and they feel empathy toward them. They're concerned. So her comments, is she concerned for the captive? Is she feeling - well, they're not really responsible. I'm concerned about what might happen to them afterwards. Then you might worry that that's the case.

LUI: So, perhaps her comment there did indicate that. Also, another comment she made in an interview. She said that while she was showering one night, the lights went out and the first thing she said was, oh, my god, the FARC is back. What do you make of that comment?

SALTZ: Well, I think that for almost anyone who has been in captivity for so long, it wouldn't be surprising to have at least initially an acute stress reaction. In other words, having initially some flash backs, some fear, some anxiety that they could easily end up back in the situation that they'd been in for so long. And the question really is that's not very surprising, but will this resolve over time or, and again, it wouldn't be shocking, will it develop into more of a post-traumatic stress disorder where months down the road, they'll still be intrusions into the day of oh my gosh, could I be back there or having flashbacks? I feel like I'm back there that is brought on by a situation like that. I'm suddenly in the dark or something unexpected is happening.

LUI: All right so Dr. Saltz, it could be too early to tell I guess is what you're saying in the end. So thank you so much, Dr. Gail Saltz from the New York Presbyterian Hospital. Thanks for stopping by and giving us an insight into some of the comments that are being made and the future for Ms. Betancourt.

You know, you don't want to miss a special CNN presentation on former hostage Ingrid Betancourt, as we've been talking about her. The HBO documentary looks at Betancourt's kidnapping and her family's six-year struggle to free her. HBO's "The Kidnapping of Ingrid Betancourt" begins tonight at 6 Eastern right here on CNN.

The candidates are not campaigning today. But that does not mean there's no political news for you. We've got some trail mix for you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: It is a quiet Sunday on the presidential campaign trail. After addressing groups of teachers and religion leaders yesterday, Senator Barack Obama is taking time off today to spend some time with his family. Then tomorrow, he heads south to campaign stops in North Carolina and Georgia. Senator John McCain meanwhile is at home in Arizona this holiday weekend. After church today, he planned to visit a nearby veterans' hospital. Tomorrow, McCain is back on the trail campaigning in Denver.

From the CNN political ticker for you today, the messenger defending his message. Senator Barack Obama responds to critics who accuse him of flip-flopping on Iraq. Yesterday aboard his campaign plane, Obama said his stance has been consistent, that he wants to safely withdraw U.S. troops from Iraq, but he deserves the right to refine his policy as the situation warrants.

Well both candidates as well have busy schedule this week. Give you a preview here. On Tuesday, Senators McCain and Obama address a top Latino organization. Later in the week, Obama has three New York fundraisers with Senator Hillary Clinton. McCain is expected to unveil his plan for more job creation as he stops key battleground states.

And happy birthday, Mr. President! Mr. Bush celebrating his 62nd birthday aboard Air Force One, while en route to the G-8 summit. White House press secretary Dana Perino says the president enjoyed a conservative size slice of coconut cake, still tasty.

For the latest campaign news, log on to CNNPolitics.com. It is the source for all things political.

All right, now to the struggle to survive in a war zone that leaves one woman with an unthinkable choice. She must leave some of her children in an orphanage.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Honestly, my heart was set to fire. I swear to god, it was so painful. My children were crying, but I told them it's for the best.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LUI: Her heart and family broken, but all is not lost.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: Well, one day after Iraq's prime minister proclaimed his government had defeated terrorism, insurgents say otherwise. A car bomb exploding outside a Baghdad mosque this morning. Authorities say it was likely targeting a police patrol. Six people were killed and at least 16 others wounded in this attack.

And this weekend, CNN and UNICEF are taking a special look at the plight of children around the world. In Iraq, thousands of families have been impacted by war and need urgent help. CNN's Jill Dougherty found one mother of six who was finally getting some.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In a Baghdad slum, a dank and dark stairwell leads to the home of Samira and her six children. They are victims of this conflict, not hit by bombs or bullets, but their family has been ripped apart by the pressures of simply trying to survive with no jobs, no money, no hope. Four years ago, Samira says her husband, consumed by that pressure, suddenly left her. Alone with six children, she tried to make ends meet working as a street vendor. Things got so bad, she says, she made the painful decision to give up three of her children putting them in or orphanage.

SAMIRA HUSSEIN, SINGLE MOTHER (through translator): It was a very hard time for us. We couldn't afford to pay our rent. We had nothing to eat, nothing to drink. Honestly, my heart was set in fire. I swear to god, it was so painful. My children were crying, but I told them it is for the best. And when I can manage a better life, then I will be back to you.

DOUGHERTY: Things improved a bit when her two older sons eventually found work. Sixteen-year-old Amir (ph) polishes shoes. Mohammed (ph), 23, gets paid for minding an electrical generator in the neighborhood. And with the help of the UNICEF program that reunites families, Samira was finally able to bring her children back from the orphanage. The organization provides enough food, four bags a month, to feed her family.

HUSSEIN: Eggs, canned food, beef and fish, tomato paste and oil, so much food, it is very good. Honestly, they saved us.

DOUGHERTY: Samira has little hope for her own life. She has diabetes and tires easily. The future, she says, belongs to her children. "God knows I will not last," she says, "but all the time I think of them." Jill Dougherty, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LUI: You can watch the "The Survival Project: One Child at a Time" tonight at 8 Eastern. The CNN/UNICEF special is hosted by our Dr. Sanjay Gupta. He brings you compelling stories of children at risk all around the world. If you would like to help, you can also find more about the global initiative to protect children at CNN.com/Impact as well. There's a special section on our "Impact Your World" page, dedicated to The Survival Project.

OK, let's kick it down to New Orleans and Fredericka Whitfield to learn more about a man called the fly jock. How are you doing, Fred?

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, good to see you. You know, the reason why he's called the fly jock is because he's the hardest working man in radio. Tom Joyner joining us to talk about findings solutions for the many problems that ail the black community, right here in the NEWSROOM in New Orleans.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LUI: The compelling sounds of New Orleans right there for you. This is just one of many music workshops this weekend at the Essence Music Festival in New Orleans. We know the Essence Festival is being called a party with a purpose. Our Fredricka Whitfield is in New Orleans all this week.

And one of the themes this year, Fredricka, economic empowerment in these hard economic times. And you've been really digging into that story, right, Fred?

WHITFIELD: That's right. It's self empowerment as a whole. And you know what, we talked to a man who's known as the most recognizable man in radio and the hardest working man in radio, Tom Joyner, and he talked about problem solving here at the Essence Music Festival.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM JOYNER, RADIO HOST: The recession in America is real. But with Black America, the recession has been real for a long time. So while America is trying to deal with the recession and the economy, we've been dealing with it for forever. We are constantly in a recession, Black America is, and so we don't let those things get us down.

WHITFIELD: Which means the problem is multiplied.

JOYNER: Yes, it is. Yes, it is. And we have to try to find money to pay our rent, to pay our house notes, to get some gas money, to get some day care money and then we have to have some money for ourselves. And OK, a lot of these people when they go home, some of these bills are not going to get paid. But for this weekend, we had a good time and we had a good time and we networked and we got some empowerment at the same time.

WHITFIELD: And this economic slowdown across the country has impacted really every sector. But when we talk about black homeownership, black homeownership has gone down 2 percent just within the past two years. And that was before anyone talked about a slowdown. So what is your fear about how bad it really might be, particularly for the black homeowner or the black family?

JOYNER: It is critical. It is critical. A lot of us got into these mortgages and we have given up 60, 70 percent of our income a month just to say that we owned a home. Well, OK, economically, that's not very sound, to spend 60 to 70 percent of your paycheck on a mortgage. But if that's what it is going to take for us to be homeowners, then we'll try it. Now that the whole thing has come crashing and we are feeling the brunt of it.

WHITFIELD: And when we talk about this festival being one of empowerment, it is also about reteaching how we think, where it comes to mortgages. What's reasonable? You know, what's reasonable in terms of a portion of your paycheck that's devoted to your car note or to your house note?

JOYNER: And there are several seminars trying to help brothers and sisters on doing just that. That's the good thing about this party here in New Orleans. You know, we party, we party with a purpose and the purpose is empowerment.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right, Tom Joyner among those keeping the dialogue going here at the Essence Music Festival. And even though this is the last day of the three-day festival, the hope is from the organizers that people will continue to talk about these things and talk about solutions even when they leave here.

But first, before they leave, they are going to be taking in some more music this evening. Mary J. Blige, you see her picture up there. She's one of the headliners there, along with comedian Chris Rock. At the Louisiana Dome, I'm Fredricka Whitfield from New Orleans. It's been fun being here, Richard. Next time you'll have to join me.

LUI: Oh, I tell you. Mary J. Blige tonight, you had Rihanna also last night. I'm kind of smacking myself in the head. All right, thanks a lot Fred, talk to you later.

WHITFIELD: I know, it's been a great event.

LUI: it certainly has. Thank you again, Fred. The essence of New Orleans in our next hour. Fredricka will be talking to evangelist Juanita Bynum about faith and the controversy surrounding her life and ministry. The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM, that starts right now.