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CNN LARRY KING LIVE
Paparazzi vs. Hollywood Stars
Aired July 25, 2008 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KATHY GRIFFIN, GUEST HOST: Tonight, paparazzi versus the stars. Is it the most dysfunctional relationship in Hollywood? They both need each other but cooperation has turned to confrontation. Have the photogs gone too far? We go live to celebrity hot spots for an inside look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Say hi to Larry King for me. Happy birthday. Oh!
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GRIFFIN: And Brooke Hogan tells us all that exposure isn't really all that great.
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BROOKE HOGAN, HULK HOGAN'S DAUGHTER: I didn't realize how interested in your life they actually get.
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GRIFFIN: The war offer privacy, right now on LARRY KING LIVE.
Can you believe this? I am the Emmy Award winning and now double Emmy nominated Kathy Griffin filling in for Larry King. What's the public's fascination with fame? Celebrities claim they have no privacy while paparazzi claims First Amendment rights. Regardless of who you side with, it's a billion dollar business and both sides are fighting to hold their ground.
We'll meet some paparazzi in a minute. First we want to check in with Jason Kennedy from E! Entertainment. Jason is live on La Cienega, West Hollywood, home of multiple celebrity hot spots.
Jason, besides trolling the street, what are you doing there? Do you have any purpose?
JASON KENNEDY, E! ENTERTAINMENT: I kind of have a little bit of a purpose right now. As you mentioned, we are on La Cienega Boulevard. STK, it's a big hot spot. We've got Coco DeVille right there, which is a lounge. Over there is a big sushi hot spot with all types of A-listers, called Koi Nobu (ph) back there. It's kind of quiet right now, but it's early. But you've got to give the celebs a break. They will be coming in and out. We hear big stars will be arriving here later this evening.
GRIFFIN: Jason, who do you think is going to come?
KENNEDY: I can't tell you my tips.
GRIFFIN: Who would you like to see fall out of a car drunk?
KENNEDY: Lindsay Lohan possibly. Maybe Cameron Diaz.
GRIFFIN: Any of your girlfriends? Slash friends?
KENNEDY: Yes. That could be a whole another show that we do. But at any given point, 10 to possibly 20 photographers are out here to get the money shot. We have a couple of guys literally hiding. They found out we were going live.
GRIFFIN: Porn? Is this a bigger business than porn?
KENNEDY: You think probably disgusting.
GRIFFIN: I do.
KENNEDY: It is much bigger than porn. It's selling magazines like "People Magazine", "Us Weekly." It generates revenue for our show.
GRIFFIN: I call them books but if you want to go with magazines. Is there anyone you're afraid of seeing?
KENNEDY: Here's the thing, celebrities will be here later on.
GRIFFIN: You don't have to yell at me.
KENNEDY: It is my job to interview them. I just have to do it. I'm not going to yell at you.
I love you, Kathy, you're doing great so far. We'll be here all night by the way.
GRIFFIN: Thank you. All right. We'll check back with you to see who stumbles out of their car.
And here we have an actual -- is it paparazzi or paparazzo?
JENNIFER BUHL, PAPARAZZO: I call it paparazza, but that's just ...
GRIFFIN: Because you're a lady. All right. Jennifer Buhl is here. What is your life like? Are you a good guy, a bad guy or in between?
BUHL: Well, I think I'm a good girl, guy. But some people would probably not like me.
GRIFFIN: I like the way you think, lady. What do you think about the celebrities kind of whining about not having privacy, or on the other hand, saying back off with the kids. I'm out with my kids. Where do you draw the line?
BUHL: Well, I think in any given situation, there is a line. Like in any job there is an ethical boundary that you do not cross. And so ...
GRIFFIN: Whoa, whoa, whoa, what's yours?
BUHL: Well, it just depends on the situation, I would say.
GRIFFIN: Let's say I walk out of my house and I don't have pants on. Take the picture or don't?
BUHL: I would probably take the picture.
GRIFFIN: I would, too. OK. And that would sell for how much?
BUHL: You without pants on.
GRIFFIN: Holding one of Brangelina's babies?
BUHL: That would probably go for a lot of money, $50,000, $100,000 maybe.
GRIFFIN: Why do I ever wear pants?
BUHL: Exactly. We could work something together, actually, as well. I can give you part of it. In fact, that works a lot.
GRIFFIN: I wanted to ask you about that. I don't know anything. This is a theory. But I've heard stories that the Britneys of the world are really, truly in bed with the photog companies and there's some sort of split going on there.
BUHL: There is a symbiotic relationship with a lot of celebrity and paparazzi.
GRIFFIN: Who calls who first?
BUHL: You know, I don't know how we exchange numbers always.
GRIFFIN: I'll just give you my home number.
BUHL: Absolutely. But I think that's what a lot of the public doesn't realize. You know, the heckles and the things that we get when there's a lot of us on Britney or Lindsay. You know, and I want to just look at them and be like, what are you doing? Like trying to be in front of the photographers. She called us. Or whatever.
GRIFFIN: That's what I think, too, nobody just goes to kiss and have hair and make up unless they've called first. By nobody, I mean me. I don't go out of the shower, I go after hair and makeup.
BUHL: Don't get me wrong, it's not like all the celebrities want it.
GRIFFIN: Who do you think genuinely doesn't want to be photographed? Like really hates it? Nicholson?
BUHL: I don't know. I've never -- maybe.
GRIFFIN: He'll throw a Croc at you.
BUHL: Julia Roberts hates it. Kate Bosworth hates it.
GRIFFIN: Is it worth more money if they hate it?
BUHL: It depends. No, not necessarily. Because they become boring. Because their lives are just normal and they're not photographed often. And so nobody really starts to care about them. Charlize Theron, a lot of beautiful, beautiful women, yes, they'll sell.
GRIFFIN: But they're not puking.
BUHL: Exactly. Like people are more interested in, like, you know, Lindsay and Samantha. Just crazy stuff like that.
GRIFFIN: Are there actual levels like, it's worth this much if they're drunk, this much if you see a bare breast? This much if they're puking? I'm not asking for tips for myself at all.
BUHL: It's definitely driven a lot by the story. You know, there are certain, like, cash cows. Matthew McConaughey will always sell.
GRIFFIN: Weren't you there for the McConaughey melee at the beach?
BUHL: I was.
GRIFFIN: What was that like?
BUHL: That was probably an 18 months of my worst experience as a paparazzi.
GRIFFIN: Wow. We'll get to that later. Because I want to hear every detail. What shot have you gotten that surprised you the most? Where you thought, I never thought I would get that person doing this?
BUHL: Probably one of the shots that sold the best, that I didn't expect, didn't even know, was Paris Hilton carrying the Bible right before she went to jail. During that, there was like probably 10 photographers and three big ...
GRIFFIN: And the Lord Jesus was probably there, too.
GRIFFIN: Ten apostles.
BUHL: There was three big short, stocky paparazzi in front of her in a little thing like this.
GRIFFIN: A formation of paparazzi?
BUHL: A formation. It was really wrong. You're not supposed to do that. But the other paparazzi that were there couldn't do anything about it because they were these big strong guys. So I was actually on the side and really mad because generally you want the front-on picture.
Well, in the end I went back and looked and I said, that's interesting, she has a Bible. But I still didn't think that much of it.
GRIFFIN: By getting the side shot you got the Bible.
BUHL: I was the only one that got the Bible.
GRIFFIN: Hence, as Jason said, the money shot?
BUHL: Exactly. You just never know.
GRIFFIN: Who knew?
Coming up, 19-year-old Brooke Hogan, her entire family is a paparazzi target. We'll get Brooke's take when LARRY KING LIVE returns.
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B. HOGAN: Hey, dad, how are you doing?
HULK HOGAN, REALITY TV STAR: I'm doing great, baby girl. How are you doing?
B. HOGAN: We're throwing a housewarming party.
H. HOGAN: You evidently don't have my new address. I didn't get my invitation in the mail.
B. HOGAN: Dad, it's not a house party for parents.
H. HOGAN: Need to get you guys balloons or any party favors or anything?
B. HOGAN: Oh my gosh.
H. HOGAN: All right, Brooke. I love you, girl.
B. HOGAN: Love you, too, dad.
H. HOGAN: Bye-bye.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: We're here with Brooke Hogan from "Brooke Knows Best," your new show. And you obviously have some thoughts on the paparazzi. Your dad calls them the terrorazzi, or the paparazzi terrorists ...
B. HOGAN: Oh my gosh. He can't stand them. I'm not even going to give his opinion. Because it's going to be a lot harsher than mine is going to be.
GRIFFIN: You have to get the orange scarf and it's a whole wardrobe change.
B. HOGAN: Yes. Yes.
GRIFFIN: My question for you is and I am of course on a reality show as well. But do you feel like you got more fame than you bargained for?
B. HOGAN: You know what, I think I got more ridiculing than I bargained for. I knew that that would be part of it. But I didn't realize that it was going to be this bad. And I didn't realize how into your life they actually get.
GRIFFIN: What's the worst story? Climbing a fence? Knocking out a window?
B. HOGAN: Worst story right now ...
GRIFFIN: Peeing your pants?
B. HOGAN: Worst story ...
GRIFFIN: Your reaction is oh no, one time they were in my ...
B. HOGAN: No, the worst story as an experience with them was actually I was, I'm not very, you know, knowledgeable about the areas of Los Angeles.
GRIFFIN: Or voting. And we'll get to that.
B. HOGAN: Or voting, yes. And I actually, I came down to L.A., or I came up to L.A., and I took my friends to Robertson. We heard it was like the cool shopping place. It is paparazzi central. We stepped out of Kitson, because I was like, they have cute stuff, I'm just thinking of the cute little boutique in L.A. And about 50 guys came and just created this U shape in front of us.
GRIFFIN: What kind of stuff do they yell? It's not just Brooke, Brooke.
B. HOGAN: They try very nice to get an answer first. They are like, oh, Brooke, you look beautiful today. You could have your zits hanging out and have your fat rolls hanging out, they'll be like you look so beautiful just to get you to answer. And if you don't answer, which I started doing ...
GRIFFIN: It's, your mom is dating a 19 year old?
B. HOGAN: What do you think about your mom dating a 19 year old? You know, you used to be so nice, why don't you answer us anymore? They are just like -- it shows their real seediness inside.
GRIFFIN: And it's interesting, because they don't actually write the stories anyway. So even if you gave them amazing quote, they're still just getting the picture.
B. HOGAN: Right.
GRIFFIN: Do you ever intentionally give them the bird or anything?
B. HOGAN: No. I have definitely thought about it, though.
GRIFFIN: I have, too. I mean, I've thought about you doing it. I've done it many times. Many, many times.
B. HOGAN: So I've heard.
GRIFFIN: How has the paparazzi interfered with you filming your reality show? Or have they?
B. HOGAN: It's crazy because in Miami there's not really that many, thank God. They haven't migrated. But after the show, you know, once the show is airing, it's kind of like it gets heavier and heavier, especially if I'm doing press in New York or L.A.
GRIFFIN: And so they'll follow you to the talk shows and stuff?
B. HOGAN: Yes. When I was in L.A., we actually started getting tailed by the paparazzi. Which I never thought that would happen to me. I thought it only happened to Britney Spears and Paris Hilton. Two cars were on her tail, and they were recklessly driving. To the point where my mom came screaming at them.
GRIFFIN: With the boyfriend?
B. HOGAN: No. Not with the boyfriend.
GRIFFIN: That was inappropriate. I'm sorry. So it is scary to have them chase you around?
B. HOGAN: It is. Because I'm always like, all right, just focus on driving. You know, they're just driving behind you. You're not -- it's not a big deal. But the fact that somebody's following you in the back of your mind, you're like, it's the fight or flight kind of mode. You want to go.
GRIFFIN: And they probably know that.
B. HOGAN: Yes. They probably know that.
GRIFFIN: And they probably want you to panic.
B. HOGAN: It actually happened on my way here today.
GRIFFIN: I think the only way that could change that would be a female president. Brooke, what is up with that -- I have to read you this quote. You have to take it back.
B. HOGAN: Read it.
GRIFFIN: All right. You know what? And this is from your show. So believe me, I know what it's liking have cameras around all the time. And believe me I want to take back half of the things I've said, except about Oprah. "I am actually not that much into voting." Brooke, you're a role model. You have to register.
B. HOGAN: You know what it is? It's actually being -- there were some other things that went along with that that was funny humor. But the fact that I'm not into voting, it was kind of taken out of context actually.
GRIFFIN: But would you vote this time?
B. HOGAN: I am being a good role model because I just don't want to vote for the person I think would be a good president. I'm actually not up to date on the facts about what's going on right now. Because I've been so busy.
GRIFFIN: Stop talking. I'm trying to help you out here. So then this time you'll be voting because all the young women should. And Brooke Hogan as a role model wants you to rock the boat.
B. HOGAN: I just don't want to vote not knowing. I want to get up to date.
GRIFFIN: All right. And how have they affected your life when you're going through a crisis? Because in my show I went through a divorce and my dad passed away and stuff. What's it like having the layer on top of the real life stuff going on in your life?
B. HOGAN: You know what? It was starting to get really bad. We heard about the jail tapes being released. I mean, it was just miserable. I mean, it really put us through a lot of stress. And it really does not help legal issues when you're dealing with lawsuits and stuff like that in your family. I mean, it really doesn't help, because there's a lot of media influence in the court of law, believe it or not. And it's kind of like, I really don't like you guys talking so bad about us, because it's not helping.
GRIFFIN: And then like when you go to the red carpet and the same photographers are there. Then you're promoting your show.
B. HOGAN: I'm like, hi. I just try to make it quick. Give them the shot and go before they can start shouting stuff out to you.
GRIFFIN: What is your "don't look at me" look? The baseball cap? Sunglasses?
B. HOGAN: It's the crazy eye.
You know what? That's one of the questions that -- it's how you dress. And it's like, I try when I know that I'm going into an area of paparazzi, and this is probably a mistake, I try to dress down, I try to go no makeup and the baseball cap, sunglasses. Then they still find out you're there. And then they get pictures of you looking like poop.
GRIFFIN: You need to get that prosthetic like you wore on the show that time where you were totally unrecognizable.
B .HOGAN: Yes, I was like Goth girl.
GRIFFIN: It's great having you, thank you very, very much.
B. HOGAN: Thank you, Kathy.
GRIFFIN: If I learned anything from watching "Point Break" from Keanu Reeves, have you seen "Point Break"?
B. HOGAN: I haven't.
GRIFFIN: For older people.
It's that surfers are territorial and the paparazzi in locals in Malibu have been going at it like crazy. We'll talk to a paparazzo who was on the scene. It's just getting good, folks, so stay with us.
GRIFFIN: It's me, Kathy Griffin. Normally you see me on Thursday nights on "My Life on the D List", but tonight I'm Larry King with a wig. Now, let's talk about this Malibu melee. We have Mark Geragos, Drew Pinsky, we have the paparazzo back. Jennifer -- paparazza.
All right. What happened? I saw the tape. Who's guilty, who's innocence.
Mark, what are you giving her the evil eye for?
MARK GERAGOS, ATTORNEY: She wants some support. She's just telling me, please be supportive.
GRIFFIN: Is that fair?
GERAGOS: Yes, it is. She's right. There's a symbiotic relationship. The people who are getting photographed for the most part want it. Obviously there's paparazzi who walk over the line or way over the line. But for the most part they're just doing their job.
GRIFFIN: What about Jennifer?
GERAGOS: She's an ex-CNN intern. We don't slam her on the air.
GRIFFIN: OK. Drew, I know you, of course, specialize in relationships. Be honest, what is the relationship between the celebrity and the photog? Because we know they want the fame or they wouldn't be a celebrity. DREW PINSKY, ADDICTION MEDICINE SPECIALIST: Absolutely. Which is part of the pathology is they tend to come to their fame with a lot of narcissistic tendencies.
GRIFFIN: Guilty. You disagree?
PINKSY: Well, what I've seen over the years I've been working in psychiatric hospitals, the magnitude of it has gotten worse when people can't maintain stable relationships and have very chaotic lives and lots of drug and alcohol use. And when they're irritable and agitated and discontent and somebody's in their face with cameras, that's somebody to take it out on.
PINSKY: So often, although it's symbiotic, it's also somebody to focus your aggression on.
GRIFFIN: Interesting. So you're saying Alec Baldwin should pipe down. Jennifer, are you on drugs or alcohol?
BUHL: No, I'm not. Not right now.
GRIFFIN: Would you say that that was a stumble? You're the cross examiner.
GERAGOS: I don't know. You were doing a pretty good job. I'll let you go at it.
GRIFFIN: You'll talk when spoken to. In the paparazzi, though, in that culture, isn't that kind of a parting culture as well? Lot of late nights?
BUHL: I wouldn't necessarily say that, no.
GRIFFIN: All right. So there was no alcohol fueling that Malibu McConaughey fight?
BUHL: There was alcohol fueling it but it was from the 16 year old kids. Absolutely none of the paparazzi that I was aware of, I mean, generally we don't drink or do drugs on the job. It is a job. And we take it very seriously.
GRIFFIN: 6:00, though, it is on.
BUHL: There was definitely, you can see from the video, a lot of kids that were underage drinking. That A, they were underage drinking, and B, they're not allowed to have alcohol on the beach. And no one consistently does anything about that because they think it's a private beach and it operates like it's a private beach.
GRIFFIN: Mark? What should be done?
GRIFFIN: Whoa, man of the people, take it easy. Wow. Peace, love. Haight-Ashbury.
GERAGOS: I don't know. The idea that somehow they're going to pass a law to abridge the First Amendment, it's not going to work.
GRIFFIN: Welcome to the United States or the Soviet Union, is that right my friend?
PINSKY: I think they're going to create a no paparazzo zones or something for traffic issues?
GERAGOS: I can't see where that would ever stand muster. The idea that somehow you're going to create a new law to address this. Look, if there there's underage drinking, there's a law for that. Bust the kids for that. If somebody's assaulting, bust them for that. There is already enough laws. We don't need more laws, or anti- paparazzi laws or anything else. There's zones that they can go into and can't go into.
GRIFFIN: Or have delivered to their home.
GERAGOS: That could be.
GRIFFIN: Which is how I took the weight off. There's zones.
BUHL: There's private property. And we don't go into restaurants, we don't go into stores, we don't go into people's homes. There's already a lot of private property.
GRIFFIN: I've seen paparazzi go into stores.
BUHL: Rarely does that happen.
GRIFFIN: I've seen that Britney footage where they knock over the Doritos.
BUHL: Absolutely. That is because Britney is complicit in those photographs, she doesn't mind us going in stores behind her.
GRIFFIN: What about the store owner? I just lost all the money on the Doritos.
PINSKY: It's the store that's private property, not Britney.
BUHL: Absolutely. You know, in that case, that shouldn't happen. And it doesn't very often happen. But to privatize a beach or to privatize a big area of a park or whatever is ludicrous.
GERAGOS: I don't know how you do it in this day and age anyway. Everybody's got an iPhone or some other phone and they can take photos themselves, they can take videos and put it on the Internet within minutes.
GRIFFIN: Drew, talk to us about the celebrities that go out knowing there's going to be paparazzi there and loving it. Kathy Griffins, if you will. PINSKY: I think the Kathy Griffins that thrive in that spotlight, I think to make the claims that somehow that is a source of stress, it's not that stressful.
GRIFFIN: Not if I know I'm walking into it. I'm not Jolie having the kids just walking out of the hospital.
PINSKY: The reality is those for whom it is really and truly a stress is probably a dozen people or so. Everybody else that complains about it is really people who seek it, or as you say, complicit in it and who get along with it for the most part. It's sort of almost a way of saying, I'm cool. I don't like all this. But in fact, it's basking in the glow of it. In fact.
GRIFFIN: I do. Now, I want to hear about these wheels and deals. Have you ever broken one of these, Mark?
GRIFFIN: You're just saying that live on the air?
GERAGOS: It's true. It's not just the tabloids that do this, mind you. Mainstream media does this as well. They will book a guest, or they want your person to be there, and then there's some kind of a payment that's made for a book deal or a magazine deal.
GRIFFIN: I've been doing this all along.
GERAGOS: Or a publishing arm.
GRIFFIN: I've been doing this all wrong.
PINSKY: Call Mark.
GRIFFIN: What's your number?
GERAGOS: This is done ...
GRIFFIN: So wait a minute. So I've heard about the Britney deal. That Britney made a deal with one of the photog agencies, and what happened, she dials them up and says I'm going to the Malibu Mart and the check goes where and it gets split how and how much is it?
GERAGOS: Usually somebody will be a broker. The broker will get the check. The check is then distributed. One part will go to the photographer, part will go to the management company.
GRIFFIN: What's the normal split?
GERAGOS: Depends. You can negotiate anything. I've actually had deals where I have sold the picture with the client's blessing, the client has said, I need to raise funds and I've sold the picture that was pre shot, if you will, and they just say, get the highest bidder.
GRIFFIN: What's the if you will?
GERAGOS: A pre shot.
GRIFFIN: A pre shot?
GRIFFIN: What do you think of your friend here?
PINSKY: Pretty shrewd. It's very interesting to me. Are we saying that most of the things we see in the tabloid magazines are ...
BUHL: I wouldn't say most of them.
BUHL: Like a setup job.
GERAGOS: Seventy five percent.
BUHL: No, no.
GRIFFIN: Come on. If you're in hair and makeup ...
BUHL: It's very easy to tell if a shot is set up or not.
GERAGOS: I'd say 75 percent are where the star not only doesn't mind, but may have told somebody, or notified the paparazzi this is where I'm going to be.
BUHL: No, no.
GERAGOS: Or their management company.
GRIFFIN: Come down and stop talking. We still have time to dish about all my tabloid favorites. We'll check back in with the celebrity hot spot and the founder of Hollywood.tv. He's going to join us too. Don't go away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRAD PITT, ACTOR: They call my kids by name. They shove cameras in their faces. I really believe there should be laws against that. My kids believe that anytime you go outside the house, there's just a wall of photographers, people that take your pictures. That is their view of the world. Now, I worry about the effect it will have on them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: Welcome back to LARRY KING LIVE. I'm Kathy Griffin filling in for Larry King. Of course, you can normally see me on "My Life on the D List." Thursdays on Bravo. Anyway, who do you side with? The paparazzi, the celebrities. Vote now at CNN.com/larryking and have your say. Now we return to Jason Kennedy from E! Television.
What is happening now, Jason? What just happened?
KENNEDY: Kathy, we have some action outside of STK. David Spade is celebrating his birthday here. He just walked by. Probably five or six other paparazzi walked by the scene. One actually wiped out trying to get the money shot, as you love so much for me to say here. It's starting to heat up. And, of course, we'll keep you posted. The cake went inside, more of David's friends. He knows a lot of celebrities. It's probably going to get better and better. I'm going to stay stationed here. OK?
GRIFFIN: Jason, you can't write that. Spade's in there, trying to act like he doesn't see the paparazzi. Did he actually assault that one? Mark Geragos, you might want to get on this? I saw assault. I'm an eyewitness.
KENNEDY: There was screaming, yelling. There was no pushing or shoving, but there are rocks here. Apparently it's not paparazzi- proof outside STK at the time. The perfect segue -- no one tried any shenanigans. There was no pantsing going on whatsoever.
GRIFFIN: Nipple tweak?
KENNEDY: I am here. If there is anything, I will let you know.
GRIFFIN: How much for a picture of David Spade tweaking his own nipples right now.
BUHL: Thousand bucks.
GERAGOS: It's not worth that much.
GRIFFIN: Jason, can you tell us about this multi-city paparazzi task force?
KENNEDY: Dennis Zine (ph) is a he councilman here in Los Angeles. Basically, he is forming a task force in the City of Los Angeles on July 31st at 10:00 at city hall. Basically, these memos were going out. On the agenda, they're going to have testimony from the paparazzi targets, victims, people from the media.
GRIFFIN: Give me names. What does that mean, paparazzi targets?
KENNEDY: Targets, it could be anybody. It could be the guy who just fell over here. Anybody who has been directly affected. It could be celebrities. It could be A-list celebrities.
GRIFFIN: Britney, Lindsay?
KENNEDY: They're trying to combat -- who knows. If they show up, that would be amazing.
GRIFFIN: Drunken Mel Gibson?
KENNEDY: Basically, they're trying to combat -- that would be even better. But they are trying to combat overly aggressive paparazzi. They want to put an end to it. I know speaking with a lot of celebrities in my years at E, they would attend something like this. It's going to be interesting to see how that goes.
GRIFFIN: Are you kidding? I would attend. We're back with our panel. We've got Sheeraz Hasan, founder of Hollywood.TV. We've got Jennifer Buhl, paparazzi, Mark Geragos, defense attorney, and Dr. Drew Pinsky, addictionologist, whose new book is called "The Mirror Affect, How Celebrity Narcissism is Seducing America." Consider myself seduced.
Sheeraz, talk to me. Would you be all over this David Spade thing? Would you knock him over? Would you kick him in the nuts.
SHEERAZ HASAN, HOLLYWOODTV: We have people obviously covering the hot spots. But it's not a big story for us. We like to go after the breaking stories as well. That's where the demand is. The media outlets tell us these are the stories we're looking for.
GRIFFIN: Who are the biggest sellers right now?
HASAN: Britney Spears, Brad, Angelina, Paris, Britney, Lindsay.
HASAN: Miley, yes.
GRIFFIN: How about Miley taking her own picture?
HASAN: You know, she's having fun. She's doing it. She's doing it for --
GRIFFIN: Is your teenage daughter taking naughty pictures of herself?
GERAGOS: I check her iPhone on occasion.
GRIFFIN: I hope she's not sending anything to those Jonas Brothers. Is that a hot picture, the Jonas Brothers making out with some guy?
HASAN: Of course it is. That's going to sell. Why not?
GRIFFIN: What kind of picture would you try to get if you were going to get a wholesome celebrity like Miley?
BUHL: Miley's awesome. She's so generous with us. She loves it right now.
GRIFFIN: Dr. Drew, is that code, she's generous with us. PINSKY: Like I said, at least she's being honest with the fact that this is a symbiotic relationship. She's using the paparazzi to convey her image.
GRIFFIN: Why is she putting pictures online? Like she's not photographed enough?
GERAGOS: Have you been on Facebook? They all do it. That's what they do.
GRIFFIN: Stop with the making excuses. What do you have a percentage of the company? You're on the take.
GERAGOS: We have -- we're just a little too old, I'm telling you.
GRIFFIN: You brokered some kind of a deal with the Cyruses, I swear to god. Tell me about this deal brokering? I am fascinated by this. Who makes the call?
HASAN: Sometimes we get calls from the managers, publicists, different locations, sometimes the stars themselves.
GRIFFIN: Wait a minute, you mean you're at your office, or apartment, and then Britney just calls or Jamie Lynn?
HASAN: It depends on who the star is. I don't like to mention names.
GRIFFIN: I do. Who you got?
HASAN: We have relationships with them. They give us a text message. Why not? They know if Hollywood.tv shows up, we can get them to one billion people in 270 countries. Why not? If you know you're going to be in a magazine around the world, it's promotion.
GRIFFIN: There must be some reason why to not do this. I like this, why not. I'm giving birth in 20 minutes. I'm going to take a picture. Why not?
HASAN: To sell records, you know, a movie, it's a PR machine.
GRIFFIN: Is there somebody you want that you haven't gotten yet? Kathy Lee Gifford nude?
GERAGOS: Oh, my god.
BUHL: Kathy griffin.
HASAN: Why not?
GRIFFIN: Will you stop with the why not? Why not?
HASAN: We're running a business, and whatever sells. If you're in the news tomorrow, this is how it works. It's very simple, whoever is in the news at that moment, they become hot. GRIFFIN: Whether it's a celebrity, acting, just famous? Scandal?
HASAN: DUI, drunk and falling over, a fight. It could be anything.
GRIFFIN: How do you get a mug shot?
HASAN: You get that from the --
GERAGOS: Actually, mug shots are pretty easy to get. Mug shots either come straight from the police -- they either release them or --
GRIFFIN: Release them to who, like literally send them to you?
GERAGOS: They just passed a bill here in California making it a misdemeanor for anybody in the court system to sell the items. For a while, that's what was happening.
GRIFFIN: You could horde those. Now they're gone.
GERAGOS: That's no longer an industry you can deal with.
GRIFFIN: So many celebrities, so little time. More dishing ahead as LARRY KING LIVE, the Kathy Griffin edition, continues.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEN EVANSTAD, PAPARAZZI: We've got some information that Calista Flockhart and her son Loam are flying out from the L.A.X. airport. We're going to try to get some nice shots.
Hi, Calista. She's just checking in now. We already have some pictures. We're just going to wait until she finishes checking her bags in and then try to get a few more shots. We'll see if we can get a little longer lens, get something a little more natural.
We got some nice shots, some good candid stuff. Hopefully we'll see it in a magazine next week.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: You know how the Emmy award winning "My Life on The D- List," we had a little fun with the paparazzi, as I had my paparazzi date with Britney's ex-boy toy, Adnan Galip (ph). Check it out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: Adnan was on it, was calling the paps, and telling them exactly where he would be, and what speed he would be driving, and what intersection he would be at when -- he's got it down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hiding under the tree.
GRIFFIN: Who is that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three photographers right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's another two right there. See those two right there.
GRIFFIN: Hey, everybody, it's me, Kathy Griffin.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is that the new Brit? What is this? What is that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can we get a smooch? No kiss? Don't we get a kiss?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: All right, so that picture did accidentally end up in some magazines for nothing, by the way, bubkiss, by the way, Geragos.
GERAGOS: You could have brokered that.
GRIFFIN: For how much? Talk to me.
GERAGOS: Five grand?
GRIFFIN: I know you're being --
GERAGOS: She said max.
HASAN: Again, it's a good story because you're with Adnan. He's pretty hot.
GRIFFIN: What could have made it better.
HASAN: If you started making out with him in the car.
GRIFFIN: I did later. Spoiler.
HASAN: On camera.
GRIFFIN: I'm on an Emmy award-winning show.
HASAN: The bottom line is, look, it works both ways. You went to the Ivy.
GRIFFIN: Of course. Where am I going to go, Denny's?
HASAN: Going to the Ivy, you've got to expect this.
GRIFFIN: I want this.
HASAN: If you go to the Ivy with that many press, your value goes down. If there's 50 photographers there --
GRIFFIN: Where am I supposed to go?
BUHL: There is a two mile radius, maximum, in West Hollywood and Beverly Hills that 90 percent of the paparazzi hang out in, and a little one in Santa Monica.
GRIFFIN: Celebrities know this, correct.
GRIFFIN: I do and I'm just a D-list celebrity.
PINSKY: If you wanted to go out and avoid the paparazzi, it's pretty easy. The restaurants you choose, where you go, where you drive, how fast you drive.
GRIFFIN: Stay at home.
GERAGOS: Live in Pasadena.
BUHL: Celebrities that don't like it rarely, rarely get photographed, rarely get photographed.
HASAN: Then you've got to look at it like, when will they get into the media, when the movie comes out. People only wait once a year.
GRIFFIN: Then they're walking down Robinson all the time when their movie comes out. I will tell you something Adnan said to me that was a little bit chilling, which is I asked him how much a photo would go for between the two of us. He was kind of shy and saying, oh, a lot. I said, no, you don't have to lie. It wouldn't go for more than 50 bucks, right? He goes, it would be worth a lot if you died tomorrow -- Geragos.
GERAGOS: That's true. But then you wouldn't be able to spend the money, so what's the point.
GRIFFIN: What is that? Are these paparazzi out to kill people?
HASAN: Let me get a point clear. Let's just say if you did, god forbid, you did pass away, I'm just saying -- I'm not -- I'm not being offensive. What I'm saying is that who's going to buy it?
GRIFFIN: My mom?
HASAN: It's the networks that are going to buy it. The magazines are going to buy it.
GRIFFIN: Let me ask you some hard names. Lohan and Samantha Ronson, are you guys unfairly outing them?
BUHL: Are we unfairly outing them? I think photographers take pictures of them. They're outing themselves.
GRIFFIN: What do you think? Are they purposely going out to be photographed? They're really photographed a lot.
BUHL: In my opinion, I believe they are. I believe they can be photographed -- they cannot be photographed 95 percent of the time if they don't want to be. Occasionally, they'll get caught.
GRIFFIN: Making out on a boat.
BUHL: I think that they're very complicit in those photographs.
GRIFFIN: I'm all for it. I think she has enough trouble with men.
HASAN: Lindsay works with the paps.
GRIFFIN: She has a deal with them.
HASAN: Not a deal, but she definitely has communication on an ongoing basis. You know?
GRIFFIN: No, tell me. Geragos?
HASAN: Why not? If Lindsay know she's going to go out -- if she's going to go out, it's a lot more safer for her. She knows she's going to get the PR, the publicity. If you notice, all of a sudden, Lindsay's doing movies now. She's doing TV shows now. She's on magazine covers. Why?
GRIFFIN: You don't think he's just taking credit for somebody's career? It so sounds like you're saying, I made her and --
HASAN: The star needs the paparazzi and the paparazzi needs the star. It's a marriage.
GRIFFIN: Do you feel the paps outed Lance Bass?
BUHL: The paps don't out anybody. The tabloids might and the media that's writing the story. But the paparazzi takes the picture.
GRIFFIN: Which is first, the picture or the story?
BUHL: The picture maybe.
HASAN: The story if you're looking for big money. You follow the story. Obviously you take a photograph following the story. That's where the money is. As an example, Miley Cyrus, you can take pictures of her, no problem. Let's say like when the "Vanity Fair" article came out, networks were calling, magazines were calling, we want Miley 24/7. They were telling me forget Britney, we want Miley. There you go.
GRIFFIN: All right. Anyway, when we come back, have you ever seen these kid paparazzi? I'm not even sure they've hit puberty. We're going to learn all about them after the break.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KING, HOST, "LARRY KING LIVE": Why you?
PARIS HILTON, ACTRESS: I have no idea. I'm just living my life.
KING: You don't call them up and say, I'm going down to Third Street tomorrow, be there?
HILTON: No, actually from the moment I wake up until I go to sleep, they're outside my house following me all day long.
KING: You have now become used to the fact that you have no privacy?
HILTON: Yes, I think it definitely comes with the territory.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: You're back with Kathy Griffin, acting as LARRY KING LIVE tonight. This is a good one. We've got two paparazzi and their teens. They're kind of like the two Coreys of photographers. It's Blaine and Austin, or Blaustin, as I like to call them. How old are you?
AUSTIN VISSCHEDYK, PAPARAZZO: Fifteen.
GRIFFIN: And you?
BLAINE HEWISON, PAPARAZZO: Fourteen, turning 16. Just kidding, I'm 16.
GRIFFIN: Easy here, Joe. Now, I've seen you out on the streets. Not when I was hustling, but when I was leaving a nice restaurant. Where was I?
VISSCHEDYK: You were at a club.
GRIFFIN: How could you know the name and I don't even know the name. I go to a club once every three years. How did you get this job to start with?
VISSCHEDYK: I've lived in Hollywood all my life. I used to -- I'd go to all the restaurants and I guess I just somehow came up with the idea that it would be fun to be a paparazzi.
GRIFFIN: There's no legal ramifications, no curfew?
VISSCHEDYK: Not if you're free lance?
GRIFFIN: You're not considered truant from school?
HEWISON: Nope. GRIFFIN: Let me guess, home schooled?
GRIFFIN: Oh, crap. Are you literate?
HEWISON: A little. I'm just kidding.
GRIFFIN: What celebs do you actually think are friendly and like?
HEWISON: All of them have been friendly and nice.
GRIFFIN: You just lost all your credibility. I'm a pain in the butt, I know. Has anyone really given you trouble, besides me?
HEWISON: Adam Sandler.
VISSCHEDYK: Adam Sandler?
VISSCHEDYK: Erykah Badu.
GRIFFIN: She got the big turban.
VISSCHEDYK: She stole my camera.
GRIFFIN: And did what with it?
VISSCHEDYK: Erased all my pictures. Said if I ever take a picture of her again, she'd kick my ass. Not cool.
GRIFFIN: Wow. What, are you going to throw down with Badu? That would be bad? Who haven't you got that you want to get?
HEWISON: Angelina Jolie.
VISSCHEDYK: Angelina Jolie.
GRIFFIN: Easy. Easy. How about an original thought here? That's it? Everybody says that.
VISSCHEDYK: I've already gotten everybody else.
GRIFFIN: What about Pamela Anderson? What's a good Pamela Anderson shot?
VISSCHEDYK: I'm not going to answer that.
GRIFFIN: Her and Tommy?
VISSCHEDYK: You've got to get like her and Adnan or something.
GRIFFIN: I've been with Adnan.
VISSCHEDYK: I've heard you before.
GRIFFIN: How much do you guys make? Can you at least tell me that?
HEWISON: A couple bucks.
GRIFFIN: What do you mean no?
VISSCHEDYK: It's a couple dollars here and there. Enough to buy --
GRIFFIN: Do you work for agencies?
VISSCHEDYK: Freelance. We make money.
GRIFFIN: All right. You don't even work together?
HEWISON: We shoot together.
VISSCHEDYK: Yes, we shoot together, but we don't sell --
GRIFFIN: How does that work, 50/50?
VISSCHEDYK: No. Whoever gets a best shot.
HEWISON: It's a competition between us both.
GRIFFIN: Where would you normally be if you weren't here, staked outside where?
GRIFFIN: People's homes?
HEWISON: That's where I would be.
VISSCHEDYK: I don't do that. That's not cool.
GRIFFIN: You don't go to people's homes?
VISSCHEDYK: I did in the beginning. And then I got a close personal relationship with a couple people.
VISSCHEDYK: People like to control their own --
GRIFFIN: Allie Lohan?
GRIFFIN: Does anybody have a deal with you?
VISSCHEDYK: Yes. GRIFFIN: Oh, my good. We're blowing the lid off this thing. I thought people just wanted to act and be in movies. They just want to be photographed in their underwear outside (INAUDIBLE)?
HEWISON: Most of them do.
GRIFFIN: Most of them do? Like who, name names.
HEWISON: Wow, our relationship is --
VISSCHEDYK: Out the window.
GRIFFIN: What do you care, you're 11.
GRIFFIN: OK wow. Would you want to do this as a career forever?
HEWISON: I'll let it take me as far as it needs to take me.
GRIFFIN: Did you just eat?
HEWISON: A little bit, yes.
GRIFFIN: Over at STK?
VISSCHEDYK: I like the food there.
GRIFFIN: What do you mean, so you take a picture and then go get a piece of steak?
GRIFFIN: What's the best shot you ever took, most profitable shot?
VISSCHEDYK: Exclusive Britney Spears.
GRIFFIN: Where? What was she doing? Was she doing anything in that?
VISSCHEDYK: She was just walking. At that time, it was like 50 people on Britney and I got her.
GRIFFIN: Most profitable picture?
HEWISON: Britney Spears flipping me off.
GRIFFIN: And you didn't take it personally, I hope?
HEWISON: No, no.
VISSCHEDYK: He asked her to do it.
GRIFFIN: Do you feel like you kind of know her? Because you actually spend a lot of time with her?
VISSCHEDYK: I don't see her a lot. It gets --
GRIFFIN: It's creepy?
VISSCHEDYK: No, it's not creepy. Up there, it gets a little rough.
GRIFFIN: Meaning too many paparazzis?
VISSCHEDYK: With her, yes.
GRIFFIN: Do you feel like you know kind of what she's like, one of her personalities?
HEWISON: I think she's really sweet.
VISSCHEDYK: I think he's a great mother. Wait, wait, wait.
GRIFFIN: I really can't top that.
VISSCHEDYK: One thing -- what -- is she -- if she really wanted to do the job, I think she should have moved.
GRIFFIN: Out of the Summit?
VISSCHEDYK: Out of Los Angeles.
GRIFFIN: Where do you want to relocate?
VISSCHEDYK: No, like Antarctica.
GRIFFIN: Let me guess, there's where you're from.
HEWISON: No, I'm from Boise, Idaho. Kidding.
GRIFFIN: We have one more segment left. This may be the best one yet. I don't know how we top this one. I really do. More sensational celebrity photos and video when we return.
GRIFFIN: Hi, it's me, Kathy Griffin. Now let's check in again with Jason Kennedy and see who he has at STK.
Jason, who you got?
KENNEDY: Well, it's just me right now, so don't get too excited. We do know David Spade is still celebrating his birthday inside of STK. More paparazzi, probably 10 to 12, and I've been bantering back and forth with them. Listen, young Hollywood is still probably sleeping right now. This place doesn't get booming probably until about 10:00 or 11:00 at Coco de Ville, which is still attached here. I did find out, Kathy -- oh, we're going to get 50 percent off? Steaks on me tonight. You and me, Kathy. Are you in?
GRIFFIN: I'm still sleeping. I'm like young Hollywood. The Vicodin is just kicking in. So I won't go out for hours. David Spade is in there. Hookers?
KENNEDY: I have not seen any. I cannot comment on that at this point in time. I've only seen young men and women going inside. That's all I can say.
GRIFFIN: Gay hookers, interesting, edgy. Who do these paparazzi want to see, a Reese and a Jake (INAUDIBLE)?
KENNEDY: Reese and Jake is huge right now. The names change on a daily basis.
Well, I would really expect someone like Reese and Jake to come here, because they have not publicly come out as a couple. They go to like San Francisco and Montana. And it's the paparazzi that travel with them, not with them per se -- but how do I put this?
GRIFFIN: Follow them? Torment them?
KENNEDY: They go very close to them. I'll let you say it. That would be a big shot, Reese and Jake. Jack Efron's big now with Vanessa Hudgens. Matthew McConaughey with his girlfriend.
GRIFFIN: Would Vanessa Hudgens be nude?
KENNEDY: Most likely she could be clothed for a scene like this.
GRIFFIN: That's not the deal that Mark Geragos was brokering, or at least working on. Now, what about if Chase Crawford was going to come out with -- who's that guy that he's usually seen with, that they think might be lovers, allegedly?
KENNEDY: Oh, J.C. Chasez? That's his friend, best friend, Kathy. We can't start these rumors again. Ed Westwick (ph), J.C. Chasez, they're all best friends.
KENNEDY: It's just guy's night out. But we have not seen them.
GRIFFIN: What do we make of this John Mayer/Jennifer Aniston pairing, do they want to be outed? Sometimes, they're shot with a long lens, which I think is wrong, and then sometimes they're holding hands at a cotella (ph). KENNEDY: Jennifer Aniston, she's normally very reserved. And then you got someone like John Mayer, who usually plays with the paparazzi. He's got banter with them. Ever since they started dating, his whole demeanor has changed. He's not as friendly to the paparazzi. It's been interesting to see how that's changed.
GRIFFIN: Does this mean sleeping together for photographs?
KENNEDY: I don't know about that. I don't think I could comment.
GRIFFIN: I don't either. I would never imply that. What do you think Paris is doing right now? Is he putting in her extensions? Is she going to go to several different places?
KENNEDY: She likes to hop around town. Ask someone else who has a great relationship with Paris Hilton. You guys love Paris Hilton, right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Paris. What up, girl. What up, Paris?
KENNEDY: They get along with Paris Hilton. Some of the other celebrities that come to STK, they really don't like to have their picture taken. But Paris is the exception.
GRIFFIN: Ask them what celebrity would probably give them a hard time.
KENNEDY: What celebrity would give you guys a hard time?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seal.
KENNEDY: Seal is very protective of Heidi Klum, especially their kids.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He don't like paparazzi. He's a nice guy.
KENNEDY: There you have it, from the paparazzi themselves.
GRIFFIN: What would be --
KENNEDY: You know what's been crazy, though?
KENNEDY: I actually saw -- normally, I'm like everybody else, I get to see it from the outside looking in, but I spent time with Britney Spears during a very interesting month for in November, when she was going through a lot of things.
GRIFFIN: Jason, you buried the lead. What is that like?
KENNEDY: I did what?
GRIFFIN: You buried the lead. What do you mean you spent a month with Britney Spears during a difficult time. Start talking, honey.
KENNEDY: Here's the thing, I spent time with her during a difficult month. It was Halloween Night. We had some mutual friends. We were in a big Escalade together. And literally a green light on Melrose Avenue, there was 40 paparazzi around us. Just people off the streets started to gather and us. And we couldn't even go forward. I grabbed my camera and just started shooting.
GRIFFIN: While you were sleeping with her?
KENNEDY: That's when people start worrying. Pardon me? I didn't catch that.
GRIFFIN: Nothing, I was just going to wrap up the show. You've done a fantastic job, Jason. I appreciate you.
KENNEDY: Thank you.
GRIFFIN: Thank you for everything. Now don't forget to check out Larry's Web site, CNN.com/LarryKing and don't forget to nominate me for another Emmy. I'm already nominated. Vote for me for hosting this, that's a given. That should be a whole special category, maybe a lifetime achievement.
Anyway, thanks to Larry for letting me fill in. I really, really appreciate it. Eat your heart out, Oprah. Yes.
Larry will return on Monday.
"Anderson Cooper 360" starts right now.