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Nancy Grace
Anthony Family Members Served With Subpoenas
Aired August 29, 2008 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, GUEST HOST: Breaking news tonight. More major bombshells as disturbing forensic evidence comes back in the case that has all of America riveted, the disappearance of that beautiful 3-year-old Florida girl named Caylee. She was last seen with her mother, Casey. Little Caylee has been missing for 10 long weeks.
Fast-breaking developments tonight, word coming in right now that a huge development in this case might happen during our show tonight. Meantime, there is mounting evidence that 3-year-old Caylee is likely dead. In the last hours, grandmother, Cindy, grandfather, George, and a neighbor are all served with subpoenas to appear as witnesses should there be a trial. This on the heels of disturbing reports from CNN affiliate WKMG that hair found in Casey Anthony`s car trunk appears to be little Caylee`s and appears to show signs of human decomposition. If proven to be 100 percent accurate, that stunning bombshell backs up air sample evidence that shows human decay, and cadaver dogs that hit on Casey Anthony`s car.
It`s a case that gets more bizarre by the minute. That bounty hunter who told us last night on this show that Casey Anthony`s bail would be revoked tonight says Casey Anthony will stay free, at least for now. We will grill him about his change of heart. Defense attorney Jose Baez says security issues have been worked out after that bounty hunter complained about death threats and protests.
But the big question tonight, will Casey Anthony take that limited immunity deal? The clock is ticking. She only has until Tuesday at 9:00 AM to tell investigators how to help locate her little girl. Tonight, there is still no sign of 3-year-old Caylee Anthony. Where, oh, where is this innocent little child?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey Anthony is now not going back to jail. The bounty hunter who helped bail Casey Anthony out of jail has changed his mind. First Leonard Padilla said he wanted to revoke her $500,000 bail, put her back behind bars. Says he won`t.
LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER: We went to the attorney`s office, and he says, What can I do to prevent her going back to jail right now on a bail revocation? I said, Well, there`s about a half a dozen security and safety situations. So he read the list, and he said that he could comply with them and get it done immediately. And I said, Well, if you do that, she don`t go back to jail tomorrow.
CINDY ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: She`s not dead. No one`s found her yet.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With new evidence confirming traces of human decomposition in Casey Anthony`s car, some people, like bounty hunter Leonard Padilla, are finding this impossible to believe.
GEORGE ANTHONY, GRANDFATHER OF MISSING TODDLER: The person who was in the back of my granddaughter`s (SIC) car was not my granddaughter!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Good evening. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. And remember, Nancy Grace back live on Monday, and she will have all the latest breaking developments in this case. But right now, more bombshells in the desperate search for 3-year-old Florida girl Caylee Anthony.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey Anthony now not going back to jail. The bounty hunter who was going to revoke her bond basically pulled a 180 today, changed his mind, was going to put her back in jail, now not so.
PADILLA: I will put her back in jail.
Being out of jail is the big thing.
You can take her back to jail.
She said if she got out, she wanted to go find her daughter.
Not a word, not a word.
She`s sitting there at home. She hasn`t uttered one word and she says (INAUDIBLE)
She didn`t say a word to me. She didn`t say a word to her mother or her dad.
I believe the baby is alive.
The little girl is deceased.
I believe she passed it off to one of her friends.
I don`t believe that somebody else put a body in the car.
And I`m still hoping that the little girl is alive.
I don`t think she`s alive anymore, no.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you still estimate it will take you a week to get her back?
PADILLA: A week from today.
The little girl is deceased.
I don`t think the little baby`s dead.
I`ve changed my mind 180 degrees.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Padilla has agreed not to surrender the bond. He`s going to stick to his word that he gave to me. I do believe...
PADILLA: I never gave you a word that I broke.
Bail can be pulled any time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He never broke his word because she`s still out.
PADILLA: I came out here thinking the little girl was alive, and I`ve gotten a hell of an education.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You sure have. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. So many developments flooding in -- subpoenas handed down, fights breaking out in front of the Anthony home, protests reportedly being planned. And there`s the bombshell DNA evidence that points to human decomposition.
For the very latest, let`s go straight out to Mark Williams, news director WNDB Newstalk 1150. Mark, you`re tracking this case very closely. What is the very latest?
MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Jane, hour by hour, everything seems to change in this. But the big thing, of course, this morning -- - that happened this morning was Casey Anthony is not going back to jail any time soon. The bounty hunter, Leonard Padilla, and Casey`s attorney, the - - Jose Baez, met this morning, Mr. Padilla, of course, escorting Casey Anthony to the attorney`s office. They spoke a little bit. They came out just before noontime, and it looked like it was a love fest out there due to the fact that they both held an impromptu news conference shortly before 12:00 noon.
Now, if that`s not enough to whet your appetite, George Anthony blew his stack today at two gentlemen from nearby Castleberry (ph) who decided to set up on his front lawn. And it`s just a little piece of ground between the sidewalk and the street. Saw the videotape a short time ago. George comes out and says, You`re on my property, and gets a little angry with these folks -- as a matter of fact, not a little angry, a lot angry -- and starts tossing their equipment that they had set up, basically, out to the street. A gentleman, his neighbor, came over, calmed him down, and he went on about his way.
And I`ll tell you, hour by hour, I mean, this is -- this is the biggest soap opera I`ve ever taken part in.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It certainly looks like that. And the kettle is boiling more and more with every passing moment. Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE producer, you are outside that very home, the Orlando, Florida, home of the Anthonys. I understand there are protests going on and there is a flurry of activity. Bring us up to date.
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s right, Jane. A protest did start not too long before we went to air. Cindy Anthony did exchange words. You can actually see some of the protesters behind me here, holding up signs saying that Casey is a murderer. They think that Casey should go back to jail. They also wrote on the back of cars, indicating that they think that Casey murdered her daughter and that she should go back to jail.
Now, Cindy Anthony did exchange some words from one of the protesters. Her name was Kitty (ph). And she said she`s very upset. Cindy Anthony made a comment a few days ago about the media being parasites and feeding on this story. However, Kitty took this personally, thinking that this was something against her, and she says they have done nothing but try to support this family and try to pray for them. However, they feel at this point, they can`t support them because they don`t believe that Casey is telling the truth and that her daughter is, in fact, dead.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, this woman, Kitty or whatever her name is, is she a member of the media that she should take offense to something Cindy said about the media?
LANCE: No, she`s not a member of the media. She is a concerned citizen. And most of these people who are out here are not people who live in this neighborhood, but they live all over the Orlando area, who have come in. They met, apparently, on some type of blog site, got together and wanted to voice their concerns about this case.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you kidding me? I mean, who are these people? Get a life! I can understand if you`re going to go out there and search for the little girl. That`s one thing. I applaud you. I say go ahead. But to stand out there and protest in front of this family -- please let me remind you that Cindy Anthony is a grandmother who does not have her precious little granddaughter at this time. Ditto for George. He`s the grandfather. And the brother of Casey, Lee, is an uncle missing his niece. I mean, where is the compassion for these people who are in this pressure cooker, and understandably, I think, are flipping out at this moment?
And of course, we do have to remember at this moment that Casey is not charged with murder. She`s only charged with child neglect and she is also charged with lying to investigators. And she has pleaded innocent. But I just can`t get over this whole notion.
Mark Williams, I want to go back to you because you`ve been covering this. You`ve been on this story from the very beginning -- that these people feel the need to go to the home of these people -- and they`re not reporters who are on the clock working, they`re not investigators who are trying to find this child, they are simply kind of looky-lous and people who feel that they`ve got to give their opinion on this.
WILLIAMS: Yes, these people remind me of people that show up after floods or huge fires. They just want to gawk. They just want to be part of the action. This protest tonight, from what we understand, was organized through one of those social networking pages. It sounds like it`s a Craigslist sort of deal. And apparently, it originated just south of here in our neighboring county, in Osceola County, and it started from there with people looking for rides to go up to the Anthony family household tonight. You know, it just boggles my mind that people would even do this. And boy, you hit it on the head.
The sheriff`s department still believing that they have a missing person in Caylee Anthony, and Casey is innocent until proven guilty. I mean, she has just the two charges. No murder charges have been brought against her, despite the fact that tests have come back indicating that there`s been a decomposing body in the trunk of her car.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, it certainly looks bad for little Caylee, but that should be a cause for grief, not a cause for rage. These remind me of the people who, you know, sit next to the guillotine, saying, The guillotine, the guillotine! I mean, it`s just -- it`s just -- psychologically, it just -- it blows my mind.
And you know, the man who some say is responsible for all of this -- and I`ll give him a chance to defend himself, maybe he is, maybe he isn`t - - is here with us tonight, the very brave Leonard Padilla -- because we have been really grilling you every single night. You`re the bounty hunter who helped get Casey Anthony out of jail.
Last night on our show, you said you were going to send her back to jail on Saturday. Then we all went to sleep and we woke up this morning and it`s a totally different story. In fact, we have a collage of your contradictions we want to play for you right now before you respond.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PADILLA: I`m going to put her back in jail.
Getting out of jail is the big thing.
You can take her back to jail.
She said if she got out, she wanted to go find her daughter.
Not a word, not a word.
She`s sitting there at home.
She hasn`t uttered one word.
And she says, Hey, here`s who has the baby.
She didn`t say a word to me. She didn`t say a word to her mother or her dad.
I believe the baby`s alive.
The little girl is deceased.
I believe she passed it off to one of her friends.
I don`t believe that somebody else put a body in the car.
I`m still hoping that the little girl is alive.
I don`t think she`s alive anymore, no.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you still estimate it will take you a week to get her back?
PADILLA: A week from today.
The little girl is deceased.
I don`t think the little baby`s dead.
I`ve changed my mind 180 degrees.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Padilla has agreed not to surrender the bond. He`s going to stick to his word that he gave to me.
PADILLA: I never gave you a word that I broke.
Bail can be pulled any time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He never broke his word because she`s still out.
PADILLA: I came out here thinking the little girl was alive, and I`ve gotten a hell of an education.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: This is a very tragic case, but you are providing some comic relief, Leonard Padilla. What is going on with you?
PADILLA: Practicing to run for president with all the flip-flops. Is that what you want to hear?
(LAUGHTER)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I want to know why you told us last night that she was going back to jail on Saturday, and this morning we wake up and we hear, Uh-huh.
PADILLA: Well, when I went to the lawyer`s office with the other fellows to deliver her, as a routine every day, he asked me into his office and he says, Why are you surrendering her? And I told her (SIC), I says, The safety situation out there and the security problems that we`re having is unbearable, and I don`t want her to get hurt. I don`t want her parents to get hurt. The threats are just inundating us since the air samples from Tennessee and the DNA came in, and it`s just going to erupt. And by Monday, it`s going to be worse than that.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know...
PADILLA: He assured me that our concerns would be addressed and that he would take care of it and that everything would be corrected.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, it doesn`t really make sense. How is the attorney for Casey Anthony going to have control over protests out on a public sidewalk? And are you contributing to the problem by talking constantly about how you`re afraid of these protests, basically, almost like issuing an invitation to people, Hey, come on down and protest?
PADILLA: No, they were on -- as Mark stated, they started out on some of these lists that promote these kind of things. And then the one tonight, as he said, didn`t even start here locally. It started out of county. We started noticing it two days ago, building. The first day that the Tennessee results came out, it started building momentum. And then the one that`s coming up Monday is even bigger. And boy, we didn`t say anything publicly about what our concerns were.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Leonard, are you having any kind of competitive competition with Tim Miller of Equusearch, who is down there? Because I heard you were concerned about whether you were going to have control over who was coming in and out of the house.
PADILLA: We were concerned about people that were driving up to the house, and we didn`t know who they were. And originally, there was some kind of an arrangement where -- in other words, if somebody was coming, we would be -- you know, we would be told. We`ve checked pizzas. We`ve checked gift deliveries and things of that nature that -- the pizzas were not ordered by the family.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, well, let`s forget about the pizzas. I wanted to know why you said she was going to jail on Saturday and now you`re, like, Never mind.
PADILLA: At that time, she was going to jail. What, I can`t change my mind? Only women can do that?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You can change your mind once or twice, but as you saw with that...
PADILLA: Once. I changed my mind once.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. OK. Well, we have video evidence to the contrary of that.
PADILLA: On her going to jail, I changed my mind once.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Now let me bring in Tim Miller, who is the head of Texas Equusearch, who says he is going to be searching for little Caylee. He, of course, very famous. This is the man who organized searches for Natalee Holloway when that young lady disappeared in Aruba.
Thank you for joining us tonight, Tim.
TIM MILLER, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: Thank you.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I understand that you have actually spent hours with the family, which is why I asked Leonard, since they haven`t been talking to Leonard, whet her he was maybe a little jealous of the fact that you`ve gotten the access you`ve gotten. Give us a sense of what`s going on inside the home. And we see what`s going on outside. It`s chaos out there. But inside the home, are they crying? Are they calm? What is the mood?
MILLER: You know what? I think everybody is basically in shock. We spent a lot of time with Cindy. We haven`t asked any questions about the search. We just let them know that what we`re going to be doing is going to be very difficult for them. You know, we`re still holding onto that hope that there`s going to be a miracle out there. We`ve seen many, many miracles after 900-plus searches and many of them came back safely that we gave up on. We have to remember Elizabeth Smart. That was a miracle.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But don`t you...
MILLER: And we also...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Don`t you generally, as a rule, search for deceased bodies? Is that your track record?
MILLER: No. You know what? We have returned nearly 300 people home alive. Many would have been dead. I`ve actually myself handed three different children back to their parents that were Amber Alerts. So you know what? We`re going to start this search. We`re going to eliminate areas. And if something has happened to Caylee, you know, it`s very, very important that she be found. You know, we have recovered the remains of 84 people, and many of them would have never been recovered. So...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I understand the you`re going to be using drones and aerial. You`re going to go from the air and look down at these large swathes -- large areas of land and take still photos of them and try to create grids where then you can see if there is any kind of a body or any kind of a living person in those areas.
MILLER: Well, you`re correct. I mean, we`re going to be using horses and four-wheelers and ground searches. We`ve got two different areas. We`re going to use a boat with sidescan sonar. We`ve had tremendous amount of success with that drone airplane. We`ve actually recovered the remains of five people. And I guarantee you, three of them would not have been recovered.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right...
MILLER: And you know what? We`ve got a lot of resources and -- but we`re just hoping that...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And I understand about 25 people. You`ve got a whole big team coming in. So hang in right there. We`re going to get back to you in a second.
We have a reminder that on Monday, Nancy Grace herself back live and she`s going to bring you all the fast-breaking developments in the search for 3-year-old Caylee Anthony. We`re going to be right back with more on this case. We`ve got so many experts for you. Stay right there. Fast- breaking developments.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is unconscionable that they`ve taken her out and they`re going to put her back in because now they think maybe she`s guilty. That`s not what bail bondsmen do. You`re there to take people out, take the money, and if they say that they`re going to skip or not show up in court, then you revoke the bond, but not just because you change your mind about their guilt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She said there was absolutely no odor in the car when it was towed on June 30, and possibly maybe a body was placed in the car after that. She said that she even went down to the tow yard and spoke to the gentleman who gave the statement to the police, who said there was this odor, and he said that that smell did not start until a week after it had been at the tow yard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. Remember, Nancy Grace back live on Monday, and she will have all the latest breaking developments in this case, which seems to be veering toward a climax.
Case in point, subpoenas were handed down today to Cindy Anthony, George Anthony, the grandparents of the missing child, and Lee Anthony, the uncle of the missing child, and also to a neighbor who lent Casey Anthony, the little girl`s mother, a shovel.
Let`s bring in the defense attorneys. What do you make of these subpoenas? Let`s start with Alan Ripka and then go to Eric Chase.
ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I think the subpoenas are really important. Obviously, at this point, the district attorney and the police officers believe that they`re going to be able to gain some information from what they get from those subpoenas. So that`s a big step, at this point.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Eric?
ERIC CHASE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, the subpoenas are a preventive measure. You issue these subpoenas at the beginning of a case to make sure you`re going to have your witnesses available. That doesn`t mean you actually think they`re going to give you anything. You have them there just in case.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think it`s bigger than that because of the shovel. They don`t need a shovel for a child neglect case. But if they subpoena the neighbor who lent Casey the shovel, I think that says something more. Ponder that, gentlemen, and we`ll talk about it.
As we go to break, remember, Nancy Grace back live on Monday, and she will have all the latest breaking developments in this case. And we`re going to be right back with more. We`ve got so much DNA evidence and circumstantial evidence to discuss in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hammering "No trespassing" signs on to her lawn, Cindy Anthony angrily denounced what she`s calling rumors.
CINDY ANTHONY: She`s not dead. No one`s found her yet.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But with new evidence confirming traces of human decomposition in Casey Anthony`s car, some people are finding this impossible to believe. The Orange County sheriff`s office would not confirm whether or not test results have come back, but adds...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We continue to look for Caylee every day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK. Some flurry of activity outside the Orlando Anthony home. Natisha, what is going on out there?
LANCE: Well, two cop cars just showed up -- four cop cars actually just showed up. They are moving the protesters back. I`m not sure if you can see behind me, Jane. There`s also an unmarked police car that is driving up to the home right now. And there`s two detectives. Detective John Allen (ph), who is the lead investigator on this case, is going up to the door. There is also a car that just went onto the lawn of the home, and there are several other police cars have gone to the home, as well. John Allen going up to the front door. And there is absolute chaos going on out here, Jane.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: This is breaking news that you are watching as it`s coming in, a chaotic scene outside the home of George and Cindy Anthony. A bunch of people took it into their heads to protest outside the home of this family that has been going through hell.
And of course, Casey Anthony, the center of the storm, inside the house being monitored with an ankle bracelet. I don`t know if she`s peeking out the window to watch any of this, but this is pretty extraordinary. This is the kind of thing you usually see with a celebrity like Britney Spears. But you don`t see it when there`s a family in shock and grief waiting to find out what happened to their little granddaughter. It`s an obscenity. Breaking news, knuckleheads protesting.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, GUEST HOST: Jane Velez-Mitchell in for Nancy Grace.
Astounding breaking news outside the Orlando, Florida home of George and Cindy Anthony. Inside, Casey Anthony, at least four cop cars, as well as an unmarked car, showing up moments ago. The big question is why are they there? Are they there because there`s a protest going on or are they there for some other reason?
Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE`s producer, outside taking in this extraordinary scene. Are they going into the home as if they`re going in to talk to the Anthony family?
Natisha, can you hear me? Well, I can tell you what I`m seeing right now is the front door appears to be open. It looks like you`re looking at Casey in there -- possibility of Casey in there, as you see somebody behind the door and, obviously, there look like officials as well.
The door closes. We don`t know why they`re there. Of course, the obvious question that`s on everybody`s mind.
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: I`m ready.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: . are they there to make an arrest? Possibly.
We don`t want to jump to any conclusions. There`s a protest going on outside. At first, the first moments we thought maybe they`re there because the protesters are getting out of hand and going on private property.
Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE producer, where did the officers go?
LANCE: Jane, there are -- the lead investigator, John Allen, is inside the home right now with two other detectives who have been working on the case. There are six unmarked police cars, two of them which are parked on the lawn of the Anthony home, which I`m sure you can probably right now.
The protesters are blocking our view a little bit.
There is also a police officer who is standing in front of the protesters making sure that nobody goes past him. Now we don`t know what`s going on at this point, however, police cars, marked and unmarked, have blocked the way for anybody to get past the front of the Anthonys driveway aside from those who were already in front of it,
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Natisha, people are coming in and out.
LANCE: Now investigators -- now investigators are coming out of the Anthony home.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m seeing what appears to be Casey in there. Is that Casey? Or is that.
LANCE: It is Casey. I can see barely, but it is Casey. I can see through the front door window. There are two investigators who are in front of her. And like I said before, the lead investigator on this case, Detective John Allen, is inside as well.
He is in this blue shirt standing closest to the door with the glasses. I`m not sure if you can see him from here or not.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I just saw Cindy as well. I saw Cindy Anthony. She is, obviously, involved in whatever conversation is going on between the authorities, the lead investigator, who appears to be opening the door right there and Casey and Cindy, all huddled in conversation.
LANCE: Casey Anthony is now exiting the home. Protesters outside here are cheering. We don`t know where she is going, but she is being led away with -- in what seems to be handcuffs.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Repeat. Is it Casey?
LANCE: Yes, it is Casey.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Casey being led away.
LANCE: She just got into one of the unmarked police cars.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK. Casey is being led out of the home.
As you stay on this picture, let`s go to the defense attorney, Alan Ripka. As you see this, what do you think -- and again, we don`t have the information. But what are the possibilities? Is she being arrested? Did she agree to the limited immunity deal, which is up on Tuesday morning?
What do you think?
ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I think that if she`s being led away in handcuffs, chances are that the information that the police officers and district attorney`s office found from either the DNA or the air has led them to bring her back in.
If she`s not in handcuffs, then she`s coming of her own free will with her attorney, chances are she`s agreed to the immunity deal and they`re going to get together and talk about it.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Natisha, let`s confirm. Was she handcuffed or not as she was led out of the house?
LANCE: I`m trying to confirm that right now, Jane. I cannot see far enough to see if she was handcuffed or not. But what I can tell you is that protesters out here are cheering and she was led out by the lead investigator, Detective John Allen, along with two other investigators.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you see Cindy.
LANCE: She is now in that car and they are in the car and they are leaving the home.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you see Cindy Anthony right there in front of her home talking on a cell phone. But she seems relatively composed. She is not visibly distraught.
So, again, going back to Alan Ripka, defense attorney, as you see these cars pull away, in your experience as an attorney, would there be that many cars to take her away if it were not something significant?
RIPKA: No, actually there would not be that many cars. And I`ll tell you something else, Jane. If this was planned, her attorney would have been in the house and they would have been together and they would have left together if they were going to go talk about this deal voluntarily.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: So what does that tell you, then, Alan?
RIPKA: It tells me that these officers, based upon this situation, and no attorney and potentially handcuffs, that they have new information or information that they think they could charge her with something new other than the child neglect and the obstruction.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: So you`re saying that it`s possible -- and I certainly don`t want to jump the gun. Again, this young woman has pleaded not guilty to child neglect and lying to investigators. She deserves the presumption of innocence.
But we`re talking about the possibility here that she might have been arrested for more serious charges, which could include, obviously, if they found her daughter`s body murdered.
RIPKA: Well, absolutely. Absolutely, Jane. You don`t go and take someone away after they just made bail and bring them back to the police station under the context of what was going on earlier, which was the potential deal of immunity and she had all weekend to think about it.
Obviously, they planned on Tuesday being the deadline so her and her attorney can discuss it and think about it. But, obviously, that`s been obviated by this complete action right now.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Do you think if they found something more, they were like forget about -- as Nancy Grace suggested, forget about the limited immunity deal, we`re just going to come in and take you.
RIPKA: Well, there`s no doubt that if they -- the reason they offered the immunity deal originally was because they didn`t have enough and they were reaching for straws hoping they can get some clues.
At this particular time, if they have more evidence that they think they can win in court, they`re dragging her in and that`s the end of the immunity deal.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE producer, doing a stellar job trying to make sense of the madness outside the Orlando, Florida Anthony home, what have you seen and heard since we last checked in with you moments ago?
LANCE: I do have confirmation that she did leave the home in handcuffs with the two lead detectives, Tim Miller, who has been on the show with us, also said that he will be talking to the lead detectives very shortly.
They`re supposed to be giving him a phone call. But at this point, all of the police cars have cleared out. The protesters are overjoyed. And Cindy Anthony did go back into the home.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Casey Anthony left in handcuffs, Natisha? That is correct. All right.
Let`s go -- Andrew Scott, former chief of police, Boca Raton, Florida. You are a former police chief. You have watched this situation unfold. Give us your analysis. And, again, we don`t want to go into dangerous speculation that is unfair.
But we want to give our viewers a sense of what`s possibly happening to Casey Anthony tonight in this case that all of America is riveted on.
ANDREW SCOTT, FORMER CHIEF OF POLICE, BOCA RATON, FLORIDA: If Casey was left out of the house in handcuffs and accompanied by the law enforcement officers, clearly she was under arrest. If she was voluntarily going to the police department with the officers to give a statement of sorts or to provide additional information and she was not handcuffed, obviously, that would be a voluntary aspect of her going to the police department.
The fact that she`s in handcuffs, obviously, new developments have come, new evidence has been brought to light, and she is under arrest. They would not handcuff her unless she was under arrest.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mark Williams, news director, WNDB Newstalk 1150, you`ve covered this from the beginning. This week has been filled with explosive developments. Air samples coming back showing a decomposing body in the trunk of the car, all sorts of other forensic evidence, hair that appears, the first test appeared to be Caylee`s and then, also, evidence that that hair showed signs of decomposition, although it`s not foolproof. It`s not 100 percent.
Do you think they have enough to charge her with something more serious, given what we know -- irrespective of did they find anything that we haven`t heard yet?
WILLIAMS: Well, let me put it to you this way. I`m surprised. Now I heard earlier tonight from a highly placed source that this was going to come down and that we could expect a bombshell coming any time during this show, which we all saw on the TV.
But the big thing is right now, I think they have enough circumstantial evidence to pick her up like they did just a couple of moments ago. They had the cadaver dogs hitting a couple of times both in the car, even in the backyard of the Anthony household.
They have the DNA and the sniff test which came back earlier this week. Again, as we talked about in past weeks, you know, people would ask where is the DNA test? I said, they`re trying to dot their I`s and cross their T`s which they`ve done.
They did it probably late this afternoon and they said let`s.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right.
WILLIAMS: Let`s go get them.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s an extraordinary event.
WILLIAMS: You bet.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And of course, so many other pieces of evidence, the circumstantial evidence, the habitual lies about where she left her daughter, a story completely that`s been completely discredited and the big fact we learned this week that she reportedly wanted to give her child up for adoption.
It appears the world is caving in on Casey Anthony tonight.
But happy news, a special happy birthday to Ann Lynch in Fayetteville, Georgia. There she is with Nancy and David`s daughter, little Lucy.
Happy birthday, Ann.
And remember, Nancy is back live Monday with all the latest breaking developments for Caylee Anthony. Monumental developments on this program. We`re going to bring you more in a second.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell in for Nancy Grace.
Extraordinary, breaking news happening on our air. Really, an extraordinary scene going on outside the Orlando, Florida, home of George and Cindy Anthony.
Just moments ago, approximately half a dozen cop cars -- some marked, some unmarked -- zoom up to the Anthony home in the middle of a protest. At first people wonder, well, was it happening to calm the protesters? Were they going on private property?
And then, no, they go right into the Anthony home. And the door is open. We see the lead investigator there. We see Casey Anthony, the mother of missing Caylee. We see Cindy Anthony, the grandmother of missing Caylee.
And then after a short discussion, you see the cops go on Casey Anthony and she is led out of that home into one of the squad cars. And those squad cars zip away.
And of course the implication is she`s under arrest. But the big question is for what? And I don`t think we should jump to conclusions just yet. We do not have a medical examiner saying that her missing child is dead, although the information coming in, the forensics coming in, are certainly quite ominous.
All of them point to the likelihood that Caylee Anthony is deceased. The air samples, of course, that show in the trunk of the car that Casey was driving -- there was signs of human decomposition. The hair sample that came back saying it was likely Caylee`s hair and it showed signs of decay.
Mark Williams, news director, WNDB Newstalk 1150, however, it doesn`t mean that they`re charging her necessarily with the big "M." It could be any other number of things -- obstructing justice, allegedly -- or anything else that she might have done in the course of the last 10 weeks where she -- her daughter was missing.
WILLIAMS: There`s just a whole litany of things they can go back on. One of the things that -- who went into the house was Uri Melich. She was the lead detective in the case as, obviously, well as John Allen, who`s a -- who`s one of the big guys downtown as we call it.
Also, when she was taken from the house, she was wearing her Caylee Anthony t-shirt. So isn`t that ironic that they put her in cuffs, put her in the back of a Ford Crown Victoria, and she`s wearing the t-shirt saying "Where`s My Caylee?"
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE producer, doing a great job there on the scene, what were the emotions? Could you tell Casey Anthony - - was she stone-faced as usual? And what about Cindy Anthony?
LANCE: Casey was stone-faced as usual. There was no changed emotion. She didn`t look like she was sad. She didn`t look like she was angry. She just had a very straight face about her.
Cindy, the same way. As you have said earlier, Jane, she had a very calm composure. She was on the cell phone. She wasn`t crying. Didn`t see any crying. The only yelling or actual emotion that we saw was actually from the protesters out here.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, Shannon Fox, family therapist and Momlogic.com contributor, when you see an extraordinary scene like this -- there`s protests going on outside the house of these individuals trapped in this horrific vortex, and then you see the woman at the center of the storm walk out totally stone-faced, what did that tell you about her?
SHANNON FOX, FAMILY THERAPIST, MOMLOGIC.COM CONTRIBUTOR: Well, you know, Jane, if she`s guilty, then she must be -- she must have some sort of sense of shame or fear, but the fact that she`s so stone-faced really indicates she`s not in the same universe.
She is -- she`s experiencing some sort of a psychosis or a sociopath experience where she feels like she`s above the law. She doesn`t even seem afraid of what`s ahead of her.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know it`s so extraordinary to me that this ordinary family -- George was once a cop. Cindy, I believe, has a nursing background.
Mark Williams, here they are in the center of something they could never have imagined, all because they had a daughter who is out of control. The -- Cindy herself described here as a sociopath to a friend. Others have said she`s bipolar.
Put this in perspective for our viewers. You live down there.
WILLIAMS: Well, you know, I`m -- I`m not a psychologist or anything like that. But, you know, I think your last guest said, yes, she does live in her own universe, there`s no doubt about it.
She`s not showing any emotion over anything like the missing Caylee or anything like that. So it`s going to be interesting to see what transpires for the next few days.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, yes, we got more to come, that`s for sure.
As we go to break, a reminder, we`re broadcasting live Monday. Nancy will be back with the very latest developments of this investigation.
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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez Mitchell in for Nancy Grace.
Extraordinary breaking news just moments ago live op our air as a protest was underway at the Orlando home of the Anthonys. A fleet of squad cars pulls up, they go into the Anthony home and they cuffed Casey Anthony, the mother of the missing toddler, and they take her out.
They put her in a squad car and they zoom away in just about a half an hour from now. The sheriff`s department says they will hold a news conference to explain exactly why they arrested Casey.
The big question, of course, everybody wondering, does this mean that they found the little toddler, Caylee? We certainly cannot jump to that conclusion.
Natisha Lance, NANCY GRACE producer, outside the home, what is going on?
LANCE: Well, things have calmed down quite a bit, Jane, since the police came through. Right now we are actually just waiting for that sheriff`s press conference to start. As soon as we are off the air, I`m going to head over there and see what they are talking about with this re-arrest.
No one has come out of the home since they left in those cars, and things have been extremely quiet, so we`re just waiting to hear something at this point.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Anjali Swienton, president and CEO, SciLawForensics, obviously, the forensics this week have been extraordinary, pointing to the likelihood that little Caylee is no longer with us. What are those bullet points?
ANJALI SWIENTON, CEO, SCILAWFORENSICS, LTD.: I think we`ve got a bunch of things going on, Jane. There`s air from the trunk that the body farm reported, showed signs of -- of human decomposition. There was the hair evidence found in the trunk of the car that came back either Caylee`s or possibly Casey`s, but could be tied to the little girl.
There was some additional biological fluid in the car, which I don`t know if those -- if those tests have come back yet, but additional decomposition was suggested and then you`ve got the cadaver dogs that hit.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Suffice it to say, very bad news.
Well, we are out of time. It`s been an extraordinary evening. Nancy Grace, back here Monday. You know she`s going to have a lot of developments for you. So please join her Monday for the very latest on missing Caylee.
Thank you so much for joining us.
END
