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House Passes Bailout Bill, President Set to Sign; Taxpayers React to Bill Passing
Aired October 03, 2008 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Nancy Pelosi now sitting down at the table signing this bill, something she still says they have a long way to go, a lot of work to still do. She will sign it and then the president is expected to step up to the mikes and also possibly sign off on this historic piece of legislation before he takes off later afternoon on this Friday.
We are covering all angles. We have Brianna Keilar on Capitol Hill, we have Gerri Willis our financial editor there monitoring e- mails, telling us what it means for our pocketbooks. Also Christine Romans out of New York and also Kathleen Koch at the White House. We have about two minutes until the president is going to speak.
Brianna Keilar, let's go back to you on Cap Hill where this historic legislation was debated, whew, everybody is just kind of taking a breath. But still, you know, still very confused on really how good of a bill this is, and what happens next. Still, a lot of questions not quite sure what could happen.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, as we speak, I believe House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has signed this bill and then shortly it should be headed over to President Bush, but yes, broad support from Republicans and Democrats in passage of this bailout plan. In fact, 58 more voting for this bailout plan, the Senate passed bailout plan than the plan that they voted for on Monday that failed in the House. You just saw and it's still going on this press conference by Democrats.
I have to point out Republicans are not at this press conference. On Wednesday night when the Senate passed their bill, it was a bipartisan press conference. We saw Democrats and Republicans basically giving each other a pat on the back. We haven't seen that from Republicans, but of course, this was a very tough vote for Democrats and Republicans who are not on board with this, Kyra, some people feel it just won't work.
Some people who feel like the tax cut should be offset. Some people who disagree with some of the add-ons and say that it is pork. But yes at this point a lot of what you have heard from Democrats is just the beginning and Nancy Pelosi said she has an eye to the future. There are still a number of things that even people who voted yes on this bill, a number of things that they want, for instance we have heard from members of the Congressional Black Caucus. They want to see more things for individual homeowners who are facing foreclosure. They want to see bankruptcy judges be able to rewrite individual mortgage terms for individual homeowners. Of course that's not in this bill, that's something they're going to pursue separately and that's something here in the future we're going to be seeing a whole lot of hearings about how did this happen? How did we get to this point? How can we fix some of the problems -- Kyra?
PHILLIPS: Eye on the future and also Nancy Pelosi saying that Congress will shine a new light of scrutiny and accountability on the nation's financial system to try and prevent this again. The president of the United States.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: ... essential to helping America's economy weather the financial crisis. The Senate passed the same legislation on Wednesday night. When Congress sends me the final bill, I'm going to sign it into law. There were moments this week when some thought that the federal government could not rise to the challenge. Thanks to the hard work of members of both parties and both houses and the spirit of cooperation between Capitol Hill and my administration, we completed this bill in a timely manner. I am especially grateful for the contributions of Speaker Nancy Pelosi, minority leader John Boehner, majority leader Steny Hoyer, Minority Whip Roy Blunt, Chairman Barney Frank, ranking member Spencer Bachus.
By coming together on this legislation, we have acted boldly to help prevent the crisis on Wall Street from becoming a crisis in communities across our country. We have shown the world that the United States of America will stabilize our financial markets and maintain a leading role in the global economy. A major problem in our financial system is that banks have restricted the flow of credit to businesses and consumers and many of the assets these banks are holding have lost value.
The legislation Congress passed today addresses this problem head-on by providing a variety of new tools to the government such as allowing us to purchase some of the troubled assets and creating a new government insurance program that will guarantee the value of others. The bill also insures that these new programs are carried out in a way that protects taxpayers, prevents failed executives from receiving windfalls from taxpayers' dollars. It establishes a bipartisan board to oversee the plan's implementation.
Taken together, these steps represent decisive action to ease the credit crunch that is now threatening our economy. Smoother flow of credit, more businesses will be able to stock their shelves and meet their payrolls. More families will be able to get loans for cars and homes and college education. More state and local governments will be able to fund basic services. The bill includes other provisions to help American consumers and businesses.
It includes tax incentives for businesses to invest and create jobs. It temporarily expands federal insurance for bank and credit union deposits from $100,000 to $250,000. A vital safeguard for consumers and small businesses. It provides families with relief from the alternative minimum tax which would otherwise increase taxes for 26 million taxpayers by an average of $2,200. I know some Americans have concerns about this legislation. Especially about the government's role in the bill's cost. As a strong supporter of free enterprise I believe government intervention should occur only when necessary. In this situation, action is clearly necessary. Ultimately, the cost to taxpayers will be far less than the initial outlay.
You see the government will purchase troubled assets and once the market recovers, it is likely that many of the assets will go up in value. And over time Americans should expect that much if not all the tax dollars we invest will be paid back. Americans should also expect that it will take some time for this legislation to have its full impact on our economy. Exercising the authorities in this bill in a responsible way will require a careful analysis and deliberation. This will be done as expeditiously as possible, but it cannot be accomplished overnight. We will take the time necessary to design an effective program that achieves its objectives and does not waste taxpayers' dollars.
Our economy continues to face serious challenges. This morning we learned that America lost jobs again in September. Disappointing news that underscores the urgency of the bill that Congress passed today. It will take more time and determined effort to get through this difficult period, but with confidence and leadership and bipartisan cooperation, we'll overcome the challenges we face. Return our nation to a path of growth and job creation and long-term economic prosperity.
Thank you.
PHILLIPS: The president of the United States saying he will sign the historic legislation tonight. What time, we are not sure. We know he has to leave the White House about 3:15 Eastern Time, we want to welcome our international viewers if you are just tuning in. After a lot of negotiating, a lot of back and forth, a lot of major disappointment, the $700 billion bailout plan has now been signed and made it through the House, the Senate and now the president says he will sign off. There were the final numbers when the voting wrapped up not long ago.
Let's get to Kathleen Koch at the White House. We pretty much knew about a half an hour into the process that when we started to watch the debate on the House that it probably looked pretty good that it was going to pass, but still, a lot of questions remain, Kathleen, about the pitfalls that still exist as well.
KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Certainly. And Kyra, you heard the president right there and I think it was very telling at the end of his statement, he said, it will be some time before you feel the full impact of this measure. He said they are going to have to be careful and deliberate in coming up with the program. He said, it's not going to happen overnight. He said it has to be a program that meets our objectives and does not waste taxpayer dollars.
We have been hearing that from the White House, because we have been peppering them with questions over the last few day. If this passes, will that free up credit immediately, will everything go back to normal and the deputy press secretary Tony Fratto has said no, he said it's hard to really underestimate the shock that this credit crisis has had on the economy. He talked yesterday about this being felt not only through the end of the year, but well into the first quarter of 2009. He says, we will certainly bounce back and the president believes that as well, but Kyra, clearly him signaling the president today from the rose garden, this is going to take some time.
PHILLIPS: Time indeed. Kathleen Koch from the White House, thanks so much.
Christine Romans, I want to bring you in. I was reading a quote from one of the Democrats that voted on the bill. The first thing out of his mouth he said, I hate this bill. This was coming from Representative John Harmon, Democrat from Kentucky, but he said, which I thought was really interesting, that a fairly low level of confidence that this will work, but the risk of doing nothing is far too great to take, which really lays out where we are right now. It may sound good coming from the president's mouth and various supporters of the bill, but really, we don't know what will happen once it starts to unfold and we see the measure at work.
Still a lot of fear and a lot of questions, right?
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And what we do know is we know that this is just the beginning. We can't say that this is good news for the middle class and for Main Street just yet. What we can say is that we hope things don't get dramatically worse. I keep asking people, you know, who are the winners, who are the losers? There are no winners, it's just how badly you're going to lose. That's the kind of economy we're in right now and the kind of environment we're in right now.
And a lot of very, very smart economists have been saying this is the beginning, all of this concern about $700 billion and the size of this, you can be sure that whoever is the next president is going to have to have some big probably expensive plans out there that are going to fall in line after this one that we haven't finished spending all of the money. We have already put billions, hundreds of billions of dollars of liquidity into the international banking system. We've already had to give a bridge loan to AIG, had to rescue Fannie Mae and Freddie, and look, we're still in this situation where we have to put $700 billion into a program to pull bad toxic loans off of banks' books.
So this is just the beginning. A lot of people are telling me the question is now, will we just have a plain vanilla recession or are we going to have a very serious, very painful recession. Are we going to have a year and a half or a couple of years of trying to claw back to where we were or is it going to be something longer than that? That's even after the bailout. So I think Kathleen Koch said earlier, no champagne corks popping and that's exactly right. They have to be careful in Washington about smiles and patting each other on the back, because the politics part of this is over, but now comes the day-to- day figuring out how they're going to buy those securities, how the treasury is going to manage it, what happens if they don't see some kind of very instant relief, what happens if confidence doesn't come back? What happens if we keep getting months of 159,000 jobs lost.
One of the reasons why this is such a hard sell I think, Kyra, to the American people and Gerri has been getting these e-mails, it's just been incredible how people have been against this, one of the reasons that it is a hard sell is because they have to tell people, OK, it's a choice between really bad or really, really bad. And the American people are saying, you know what, we'll take our chances, because we don't have a lot of confidence in Washington, and in Wall Street who led us here. The two people who led us here, Washington and Wall Street, are the ones that are being trusted to lead us out now.
PHILLILPS: OK. Let me ask you this, I don't even know if I can even ask you this question, just listening to what you're saying and still the fear and the questions and all of the what ifs, what does the signing of this bill do? Does it prevent a disaster? Does it prevent something catastrophic that we simply can't handle and we just completely go into a massive depression?
ROMANS: That's the aim and that is the hope. The former fed --
PHILLIPS: You say aim and hope that still makes me nervous.
ROMANS: That's right.
PHILLIPS: $700 billion and we are still talking about an aim and a hope.
ROMANS: We have never been here before. Ben Bernanke put out a statement and he said, we at the fed are going to use everything in our arsenal to do whatever we have to do from here. Leaving the door open for more work, whatever the fed has to do, the fed's going to do, whatever the treasury has to do. I talked to Ken Roguoff, an economist at Harvard and former chief economist at the IMF. And he said that his is just the beginning and he thinks the fed and the treasury have done a very good job of managing what is a crisis in the banking sector, but again, I can't stress to you enough, this is the beginning of the process, this certainly isn't the end.
This is a very important political storm that has taken two weeks to unfold here, but now comes the really hard work as we go forward here. I think that a lot of people who saw those jobs numbers today know the jobs market is not going to improve overnight because of this, it certainly isn't.
It's going to prevent it from getting much, much worse is the hope, but it isn't going to improve it overnight. We're getting the oxygen flowing back into the system and that's the best way to describe it. When you get the credit market breathing again, that is the first step. Now the banks have to get confidence that they can lend to each other. They have to get confidence. The corporate treasurers have to regain the confidence, the corporate treasurers have to regain the confidence of the banks so they can borrow money for their payrolls and to buy raw materials.
And it's going to take a few days, Kyra, honestly before we're going to see how well that's working. I think you're probably going to see an instant kind of thaw, you know, of these frozen markets. A lot of the corporate treasurers have been hoping that just once they knew that they were going to get this bill through that confidence would come back a little bit and people could start to lend again. And that's the beginning.
PHILLIPS: All right, Christine Romans, thanks so much.
Let's get back over to Cap Hill with Brianna Keilar, apparently the bill is on its way to the White House right now, right Brianna?
KEILAR: Well, what we understand is over at that press conference that the Democrats on the House side were having, they handed it off in a box to a clerk and it's not quite on its way yet. What it has to do is basically go downstairs to the clerk's office, you know they ready it to be sent actually over to what is called the president protem of the Senate, that's Senator Byrd, who is the longest serving senator on the majority side and is the longest serving senator, period.
Then he will sign it, and then the bill would be driven over to the White House. So we don't know exactly when that's happening, but at this point we believe it is still here on Capitol Hill getting ready to be driven over to the White House.
I just want to tell you a little bit -- some of the communications that happened after this vote, Kyra. We're hearing from a senior Democratic leadership aide that President Bush actually picked up the phone, called House Speaker Nancy Pelosi as soon as the votes crossed that 218 threshold. She was still on the floor at the time, but of according to that aide, they were able to connect, and apparently President Bush also called Steny Hoyer, the House majority leader so that they could talk about what obviously both of them see as a success. So you're seeing a little bit of the communication behind the scenes there.
Also, I want to point out as we talked about before that press conference with House Democrats, there were no Republicans there. Well, I do want to tell you that now we have a written statement from House Minority Leader John Boehner and this may explain part of the reason why Republicans didn't join in that. He said the passage of this flawed but necessary bill is not cause for celebration. He went on to say the financial crisis is not a failure of the free market system, it is a failure of a broken Washington and a government culture that allowed executives at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and other firms to run amuck, ultimately imperiling our nation's economy.
This was a very tough vote for many members of Congress, especially for House Republicans describing this as quite a bitter pill -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: As we were talking, Christine Romans just sent me an e-mail, Brianna, it's the love of technology, how we can text, e-mail each other as all these things are going on. And Brianna, Christine says the best line she heard today was this bill is like Sophie's Choice, no reason to smile and no one wins. KEILAR: Yes, I know.
PHILLIPS: And you were talking just about how heated it got there on the hill. I mean the Democrats and Republicans and I'm trying to remember who said this to me the other day. I think it was Jessica Yellin, how she said that they have not struggled with something like this going back all the way to whether the U.S. should go to war with Iraq. That was the last time they felt this tension and this pressure from all angles whether it was the president, to wall street, to their constituents, to each other.
KEILAR: Now it's so difficult and what you're hearing from both sides is they had to pass this and they're not happy with it. You have Republicans and you have Democrats who would like to have seen more things added on to this bill, other provisions, but they didn't get it. I mean even at this point, you have many members still who didn't vote for it. They disagreed with whether or not this is actually going to work.
Whether or not tax cuts were going to be offset, whether or not there were certain tax cuts in there that should be in there, so both sides, you know, not thrilled about this, but they felt they had to do it and they had a limited amount of time. What we're going to be seeing Kyra here in the future is a lot of hearings about how did it get to this point? What needs to be done? Does there need to be more regulation of Wall Street?
So there's going to be a lot of that sort of the second look, the look back, the retrospect that we didn't get to see once the Bush administration sent their proposal over here because Congress had to move so quickly. Normally, there are hearings and then legislation is drafted. They didn't have the luxury of time here or at least members of Congress didn't feel that they had the luxury of that time.
PHILLIPS: All right, Brianna Keilar on Capitol Hill, thank you so much. And we've been talking about the politics, now to the pocketbook. Ben Bernanke, Federal Reserve Chairman coming forward saying he's praising the House of Representatives and the passage of the $700 billion bailout of the U.S. financial system. He is promising to work closely with the treasury department to implement that plan. What does that mean?
Well, the treasury department can start buying up all that bad debt to try and help you and me, everyone else, trying to get money, trying to just keep the family afloat right now, when it comes to your home, your mortgages, your paycheck, filling up the gas tank. He went on to say it demonstrates the government's commitment to do what it takes to support and strengthen our economy. He went on and said the legislation is a critical step towards stabilizing our financial markets and ensuring an uninterrupted flow of credit to households and businesses.
Susan Lisovicz, live from the New York Stock Exchange. That's basically what taxpayers want to hear. They hear $700 billion bailout, what the -- when they are trying to get credit and they're trying to keep their small businesses afloat and they're trying to keep their homes from being foreclosed.
SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think that, you know, I think that disgust is rampant and also I think that the treasury secretary, the federal reserve chairman are appalled, but I think that it got to the point where it was like sort of a break glass in case of emergency. They felt like it really had gotten to the point. In fact, there was a dissection or a complete comprehensive article on some of the exchanges that went down about a week or two ago when this plan was first broached and there is a quote from Bernanke that said something like, we may not have an economy on Monday.
That conversation took place on a Thursday. That's the kind of comment that when Senator Chris Dodd said the oxygen went out of the room, that's the kind of thing that frightens a lot of people, but you know, now we have this plan and I don't think that anyone should expect this as the end of it. We are looking at fed fund futures which are betting pretty much with 100 percent certainty that the Federal Reserve is now going to cut interest rates. This legislation now that it's going to be a done deal kind of frees his hand to do that and of course, oil prices have come down so substantially.
So it's not the end of the problem here and of course, you know, this credit crunch was preceded by a slowdown in the economy that we saw already. It just compounds it. You know, we have the jobs numbers today, we're going to start seeing corporate earnings for the third quarter, and we're going to expect to see some lousy numbers. What does that mean? Well that means that, you know, your 401(k) will further be impacted by what we see and also of course, your job. When, you know, with these kind of, when this kind of reaches a certain point, you know, companies are cautious, they're very cautious about how they hire, upgrade, expand and so on.
PHILLIPS: So let me ask you a question, Susan, because Nancy Pelosi, other Democrats hammering the point that it's all about accountability, we don't want to get to this point again. We have to hold accountable those high flyer CEOs, get rid of those golden parachutes.
OK, give us a reality check with regards to accountability. I mean I talked to an FBI investigator weeks ago and he said, you know what, we're talking about so much money, and money that's given to these politicians who are voting on this bill to support their campaigns and stay in office, I mean what, can this really happen? Will we really see no more golden parachutes for the CEOs and will we see the SEC and will we see the accountability factor really take play here? Will it finally happen? It hasn't happened for a long time on so many levels. Why believe in it now?
LISOVICZ: Well, I mean I think that everybody knows that some of these packages have just been outrageous, and any company that's involved that benefits from this program, I believe that one of the attachments is that there will be certain curves no question about it on compensation. Not only for the CEO, but for the top-paid executives and that is of course only fair, because it is not private sector anymore, I don't know what it is, but it's not private sector. But I don't think that, I think it's naive to think that it's the end of golden parachutes that we're seeing, that's because there are plenty of companies that won't be in this. This particular time frame where the economy is slowing, I mean I think about everybody is impacted, but I think that, yes, you're going to see a lot more oversight, and frankly, the lack of oversight was one of the factors that contributed so many factors that contributed to the mess we're in now including the fact that we all piled up on buying a lot of thing. Not only homes, but things to put in them, and debt and credit was just too readily available. It was reckless and in some cases criminal, but it's all reaching a crescendo now, and you're starting to see, you know, the ramifications of that -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Bottom line, it's still going to be a rough road ahead. Susan Lisovicz, live from the --
LISOVICZ: We've gotten through it before, we'll get through it again.
PHILLIPS: There we go. We'll be positive. We will survive, right?
LISOVICZ: There is still a sky overhead.
PHILLIPS: Amen. All right, let's just hope no apples hit us on the head. All right, Susan Lisovicz, thank you so much. Now during the debate on the floor, we heard a lot from Democrats and Republicans. Let's take a quick listen to Republican John Boehner, what he said when the debate was raging on.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R) MINORITY LEADER: I said my prayers this morning like I do every morning, so that I can understand and feel better about the vote that I cast. But even if we pass this bill today, let's not kid ourselves. We're in the midst of a recession. And it is going to be a rough ride. But it will be a whole lot rougher ride if we don't pass this bill. I will say to all of you, when this bill passes today, remember those words in God we trust, because we are going to need his help.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: So does the next president of the United States either John McCain or Barack Obama that's going to take this on and has to work with this measure until the end of the year and for the next four years, what does that all mean? What are they saying? Where do they go from here?
We're going to talk to our Ed Henry who is on the campaign trail right after a quick break.
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PHILLIPS: And if you are just tuning in, we want to welcome obviously our international viewers as well. Congress has passed that historic legislation, that legislation we have been talking about for weeks now the $700 billion bailout plan to try and save the troubled financial industry here in the United States.
We have heard from various leaders within the Senate and the House. The president of the United States now expected to sign the bill before he leaves, about 3:15 eastern time today or possibly after he leaves the White House. He did mention this evening, but a long point in short the president of the United States going to sign off on the legislation. The bailout bill has passed. What it means for the United States, what it means for taxpayers, what it means for international relations.
We're hammering it all out with all of our various correspondents and I would love some direction on where I'm supposed to go. Perfect -- Ed Henry.
We're going to go to you still in Pueblo, Colorado, he's on the campaign trail actually with John McCain. I'll tell you what Ed, we have been going to so many different correspondents covering all angles of this story, sometimes when we go to commercial break, I forget exactly where I am. But I have you and you are going to talk to me about John McCain, Barack Obama, one of those men will take the helm of this bailout plan when they become president of the United States.
How do they move forward now talking about this? Dealing with this? Getting ready for this? And how will it affect the presidential race coming 30 days from now?
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, what's interesting is John McCain did just wrap up a town hall meeting behind me in Pueblo, Colorado, a battleground state where Barack Obama has really been gaining steam. One of many battleground states in the last two weeks, in large part because of this financial crisis, we thought maybe John McCain would come out and take a little bit of a victory lap, after all, he took kind of a beating politically at least earlier in the week when this bill sort of melted down in the House of Representatives, maybe he'd take a victory lap.
But no, there was no time for celebration, instead he was very frank, very blunt in saying, look, this is just a tourniquet. It's not a be all, end all solution. He said again, it's a tourniquet, it's going to stop the bleeding in the short term we hope, but it's not enough, there's got to be a lot more reform in Washington. We have to make sure we keep taxes low and he went into kind of the rest of his stump speech where he tries to lay out a contrast with Barack Obama. The reason why there's no celebration from John McCain today is pretty clear. People are hurting around the country with -- all across the United States. He doesn't want to look like he's patting himself on the back. But also you saw that awful jobs report of more than 150,000 jobs lost in the United States, once again, just in the last month. He's got to be very careful about not celebrating.
And finally, I mentioned that in various key polls, we have seen Barack Obama gaining steam and so John McCain doesn't want to go too far with this. He realizes that he's got has to push back on issues like taxes. And so what we heard from John McCain in addition was he was saying, bottom line, that John McCain believes that Barack Obama is going to raise taxes on a lot of the Americans and that that would just make the economic situation even worse.
What we heard from Barack Obama earlier today in Pennsylvania was some real strong pushback where he insisted he wants to cut taxes, not raise taxes, but cut taxes on 95 percent of Americans, only raise taxes on the wealthiest 5 percent of the Americans. So you can bet it's going to be a lot of back and forth in these final few weeks, on the issue of taxes in particular, as to who has the better prescription to deal with this economic and financial crisis.
And the final point I make obviously is that John McCain wants to be careful about celebrating as well because he realizes he doesn't know how this bailout is going to work. As you know, even though it is now finally passed through both chambers of Congress, a lot of the lawmakers who voted for it say that their constituents are 8 to 1 or 9 to 1, you pick the number, against this bailout, thinking that it's going to bailout people on Wall Street and not help people in Main Street, USA.
And so John McCain has to be really careful not to look like he's too happy about this passing. He doesn't quite know really whether it's really going to work. So the bottom line, he's being very careful in the his rhetoric, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right. Meanwhile, while I have you and while you are there on the campaign trail, I'm curious to get your impressions from the debate last night -- Sarah Palin, Joe Biden. What is the word? What is the talk? How did that debate affect the future president?
HENRY: Well, you would not be surprised that John McCain opened his remarks by talking about Sarah Barracuda, her nickname. There was a sign in the crowd about the barracuda doing well last night. He obviously felt she did well, felt like she won the debate. A lot of McCain aides telling me this morning that she knocked it out of the park.
Democrats, as you're not going to be surprised either, insist that Joe Biden won that debate.
My initial impression was that it really looked like both sides scored some points, but there was no clear winner. It almost seemed last week with the presidential debate, where it was almost a draw. Both sides made their points in that first presidential debate. You'll remember Democrats tried to spin it forward as saying, look, a draw is a win for Barack Obama because he was not expected to do well on foreign policy, not as well as John McCain.
Likewise, you're now hearing from Republicans, if it was a draw, and they don't think it was, they think it was an outright win for Sarah Palin, but if it was a draw, since expectations were so low and a lot of people thought, in both parties, that Sarah Palin would not win that debate, not even come to a tie, Republicans are trying to spin that forward as a victory that she went toe-to-toe with Joe Biden -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right. Our Ed Henry there on the campaign trail in Pueblo, Colorado with the John McCain camp right now, giving us both sides to the story.
Thank you, Ed.
Meanwhile, the struggling economy is dominating the debate on Capitol Hill and the conversations on Main Street, obviously. It seems everybody has taken a hit, especially the people in the housing industry, not just realtors, but also plumbers, electricians, heating and air people, the list goes on.
CNN's Rusty Dornin at the Convention of Home Renovators right here in Atlanta. I can just -- we have experienced this, Rusty, here in Atlanta, seeing all of the homes that haven't been selling, al the subdivisions that have been going down tank. It's been happening across the country.
What are the home builders telling you?
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, you are talking about the Main Street, the folks that are at this international trade show -- they are the ones that are building Main Street, and they have really been hit. When this whole housing crunch happened, they were the first ones hit. They're the ones not getting hired for the jobs to begin with.
Now this convention, originally, a couple of years ago, had 10,000 attendees. This year, only half, which is really a sign of the times. And then only 3,000 showed up because of the gas shortage in Atlanta.
But here, managing the trade show is Daniel McKinnon -- really, how are people feeling about this bailout bill? Do you think that people were nervous whether it was going to be passed? How is it going to affect them?
DANIEL MCKINNON, EXEC. V.P., MESSE FRANKFURT: I think that after the first one wasn't passed, they were nervous about it. But I know there's a huge sigh of relief right now that it has been passed, and I think that they feel confident that it's going to help them in the future.
DORNIN: But how is it going to help them? How is this bill going to help the plumbers and the retrofitters and the remodelers and that sort of thing?
MCKINNON: It's going to relieve some of the credit issues that have been such a concern. It's going to provide them with the opportunity to expand their product lines. And also it's going to give -- on the other side -- people that want a mortgage are finally going to -- hopefully be able to obtain one and buy a house and build a house and renovate their house.
DORNIN: You were also telling me some of the ways the bill was sweetened are actually -- are positive for the folks in this business. What are some of those things?
MCKINNON: I think there were some provisions for renewable energies and for sustainable types of technologies that really help this industry, specifically the funding contractors and the manufacturers that fund the equipment. I think that once those types of products are starting to put into commercial and residential buildings and projects, it will help them a great, great deal.
DORNIN: But how long do you think that is going to take? How long is that trickle down going to take where it's going to maybe inject some energy into the business for these folks?
MCKINNON: It's going to take a while. Those are expensive technologies, those are new technologies. And the people that are specifying the architect and the builder, they're going to have to adapt these into their own projects and into their own plans in order for these technologies to come to fruition.
But they are being built, they are being developed. There are indeed -- people are working on them.
DORNIN: You were also just saying -- to wrap this up -- the international trade shows are really sort of an indicator of the economies. Why?
MCKINNON: Absolutely. People that are trying to sell their products -- it's the best -- it's a fundamental sort of requirement for people to get their products into the hands of their customers. Trade shows provide that opportunity because they have a variety, an array of products and networking and education. People are coming here to see products and if they don't come, they are not seeing products, they're not buying them, and not distributing them.
DORNIN: All right. Thank you very much, Daniel McKinnon.
And if that is any sign, Kyra, as we said, less than a third of people that attended this show last year did come. So, a sign of the times. Builders, people who are constructing Main Street, having a very tough time, but hoping that the bailout bill is something that is going to reenergize the business -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Rusty Dornin, thanks so much.
Constructing Main Street. How about reconstructing Wall Street?
Ali Velshi going to talk to us about the changes this bill is going to mean for accountability. And also, we're going to take -- yes -- we're going to talk to him in just a second. There you go -- a live shot from Capitol Hill as well.
We are going to take a quick break. We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Well, if you're just joining us, the historic bailout plan has been passed. The president is expected to sign off on it this evening.
Ali Velshi will be monitoring all aspects of this, from your money to the markets to politics. Ali Velshi in Chicago there at CBOT.
Ali, I'll tell you what -- everybody was watching those numbers, watching to see if indeed it was going to pass. We can hear all the craziness behind you. Then it finally went through. And you actually -- I got an e-mail from you saying that you saw things happening immediately with regard to credit -- lower rates. Yes.
ALI VELSHI, CNN SR. BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right.
This is where you track credit. One of the reasons I am here today and not at the stock market is that stocks are equity, that's what they are. This is the credit markets. Now credit markets, as soon as the bailout passed, started to thaw up. Very little. Money is moving very slowly now, like a big fat turtle that has just had lunch, like -- it is hardly discernible. In fact, the traders I have talked to have said, you cannot even call it a trend. But the bottom line is that short term money, which is the most instant measure of whether or not credit is loosening, has started to loosen a little bit.
This is not your money, this is not your car loan or your home loan. This is credit at the highest levels, between institutions. But that is what was blocked up.
Now, Susan Lisovicz, responded to that same e-mail and said, OK, Ali, go out to try to get a car loan right now and tell me how well that goes. And the bottom line is, Susan is right. The question remains how long between this slow fat turtle of money that has started to move, and woken from its slumber, until you start being able to get a loan at a lower rate, a mortgage, a car loan, before somebody is trying to buy your house can do it.
So, Kyra, the issue here is we are waiting to see how this flows down, how this trickles down. I know you have asked this question many times today, this is what Americans are asking -- when does this come back to me? I've held my nose, and I swallowed this bitter pill of this bailout, when will I see the benefit?
Now, Kyra, here is the thing -- we have other problems. We saw unemployment, we saw a big plunge in the number of jobs -- a big increase in the number of jobs lost in September. We have now lost 760,000 jobs since the beginning of the year and that is not going to slow down immediately. That is very important.
So this just takes care of one specific aspect of the credit markets, the rest of the economy is still in a lot of trouble. And that is why we are still wondering -- and that's why you're looking at that Dow that has been all over the map today. It was even negative a few minutes ago.
PHILLIPS: Ali Velshi, thank you so much.
And as you can imagine, we have been getting crazy amounts of viewer e-mails. Gerri Willis has been monitoring all that.
I apologize, Gerri, because you do have to weed through a lot of crazy e-mails.
GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR: It is incredible, I have never seen anything like this.
Kyra, we are giving CNN viewers a voice here -- issue1@CNN.com -- if you want to talk about this, we want to hear your voice. Tons of e- mails.
Let me start with Lauren in California, she actually supports this move: "Everyday Americans need to step back and look at the big picture. The consequences of doing nothing, worse than the rescue package."
And Rob who says: "I am not happy that we had to do this bill, but we had to. Hopefully this will stabilize financial markets."
But far more common place is Elsie (ph) who says: "Shame, shame, shame on Congress."
Emily, who describes herself as a CPA, she says: "The biggest loser is the prudent renter waiting for housing prices to follow (ph) real values who now has to pay more taxes to keep prices artificially propped up."
And Russ White who says: "With the passage of this bill, the last of any confidence in our economy and our standing in the world is gone. My wife is scared. I am, too. We are canceling all unnecessary spending."
And this from Jim Walters: "I am a small business owner, and I have to manage my business in a responsible way or my company folds. Nobody bails me out."
I am telling you, we are getting e-mails from all over the country, Butch Riddle (ph), Bernice Sal (ph), Cheryl (ph) -- it goes on and on. And every time we say issue1@CNN.com, I cannot keep up. Literally, cannot keep up, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Well, we're going to checking in with you. Try and keep up, and we'll keep talking about the bottom line for all of us.
WILLIS: I will.
PHILLIPS: Gerri Willis, thank you so much.
Meanwhile, we are waiting to hear --
WILLIS: My pleasure.
PHILLIPS: -- from Steny Hoyer and Representative Roy Blunt -- 2:45 p.m. Eastern time. We are expecting a bipartisan newser on the outcome of this legislation finally being signed. Is it good? Is it bad? A lot of fear, a lot of questions. Still not sure, and we won't know for a long period of time. It is a long road ahead, both Democrats and Republicans admitting to that.
Well, the buildup was incredible. How would Sarah Palin and Joe Biden handle themselves in their first and only vice presidential debate? Well, now we know. There were no big gaffes in last night's face-off in St. Louis as the Delaware senator and the Alaska governor focused on the big issues, and apparently satisfied their supporters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOE BIDEN (D), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This is a fundamental difference between us. We will end this war. For John McCain, there is no end in sight to end this war. Fundamental difference -- we will end this war.
GWEN IFILL, MODERATOR: Governor?
GOV. SARAH PALIN (R), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Your plan is a white flag of surrender in Iraq, and that is not what our troops need to hear today, that is for sure, and it's not what our nation needs to be able to count on.
BIDEN: The middle-class, under John McCain's tax proposals, 100 million families, middle-class families, households to be precise, they got not a single change -- they got not a single break in taxes. No one making less than $250,000 under Barack Obama's plan will see one single penny of their taxes raised, whether it is their capital gains tax, their income tax, investment tax, any tax.
PALIN: I do take issue with some of the principle there with that redistribution of wealth principle that seems to be espoused by you. But when you talk about Barack's plan to tax increase effecting only those make $250,000 a year or more, you're forget the millions of small businesses that are going to fit into that category.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: All right. So what are all the pundits saying? Joining me now from New York, CNN political analyst and Obama supporter, Roland Martin and from San Diego, nationally syndicated columnist, Ruben Navarrette.
Both, regular columnists and commentators for CNN.com.
Ruben, what do you think? Who won?
RUBEN NAVARRETTE, CNN.COM COMMENTATOR: Well, Kyra, this was really not a debate, it was a referendum on Sarah Palin. If you love Sarah Palin, you think she won. If you don't like Sarah Palin, you're inclined to say that she lost.
I think an objective view is that it was a tie, there was no win, knock-out punch. It was a tie --
Well, I think I hear some commentary already in the background.
PHILLIPS: Yes, gee I think that's Roland laughing. What do you think -- NAVARRETTE: Well, I think it was a tie and I think it was a tie in a sense that she gets the benefit from that because all week long we were told she was going to get blown away. And I think a lot of liberals out there, present company excluded, Roland, were disappointed that didn't happen. She showed she -- she had a lot more on the ball than they give her credit for. And a lot of folks who didn't like her at the beginning of it, I think, grudgingly, had to give her credit for a really nice performance.
PHILLIPS: Roland?
ROLAND MARTIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, first of all, Ruben, let me explain something -- a blind man and a deaf woman could figure out that Joe Biden won this debate. You don't give somebody points because she showed up and put her name down and said, hey, I'm here. No.
Here is the problem I have, and you just articulated it. Your bar is set so low, it is ridiculous. I had a high bar for her and high bar for Joe Biden because this is for the vice president of the United States. Joe Biden -- he nailed it. OK, she wouldn't even answer certain questions.
Did she fulfill the role that other people laid out because of a low bar? Of course she did. But I am sorry, I have a much higher standard for somebody who wants to be the second highest post in the world --
(CROSSTALK)
NAVARRETTE: Roland, if you had a high standard, you would not be backing Barack Obama/Biden so enthusiastically.
MARTIN: Oh please -- oh, Mr. I don't know about the economy, right, Ruben. He has been delusional for two weeks. He has no clue what is going on.
NAVARRETTE: Roland, you can say something nice about a Republican, you will not get struck by lightning. Trust me --
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: No -- see Ruben, here is your problem. See you fall for the standard liberal stuff. I'm from Texas. I voted for George H.W. Bush in '88. I voted for his son in 2000. I voted for Republicans.
NAVARRETTE: Right.
MARTIN: That's what you don't understand. I choose people, not ideology. And the reality is this here -- Joe Biden nailed her when it came to health care, when it came to the economy --
NAVARETTE: Roland, this is what I understand --
MARTIN: All she could say was --
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: Ruben -- Ruben all she could say all night, tax cuts, tax cuts, tax cuts. That was their policy.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: So Ruben, what was the high point for Palin then? What was the high point?
NAVARRETTE: Well, Kyra, I think the absolute high point was what -- and Roland alluded to it --
MARTIN: She showed up, right?
NAVARRETTE: No, I think the high point was when she turned to the camera and said, I am not here to answer Joe Biden's questions, or the way that the moderator wants to answer the question, I'm going to speak directly to the American people. And I will say this, during the McCain/Barack Obama debate, I think Barack Obama won that debate because John McCain didn't even look at Barack Obama, didn't look at the camera, kept looking at the moderator.
It is not too much to ask, folks, if you're going to run for president or vice president, to look into the camera and come into our living room. Barack Obama did that, John McCain didn't. Using that same standard, last night I say Palin did that, and Joe Biden didn't.
It is obviously why Roland doesn't like her, because he is afraid of her, because he knows she is the best thing McCain has going.
MARTIN: Ruben, if she is the best thing McCain's got going, trust me, he has issues.
But, Kyra --
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: But Roland, this was sort of a -- they were going at Barack Obama and they were going at John McCain. You didn't hear a lot of Senator Biden, Governor Palin. There wasn't a lot of going at each other, a lot of attacks on each other. They focused on John McCain and Barack Obama.
MARTIN: And that is what you are supposed to do. Your job is to go after the person at the top, and that is what Joe Biden was doing. Sarah Palin was defending who she was. She didn't spend that much time really trying to show the contrast.
But listen to that, Ruben just laid out his rationale -- she looked into the camera, not health care, not housing, not bailout --
PHILLIPS: Hold on for just a second. We've got video here of the president of the United States. He was connecting at the Treasury Department with Henry Paulson.
Are we actually going to listen to that, guys, or is this just video?
OK, let's go ahead and take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: Mr. Secretary, you and your team have worked incredibly hard. You've worked with the Congress, you've worked with the financial markets, both domestically and internationally. I know that your people are exhausted in there, and I really appreciate the fact that I am going to sign a piece of legislation that will be a part of, you know, solving this crisis, an important part of solving the crisis. And so I just went up to thank people.
Sometimes people in government never get thanked enough for all of the hours they keep. And you know, I've got a lot of confidence in you, Mr. Secretary, and your team. And I want to thank you for giving me the chance to come by and I am looking forward to getting this plan in place.
I just told the people in the Rose Garden that, you know, it is complicated and we're going to make sure that whatever we do is done in a deliberate fashion and one that will be effective and be mindful of the taxpayers. I appreciate your service.
HENRY PAULSON, TREASURY SECRETARY: Thank you very much, sir.
BUSH: Thank you all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: The legislation has passed, the president has signed off. Now, how quickly, as we look at Henry Paulson there, the head of the Treasury Department, how quickly will the Treasury Department be able to buy up all of that bad debt from various lending institutions? How quickly will we be able to see the effects of this take place and help the taxpayer? How much will it help the taxpayer -- the average middle-class American?
Still a lot of guessing, a lot of fear, and not quite sure how good of a bailout plan this is. Still a lot of questions at hand.
Meanwhile, Steny Hoyer, Roy Blunt holding a bipartisan newser right now. Let's go ahead and take a listen to that for a minute.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
REP. ROY BLUNT (R), MINORITY WHIP: ... And beyond that, we even put a provision in the bill that should guarantee that taxpayers don't lose money. The oversight, the transparency, not the two and a half page bill that the secretary of the Treasury brought up, but a bill that basically takes every belt and suspenders approach you can take to being sure that people are looking at this, that people don't -- are not able to take advantage of the system. In fact, one of the things that I don't think I have shared with you yet that I put into the record today was a letter we got yesterday from the secretary of the Treasury, talking about the rules would to relate to foreign entities, ensuring that only banks (INAUDIBLE) regulated to and doing business in financial entities in the United States would be part of this plan.
And also, strict rules so that people who are participating in one side of this plan would not be benefiting from the other side. Where you don't say, OK, here, buy my assets and let me manage them for you. I think those are the kinds of things that Congress has worked hard to see that it doesn't happen. Monday -- we were working against a deadline unlike any I ever remember working against where everybody in the building knew what time we were going to vote. I think today's approach was much better when we were both saying, we are going to vote when we have got our job done and have the votes ready to go to the floor. And so we added a number of Republicans, as we should have. And on your side, you added some votes as well.
I think that our members are going home with a sense that the changes that happened this week, the SEC changes were helpful, and (INAUDIBLE) having the -- we have in the legislation today report now in the next 45 days that will actually monitor, as it turns out, these new changes that the SEC and the accounting folks have just said banking institutions should be using. Monitor them, see what kind of job they are doing and if more need to be done. Clearly the FDIC insurance addition -- every member of Congress, or most members of Congress, by today had some story from their district where people were coming in and taking money out of their account if it was over $100,000. And when that money goes out of the account, particularly if it goes home, not only is that a dangerous thing, but it is obviously no longer there to loan to somebody who you are in business (INAUDIBLE) to do, take people's money in, loan it out.
So, I know we are all relieved to be beyond where we were yesterday. I think that the members are going to have the opportunity now, over the next couple of weeks, to be talking about what we did rather than what the country had been led to believe for several days we were going to do.
REP. STENY HOYER (D), MAJORITY WHIP: Thank you, Roy. Any questions?
QUESTION: I am wondering if you can both address whether --
PHILLIPS: Steny Hoyer, Roy Blunt hold a bipartisan newser there after the big news of the day, the historic legislation, that $700 billion bailout plan has passed. The president has signed off on it. Now, the question remains -- how good is this for the American public? How is this going to affect Wall Street to Main Street to the middle- class taxpayer.
Rick Sanchez, you are getting ready to start off and kick off the next hour. Still a lot of questions out there.
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Who was this supposed to help? Bankers, right? Bankers. Bankers.
PHILLIPS: It's supposed to -- well, if you -- it depends on who you talk to. If you want to talk to various Democrats and Republicans --
SANCHEZ: Let me ask you this --
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Let me ask you this --
PHILLIPS: -- not only help the banking institutions, but ultimately the taxpayers.
SANCHEZ: Do you think Americans wanted this as a way of helping investors in American Samoa?
PHILLIPS: I think Americans are confused. Americans are confused --
SANCHEZ: I'm telling you --
PHILLIPS: It scares them to believe in it, it scares them not to believe in it. Still nobody knows.
SANCHEZ: This thing is filled with pork.
PHILLIPS: You are talking pork, and we're not talking not the sandwich you had at noon.
SANCHEZ: Pork. Lots and lots of pork.
People, they have just passed a resolution that essentially says as a result of this bailout or -- quote -- "rescue plan," what they are going to do is --
PHILLIPS: Or buyout. Don't forget buyout.
SANCHEZ: They are going to give advantages now to people who invest in wind power, solar power, have an electric vehicle, invest in American Samoa, mine rescuers, worsted (ph) wool fabric producers, makers of wooden arrows --
PHILLIPS: OK, look, you've got have --
SANCHEZ: You confused yet?
PHILLIPS: No, no, hold on. You've got various politicians, right? That worked certain parts of the United States, they've got to make sure their constituents are happy. They've got to make sure that there are small business bow makers --
SANCHEZ: What the hell does that do with saving the banks?
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Hey, you've got to get money from the banks to be able to do your small business. Come on, Rick.
(CROSSTALK) SANCHEZ: You know who we're going to have in just a second --
PHILLIPS: You've never shot a bow and arrow.
SANCHEZ: Ron Paul is going to join us in just a little bit. There is a side to this story that I think Americans need to hear. And what we did is, with our staff back here, we went through this thing and found all of the stuff that has nothing to do with banking. And we're going to present it to you, and then we're going to let you draw your own conclusions.
Oh and by the way, Ron Paul might lead you in your conclusion, somewhat. He'll be joining us live.
Back with you.
PHILLIPS: Actually, I'm going to wrap it up here, enjoy my weekend, think a lot about this bailout plan. But still bottom line is, there has got to be accountability. The SEC has got to watch over Wall Street, and the FBI needs to continue to investigate into the corruption, so we are not in the position again.
We don't want to be in it again. We dealt with it in the '80s, we're dealing with it now.
SANCHEZ: I'll tell you most of the tweets that I have been getting today seemed to indicated that people are a little softener in their position on this than they were earlier in the week. Some are saying, I hate it, but if we've got to have it, let's have it.
PHILLIPS: And still a lot of people are confused too. I know -- now we just have the long journey ahead. That's for sure.
We're going to take a quick break and Rick will be right back to take it from here.
