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News Conference on Arrest of Illinois Governor and Chief of Staff

Aired December 09, 2008 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Once again, a live picture for you, we're awaiting the details of the indictment against Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich. When that news conference begins any moment now we will bring it to you.
Hello again, everyone. I'm Tony Harris in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Here are the headlines from CNN for Tuesday, December 9th.

Again, breaking news. The governor of Illinois and his chief of staff arrested on corruption charges. What exactly are they accused of? Answers as we bring you the government's news conference live.

Intense closed door talks in Congress over the auto bailout. Will the automakers get their $15 billion loan or will President Bush put the brakes on the plan?

Again, breaking news this hour. Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich in federal custody, he is facing a long list of corruption charges, his chief of staff also under arrest. We are awaiting a news conference any moment now from the U.S. attorney's office. Among the allegations against Blagojevich seeking financial gain in return for appointing someone to fill Barack Obama's Senate seat.

We have the details earlier from an FBI spokesman.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

VOICE OF ROSS RICE, FBI SPOKESMAN: About 6:30 this morning Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich and his chief of staff John Harris were arrested without incident by FBI agents here in Chicago. Both men were charged in a criminal complaint tat was filed in U.S. district court here in Chicago on Sunday with two violations of federal law. One, solicitation of a bribe. Second, is mail fraud.

(END OF AUDIO CLIP)

HARRIS: The allegations against Blagojevich, shocking many around the country, but pay to play apparently is nothing new to Chicago politics. I spoke last hour with Lynn Sweet, Washington bureau chief for the "Chicago Sun-Times".

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LYNN SWEET, "CHICAGO SUN-TIMES": The governor's been under a cloud for years, what the fed seems to have focused on, in a sense, nailed him on, is what has happened just in the past few weeks.

HARRIS: Yes.

SWEET: Just in the past few weeks. The stuff that is frankly the most sexy, the selling of a Senate seat and the purging an editorial board of a newspaper in exchange for getting some deals on Wrigley Field.

The complicated story seems he was alleged to have been in, you know the pay for play in commissions and boards, and that stuff has been going on for years at this point. What's interesting here is that what the indictment is focusing on, stuff that just happened in the last few weeks. Especially with the Senate seat, when Governor Blagojevich could have known he has already been under some scrutiny.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

HARRIS: Wow. Let's bring in our senior legal analyst to walk us through the charges and allegations against the Illinois governor. Jeffrey Toobin joins us now from New York.

Jeffrey, good to see you. Jeffrey, what's sexy and eye-popping here, obviously, is this idea of selling off Barack Obama's vacated Senate seat. The pattern of business as usual corruption in Chicago -- maybe I'm being a little naive here but I'm going to be naive for many in the country who may be wondering.

What's going on in Chicago?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Let's just start with the fact that Blagojevich's predecessor George Ryan, he's in jail now for a totally different corruption scandal. There does seem to be something in the water or at least in the culture, of Illinois and Chicago politics. But this Blagojevich thing, I have to say, this document, this affidavit, it reads like a David Mammoth play.

It is just so full of cynicism and corruption and in just the most astonishing passages, but there are three parts to the charges, let's be clear. The first is the classic pay to play kickback scheme. If you give us campaign contributions, we'll give you money. That is the Rezko scandal, it's all an outgrowth of that and that's been a long running investigation in Chicago.

The new stuff is really the most astonishing stuff and it comes in two parts. The first part relates to the now bankruptcy of the "Tribune" Company which owns the "Chicago Tribune" and the Chicago Cubs. In trying to make money off the asset of Wrigley Field, where the cubs play, the Tribune Company tried to get the Illinois government to put up some of the money. Blagojevich is charged with saying we'll put up the money if you fire editorial writers at the "Chicago Tribune" --

HARRIS: Are you kidding me?

TOOBIN: -- who have been critical of me.

HARRIS: Is that the allegation?

TOOBIN: That's totally the allegation. It's astonishing. I've never read anything like it, but there are lengthy quotes from wiretaps which seem awfully difficult to refute.

Obviously, we need to hear Blagojevich's side of the story, but I certainly never heard of a corruption scheme based on the firing of editorial writers at a newspaper. OK, that's bad enough, but then the topper, and certainly the most dramatic part of the charges is that Blagojevich is governor of Illinois, has the legal right to name Barack Obama's replacement in the United States Senate. And he is charged, in essence, with selling that Senate seat, trying to sell it.

How can I get money? How can I get a job for me? How can I get a job for my wife? How can I get a foundation set up that will pay me in return for appointing the candidate who gives me the most money or privilege or stuff?

HARRIS: Can we just sort of -- we both have pretty vivid imaginations and certainly mine is out of bounds sometime, but how does something like that possibly work? For example, just as an example, we know that Jesse Jackson Junior is interested in that seat. So, I mean, hypothetical, everyone at home. Just a hypothetical.

How would something like this work? We're not talking about classic bag man kind of stuff over drinks and cigars? I mean, how -- well --

TOOBIN: Who's to say we're not? That's the thing about the allegations here. They are so outrageous, they are so old school that you'd think, oh, come on.

If you put it in a screenplay no one would believe it. But, for example, Blagojevich is quoted in this complaint as saying "well, you know, maybe Obama's people will get Warren Buffett to put $10 or $12 million up and I'll have a foundation to run, and then I'll appoint their candidate."

Very important point to make here, and certainly this question is going to be asked a lot: What did Obama know about any of this?

There is no evidence in this complaint that Obama knew anything about these machinations. He's certainly going to be asked about it. It's appropriate that he's asked about it, but there is certainly no evidence in the complaint that Obama was aware of this scheme going on, that he participated in it, but it's certainly awkward for him, because it relates to his own Senate seat.

HARRIS: Absolutely.

TOOBIN: And he's mentioned throughout this document.

HARRIS: All right. Looks like we're getting -- thank you. Rabbit ears, a two-minute warning. Jeffrey, you just provided me with a terrific opportunity to bring in Elaine Quijano. The most stunning allegation that we've been talking about here that Illinois Governor Blagojevich tried to sell the Senate seat vacated by Barack Obama.

Elaine Quijano there in Chicago, let's bring her in.

And Jeffrey, if you would stand by for us please.

Elaine any reaction so far from the president-elect to this breaking news?

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No. And I can tell you that's obviously not a surprise. Like everyone else, they're waiting to hear as details continue to come out, but the answer to your question, quite simply, no comment. It will be interesting to see, cameras are supposed to be allowed into a meeting that's scheduled to take place in a little bit between the president-elect as well as former vice president Al Gore. We'll see if any questions are shouted the president-elect's way. But right now, no comment from the Obama transition team.

HARRIS: Elaine, thank you.

Let's bring back in Jeffrey Toobin as we wind down, getting very close to the start of this news conference. This is such a far- reaching indictment here, Jeffrey. I was asking you just a moment ago, is this sort of a classic bag-man situation, where money exchanges hands over drinks and cigars.

What do we have here? The evidence procured through what, wiretaps, recorded conversations?

TOOBIN: The more recent evidence does seem to be largely based on wiretaps and bugs. It's just a remarkable series of events that Blagojevich knew he's been under investigation for years, yet he seems to have spoken with unbelievable candor to people who were wearing wires, which doesn't say much about his intelligence or his perception in this. Also, keep in mind that the FBI this morning arrested Blagojevich in his house.

HARRIS: What do you think of that?

TOOBIN: In a white collar case, that is very unusual. Usually it's done, you call the lawyer, say let the guy surrender. The only thing I can conclude, and we'll see what Patrick Fitzgerald, the U.S. attorney says, is they were so worried that Blagojevich was simply going to appoint someone to the Senate seat, they felt like they had to bring the case down right away to prevent a corrupt appointment to the U.S. Senate from taking place.

HARRIS: Jeffrey, let's get to the news conference.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

PATRICK FITZGERALD, U.S. ATTORNEY, NORTHERN DISTRICT OF ILLINOIS: Good morning.

Joining me is to my far right, Rob Grant the special agent in charge of the FBI office here in Chicago. To his left is Al Patton, the special agent in charge of the IRS criminal investigative division. And to his left is Tom Brady, the inspector in charge for the postal inspection service in Chicago. Behind me to my left, Carrie Hamilton, Reid Sharp and Chris assistant U.S. attorneys.

This is a sad day for government. It's a very sad day for Illinois government. Governor Blagojevich has taken us to a truly new low. Governor Blagojevich has been arrested in the middle of what we can only describe as a political corruption crime spree. We acted to stop that crime spree.

The most appalling conduct Governor Blagojevich engaged in according to the complaint filed today, unsealed today, is that he attempted to sell the Senate seat, the Senate seat he had the sole right under Illinois to appoint replacement of President-elect Obama. Let me take you back eight weeks ago to set the allegations in context. Back eight weeks ago we had the following environment.

It was a known investigation of the Blagojevich administration that had been going on for years involving allegations of pay to play conduct and corruption. There have been a recent trial of an associate of Governor Blagojevich in which allegations were aired, where people testified, that Governor Blagojevich was involved in corrupt conduct and there was an ethics in government act that was pending, that would go into effect January 1, 2009, that would bar certain contributions from people doing business with the state of Illinois. You might have thought in that environment that pay to play would slow down. The opposite happened. It sped up.

Governor Blagojevich and others were working feverishly to get as much money from contractors shaking then down, pay to play before the end of the year. I will give you one example. A month or so ago a $1.8 billion toll way project was announced. While that toll way project was being announced, Governor Blagojevich was privately seeking to have a person benefiting from that contract raise $100,000 in contributions, and privately the government said, I could have made a larger announcement but wanted to see how they would perform by the end of the year. If they don't perform, bleep them. That's a quote. And the word bleep was not the word he used.

After being aware that actually the pay to play scheme had taken up greater steam and greater urgency back eight weeks ago, after careful review, the decision was made that more extraordinary means of investigation needed to be used. After that point, a bug was placed in the campaign offices of Governor Blagojevich and a tap was placed on his home telephone. And that tap and that bug bore out what those allegations were.

I'll give you two examples set forth in the 76-page complaint. One involves Children's Memorial Hospital. A hospital that obviously takes care of children. At one point the governor awarded funding reimbursement funding to that hospital to the tune of $8 million. But he also indicated privately that what he wanted to get was a $50,000 personal contribution from the chief executive officer of that hospital. In the ensuing weeks, that contribution never came.

And Governor Blagojevich was intercepted on the telephone checking to see whether or not he could pull back the funding for Children's Memorial Hospital. A second example is legislation that is pending concerning horse racing. There is a bill that I believe sits on the governor's desk that would take money from casino revenues and divert a percentage of it to horse racing tracks.

While this was pending the interceptions show that the governor was told that one person who he was seeking to have raise $100,000 also was working with a person who was seeking that money to have a bill passed. The governor was told that the person who wanted that bill, from whom they wanted money, was told the following, he needed to get his contribution in and the quote was, "Look, there is a concern that there is going to be some skittishness if your bill gets signed because of timeliness of the commitment."

Then the person told the contributor the money "got to be in now." And when the governor was told this part of the conversation, his response was, good. Shortly thereafter the person was trying to get the contribution from the person who had the bill pending suggested that the governor call the person directly, that it would be better to get the call personally from the governor, "From a pressure point of view." And the governor agreed.

As we sit here now, as far as we know, that bill sits on the governor's desk, that $8 million in funding is still spending. In addition to the pay to play allegations which are described in greater detail in the complaint, we also were surprised to learn of an extortion attempt against the "Chicago Tribune" newspaper. The "Chicago Tribune" had not been kind to Governor Blagojevich, had written editorials that called for his impeachment and Governor Blagojevich and defendant Jonathan Harris, his chief of staff, schemed to send a message to the "Chicago Tribune" that the Tribune Company who wanted to sell its ball field, Wrigley Field, in order to complete a business venture, the price of doing so was to fire certain editors including one editor by name, and the governor's words, "fire all those bleeping people.

Get them the bleep out of there, and get us some editorial support." And the bleeps are not really bleeps. The defendant Harris tried to frame the message more subtly to get the point across to the "Tribune" that firing the editorial board members would be a good thing in terms of getting financing to allow the sale to go forward.

But the most cynical behavior in all this, the most appalling, is the fact that Governor Blagojevich tried to sell the appointment to the Senate seat vacated by President-elect Obama. The conduct would make Lincoln roll over in his grave. The governor's own words describing the Senate seat, "It's a bleeping valuable thing. You just don't give it away for nothing." Another quote, "I've got this thing and it's bleeping golden. I'm just not giving it up for bleeping nothing. I'm not going to do it. I can always use it. I can parachute me there." Those are his words. Not our characterization, in regards to bleeps.

The tapes reveal that Governor Blagojevich wanted a number of things in exchange for making the appointment to the Senate seat. An appointment of secretary of health and human services or an ambassadorship, an appointment to a private foundation, a higher paying job for his wife, or campaign contributions.

And at one point he proposed a three-way deal that a cushy union job would be given to him at a higher rate of pay to make money, in exchange he thought that the union might get benefits from the president-elect and therefore the president-elect might get the candidate of his choice. I should make clear that the complaint makes no allegations about the president-elect whatsoever. His conduct.

This part of the scheme lost steam when the person that the governor thought was the president-elect's choice of senator took herself out of the running. After the deal never happened this is the governor's reaction. "They're not willing to give me anything but appreciation. Bleep them." And again, the bleep is a redaction.

I should also talk about, that in another event, somebody else approached the governor, and the governor's understanding of this approach was that an exchange for appointment to the Senate seat he would receive campaign contributions, and the government's view of what was told to him through intermediaries was that, "We were approached pay to play. That you know he raised me 500 grand and the other guy would raise a million if I made him senator."

This is a conversation with a senator describing how he perceived a message that came through multiple hands. His concern was the offended, that he thought campaign contributions were being offered in exchange for a Senate seat. No. He was worried that the campaign contributions would actually be paid. He wasn't against the corrupt deal. He was against being stiffed in the corrupt deal. His quote was, he wanted the money "tangible, up front." He told someone who was his intermediary, "Some of the stuff's got to start happening now. Right now. We got to see it."

Just last week he was saying this to someone to make sure that the money was going to be up front and he said, "You got to be careful how you express that and assume everybody's listening. The whole world is listening. I would do it in person. I would not do it on the phone." That's the governor of Illinois.

After an article appeared in the Tribune last week indicating a belief that Mr. Blagojevich had been taped then a message was sent for him to undo contact with the intermediary on that campaign contribution deal. And finally we should also note that the government talked about him putting himself in the Senate seat for reasons not having to do with the better welfare of the citizens of Illinois.

He wanted to do it to avoid impeachment in the Illinois legislature for his conduct, he wanted to do it to have access to greater financial resources, if he were indicted. He wanted to do it to see if he could help his wife work as a lobbyist. He wanted to do it to remake his image to run for office in 2016, and he wanted to do it to see if he could generate speaking fees.

At the end of the day, the conduct we have before us is appalling. What I do want to note is that at the end of the day it's very, very important that how we proceed from here be the right way to proceed. We have a lot of information gained from a number of interviews and investigation over the years. We have a tremendous amount of information gained from the wiretap and the bugs that occurred over the last month and a half or so.

What we also know is that some of these schemes went pretty far and some did not go far at all. They had discussions about what they would do, who they would approach and how they would phrase it and we need to do the investigation, now that the investigation is overt to find out from other people what happened what they were told, how explicitly what they understood and what happened. That part of the investigation we intend to conduct responsibly.

We hope that people out there understand that this complaint only charges two individuals. These two individuals are presumed innocent, but we make no charges about any of the other people who are referenced in the complaint most not by name and people should not cast dispersions on people who are discussed with wiretap or bug tapes or conduct when other people are scheming to figure out how to approach them for different things.

We hope you'll bear that in mind and not pass dispersions on people for being named or being discussed. What we've learned or being interviewed. The other part is that I think this is a moment of truth for Illinois.

In all seriousness we have times when people decry corruption and yet here we have a situation where there appeared to be wide-ranging schemes, where people were seeking to make people pay contributions to get contracts, appointments or do other stuff.

The FBI and their sister agencies at Postal, IRS and the Department of Labor, have done a magnificent job. They will continue to work very, very hard, but what we really need is cooperation from people who are not in law enforcement. People outside who heard or saw things or were approached in ways that felt uncomfortable. If they felt uncomfortable and they think this is not how you run a government, they ought to come forward and give us that information.

Very, very important that we get that information so we can make the right decisions about where to proceed from here. I can tell you we've been conducting interviews during the day and were quite heartened to hear that there were a number of people out there who were appalled by this conduct who are willing to come forward and talk to us.

I encourage people to talk to us. We encourage people to work with us, to let us get to the bottom of what has happened here. We remind people that there's a lot we don't know and need to know. We remind people that there's an awful lot we do know and we'll be able to verify what people tell us and we ask that the press in particular recognize that we're not casting aspersions on people other than the two people we charged and bear that in mind and be responsible.

With that I'd like to turn the microphone over to Rob Grant, the special agent in charge. I want to thank the assistant U.S. attorneys who worked night and day in this case, especially want to thank the FBI agents who monitored the bug and wiretap and did all sorts of work over the last few months on top of the work they've done for years and their partners at IRS, postal and labor. Thank you.

ROBERT GRANT, FBI SPECIAL AGENT IN CHARGE: Thanks, Pat. I know you all have a lot of questions so I'm not going to make this long. Today certainly is a new low for the state of Illinois. A little over two years ago the U.S. attorney and myself stood up here and talked about the conviction of a former governor and hoped that conviction would send a clear signal to elected officials in Illinois that business as usual will no longer be tolerated.

That selling your office for personal gain is a practice of the past. It's obvious by this complaint and by today's charges that this current governor did not get that message. I got here four years ago. A lot of you were in the audience asking the question whether or not Illinois is the most corrupt state in the United States. And I didn't answer that question yes or no, and I can't answer that question today. I don't have 49 other states to compare it with. But I can tell you one thing. If it isn't the most corrupt state in the United States it's certainly one hell of a competitor.

This wiretap I can tell you from the FBI agents that participated in this wiretap investigation were thoroughly disgusted and revolted by what they heard. And I think even the most cynical agents in our office were shocked. I want to thank them. They put a lot of countless hours in, as did the prosecutors, a lot of weekends, a lot of holiday times away from their family. They worked tirelessly to bring this to a successful conclusion. To them goes the credit. Thanks.

QUESTION: Mr. Fitzgerald, was this done today in an effort to head off the appointment of someone to fill Barack Obama's Senate seat, was it so imminent that that's why you had to step in?

FITZGERALD: I would say that we decided that this required unusual measures and there were a lot of things going on that were imminent. There's a bill sitting on the desk that we think a person who is supporting that bill has been squeezed to give $100,000. And to let that bill be signed, to me, would be very, very troubling.

There's a hospital, Children's Memorial Hospital, believing that it's getting $8 million, but its CEO has not coughed up a campaign contribution and the thought that that money may get pulled back from the Children's Memorial Hospital is something that you cannot abide. There is an editor that they'd liked fired from the "Tribune" and I laid awake at night worrying whether I'd read in the paper in the morning that there were layoffs we'd find out that that person was laid off.

The complaint lies out in there, in fact, when there were layoffs, there were conversations to find out whether the editor they thought should be fired and he wasn't. And the governor was asking whether there would be more layoffs. The governor, in these modern times, the only one who's looking for more layoffs.

You take that, and what's going on and add it to the fact that we have a Senate seat that seemed to be as recently as days ago auctioned off to the highest bidder for campaign contributions and Governor Blagojevich's own words on the tape, on the bug, that set forth in the complaint talked about selling this like a sports agent. So - I'm just -- so we stepped in for a number of reasons. Basically as I said before, we're in the middle of a corruption crime spree and we wanted it to stop.

QUESTION: In your view --

FITZGERALD: OK. Can we -- can we just -- just one second. Let me say one thing. We're going to stay here as long as this is productive. You're not on a clock. We want to dispel any misperceptions. Don't feel like anyone's got to yell to get a question in.

QUESTION: You said twice (INAUDIBLE) -- recognized within the complaint. Does that mean that all of these people are beyond blame in any way? I mean, some of the things in the complaint point a very kind of a tacky finger at some people, their willingness to play and to pay to play is illegal, isn't the willingness to play also called (INAUDIBLE) charged here today?

FITZGERALD: What I'm trying to say is this, look, we never give, you know, I think anyone who is from Chicago knows, you've heard it a thousand times.

We don't give clean bills of health. I mean I've always been afraid of this, you can say, did Carlos or me, are we in trouble? I'm never going to say, no because that's just our practice, but I don't want people when I answer those questions to imply that someone is in trouble.

What I'm trying to do is explain caution about a complaint. When someone says something that's on tape, largely they're stuck with it. When someone says something on tape about someone else you usually want to do more investigation to verify what it is that happened. We're going to do that investigation and verify what it is that happened, what didn't happen, what the circumstances are.

There may be people who had no idea what was going on, had no idea they were being discussed. There may be other people who are involved in things they shouldn't have been involved in, and we're going to sort that out and we're going to see, you know, some things will be black and white and some things will be shades of gray.

What we wanted to make clear, is that our complaint sets forth charges against the governor and Mr. Harris and we put in there mindset, what they understand when they're steaming is important to the probable cause of what they were planning to do when they schemed. We'd like to see what schemes were carried out or not. Who made contributions or didn't. That sort of thing.

For that we don't draft complaints with that in mind and we want people to take what we say with more than a grain of salt. With a whole lot of salt. What we're saying, we're going to go out and we're going to do an investigation, if other people did wrong we'll deal with that.

QUESTION: Address one thing. If Blagojevich walks out of here today, if I'm mistaken about the constitution of Illinois, he will still be governor, he will still have the power to make the appointment to the Senate seat, he will still have the power whether or not he's going to sign the bill that you're concerned about. Also, would you address the fact -- and I know you referred to this.

Would you just address whether or not President-elect Obama was aware that any of these things were taking place --

FITZGERALD: OK. I'm not going to speak for what the president- elect was aware of. We make no allegations that he's aware of anything. That's as simply as I can put it. The first part, my understanding is that he is sitting governor of Illinois today, now, and that is not something we have any say in or control over.

So at the end of the day, he will be the sitting governor.

QUESTION: But you said you took this step -- you intervened because you were afraid something was going to happen with this Senate seat -- he still has the power to do that.

FITZGERALD: Yes. When there's a bunch of people scheming in private and they think no one's listening and no one's aware of it, they can do a heck of a lot more than when someone goes and basically raids the crime in plot and airs what's going on and people know what we're aware of, and if I were someone who wanted to pay to play, I think this would be about the worst time to try to make a cash contribution to someone to get something illegal, and there's a lot to be said for exposing this to the sunlight.

So this is a thorough prosecution that we will see through the court system. He is presumed innocent, but I was not going to wait until March or April or May to get it all nice and tidy, and then bring charges and then say, by the way, all this bad stuff happened because no one was aware of it back in December.

I think that would be irresponsible. So sometimes when there's ongoing criminal conduct, and this is a very different case than what we often see, we will expose the criminal conduct and bring charges to let people know we're on to it, and hopefully to put a stop to it.

QUESTION: Your views --

FITZGERALD: Carlos is next?

QUESTION: Should the governor on his own volition step aside while he fights these charges or -- should the Illinois state legislature move ahead with what is directed to do and impeach him? What are your views on both of those?

FITZGERALD: The office of the United States Attorney has no view. We are not entitled to any view and the view of what happens in the legislature of Illinois is not for us.

Paulus (ph). Paulus and then Carol.

QUESTION: Pat, given the scope and the brazenness of this alleged conduct of Governor Blagojevich, what does it say that this happened despite the cautionary tale of Joe Bryant (ph)?

FITZGERALD: I just -- I think it tells us, certainly, you know, I don't want to jump ahead of things. Again, the governor's presumed innocent. But if the charges set forth in the complaint are true, it is an appalling, appalling statement about what's been happening in Illinois government with Governor Blagojevich and his chief of staff. And what it tells us is that it's great to have the FBI and their colleagues working on this.

But we need people in the public to stand up and say, enough. And if people start hearing things that they feel is untoward or improper, that we need them to come forward. We're not going to end corruption in Illinois by arrests and indictments alone. I'm not minimizing the impact of charging people who commit crimes. What's going to make the difference is when people who are approached pay to play first say no and second report it.

Carol --

QUESTION: Are you able to tell us if in the "Tribune" scenario it was the "Tribune" who came to you and said we're being extorted or you that went to the "Tribune" with this revelation (ph)?

FITZGERALD: I don't -- that's not set forth in the complaint. What we can tell you is that that was conversations we intercepted on the governor's side speaking to Mr. Harris about what they wanted to do.

QUESTION: So it's conceivable then that the "Tribune," at some level of management, was considering -- forced to consider the governor's alleged extortion?

FITZGERALD: I'm not going to speak for the "Tribune" or what happened, what message got there. I think the complaint made clear that Governor Blagojevich, what he had in mind, was basically a get rid of the editors for this. The complaint also makes clear that Mr. Harris was one who wanted to be far more nuanced and basically Governor Blagojevich delegated to him, well, you know what you've got to do, be careful.

So I can't describe to you what conversations Mr. Harris had. And I think it would be dangerous to do so. It goes to my point of, it's one thing to attribute someone's own words to them. It would be another to attribute someone's own words to you.

And, you know, if I say something on tape, then I'm charged with what I said. If someone says something on tape about me, that's a different story. So I'm not going to speculate as to what, if any, conversations were had in the "Tribune" at this point. Not only would that be fair to them or anyone else when we're just describing his mind-set of what Governor Blagojevich wanted Mr. Harris to do. We're not describing what happened in the scheme beyond that. QUESTION: Mr. Fitzgerald, what does it say about Senator Durbin's letter to the president requesting commutation of George Ryan's sentence, which is only a year of the six-and-a-half year sentence that was imposed for the crimes that this office charged him with? And can the ...

FITZGERALD: And that's a different matter. I told you the office doesn't have a view on what happens in sort of Illinois government. We just don't have a stake in that.

To the extent the office has a view in the pardon. If we're asked by the Department of Justice or the White House to express that view, we will do so privately. But we're not going to -- it's inappropriate for me, on behalf of the office, to express a view where the power of pardon and commutation rests with the president and it's not our power and we do not make a practice of commenting to other branches of government what they ought to do unless asked by them in private.

Yes.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) this question. What does the law say about employment processes of U.S. (INAUDIBLE), you know, as it relates to the governor before his arrest. And then I have another question. After the employment process of a U.S. Senate, you know, change, now that you know what the governor's (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: And I'm not going to comment on any proposed legislative changes. I think we cite a statute. I can't tell you the numbers offhand. But the bottom line is, it's the sole call. It's entrusted to the sole digression of the governor of Illinois. The way the Constitution works, it leaves it for the states to figure out how a senator is replaced if they leave office for any reason. And Illinois has a statute that puts it to -- in the sole hands of the governor. And you can look up that statute, but I'm not going to comment on any proposed modifications.

Yes.

QUESTION: Pat, when (INAUDIBLE) get together and cut (INAUDIBLE) and certainly the point (ph) (INAUDIBLE). It's not uncommon for everybody to be self-interest with all the parties involved. Where is the line between cutting an all political deal and selling the United States Senate seat?

FITZGERALD: And I understand we're not -- you know, there's politics and there's crime. And sometimes I think when people get in trouble, they try and blur those lines. I think when you start having quid pro quos, whether it's a deal, if you give me this and I will give you that in exchange for rewards. If you tell someone -- if you read the complaint carefully, one of the conversations describes how the job that Governor Blagojevich wanted for himself with a union couldn't be just given to him by the union, because they already had people doing that job.

So when you say you want a job for four year, you want a salary of about $300,000 and you basically want to work on behalf of a union and cost them $1.2 million to basically add no value because people are already doing your job and part of that is an exchange, where in exchange if you don't get that job, no one's going to get appointed Senate seat , we're comfortable in the law that someone who schemes to do that has broken the law.

And we're not trying to criminalize people making political horse trades on policies or that sort of thing. But it is criminal when people are doing it for their personal enrichment and they're doing it in a way that is, in this case, clearly criminal.

Yes.

QUESTION: What kind of advice would you give to (INAUDIBLE) right now (INAUDIBLE) take a senatorial appointment from (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: I'm going to duck that one.

OK. Yes, sir?

QUESTION: We understand the governor's been taken by the FBI (INAUDIBLE) this morning.

FITZGERALD: Yes.

QUESTION: Was he interviewed there? And did he make any kind of a statement?

FITZGERALD: I'm not allowed to comment on whether anyone made a statement. But he was arrested and taken to the FBI.

QUESTION: Was he interviewed?

FITZGERALD: I don't think I . . .

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) interview?

FITZGERALD: I don't know if I can comment on whether we attempted to interview him, under the rules. I can't comment on that.

QUESTION: Could Mr. Grant describe the arrest?

FITZGERALD: OK.

Sorry?

QUESTION: Could Mr. Grant describe the arrest? There were no cameras there? No witnesses apparently. Can you explain how it happened?

GRANT: It occurred about 6:00 in the morning. And it was a phone call from me to the governor advising him that we had a warrant for his arrest. That there were two FBI agents outside his door. Asked him to open the door so we could do this as quietly without the media finding out about it, without waking the children. He was very cooperative. And that's it. QUESTION: Was he handcuffed?

GRANT: Yes, which is normal standard practice for us.

QUESTION: What did he say on the phone?

QUESTION: Does his family know?

GRANT: First question?

QUESTION: What did he say to you?

GRANT: Well, I woke him up. So the first thing was, was this a joke. But I'll leave the rest -- you know, he tried to make sure this was an honest call. So . . .

QUESTION: How about his family? Was his wife there when the arrest happened? Were his children? Did they wake up?

GRANT: They did not wake up that I know of. They were beginning to stir as we left. But they were not awakened and unaware. But his wife was awake.

QUESTION: There was a rumor that you visited his house within the past couple of weeks? Did you talk to him about this ongoing case?

GRANT: I can't . . .

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE).

GRANT: I can't comment on that.

QUESTION: How long were you at the house?

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) decision to (INAUDIBLE) actually arrest him rather than allow him to turn himself in? Trying to send a signal here?

GRANT: It was exactly what Pat said earlier. And that was, we have a lot of things we learned from the wiretap. A lot of things we learned from these microphones. There is a lot of investigation that still needs to be done. And there are critical interviews that we have to do and cooperation we need to get from different people.

So it wasn't about, as Pat said, tying this in a bow, waiting till spring, letting things be done to damaged the state of Illinois, damage the United States Senate, hurt people. It was about what is good for the investigation. What is good to find out the truth about what is going on. Because this goes beyond just the governor. It goes to other people who were involved in these schemes.

QUESTION: Mr. Fitzgerald, would you make clear just something about the timing here. When the "Tribune" ran its story a few days ago revealing that the governor was being tapped, would you explain -- and I think some of this is laid out in the complaint. Did (INAUDIBLE) take place -- did that essentially terminate your ability to listen . . .

FITZGERALD: Well, what I would say is, to back up and to the extent that there have been articles, I'm not confirming or denying the accuracy of the articles. You can compare them against what happened.

I will say this. As you guys know, you guy are in the information business of getting it and publishing it and we're in the information business of getting it and using it.

About eight weeks ago, before we had the bug install and before we had the wiretap up, we were contacted why the "Tribune" to comment or confirm or deny this story that they were going to run. And they ran that story. We thought we'd never had the opportunity to install the bug or place the telephone tap. And we made an urgent request for the "Tribune" not to publish that story.

That is a very rare thing for us to do and it's an even rarer thing for a newspaper to grant. We thought that the public interest required that the story not run. It was a very difficult conversation to have because we weren't allowed to describe what we doing. And I have to take my hat off that the "Tribune" withheld that story for a substantial period of time, which otherwise might have compromised the investigation from ever happening. And I think that's something that we should take note of.

And later, in a later point in time, that story did run. I believe it ran on Friday morning. And we were recording after the story ran that said, "Fed's Tape Blagojevich." And as set forth in a complaint, days before, or even a day before that story ran, Governor Blagojevich was intercepted telling his fund-raiser to have that conversation about wanting to see campaign contributions up front and telling him to talk as if the whole world is listening. Be careful. Do it in person. Not over the telephone.

And then after the story ran, we got a different conversation the next day, which basically says, undo what you just did. So it was clear that the reaction to the story was to think that they shouldn't proceed down that road. So to the extent that we had a number of weeks of interception, bugging the telephone.

I do think we ought to credit the "Chicago Tribune," that they agreed to that request. They didn't agree to all our requests, as you might imagine. They saw it differently than we did. But I appreciate that and respect what they did.

QUESTION: Patrick, you are always very careful to separate politics from law enforcement. But as you stand here and outline, the case has been described as shocking, disgusting, sickening, appalling, the worst ever. And Rod talking about Illinois (INAUDIBLE) serious contention. We now have a governor facing these charges and perhaps many, many more. He still has the power to appoint a U.S. Senate. And I'm wondering, even though it's a statutory provision, would the people of Illinois be well served by a quick, special session of the legislature to try to change the law? You're quick to make value judgments about good and bad behavior. How about weighing in on a manner of civic responsibility?

FITZGERALD: I think there's enough people here who can weigh in on their opinions about things. And the citizens can weigh in with their opinions. The U.S. attorneys office and the FBI do not have an opinion on what actions the legislature ought to take. The only opinion we'll express is that we hope that people with relevant information will come forward and cooperate with us.

QUESTION: Would (ph) you trust the governor of Illinois to make this appointment?

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: Yes. OK.

QUESTION: Pat, you're a citizen of the state of Illinois. You live here in Chicago. Do you trust this governor to make a good choice for the Senate, which is so important?

FITZGERALD: I am a citizen of Illinois and I do have opinions and beliefs. And what they are, are for me. Because when I speak, I speak on behalf of that seal. And that seal has no opinion on that matter.

In the back. Yes. And then you.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) can you just confirm (INAUDIBLE) investigation procedures (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: What we simply say is the investigation continues. We're not going to predict that other charges will or will not be filed.

Yes.

QUESTION: You spoke before about it's senator (INAUDIBLE) awareness of the senator, or President-elect Barack Obama knew about this so that they could say he had not been briefed. And can you also tell us if any phone calls were made to President-elect Obama that you intercepted or to Rahm Emanuel.

FITZGERALD: OK. I'm not going to go down anything that's not on the complaint. And what I simply said before is, I have enough trouble speaking for myself. I'm never going to try and speak in the voice of a president or a president-elect. So I simply pointed out that if you look at the complaint, there's no allegation that the president-elect -- there's no reference in the complaint to any conversations involving the president-elect or indicating that the president-elect was aware of it. And that's all I can say.

QUESTION: Pat, what will be your position -- what will be your position at this afternoon's hearing on detention or bond of the governor?

FITZGERALD: I don't expect there's going to be a contentious issue about bond, but we'll -- the magistrate judge, Nan Nolan, will be handling that proceeding. I think she can hear the specifics from us for the first time in court. But, you know . . .

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: I think Judge Nolan should hear what our position is for the first -- not through your excellent reporting but through our assistants telling him what it is.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: Sorry. And then next.

QUESTION: How would you characterize (ph) his alleged (INAUDIBLE). How would you characterize this?

FITZGERALD: I'm not going to go beyond saying that this -- the conduct we think is appalling. And I'm not going to do it compared to other case. But I just think it's very, very disturbing that we have these pay to play allegations going on for years. They picked up steam after a conviction. They picked up steam after an ethics and government act. And that it would go so far as to take the process by which the governor and his inner circle of advisers were choosing someone to take a seat in the United States Senate to represent Illinois.

QUESTION: Mr. Fitzgerald, you (INAUDIBLE) the governor Senator Kennedy number (ph) five (ph) took herself out of the running after this was made apparent to her. And we gather that it's (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: I'm not going to confirm or deny any names with numbers. I just can't.

Yes.

QUESTION: Could you name the governor's wife in this and he (ph) told her in the charges. Can you recount for us what she said and what her role was as is laid out in the charge?

FITZGERALD: Since I won't quote it accurately, there's a paragraph, I believe, that describes a situation in which she describes the interaction between the "Tribune," who owns the Cubs, and the editorial board. And she is part of the conversation with the governor and others making suggestions as to what should happen. There may be another reference or two in the complaint. And since I can't call them up with precision and I don't want to start reading the complaint in front of all of you, I think I'll just leave you to looking at the complaint and . . .

QUESTION: She says what the governor has -- charged with, why shouldn't she be charged if she's saying the same thing?

FITZGERALD: I'm not going to comment on anyone not charged. Simply say that there's a description of a conversation that took place in the complaint. And leave it at that.

QUESTION: Mr. Fitzgerald, did you have a conversation with the attorney general or somebody close to him either regarding the ability to get the wiretaps on the campaign office, on the home, or about the decision (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: I will say this. One, when it comes to wiretaps and bugs, I think the procedure we follow is well known. To file a wiretap, first of all, you need the FBI boss in Chicago, whose people are doing all the work, to be onboard. You need my office to be on board.

That gets you nowhere. You have to go down to Washington to Office of Enforcement Operations, OEO. And you've probably never heard of OEO and you'll see "CSI" on TV and the people in OEO do a fantastic job. They are the people who review, among other things, applications for wiretaps and bugs and they scrub them and they're very smart. And what we like about OEO is they know how to say yes and they know how to say no. And if they don't think it meets the standards, they'll tell you that and you won't get your wiretap or bug. If they think it does, they'll say yes. And if it needs fixing, they fix it.

And after it is approved in the office of OEO, it then goes up through the chain to high-ranking officials in the criminal division who sign off on it. And once it's been signed off at main justice, which says you're allowed to go see it, you're still nowhere because you can't put a bug or wiretap in without the approval of the chief judge in the district. So the chief judge takes an independent view and signs off on it.

We complied with all that, obviously. Beyond that, what I'll simply say is that no one -- the deputy attorney general, the FBI director or the attorney general aren't going to drop their coffee this morning to find out about this case for the first time. We've obviously kept them briefed. And -- but beyond that, we'll take responsibility for the decisions we made and leave it at that.

Yes.

QUESTION: I have a question, if you could also just clarify again, is discussing a quid pro quo where he, you know, acted criminally, was he actually carrying it out. I mean if he's just having conversations about eliminating a member of the editorial (INAUDIBLE) "Chicago Tribune" but nothing is actually carried out. How much of that is just someone trying to be a tough guy and how much of that is criminal (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: Well, you hit on two questions. One is a legal distinction. There is scheming or conspiracy to commit a crime and then there's a substantive crime. We've charged conspiracy, or scheming, in this complaint. One of the things we want to do with this investigation is to track out the different schemes and conspiracies to find out which ones were carried out or not and who might be involved in that or not. And that's something we haven't done yet. Now that we've gone overt, we'll be interviewing people and figuring that out.

But it is a crime in and of itself for people to scheme, to violate the law. That's called conspiracy. Then there's a substantive crime. As far as how much -- whether or not there are people acting like a tough guy or not, I mean, I don't want to pre-try the case. But if you lean on someone and lead them to believe their bill is not getting signed unless they give you the money, that is what acting like a tough guy is, it's a crime. And we can sort through it at any trial as to, you know, what was said, what was followed through. But it is a crime to conspire to shake someone down.

Yes.

QUESTION: Is the governor being held in a jail cell at the moment?

FITZGERALD: I believe he's probably somewhere in the building and he'll be presented in front of Judge Nolan.

QUESTION: Yesterday, when asking about the tape, the governor said that he invoked the names Nixon and Watergate. I mean, isn't it essentially what the government did here under the authority of a wiretap court order? The same thing? Didn't FBI agents have to break into the governor's office in order to plant these?

FITZGERALD: And I'm not going to compare FBI agents enforcing the law, trying to stop a senator from auctioning off a Senate seat or shutting $8 million out of a children's hospital from being pulled back or stopping people for greasing the skids to get a bill, or get someone fired with Nixon. It just -- it doesn't fly. What we did was lawful.

Yes.

QUESTION: Patrick. Sir, just to be (INAUDIBLE), you're not aware of any conversation that had took place between the governor and any member throughout (ph) Obama's transition team (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: And what I simply said is, you can read the complaint. I'm not going to sit here with a 76-page complaint and parse through it. That's all we're alleging. And I'm just -- I'm not going to start going down and saying, did anyone ever talk to anyone? You can read what we allege in the complaint. It's pretty detailed. Look in the 76 pages. And if you don't see it, it's not there.

Yes.

QUESTION: You talked about keeping your ears informed as to what was going on. Assuming that means the attorney general. In the briefing that President-elect Obama has had over the past weeks, with various government departments here, would it be possible for him to have been briefed on what was going on here with regard to this investigation?

FITZGERALD: I -- I'm not going to comment on that. I'm not the -- I'm not the briefer. I'm not at those meetings. But I would simply say that this was a very close hold in Washington and on a need to know basis. So I'm -- but I'm not going to -- I'm not the briefer, so I'm not going to represent what happens. But I'll leave it at that. QUESTION: Will you quantify the number of calls that you got.

FITZGERALD: OK. After Carol we'll go -- do a ring around the back.

QUESTION: You said that this morning you had already gotten calls that were heartening. Can you assign a number to that in terms of meaningful individuals that you're really searching for as this thing goes forward fast (ph)?

FITZGERALD: I'll just say that, you know, I'm not going to describe who it was or what it was. But, you know, someone reported in as to a conversation and I felt very, very happy. It was just sort of like, OK, good. You know, that one sort of brought it home. I've, you know, I've tried to speak at times about telling people that, you know, you look to the FBI to do a lot. You look to law enforcement to do a lot.

But the real effort to clean up corruption is going to start with the citizenry. People who are going to speak up and say something when it's wrong. And when you reach out to contact someone to say, do you know anything and they say, oh, boy do I. And let me tell you what I know and I remember details, that tells you that there are people out there who are pretty damn angry and are willing to step up to the plate and say, I'm not going to complain about it, I'm going to do something about it.

Now we'll go to the back. Yes.

QUESTION: Pat, one of the things I think that you (INAUDIBLE) look at and say, (INAUDIBLE) the governor's known he's been under investigation for several years and yet he was still engaged allegedly in this kind of activity. What does it say about the audacity of the governor? And (INAUDIBLE) he's under investigation and knows it?

FITZGERALD: I'll leave that for you to draw your own conclusions. It's a pretty audacious set of conversations set forth in the complaint in the circumstances.

In the back. Yes.

QUESTION: Which union did the governor solicit in exchange for the Senate appointment?

FITZGERALD: I think it's laid out in the complaint that it's -- that the person he discussed -- or the union he discussed getting a job with. And, again, I'm not going to describe more that is in the complaint. But the scheme that he had in mind with co-defendant Harris was a job with a coalition called Change to Win, which was affiliated with SEIU, which is a Service Employs International Union. And that was their, you know, their scheme to sell the seat in that three-way exchange. That never happened. That scheme did not come to fruition. He curses later that it didn't happen. But the one being discussed was the SEIU union.

Anyone else in the back? QUESTION: Pat, can I ask you . . .

FITZGERALD: Sorry, guys.

QUESTION: Pat, can you comment at all on this (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: I don't think it's the governor's office at the Thompson Center that they search warrant. Can we say where? It's at the office of deputy governor -- a deputy governor. And there's a search warrant being executed at the Friends of Blagojevich campaign headquarters.

One more. I want to make sure . . .

QUESTION: This investigation has been going on for years now, obviously. (INAUDIBLE) charged with (INAUDIBLE) what's been happening to the overlying investigation (INAUDIBLE) or not?

FITZGERALD: They will still be followed. If you look at the complaint, it cites back to wiretap conversations from the -- from the conversations we wiretapped way back in 2004 and we've been filing charges based upon that wiretap up until quite recently. And we will take all of the existing strands of the investigations that some of which you know about, some of which you don't, and we will take this and we will process it and figure out as much as we can. And what we'd really like to do is add a whole lot more information from the people out there who may know something.

Yes.

QUESTION: Pat, I haven't read through the entire complaint yet, but I'm wondering if there's an indication that the governor was trying to steer (ph) employment for himself and for his wife or stream (ph) an income because he thought he might get indicted? Because he thought he might not win (ph) in the election? What was he -- what was he thinking?

FITZGERALD: I think he -- there were quotes in there, he wants to make some money. He's got to think of his future. He did -- does talk about getting more income for himself, more income for his wife. He does talk about the prospect of appointing himself. That puts him in a better position if he's indicted. And I won't go beyond the complaint. But all three issues are discussed in the complaint.

I'll get the person who's either fixing a camera or raising a hand?

QUESTION: Can you help me with a matter of law -- a question of law.

FITZGERALD: OK.

QUESTION: If it's against the law to sell or trade a job or (INAUDIBLE), is it also against the law to try to buy one? In other words, if you were a politician offering the governor $500,000 in campaign cash in exchange for a Senate seat, (INAUDIBLE) that you might be willing to raise that kind of money for him, are you culpable or is that just horse trading?

FITZGERALD: I'm not -- I'm not going to . . .

QUESTION: I'm not mentioning names.

FITZGERALD: OK. And I'm not going to get into hypotheticals that you'll extract from the complaint and start going down that road. I will say we charged Govern Blagojevich and Mr. Harris. That's all we're saying. And we'll do a further investigation and we'll get behind what we can in different transactions. And I'm not going to prejudge any matter whatsoever.

QUESTION: I'm going to see (ph) three more.

FITZGERALD: Yes.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) were Natasha (ph) and Dave (INAUDIBLE) had their hands up first and I think that should be it.

FITZGERALD: OK. Rob.

QUESTION: I was just wondering, is -- I have (INAUDIBLE). Is (INAUDIBLE) going to be testifying in front of (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: I think there's a discussion of Mr. Rezko in a footnote somewhere in the complaint. And I couldn't tell you the footnote number. But if you look there, there's a distinct summary of his status in that footnote that I won't try to repeat out loud.

And, yes, who's next. Natasha.

QUESTION: That was my same question, (INAUDIBLE) but that you were checking it out and just trying to see what the status is.

FITZGERALD: And I think -- I'm not going to go beyond that footnote. We didn't rely upon his information in the complaint, but it doesn't give a definitive view and (ph) a status. It describes what his status is.

Yes.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE). That's it, folks.

FITZGERALD: OK. OK.

QUESTION: If a "Tribune" executive did agree to fire somebody on the editorial board in exchange for this, would it be criminal behavior? And can you characterize at all how (INAUDIBLE)?

FITZGERALD: I'm not going to say how far the "Tribune" plot went, other than the person who was identified as the person to be fired was not fired and still works there today. Beyond that, I'm not going to try and walk back where the scheme went from a pretty explicit scheme by Governor Blagojevich as described in the complaint, describing to Harris. And then Harris basically saying, I'm going to be more subtle about it. And Governor Blagojevich saying, well, do it the appropriate way.

We don't go beyond that. I'm not going to opine on if, what and when as to what happened once the conversation left the two people charged, Governor Blagojevich and Harris.

Yes.

QUESTION: He spoke very directly about why these indictment had to come now. Conversely, given the fact that all this is now out in the open, is it possible that anyone appointed to the Senate seat by Governor Blagojevich could do so and take office without there's being a cloud over his or her head?

FITZGERALD: And, I'm going to -- first of all, there's not an indictment. I realize it's a complaint. So I don't want people to understand it's an indictment. We've filed a criminal complaint. And I'm not going to get into where things stand in the Senate seat, other than that we've -- there's an ugly episode that we've aired. We've brought charges. We'll proceed. And the public discourse will go its way without our guidance.

QUESTION: During the (INAUDIBLE) you said this morning you'd like to see impeachment proceedings begin as early as January. And I understand that impeachment is something like a trial. Would you assist them in any sense with any of the evidence (INAUDIBLE).

FITZGERALD: I thought about a lot of things this morning. That one hasn't come up yet. And I'm not going to take it off the top of my head and swing. So we'll go from there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Thank you very much, folks. Court at 1:30.

HARRIS: My goodness. A deep breath here. An extraordinary news conference in Chicago.

Federal Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald taking the national spotlight once again with another huge case. Fitzgerald outlining the charges against Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich. Prosecutor Fitzgerald calling this a sad day for government, saying Governor Blagojevich was engaged in what amounted to a political corruption crime spree.

Let's talk about this amazing press conference for a bit here with our senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin and our Elaine Quijano with the Obama transition team in Chicago.

Jeffrey, let us start with you in the minutes that we have here before we turn things over to Kyra Phillips. Patrick Fitzgerald called the breath of this corruption staggering. What do you make of this?

TOOBIN: Well, it's hard to argue with when you consider that the governor, already under investigation in a widely publicized case, in the bribery case, the pay to play investigation, the Rezko case, knowing that, gets involved in two separate, new scams, each more breathtaking than the next, to fire newspaper writers in return for government aid to the "Tribune" company.

And then, most incredible of all, essentially to sell Barack Obama's seat in the United States Senate. Well, I think astounding, breathtaking, it's hard to come up with the adjective that is sufficiently astonishing.

HARRIS: He was this -- yes, he was describing the kind of reckless, brazen behavior that seemed to suggest that he thought he was above the law. He seemed to be acting -- again, these are allegations. We haven't heard from the defense. But Patrick Fitzgerald was describing a man who was acting like a manager who was trying to make numbers to get a bonus by the end of the year.

TOOBIN: And the thing that is so incredible about this complaint is that it is full of quotations from wiretaps and bugs that make Blagojevich look like a deranged criminal. You would not believe it if you did not have the direct quotes because you would say to yourself, come on, nobody is that corrupt. Nobody is that cynical. But the quotes are there. And we await Blagojevich's -- or his lawyer's explanation of why there's an incident purpose for all of this (ph).

HARRIS: Yes, exactly.

And, Jeff, we're going to turn you over to Kyra in just a moment. But I want to squeeze in a quick one for Elaine Quijano, with is with the Obama transition team in Chicago.

And, Elaine, no suggestion from Patrick Fitzgerald that Barack Obama had anything to do with what the prosecutor called this political corruption crime spree. But he is going to be asked questions about this. I'm wondering, has there been any response so far from team Obama about the criminal complaint?

QUIJANO: No response at all from team Obama. I can tell you that just a short time from now cameras are scheduled to go into a meeting -- a previously scheduled meeting -- that the president-elect is due to have with former Vice President Al Gore on the issue of energy and climate change. Whether or not the president-elect will answer a question remains to be seen. But cameras are scheduled to go in. That meeting is supposed to be taking place right now.

We expect that shortly the cameras will be allowed in there. Right now, though, no comment from Obama's transition office.

HARRIS: OK. Let me leave it there and let me turn things over to the capable hands of Kyra Phillips.

CNN NEWSROOM continues right now.