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Is Discovered Body Caylee Anthony?; Illinois Legislature Moves to Remove Blagojevich; Mexican "Playboy" Depicts Virgin Mary on Cover
Aired December 15, 2008 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Here is what is making news right now.
Is a Mexican version of "Playboy" mocking the Virgin Mary? Or is this cover just a coincidence?
Why are Iraqis taking to the streets to demonstrate over this incident? Where is the shoe-thrower? And what did he say?
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: But let me talk about the guy throwing the shoe.
SANCHEZ: What does it mean now for President Bush politically, his legacy? Did this surprise trip do more harm than good?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want to proceed carefully, methodically.
SANCHEZ: Prosecutors say her mother killed her. Could a recovered body send her to prison for the rest of her life?
And the Illinois legislature kicks into high gear to dump the governor.
What you're saying on Twitter, MySpace, on the air and on the Net. Lunchtime in San Bernardino and 2:00 p.m. in Saint Louis, this national conversation begins right now.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: And hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez here in the World Headquarters of CNN.
This is going to be an interesting newscast. One of the things that we're going to be doing is, do you remember Scott Ritter, Scott Ritter, weapons inspector, Scott Ritter, who, as a result of the Iraq invasion, was humiliated in many different ways?
He's going to be joining us in just a little bit. He's going to be giving his reaction to this video of George Bush and the shoe- throwing incident or (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE) as it's being called in some parts of the world.
The impact of this is more than just a feature, a joke to be told by newscasters and others around the world. And there's several reasons for that. Because of the impact that it may have in terms of foreign affairs for the United States, if nothing else.
Let me show you some video. Here's what's going on in parts of Iraq. There are actual demonstrations that have been taking place in places like Sadr City, where as a result of this shoe-throwing incident by this reporter, he's being called a hero.
His television network, Al-Baghdadia, is demanding that he be released. There is consideration that he will be actually charged with assault, not for throwing the shoe at President Bush, but for throwing the shoe near al-Maliki, strangely enough.
These are just some of the protests. That's that effigy of George Bush that has been taking place. And obviously it's the shoes that have so much import in this story.
One other thing, Dan. Have you got the picture of the reporter? His name is Muntazer al-Zaidi. He's a reporter, again -- there he is -- for the Al-Baghdadia network. It's based in Egypt, but it's owned by Iraqis, interestingly enough.
Let's do this. Before we do anything else, let's take you to Baghdad. That's where Michael Ware has been following this story. He's joining us now with the very latest on this.
Take us back to when this happened and what the reaction has been there since, Michael, if you would.
MICHAEL WARE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you can see clearly from this extraordinary film that is almost certainly going to become an icon of the war in Iraq what happened.
There is a press conference. President Bush arrives without any warning. He's going through all these sort of formal meetings, a sort of show and tell, you know, dog and pony show, ceremony for the signing of the agreement.
And in the middle of the press conference, this guy just stands up, no warning, and starts hurling the shoes at President Bush's head. Now, today in Iraq, it's the morning after the night before, because this happened overnight in Iraqi time.
When the people woke up here, you know, this was clearly the talk of the town. And opinions divided pretty much equally straight down the middle. Some people criticized this Iraqi journalist for doing this. They say that it's not about throwing it at President Bush. It's about doing it in front of Maliki.
President Bush is Maliki's guest. You embarrassed the man. And it's impolite. Others say President Bush deserves this and more. Across the board, everyone agrees the guy shouldn't go to jail and that whether you approve of his etiquette or not, you understand why he did it.
So, that's the reaction here on the ground, Rick.
SANCHEZ: It's amazing, and especially when you consider that this guy is all but being made a hero at this point. And it may be a bad move to keep him behind bars.
Octavia Nasr is joining us now. She's our Arab analyst.
Before we do anything else, I want the viewers to see -- because, you know, as I mentioned earlier, and I think those of you at home get this, this is not just a Jeanne Moos story that you are going to see here on CNN. This has real serious political and foreign affairs implications.
Let's watch this thing in real time together. I will shut up. We will all shut up and we will let you listen to it as it happens. And then I want you to break it down for us and tell us what is actually being said, all right, as best you can. Let's run it, Dan.
SANCHEZ: All right, what is he saying?
OCTAVIA NASR, CNN SENIOR EDITOR FOR ARAB AFFAIRS: Well, first of all, when he stood up, he said, this is a farewell. And he threw the first shoe. Basically...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: A farewell, as in goodbye, President Bush? Yes.
NASR: As in goodbye, because President Bush was basically bidding farewell to the Iraqis in this press conference.
SANCHEZ: Right.
NASR: He had an opening remark. He said all the things he wanted to say. He talked about the security agreement, and he said, in Arabic, (SPEAKING ARABIC) which means thank you very much.
This is when the man stood up and says, this is a farewell. He threw the first shoe. As he was throwing the second shoe, he was calling him, "you dog." In the Arab world, throwing a shoe at someone is very impolite. It's very rude.
SANCHEZ: It's the ultimate act of contempt and/or repudiation, right?
NASR: Really. It's a no-no. You don't do that. You don't just pick up your shoe and throw it at anyone. It's just low.
SANCHEZ: So, it's done with a purpose, though?
NASR: It's done with a purpose. And also he calls him "you dog." So, basically, it's not just the gesture, but it's also the rhetoric that this is a farewell, and that he spoke in the name of the Iraqi people. He said the Iraqi people that you killed. That's what he was saying when he was on the floor.
He was still trying to say something as the security officers were trying to pin him down.
SANCHEZ: So the imagery that we're now seeing, with all these protests, we're told most of them are taking place in Sadr City. But is this something that would only take place in Sadr City or does it represent the thoughts of many Iraqis?
NASR: It represents the thoughts of many Iraqis. There's no doubt about that, and also Arabs, not just Iraqis.
But also what represents the thoughts of many Iraqis and Arabs is that this is not an act that you do. It's not an act that you commit. You don't just stand up in the middle of a press conference and throw a shoe at a guest of your prime minister in the presence of the prime minister.
SANCHEZ: Not to mention the fact that, as a journalist, he's really undermining our responsibilities.
NASR: And that's why the Association of Iraqi Journalists issued a very strong saying, this man and his station should apologize.
This is not something that reflects well on the Iraqi profession of journalism. And they want him to apologize.
But really what Michael is saying people are right in the middle on this. You have people cheering him on, people saying, you know, he should have done more. But the -- most people will say what he did is wrong.
SANCHEZ: Interesting. Stay with us.
We want to follow up on this story as we look into it and the effect that it's going to have on the Bush administration now and the Bush legacy in the future. After all, he went there to try and say, this is the one thing that's worked. Maybe this is the one thing I want to be remembered for.
Will that image now be what he's remembered for? That and a whole lot more, including this story. Illinois lawmakers start the impeachment committee proceedings against their governor. We're all over that, as you might imagine.
And then take a look at this picture. Tell me if this looks like the Virgin Mary to you. The folks who put out the magazine say, no, no intention.
I want to know what you think. Stay with us. That and a lot more -- when we come back. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez here in the World Headquarters of CNN.
We are getting a lot of comments by the way from you on MySpace and Facebook and on Twitter about what's going on with this shoe- throwing incident against the president of the United States. We are going to get to those in just a minute.
But something else I have just been handed moments ago during the break, one of my producers came over and handed me a piece of paper that essentially says that Barack Obama has now issued a statement regarding remember he said that he was going to check on his staff to see if anybody had had any kind of contact with the governor's office, Governor Blagojevich, Rod Blagojevich?
Well, guess what. He's put out a statement that makes it pretty definitive. But yet parts of the statement don't exactly give us the answer that I think some people are looking for. I will get to that in just a minute.
I want to finish up with Octavia Nasr on this issue.
And we want to watch this tape once again. When he gets up and he starts to throw the shoe, Muntazer al-Zaidi, what is the reaction from the other journalists in the room?
NASR: Basically, you saw that people were shocked. That's the first thing.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Right. What do they say to him, though?
NASR: Actually, it was so fast. It all happened so fast. You see that. We don't know that this is a journalist or a security officer in civilian clothes. We're not sure.
But basically they tried to stop him. So, that's the reaction. People are shocked.
SANCHEZ: What did the security guys say to him as they approached him? Was there any language there?
NASR: Good point. Good point.
Yes. First of all, you hear, who is this guy? Who is this guy? So they don't know. They're trying to identify who the guy is. You see the hand on the camera and you hear the word camera about four times by my count. They're calling for them to shut off the cameras, which is what's shocking so many people in the Arab world, saying, wait a minute, didn't we talk about democracy in Iraq? Isn't this the new Iraq? What are you doing shutting off the cameras?
As a matter of fact, people inside the room are saying that it was the Americans, the U.S. security officers telling them, no, no, don't shut off anything. Let's just keep things as they are.
SANCHEZ: Here's what's curious. Al-Baghdadia is saying that this is a freedom of speech issue and they want their guy released, while at the same time, you told me moments ago that some in the journalistic community throughout the Arab world are saying they repudiate what he did by essentially making other journalists look bad. Which is it?
NASR: Well, both. You have to see it in both ways. I mean, it's one thing to stand up and throw your shoe at people. It's a no-no. It's unacceptable. It's bad for the country, for the image of the country, image of journalists there. But, at the same time, they say, he didn't commit a crime. What did he do? He disrupted a press conference.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Is this guy going to be seen as a hero of sorts? And if they keep him in prison for a long time, will he become more of a martyr?
NASR: He's already seen as a hero.
Whether you agree with what he did or not, he's seen as someone who stood up to the president of the United States and dared to throw his shoe. It takes a lot of guts to do that. It's not something that you do on a daily basis. It's like spitting at someone.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Let me ask you this question, then. Is this as bad a thing, short of harming him, which obviously no one would want, even his critics, is this as bad a thing as you can do to an official from the Western world?
NASR: Or any official.
SANCHEZ: Really?
NASR: Really, the act itself is not something -- I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't appreciate anyone doing that.
What people are worried about right now is that every press conference, you might have someone who decides to take off his shoe and throw it at someone, just because they don't like what they're saying.
SANCHEZ: But isn't it reserved for only -- and I'm not saying this fits George Bush -- but the worst of the worst?
NASR: It is reserved for the worst of the worst, but it's again something that you don't do in this kind of setting. And people now are concerned that there is a precedent. This man is seen as a hero. He's hailed as a national hero.
Other people might like the attention and say, you know what, I don't like what you're saying. Here's a shoe in your face.
SANCHEZ: But does it set George Bush back even more than some would argue he already was set back?
NASR: Maybe. But also there are people who are saying, you know, this might be the best thing to happen to Bush, because people are done. They saw him humiliated. They saw him dodge a shoe and a second shoe, and it's over. Move on. SANCHEZ: That's interesting. That's interesting.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Your use of the word humiliated, though, is an interesting one there. Go ahead.
NASR: It's absolutely how they see it on Arab media, that that's it. The man was humiliated. When you throw a shoe at someone, it's humiliation.
SANCHEZ: You can't get any worse than that?
NASR: No. But also when you think about the images, when you think about the fall of Baghdad, what do you think of? You think of the statues of Saddam Hussein on the ground.
SANCHEZ: And people hitting them and hitting with their shoes.
NASR: And now you watch it on Arab media, you watch in on the newspapers. You're seeing that picture. And this is going to be -- at least that's what people are predicting, that this is going to be the image of the Bush legacy in Iraq. It will be ending this way.
SANCHEZ: That's fascinating.
You remember Scott Ritter?
NASR: Yes.
SANCHEZ: Scott Ritter is going to be joining us in just a little bit. Scott Ritter was in many ways or some would argue humiliated as well when he said many things about the invasion of Iraq. He's going to join us in just a little bit. He's going to go through this video as well and we will get his reaction.
And then police -- do we have this video? Let's go to that video we have out of central Florida. Police are searching in central Florida for even more clues and now we're being told that some bones may have been found that may belong to Caylee Anthony. That story as well. Stay with us. We have got so much coming your way.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: And we welcome you back with breaking news.
I told you moments ago that we would release this piece of information. Essentially, it's a memo that's being put out by the administration of president-elect Barack Obama regarding his associations or his staff's associations with Governor Blagojevich.
Brianna Keilar is joining us now from Washington to bring us up to date.
What does the memo say? What's its import? BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, basically, you know, you will recall, Rick, that on Thursday president-elect Obama said that there would basically be this internal investigation and that in the next few days he would put that information about conversations between his staff and the governor's staff about his replacement as U.S. senator, he would put that information out to the media.
Well, we just got this statement from a spokesman for the transition saying that this review is ready for release and that it reaffirmed public statements of Obama that he had no contact with the governor or his staff and that there was no inappropriate contact between the two staffs.
But it also says that the U.S. attorney's office has requested that the public release of this transition review, as they put it here, be put off until the week of December 22, so next week, so that it doesn't get in the way of the investigation of Governor Rod Blagojevich.
President-elect Obama, according to this statement, has put Gregory Craig, the counsel to the transition, in touch with the U.S. attorney's office. There's been full cooperation and disclosure, according to the transition.
But, you know, Rick, this Blagojevich scandal has been something that has -- it's created quite a distraction for president-elect Obama and it's going to continue to, of course, as these questions remain, even though you hear the...
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: I got a question right now. The use of the word inappropriate discussions. The president-elect's staff was not involved in inappropriate discussions, which would lead me to believe or ask as a journalist, does that imply that they did have discussions, but these discussions are, according to you, president- elect Obama, not inappropriate?
You know, it's just -- it's just an interesting part. It almost seems with this story, Brianna, and these happen all the time, that every time you cross one hurdle, there's still another one on the other side, right?
SANCHEZ: Well, but what we have heard from so many people, and that's not to say this doesn't create a question mark or that a question mark remains, because it does, because, as you said, they're saying no inappropriate communications.
But, at the same time, a lot of people have pointed out it wouldn't be unusual or even inappropriate for president-elect Obama's staff to be in touch with Governor Blagojevich's staff about Obama's replacement in the Senate, that this would be quite usual, that he would, you know, have an interest, obviously, and have some input, that his staff would have some input, Rick.
SANCHEZ: Right. Oh, of course not. Of course not. And he certainly would be entitled to have that input. I'm just looking at the word -- we didn't have -- OK, we had discussions, but they weren't inappropriate discussions, which then leads somebody to come back and say, OK, can you tell us what the discussions were like, so then we can write in our newspapers or here at CNN appropriateness or not? I will tell you, it just continues.
Brianna Keilar, hey, thanks so much for bringing us up to date on that. We certainly appreciate it.
KEILAR: You're welcome.
SANCHEZ: By the way, when we come back, we have been telling you the story of what's going on not only with Blagojevich, but this new controversy taking place in central Florida. It's the body of a little girl and still the DNA is not back to confirm whether or not this skeletal remains is here. More information on that today, and we're talking obviously about Caylee Anthony. And we will bring it to you on the other side.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: And I welcome you back. I'm Rick Sanchez.
Let me share with you what you're saying about this newscast both on MySpace and then we will go to Twitter.
Johnny, let's start off with a MySpace comment.
"One shoe-throwing incident can't possibly overshadow the entire Bush presidency. In many ways, it's a miracle that things like this don't happen on a daily basis."
All right, let's flip the camera and let's get a Twitter response here. "Shoe-throwing incident will go down in American history as a defining moment in the Bush presidency. Schools will teach it."
Let's bring in somebody else now who has probably got a lot to say about this in many ways. He is Scott Ritter. As you may recall, he is a former U.N. weapons inspector. In fact, he was the chief U.N. weapons inspector at one time.
Mr. Ritter, thanks so much for being with us, sir.
SCOTT RITTER, FORMER CHIEF U.N. WEAPONS INSPECTOR IN IRAQ: Oh, thanks for having me.
SANCHEZ: You were against the invasion. You said there weren't nukes. You said that we likely would not find chemical weapons. You said we shouldn't go in. You said we should give the Iraqi inspectors more time. You said that there was probably not going to be a tie to al Qaeda.
And you were humiliated in many ways, some would argue by the administration, some would even argue by the media. Where are you now?
RITTER: Well, it's a strange -- strange use of the word humiliation.
I don't know how you can be humiliated for being right. I think those who threw stones at me are the ones who suffered humiliation. But, be that as it may, the bottom line is, I think I have been on the right side of history, you know, absolutely throughout this entire debacle that we call the war in Iraq.
SANCHEZ: Take us back now, because I think even journalists like myself who were in many ways wrong in what we did would want to know what your perspective is. And I would like to be big enough to ask you, where did we as a nation go wrong as we embarked on this plan to occupy Iraq?
RITTER: I think there was a lot of groupthink going on.
First of all, let's start off with the fact that not everybody was a chief weapons inspector in Iraq, so not everybody was privy to the level of detail that I had. And they had to go with, you know, the perceptions that they draw from the data that was available.
And I do believe that the media oversimplified the data and had a strong pro-administration bias in presenting the data. Nobody wanted to be seen as being on the side of Saddam. And, of course, when you have a president that says you're either with me or against me, anybody who dared raise their hand and say, excuse me, got a question for you, you're suddenly against the question, which makes you for Saddam.
So, I think there was this groupthink mentality that led us down the path of accepting at face value without question anything the administration said about Iraq, about Saddam Hussein.
And what I think we found out, in a democratic society, there is an inherent obligation on the part of not just the media, but indeed all of the citizens, to ask the questions, because that is perhaps the most patriotic thing we can do. Maybe this war has taught us a big lesson in patriotism.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: But maybe -- maybe it was your fault. Maybe you were too strident in the way that you made your presentation. Maybe you couldn't get people -- have you ever thought about this -- "I, Scott Ritter, failed to get my message out there, and maybe I did something wrong"?
And when you think about that, what kind of conclusions do you come up with?
RITTER: Well, of course. Somebody -- everybody has to go through some -- a period of self-criticism.
And, you know, I was equipped with the truth. I was equipped with the facts. And, for whatever reason, I was unable to translate the truth into a medium that was digestible by the media or the American people. But it's a little bit much to say that the man armed with the truth is solely responsible for the failure of the American people and the media to stand up and do the right thing. While I might have been strident, I was strident in defense of the truth.
SANCHEZ: One final thing. As you look at this video, this shoe- throwing incident that everyone seems to be talking about and that could possibly have an impact, as you heard from our Arab affairs correspondent report to us moments ago, what do crow think?
RITTER: Look, this is a tempest in a teapot. It was an unfortunate incident. It's a regretful incident.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: Scott, do you feel bad for the guy?
RITTER: For President Bush?
SANCHEZ: Yes, sir.
RITTER: Absolutely. Absolutely. Look, no -- he's the commander in chief. He's our president. And he was assaulted.
This should never have been allowed to happen. I'm against his policies. I'm against what he's done, but the bottom line is, I don't want our president to be, you know, to have an incident like this occur. I think it's a tempest in a teapot. I think this will be forgotten. We got a new president coming in, new policies, and the war in Iraq is not going away.
This is something that we won't be talking about in a month's time.
SANCHEZ: Scott Ritter, we will have you back. Thanks so much for joining us. We appreciate it.
RITTER: Thank you.
SANCHEZ: Another side of the story.
Ron Christie, he is a former policy adviser for Bush and Cheney. And he's good enough to join us now as well.
Mr. Christie, do you believe those who say it may have been a mistake for President Bush to go there to Iraq, given what happened with this incident, because it might hurt him, his administration, and his legacy?
RON CHRISTIE, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT BUSH: No, I don't pink.
I think, Rick, it was a very important opportunity for the president to go over to meet with Prime Minister Maliki, to sign a very important security and stabilization agreement, and, of course, to meet with our troops, our brave men and women, not only in Iraq, but also in Afghanistan.
SANCHEZ: But if there are people on the streets now essentially calling the guy who threw a shoe at him a hero, what does that say for America's foreign policy and what does it say about this president? How do you -- how do you -- how do you not see the elephant in the room?
CHRISTIE: Rick, I think, eight years ago, if you had a reporter who had taken off their shoe and flung that shoe at Saddam Hussein, I think he would be in a far worse place than in jail right now.
I think it also says a lot about the stability on the ground in Iraq, that, in fact, you have people who are out, who are exercising their new Constitutional rights of freedom of speech and expression. I don't agree with their speech or their expressions about President Bush. But it shows a remarkable transformation of the country, where it was eight years ago, when it was run by a brutal dictator, and where we are today, where there is democracy that is flourishing in Iraq. I think it is a remarkable statement.
SANCHEZ: Ron Christie, foreign policy adviser for Bush and Cheney.
My thanks to you, sir, for taking time to talk to us. We certainly appreciate it.
When we come back, several issues still to talk about. Among those, why is it that the publisher of "Playboy Magazine" in Mexico is saying that this picture does not in any way represent a religious figure, or, more specifically, the Virgin Mary? Do you buy it?
Stay with us. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.
House Speaker Mike Madigan took to the air waves today after having several meetings -- by the way, he's the House speaker of the assembly in Illinois. He's the top law maker there, one of the top law makers. And he announced that impeachment proceedings, in the form of a committee that has now been formed, will begin against Governor Rod Blagojevich in that state. It's an important statement, because it kind of sets the wheels in motion against Rod Blagojevich.
Here's what I want to do now. I want to show you what happened with the governor last night when he was, as some might say, staked out by a reporter there. Watch this and then we'll come back on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, how are you?
GOV. ROD BLAGOJEVICH (D), ILLINOIS: How are you? Good to see you. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Merry Christmas.
How are you?
BLAGOJEVICH: Govern, I'm the only one here. Can you say something to us? Do you have a word? The longer you say nothing, the longer people --
BLAGOJEVICH: There will be an appropriate time to talk about this. But let me just wish everybody happy holidays and things will work out just fine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The rumor is you intend to resign. Is that true or false?
BLAGOJEVICH: I think you should all have a great holiday season.
Sam, I'll see you my friend. I'll see you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: Lynn Sweet writes for the "Chicago Sun Times." She's good enough to join us. That newspaper has broken a bevy of stories on this particular incident.
Why are lawmakers doing this today? What's the import here?
LYNN SWEET, "CHICAGO SUN TIMES": They're doing it now because it's clear that Governor Blagojevich has no intention of resigning immediately, and they have to get the ball rolling. There's a few tracts here, Rick. The Supreme Court has a petition in front of them from the Illinois attorney general to remove Blagojevich from office, either temporarily or another way, if they could find it. But they have to -- they have not acted. The brief was put in last week.
Then you have the impeachment ball rolling. I think right now though, Blagojevich is fairly immune from any calls for him to step down immediately.
SANCHEZ: You know what's interesting, why should he resign? This is a guy that has told us, if we've learned nothing else from listening to those transcripts, it's that this is a guy who knows how to play the game. I've got something. Why should I give it up? And why should he resign? That's the one thing he's still holding on to, right?
SWEET: Every the sunny optimist, that's Rod Blagojevich, something will come up. But the only leverage he has right now in talking to the prosecutors is his office. If he gives it up right now, he loses whatever leverage. He still gets a paycheck. He still has staff. He has a car driving him around. So I think there is, from his point of view, little -- he's already in a mess. It doesn't make the mess go away for him by stepping down. And if he does talk to prosecutors, it gives him something to give up.
I think he knows where he's headed. It just isn't time yet. SANCHEZ: Let me read something to you. This is a memo that came into us just a little while ago from President-Elect Barack Obama's staff: "the review affirmed the public statements" -- we want to shoot this, Johnny, over the shoulder -- "the review affirmed the public statements of the president-elect that he had no contact with the governor or his staff and that the president-elect's staff was not involved in inappropriate discussions."
You notice the way I highlighted the word inappropriate. What does that tell you?
SWEET: Well, it tells me -- that was a press release they just put out a few minutes ago. It tells me that the presidential team understands that there were communications, but they weren't inappropriate. We're just trying to fill in the dots here right now, who said what when. And everybody who might have talked to the governor doesn't necessarily -- or probably did not break any law.
SANCHEZ: Right.
SWEET: So what you do want to know is what were the communications and who made them? Now, the other thing in that statement, it also says that the -- this internal report that President-Elect Obama said last week would be done and released within days now is delayed until the week of December 22nd --
SANCHEZ: Right.
SWEET: -- at the request of U.S. Attorney Fitzgerald. That also tells me it will happen -- released conveniently when Obama probably is on vacation in Hawaii.
SANCHEZ: Good work on this story. Lynn Sweet from the "Chicago Sun Times."
Joining us now is Mike Madigan. He is the speaker of the House. He's the one who told us about this -- this committee that has been set up to impeach the governor.
Thanks so much, Mr. Speaker, for joining us.
How long is this going to take? It sounds like, when you were describing it, a process that's going to go on for quite some time.
REP. MIKE MADIGAN, ILLINOIS STATE ASSEMBLY SPEAKER: I think I heard your question to be how long will this take. We don't know. Today, we've announced the formation of a committee of inquiry concerning the possible impeachment of Governor Blagojevich. I've directed that committee to move with all due speed, providing for the governor to be accorded his rights under the federal and state Constitution of due process, equal protection under the law, right to confront witnesses and cross examine those witnesses.
For our part, without regard to the governor, we will move ahead with all due speed. SANCHEZ: How can you -- how can you take this guy down unless the Feds share their information with you? And will they? Or have you asked them to?
MADIGAN: Well, we have available the FBI affidavit, which is 76 pages long. We have another list of what we consider to be abuses of power by Governor Blagojevich during the time that he's been the governor of the state of Illinois, instances where he has ignored directives of the legislature, instances where he has taken action, including the spending of money, without any authority, any appropriation authority from the legislature.
So our plan is to move forward with what is made available from the federal government. In addition, instances of abuse of power that we are aware of that happened right here in the Capitol building in Springfield.
SANCHEZ: Why is it then taking, sir, the Feds, law enforcement agents, to come in and do the work that I'm now hearing you and so many other Chicago politicos say they kind of knew all along? Why didn't anybody act before this?
MADIGAN: For one thing, we didn't have access to wiretapping authority from the federal judge, because nobody came and told us about it. Apparently, somebody went to the US attorney's office and told them what Governor Blagojevich was attempting to do. They had the ability to get an order from Judge Holderman in the Chicago District Court authorizing the wiretap and the bug. So they're better equipped than we are in the legislature.
SANCHEZ: House Speaker Mike Madigan, good enough to talk to us today after making that important announcement today about the beginning of what possibly will be impeachment proceedings against this governor.
Thanks again, sir.
When we come back, the latest on Caylee Anthony in central Florida. New reports that other bones may have been found in the area, and your comments. We'll be right back.
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SANCHEZ: All right. Let's start with this: WFTV in Central Florida is reporting that more bones have been found near the site where the skull had been found just last week in the Caylee Anthony investigation. We should tell you, for those of you following the story, that that site is right next to the grandparents' house of Caylee Anthony. So it gets even more and more interesting.
Two guests, Ashleigh Banfield, she's from truTV, as you know, and Mike Brooks, our law enforcement analyst. Sounds like a country western team, Brooks and Banfield.
Ashleigh, let me begin with you, if we possibly can. Bring us up to date. Where are we on this today? ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, TRUTV ANCHOR: I would not be surprised if what WFTV is reporting is accurate, because, as you know Rick, it could be up to six months that those bones have been in that area, underwater and exposed to the elements. If there were any animal activity in the area, often times that scatters human remains. There are all sorts of reasons why that might be. But, let me also say that the sheriff is being very cagey down there, and not releasing much information at all. That's quite a find if WFTV was able to glean that kind of information.
SANCHEZ: If it's her -- and we now probably could know officially within the next couple of days. All indications are it very well may be.
How does it change this case? Why is it so dramatic? What does it do that we don't already know, Mike?
MIKE BROOKS, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: If they can prove that there was an aggravating circumstance in her murder, then they can maybe put the death penalty back on the table. Let me talk more about the evidence that Ashleigh was just talking about. There were about ten to 12 more bones found. Some of those were very small. They were found during a sifting operation this past Saturday and Sunday by the FBI's Evidence Response Team, who has come with Orange County sheriffs and also the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
They expect to be on this scene, Rick, until at least Wednesday. This is still an active crime scene right now.
SANCHEZ: Is there is an impact -- if this thing is confirmed, Ashleigh, and we come out -- FBI guys up in Washington and Quantico come back and say, yes, these are her bones, how in your view does it change this case? Psychologically for the people there of for the lawyers themselves?
BANFIELD: All of the above. It completely changes the dynamic of a case, Rick, when you go into court and you have a body as evidence. If you don't have a body, it's extraordinarily difficult for a jury to get their minds around the fact that this child isn't maybe still missing. That's called reasonable doubt.
If you can bring a body to the table, and, as Mike just said, if you can examine that body for tool marks, for breakages, for abuse, for anything that might, as Mike said, show aggravating factors, you can bring death penalty back. Even though that 45-day window closed and the prosecutors decided not to seek it, they can go back to the judge and they can say, judge, we have found in forensic evidence that this child's neck was broken or that there was a tool mark on her head showing beating or a weapon. They can bring it back.
SANCHEZ: As I hear both of you speak, I'm thinking what it does is it tells the story of her death. And that's essentially what prosecutors have to do in a case like this. Guys, we're out of time. Thanks so much. The time of Brooks and Banfield, we thank you for being with us. Good stuff. When we come back, did you even know that Mexico had a "Playboy Magazine"? We were surprised to find out this morning and the further surprise was that they're involved or embroiled in a very big controversy right now over that picture. That's what we're talking about next. Stay with us.
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SANCHEZ: And I welcome you back. Go ahead and, if you would, put this VO back up of this "Playboy Magazine" out of Mexico. You see that right there?
While you look at that picture, let me read you what they're saying on Facebook.
This is Faith Calisa. She wrote to us just moments ago from Dallas. She says "Even an atheist would agree that image is the Virgin Mary. Come on. We're not idiots."
And then Haja Marie is watching us as well and she says, "How insulting. I didn't know the Virgin Mary was a Playmate."
Now, flip that will camera around, Johnny, if you would. Let's go to this one. This is on Twitter. "The December cover of Playboy is not obscene. It's a cry for publicity. Congrats, Playboy, it worked."
Interesting perspectives on this story. Glenda Umana has one as well. She has been following the story throughout the day. She is joining us from CNN En Espanol.
What is going on in Mexico? How big a deal is this?
GLENDA UMANA, CNN EN ESPANOL: Let me tell you, we called our reporters there and there has not been a lot of publicity. It's very interesting. But certainly it has been very, very offensive, not only for the Catholics in Mexico, but all Catholics worldwide.
As we can see, this Mexican version of "Playboy Magazine" shows the cover of a model, as you were explaining, Maria Florencia Onori from Argentina, posing like the Virgin Mary. This was published last week on the exact date, Rick, when millions of Mexicans celebrate the festival of the Virgin of Guadalupe, very important, not only for Mexicans but for all Latino-Americans.
SANCHEZ: So the timing is interesting here. Let me read to the viewers, because we contacted the magazine.
UMANA: You have a reaction from them, right?
SANCHEZ: We do. This is from the publisher of the magazine, Raul Sayrols (ph). He says, "The image is not and never was intended to portray the Virgin of Guadalupe," -- which is the Virgin Mary. "The intent was to portray a Renaissance-like mood on the cover." Interesting. Let me bring in somebody for whom this hits home. He's one of the best known priests in the United States. His name is Father Cutie. I've worked with him in Miami many times. Has his own show, actually has his own book out now. It's called "Real Life, Real Love." Best seller, by the way.
Father, are we as Catholics just too sensitive when it comes to this? After all, it's a beautiful woman being shown to represent what is in our minds, to all of us, a beautiful woman.
FATHER ALBERT CUTIE, HOST, RADIO PAZ: Listen, there's no doubt that she's a beautiful woman, but a stained glass window and the veil that looks like that, certainly there's a reference to Mary. Whoever tells you there isn't is simply being hypocritical or not very honest. That's what I don't like about the statement from "Playboy Magazine."
I think that they timed it not only with the Virgin of Guadalupe, as Glenda was saying, but also with the month of December. How many Nativity scenes are out there this time of year? How many times is Mary a central figure in this celebration?
This is offensive, very offensive. It's blasphemous.
SANCHEZ: As a matter of fact, father, we got one statement from him. Let me read you the entire statement he had put out earlier in the day: "the image is not and never was intended to portray the Virgin of Guadalupe or any other religious figure," he goes on to say, "or any other religious figure."
Now, on its face, as you look at this picture, that looks like a bald-faced lie, doesn't it?
CUTIE: Not only that, this is someone who obviously has no scruples. I'm not talking about the model, whoever designed this whole thing. First of all, we don't adore Mary. We adore God, only God. To say "Te Adoramos Maria," Spanish, we adore you, Mary, basically, it's making a direct religious reference to something that is sacred.
You don't adore anything if it's not sacred. To us, really, it's a double offense.
SANCHEZ: By the way, the emphasis, "te adoramos," as you know being Cuban yourself, that word in Spanish has even more of a heightened religious meaning than it does in English.
CUTIE: That's right. It means that you love someone.
SANCHEZ: You hail them.
CUTIE: That's right. That's right. Now, in the cover of a magazine of a porn business that is already a huge success, why would you need to use religious symbols to sell more magazines?
This sounds desperate to me, and not only desperate, it's totally offensive to a billion Catholics in the world and to non-Catholics who honor Mary as the mother of Jesus.
SANCHEZ: Father Cutie, thank you so much -- or Father Alberto, as you've always been known as, good to see you again sir.
CUTIE: Great to see you.
SANCHEZ: All right, Wolf Blitzer standing by now to bring us up to date on what's going to happen in "THE SITUATION ROOM" today.
What have you got, Wolf?
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much, Rick.
Live here in "THE SITUATION ROOM," Barack Obama will hold a news conference to announce the newest members of his cabinet. He's also just released a statement about the internal review of who said what about Barack Obama's open Senate seat. And within minutes, lawmakers will begin meeting in the Capitol of Illinois, taking the first steps to try to impeach the governor, Rod Blagojevich. We're live there with the latest.
We also have new information coming into "THE SITUATION ROOM" on that $50 billion investment scandal. The list of big name investor who lost millions is growing, Steven Spielberg, Fred Wilpon, the owner of the New York Mets, even a United States senator, and some important charities might be going down as a result, as well.
All that and a lot more coming up right here in "THE SITUATION ROOM."
SANCHEZ: Thanks so much, Wolf.
What's the impact of that on Wall Street? We'll tell you when we come back.
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SANCHEZ: So much reaction has been pouring in on all of these stories. And that last Catholic Church story we just did, people are Tweeting like crazy, as well as MySpace and Facebook. One of these days, I'm going to do a show where all I do is get reaction from people. I swear, because we never have enough time.
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SANCHEZ: Thanks so much. Susan Lisovicz finishing things off for us in grand style, as she usually does. Wolf Blitzer now getting ready for a grand entrance as well. Here's Wolf.
