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Lou Dobbs This Week
Califronia Budget Crisis; Obama Appeals for Stimulus
Aired January 11, 2009 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, HOST: Tonight: President-elect Obama making a direct appeal for Congress and the public to support a huge economic stimulus package. Will the president-elect sell his plan successfully to Republicans and Democrats?
And you won't believe what Governor Schwarzenegger in California is proposing now to tackle his state's worsening budget crisis. We'll have that report, a great deal more from an independent perspective -- straight ahead here tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS THIS WEEK: News, debate and opinion. Here now: Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: Good evening, everybody.
President-elect Obama, this week, warned that recession could last for years unless Congress passes his huge stimulus package. And the president-elect said it's time to end the culture of anything goes and it's time to put the national interests first.
One day after the president-elect's appeal, more evidence of that worsening economy. Unemployment is soaring to 7.2 percent in December. That is the worst unemployment rate in 16 years.
Candy Crowley reports on the president-elect's political challenge.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): His inspirational campaign rhetoric has turned into an apocalyptic sales job.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT-ELECT: For every day we wait or point fingers or drag our feet, more Americans will lose their jobs, and our nation will sink deeper into a crisis that at some point we may not be able to reverse.
CROWLEY: Barack Obama pushed Congress to move fast on his massive stimulus package in a stark speech. Dire. Urgent.
OBAMA: If nothing is done, this recession could linger for years. The unemployment rate could reach double digits.
CROWLEY: But on Capitol Hill, the problem isn't urgency, it's the specifics. A payroll tax cut.
OBAMA: To get people spending again, 95 percent of working families will receive a $1,000 tax cut.
SEN. RON WYDEN, (D) OREGON: We have an example with the first stimulus that indicated just giving people $500 and $600, while certainly welcome while there's all this economic hurt, may not be the best use of stimulus.
CROWLEY: That $3,000 tax credit to businesses for every new hire.
OBAMA: This plan must begin today, a plan I am confident will save or create at least 3 million jobs over the next few years.
SEN. KENT CONRAD, (D) NORTH DAKOTA: If you think about it, business people are not going to hire people to produce products that are not selling. I mean, who's going to hire in the automobile industry if you give them a $3,000 credit to make cars that people are not buying?
CROWLEY: And there's what's missing, that campaign talk of rolling back Bush tax breaks for the wealthy -- seen as a bad idea now during a recession -- the president-elect no longer talks about it. But Nancy Pelosi does.
REP. NANCY PELOSI, (D) HOUSE SPEAKER: Put me down as clearly as you possibly can as one who wants to have those tax cuts for the wealthiest in America repealed.
CROWLEY: Think about it. Those are just the Democrats objecting. Minority Republicans, though pleased Obama agreed to business tax cuts, are appalled at the price tag.
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL, (R) MINORITY LEADER: Well, given the deficit numbers, it really ought not to be $1 trillion spending bill. I think we can start by saying that.
CROWLEY: For the incoming president, the opening volleys in the stimulus debate are a lesson in the limits of presidential power. He will not get everything he wants.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The certificate of the electoral vote of ...
CROWLEY: But it also came on the same day his election became official, with a congressional count of electoral votes.
VICE PRESIDENT RICHARD CHENEY, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Barack Obama of the state of Illinois has received, for president of the United States, 365 votes.
CROWLEY: And therein is a lesson for Congress. Barack Obama does not hold all the cards, but he sure owns the poll numbers. He'll get most of what he wants.
Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DOBBS: The economic challenge facing the United States and our president-elect is growing. As we reported, unemployment soaring to more than 7 percent last month after employers slashed more than half a million jobs in the month of December. In all, the economy is losing more than 2.5 million jobs. That is the highest number of job losses since 1945.
As the president-elect tries to focus on fixing the economy, Democrats are in disarray over allowing Roland Burris to be seated in the Senate. Burris went to the Senate Tuesday, declaring he's legally- entitled to be the junior senator from Illinois. He was turned away by Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and also the senior senator from Illinois, Dick Durbin, after top Democrats said his appointment by Governor Rod Blagojevich was, quote-unquote, "tainted" -- legal but tainted.
A day later, Burris met with the majority leader again and afterwards there was an abrupt reversal on the part of Senator Reid, declaring now he's willing to seat Burris, provided certain questions about his credentials are resolved.
Meanwhile, the governor's political difficulties worsened. The Illinois House of Representatives voting Friday to impeach Blagojevich.
Joining me now to talk about all of this, the political and economic challenges facing the nation and the president-elect and the Democratic majority in Congress: our senior political correspondent Candy Crowley, national political correspondent Jessica Yellin, senior White House correspondent Ed Henry.
This has been a week of campaigning by the president-elect, has it not, Ed?
ED HENRY, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. It really brought to mind -- that economic speech late in the week really brought to mind some of his campaign speeches with sort of the lofty rhetoric, but not a lot of the details. And I think he's being pressed on those details now.
And one of the reasons why you said Democrats are in disarray right now, that might be a little strong, but they certainly are in some trouble in the sense that all of a sudden, the president-elect is laying out his signature program that he wants to roll out even before he's sworn in, and you're starting to hear a lot of noise from Senate Democrats that they're not really in favor of the tax cut that he wants, for example. And it's becoming very clear to the incoming Obama administration from the get-go that just because they have more Democratic seats in Congress doesn't mean they're going to get what they want, Lou.
DOBBS: Does it appear, Jessica, that the president-elect is stepping forward a bit too early on this, threatening the possibility that the honeymoon with Congress -- which is traditional -- will thereby be shortened and the political, if you will, fighting between Republicans and Democrats and within the Democratic Party over these stimulus package proposals will be even more intense?
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, look -- we've all noted that Barack Obama doesn't mind being the president when it comes to the economy. He says there's only one president at a time when he doesn't want to take the lead on an issue.
On this one, it's the Democrats flexing their muscles. They were going to do this whether he announced his stimulus package after he was inaugurated or before, because they're annoyed that Barack Obama is extending these olive branches to Republicans. Barack Obama wants a bipartisan stimulus package. So he's including, for example, some business tax cuts in there to get some Republicans on board. And the Democrats are just annoyed that they're reaching out to the Republicans and they're not getting a purely Democratic package.
And so there's this infighting that's going to take place and this is what Barack Obama has to get used to. They don't want to be rolled.
DOBBS: What about the tone, here, too, Candy? As I listen to the president-elect this week -- I mean, he talked about a sick, a damaged economy. He talked about a crisis that was worsening. His were, you know, his was, without question, the rhetoric of fear, something that he avoided on the campaign trail, but seems to have embraced here in the early going, at least.
CROWLEY: Absolutely. But you have to put this in the context of a sales pitch. I mean, he really has become the "Grim Reaper" of the economy and, I mean, just incredible stakes that he's putting out there. If we don't do something, we might not be able to climb out. We are looking at, perhaps, $1 trillion deficits for years to come. I mean, just on and on.
Obama has said that what he really wants is to have this open conversation, have everybody throw their ideas out there. But the fact of the matter is, that's really time-consuming because the other thing he really wants is to have this done quickly. And you cannot do this quickly unless there is some kind of effort to rollover some of these objections. So, I suspect you will see that.
But let's remember the poll numbers -- certainly, the presidency is not absolute power, but right now the poll numbers are on Barack Obama's side, and that's worth a lot on the table up on Capitol Hill.
DOBBS: It's worth a lot. And then we heard this week, the president- elect, Ed, say, you know, but -- you know, "I've got some great ideas here and I want you to enact them, but, you know, if you've got great ideas there in Congress, let me hear it. And if you can, you know, -- and although, we're not going to have any pork, but if you've got a project that you think will be very efficient in creating jobs, heck, we'll do that too."
HENRY: Oh, yes, it's a balancing act. And I think, as well, as Jessica said, Democrats want to make clear they're not going to be rolled and they don't want to be dictated to. So, I think Barack Obama is trying to do a little dance there and saying, "Well, we want to hear those ideas. We're not just going to force this upon you," even though we know full well that the incoming Obama folks want to get as much as this stimulus package as they possibly can. And I do wonder just how much Democrats really will push back. You remember at the beginning of the week, Diane Feinstein was yelling and screaming about Leon Panetta and she didn't know that he was going to be the CIA director, and then she got an apologetic phone call from the president-elect ...
DOBBS: Right.
HENRY: ... and next thing you know, she said, "I'm going to support him."
DOBBS: And she also had the guts to say to her majority leader, "Seat Roland Burris, I don't care what Blagojevich's problems are." Both being independent and asserting some leadership.
Jessica, the Republicans, is there a role for them here, and will they even have a presence, let alone be effective in this Congress?
YELLIN: Well, sure. They have a chance to flex their muscles because they can be the opposition right now. Look, they're going to object to plenty, it's just how effective will it be when the country as a whole agrees, we're talking about these poll numbers, the country wants something to happen.
And so, Republicans have to be able to be critics without being obstructionist. Because if they look like they're standing in the way of progress on the economy, they'll really get whipped. So, it's a difficult balancing act for them, too -- but expect them to be noisy.
DOBBS: Candy, you get the last word.
CROWLEY: Well, just -- you know, in perspective, I have never ever seen a presidential proposal or a president-elect proposal that went up to Capitol Hill and came out the same way. There is flexibility there, but not much. And, again, the person that has the public on his side holds the majority of the cards. He'll get a lot of what he wants.
DOBBS: All right. Thank you very much. Candy, Jessica, Ed, thank you.
Up next: Corporate America's aggressive campaign to drive down the wages of American scientists, engineers, and to get a big chunk of all of that economic stimulus money. We'll have the report for you.
And the always provocative commentator and conservative author, Ann Coulter, joins us. We'll be talking about her explosive new bestseller, "Guilty."
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: New evidence tonight: There are enough American scientists in this country to fill job openings in science and engineering, and in science and engineering companies, despite many industry claims to the absolute contrary. Those companies actively discourage American workers by keeping wages lower than they would otherwise be without foreign workers being imported. They keep wages low by exporting visa rules, and bringing cheap foreign workers into this country.
Bill Tucker has the report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This fact from the National Science Foundation highlights a serious problem: "The number of foreign postdocs has increased by 52 percent since 1996, whereas the number of U.S. citizen and permanent resident postdocs has grown by 9 percent."
The conventional wisdom is that that data shows a shortage of scientists and a dire need to bring in as many foreign scientists on H-1B visas as we can. Science professionals see it very differently. Berly Lieff Benderly writes a monthly column for "Science Careers" on science labor force issues.
BERLY LIEFF BENDERLY, SCIENCE CAREERS COLUMNIST: There is no shortage of people. There are thousands of people who cannot find careers as scientists after they've been through years of training.
TUCKER: Studies from the Urban Institute, the Pratt School of Engineering at Duke University, the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation all agree. The United States produces more scientists annually than science jobs. There is no shortage reflected in the pay they receive either.
Ellis Research Services, which has been doing wage studies in the science and engineering fields for 20 years, has consistently found pay for scientists to be in line with or lower than the average for all fields.
RON HIRA, ROCHESTER INST. OF TECHNOLOGY: There's no premium to these careers. And at the same time, what's happened is that there's been an increase in the risk to those workers, right, as employers cut, for example, benefits, as employers start to look to move work overseas and a lot of science positions are vulnerable to being moved overseas.
TUCKER: In other words, there's a disincentive for choosing a career in science.
PROF. NORM MATLOFF, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA: The first thing the Obama people should do is take a hard look, ignore the PR and take a hard look at what's really going on in terms of wages and job opportunities in science today.
TUCKER: There are winners, just not the scientists.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: A typical postdoc in their early 30s, after years of school, having a PhD, will earn about $35,000, maybe $40,000 a year in a research position. Helping keep those wages low, the fact that research institutions have unlimited access to H-1B visas, and according to Ron Hira, some 60 percent of postdocs are foreign students, Lou, here on guest worker visas.
DOBBS: I'm not sure I quite understand this. You're telling us that a person with a doctorate in this country, and roughly 30 years of age, late 30s ...
TUCKER: Right.
DOBBS: ...early 30s -- I mean, late 20s, early 30s, is making just about the same as the median household income in this country?
TUCKER: They're making about $35,000 or $40,000 a year, after all of those years of schooling ...
DOBBS: That's incredible.
TUCKER: ... which, Lou, is below what a bachelor -- a bachelor make.
DOBBS: So, let me ask a question. Why would it not occur to geniuses like Bill Gates, who's had the temerity to stand in front of Congress and demand an infinite number of H-1B visas, why would it not occur to such a genius as Bill Gates and others in corporate America and in academia to perhaps offer greater pay for higher education in corporate America?
TUCKER: Well, I can't speak for them, but they're the ones who benefit from the lower wages, Lou. So, I would imagine they were acting, as they would say, in their own self-interest.
DOBBS: Well, a horrible -- a horrible construction of self-interest, denying an incentive for people to move into those jobs and give them a living wage. Outrageous.
And I really would love to hear from the Chamber of Commerce, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Business Roundtable. We invite you to come here and demonstrate to us the error of our ways, because you've been among those, Chamber of Commerce, Business Roundtable -- and Bill Gates, I want to invite you too, Bill, because you and I have known each other a long time. You know I'm a straight shooter and I know that you can be when you're wrestled to the ground.
So, why don't you come here and we'll talk about what's really going on and how the American interests and American middle-class workers can best be served -- because it looks like, frankly, folks, you're doing the nation a great disservice by distorting what is happening in this country for higher education graduates, particularly postdocs, in corporate America.
Well, there are, right now, 23 guest worker programs. By the way, I know you're one of these people, I bet you, who like me, has listened to the president say we've got to have a guest worker program. Well, let me repeat that number. We keep trying to keep -- to figure out how many there are, and the number right now is just 23 guest worker programs. So, Mr. President, I know you've only got a couple of weeks left, a little less than that. But I want you to hear me loud and clear. As you've been going around the country saying this nonsense -- there are 23 guest worker programs, folks.
Foreign workers enter here under an alphabet soup of different visas in those guest worker programs. In addition to the H-visas, there are also -- the E, the G, the I, the O, the P and there's an R visas as well. There's also a visa for workers covered under NAFTA.
In total, almost 810,000 foreign worker visas were issued in 2007. H- visas accounting for more than 400,000 of those workers and eight of the top 20 companies requesting H-B1 visas last year -- are you ready -- those American companies looking for that skilled talent that Bill Gates talked about, and the Chamber of Commerce wants, well, eight of the top 20 -- that's right -- they were based in India. They were outsourcing jobs. I just thought we would bring that to your attention as well, Mr. Gates.
Coming up next: One state's residents hoping to pay some of their bills with their tax refunds, but they could be in for a shock from their state government. We'll have that story.
Also ahead, conservative writer Ann Coulter on her explosive new bestseller "Guilty: Liberal 'Victims' and Their Assault on America."
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: California's considering a drastic, urgent action to tackle its worsening budget deficit crisis. That deficit is simply out of control. And there are new concerns that California government could run out of money soon. And Californians awaiting their tax refunds could be stunned when they open their mail from the state.
Casey Wian has the report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A month ago, Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger said, "California was heading towards financial Armageddon." Since then, conditions have only deteriorated. And now, the Golden State is just weeks from running out of money.
JEAN ROSS, CALIFORNIA BUDGET POLICY CENTER: We are missing about $1 out of every $5 needed to balance the state budget and that comes on the heels of a spending plan that cut billions and billions of dollars out of our public schools, billions of dollars out of health and social service programs. So, we are starting from a very dire situation.
WIAN: If there's no deal between the governor and state lawmakers to close California's pending $42 billion budget deficit, people in businesses expecting income tax refund checks will instead receive potentially worthless IOUs starting February 1st. GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER, (R) CALIFORNIA: These are taxpayers that are working hard, that live by the rules and raise their families. I think that they deserve better than that.
WIAN: Beside sales and income tax increases and cuts to state programs, officials are proposing the elimination of two paid holidays for state employees and mandating two additional unpaid days off through 2010. They're also considering shortening the school year by a week to save $1 billion. At Los Angeles Unified, supervisors sent out more than 2,000 layoff notices this week and have no idea how many more jobs they'll be forced to cut.
RAMON CORTINES, L.A. SCHOOLS SUPERINTENDENT: What is devastating to us is that decisions are not being made in Sacramento so that we can begin the process and we can plan in an orderly way.
WIAN: So far, Schwarzenegger has vetoed budgets passed by the Democrat-controlled state legislature that attempted to circumvent California's landmark Proposition 13, which requires a two-thirds vote to raise taxes. If the governor does sign such a bill, lawsuits are already waiting.
JON COUPAL, HOWARD JARVIS TAXPAYERS ASSN: The action of each legislative House in passing them is a violation, we believe, of the state Constitution and the federal Constitution.
WIAN: With each passing day, California's budget deficit grows by $33 million.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: Schwarzenegger says the main problem now is neither Democrats nor Republicans in the state legislature are willing to step over what he calls their ideological lines, and risk angering their special interest constituents to get a budget deal done -- Lou?
DOBBS: Casey, thank you.
Coming up here next, I'll be talking with conservative commentator and author, Ann Coulter, about her new bestseller, "Guilty."
Also, a salmonella outbreak in more than 40 states. Hundreds of people have been sickened. Does the federal government have any idea how to protect American consumers?
And President-elect Obama is to take office in just over a week. He's already facing opposition from his own party on issues. Three top political analysts join us to assess that and a great deal more. We'll be right back. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Don Lemon live at the CNN world headquarters in Atlanta. Back to LOU DOBBS THIS WEEK in just a minute. I want to tell you this, some headlines: 4 million jobs. That's the figure President-elect Barack Obama gave today as he offered new details about his economic stimulus plan. He says it could save or create up to 4 million badly-needed jobs and suggested it may be the only way to avoid double-digit unemployment.
Well, today was President George W. Bush's last official flight on Air Force One. After leaving Norfolk, Virginia, and landing at Andrews Air Force Base this afternoon, Mr. Bush, along with the First Lady, stayed put while Air Force One taxied into the hangar where they met privately with workers that handled operations for the plane.
It has been a bloody Saturday in the Middle East. Israel is poised to expand its military offensive in Gaza. The Israeli air force dropped leaflets today, warning residents to leave certain areas and threatening to escalate its attacks, which began with air strikes back on December 27th.
There are some terrifying moments to tell you about today on an interstate near Albany, New York. Police say a passenger in a taxicab opened fire on passing cars, including a state trooper. Now, here you see the trooper pointing his gun at the suspect. Other troopers moved in, surrounded the taxi, and arrested the suspect. The other person shot was the suspect -- the only person shot, I should say, was the suspect. It is unclear if police shot him or if he shot himself.
CNN's meteorologist Jacqui Jeras checking on severe weather happening in a big part of the country -- Jacqui.
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes. Really, a lot of snow. This system, Don, just really moisture-laden. We're talking about six to 10 inches has fallen in many areas of the Midwest and the northern Ohio River Valley. In fact, record snow in Chicago today, about 8 1/2 inches there.
While this storm winds down in the Midwest, we're starting to see that heavy snow across Upstate New York moving into western Massachusetts as well as the Connecticut area. It's been a real problem for you, travelers -- lots of flight cancellations as well as delays.
Right now, looking at a ground stop in Charlotte. JFK, looking for departure delays at 30 minutes. And believe it or not -- White Plains is closed at this time. They're trying to clear up the runway but they do anticipate it will reopen.
We had some isolated severe storms in Mississippi and also into Alabama. The threat tonight is very minimal; we think it's being reduced. But watch out for the wet roadways, that's going to continue --Don?
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Jacqui Jeras, we'll talk weather at 11:00.
Also at 11:00 tonight, you know the porn industry wants a bailout. We'll talk with Joe Francis, the founder of "Girls Gone Wild" about why he wants a bailout for the porn industry. We're back here at 11:00 p.m. Eastern. Now back to "Lou Dobbs This Week." I'm Don Lemon.
LOU DOBBS, CNN HOST: Joining me now to talk about the Obama transition, a host of other issues, Ann Coulter, outspoken critic of the country's liberals, they're nasty agenda of other things. Her new book is "Guilty: Liberal Victims and their Assault on America." Great to have you back with us, Ann.
ANN COULTER, AUTHOR "GUILTY: LIBERAL VICTIMS AND THEIR ASSAULT ON AMERICA": Great to be here, Lou.
DOBBS: Can I ask you, this liberal bias in the media, I've never noticed such a thing. What makes you think there's such a thing?
(LAUGHTER)
COULTER: Well, I have about 200 pages in this book, maybe more covering just that. And I must say, this last campaign, the 2008 campaign, was a beautiful template. I was not planning on writing as much about the media or politics, but since I was writing the book as the campaign was going on, you know, walking through the kitchen, you keep hearing about the republican attack machine. I wish we had a republican attack machine.
DOBBS: The republicans, I mean, well the republicans, do you feel like sort of, in a way -
COULTER: The only man in the party? Why, yes, I do.
DOBBS: Whatever one thinks of you, whether they're conservative or liberals, you are the, without question, the sharpest tongued, sharpest-witted conservative out there.
COULTER: Well, thank you.
DOBBS: No and I mean that. One has to certainly admire the energy and the efforts you bring to your cause.
COULTER: Thank you.
DOBBS: And as you look at this administration, and conservatives across the board in this country, principally, what are you doing wasting our time. They're unengaging. They're uninspiring.
COULTER: Right.
DOBBS: And they sort of sit there and sort of take it.
COULTER: Right, right. I'm tempted to tell you what I was thinking of calling this book but I don't think we can say it on air about the republicans. One beautiful example -
DOBBS: Now you have everyone's imagination raging.
COULTER: It's a funny title. One beautiful example of this and illustrating the theme of the book is in the last chapter. At the Republican National Convention, Sarah Palin gets up to give her - the most important political speech in a decade, where she's being introduced to the nation.
Two Obama fundraisers stand up and start screaming at her and storming the stage. Now point one, how many newspapers reported that story? That's right, two local newspapers. No place else. Do you think it would have made news if a major McCain fundraiser had stood up during Obama's speech at the convention and started screaming and storming the stage?
Moreover, I mean, the stunning thing about the story is, if you could get the video and you could only see it online, you see all these republican men standing there, right next to these screaming banshees, doing nothing. Doing nothing! Geez, you have this 99-pound woman in heels on stage trying to deliver the most important speech of her life and strong republican men standing there - how about a bunch in the yap to these screaming banshees?
DOBBS: I'm curious. Do you think that maybe the republicans are becoming the feminist party?
COULTER: Girls?
(LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: Because you, Governor Palin, prominent with more energy, more - let's put it this way, verve, than any of the candidates running for president nor any of the political strategists behind them.
COULTER: Well, I do note that at the end of that section, no wonder we needed a girl to run for vice president, with all these republican men standing around doing nothing. And of course, the two women, the Code Pink, big Obama fundraisers, bunglers, who were then eventually taken out after standing there screaming, they complained that they were victimized. Why do they have to drag two women out of there. Well just two women. Somebody else they even beat showing up at somebody's party, it would be like somebody walking in here right now on your TV show, you don't have someone else coming in and screaming in the middle of your TV show.
DOBBS: We were supposed to do that, but we forgot. But it's awfully nice for you to be with us, Ann. The book is "Guilty." And may I?
COULTER: Yes.
DOBBS: The book is "Guilty, liberal victims their Assault on America" is the subtitle. I like that.
We are becoming a culture of victims, I think both left and right. I know you don't agree with half of that.
COULTER: Right.
DOBBS: But it's delightful of you to be here as well. Ann, thank you so much. Ann Coulter.
COULTER: Thank you.
DOBBS: "Guilty," another best seller. You've just got people screaming. You set people off. Amazing.
Up next, ethics and science. New concerns about some parents choosing the sex of their children. Where does it stop?
And a nationwide Salmonella outbreak raising new questions about the government's ability, its willingness to protect American citizens. We'll be right back with those stores and a great deal more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Choosing the sex of your new baby could become as common place as selecting the color for a new car in this country. But there are rigorous ethical concerns about parents who are using medical technology now to act on their cultural preferences for male children. Ines Ferre has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The most anticipated moment of pregnancy used to be finding out the sex of a child. But today, having a boy or a girl is a matter of choice, especially among some Asian immigrant couples who often prefer a boy. Fertility specialist, Dr. John Zhang says about a third of his patients are Asian. 70 percent of them want a baby boy.
DR. JOHN ZHANG, NEW HOPE FERTILITY CENTER: Because in many countries, the option of gender selection may not be so easy or popular, so when they came here, the first thing they learn, oh, we can do something like that? Then they will come. So that's why you see typically in the Asian community, most are the new immigrants.
FERRE: It's a trend that's been studied at Columbia University using census 2000 figures, which found that second or third children of Asian, Indian, Chinese, and Koreans in the U.S. tended to be male if the first child was a girl.
LENA EDLUND, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY: There are two things driving this. One is a preference for sons and the other one is a willingness to do something about it.
FERRE: An increasingly popular technology to do this is called PGD, preimplantation genetic diagnosis. Part of an in vitro procedure where a cell is taken out of the embryo to look at the sex before being implanted in the mother.
FERRE (on-camera): PGD is a technology that was initially used to detect hereditary diseases, but it quickly became popular in determining gender.
FERRE (voice-over): The entire procedure raises ethical questions.
ZHANG: Technology always come first and our models, standard, are trying to follow. The rules and regulations come after technology.
FERRE: The United States is one of the few countries where the use of preimplantation genetic diagnosis and sex determination is unregulated.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FERRE: And ethicists say it's difficult to put restrictions on how procedures like these can be used once they're authorized. It's hard to determine what purpose they're being used for and they're also usually privately paid procedures and fall into the realm of consumer choice, making them harder to regulate. Lou.
DOBBS: Hardly controversial and lots of ethical questions.
FERRE: Definitely. And it's not just a certain group that wants to use this. I mean now families are using this to balance their families. There's couples who say, you know, I've got two girls already, I want a boy. Or I've got one boy, I want a girl now.
DOBBS: We'll have much more on this. Ines, thank you very much. Ines Ferre.
Well some families are using science to put their children on a path to college scholarship or a career as a professional athlete. A Colorado company is now offering a new test that it says could predict natural athletic ability. The test analyzes the ACT-3 gene to determine whether a child is best suited for power sports like football or endurance sports like distance running or whether the child could be a lead athlete in a number of sports.
A 2003 study discovered a link between the ACT-3 gene and athletic ability. The test is extremely controversial. With everyone from doctors to parents offering varying opinions. Some critics compare the genetic testing to Hitler's desire for a so-called perfect race.
A new outbreak of Salmonella poisoning has spread to more than 40 states tonight. Hundreds of people have been infected. The Centers for Disease Control now leading that investigation and has yet to identify the cause or the origin. The Food and Drug Administration widely criticized for its handling of last year's massive Salmonella outbreak is assisting the CDC in its investigation. Louise Schiavone has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A Salmonella outbreak is emerging across the nation. And while there have been roughly 400 sick, including some hospitalizations, government scientists don't know the source of the Salmonella. Unacceptable, says this former secretary of health and human services.
TOMMY THOMPSON, FORMER HHS SECRETARY: 76 million Americans have some type of food poisoning every year. 325,000 Americans go into the hospital. 5,000 people die. That's not good enough for America.
SCHIAVONE: The CDC is still trying to confirm individual state counts in this latest outbreak, but health officials in Ohio believed to rank high on the list tells CNN they have 51 reported cases. Assisting in the CDC investigation, the agriculture department and the Food and Drug Administration, whose efforts may be hampered by strained resources.
LADD WILEY, COLAITION FOR A STRONGER FDA: We think strengthening the laboratory capacity, strengthening the number of field agents and creating rapid reaction teams are important elements to that.
SCHIAVONE: The House energy and commerce committee discovered that despite their shortage of funds, just last month the FDA spent $1.5 million on a private contract to boost moral at the battered agency using the services of an Oakland, California, group called the Center for Professional Development.
Republicans Joe Barton and John Shimkus challenged the FDA in this letter, stating among other things, we note that according to CPD's website, one of CPD's consultants "works with the metaphor of color, symbol, dance and story to help people give meaning to their lives and work." The outrage is bipartisan.
REP. BART STUPA (D), MICHIGAN: They spent $1.5 million to make themselves feel good because their track record is so dismal. They're on their way out. They know they're on their out, but I guess they've got to have one more pat on the week to make them feel good.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHIAVONE: Well for its part, one FDA official said that meeting was very positive and with regard to the latest Salmonella outbreak, the agency says it's working closely with the CDC to determine the origin of the Salmonella outbreak. Lou.
DOBBS: Hopefully with greater effectiveness, greater quickness than displayed last year. Louise, thank you very much. Louise Schiavone with our story from Washington.
Up next, democrats in disarray over the president-elect's replacement in the Senate and what are Obama's chances of passing his economic stimulus package? We'll have that story and a great deal more, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Joining me now, three of the best political analysts in the country, all CNN contributors. Republican strategist, Ed Rollins. Ed served as White House political director under President Reagan, chaired the Mike Huckabee presidential campaign. "New York Daily News" columnist, Errol Louis, also the host of WWRL's morning show in New York City. Democratic strategist Hank Sheinkopf.
Gentleman, thanks for being with us. This past week, the President- elect started sounding, looking and acting like the president, rather than the president-elect, Hank.
HANK SHEINKOPF, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, that's true. It's kind of been that George Bush hasn't been around for quite some time. Barack Obama's filled the vacuum and the press likes it that way, Lou.
DOBBS: Well the press may like it that way, but the press right now seems a little confused and the democratic party is making it very clear, it's going to be divided on even their democratic president's agenda. What do you make of it?
SHEINKOPF: Look, when you have that much control by one party, you invariably have a reform movement of some kind. It's happened to the republicans constantly. It's happened to the democrats. You would have more division because more people can't agree on more things at one time.
DOBBS: The idea that the democratic party, Errol, is - we've already got, for crying out loud, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid blustering that he doesn't work for Barack Obama. This is not exactly the beginning that many had anticipated, is it?
ERROL LOUIS, "NEW YORK DAILY NEWS": Well, I don't know what you anticipated, but the reality is this guy only a few weeks ago was a junior senator from Illinois. So these folks who have been around for a long time who used to kind of tell him what to do and show him the ropes, they're not going to roll over, that's number one.
Number two, this is going to look a little bit different or a lot different from the Bush presidency. This is a presidency and an administration -
DOBBS: From your lips to God's ears.
LOUIS: Look, it's an administration that's made up of legislators. The secretary of state and interior and labor and the vice president and the chief of staff, they're all former congressmen and women. These are people who are used to the give and take.
DOBBS: Does that assure you or does it concern you?
LOUIS: It tells me that we're going to have more give and take between the branches. I think that one of the problems that the Bush administration had is that it's so tightly controlled the republican agenda that in a way the system kind of broke down. You didn't have healthy dissent. Now we've definitely got dissent. It remains to see whether or not it will be healthy.
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STATEGIST: It becomes very important now that the president has a legislative package that's his package. The guy that puts the first draft down makes it happen and if he doesn't have that, he doesn't get the Congress on board early to give their ideas, and commit to an overall program, what happens is legislative staffers start their hearings, their appropriation, their authorization hearings. The Congress moves forward. And unless you write in big bold letters, this is what I want, and it's clear, and they buy into it, you get nickelled and dimed to death, or billions and billions to death now.
So I think the key thing here is that because Barack's still got a lot of vagueness in his stimulus package and the first package that Bush pushed forward that failed so miserably, I think people are starting to look at other alternatives.
DOBBS: Well, one of the things that I think that most people are so hopeful in the Obama presidency is that there would be straightforwardness, there would be transparency, there would be a direct connection between a problem and a solution. I think this past week, Obama did a terrific, artful job of articulating the distrust that exists now between the people and government.
I'm not convinced, however, that throwing everything at the government's - in the government's resources after this economic crisis, in the way that it's been ambiguously laid out is going to resonate with the American people. What do you think?
SHEINKOPF: The American people give Barack Obama a lot of room to maneuver. They believe some of the help has got to come from Washington. Most of it, they believe an economic stimulus, the amount of money, well, they're not sure about that either. But I tell you what. What they're really concerned about is being out of work.
And if Barack Obama seems to have the solution for the time being, they're going to say, go ahead, president, we'll give you some room.
DOBBS: The problem is, I don't think anybody stepped back, whether the economists, whether there are politicians, either the left or the right, republican or democrat, and said just exactly what is the historical precedent and template here that we're following and has it ever been successful?
Just a cursory review of history says we've never seen this happen before. We haven't even had a single elected official in Washington, D.C., whether in the executive or THE legislative branch say, well, we've put up $8 trillion, we pledged it, we spent it and we loaned it and this is what it's accomplished. That is remarkable.
LOUIS: It is remarkable. I think Obama is going to need more allies like Mayor Bloomberg of New York City. He was down there for the economic speech. He passed out to no fanfare - nobody picked it up. I think they gave it to me because nobody else was interested, a six- page description short of saying what this would mean for New York City. And I think that's the way Obama can sell this to the American people, that it's not something vague.
It's not just the jobs in the abstract. It's a new hospital, two new police precincts, you know, specific projects, you know, wastewater treatment plants, things that we know in the city that we need. In other jurisdictions I think it will be the governors, it will be the county executives that will help sell this program. Because it will turn it something from the abstract like a whole lot of money that just vanishes into something real, something tangible, in people's lives, in their neighborhood.
ROLLINS: It's the transparency that becomes the key. We gave all this money to the banks. The banks didn't even say so much as thank you. No one's credit is working better out there. There are no loans. People aren't getting money to buy cars. People don't have jobs to buy cars. And I think to a certain extent there's this sort of a great fear.
I think all the things that you're talking about are important except you guys say, all right. We're building this interstate highway, we're going to do maintenance on this interstate highway. This is going to create 10,000 jobs and these are good jobs that will be there for a period of time. But to say, everybody throw their list of things that didn't - it's sort of like all the old programs, you know, let's put 100,000 cops on the street and two years later the money is not there for them anymore and cities end up laying them off.
I mean there really has to be some priorities set and there really has to be transparency and this is what we get for it.
DOBBS: Again, the president-elect has been more forthcoming in saying there has to be an end to what has begun here than the legislators and the democratic Congress and the Senate and many of the enthusiasts were greater government. Now, the republicans, in their wisdom, elected a president and put forward a president for election who called himself a compassionate conservative. But who turned out to be an extraordinary liberal and, by his own acknowledgement, abandoned free market principles.
We're watching far more here, are we not, than simply a response to a crisis. This is a change of direction for the United States government. It is a fundamental shift in the foundation and the aspiration of our economy and our politics. Hank.
SHEINKOPF: Absolutely true. We have never seen this kind of government control, that many industries at one time with continued government - with continued call within and without government for even more money, which means ultimately control. Not very good for democracy potentially the long term. But Barack Obama has a lot of room to maneuver. Why? Politicians are rational, Lou. They want to get reelected. But right now he's popular. If the popularity continues, they won't lay many gloves on it. If not, look for war.
DOBBS: And at what other time in history, Errol, could we have seen any president or any political party like the democrats, in control of both houses, have a better time to throw a trillion dollars at places like New York City, to build all sorts of projects, what are necessary New York City. However, in Alabama or California or Iowa be pork? This looks like a very problematic and troubling course that we're embarking on.
LOUIS: Well, I'm not troubled by it because -
DOBBS: I know you're not.
LOUIS: Well, look, the rules change in this kind of a crisis. That was one thing that we did learn during the last I think roughly analogous period, which is the 1930s, you know that all the rules changed. That the 15 major pieces of legislation that Roosevelt passed in the first 100 days in the 1930s, nobody had ever seen anything like that. It caused a lot of turmoil politically speaking. We know with the hindsight of history that you know trying to make something happen was absolutely the right thing to do. And maybe you get it right or maybe you get it wrong and maybe you run up against political or even constitutional limitations.
The important thing is to try. Roosevelt said that all the time. Obama, I think, is going to have to get people up to speed on the fact that we're in a similar period. We're going to have to do things that go far you know beyond slapping at each other's pork projects.
DOBBS: well, you're taking a lot of support at the same time. Thank you very much, Errol.
We're going to be back with our panel in one moment. Stay with us. Ed Rollins is going to give us some ideas whether or not - is there an opposition party still in existence here? We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: We're back with our panel. Ed Rollins, are the republicans still a party in opposition? The loyal opposition, are they going to have any ideas to offer in countervailing - in a countervailing way?
ROLLINS: They have a unique opportunity. I'm not sure they will be able to do it but they have a unique opportunity to become a real opposition party. They have no part of the governing process for the first time really in 30 or 40 years. You know, the whole idea that they can basically block some things in the Senate is absurd.
John McCain may be the 60th vote. He may be the guy who vote with Barack Obama. If not, there are two or three other republicans certainly will give him. It's not going to be filibusters. So they really have an opportunity to basically say, listen, let us be the watchdog for your money because at the end of the day all these stimulus programs and everything are wonderful, but if they're wasting and someone has to pay for it - at the end of the day you're going to have to pay for it, your kids are going to pay for it. When Bush came in a $2 trillion national debt. We now have $10 trillion national debt and we're adding $2 or $3 trillion almost every month now in the sense of the new program. So -
DOBBS: The republicans really have no standing to say, trust us with your money. I mean they have squandered our wealth. They have squandered our government -
ROLLINS: I don't disagree with anything. All I'm simply saying is you can't run on the past record because there is no past record, and it's one that I'm not even proud of as a republican. I think what they have to do now is they have to basically look to a long-term, we are really going to become an opposition party and we're going to stand up and continue to articulate things that we think are right things and we think are wrong.
DOBBS: As the condition that preceded what Ed is prescribing, isn't it necessary that the republicans come up with a new, original, innovative idea?
SHEINKOPF: They don't have an ideology that works anymore. Completely discredited. The three things that made them restore, defense, integrity, let's get America back to some kind of morality and we'll rely on the capitalist system across the board, don't work. They need to redefine that party before they can do anything. DOBBS: As Barack Obama said last week, the anything goes period in American history is over. However, in Washington, this is starting to look like anything goes in public policy. We'll see what the constraints turn out to be and hopefully what many of the successes look like.
Thank you very much, Ed. Appreciate it. Errol, Hank, thank you.
Please join me on the radio Monday through Friday for the "Lou Dobbs Show." Go to loudobbsradio.com to get the local listings in your area for the show. And we thank you for joining us here. Please join us tomorrow. For all of us, thanks for watching. Good night from New York.
A CNN special presentation "Madoff: Secrets of a Scandal" starts right now.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN HOST: Call it the scandal that rocked Wall Street, shook up Main Street and caused financial tremors around the world. We aren't just talking millions. Bernard Madoff's alleged ponzi scheme caused folks around the world billions. You may have heard the headlines, it's time now to dig deeper into the depths of "Madoff: Secret of a Scandal."
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: ... very minimal. We think it's being reduced but watch out for the wet roadways. That's going to continue. Don.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Jacqui Jeras, we'll talk weather at 11:00.
Also at 11:00 tonight, you know the porn industry wants a bailout. We'll talk with Joe Francis, the founder of "Girls Gone Wild" about why he wants a bailout for the porn industry. We're back here at 11:00 p.m. Eastern. Now back to "Lou Dobbs This Week." I'm Don Lemon.
LOU DOBBS, CNN HOST: Joining me now to talk about the Obama transition, a host of other issues, Ann Coulter, outspoken critic of the country's liberals, they're nasty agenda of other things. Her new book is "Guilty: Liberal Victims and their Assault on America." Great to have you back with us, Ann.
ANN COULTER, AUTHOR "GUILTY: LIBERAL VICTIMS AND THEIR ASSAULT ON AMERICA": Great to be here, Lou.
DOBBS: Can I ask you, this liberal bias in the media, I've never noticed such a thing. What makes you think there's such a thing?
(LAUGHTER)
COULTER: Well, I have about 200 pages in this book, maybe more covering just that. And I must say, this last campaign, the 2008 campaign, was a beautiful template. I was not planning on writing as much about the media or politics, but since I was writing the book as the campaign was going on, you know, walking through the kitchen, you keep hearing about the republican attack machine. I wish we had a republican attack machine.
DOBBS: The republicans, I mean, well the republicans, do you feel like sort of, in a way -
COULTER: The only man in the party? Why, yes, I do.
DOBBS: Whatever one thinks of you, whether they're conservative or liberals, you are the, without question, the sharpest tongued, sharpest-witted conservative out there.
COULTER: Well, thank you.
DOBBS: No and I mean that. One has to certainly admire the energy and the efforts you bring to your cause.
COULTER: Thank you.
DOBBS: And as you look at this administration, and conservatives across the board in this country, principally, what are you doing wasting our time. They're unengaging. They're uninspiring.
COULTER: Right.
DOBBS: And they sort of sit there and sort of take it.
COULTER: Right, right. I'm tempted to tell you what I was thinking of calling this book but I don't think we can say it on air about the republicans. One beautiful example -
DOBBS: Now you have everyone's imagination raging.
COULTER: It's a funny title. One beautiful example of this and illustrating the theme of the book is in the last chapter. At the Republican National Convention, Sarah Palin gets up to give her - the most important political speech in a decade, where she's being introduced to the nation.
Two Obama fundraisers stand up and start screaming at her and storming the stage. Now point one, how many newspapers reported that story? That's right, two local newspapers. No place else. Do you think it would have made news if a major McCain fundraiser had stood up during Obama's speech at the convention and started screaming and storming the stage?
Moreover, I mean, the stunning thing about the story is, if you could get the video and you could only see it online, you see all these republican men standing there, right next to these screaming banshees, doing nothing. Doing nothing! Geez, you have this 99-pound woman in heels on stage trying to deliver the most important speech of her life and strong republican men standing there - how about a bunch in the yap to these screaming banshees?
DOBBS: I'm curious. Do you think that maybe the republicans are becoming the feminist party?
COULTER: Girls? (LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: Because you, Governor Palin, prominent with more energy, more - let's put it this way, verve, than any of the candidates running for president nor any of the political strategists behind them.
COULTER: Well, I do note that at the end of that section, no wonder we needed a girl to run for vice president, with all these republican men standing around doing nothing. And of course, the two women, the Code Pink, big Obama fundraisers, bunglers, who were then eventually taken out after standing there screaming, they complained that they were victimized. Why do they have to drag two women out of there. Well just two women. Somebody else they even beat showing up at somebody's party, it would be like somebody walking in here right now on your TV show, you don't have someone else coming in and screaming in the middle of your TV show.
DOBBS: We were supposed to do that, but we forgot. But it's awfully nice for you to be with us, Ann. The book is "Guilty." And may I?
COULTER: Yes.
DOBBS: The book is "Guilty, liberal victims their Assault on America" is the subtitle. I like that.
We are becoming a culture of victims, I think both left and right. I know you don't agree with half of that.
COULTER: Right.
DOBBS: But it's delightful of you to be here as well. Ann, thank you so much. Ann Coulter.
COULTER: Thank you.
DOBBS: "Guilty," another best seller. You've just got people screaming. You set people off. Amazing.
Up next, ethics and science. New concerns about some parents choosing the sex of their children. Where does it stop?
And a nationwide Salmonella outbreak raising new questions about the government's ability, its willingness to protect American citizens. We'll be right back with those stores and a great deal more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Choosing the sex of your new baby could become as common place as selecting the color for a new car in this country. But there are rigorous ethical concerns about parents who are using medical technology now to act on their cultural preferences for male children. Ines Ferre has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The most anticipated moment of pregnancy used to be finding out the sex of a child. But today, having a boy or a girl is a matter of choice, especially among some Asian immigrant couples who often prefer a boy. Fertility specialist, Dr. John Zhang says about a third of his patients are Asian. 70 percent of them want a baby boy.
DR. JOHN ZHANG, NEW HOPE FERTILITY CENTER: Because in many countries, the option of gender selection may not be so easy or popular, so when they came here, the first thing they learn, oh, we can do something like that? Then they will come. So that's why you see typically in the Asian community, most are the new immigrants.
FERRE: It's a trend that's been studied at Columbia University using census 2000 figures, which found that second or third children of Asian, Indian, Chinese, and Koreans in the U.S. tended to be male if the first child was a girl.
LENA EDLUND, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY: There are two things driving this. One is a preference for sons and the other one is a willingness to do something about it.
FERRE: An increasingly popular technology to do this is called PGD, preimplantation genetic diagnosis. Part of an in vitro procedure where a cell is taken out of the embryo to look at the sex before being implanted in the mother.
FERRE (on-camera): PGD is a technology that was initially used to detect hereditary diseases, but it quickly became popular in determining gender.
FERRE (voice-over): The entire procedure raises ethical questions.
ZHANG: Technology always come first and our models, standard, are trying to follow. The rules and regulations come after technology.
FERRE: The United States is one of the few countries where the use of preimplantation genetic diagnosis and sex determination is unregulated.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FERRE: And ethicists say it's difficult to put restrictions on how procedures like these can be used once they're authorized. It's hard to determine what purpose they're being used for and they're also usually privately paid procedures and fall into the realm of consumer choice, making them harder to regulate. Lou.
DOBBS: Hardly controversial and lots of ethical questions.
FERRE: Definitely. And it's not just a certain group that wants to use this. I mean now families are using this to balance their families. There's couples who say, you know, I've got two girls already, I want a boy. Or I've got one boy, I want a girl now.
DOBBS: We'll have much more on this. Ines, thank you very much. Ines Ferre. Well some families are using science to put their children on a path to college scholarship or a career as a professional athlete. A Colorado company is now offering a new test that it says could predict natural athletic ability. The test analyzes the ACT-3 gene to determine whether a child is best suited for power sports like football or endurance sports like distance running or whether the child could be a lead athlete in a number of sports.
A 2003 study discovered a link between the ACT-3 gene and athletic ability. The test is extremely controversial. With everyone from doctors to parents offering varying opinions. Some critics compare the genetic testing to Hitler's desire for a so-called perfect race.
A new outbreak of Salmonella poisoning has spread to more than 40 states tonight. Hundreds of people have been infected. The Centers for Disease Control now leading that investigation and has yet to identify the cause or the origin. The Food and Drug Administration widely criticized for its handling of last year's massive Salmonella outbreak is assisting the CDC in its investigation. Louise Schiavone has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A Salmonella outbreak is emerging across the nation. And while there have been roughly 400 sick, including some hospitalizations, government scientists don't know the source of the Salmonella. Unacceptable, says this former secretary of health and human services.
TOMMY THOMPSON, FORMER HHS SECRETARY: 76 million Americans have some type of food poisoning every year. 325,000 Americans go into the hospital. 5,000 people die. That's not good enough for America.
SCHIAVONE: The CDC is still trying to confirm individual state counts in this latest outbreak, but health officials in Ohio believed to rank high on the list tells CNN they have 51 reported cases. Assisting in the CDC investigation, the agriculture department and the Food and Drug Administration, whose efforts may be hampered by strained resources.
LADD WILEY, COLAITION FOR A STRONGER FDA: We think strengthening the laboratory capacity, strengthening the number of field agents and creating rapid reaction teams are important elements to that.
SCHIAVONE: The House energy and commerce committee discovered that despite their shortage of funds, just last month the FDA spent $1.5 million on a private contract to boost moral at the battered agency using the services of an Oakland, California, group called the Center for Professional Development.
Republicans Joe Barton and John Shimkus challenged the FDA in this letter, stating among other things, we note that according to CPD's website, one of CPD's consultants "works with the metaphor of color, symbol, dance and story to help people give meaning to their lives and work." The outrage is bipartisan. REP. BART STUPA (D), MICHIGAN: They spent $1.5 million to make themselves feel good because their track record is so dismal. They're on their way out. They know they're on their out, but I guess they've got to have one more pat on the week to make them feel good.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHIAVONE: Well for its part, one FDA official said that meeting was very positive and with regard to the latest Salmonella outbreak, the agency says it's working closely with the CDC to determine the origin of the Salmonella outbreak. Lou.
DOBBS: Hopefully with greater effectiveness, greater quickness than displayed last year. Louise, thank you very much. Louise Schiavone with our story from Washington.
Up next, democrats in disarray over the president-elect's replacement in the Senate and what are Obama's chances of passing his economic stimulus package? We'll have that story and a great deal more, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Joining me now, three of the best political analysts in the country, all CNN contributors. Republican strategist, Ed Rollins. Ed served as White House political director under President Reagan, chaired the Mike Huckabee presidential campaign. "New York Daily News" columnist, Errol Louis, also the host of WWRL's morning show in New York City. Democratic strategist Hank Sheinkopf.
Gentleman, thanks for being with us. This past week, the President- elect started sounding, looking and acting like the president, rather than the president-elect, Hank.
HANK SHEINKOPF, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, that's true. It's kind of been that George Bush hasn't been around for quite some time. Barack Obama's filled the vacuum and the press likes it that way, Lou.
DOBBS: Well the press may like it that way, but the press right now seems a little confused and the democratic party is making it very clear, it's going to be divided on even their democratic president's agenda. What do you make of it?
SHEINKOPF: Look, when you have that much control by one party, you invariably have a reform movement of some kind. It's happened to the republicans constantly. It's happened to the democrats. You would have more division because more people can't agree on more things at one time.
DOBBS: The idea that the democratic party, Errol, is - we've already got, for crying out loud, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid blustering that he doesn't work for Barack Obama. This is not exactly the beginning that many had anticipated, is it?
ERROL LOUIS, "NEW YORK DAILY NEWS": Well, I don't know what you anticipated, but the reality is this guy only a few weeks ago was a junior senator from Illinois. So these folks who have been around for a long time who used to kind of tell him what to do and show him the ropes, they're not going to roll over, that's number one.
Number two, this is going to look a little bit different or a lot different from the Bush presidency. This is a presidency and an administration -
DOBBS: From your lips to God's ears.
LOUIS: Look, it's an administration that's made up of legislators. The secretary of state and interior and labor and the vice president and the chief of staff, they're all former congressmen and women. These are people who are used to the give and take.
DOBBS: Does that assure you or does it concern you?
LOUIS: It tells me that we're going to have more give and take between the branches. I think that one of the problems that the Bush administration had is that it's so tightly controlled the republican agenda that in a way the system kind of broke down. You didn't have healthy dissent. Now we've definitely got dissent. It remains to see whether or not it will be healthy.
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STATEGIST: It becomes very important now that the president has a legislative package that's his package. The guy that puts the first draft down makes it happen and if he doesn't have that, he doesn't get the Congress on board early to give their ideas, and commit to an overall program, what happens is legislative staffers start their hearings, their appropriation, their authorization hearings. The Congress moves forward. And unless you write in big bold letters, this is what I want, and it's clear, and they buy into it, you get nickelled and dimed to death, or billions and billions to death now.
So I think the key thing here is that because Barack's still got a lot of vagueness in his stimulus package and the first package that Bush pushed forward that failed so miserably, I think people are starting to look at other alternatives.
DOBBS: Well, one of the things that I think that most people are so hopeful in the Obama presidency is that there would be straightforwardness, there would be transparency, there would be a direct connection between a problem and a solution. I think this past week, Obama did a terrific, artful job of articulating the distrust that exists now between the people and government.
I'm not convinced, however, that throwing everything at the government's - in the government's resources after this economic crisis, in the way that it's been ambiguously laid out is going to resonate with the American people. What do you think?
SHEINKOPF: The American people give Barack Obama a lot of room to maneuver. They believe some of the help has got to come from Washington. Most of it, they believe an economic stimulus, the amount of money, well, they're not sure about that either. But I tell you what. What they're really concerned about is being out of work.
And if Barack Obama seems to have the solution for the time being, they're going to say, go ahead, president, we'll give you some room.
DOBBS: The problem is, I don't think anybody stepped back, whether the economists, whether there are politicians, either the left or the right, republican or democrat, and said just exactly what is the historical precedent and template here that we're following and has it ever been successful?
Just a cursory review of history says we've never seen this happen before. We haven't even had a single elected official in Washington, D.C., whether in the executive or THE legislative branch say, well, we've put up $8 trillion, we pledged it, we spent it and we loaned it and this is what it's accomplished. That is remarkable.
LOUIS: It is remarkable. I think Obama is going to need more allies like Mayor Bloomberg of New York City. He was down there for the economic speech. He passed out to no fanfare - nobody picked it up. I think they gave it to me because nobody else was interested, a six- page description short of saying what this would mean for New York City. And I think that's the way Obama can sell this to the American people, that it's not something vague.
It's not just the jobs in the abstract. It's a new hospital, two new police precincts, you know, specific projects, you know, wastewater treatment plants, things that we know in the city that we need. In other jurisdictions I think it will be the governors, it will be the county executives that will help sell this program. Because it will turn it something from the abstract like a whole lot of money that just vanishes into something real, something tangible, in people's lives, in their neighborhood.
ROLLINS: It's the transparency that becomes the key. We gave all this money to the banks. The banks didn't even say so much as thank you. No one's credit is working better out there. There are no loans. People aren't getting money to buy cars. People don't have jobs to buy cars. And I think to a certain extent there's this sort of a great fear.
I think all the things that you're talking about are important except you guys say, all right. We're building this interstate highway, we're going to do maintenance on this interstate highway. This is going to create 10,000 jobs and these are good jobs that will be there for a period of time. But to say, everybody throw their list of things that didn't - it's sort of like all the old programs, you know, let's put 100,000 cops on the street and two years later the money is not there for them anymore and cities end up laying them off.
I mean there really has to be some priorities set and there really has to be transparency and this is what we get for it.
DOBBS: Again, the president-elect has been more forthcoming in saying there has to be an end to what has begun here than the legislators and the democratic Congress and the Senate and many of the enthusiasts were greater government. Now, the republicans, in their wisdom, elected a president and put forward a president for election who called himself a compassionate conservative. But who turned out to be an extraordinary liberal and, by his own acknowledgement, abandoned free market principles.
We're watching far more here, are we not, than simply a response to a crisis. This is a change of direction for the United States government. It is a fundamental shift in the foundation and the aspiration of our economy and our politics. Hank.
SHEINKOPF: Absolutely true. We have never seen this kind of government control, that many industries at one time with continued government - with continued call within and without government for even more money, which means ultimately control. Not very good for democracy potentially the long term. But Barack Obama has a lot of room to maneuver. Why? Politicians are rational, Lou. They want to get reelected. But right now he's popular. If the popularity continues, they won't lay many gloves on it. If not, look for war.
DOBBS: And at what other time in history, Errol, could we have seen any president or any political party like the democrats, in control of both houses, have a better time to throw a trillion dollars at places like New York City, to build all sorts of projects, what are necessary New York City. However, in Alabama or California or Iowa be pork? This looks like a very problematic and troubling course that we're embarking on.
LOUIS: Well, I'm not troubled by it because -
DOBBS: I know you're not.
LOUIS: Well, look, the rules change in this kind of a crisis. That was one thing that we did learn during the last I think roughly analogous period, which is the 1930s, you know that all the rules changed. That the 15 major pieces of legislation that Roosevelt passed in the first 100 days in the 1930s, nobody had ever seen anything like that. It caused a lot of turmoil politically speaking. We know with the hindsight of history that you know trying to make something happen was absolutely the right thing to do. And maybe you get it right or maybe you get it wrong and maybe you run up against political or even constitutional limitations.
The important thing is to try. Roosevelt said that all the time. Obama, I think, is going to have to get people up to speed on the fact that we're in a similar period. We're going to have to do things that go far you know beyond slapping at each other's pork projects.
DOBBS: well, you're taking a lot of support at the same time. Thank you very much, Errol.
We're going to be back with our panel in one moment. Stay with us. Ed Rollins is going to give us some ideas whether or not - is there an opposition party still in existence here? We'll be right back.
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DOBBS: We're back with our panel. Ed Rollins, are the republicans still a party in opposition? The loyal opposition, are they going to have any ideas to offer in countervailing - in a countervailing way? ROLLINS: They have a unique opportunity. I'm not sure they will be able to do it but they have a unique opportunity to become a real opposition party. They have no part of the governing process for the first time really in 30 or 40 years. You know, the whole idea that they can basically block some things in the Senate is absurd.
John McCain may be the 60th vote. He may be the guy who vote with Barack Obama. If not, there are two or three other republicans certainly will give him. It's not going to be filibusters. So they really have an opportunity to basically say, listen, let us be the watchdog for your money because at the end of the day all these stimulus programs and everything are wonderful, but if they're wasting and someone has to pay for it - at the end of the day you're going to have to pay for it, your kids are going to pay for it. When Bush came in a $2 trillion national debt. We now have $10 trillion national debt and we're adding $2 or $3 trillion almost every month now in the sense of the new program. So -
DOBBS: The republicans really have no standing to say, trust us with your money. I mean they have squandered our wealth. They have squandered our government -
ROLLINS: I don't disagree with anything. All I'm simply saying is you can't run on the past record because there is no past record, and it's one that I'm not even proud of as a republican. I think what they have to do now is they have to basically look to a long-term, we are really going to become an opposition party and we're going to stand up and continue to articulate things that we think are right things and we think are wrong.
DOBBS: As the condition that preceded what Ed is prescribing, isn't it necessary that the republicans come up with a new, original, innovative idea?
SHEINKOPF: They don't have an ideology that works anymore. Completely discredited. The three things that made them restore, defense, integrity, let's get America back to some kind of morality and we'll rely on the capitalist system across the board, don't work. They need to redefine that party before they can do anything.
DOBBS: As Barack Obama said last week, the anything goes period in American history is over. However, in Washington, this is starting to look like anything goes in public policy. We'll see what the constraints turn out to be and hopefully what many of the successes look like.
Thank you very much, Ed. Appreciate it. Errol, Hank, thank you.
Please join me on the radio Monday through Friday for the "Lou Dobbs Show." Go to loudobbsradio.com to get the local listings in your area for the show. And we thank you for joining us here. Please join us tomorrow. For all of us, thanks for watching. Good night from New York.
A CNN special presentation "Madoff: Secrets of a Scandal" starts right now. CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN HOST: Call it the scandal that rocked Wall Street, shook up Main Street and caused financial tremors around the world. We aren't just talking millions. Bernard Madoff's alleged ponzi scheme caused folks around the world billions. You may have heard the headlines, it's time now to dig deeper into the depths of "Madoff: Secret of a Scandal."
