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Nancy Grace

Public Memorial Service for Caylee Set for February 10

Aired February 05, 2009 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the desperate search for a beautiful 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee. Six months of searching culminates when skeletal remains found in a heavily wooded area just 15 houses from the Anthonys` confirmed to be Caylee, manner of death homicide, the little girl`s remains completely skeletonized. This after a utility meter reader stumbles on a garbage bag containing a tiny human skeleton, including a skull covered in light-colored hair. The killer duct tapes the child`s mouth, then finishes it off by placing a child`s heart-shaped sticker over the duct tape, little Caylee`s tiny skeleton double-bagged like she`s trash.

Bombshell. Insult to injury. Is little Caylee being sold on the auction block? That`s right, in the last hours, reports emerge tot mom`s trying to make money off her personal photos of dead Caylee. Already raking in $200,000 to date for video and photos of Caylee, she`s at it again.

And tonight, we confirm a date is set for 2-year-old Caylee`s public memorial. It`s the morning of February 10, 1st Baptist Church, Orlando, grandmother Cindy, not tot mom, hand-picking location, flowers, music, people even flying in from all over the country, seating capacity 5,000. The catch? Every single person attending Caylee`s memorial subject to search.

Tonight we learn the Anthonys reserve the right to refuse entry or eject attendees at will. It is confirmed tonight tot mom may be watching from behind jailhouse walls. And major development. The defense forensic testing? It`s done! So somebody tell me, why do Caylee`s remains still sit alone at a box in a local funeral home?

The clock ticking tonight on videotaped sworn testimony by the Anthony family, all four refusing to answer questions under oath unless the answers kept secret. Grandfather George Anthony back home under medical care after walking out of a hospital psyche ward.

Thousands planning to mourn at the public memorial, but tot mom sits less than a mile away behind bars, racking up money from strangers -- ka- ching! -- across the country, to buy treats for herself, chocolates, snacks, expensive bottled water, beauty products all to enjoy in her private jail cell.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New details emerge in the case of 2-year-old Florida toddler Caylee Anthony. Is tot mom`s defense attorney attempting to sell photos of her and Caylee? One Orlando station is reporting that the tot mom is willing to sell photos of her deceased daughter to pay for her own defense.

GEORGE ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S GRANDFATHER: The photos of her are beautiful, but when you see her in front of you, the eyes...

CASEY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S MOTHER: She`s captivating. She`s absolutely captivating.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Baez is reportedly trying to market photos to the media in the hopes of financing the tot mom`s case.

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR CASEY ANTHONY: I don`t care how much criticism I face personally. It`s silly.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Also today according to the Anthony family attorney, the defense has finished their testing on the remains, and as a result, the date of the public memorial has now been officially confirmed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Anthonys are going through something horrendous, something that most people will never, ever even begin to imagine. They have not been able to bury her with the dignity and respect that she deserves.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The memorial service will be held on Tuesday morning at the 1st Baptist Church of Orlando. The says the public is invited to the service, but the Anthonys and the church retain right to refuse entry to certain people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And tonight the mystery surrounding the sudden disappearance of a beloved nurse and mother, South Carolina, her remains just discovered in a heavily wooded area tonight. Who killed 31-year-old Maria Fernandez?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities continue to gather evidence if the case of Maria Fernandez. Maria had been missing since September, when a utility worker found her skull and jawbone in a wooded area off a local road in rural South Carolina.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The remains were found scattered in this wooded area not far from some railroad tracks. Investigators haven`t been able to find all of the remains, just teeth, a skull and some bones, plus pieces of clothing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Maria, who works two jobs as a nurse, was last seen leaving one of her jobs September 3rd, with her boyfriend, Jamel Good. Authorities say Good is a person of interest in this case and has been uncooperative, while Good`s attorney disagrees and says his client is working with police. No arrests have been made in this case.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Is little Caylee being sold on the auction block?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stunning developments today in the case of 2-year- old Florida toddler Caylee Anthony. According to one Orlando station, tot mom Casey Anthony`s defense attorney, Jose Baez, may be trying to sell photos of the tot mom with her daughter, Caylee.

BAEZ: I don`t care what type of speculation is out there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: CNN affiliate WFTV is reporting that Casey Anthony told Baez he can sell the photos in order to pay for her own defense. Baez is said to be reportedly shopping the photos to different media outlets.

BAEZ: It is absolutely untrue and it should be put to rest, period.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Meanwhile, the date for Caylee`s public memorial has now been finalized. The attorneys for grandparents George and Cindy Anthony say that because the defense has now finished the testing on the remains, the Anthony family can now hold the memorial for the toddler.

CASEY ANTHONY: Dad, I don`t care about all this other stuff. I mean, I don`t care about the media. I don`t care about what people have been saying about me. That doesn`t matter because I know it`s not true and everyone that knows me knows that it isn`t true. All I want is Caylee home, but I want to be there when she comes home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The service will be held at 1st Baptist Church of Orlando, which can hold up to 5,000 guests, on Tuesday morning. The Anthonys invite everyone from the public to come to the memorial, but say they may not allow certain people to attend.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Kathi Belich with WFTV. Little Caylee on the auction block. Is it true?

KATHI BELICH, WFTV: That`s what we understand. A very reliable source says that Jose Baez was offering to sell photographs, and he was turned down by at least one media outlet.

GRACE: Well, Kathi Belich, Baez doesn`t just come up with these things on his own. These are not photos that belong to Jose Baez. He`s got to get them from the tot mom.

BELICH: That`s absolutely right. You`re aware of reports six months ago of almost $200,000 being paid for other photographs of Casey and Caylee. That was before the remains were found. But we understand that he`s trying to sell more photographs, and it could be an indication that some of that money -- very little of that money is left at this point with some of the high-priced experts he`s hired.

GRACE: Well, when we spoke to the experts, they had not been paid, Kathi Belich. So where`s the money going?

BELICH: That`s a very good question, a very good question.

GRACE: I would like to trace that money and find out what Baez and the tot mom are doing with it. We are taking your calls. Tonight, we learn that the tot mom is planning to sell more images of her daughter.

Straight out to the lines. But first to Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst and author of "Dealbreakers." What about it, Bethany?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Well, it reminds me of a lot of cases we`ve covered here on your show, where mothers did have a hand in their children`s demise, and the next day, the sonogram pictures, the baby pictures, the booties, the blankets, everything just thrown in the trash. So as the child is thrown out like trash, all the pictures and the baby`s items are immediately gotten rid of.

So I would wonder, was she torn up about this, and conflicted about selling the baby`s pictures, or was it, like, Oh, they didn`t really have any value to me anyway? I would suspect, given her demeanor throughout, that it was the latter.

GRACE: Out to Sevi (ph) in Ohio. Hi, dear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I was wondering, how much money has Casey`s lies cost the taxpayers in Florida?

GRACE: Oh, man, it`s getting to be quite the price tag! Out to Natisha Lance, our producer, standing by at the jail. So far, do we have a price tag on how much this has cost?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: I believe it`s hundreds of thousands of dollars, Nancy. The most recent thing that we learned about is the attorney for Roy Kronk, who is the person who found the remains -- that his attorney was paid for by the county, and he`s received about $7,500, but he said by the end of it, he will receive $10,000. So that`s just a small amount compared to everything else that has gone into this case. But I`m hearing that it`s been at least hundreds of thousands of dollars.

GRACE: Kathi Belich with WFTV, $10,000 on Kronk is a drop in the bucket compared to what is being spent so far on the tot mom. That`s nothing!

BELICH: That`s absolutely right. I mean, hundreds of thousands, as Natisha says. There`s overtime -- hundreds of officers across the country have followed all of those tips that were called in, possible sightings of Caylee, hundreds of thousands of man hours of overtime, I`m sure, here in central Florida with the local officers investigating this case since July.

GRACE: To Mike Brooks, former fed with the FBI. Mike, when you`re interviewing witnesses, finding witnesses, traveling all over the country - - remember, police had to fly out to California...

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Right.

GRACE: ... to South and North Carolina, to Georgia, all across Florida, all to try to follow up on tips. Plus, they were working around the clock on their hands and knees, digging for Caylee`s remains. This has got to be well over a half a million dollars already.

BROOKS: Oh, Nancy, at least that because -- figure, you had local, state and you had the FBI. You had the FBI evidence response team there and FBI leads being run all over this country. So it`s costing the taxpayers of the whole country money on this particular case.

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, felony prosecutor Eleanor Dixon, who`s straight off a death penalty win, defense attorney defense Lauren Lake joining us out of New York, and also out of Atlanta, veteran trial lawyer Peter Odom.

Eleanor, about how much does a death penalty case cost to put on by the state? And remember, they`re going to claim they need money for the defense at some point, all right. So we`re going to not only pay for the prosecution, the investigation, but the defense. And Eleanor, they want a change of venue. That means every person involved in the case, the prosecution, every single witness, the court reporters, everybody has to have their transportation, food and hotel paid for for the duration of the trial.

ELEANOR DIXON, PROSECUTOR: Oh, it can cost a million dollars, Nancy. In fact, in Georgia, when I tried a death penalty case, venue was changed and we had to live in a hotel in another city for a month. That was just the prosecutors. We had to fly all our witnesses into another city. So take into account all those expenses, as well as the salaries of the people and the police, the prosecutors.

GRACE: Well, I`m not including the salaries because they`re going to get paid no matter what, whether this case existed or not. And very quickly, Peter Odom, the Atlanta courthouse shooting case just finished. How much did that cost the taxpayers?

PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Approximately $3 million price tag. It wiped out our indigent defense system here in Georgia, Nancy.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I don`t want to be one of those thousands of parents that has to deal with the possibility of never seeing their child again, the potential of knowing that their child is alive and with someone else. The thought of that every day makes me sick.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S GRANDMOTHER: There`s something wrong. I found my daughter`s car today, and it smells like there`s been a dead body in the damn car!

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

GEORGE ANTHONY: I think (INAUDIBLE) That`s what I thought. That`s what I -- my heart was there.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What about Caylee (INAUDIBLE)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know. All I want is to see Caylee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Out to the lawyers, Eleanor Dixon, Lauren Lake, defense attorney, Peter Odom, defense attorney, as well. Lauren Lake, the tot mom reportedly selling her private photos of little Caylee. Bottom line is she`s going to use the state funds. None of her experts have been paid, the ones that have spoken to us. So where`s the money going?

LAUREN LAKE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, no one knows where it`s going right now, but there is something called a legal defense fund, and this girl needs one. She`s fighting for her life. And I know it sounds horrible and no one likes to hear it, but she`s going to do whatever it takes to make sure she has enough money...

GRACE: (INAUDIBLE)

LAKE: ... to defend herself, which she`s entitled to do, let us not forget.

GRACE: You know, Lauren -- put Lake back up, please. Let`s not equate defending herself with selling off what`s left of her dead daughter, all right?

LAKE: See, Nancy, you`re going to set me up to look like Satan`s sidekick...

GRACE: You`re the one that said it!

LAKE: ... but thankfully, I have the Constitution on my side. This girl...

GRACE: The Constitution doesn`t...

LAKE: ... as much as we all may not like her...

GRACE: ... mention a thing about selling off your daughter.

LAKE: As much as we all may not like her or think that she may have done something horrible to her daughter, she`s still entitled to a defense. And now, at this point right now, she`s not convicted and she can sell the pictures. I know it`s horrible...

GRACE: Lauren, you left out one thing!

LAKE: ... but it`s the truth.

GRACE: You didn`t tell me she`s presumed innocent, like you normally do.

LAKE: I was going to save that for the next time, Nancy.

GRACE: Lauren -- Lauren, you mentioned the Constitution. Let`s go to Eleanor Dixon. Eleanor, you and I have both taught legal classes many, many times. We`re very familiar with the Constitution. In fact, I carry a pocket Constitution in my pocketbook, as you know, Eleanor. Where in it, Eleanor Dixon, does it say you have the constitutional right to put your daughter on the auction block to save your own skin?

DIXON: Well, of course, we all know it`s not there...

GRACE: Oh, OK, thanks.

DIXON: ... and what she`s doing is despicable, Nancy.

GRACE: Bottom line, Lauren is referring to the right to counsel. That doesn`t say anything about auctioning your daughter off.

Out to Bonnie in Missouri. Hi, Bonnie.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, good evening. I wondered if there is a way to tell if you`ve run a license plate or not on a certain license because I believe that Casey saw Zenaida woman coming from that apartment and assumed she lived there and had a boyfriend maybe that was in the police department to run that license plate.

GRACE: Interesting. To Leonard Padilla. First of all, Leonard, before you start talking, just try to go one night without blaming something on Cindy Anthony. Just surprise me, OK? Throw me a bone. Leonard Padilla, bounty hunter, who then began looking exhaustively for little Caylee -- Leonard, you know, I heard Morgan, the counsel, one of the co-counsels for Zenaida Gonzalez, the real Zenaida Gonzalez, tell me something I didn`t know, that she was at Sawgrass that day in a car with New York tag plates.

LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER: Correct.

GRACE: Then later, the tot mom says, Well, the police are looking for the wrong Zenaida, the nanny, because she lives here and New York, all right? That`s quite a coincidence. Any chance she could have run or had run a license plate?

PADILLA: No. No. No. The car`s registered to Zenaida`s son, I believe, not her. So the running of the plate wouldn`t have come back with anything, I think, except with her older son`s name on it.

GRACE: Gonzalez.

PADILLA: I believe I`m accurate on that.

GRACE: But didn`t she, we think -- isn`t it alleged she got the name Zenaida Gonzalez -- I guess the son would be Fernandez -- Zenaida Gonzalez was from the sign-in at Sawgrass Apartments?

PADILLA: Yes. What happened is...

GRACE: I still don`t understand how she got her mitts on sign-ins.

PADILLA: Well, let me explain this you. Harry (ph) comes out as Zenaida is leaving, and she says Zenaida, Mrs. Zenaida Gonzalez, you forgot to sign your application. At that time, Casey was driving her boyfriend`s Jeep, who incidentally, has New York plates on it also. So she knows she`s driving a vehicle with New York plates on the 17th. She sees a New York- plated car, hears Harry say, Zenaida, Zenaida Gonzalez, you forgot to sign your application, walks up to the window of the car. This is all going on while she is probably just sitting there, waiting to go up and visit her friend, Dante (ph). It all fits within that...

GRACE: Yes. OK. You know what? I got it. Thank you for explaining that. So she didn`t need to run a license plate.

PADILLA: No. No.

GRACE: But was she still dating a cop at that time or have access to a license plate being -- possibility to have it run?

PADILLA: Well if it was run, I`m telling you law enforcement would have already known about it and checked it because...

GRACE: All right.

PADILLA: ... all of those things are flagged. They`re flagged. You run a plate, cop runs a plate for you, he`s go to enter his badge number.

GRACE: Isn`t that right, Mike Brooks?

BROOKS: ... badge number, identification number?

GRACE: Yes.

BROOKS: Yes, through local or through NCIC for the national check. Yes.

GRACE: Every time I ran a rap sheet or NCIC as a prosecutor, I was logged in. I mean, you can see -- you can go back and there`s a history of who was running what.

I want to go to Nikki Pierce with WDBO. A memorial has been set down 10:00 AM February 10. Now, I notice that there are rules regarding attending the memorial. Explain.

NIKKI PIERCE, WDBO: That`s right, Nancy, there are rules. First of all, there will be no cell phones, no cameras, no videocameras allowed. You`re going to have to walk through metal detectors at the doors when you go inside. They also are not allowing you to bring purses, bags, backpacks of any kind. And also, the Anthonys are reserving the right to refuse entry to anybody that they desire.

GRACE: You know what? Nikki, I don`t blame them one bit for any of those rules. At some point, they`re going to have a funeral where they either bury or cremate little Caylee. This is for the public. The last thing I would want is some nutjob in the memorial -- which they don`t have to throw for the public, they`re doing it because of the public`s concern for Caylee -- in there snapping photos with a cell phone. And look, think back on it, Nikki. Remember all the kooks that were trying to actually fistfight George Anthony in his own front yard? I mean, what if they show up?

PIERCE: Yes, I do. That`s a very good point. There were some violent things going on outside the Anthony home, so they are taking as many precautions as possible.

GRACE: Everybody, quick break. We`re taking your calls live. But as we go to break, tonight, I am wearing red to support the American Heart Association`s Go Red for Women National Wear Red Day. Heart disease, the number one cause of death for women over breast cancer. Heart disease claims over 450,000 women`s lives each year -- half a million lives. That`s one death a minute. For more information, go to Goredforwomen.org.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The lawyer representing Zenaida Gonzalez says her defamation suit against Caylee`s mom, Casey Anthony, can be easily closed. Gonzalez says Casey Anthony ruined her name by claiming a nanny with the same name kidnapped her daughter, Caylee. One of her attorneys says all Casey Anthony has to do is say the Gonzalez they represent is not the one she was talking about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Well, as the memorial is being set to occur in just a few days less than a mile away from the tot mom behind bars, it has apparently not affected her appetite. I`m looking at her latest commissary order. She`s got chocolates, fish, pretzels, a lot of cheese products.

You know, it`s amazing all the people -- to Natisha lance -- that send in money to her. You know what? Forget it, Natisha. I think we need a shrink on this one. To Dr. Bethany Marshall -- Mike Dembrowski (ph) from Michigan, Andrea Sowers, Fort Lauderdale, M. Kelley from California sending money so she can have chocolates and beauty products and expensive bottled water?

MARSHALL: Well, as I said last week, I think there`s something about this particular story that they identify with that evokes something in them. Either they`ve been a crime victim, or more likely, they perpetrated something against another person, their own child perhaps. Or maybe they felt framed or unfairly treated. So the idea of standing behind her as a cause is very appealing to them.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING CAYLEE: The horrible thing that happened is, this is the honest to God`s truth, of everything that I`ve said, I don`t know where she is. The last person that I saw her with is Zenaida. She`s the last person that I`ve seen my daughter with.

CPL. YURY MELICH, ORANGE COUNTY SHERIFF`S OFFICE: And we know that that`s true. That can`t be the truth.

GEORGE ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S FATHER: There`s little threads of truth in all these little lies she`s telling. I know it. But we just can`t get it together.

MELICH: Here`s where it needs to end. Here`s where the truth needs to come out. OK? No more lies. No more bull coming out of your mouth. We`ve been very respectful. We`re talking our time and talking to you. But we`re tired of the lies. No more lies. What happened to Caylee?

C. ANTHONY: I don`t know.

CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S MOTHER: My daughter may have some mistruths out there or half-truths, but she is not a murderer.

MELICH: Basically they`re trying to fabricate a story to kind of make something look a little bit better. Now is your time to tell me. Are you telling me that this is the story want to stick with?

C. ANTHONY: It`s the truth. It`s the story I`m going to stick with. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Caylee Anthony`s grandfather is resting at home after being hospitalized for a suicide scare. George Anthony spent more than a week at a Daytona Beach psyche ward. He used side exits to dodge the media when he was released. The Anthony family attorney said they want privacy while they use this time to heal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: We have learned that the defense has completed all of their forensic testing, but that certainly has not prompted anyone to make funeral arrangements for little Caylee. We do have the date tonight. Feb 10, that morning, 10:00 for the memorial, the public memorial for Caylee.

And Natisha Lance, the rules for entry, no cell phones, no bags, no book bags, no cameras, no video. Everyone will have to go through a video camcorder. Everyone`s got to go through a metal detector.

Is that church, First Baptist Church of Orlando, wired for television?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER, ON LOCATION FROM TOT MOM JAIL: They are, Nancy. This is a huge church. They have their own video facility. As a matter of fact, they`re going to be the ones providing the pool for all of the local media out here. So they are wired for television, most definitely, and I`m not sure if they are wired for these - - for these things that people are going to -- the metal detectors that people are going to have to go through, but they are getting everything together, working with local law enforcement, as well as private P.I.s as well as private security that is being provided by the family.

GRACE: Out to the lines, to Kelly in Indiana. Hi, Kelly. Oops, sorry, Kelly. It`s Tina in Louisiana. Hi, Tina.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. This is utmost outrageous. How can they -- Casey even allow herself to sell these videos and photos of her daughter? These should be keepsake memories and precious. And does her grandparents have any say so about this?

You know, I lost my only daughter. It will be five years come Sunday, and I wouldn`t even think about giving her things nor her pictures away. And how can they even do this?

GRACE: To Bethany Marshall, it`s extremely odd.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": It is so odd and, Tina, I`m so sorry for your loss, and mothers like you who have lost their children, they hang to the pictures. Remembering and looking at the image is such an important part of the grieving process.

Families I`ve treated that have lost a child, they`ll build shrines in their houses. They`ll light candles. They`ll line up all the children`s clothes, looking at the possession points to who the person and was what they meant. So.

GRACE: Well, you know, Bethany, I`m afraid I`m projecting because to this day I still have the items that I have that belong to my fiance before his murder.

MARSHALL: Of course.

GRACE: And they`re -- I could see them -- they`re not out for people to walk into the home, but I can see them every day if I want to.

MARSHALL: Nancy, it`s.

GRACE: I just.

MARSHALL: Sorry.

GRACE: I just -- I can`t -- I`m just a lawyer. I don`t know the correct psychological label to put on this.

MARSHALL: Well, grieving is remembering. When you grieve, you remember all the wonderful memories with the lost loved one and as you remember and you instill those memories with meaning like remembering her favorite food or a time that you took her to the park, all those memories are infused with meanings and as you do that the mind begins to accept that the person is no longer there.

You also dismantle your hopes and dreams for the future, the hope of watching her go to school for the first time or watching her get married or have her first boyfriend or her first little friend or sleepover. So you dwell on the past and the future.

The giving away of the photos, it flies in the face of such an important grieving process. It`s really quite unimaginable to believe.

GRACE: You know, Bethany, the other day, John David and Lucy had their first playdate that come over to play. It was the biggest deal. We had the camcorder out, we took pictures, we were excited, we cleaned up. It was just -- we got the toys all lined up.

When I -- think about little Caylee, so much, those grandparents are going to miss and they -- this child was clearly the light of their life.

To Dr. Bruce Levy, medical examiner, joining us out of Nashville, Tennessee. Dr. Levy, thank you for being with us. You know, Dr. Levy, a lot of people have made much do over the fact that little Caylee may ultimately be cremated which would disallow any further testing on the bones, but how often, Dr. Levy do you see an exhumation?

I mean the defense has just finished their own round of testing. They`ve had a second autopsy.

DR. BRUCE LEVY, M.D., MEDICAL EXAMINER: I mean I think at this point, it`d be very rare that you would need to have an exhumation. All the information is already been collected.

GRACE: I mean, how many exhume eggs have you seen?

LEVY: It`s been looked at by many experts.

GRACE: How many exhumations have you seen?

LEVY: I`ve probably seen maybe half a dozen exhumations over the last 20 years.

GRACE: OK.

LEVY: Very, very few.

GRACE: I was only involved in one case that had an exhumation, OK? And that was because the woman that was charged with murder was suspected of murdering someone earlier.

LEVY: Right.

GRACE: So that body was exhumed.

We are taking your calls live. To Bonnie in -- in New York, hi, Bonnie.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. Will Cindy be selling the video from the memorial service? And.

GRACE: Excellent question. OK, what`s your second question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. And one other thing. Is Caylee sold out? Is the crime -- making money off a crime or is that because she hasn`t been convicted?

GRACE: Oh OK. I got it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.

GRACE: Can Casey, tot mom Casey Anthony make money?

Out to Kathi Belich of WFTV, you`re the one who broke the story regarding Jose Baez attempting to sell the images of little Caylee. What about it? Would the video of the memorial be sold? Is it going to be broadcast?

KATHI BELICH, REPORTER, WFTV, COVERING STORY: It`s going to be broadcast. It`s going to be out there. I know our Web site is going to broadcast it live. So it will be out there. I don`t know anything about selling that video, but it will just be out there and people can freely record it themselves. So I don`t know who would pay for it.

GRACE: Let`s go to the lawyers, Eleanor Dixon and Lauren Lake, Peter Odom.

Back to you, Eleanor. You know, we used to have the Son of Sam law which was created after Berkowitz, the serial killer, made money, made profit off his murders. It was overturned and -- the Simon Schuster case by the U.S. Supreme Court, but a lot of individual states have re-enacted similar notoriety for profit legislation.

Since she has not been convicted yet, can she make money behind bars?

ELEANOR DIXON, PROSECUTOR: Yes, sadly, Nancy. She can make money behind bars from selling these photos and it`s a tragedy.

GRACE: So, I guess, Lauren Lake, in your interpretation of the constitution, how would that be protected?

LAUREN LAKE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The bottom line is, Nancy, she`s entitled to a defense and raising money for a defense is a necessity.

GRACE: Second verse.

LAKE: Like I said before, you don`t want to hear it, but it`s the truth.

GRACE: I don`t mind hearing the truth, but second verse same as the first, you know, you show me where that is in the constitution, Lauren.

LAKE: You`re entitled to a defense, Nancy. You have to have money. You have to pay lawyers.

GRACE: That doesn`t mean selling off your daughter.

LAKE: A defendant is going to do whatever they have to do. People mortgage their homes, Nancy, they sell their wedding rings. Unfortunately, these are pictures of a child that we don`t want her to sell.

GRACE: All right. OK.

Peter Odom.

LAKE: But she`s going to do it.

GRACE: Since it`s going to get out, would you allow your client to do it if it`s going come up in court.

PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, personally, I find it unseemly, however, that`s from the outside looking in.

GRACE: I asked you.

ODOM: This woman is faced with a very difficult choice.

GRACE: . if it was going to come up in court, would you let your client sell personal photos of her dead daughter? Would you have your client do that and have it brought up on cross-examination? I think you would not.

ODOM: I would not. However, she`s faced with a difficult choice. From the inside looking out, she`s got a very expensive defense to pay for.

GRACE: OK. I believe your answer was.

ODOM: And she`s got to make that choice.

GRACE: . I would not. Thank you, Mr. Odom.

ODOM: Correct.

GRACE: Everybody, to break. And as we go to break, at your request, new photos of the twins. They`ll be on the Web tonight, I hope you like them. The twins came to work today. That`s little Lucy. She just stole that from John David. There`s John David with the skyscraper behind him. That`s me in the background in the t-shirt. There he is. Little baby man- man and little baby gir-gir.

Look how long her hair is. People send me barrettes all the time. There are the socks in the background. They didn`t last very long.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Orlando affiliate WFTV reports the lawyer representing Zenaida Gonzalez says her defamation suit against Caylee`s mom, Casey Anthony, can be easily closed. Gonzalez says Casey Anthony ruined her name by claiming a nanny with the same name kidnapped her daughter Caylee.

One of her attorneys says all Casey Anthony has to do is say the Gonzalez they represent is not the one she was talking about.

CINDY ANTHONY: Do you still think she`s OK?

C. ANTHONY: I know in my heart, mom. I know in my gut she`s all right. I can feel it. Every day that gets stronger and I still know that she`s coming home. I can still feel that that she`s coming home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Out to Natisha Lance standing by at the jailhouse. Natisha Lance, will the tot mom be allowed to watch the memorial behind bars?

LANCE: Well, that depends, Nancy. If this is during her hour of free time there`s a possibility that she will be able to watch the memorial on TV from the jail, but we don`t know what time she`ll be allowed out of her cell for her hour of free time.

She cannot be out while other inmates are out because she`s in protective custody still. So we will be following up with the jail to find out if that does happen.

GRACE: Well, Natisha, can her free time be arranged so she can see the memorial?

LANCE: It`s a possibility. They`re saying that they`re not planning to give Casey Anthony any preferential treatment so that she will be allowed to watch this memorial, but they are saying it is a possibility. However, they`re not confirming that she will be able to at this point.

GRACE: Kathi Belich with WFTV, any idea what images are on the market to be sold by the tot mom and her lawyer.

BELICH: I do not. I`m sorry I do not and the other thing that I do know about this is he wasn`t asking for any specific price. I guess he was leaving it up to whoever was interested to decide how much they were willing to pay, but I don`t know how many or exactly what the images are.

GRACE: Back to Nikki pierce, WDBO Radio. Nikki, are there people that we`re aware of right now that are going to be refused entry to the memorial?

NIKKI PIERCE, REPORTER, WDBO RADIO, ON LOCATION FROM TOT MOM JAIL: Well, there`s no one that we know of specifically. Of course, people that have cell phones or cameras will be refused entry. Also there are going to be special arrangements made for the media. They can`t bring cameras and so forth in, but we don`t have any idea who is going to be refused entry. We just know that the Anthonys have the right to refuse entry to anyone that they choose.

GRACE: Well, Nikki, why is grandmother Cindy planning the memorial? Why is the tot mom not doing anything to take part in her daughter`s memorial?

PIERCE: That is a very good question. We do know that Cindy chose the music. She chose the flowers. She is definitely in charge of this whole thing. We`re completely unsure as to why Casey has not participated.

GRACE: Out to the lines, Kelly, Indiana. Hi, Kelly.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. You are my hero and your kids are beautiful.

GRACE: Well, I don`t deserve that, but thank you for the compliment for the children. What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m wondering, how is Casey getting access to these pictures? She`s in jail. Are George and Cindy, are they giving them to her? How`s -- and Jose getting them?

GRACE: How do we believe that`s working, Natisha?

LANCE: Well, Nancy, that`s a good question. We would have to assume that Jose would have to get them from George and Cindy Anthony with Casey Anthony`s consent because, obviously, Casey is behind bars so he would have to go ahead and get them from George and Cindy since they have access to those photographs at this point.

GRACE: Everybody, we`re taking your calls live, but right now I want to tell you about another story. Officials need your help. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Missing mom and dedicated nurse Aretha Maria Fernandez was missing for months before her skeletal remains were found by a utility worker in a wooded area just off a local road. Authorities say she was murdered.

Maria was last seen in early September leaving one of her two jobs as a registered nurse at a South Carolina nursing home. An employee with the local utility company was checking for downed lines when he found Maria`s remains, which included her skull and jawbone.

Authorities say her death has been ruled a homicide, but because of the condition of the body, the cause of death will be very difficult to determine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In and of itself having an attorney does not denote guilt or innocence, but it`s kind of unusual when you`re talking to someone who is concerned over someone else`s whereabouts to give you pertinent information as to her last known location, her habits and taste, it can do to help us and the fact that, you know, you felt the need for an attorney at that early point of the game.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Mike McCormick with WYFF. Mike, thank you for being with us. What is the latest regarding the discovery of Miss Fernandez`s body?

MIKE MCCORMICK, REPORTER, WYFF, COVERING STORY: The big thing right now, Nancy, is trying to figure out how she was killed and who killed her. They say they`re looking at everyone. They don`t have a prime suspect and that`s what we`re all waiting to hear and what everyone around us is waiting to hear. How she died and who killed her.

GRACE: She`s got a -- how old is the little boy? 5?

MCCORMICK: I believe he`s 5, right.

GRACE: Who was -- who`s got him?

MCCORMICK: From what I understand he`s staying with her boyfriend`s parents which would be his grandparents, I believe.

GRACE: So the boyfriend, his biological father, doesn`t have him?

MCCORMICK: He does not from what we were last told, no.

GRACE: Ha. To Sheriff David Taylor, he`s Union County -- with the Union County Sheriff`s Office. He`s handling this case. Sheriff, it`s a pleasure to have you with us. Thank you for being with us.

Sheriff, what do we know about the time of death and if you can explain to me where her body was found.

SHERIFF DAVID TAYLOR, UNION COUNTY SHERIFF HANDLING FERNANDEZ CASE: OK. First of all, I want to apologize for Mike for not calling him back today. I -- the information that you have asked about, we don`t know exactly what her time of death was. One thing that contributed to that is the fact that we were so late finding her -- her remains.

GRACE: Sheriff, I understand that it`s believed she was murdered just around the time of her disappearance, is that true?

TAYLOR: Yes. Yes, ma`am. Nancy, we do think she died shortly after her disappearance. Probably the same day.

GRACE: Why is that? Due to the -- did you find clothing that matched what she had on the day she went missing?

TAYLOR: We`re not sure when she left work that day. He -- the boyfriend picked her up from work. They went to some other location so from the last time she was seen until she was missing we don`t know that she may have changed clothes.

GRACE: So she -- she may have changed clothes. Then why, Sheriff Taylor, do you believe she was killed around the time she went missing?

TAYLOR: Because of the time that some of the family members tried to get in touch with her, the length of time that it took.

GRACE: Got it. That makes perfect sense.

With me Sheriff David Taylor out of Union County there in South Carolina.

To Dr. Bruce Levy, the -- our medical examiner, joining us tonight out of Nashville, Tennessee, can you look at the skeletal remains, or what`s left of the body, and determine, if you know, the weather and whether the body has been out in the elements, how long it`s been there?

LEVY: At this point only in a very broad sense. After a person has died and the body begins to deteriorate, the variables are so great that the best you could get is within a period of weeks at this point.

GRACE: The tip line is 864-427-0800. There is a reward in the case. Take a look.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: . by animals, Nancy. She was identified by her dental records. But, you know, there could be something soon, but there`s also some evidence that apparently they`re waiting for to come back from the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division.

GRACE: What do you know about the boyfriend who is not a suspect at this time?

BROOKS: He -- you know, don`t know too much about his criminal record, but, Nancy, when he first showed up, when they first wanted to talk to him, he showed up and lawyered up -- showed up with a lawyer right away, and one of the other things that bothers me, Nancy, you know, if he was -- if he was so caring about her, why didn`t he even go to her funeral?

GRACE: Everybody, in this case, the victim had over 1,000 people at her funeral. She left behind a 5-year-old little boy. Please, take a look. Any information you have 864-427-0800.

Let`s stop and remember Army Sergeant David Cooper, 25, Williamsburg, Kentucky, killed in Iraq on a third tour. Left studies at Eastern State Kentucky University to enlist. Awarded the Bronze Star, Purple Heart, Army Commendation Medal.

Easy going, with a smile that lit up a room. Dreamed of starting a computer business after Iraq. Leaves behind parents Ronald and Judy, sisters Veronica and Vanessa, widow Amanda.

David Cooper, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially for you for being with us. I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END