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Renter's Face Crisis of Home When Owners Face Foreclosure; Mike and Rollin Green Report on State of the Autoworker in Lansing; Chinese Aggression Toward U.S. Naval Ship Impeccable; The Battle over Embrionic Stem-cell Research

Aired March 09, 2009 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR, CNN NEWSROOM: Politics, science and religion, a volatile mix under a microscope. We're back on the embryonic stem cell. Research is a moral obligation for some, a moral outrage for others. The ink is dry on the executive order, so let's push it forward. What will more money for research do?

And give them billions, or let them go bankrupt? Which way is forward for General Motors?

Hello, everyone. I'm Kyra Phillips live in CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta. You're live in CNN NEWSROOM.

Sound science and moral values? In opening up new federal funding for embryonic stem cell research, President Obama says that science and morality can co-exist. As you may have seen here, live in the NEWSROOM, Mr. Obama also signed an order taking politics out of the scientific equation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: To ensure that in this new administration, we base our public policies on the soundest science, that we appoint scientific advisors based on their credentials and experience, not their politics or ideology. And that we are open and honest with the American people about the science behind our decisions. That's how we'll harness the power of science to achieve our goals. To preserve our environment, protect our national security, to create the jobs of the future, and live longer, healthier lives.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: We're following the politics with CNN Suzanne Malveaux at the White House and Senior Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen, joining me here in the NEWSROOM, with the science and prospects of stem cells.

Let's go ahead, Suzanne, and start with you. What's the fallout of the president's action?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, it's very swift, actually, the fall out we've heard from California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, obviously a Republican, who was praising President Bush about this. There are some other Republicans however, who are really very, very critical about this very controversial issue.

I had a chance, too, to talk to the congresswoman who wrote up the legislation, the last go-rounds, the two times when President Bush had vetoed it, allowing for these scientists to ask for federal dollars to support their research, embryonic stem cell research. She is going to be passing, or at least trying to push through legislation in Congress to codify this executive order, which limits the ban, because they don't want this to be overturned the next go-round when you have the next president.

But I want you to listen to one of the Republicans who, obviously, is going to be fighting that effort.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. CHRIS SMITH, (R) NEW JERSEY: We don't want to be dependent for regenerative medicine on destroying human embryos. If it ever did work, that is to say human embryo destroying stem cell research, if it ever did work, millions upon millions of embryos would have to be destroyed in order to derive their stem cells. Thank God there is an alternative that works, that is also ethical.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Kyra, the alternative he's talking about is using adult stem cells from either bone marrow or placenta, these type of things. They say that they believe that you've seen some promising results here. So a lot of people still kind of uneasy about this idea of using embryonic stem cells, or the stem cells from human embryos. This is clearly, Kyra, not something, that is going to go away. A lot of fierce debate over the president's decision today, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Suzanne, thanks so much. We will continue to push forward now. We are taking note of what the president's action does and doesn't do. By itself, it doesn't fund any new research or anything else. Congress still decides how federal dollars are spent.

It doesn't change a law that bars the use of federal funds for the creation of stem cell lines by creating and destroying embryos. Now, it will allow federal funds for research using stem cell lines created privately. Elizabeth Cohen, scientists are hoping that stem cells will some day treat or cure almost every disease on the planet. So a lot of people wondering why the opposition?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, it's very simple. In order to do embryonic stem cell research, you have to destroy a human embryo.

I spoke to one woman who opposes this research, for example, and I said look, if you, God forbid, were hit by a car, you were in a wheelchair and someone said to you hey, we have a cure for your problem that was made using embryonic stem cells, would you take that drug? She said absolutely not. She said I would rather be in a wheelchair, I would rather be dead than use a medicine that was derived from embryos, or that was derived from destroying embryos. That is how strongly some people feel. Now, not everyone feels that way. For example, Orrin Hatch doesn't feel that way. He's a Republican. Nancy Reagan has come out today in support of what President Obama did. But some people do feel a human embryo, whether in a woman's uterus, or sitting in a lab, is human life.

PHILLIPS: Let's talk more about what the other side does say, because the feelings on that side are just as strong as the other.

COHEN: Yes, exactly. The feelings of the people who agree with President Obama, they say look, you have embryos sitting in fertility clinics and they're either going to be destroyed or they're going to sit on dry ice forever, or maybe there's what some would say is a relatively small chance they could be adopted by a family to start a human life. But they say for the ones that aren't going anywhere, why not use them to make a cure or treatment that could help people.

PHILLIPS: It's interesting that you say that, because I was talking to a friend of mine who is a fertility doctor, and he said you would not believe the amount of embryos that are discarded. You think gosh, that could be going towards some sort of cure for one of these diseases.

So, bottom line, how close are we to even seeing whether stem cells can cure a disease?

COHEN: You know, we are not all that close, if you sort of look at it in a big picture way. There is only one clinical trial using human beings that's going on right now to try to see if these embryonic stem cells work, and they haven't even really started yet. What they're hoping to do is to get patients who have had some kind of spinal cord injury and to see if these embryonic stem cells can help them. But really, we're in sort of, if you forgive the term, the embryonic stages with this research in many ways.

PHILLIPS: So, you really wonder, will new money, or new access to money, actually push forward the timetable of seeing any kind of results?

COHEN: Right. A lot of researchers would say absolutely yes. A lot of people would say the reason we haven't gotten all that far is because there was so little federal funding for eight years. It was so limited, so those folks would tell you yeah, with an infusion of dollars, we could do this move a lot faster.

PHILLIPS: Well, we'll follow the new money trail, I guess we should say.

COHEN: That's right.

PHILLIPS: We know it's an emotional issue for many of you on both sides of this debate. We want to hear what you think of embryonic stem cell research. Send us your e-mails, the address at CNNnewsroom@cnn.com.

You have to think GM and Chrysler are putting their best foot forward right now. The president's auto task force is actually in Michigan meeting with officials from both automakers and the auto workers union. They're trying to decide if the companies should get the additional $21 billion in federal funds.

Some Republicans say Chapter 11 is what they need. The group was slated to take GM's new electric car for a spin and tour one of Chrysler's pickup truck factories.

This isn't just about GM's future. It's about thousands of futures, including those of Mike and Roland Green. GM is pretty much all the father and son know. They will join us live later this hour to talk about it.

After the stimulus, after the bailouts, with more stimulus and more bailouts, possibly yet to come, Congress has to come back to the fiscal year that's almost half over and still not fully funded. Brianna Keilar is on Capitol Hill.

Brianna, where do we stand on the spending measure that even the White House admits is pretty ugly?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the debate continuing today, Kyra, longer than Senate Democratic leaders had planned for, and there are a few hang ups here.

One, the overall price tag, this is $410 billion to fund the rest of the fiscal year, and that's an 8 percent increase in spending. This has Republicans and some Democrats saying why are we doing this, when the federal government has increased it's spending to deal with the economic crisis already. One of the other issues, earmarks, about 8500 earmarks in this, Republican and Democratic earmarks. Some Republicans have really hammered home on this issue, saying they don't belong in this and they are just pork.

Then another issue for Senate Democratic leaders, who have wanted to usher this through the Senate, has been a provision that would relax trade and travel restrictions with Cuba. Because of this, they lose two Democrats, Robert Menendez of New Jersey, who is a Cuban- American and Bill Nelson of Florida, because he has a strong Cuban- American provision. It's because of these reasons that this vote we're expecting tomorrow night, this overall vote, is expected to be very much a tight one.

It's one of the reasons why Senate Democratic leaders had to capitulate to Republican demand. Republicans wanting to propose some changes to this spending bill and they got their way on that. It's those changes, those amendments, that we're going to be seeing votes on today, Kyra, and tomorrow.

PHILLIPS: All right. We'll track them. Thanks, Brianna.

A prank, political attack? The college kid who allegedly hacked Sarah Palin's e-mail now facing new charges.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PHILLIPS: A day later his Sunday service shattered by gunfire. The pastor's dead. The congregation dazed. The gunman, charged today with murder.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: A day later, his motives remain a mystery, but here's what we do know about the accused Illinois church shooter. Terry Sedlacek has just been charged with first degree murder and two counts of aggravated battery. The 27-year-old remains in the hospital in serious condition with stab wounds. Illinois police haven't found any real connection between the suspect and his victim. Only that Sedlacek knows some people who worship at that church. Some of those parishioners are now talking about the terror that hit that church. More from CNN's Carol Costello.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At first we thought it was confetti. Later we found that he shot through his bible and disintegrated his Bible.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The relative quiet among the congregants inside the members of the First Baptist Church in Maryville, Illinois quickly turned to chaos Sunday morning. Police say an unidentified gunman calmly walked down the aisle during the Reverend Fred Winters' sermon, exchanged a few words with the well- liked pastor, then pulled out a gun and opened fire.

LARRY TRENT, DIRECTOR, ILLINOIS STATE POLICE: The suspect said something to the pastor and the pastor said something back to him. We don't know what that was. It was almost as if the pastor may have recognized him but we're not sure about that at all.

COSTELLO: After the shots rang out, the Reverend Winters ran down the aisle before collapsing. Parishioners dropped for cover, praying, and fearing they might be next.

CLAUDIA BOHLEY, WITNESS: They were down on their knees on the floor screaming and praying. It was a terrible thing, just terrible.

COSTELLO: Police say the killer pulled a knife after his gun finally jammed. That's when two parishioners tackled him to the floor. In the struggle, all three men were stabbed. Both the gunman and one of those heroic churchgoers seriously injured.

Besides his wife and two children, Pastor Winters leaves behind his flock, which had grown to some 1,000 members since he took over the church more than 20 years ago.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He knew your name the minute you walked in the door.

COSTELLO (On camera): Even with over 1,000 members?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He knew your name. COSTELLO: As for the two men who tackled the gunmen, one of them, Terry Bullard, remains in the hospital in serious condition. The other man, Keith Melton, is at home recovering. The gunman is in serious condition with knife wounds to his neck. Police will spend the day listening to audiotapes from inside the church to figure out what words were exchanged between the pastor and his killer before the gunfire broke out. Carol Costello, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: It's said that necessity is the mother of invention. But it was compassion for the homeless that prompted one man to invent what some are calling the hobo condo on wheels.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Here's the dilemma. You're a successful home builder. You wake up one day to find that you're facing stiff competition from, get this, foreclosed homes. Your solution? Sleep on the job. Sounds crazy, I know, but it's the marketing strategy of Atlanta home builder John Wieland. He's with Brooke Baldwin right now.

So, he's been getting a lot of publicity for this now, Brooke. Any bites?

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Already bites, Kyra, over the weekend. He's trying to sell 101 homes. That's his shtick, if you will, this is John Wieland's mission and he's sold 15 already over the weekend.

But today, Kyra, marks day one. He is traveling in this Winnebago, trying to sell beautiful homes and townhomes like this. This is a scene played out across the country. They are empty, empty, empty. What's he trying to do? John Wieland is getting creative and as I'm about to show you, he is going to the mattresses to do just that, to sell these homes.

Here is John Wieland and here is his mattress. He is pledging, on this crusade, to sleep on the floor in his empty homes for as long as it takes, he's hoping beginning of April, to sell 101 homes. John Wieland here.

John, how did you come up with the idea?

JOHN WIELAND, WIELAND HOMES: Well, I decided I needed to do something to demonstrate the importance of housing and to demonstrate that this is a great time to buy a home, historically low interest rates, great prices. Our prices are down 5 percent to 25 percent from a year ago. And now's the best time to choose a house because builders aren't building, homes aren't selling. So I'm going empty home to empty home and sleeping on the floor.

BALDWIN: Abandoning your real home and wife who perhaps thinks what, you're a little crazy, or she's behind you in your mission?

WIELAND: I think the first couple weeks, she was behind me, but we'll see in a couple of weeks. We'll check back in with her.

BALDWIN: I want to point out, Kyra, if I can walk over here just for a moment, I don't know if this was sort meant to be here or not, but I walked in and saw John, he's reading, take a look at the front of "The New York Times" headline, "A Gloomy Outlook for Home Sales Big Season.

John, when you look at that headline, let's talk reality. What if you don't sell these homes? What do you do with your business?

WIELAND: Well, we're going to sell the homes. That's why I'm here. I'm not going off my tour until we sell the homes. It's a challenging time but it's important for the country to get housing moving. You can track how I'm doing on my blog, which is gethousingmoving.com.

BALDWIN: You have a positive message. There's a lot of doom and gloom out there when we talk about the economy. Your message is this, you know what, this is my fourth recession, we bounced back, people will recover?

WIELAND: Right. Housing is so important. It's the fabric of America. Housing kind of led us -well, it led us into this recession, and it can lead us out. That's what I'm on the road to tell.

BALDWIN: All right. John, best of luck to you. Here's hoping he won't be sleeping on his mattress too long, Kyra. But this just really shows how businessmen and women in this economy are having to get creative to make a little money.

PHILLIPS: Yes, it reminds me of college. Does he feel like he's back a junior at the university there, sleeping on the mattress?

BALDWIN: Looks kind of like your dorm room, huh? It's like a dorm room, throw back?

WIELAND: This is my dorm room, right.

BALDWIN: Hopefully not a dorm room for too long.

PHILLIPS: Thanks, Brooke.

Well, a Hollywood producer's vision to help the homeless has a moving effect on the streets of LA. He's helping them get out of those cardboard boxes into more humane sleeping quarters. Our Ted Rowlands has their story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): It's called an EDAR, it stands for Everybody Deserves A Roof. It's sort of a mini mobile home for the homeless. It has plenty of waterproof storage space and can be pushed along the street. Park it and it can expand into a tent that's raised off the ground.

JOSE FONT, HOMELESS: Everybody calls it the hobo condo. ROWLANDS: Fifty-year-old Jose Font, who says he's been homeless on and off since 1979, is one of 60 people testing the EDAR on the streets of Los Angeles. Jose says it's already made a difference in his life.

FONT: I had the EDAR for about three weeks now. It makes me feel like I got something to come to.

ROWLANDS: The EDAR is also being used in shelters.

BARBARA GARDENHIRE, HOMELESS: It's very comfortable.

ROWLANDS: For the past year, 60-year-old Barbara Gardenhire has been sleeping on the ground.

GARDENHIRE: You have your own little space, read, eat, sleep, whatever, this is yours.

ROWLANDS: The EDAR was an epiphany that "Revenge of the Nerds" movie producer Peter Samuelson says he had after meeting some local homeless people.

PETER SAMUELSON, MOVIE PRODUCER, EDAR FOUNDER: I asked them how did you get money? And where do you sleep? I thought they all went to shelters, or whatever. There's only a shelter bed for about a fifth of our urban homeless in this country. Four-fifths are sleeping somewhere we wouldn't want to sleep.

ROWLANDS: Samuelson sponsored a design contest to develop the prototype, then used his own money and donations to build the first batch of EDARs.

SAMUELSON: We build shelters and then we won't need EDARs. And we will gather them all up, put them in a big bonfire, set fire to it. I'll light the first match.

ROWLANDS: But for now, at $500 a pop, Samuelson he says the EDAR is an affordable way to give the homeless a less horrible place to sleep. Ted Rowlands, CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: So, you pay your rent on time every month and you're a model tenant. It still doesn't mean you're safe from foreclosure. If your landlord runs afoul of the bank, you could find yourself homeless in a hurry.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, our money says that in God We Trust. Hey, (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

But apparently fewer Americans are taking that as their personal motto. A new national survey released today revealed a dramatic shifts in belief and a rise in the number of people who choose non-belief. Check out these results from an American religious identification survey on USAToday.com. This is our first map right here.

This is a change in percentage of folks that claim to be Christians. Look at this. It's up only in two states, right here, Louisiana up 8 percent and also Rhode Island up 2 percent. But in every other state, it's down. Look at that. All the way to Texas, down 20 percent. You thought Texas was the Bible Belt.

Then there's this other map. This is what really grabbed our attention. This is how many people don't claim any religion. In every single state, it's up, Vermont, 21 percent. All the way down, lowest percent, 2 percent there in Arkansas. Now, why are people saying this? Why are these numbers so high? Apparently, according, Barry Coseman (ph), is a co-author of this survey and said more than ever before, people are just making up their own stories of who they are.

He went on to say that what they've told him, "I'm everything, I'm nothing, I believe in myself." He also said, as he did this survey that people said that religion has become more like a fashion statement, not a deep personal commitment for many.

Pretty interesting. We wanted to bring you both that survey and reasons behind that survey.

Well, the auto industry is all Mike Green and his son Roland, know. They are part of a GM family that spans three generations. What would they say to an auto task force that's holding their future? We're about to find out.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Here's another layer to the housing crisis. Renters tossed out into the street because their landlords were hit with foreclosure. CNN's Kate Bolduan has one renter's story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARIA STEPHENS, FORECLOSURE VICTIM: OK, run the bases!

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Simply playing in a yard, Maria Stephens can call her own is a blessing.

STEPHENS: I was in a situation of no fault of my own. I'm a single mom with three boys. I'm just trying to raise my three kids.

BOLDUAN: Stephens was comfortably middle class, making $80,000 a year, when the housing crisis hit. She lost her job and ended up homeless living in a shelter with her sons for seven months.

STEPHENS: I promised my son -- I promised that I would do everything I could to get out of the shelter.

BOLDUAN: Stephens was a renter and was forced out of her home. Why? The lease dissolved because her landlord went into foreclosure. Leaving Stephens little notice or recourse.

STEPHENS: They are everything. BOLDUAN (on camera): According to the National Low-Income Housing Coalition, about 40 percent of people facing eviction due to foreclosure don't even hold the mortgage. They are renters. And often unwitting victims.

LINDA COUCH, NATIONAL LOW INCOME HOUSING COALITION: People who have been paying their rent on time, have been keeping up with their lease requirements, all of a sudden, are served with foreclosure notices.

BOLDUAN (voice-over): Linda Couch says low-income renters are especially vulnerable because they don't have the money it takes to secure new housing in a pinch. Advocates like her want more protection for renters and more affordable housing options nationwide.

President Obama's 2010 budget proposal increases funding for the Department of Housing and Urban Development by $6 billion. Puts $1 billion towards housing for the poorest families and boosts funding for rental vouchers. Measures Couch applauds but argues don't go far enough.

COUCH: If banks and new owners tomorrow were required to allow people to stay in those homes for 90 days through the term of their lease, we would see an immediate and dramatic impact on potentially millions of people's lives.

BOLDUAN: Maria Stephens is finally moving on with hers. Renting another home but now saving a little more, just in case.

STEPHENS: I can look back in this picture say. I might have been there, but this is where I am now.

BOLDUAN: Kate Bolduan, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: So, what do you do if you find out your landlord's in foreclosure? Personal Finance Editor Gerri Willis has some tips for us.

Where do you even begin, Gerri?

GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR: Well, the good news here is that the federal government is giving a lending hand to renters facing eviction because of the landlord is in default of the mortgage. For example, renters are able to get an extension of their lease from month to month if the landlord has a mortgage owned by Fannie Mae. Freddie Mac is also coming up with its own plan.

If you're facing imminent homelessness, HUD has a program available that may provide rental assistance and housing relocation. To see what laws apply in your location, go to the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development website, it's hud.gov.

Now, you may also be able to buy more time if you have a special reason for staying in the home, say your children need to complete the school year. Your landlord is under no obligation - you should understand this - to tell you if they are facing foreclosure and you may get no warning at all. But it pays to keep your eyes open for the red flags so that your landlord is having trouble. First off, if the building maintenance has gone noticeably slack. I mean, that the lawn is overgrown or there are fewer building repairs. Look at your local newspapers for legal notices against your landlord and, of course, you can't discount town gossip because it's sometimes true.

PHILLIPS: What happens if you do receive a notice of eviction?

WILLIS: Well, whatever you do, just keep making your monthly payments. If you don't, the landlord could sue you, and unless you're evicted, you still have to abide by your lease. Plus, you don't want to hurt your credit score by missing payments.

Now, if you don't want to move, you may be able to negotiate with the new owner and don't forget to get back your security deposit. If you've been keeping up your end of the lease agreement, that's your money - Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right, Gerri Willis, thanks for the tips.

WILLIS: My pleasure.

PHILLIPS: Go ahead and check the Dow right now. About 90 minutes before the markets close, take a look at the Big Board. Dow Industrials down 54 points.

Well we've told you about what could be a $21 billion visit to Michigan that's going on right now. The president's Auto Task Force is meeting with officials from GM, Chrysler and the Auto Workers Union. The futures of Mike Green and his son, Rollin, could be riding on it. Mike was recently laid off, but he's been retired. And Rollin was laid off, too. He's still waiting to hear back. Oh, and did we mention that Mike's father is a GM veteran, too? Truly a family business. They've been on the show a number of times and we've been tracking everything that's been going on within the auto industry.

Guys, good to see you. Mike, let's go ahead and start with you, because the last time I interviewed all three of you - Grandpa obviously is traveling today - you all were working and you were concerned about the way things were headed, but you all three had good, secure jobs. So how did you find out, Mike, that you were being let go and what was the reason that they gave you?

MIKE GREEN, GM EMPLOYEE, LOCAL UNION PRESIDENT: Well, it was a layoff which they extended the Christmas break and took five weeks out of the schedule. So when the plant was laid off, I also was laid off. I'm no better than anybody else. My peoples are laid off, I'm laid off. Rollin's situation's a little bit different. He's permanently laid off, with no rehire date. So he's low on the pole. That doesn't look good right now.

PHILLIPS: So Rollin, what did they say to you? Why did they say they were letting you go? ROLLIN GREEN, LAID OFF FROM GENERAL MOTORS: It was basically after the Christmas break, they decided when they come back, they were running one shift. I was low seniority on second shift so I was one of the first to go.

PHILLIPS: OK. So Mike, basically, if you're a younger employee, you're hosed.

M. GREEN: Well, yes. What happened was they cut the second shift. So you know, that affected at the GM plant here at Lansing several hundred people. Not to mention parts supplier companies, we lost people out of there, too, 600 to 700 people out of there after the first of the year because of car sales.

PHILLIPS: Well, which leads me to one of my questions. I'm going to get to the car sales point that you just made in just a second, but this Auto Task Force is actually headed to GM's Warren Tech Center to spend time, we're told, behind the wheel of a preproduction version of the Chevrolet Volt. Mike, do you think that's a good idea? Is this the future of the company?

M. GREEN: Well, sure. I mean, it's nice that they take the time to come up and take a look at the process itself. I would invite them to Lansing, Michigan, you know, two of the newest plant that's built in North America right here in Lansing. And they built that here because of the work force that we have here. And I would invite them to come in to the plant, if they'd like to. I mean, we have the "Motor Trend Car of the Year," the CTS Cadillac.

PHILLIPS: OK, so you're saying it's not just the Volt, but there's other things they should be seeing, also, which leads me to that question about sales. I mean, let's say you get the money, and you're able to bring a lot of the employees back, maybe even Rollin, you'll get your job back. Can you actually, do you think that you can make the sales need to pay back that government loan?

M. GREEN: Well, absolutely. I mean, like you say, it's a loan. You know, some people want to call it a bailout. We call it a loan. We're all taxpayers. You know, and you hear some of these southern senators and them saying, why should we give them more money. Well, what's more patriotic than helping the American people with American jobs?

PHILLIPS: So, just to kind of - well, actually, Rollin, let me ask you this, because, they're also going to meet with the UAW pres and you guys are very active, obviously, within the union. You know, Rollin, what would you want to say to them if you had a chance to sit in that union meeting? What do you absolutely need and what can you let go?

R. GREEN: I mean, we need car sales to pick up is the biggest thing. We're not going to get anywhere without selling what we produce. And I mean, we need the loan for now, and you know, they want us to prove that we're a viable company. Well, General Motors has been around for 100 years now, and I don't know how you can prove to be much more viable than that. PHILLIPS: John McCain came forward, Mike, and said, hey, best thing for General Motors is, you know, go into Chapter 11. You can reorganize, renegotiate the union management contracts and all that, can come out of it stronger, better, leaner, more competitive automotive industry. Do you agree?

M. GREEN: I don't agree. Here's a guy, thank God he didn't win the presidency. I mean, if that's his idea of helping American people, you know, God help us all. I would invite him here. If you want to see leaner, more competitive, come to Lansing, Michigan. I can show you that right on the line.

PHILLIPS: Final thought, Rollin. Are you looking for a different type of job or holding out hope GM will take you back?

R. GREEN: I'm at a point now where it's time to start look for another job. You know, there's no guarantee I'll go back to General Motors and at the end of the day, all the bills and mortgage payment are still there.

PHILLIPS: Rollin, Mike Green, we will track both of you and what's going on, obviously, within the business. And tell your grandfather and father we said hello. We missed him with you today.

M. GREEN: Thank you.

R. GREEN: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: All right, guys.

Howling winds made for uncertain hours for some of your friends and neighbors. The latest on where those tornadoes hit. Plus ,the new weather threat facing part of the nation right now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, check out the mess residents in the Midwest, they're dealing with this after at least three tornadoes touched down in Illinois and Indiana. Dozens of those homes were damaged or destroyed. Then, a handful of minor injuries were reported. One Indiana man says he was watching TV in his mobile home when the winds made it jump. The next instant, he saw an eight-foot-long piece of aluminum siding flying past his window.

Some Midwesterners are really bracing for more damage, too, because of the weather in the form of wind, possible hail, even flooding.

(WEATHER REPORT)

PHILLIPS: High gas prices and the recession pushed more Americans on to mass transit last year, but will they keep riding the rails? Let's check in with Stephanie Elam who has our "Energy Fix" from New York today.

Hey, Stephanie. STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Kyra.

Yes, Americans took 10.7 billion trips on public transit last year, that's the most since 1956. Now, we know gas prices had a lot to do with that. Check out how ridership actually spiked in the third quarter. Just as gas prices hit a record $4.11 a gallon. But ridership growth slowed noticeably in the fourth quarter as gas prices came back down. Nevertheless, the overall trend still shows an increase. People were still jumping on public transit even as pump prices fell.

What we don't know for sure is why. Some experts say we have seen a permanent shift away from driving in this country. It's declined for 14 months in a row. Others say, this is just a temporary change here as people try to save money by taking the bus or riding the train. Either way, advocates are pushing for more investment in transit. Now, the stimulus bill set aside nearly $8.5 billion for public transportation and transit officials are pushing for even more federal funding.

PHILLIPS: Well, if ridership hit a 52-year high last year, then why aren't transit systems rolling in the dough?

ELAM: Yes, right, that's what you would expect, right? Agencies actually blame the slumping economy. Huge budget shortfalls and falling sales and property tax revenues have forced many agencies to raise fares and cut service. And despite last year's huge surge in ridership, the trend probably will not continue. That's because so many commuters are losing their jobs and that's who's really riding the trains and buses. We know that. Nearly 60 percent of public transit users are going to and from work. So, obviously, that would impact on that level.

And Kyra, as always, if you need more of an energy fix, go to cnnmoney.com.

PHILLIPS: All right, thanks, Stephanie.

ELAM: Sure.

PHILLIPS: What's happening in Vegas is the same thing that's happening everywhere: the economy is taking a toll. Now the city is taking some unusual steps to lure the visitors back.

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PHILLIPS: Well, around the world, policies on stem cell research vary tremendously and change over time. Fewer than a dozen countries have reached the stage where scientists are actually creating embryos specifically for research. According to the International Society for Stem Cell Research, those countries include Belgium, Sweden, the United Kingdom, South Africa, Israel, Russia, China, Japan, Singapore and Turkey.

Well, we wanted to know about what you think about this change: loosening federal funding for embryonic stem cell research. And you had a lot to say. We want to read some of your e-mails.

Randy in Princeton wrote this, "With just a fraction of the billions of dollars being spent to clean up after the greed on Wall Street, a spinal cord injury could be cured. I sympathize with the people struggling in this economic climate, but as a spinal injury patient I gladly would take poverty and homelessness in exchange for getting back basic function."

Pete in South Carolina put it this way, "As an 82-year-old with Parkinson's Disease, the reversal of the ban on stem cell funding is too late for me but it may be in time to save my 16-year-old grandson from the hideous disease."

Mary disagrees with him. She writes, "An embryo is a human being in the initial stage of life. It's very sad to see a person paralyzed as Christopher Reeve was, but he was alive... an embryo used for healing though stem cell or discarded never has a chance for life."

Thanks to all of you for e-mailing us.

In Saudi Arabia, one of the Unites States' best Middle East allies, a court case you need to hear about. A 75-year-old woman due to be imprisoned for four months, then deported, but first, she'll be flogged. Forty lashes for being inside her own home with two men not related to her. All of them were arrested by the Saudi Religious Police. The elderly woman says she will appeal her sentence. We'll keep a close eye on this one for you.

And with the economy going bust, it's no surprise that Las Vegas is worried about its fortunes. So the tourism board's doubling down with a couple ad campaigns. Their latest slogan, "Take a Break." And their newest target, not gamblers, but conventioneers. Check out this full-page ad in "USA TODAY." It's an open letter from Las Vegas. It's a bid to tone down the old image after a financial firm canceled a corporate visit for PR reasons. Vegas is all about serious business, the ad says. Heck, even the strippers are reading the "Wall Street Journal." All right, I made that last part up.

As always, "Team Sanchez" back there working on the next hour of CNN NEWSROOM. Oh there's that sheepish grin. What are you up to, Rick Sanchez?

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: I listen to you, you make me laugh. You know what I mean? Kyra, Kyra, quite contrira.

PHILLIPS: Oh, Ricardo.

SANCHEZ: Yes, you call me - you're the only one who calls me Ricardo. You and mi mama.

PHILLIPS: That's right. Mi mama and I - or tu mama and I are very close. She tells me I need to keep you in line, but I digress. What are you working on?

SANCHEZ: Don't - don't - don't listen to her. Hey, a couple interesting things. Look, with everything that we're discussing right now having to do with the economy, there was an interesting comment made by Newt Gingrich when he was on "Meet the Press." He said, to the effect, that a lot of his friends, a lot of the investment class, a lot of the rich folks, are angry and don't trust Barack Obama, almost back to this socialism argument. There's a bit of a class warfare argument going on right now in how to fix the economy, rich versus poor, worker versus employer. And we're going to be getting into that with one of the best people to talk about that, and that is Bob Lenzner from "Forbes" magazine, the editor.

You know, the thing about Bob, he tells you exactly what he thinks and he's right down the middle because he's an economist. He's not a republican, he's not a democrat. He doesn't look at things that way.

The other thing going on there is what's going on in Mexico right now. There's a lot of people talking about the border wars and drug wars going on in Mexico. And you've got to be real careful when you watch that story because there's a lot of experts who live in places like Connecticut who are telling us about these stories when in actuality, maybe the best people to ask are people who are actually Mexican-Americans who grew up in the Unites States, grew up near the border and now go back there, like one of our own producers, Nick Valencia (ph), who has done just that. I trust him. You should, too. He's going to be sitting next to me and taking me through what he saw when he went back to Tijuana.

And one other story that I know you are going to be interested in, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: And that is?

SANCHEZ: Nine-year-old girl raped by her stepfather. She gets pregnant with twins. You following?

PHILLIPS: At nine?

SANCHEZ: At nine. What does a mother do, because the doctor says, if she carries the babies to full term, she'll likely die. So do you terminate the pregnancy and if you do, are you then going against your own faith, the Catholic faith. What does the Vatican do to the mother? What does the Vatican do to the doctors? And what does the mother ultimately decide? I mean this one, this one is like, wow!

PHILLIPS: You say this is stepdad that did this?

SANCHEZ: Stepdad.

PHILLIPS: Well, you start by shooting him and then dealing with the rest of the stuff.

SANCHEZ: Yes. You're right.

PHILLIPS: Thanks, Rick.

A dangerous case of chicken on the high seas. U.S. officials say Chinese ships harassed an American surveillance vessel. We'll go live to the Pentagon for the latest.

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PHILLIPS: Another international problem on President Obama's plate. U.S. officials say that Chinese ships played a dangerous game of chicken, with an American surveillance ship in international waters in the South China Sea. Chris Lawrence following the developments at the Pentagon.

Chris, what happened and how serious is it?

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, the Navy says the five Chinese boats aggressively blocked this U.S.N.S. Impeccable. In fact, they say some of the Chinese sailors waved Chinese flags and refused to allow the boat to continue forward. They say that the Impeccable is unarmed, so at one point, it fired its fire hoses at the Chinese boat. Now that soaked the Chinese sailors, but it didn't stop them. Apparently, they stripped down to their underwear and kept coming, one to about 25 feet of the Impeccable. Again, the U.S. says, when they asked for a safe path out of the area, that the Chinese boats cut them off and forced an emergency stop, and then dropped pieces of wood directly in the path of the Impeccable - Kyra.

PHILLIPS: So still don't have any understanding why they did this and is the Obama administration saying anything about this?

LAWRENCE: The Pentagon calls it one of the most aggressive actions it's seen in some time. The Obama administration has lodged a protest and says they will continue to operate in that area and expect the Chinese to respect international law.

PHILLIPS: Well, let us know if we hear anything more as to why China did what it did. Thanks, Chris.

Now to Iraq, where 12,000 American troops will be pulling out by September. A U.S. military spokesperson says the draw-down is possible because of a greatly improved security situation. President Obama has said that he'll withdraw most U.S. troops by the end of August next year. In addition, all 4,000 British soldiers still in Iraq are also scheduled to leave by September.

All right, that does it for us. See you back here tomorrow. Rick Sanchez picks it up from here.