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American Morning
Sunday Was Church Gunman's "Death Day"; U.S.-China Naval Standoff in the High Seas; Obama to Unveil Education Plan That Critics Call Too Ambitious; Getting a Car for a Buck?; Women: New Face of FBI
Aired March 10, 2009 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Well, it's coming up right on 7:00 here in New York. A lot in our agenda this morning. Here's what we're covering for you in the next 15 minutes.
We have new details about the man accused of killing a pastor and his plan to try to kill even more. Prosecutors say he marked Sunday "death day" in his planner. We're going to have more on some of the conditions he may have been suffering from as well.
Also developing right now, word of intense standoff at sea between the U.S. and China. The Pentagon says that Chinese ships harassed a U.S. surveillance ship in the South China Sea. China is accusing the U.S. of breaking international law. We are going to get the latest from the Pentagon just minutes away.
And it's day 50 of the Obama administration, one of the busiest starts to any administration in history but today there are signs of cracks within his own party, some impatience over plans to get the economy moving and the trillions being spent to do that.
And we begin the hour with chilling new details about the church shooting in Maryville, Illinois. A prosecutor on the case says that the 27-year-old suspect, Terry Sedlacek, marked Sunday as "death day" and was possibly ready to kill dozens of people. Meanwhile, one of the church pastors has met with the suspect's family who says they're "very sorry" for the congregation.
Jim Acosta tracking the latest for us this morning from Washington. And I'm sure investigators right now are talking to anybody they can, struggling to figure out what made this person commit this horrific crime.
JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Kiran. Some of the first clues are coming from the gunman's family who says Terry Sedlacek was mentally ill. But investigators still don't know why he carried out this rampage. He remains in the hospital in serious condition this morning. He had stabbed himself in the throat in the moments after the shooting. One thing police do know, this day of violence could have been much worse.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA (voice-over): Prosecutors say a day planner found in Terry Sedlacek's home marked Sunday as "death day." Investigators now say he came prepared to deliver, carrying enough ammunition to kill 30 people. He managed to fire four rounds, the first deflected by Pastor Fred Winters' Bible, another hitting the man most called Pastor Fred in the heart. After that, the gun jammed and Sedlacek was tackled by two men who jumped from the pews.
KEITH MELTON, SUBDUED ATTACKER IN CHURCH SHOOTING: I just ran and got behind the guy, managed to get my arms around him and pull him off the pastor. That's, you know, and then the struggle there somewhere within that struggle he was able to stab me.
ACOSTA: Investigators think Sedlacek arrived early, parking his Jeep closed to the door. Once inside, witnesses say he walked straight down the aisle right up to the pastor.
MELTON: As we were enjoying our church service, this gentleman just walked in, walked straight down the center aisle of the church, up to our pastor and our pastor paused to greet him and asked him if he could do anything for him and he opened fire.
ACOSTA: Investigators still aren't sure if the two knew each other. In an article published last August, Sedlacek's mother told the "St. Louis Post-Dispatch" her son had been diagnosed as mentally ill in high school and at one point had been taking up to 18 pills a day. Neighbors say they would sometimes see him running around like a ninja.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His karate moves and stuff and yelling and screaming.
ACOSTA: The church says it's keeping Sedlacek in its prayers, even sending a pastor to visit his family.
PASTOR MARK JONES, FIRST BAPTIST CHURCH: We actually pray for him. We pray that he apparently has a second chance.
ACOSTA: On the church's Web site, members have been posting memories of Pastor Fred, part of it with growing the congregation through his almost 22 years there. And his sermon Sunday was about finding happiness, similar to the one he delivered just a week before his death.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on, get happy. And we've been talking about keys to happiness in our life.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA: Sedlacek's mother has blamed her son's mental illness on Lyme Disease, a link that's the subject of serious debate and that the Centers for Disease Control calls highly unusual. A service for Pastor Fred who leaves behind a wife and two children will be held on Friday, Kiran.
CHETRY: All right. Jim Acosta for us this morning, thanks so much.
Also ahead on the Most News in the Morning, we're going to be talking with Keith Melton. You just saw him in Jim's piece. He's one of the two heroic men who tackled this gunman. His story in his own words live in about 30 minutes -- John.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: Looking forward to that coming up, Kiran.
Also developing this morning, the United States and China butting heads at sea. The Navy says Chinese boats harassed a U.S. ship, coming within 25 yards of it, close enough to see Chinese sailors allegedly stripping down to their underwear for some reason. It happened in the South China Sea in international waters according to the Pentagon. But now China is saying the United States had no business being there.
Our Chris Lawrence is working his sources at the Pentagon to come up with some answers here. International waters? The Chinese say the U.S. has no business there. And what's this business about stripping down to their underwear, Chris?
CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Yes, John. Well, defense officials, some of the defense officials that I've spoken with say they believe these are deliberate actions by the Chinese. Now, this involved a Navy ship that collects data for undersea warfare. And at one point, the crew thought their ship may be boarded by the Chinese but the Impeccable is unarmed so they sprayed their fire hoses at the Chinese boats.
Well, that soaked some of the Chinese sailors but it didn't stop them. They stripped down to their underwear, and kept coming.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LAWRENCE (voice-over): Sunday in the South China Sea, the Pentagon says a Chinese naval intelligence ship and four other vessels aggressively blocked the American ship Impeccable, one close to within 25 feet and ordered the Navy ship to leave. When the Impeccable asked for a safe path out of the area, two boats cut it off and forced an emergency stop. And the Navy says the Chinese sailors dropped pieces of wood in the Impeccable's path.
The Pentagon calls it "one of the most aggressive actions we've seen in some time," and the Obama administration has protested the Chinese's actions.
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE SPOKESMAN: We're going to continue to operate in those international waters, and we expect the Chinese to observe international law around that.
LAWRENCE: Analysts say this could be a test of the new administration, and the Chinese will be focusing less on words than what American ships actually do at sea.
JAMES CARAFANO, HERITAGE FOUNDATION: If we back off on the right of navigation, if we give in to bullying, the Chinese will interpret that as a real signal of weakness.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTS: Chris, you said aggressive displays on the part of the Chinese not an isolated incident?
LAWRENCE: No, the Defense Department says there were several incidents like this leading up to it, including one in which Chinese intelligence ship ordered the Impeccable to leave the area or "suffer the consequences." So the folks here believe these are no accidents.
ROBERTS: All right. We'll see which way this goes. Chris Lawrence for us at the Pentagon this morning. Chris, thanks so much.
CHETRY: And back here at home we're half way through President Obama's first 100 days. Day 50 of the new administration will be another ambitious one for the White House. The president will unveil the first part of his plan to overhaul the nation's education system. But the 800-pound gorilla in the room is still the economy.
Since taking office the Dow has tanked more than 1,400 points. It's down some 21 percent. Even business titan Warren Buffett not mincing words when talking about the situation we're in.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WARREN BUFFETT, ENTREPRENEUR: The economy ever since we talked in September, we talked about it being an economic Pearl Harbor and how what was happening in the financial world would move over to the real world very quickly. It's fallen off a cliff. And not only has the economy slowed down a lot, people have really changed their behavior, like nothing I've ever seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: Well, our Suzanne Malveaux is tracking things from the White House for us this morning. And as we know we can't underscore the fact that this is a huge challenge for the administration, dealing with the economy, tackling other things on the agenda and now also dealing with some pushback from Barack Obama's own party. The president facing some in Congress who are going to be making decisions about that budget, and whether or not certain things that he really wants to see happen are actually going to make it through Congress.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: You're absolutely right, Kiran. I talked to a top White House aide. He says, you know, what they're trying to do here is absolutely breathtaking and now you've got not only critics but supporters as well questioning whether or not this is all too much.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX (voice-over): Out of the gate, a bold agenda, some say too ambitious. Check out the scorecard. One of President Obama's first official acts, an executive order to shut down Guantanamo.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I have ordered the closing of the detention center at Guantanamo Bay and will seek swift and certain justice for captured terrorists.
MALVEAUX: A pledge to end torture. OBAMA: I can say, without exception or equivocation, that the United States will not torture.
MALVEAUX: Billions to bail out the banks, and $780 billion more to rescue more than 3.5 million jobs.
OBAMA: My bottom line is to make sure that we are saving or creating four million jobs. We are making sure that the financial system is working again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right there, right there!
MALVEAUX: Oh, and by the way, Mr. Obama says he's also taking steps to end the war in Iraq.
OBAMA: Let me say this as plainly as I can. By August 31st, 2010, our combat mission in Iraq will end.
MALVEAUX: CNN political analyst David Gergen, who has served as top adviser to Democratic and Republican presidents alike, offers this report card for the new guy in charge.
DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I think the foreign policy overall has been an "A." The handling of the economic crisis it seems to me is an incomplete.
MALVEAUX: As Mr. Obama himself admitted, he's already made some serious mistakes. Two of the president's high-profile appointees had to bow out over tax problems.
OBAMA: I think this is a mistake. I think I screwed up.
MALVEAUX: And despite Mr. Obama's efforts to woo Republicans, those in the House unanimously rejected his economic stimulus plan and his GOP pick for commerce secretary walked away from the job offer unable to stomach the president's economic policy. But Mr. Obama embracing his mandate for change is moving full speed ahead to roll out his bold agenda reforming health care, energy, education and stem cell research.
And the new president heads into his next 50 days with challenges that are equally daunting, with the markets tanking and more Americans losing their homes and jobs.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MALVEAUX: And, Kiran, that's why he sent his treasury secretary on the Hill just last night to talk to Democrats, and simply telling them, look, please be patient -- Kiran.
CHETRY: All right. Suzanne Malveaux for us at the White House this morning, thanks.
Also, President Obama speaks on education reformulator this morning and CNN will carry those remarks live, 9:45 a.m. Eastern, or if you're away from your TV you can also watch it online, CNN.com/live.
ROBERTS: Eleven minutes now after the hour and here's what we're following for you right now. Details just coming out about a financial plan that could finally help out the little guy.
Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner told House Democrats that the administration is working on ways to help small business. He was also forced to defend the president's efforts to free up loans and save jobs, reportedly saying we are doing in weeks what other countries did in years.
Congressman Barney Frank joining New York's attorney general pressing Bank of America over billions in bonuses that were paid out to Merrill Lynch executives last year. Bank of America bought out the investment bank as it was going under. B of A has taken $45 billion in taxpayer bailout money.
The father of so-called octomom Nadya Suleman is buying her $500,000 home for her and her 14 kids. Suleman last time is facing foreclosure because her mother could not keep up with the mortgage payments.
Twelve minutes after the hour. You're watching the Most News in the Morning.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Fourteen minutes past the hour. We fast forward now to look at the stories we'll be bringing you later today.
One of the stories we've been following here on AMERICAN MORNING, the growing violence on the border with Mexico. Today at 11:30 a.m. Eastern, a House subcommittee will be holding a hearing to discuss the problem. The Department of Homeland Security's response as well to this increasing violence we've seen there.
Also, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is hoping that today will be the day that the $410 billion spending bill will clear the Senate. John McCain attempted to strip the bill of earmarks. It was defeated, though, by Democrats and Republicans. The White House says that President Obama will sign the measure despite its more than 8,000 pet projects.
And, of course, all eyes will be on the markets today. The New York Stock Exchange closed yesterday at another 12-year low. Be sure to stay with CNN and CNN.com for all the latest financial news concerning you and your money.
Those are the stories we're following for you this morning. Hopefully perhaps some help out there with a new plan that could help small businesses.
ROBERTS: Yes. Remember we had that iReporter out there yesterday who was telling us, you know, complaining that it's all of these big businesses who are getting all the help and that the little guys aren't getting any help at all. Well, the nation's small businesses may get some help from the government.
Christine Romans here "Minding Your Business" this morning. Details on a new plan that Tim Geithner was hinting about last night.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: That's right. We're learning more details about a plan that would help small business. It would fund, you know, boost liquidity, which means boost money and credit and the availability of credit to small business.
You know, there's been a lot of criticism that hundreds of billions of dollars are going to Citigroup and Bank of America and AIG. But what about the little businesses around the country that are such huge drivers of job creation, who are literally closing their doors because they can't get credit because the economy is hitting them so badly? So we're learning a little bit more about what the Obama administration wants to do for small business.
We don't know many of the details or plans, but we know that they're very soon going to come out with a plan that is going to address this and try to get more money to them. Again, increase the liquidity, increase the lending to small business, open it up to get the money flowing.
We know already that the administration has put some $730 million in the stimulus bill for small business, some $700 million in the proposed budget. This would be separate from all of that. It would be another measure much like that consumer lending program we think the TALF, they call it, another terrible acronym.
ROBERTS: So $1.4 billion in total spending on this, any idea how you qualify for it?
ROMANS: No idea yet how you qualify for it. We just know that they're working on the details to try to get more help out there. Again, probably in response to so much of the criticism, the big guys had so much help.
ROBERTS: Oh, yes.
ROMANS: What about the little guys?
ROMANS: Exactly.
ROMANS: We'll look for more of those details, but we know that this is something that they are working on. We can confirm that they are working on a new plan for this.
ROBERTS: Good deal, Christine, thanks so much.
ROMANS: Sure.
ROBERTS: Seventeen minutes now after the hour.
CHETRY: Buy a truck, get a car for free?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) PETER VALDES-DAPENA, CNNMONEY.COM: You're not getting a free car, believe me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: How desperate can a dealer get?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JESSICA CALDWELL, ANALYST, EDMUNDS.COM: If you had told someone two, three years ago that you can buy a vehicle and get one free, I think most people would have thought you're crazy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: The most outrageous car deals out there, ahead on the Most News in the Morning.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Some of the top videos right now at CNN.com. Check out video of a store clerk overpowering a robber carrying a fully loaded shotgun. The man burst behind the counter with a double barrel shotgun, but the clerk quickly turns the tables by twisting the man into a choke hold using his own weapon. You don't want be in the business end of a shotgun. The would-be robber got away but left behind a shoe which police are now using to track him down.
Reunited after 39 years, two pilots who flew together in Vietnam meet for the first time since one man saved the other's life during a rescue operation in Vietnam. They located each other last year using the Internet.
And presidential partying, President Obama seen here in this video showing some of his loose moves at Senator Ted Kennedy's birthday concert over the weekend.
And those are the most popular videos on CNN.com right now -- Kiran.
CHETRY: He was very subtle. If you blinked, you missed it. He just only danced for a second there.
Well, if you want to buy a car for a buck, one dealership is hoping that you'll drive up sales in the process and buzz in a down economy that has a lot of people talking. But, of course, there's a catch.
CNN's Mary Snow joins us now to explain. It's not as good as it sounds.
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Kiran. Yes, but certainly gaining a lot of attention. Some say it's desperation. Others say it's a sign of people getting a lot more clever in a very tough climate.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW (voice-over): It sounds too good to be true: Buy a big truck at this Seattle dealership and you get a small car for $1.
CURT BUSH, MANAGER: We're not desperately selling cars. What we're trying to get people knowing who we are and get people out and let them know there is good deals out there.
SNOW: It certainly is a deal getting attention. But those who follow the industry say read the fine print.
PETER VALDES-DAPENA, CNNMONEY.COM: You're not getting a free car, believe me. Because if from what I understand within a set up like this, you pay full sticker price for a heavy duty pickup truck which, first of all, nobody is paying full sticker price for big trucks right now.
SNOW: Still the Seattle dealership says it's made about a dozen sales since it promoted the deal last week, and there have been a number of similar offers around the country.
JESSICA CALDWELL, ANALYST, EDMUNDS.COM: I think it absolutely is a sign of desperation at these dealerships. If you had told someone two, three years ago that you can buy a vehicle and get one for free, I think most people would have thought you're crazy.
SNOW: Newspapers are flooded with incentives. Pick your payment, reads this dealership ad. Mitsubishi touts a recovery program with zero percent APR for 60 months in this ad. But it is Hyundai that has been gaining the most attention. Hyundai first offered to take a car back if you lose a job within a year. In February, it sweetened the deal.
NARRATOR: We expanded our Hyundai assurance so that if you lose your income, we'll make your payments for three months. And if that's not enough time to work things out --
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: Now for Hyundai, there are signs that this program is actually working. Its car sales haven't been as bad as competitors, and GM for one has said it's looking at Hyundai's program as well as other incentives in order to boost sales. And it's expected that some of these carmakers will be following soon in trying that program.
CHETRY: Just a fascinating sign of the times, though. If you need a new car but you're not sure about what else, you know, is going to go wrong, you have some assurance with this. It's legit. It's above-board, Hyundai's program?
SNOW: Their motto has been, "We're in this together."
CHETRY: Right.
SNOW: And, you know, so far, it seems that that has been connecting with people. CHETRY: Wow, all right. Mary Snow for us, thanks.
SNOW: Sure.
CHETRY: John?
ROBERTS: He went to church to worship and instead may have saved dozens of people from being killed. We're talking live to Keith Melton. He helped tackle the man who shot his pastor over the weekend.
It's 24 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. On 9/11 the enemy changed and so did the way that we fight crime. The FBI got more power and more creativity.
CNN's Deborah Feyerick has got more on the new face of the bureau for us this morning. She joins us.
Hey, Deb.
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, John. The FBI's power really has grown in the last seven years since major changes were enacted after 9/11. Now, investigators look at crime in a whole new way through the eyes of people trained to see the larger picture.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FEYERICK (voice-over): FBI international terrorism analyst Jennifer Ruiz knew right away she was on to something.
JENNIFER RUIZ, FBI INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: I found something just kind of hit me like a ton of bricks. And I, you know, I said this has to be something that is going to lead us somewhere and give us a big break so I presented it to the case agents and they loved it.
FEYERICK: Ruiz does not carry a gun but does arm investigators with intelligence about crime in Eastern Europe and the former Soviet Republic. And for colleague Summer Yves (ph), specializes in terror financing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The agents work more on the operational side of what's going on, where I, on the intelligence side, am more focused on analyzing trends and patterns.
FEYERICK: In other words the big picture, and this is the new face of the FBI. Since 9/11, a 150 percent jump in the number of intelligence analyst whose primary mission is to think outside the box. That includes terrorism financing, human trafficking, money laundering and cybercrime, all connected says superviser agent Karen Lawrence.
KAREN LAWRENCE, FBI SUPERVISORY INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: The bad guys don't really separate themselves out by, well, I only do international affairs. And I do not engage in other criminal activity. Obviously, they're doing whatever they need to do so...
FEYERICK (on camera): And that's where what you're in charge of doing is connecting all the dots.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's absolutely no question that we are much safer today.
FEYERICK (voice-over): Teresa Carlson is one of the top agents heading up the FBI's intelligence division in New York.
TERESA CARLSON, FBI ASST. SPECIAL AGENT: The analyst is looking at from this is what we don't know. These are the things that we need to, in addition, go out and find out. They may not be an element of the crime, but the agents looking for it is looking to prison these elements of the crime that it's all this other stuff that is helping us building a big picture of monitoring the threat and being able to neutralize the threat across the board.
FEYERICK: The Patriot Act, new attorney general guidelines have given the FBI more authority to collect intelligence. Both have been criticized but these analysts say the bureau has benefited due to greater cooperation between intelligence agencies, something taboo in the past.
Teacher turned cyber-analyst Suruchi Chen, the difference is huge.
SURUCHI CHEN, FBI INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: To say, you know, I'm working with 23 other countries, it's pretty awesome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FEYERICK: Now in the end, it boils down to better communication. Not only do you have these intelligence analysts teaming up with investigators but within the last few months, the FBI has now added another layer of analysts, strategic analysts who look at all cases everywhere in an attempt to make even more connections. All that information then goes back to the executives at headquarters so they've got a bigger stake in it, too, because they know what's going on looking all the cases.
ROBERTS: But I can hear the question a lot of people at home are asking now. That young woman went from being a teacher to an FBI intelligence analyst. How does she make that transition and why?
FEYERICK: Well, the reason she made it is she just thought that she was doing her duty to the country. It was a more interesting job for her. She's also a Hindi linguist, so that's her specialty.
And they train them. They train people who just are eager to get in and to learn. So it's really an interesting dynamic, but all of these women came from different jobs prior to joining the FBI within the last couple of years.
ROBERTS: Great stuff. Deb, thanks so much for bringing that to us.
Twenty-nine minutes now after the hour. And here are this morning's most important stories we're following for you.
Day 50 of the Obama administration, half way through the first 100 days. And in just over two hours, the president will lay out details to start overhauling the country's broken education system. Critics say the White House is taking on too much and should remain focused solely on the economy.
Five detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba are apparently admitting to the 9/11 terrorist attacks in a new document. The "New York Times" also reporting among the five is self-described 9/11 mastermind, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. Their document calls the attacks "a badge of honor." Several of the men have already admitted to the attacks, so their motive for doing so again is unclear at this point.
Louisiana Republican Senator David Vitter introducing an amendment to end cost of living raises for members of Congress. Vitter attached the amendment to the $410 billion spending bill now on the debate on Capitol Hill. Right now, lawmakers make $174,000 a year. Critics accuse Vitter of playing politics -- Kiran.
CHETRY: This morning, we're learning new details about the chilling murder of Pastor Fred Winters. A prosecutor says Terry Sedlacek marked Sunday in his planner as "death day" and was carrying enough ammunition to possibly kill as many as 30 people. Police are now charging the 27-year-old with first-degree murder, and two churchgoers tackled the shooter, heroically stopping him before he could hurt anyone else.
One of those men is Keith Melton. He joins us live to tell his story. You're a parishioner at the First Baptist Church in Maryville, Illinois, where this happened. Thank you so much for joining us this morning. First of all, how are you doing?
KEITH MELTON, SUBDUED ATTACKER IN CHURCH SHOOTING: Well, thank you, Kiran. All things considered, I think I'm holding up pretty well. I think as most of the congregation, we're still stunned. We have a lot of grieving yet to do, and I believe that grieving will start in the coming days as we have Pastor Winters's funeral here.
CHETRY: Right, and I understand you had a memorial service as well for him, to remember his life and celebrate his life. If could you walk us through the day this past Sunday, you and your wife were attending services together, and you say the pastor was well into his sermon when this young man, who turned out to be the attacker, started walking down the aisle of the church. What did you think? What was going through your mind when you saw this man walking right up to the pastor?
MELTON: Well, as he walked by me, the first thing that I thought was it just seemed a little out of place for someone to be walking up to the front to take a seat at that point in the sermon. Like I said, he was well into his sermon, but then he continued up directly in front of the pastor as he was preaching. And the pastor paused, said good morning to him, asked him what he could do for him. And at that point, the assailant pulled out the gun and started shooting.
CHETRY: You describe what happened at first. The first shot -- round was blocked by the pastor's Bible, right? It sort of almost disintegrated into the air. It looked like confetti. And then what did the pastor do after that first shot was blocked?
MELTON: Well, as we were trying to register what was going on, seeing all the confetti, it was a bit confusing just at first, but you could see by the pastor's reaction that that was not anything that was a part of what he was doing, and he started trying to escape the assailant.
CHETRY: And you said that he went after him with a laser focus and eventually, tragically, he shot and killed him. At this point, you jumped out of your seat. You ran over there trying to help him. What happened in the aftermath of the pastor being shot?
MELTON: Well, when the first shot rang out, like I said, most of us were just kind of stunned, trying to gather our minds about what was going on. But by the time the second shot rang, there were a number of us that sprang into action, and I immediately ran. And as the pastor was trying to flee from him, basically once the pastor jumped off the stage and into the aisleway, he was met by the gunman. And they were in close quarters, still, you know -- they were still standing but still kind of wrestling together as I got there and was able to get the assailant off of him, but obviously not before the fatal shot was fired.
CHETRY: And you say he put up quite a fight. He actually tried to get away. You grabbed him around the leg. Someone else, also another parishioner, was trying to help out. And that's when he pulled out a knife. You didn't even realize that he had stabbed you.
MELTON: No, it was minutes after before I'd even realized that. I'm sure the adrenaline rush and everything going on, and -- because once he turned to flee from me and I was able to tackle him, as soon as I looked up, I mean, there were men everywhere. They were blocking the aisles. They were doing everything they could to keep this guy contained.
And immediately, once they had him secured, I ran back to the pastor to see if I could help, but by that time there were more people there who were better skilled at trying to help him. And it was in that time that I realized I'd been stabbed.
CHETRY: You were treated and released, thank goodness. You said you got a tetanus shot. But you guys lost Pastor Winters. But we're learning new details now about just how much worse it could have been.
Apparently this suspect had in his home in a planner. And it was marked Sunday as "death day," that he had enough ammunition possibly to kill as many as 30 people, according to prosecutors. Have you thought about just how much worse this situation could have gotten if you hadn't acted and others hadn't acted when they did to try get this guy down?
MELTON: It certainly -- I have. You know, of course most of that come to light afterwards. I did hear someone say after we had him subdued there were other magazines there, but I didn't know the extent of that until the news came out yesterday.
CHETRY: And how are you guys dealing with this in terms of trying to understand how this random act of violence came to your congregation for no apparent reason?
MELTON: You know, Kiran, I don't think that we're ever going to be able to make sense of it. You know, evil exists in the world, and it's going to continue to strive, and we just have to trust God and help him heal us through this because I truly believe we'll never make sense of it.
CHETRY: Well, Keith, you potentially saved many, many more lives that day, and I know that this is a tough situation for you and your congregation. We're certainly thinking about you, and thanks so much for joining us this morning. We appreciate it.
MELTON: Thanks, Kiran. We covet all your prayers.
CHETRY: All right. Thirty-five minutes past the hour.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTS (voice-over): Why Oprah thinks Rihanna should run.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chris Brown wants a misdemeanor with no jail time, and of course people in the Hill want a little sip of ice water.
ROBERTS: Stars, violence and scandal. The latest on the Rihanna-Chris Brown saga and why Oprah is getting involved ahead on the most news in the morning.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Well, the Rihanna-Chris Brown drama deepens this morning. Now Oprah is involved. The queen of talk has a strong warning for the female pop star, and Randi Kaye brings it to us this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Rihanna, are you listening? Oprah is talking to you.
OPRAH WINFREY, HOST, "THE OPRAH WINFREY SHOW": If a man hits you once, he will hit you again.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's right.
WINFREY: He will hit you again. I don't care what his plea is. He will hit you again.
KAYE: That was Oprah on her show last week warning singer Rihanna that her boyfriend, Chris Brown, will likely hurt her again. Brown is charged with two felonies for assault and criminal threats. Word that after a public apology from Brown, the couple is back together not only raised red flags for Oprah but also alarmed Linda Fairstein, former chief prosecutor for the New York D.A.'s sex crimes unit who now tracks domestic abuse.
LINDA FAIRSTEIN, FMR. CHIEF PROSECUTOR, NEW YORK D.A.: This is deadly conduct. This is not a late (ph) bruising and assault. This is something that has a tendency to escalate.
KAYE: The police affidavit alleges Brown assaulted Rihanna in a Lamborghini after she read a text message from another woman with whom he had a sexual relationship. The affidavit says he shoved her head against the passenger window and continued to punch her in the face. Police say Brown threatened to kill her and placed her in a headlock until she began to lose consciousness. This photograph obtained from the gossip and entertainment Web site, TMZ, shows the victim's battered face.
FAIRSTEIN: He choked her until she was practically unconscious, rates very high on that predictability scale. Verbalizing the threats to commit murder, again rate very high on the chart.
KAYE: Fairstein says this case reminds her of patterns she's seen before. What is your advice for Rihanna?
FAIRSTEIN: Get serious counseling about this, unless his behavior changes, unless he's brought to understand it, she's really not safe with him.
KAYE: Brown will enter a plea next month. He hasn't talked about the charges against him, and it's unlikely he'll be sitting on Oprah's couch any time soon. Her show on domestic violence airs later this week, and no matter how much advice she has, neither Chris Brown nor Rihanna are expected to appear. Randi Kaye, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHETRY: All right. And here's what we're working on for you in the next 30 minutes.
A miracle surgery for a little seven-year-old. She wound up being the donor and the recipient of her own organs. Dr. Sanjay Gupta tells us how.
And right now, states are trying to figure out how they'll spend billions in stimulus money. We're going to show you one state's solution in the eye-popping proposals that they're receiving. It's 41 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Wow, a pretty shot this morning as the sun is shining over Baltimore. Good morning, Baltimore. It's 40 degrees right now, and a little bit later today it's going up to 49 for a high and it will be cloudy. So enjoy it now. Pretty sight, though.
Rob Marciano is with us this morning. He is keeping an eye on extreme weather for us. A little quieter there than it has been though over the past few days.
ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Quiet maybe where you are, but right now we've got some construction work going on here so I can hear somebody drilling or the earth or the ground is shaking. Everything's fine. Got a big storm just rolling across the Midwest right now and some weird things have been happening across parts of the Great Lakes. It's going to show you some dramatic ice video coming in off of Saginaw Bay, this from Lake Huron, with northeast winds that's taking the ice up, piles up there along the shoreline and just moving it onshore into these beach houses.
They had to do some evacuations there, dramatic stuff. That's something they have rarely seen. Meanwhile, a little farther to the south, flooding issues across parts of northwest Ohio. Check out some of these aerials along the Blanchard river. This is Findlay, Ohio. They make some of the best U.S. flags there, will make Betsy Ross proud. But they are wet this morning with all this water. It's heading down river towards Ottawa and they're bracing for the crest right now.
So, a lot of floodwaters in effect for parts of this part of world with more on the way and snow also going to be an issue. Heavy rain right now from Fort Wayne to Kalamazoo with some snow working its way all the way back through parts of north and south Dakota. You could see a foot of snow and blizzard conditions for places like -
CHETRY: You weren't kidding. I'm listening to you and some sort of drill or saw. Did they know you're on a live show...
MARCIANO: We're trying to make TV down here. We're all working together -- Kiran.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stand by.
CHETRY: Somebody said stand by.
MARCIANO: Kyra Phillips bringing me the baby hammer so I can go to work rebuilding the CNN Center.
CHETRY: Is Kyra doing repair work on the Atlanta set in the meantime? I mean what the heck is going on down there?
MARCIANO: I have no idea. I just show up and hope my key works to get in the building every day.
CHETRY: I hear you. All right. Your key works, your drill works and apparently your buzz saw does as well. All right...
MARCIANO: We're going to work here.
CHETRY: See you in a few minutes.
MARCIANO: See you.
CHETRY: Bye, Rob.
ROBERTS: Sounds like my dentist showed up down there. Forty-six and a half minutes after the hour.
Here's what we're working on new this morning, Jay Leno doing free standup in Motown. He says its to boost spirits and the economy. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAY LENO, HOST, "THE TONIGHT SHOW WITH JAY LENO": Awful lot of people unemployed, out of work, don't have any entertainment dollars. You're not really going out. You're not doing anything. One of my favorite places is Detroit, and there are so many out of work autoworkers, people work hard their whole lives. They're saving their money and I thought why don't we go to Detroit and do some shows, do a free show, I called up the Palace where the Pistons play, they gave me the whole place.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Really?
LENO: I called up Pepsi, one of our sponsors and I said I want to do a show for not just the autoworkers, anybody out of work in Detroit, but here's what we're going to do. Tickets will be available next Monday, it's the honor system. If you haven't taken your wife out, if you haven't taken your husband out, just want to get out for a night, maybe forget your troubles, forget the mortgage, come for a night of comedy. We'll pick up the parking, no parking to park. It's all free, we do a comedy show. It's April 7th.
As I said, Pepsi has been great. They're going to refresh the evening, so to speak. Yes, that's their whole campaign. But it will be free. It won't cost you a dime. You can pick up your tickets next Monday, go to our Web site and find more information out. Like if say, if you're an autoworker, and you've been laid off, and you haven't just gotten out of the house because there's nothing to do, not that I'm the greatest comic in the world, but it's free. If you don't like it, get your money back. We'll see you on April 7th.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: There you go. Jay Leno with the money-back guarantee. If you don't like my free comedy, you can get your money back. All free.
Jupiter finally growing out of the awkward teen years. The planet's great red spots slowly clearing up, according to scientists. Amazing what a little Proactiv will do. They say the spot is a colossal storm that lasted for 300 years but now study shows the storm is getting smaller as the giant planet goes through its own climate change.
CHETRY: Wow, that will teach us the next time we complain about the weather.
ROBERTS: Or acne.
And a 200-year-old shipwreck discovered in the Gulf of Mexico. Archaeologists pulled up some of the most delicate items still intact including French wine bottles, British beer bottle and utensils. Research shows that the wreck may be a shipped named "Rapid." It's an American vessel that sank in November of 1813 as it tried to outrun a British warship. That's what's new this morning, it's 49 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Here's a story about a seven-year-old girl who underwent a very risky operation and involved removing six of her internal organs in a procedure that lasted 23 hours. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta is with us this morning. He is in Atlanta. This is pretty extraordinary surgery, Sanjay. I think only the second time that this has ever happened and the first time in a child?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. It is a pretty remarkable surgery. It's sort of a major transplant surgery where the patient is both the donor and the recipient at the same time. 23 hours as you mentioned. Good news story here, John. The seven-year-old is doing very well. This operation back in February. Doctors saying she has done very well.
She had what is known as a mild fibroblastic tumor. It's a type of tumor that invades organs and it can be very difficult to remove. It can wrap itself around blood vessels. It can feel like concrete when it's being taken out. So in order to get this out about a baseball-sized tumor, they had to remove six organs. You are looking at them, the entire contents of essentially her abdominal cavity, her pancreas, her spleen, her liver and both her large and her small intestine.
They did this operation, they have to -- while the operation itself took 23 hours, the time that the organs were out of the body, a much shorter time because you need to get those organs back in the body. Ultimately, they were able to replace the liver and the large and small intestines. This tumor had sort of invaded around the pancreas, the spleen and stomach so they had to sort of refashion a new stomach.
She is going to be without a pancreas. So she needs to take insulin as if she were a diabetic, take digestive enzymes which the pancreas also produces. And she's going to be without a spleen as well. But you know, bottom line is as you pointed out, John, remarkable and first time its been done in a child and she seems to be doing very well, John.
ROBERTS: If doctors basically eviscerated her, Sanjay and people at home might ask the question how did they keep her alive during all of that time?
GUPTA: It is challenging. I think there's a reason probably this hasn't been done very frequently. In fact, you had the doctor on AMERICAN MORNING last year who did this operation on an adult. He is the same doctor that did it on the child. So this is a doctor who is, I guess, pioneering this type of operation. You think about it sort of like you're operating on the engine while the engine is still running. You got to keep the engine running very, very slowly and you got to do the repairs frankly as quickly as possible.
Out of all of those organs that we just showed on the screen, the one that is crucial, the one that is the most time sensitive really is the liver. So they really probably took that out near the end and put it back out as quickly as possible. But the other ones, she can live without for a period of time, John.
ROBERTS: And they had the father standing by for potential live liver donation.
GUPTA: I know. Remarkable. Really remarkable.
ROBERTS: Unbelievable. Sanjay, thanks for bringing that to us this morning.
GUPTA: Thanks, John.
ROBERTS: Good to see you, Doc.
Fifty-three minutes after the hour.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHETRY (voice-over): How would you spend stimulus billions? America weighs in?
The plumber. The student.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm kind of struggling right now with money.
CHETRY: Stimulus wish list. Suggestion, suggestion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did you ever expect to see this kind of interest?
CHETRY: You're watching the most news in the morning.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Well being a parent can be very challenging, especially when your child makes a mistake and knowing how to discipline is always tough. Alina Cho joins us now with a startling case that started out with a child's bad decision but what happened to this family after that is truly outrageous. This really is an amazing story.
ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's an amazing story and there could be thousands of cases just like this one. You know, a kid makes a bad decision. Parent calls the cops because they want to teach the kid a lesson. What happened next is really surprising, guys. You know, we're talking about judges who are literally paid millions of dollars to send kids to jail.
The kickbacks came from the privately run juvenile detention centers that stood to make those millions by increasing the head count. Kids as young as 12 hauled away for trespassing and fighting on the school bus, even pocketing loose change. Kids who are taken away from their parents and, in some cases, for years.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHO (voice-over): The day is seared in Linda Donovan's memory.
LINDA DONOVAN, SON VICTIM OF JUDGE'S CORRUPTION: They just grab him like he is some kind of hard criminal, like he is a murderer and rip him away and there is nothing you can do.
CHO: Nearly three years ago, her son Eric, 11 at the time, took her car out for a joy ride. Eric crashed the car and Linda called the police. She wanted to teach her son a lesson and thought, at most, he would get a slap on the wrist. What happened next shocked both mother and son.
ERIC STEFANSKI, VICTIM OF JUDGE'S CORRUPTION: The guy said - grabbed my arm and said "come this way" and that was it. He just put the handcuffs and shackles on.
CHO: Eric at the age of 12 was hauled away to a juvenile detention center. What were your emotions that day?
STEFANSKI: Scared, confused, helpless.
CHO: Most of all alone. For the next two years, Eric was shuttled from lock-up to lock-up. He says he even thought about suicide.
STEFANSKI: I would call her and say, "it's not worth it. I'm never going to see you again."
CHO: This past October he finally came home but before they could celebrate they learned Eric's case was part of a countywide corruption scandal that has rocked the small section of eastern Pennsylvania. Two judges, Mark Ciavarella and Mike Conahan charged in a federal case involving $2.6 million in kickbacks. In return for the money the judges sent teens to at least two privately run juvenile detention centers which stood to gain by filling them up.
MIKE CEFALO, ATTORNEY, KIDSFORCASH.COM: I mean, there's a kid who fought on a school bus, he got nine months in detention. Another one put something on MySpace about a teacher and told everyone it was a joke, those people got time in detention. I mean, this is crazy.
CHO: Lawyer Mike Cefalo is representing more than 200 families. And the list keeps growing. DONOVAN: All this time I thought I was blaming myself. It's my fault, I should never should have called the cops and to hear a greedy judge is behind this, I'm irate.
CHO: What's worse, Eric has changed. Both at home and at school.
STEFANSKI: They think I'm crazy.
CHO: How does that make you feel?
STENFANSKI: Like an outcast.
CHO: The judges have pleaded guilty to fraud and tax charges. They've been disbarred and under the plea deal will serve more than seven years in prison. For Linda and her son, that is little consolation.
DONOVAN: We have to make up for the two years that was taken away. We'll never get back what we had. We'll never be the way we used to be.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHO: CNN has reached out to both judges and their lawyers. Nobody would comment to us, but Judge Mark Ciavarella told the "Guardian" newspaper in Great Britain he only wanted to, quote, "help these kids straighten out their lives."
"Cash for kids?" he responds. "All I wanted was for these children to avoid becoming statistics in an adult world." But clearly, the families see this very differently. Their lives have been changed forever, guys. And there could be thousands of cases just like this.
The lawyer that we talked to, representing more than 200 families right now, he gets 35 to 40 letters a day, letters not written in many cases by the parents but by the kids themselves. Handwritten letters, just incredible to read.
ROBERTS: Unbelievable. Thanks for bringing that to us this morning, Alina.
CHO: You bet.
