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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Sotomayor Under Fire; Obama and the Middle East; GM Selling Hummer; Amnesty Agenda
Aired June 02, 2009 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, HOST: Good evening, everybody.
Supreme Court nominee Judge Sotomayor goes to Capitol Hill in part to defend herself against charges that she's putting group and identity politics ahead of the law. But she refuses to talk with reporters about her controversial remarks on Latina women and white male judges.
Also President Obama offering Iran what critics say is another concession only days before he is to deliver a speech from Egypt. Tonight we examine the president's struggle to convince Islamic nations that the United States is what he calls a role model.
And the Obama administration and the U.S. Chamber of Commerce working together to delay the expansion of E-Verify to delay its implementation for a fourth time, trying maybe to kill it outright. E-Verify of course is the single most effective program against illegal immigration.
We'll also be examining the president's push for another immigration enforcement program while ignoring gaping holes in our border and port security. That's the subject of our "Face-Off" debate tonight.
We begin with Judge Sonia Sotomayor's visit to Capitol Hill today. The Supreme Court nominee tried to end the outrage over her suggestion that a quote, "wise Latina woman", end quote, would make a better judge than a white male. Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Senator Patrick Leahy said Judge Sotomayor promised to apply the law ultimately and completely regardless of circumstance. The ranking Republican on the Judiciary Committee, Senator Jeff Sessions promised Judge Sotomayor's confirmation hearings will be fair. Dana Bash has our report from Capitol Hill.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): One Senate office to another, Judge Sonia Sotomayor sat, smiled and made small talk for the cameras before meeting privately with the senators now judging her. As she made her rounds, Sotomayor would not answer questions publicly, not even about incendiary charges against her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you think of the fact that two prominent conservatives have called you a racist?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) BASH: But the majority Democrats first on her calling card made a pre-emptive move to address that controversy figuring prominently in Republican attacks. Her quote from a 2001 speech suggesting as a Latina woman saying she would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I did raise that question.
BASH: Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy told reporters he asked her about it and he announced her response.
SEN. PATRICK LEAHY (D), VERMONT: What she said was of course one's life experience shapes who you are, but ultimately and completely, and she used those words, ultimately and completely as a judge, you follow the law.
BASH: A senior Democratic source tells CNN Democrats made a tactical decision to have Leahy ask Sotomayor about the controversy so he could portray her answer before Republicans did. Ironically the lead Republican on the Senate Judiciary Committee didn't go there.
Did you directly ask her about the comments that she made in 2001?
SEN. JEFF SESSIONS (R), JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: No, not directly. We talked about the idea and the concept of personal feelings and -- to some degree.
BASH: He's saving pointed questions for later. He called Sotomayor delightful after cameras captured this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You saw Senator Leahy before you got here, and that's -- he's as knowledgeable about this process as anybody you'll find, that's for sure.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BASH: Now Senator Jeff Sessions may not have asked Sotomayor about her controversial comments suggesting that a Latina woman would use her experience to make a better decision than a white male, but other senators, we are told did. Senators of both parties, in fact, Lou, Senator Dianne Feinstein, a Democrat, just came out of her meeting with Judge Sotomayor and said that she did ask about the comments and Sotomayor responded that those were a poor choice of words. Lou?
DOBBS: Did she though renounce those words? Did she say, this is what is not clear in listening to Senator Leahy, did she say in point of fact that her statements would have no part in making a judgment because that was precisely what she was talking about was making rulings from the bench and the advantages of being a Latina woman over being a white male?
BASH: As far as we know, she didn't explicitly say that. But that again emphasizes as far as we know because she had eight or more meetings today with senators and some Republicans we know did ask her about this. We're not -- they're not telling us what they specifically asked and even more so not telling us what she specifically said, but you know you can bet that this will come out in a very public way -- public way rather once these hearings start -- Lou.
DOBBS: And the posturing has already begun on both the part of the Republicans and the Democrats. Thank you very much, Dana Bash.
BASH: Thank you.
DOBBS: President Obama tonight is headed to the Middle East and to Europe. The president today indicated that Iran does have the right to nuclear power, provided its nuclear ambitions are as he put it, peaceful. The president says he hopes his tour will begin a new dialogue between the United States and the Muslim world. Candy Crowley has our report. Candy, what does the president hope to gain?
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he has a very big speech in Cairo which has been much anticipated in the Muslim world. He sees this as part of a continuum of something that he started when he first got into office. What he wants to do, as he puts it, open up a dialogue with the Muslim world, with the Arab world. And the reason this is so eagerly anticipated is will he get specific?
And I'm told the answer to that is not very. But he sees it and says he understands that eventually actions are going to be what in fact helps that relationship and not words. But he is looking particularly when he goes to Saudi Arabia and meets with the king, when he meets with Hosni Mubarak in Egypt, he really needs their help.
He needs their help in the Israeli Palestinian peace process. If he can move Israel along, he is going to need help from Muslim countries, from Arab countries to push along the Palestinians. So this is one of the things he's seeking, obviously a more steady flow of oil would be helpful. But in general, when he's reaching out to the Muslim world, what the president is trying to do is really reset the relationship that the Muslim world said went very, very sour over the past eight years when President Bush, among other things started war in two Muslim countries.
I think if you will look here, this is U.S. opinion here of Muslim countries. Only 21 percent of Americans said they had a favorable view of Muslim countries, unfavorable, almost twice as much at 46 percent. And I can tell you, Lou, on the other side it is equally suspicious. Gallup did a poll of Arab countries and found that three out of four in Arab countries disapproved of U.S. leadership. So this is a pretty big gap here.
DOBBS: A big gap, it's a gap that has -- that the previous administration twice tried to bridge in the interest of lowering oil prices, both times with Saudi Arabia, both President Bush and his vice president, Dick Cheney being rebuffed by the Saudis. This will be also a key element of whatever success this president can hope to achieve in this trip, correct.
CROWLEY: Well absolutely, but I will say that is not something that they have put out there as a possibility, but something that he indeed will bring up in his conversations. Generally they have taken, sort of a 50,000 foot-view here and said stability in the region is one of the best things that could happen for the stability of oil supply, but obviously Saudi Arabia, a U.S. friend, a U.S. ally has a lot to do with that.
Now they argue that really speculators that keep driving the price of oil up, that it's not supply. So obviously this is going to be part of the conversation, but I would say in general his two stops in Saudi Arabia and Egypt really are part of his effort to reach out to the Muslim world for a variety of reasons.
DOBBS: OK and not reaching out to the state of Israel, he will not be visiting Israel this trip, part of the equation intentionally avoiding that part of the symmetry of the region?
CROWLEY: Well, certainly it must be intentionally because I am assuming that he had some control over his -- over his schedule. But yes, that is very much looked at as he tries to sort of operate on the Arab side of the equation, of the Palestinian-Israeli peace. So I have not yet heard whether the Israelis feel snubbed, but nonetheless, it is being noted.
DOBBS: All right, Candy Crowley, thank you very much.
President Obama strongly defending his decision to close the military prison at Guantanamo Bay despite bipartisan opposition on Capitol Hill and public opinion strongly against him as well -- lawmakers are refusing to provide money to close down the prison until the president has a clear plan for the detainees.
And a new poll indicates most Americans agree with Congress on this issue, the Gallup poll shows fully two-thirds of Americans oppose the president's plan to close the Guantanamo Bay prison. Even more Americans, three-quarters oppose the idea of transferring detainees to prisons in the United States.
The Brazilian defense minister tonight has confirmed that searchers have found debris from a missing Air France aircraft that disappeared over the Atlantic Ocean. That aircraft carried 228 people including two Americans. Searchers have found an airplane seat, a life vest, and other wreckage, a debris field that reaches over three miles, but no signs whatever of life.
Brazilian officials say that the wreckage was found 50 miles east of the aircraft's flight path, 600 miles from the Brazilian coast. The Airbus A330 disappeared yesterday after hitting a powerful thunderstorm.
General Motors reaches a deal to sell one of its iconic brands to communist China and corporate elites trying to kill the single most effective federal program against illegal immigration with the help of the Obama administration. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Home sales jumped almost seven percent in April. That is the biggest monthly increase in pending wholesales in nearly eight years. And another indication that the housing market in this country is stabilizing. But it's not a sure sign that the housing crisis has ended. Home sales driven by price reductions, low interest rates and a first-time buyer tax credit.
For the automobile industry a late-month sell off boosting sales in May, but auto sales down from a year ago -- General Motors sales off 30 percent, Chrysler sales down an amazing 47 percent and Ford, the only car maker now of the former big three not in bankruptcy and not taking taxpayer money posting a decline of 24 percent. Among the Japanese car makers, Toyota sales down 41 percent, much more than had been expected, Honda sales also more than expected, plummeting 42 percent, Nissan sales off a third.
Well there are deep concerns tonight about a deal that General Motors has struck initially in secret to sell off its iconic Hummer brand. That deal is with a company from communist China, but many of the details are still being kept secret with billions of taxpayer dollars now invested in General Motors and many more on the way, many are saying this secrecy is absolutely unacceptable. Brooke Baldwin has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's big. It's rugged. It's proudly patriotic. The Hummer, a brand born in the USA is about to be sold off to China. According to Hummer, General Motors signed a preliminary agreement with Sichuan Tengzhong, a heavy industrial machinery company in western China.
RAY YOUNG, CFO, GENERAL MOTORS: We have reached an MOU. We are actually very, very pleased with this arrangement because we will be able to continue the Hummer brand with this purchaser and also maintain production of Hummer here in the United States.
BALDWIN: The reaction among auto workers at this Shreveport, Louisiana Hummer plant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would have preferred an American company buying it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We haven't had any security for a long time. We just gave up a bunch of our benefits last week, and now we have been bought out, so I just hope to stay with GM. That's what I hope.
BALDWIN: The head of the local union says whether we like it or not, American manufacturers have to compete on a global scale.
MORGAN JOHNSON, PRES., UAW LOCAL 2166: When everything's on a level playing field, we can compete with anybody in the world you know and, of course, you know, in the UAW we believe with all our heart that if things are going to be sold here, they should be manufactured here in the United States.
BALDWIN: GM says this plant will remain in operation and that 3,000 job will stay in the U.S. through next year. After 2010, GM offers no guarantees. Chrysler and Italy's Fiat, now GM and the Chinese one industry expert says our industrial base is being carved up.
KEVIN CARNES, U.S. BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY COUNCIL: And it really makes a difference who owns a company, who owns part of the industrial base because they make the decision about hiring and firing and new plants. This is a great toe hold for the Chinese to come in and sell all types of vehicles, not just Hummers.
BALDWIN: The Bureau of Labor Statistics says that China substantially increased its manufacturing jobs from 2002 to 2006, while the U.S. lost 1.4 million manufacturing jobs. Both countries have lost hundreds of thousands of manufacturing jobs since the global recession hit.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: Now GM initially said they were not going to divulge the purchaser or the prices this morning here despite the fact Lou, as you mentioned, that the American taxpayer now has a 60 percent stake in this public company. We're also hearing for the very first time tonight reaction from the chief executive, from this Chinese company and here we go -- with regard to this pending purchase of Hummer he says quote, "Hummer is synonymous with adventure, freedom and exhilaration and we plan to continue that heritage by investing in the business" -- Lou.
DOBBS: He said freedom.
BALDWIN: He said freedom. I pulled that just for you.
DOBBS: Outstanding -- outstanding, thanks very much, Brooke.
BALDWIN: Thanks.
DOBBS: Brooke Baldwin. Well, the American Hummer brand may be sold off to China, but the top-ranked pick-up trucks in this country, still American made. "Consumer Reports" ranking the Chevrolet Avalanche, the Chevrolet Silverado, and the GMC Sierra as the top three full-size pick-up trucks in the nation -- the top rank compact pickups, however, are all Japanese. "Consumer Reports" say they are the Honda Ridgeline, the Nissan Frontier and the Toyota Tacoma.
Later tonight General Motors' Vice Chairman Bob Lutz joins me. We'll be talking about the issue surrounding the GM bankruptcy, the sale of Hummer to communist China and the future of the company.
The outbreak of swine flu is worsening, another death from the virus in this country and the latest effort to shut down the most effective program against illegal immigration in the federal government's arsenal, the E-Verify program.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The man accused of shooting late-term abortion Dr. George Tiller has been charged with first-degree murder. Scott Roeder is accused of killing Tiller while he serving as an usher at his church. Roeder was a regular protester outside Tiller's clinic in Wichita, Kansas. Dr. Tiller had received numerous threats on his life from anti-abortion groups over the two decades that he ran his clinic.
The man accused of opening fire on a Little Rock Army/Navy Recruiting Center today pleaded not guilty to murder. Police say Abdulhakim Muhammad killed one American soldier, wounding another in a drive-by shooting at that center. Muhammad reportedly a recent convert to Islam and in a videotaped statement he said he was quote, "mad at the U.S. military because of what they have done to Muslims in the past." Muhammad now faces one count of capital murder, 16 counts of engaging in a terrorist act.
In New York City a child with swine flu has died. The child is the fifth person in New York to die with swine flew. At least 17 people have died in this country -- public school 209 in the Bronx closed this morning, 14 students there with flu-like symptoms. The World Health Organization today announced that it may well increase the pandemic alert level worldwide to phase six. Phase six is the highest on the alert system and is used to describe the arrival of a global pandemic.
The Obama administration tonight planning to again delay the expansion of E-Verify, the single most effective measure against illegal immigration -- this is the fourth time that the government has delayed the E-Verify program, which is more than 99 percent accurate. The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the country's biggest business lobby has been trying to kill the E-Verify program for years. It now appears the Obama administration may be helping them out. Louise Schiavone has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): LOU DOBBS TONIGHT has learned that the Obama administration plans to delay the June 30th implementation date requiring federal contractors to consult with a government database when hiring workers.
REP. LAMAR SMITH (R), TEXAS: This is a program, the E-Verify program, which allows employers to check to see whether the people they hire are in the country legally and eligible to work. This is the best protection we have for American workers.
SCHIAVONE: The rule would apply to a wide variety of federal contract work from construction to clerical and would apply to companies with federal contracts greater than $100,000. Over 100,000 businesses across the nation have signed on to the government's free electronic background check system.
But a DHS source tells us that the Obama administration wants to have more time to review the rule due to what it says is, quote, "an unrelated and unforeseen matter of national importance", end quote. Critics like the Center for Immigration Studies, which supports restrictive immigration policy says this says something about the Homeland Security secretary.
JANICE KEPHART, CENTER FOR IMMIGRATION STUDIES: She has not shown any interest in actually pushing forward on a legal immigration agenda.
SCHIAVONE: This is the fourth delay of the E-Verify compliance deadline for federal contractors and it follows a filing by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce challenging the order signed by President Bush.
KRIS KOBACH, FORMER JUSTICE DEPT. OFFICIAL: This litigation involving the Chamber of Commerce is interesting because the Chamber of Commerce doesn't want the system to go into place ever for anybody, because the Chamber of Commerce you know likes the idea of businesses being able to rely on cheap, illegal labor.
SCHIAVONE: The Chamber of Commerce responded, quote, "we believe that it's illegal for the government to mandate that federal contractors be held responsible for the hiring practices of all their subcontractors by mandating E-Verify", end quote.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHIAVONE: Lou, expect an announcement on the E-Verify delay for federal contractors this Thursday with a new implementation date of September 8th to be announced in Friday's federal register -- Lou.
DOBBS: Louise, thank you very much -- Louise Schiavone.
We would like to know what you think about all of this. Our poll question tonight is, are you outraged by this fourth delay of the most effective government program to fight illegal immigration, the E- Verify program? Cast your vote at loudobbs.com. We'll have the results here later in the broadcast.
The president expanding an immigration enforcement program that will do absolutely nothing to improve security at our borders and ports -- that's the subject of our "Face-Off" debate tonight.
And General Motors' future hanging in the balance -- the federal government pushing General Motors into bankruptcy, pushing $30 billion in loans toward General Motors -- GM's Vice Chairman Bob Lutz joins us here next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: Here again, Mr. Independent, Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: One day after filing for bankruptcy, General Motors today said it's reached a preliminary agreement to sell its Hummer brand. GM tried to keep details of the deal secret, even though it's receiving tens of billions of dollars in taxpayer money and is a public company and is in bankruptcy. But General Motors later did confirm that the buyer is a company from communist China. Joining me now is GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz -- Bob, good to have you with us. BOB LUTZ, VICE CHAIRMAN, GM: Nice to be here, Lou.
DOBBS: What is -- what's the mood at General Motors right now? A lot of people to lose their jobs, lots of plants, 14 of them to be closed. What's morale like at the company?
LUTZ: Well I would say that we're all very sad for -- about those who are going to lose their jobs. You hate to downsize. You hate to close plants, but you know we in management have been preparing for this day for probably the last six months or certainly the last four months, working together with the Obama automotive task force, so to us it's almost a relief that it's out in the open.
It's going to be behind us soon. When we get through Chapter 11, we will emerge as a much stronger company for the next 100 years, no longer burdened by all of these legacy costs, which is really what dragged us down. It wasn't low vehicle sales that did it. It was basically our crushing debt burden and these billions of dollars annually of legacy costs.
DOBBS: And the fact that the American consumer right now isn't buying cars, are they?
LUTZ: Well actually May was a little bit better. It's still way down over last year, but it was quite a bit better than April and all three domestics did relatively well. We were all out sort of between 20 and 30 -- or all kind of 20 to 30 percent better than April. Still down versus last year and this time quite interestingly the main Asian brands took the main -- took the main head. They were down almost 50 percent. So there may even be a slight switch in the buying habits of the American public.
DOBBS: That switch in the buying habits, I talked with your chief financial officer, Ray Young, last night.
LUTZ: Yeah.
DOBBS: He's talking about a world that you all are preparing for, in which it's a 10 million unit world, the United States market, versus a 17 million unit world.
LUTZ: Right.
DOBBS: That -- how much smaller will General Motors likely be in say 24 months than a year ago?
LUTZ: Well, we're going to downsize to the point where we can be break-even to marginally profitable at an industry level of 10 million units. We think that's very conservative. I think we're starting to see some signs of a gentle economic recovery. We might see 10.5 million or 11 million or even 11.5 million next year. And then there will be a gradual rise, because right now the scrappage rate is 13 million units. That means that we're scrapping way more units than we're selling every year, and that can only go so long and then you finally run out of vehicles. So at some point, sheer replacement demand is going to kick in. And sheer replacement demand, not counting two million new drivers every year, but sheer replacement demand is about 13 million units. And we're going to size ourselves through this Chapter 11 restructuring to where we can do well at 13 million units.
DOBBS: And how well will the employees of General Motors be doing? I mean, the workforce has just been cut tremendously over the course of the past decade.
LUTZ: Well, don't say decade, it's really the past 30 years.
DOBBS: Or 30 years.
LUTZ: Ever since General Motors has been under tremendous competitive pressure from the Asians, we have had to reduce capacity and let people go, and we're down to about 40 or 50,000 hourly workers. We used to have 340,000, and that's one of the reasons why we now have an active to retiree ratio of ten to one, which if you look at pensions and retiree healthcare, if we didn't have this restructuring, we simply couldn't take it.
DOBBS: And you look at that ratio and you think it's insane, and how in the world did you ever get there?
LUTZ: Yeah. Well, that's right. But it was the fact that we had a bad balance sheet and we had to borrow money because these legacy costs were draining so much of our substance. I mean, $103 billion over 15 years, that's money that could have gone to capital or money that we wouldn't have had to borrow. And I think it's quite a remarkable feat that despite all of that, we were able to put out an array of new products over the last five years which are really selling well, having good margins and getting rave reviews.
DOBBS: How soon do you expect Hummer to be -- the transaction with the communist Chinese company, how soon do you expect that to be wrapped up?
LUTZ: I think we're shooting for the end of the third quarter. Right now it's a memo of understanding.
DOBBS: All right.
LUTZ: So we hope to have that finalized by the end of the third quarter.
DOBBS: Is there some reason that General Motors didn't want to say who they were selling the company to? I mean, you guys are sitting there taking almost $50 billion in taxpayer money, you're a public company and in bankruptcy, and you're playing -- playing let's keep a secret?
LUTZ: No, I think we just -- maybe it just -- frankly I don't know the answer why we didn't announce it earlier. But I'm sure there's nothing sinister involved, it's just that normally when we discuss deals with other companies, we don't like to discuss who it is or put out any details of the deal until it's finalized, and this isn't going to be finalized for quite some time. DOBBS: Bob, we wish you all the best and good luck. Bob Lutz.
LUTZ: Thank you very much. Personally I'm very optimistic. Thanks a lot, Lou.
DOBBS: All right, well, optimism, we can use all across the country right now. Thanks very much, Bob Lutz.
The Obama administration expanding a program checking the immigration status of prisoners, but does the program do enough, does it go far enough? That's the subject of tonight's "Face-off" debate.
And thousands of desperate Americans seeking medical treatment overseas, no proof those treatments work, some considerable proof that some doctors are making a lot of money.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Tonight now than of American families faced with terminal illness are looking for miracle treatments outside the United States. Those families are paying tens of thousands of dollars for stem cell treatments that haven't been approved in this country. Those treatments haven't proved effective either. Drew Griffin from CNN's special investigation unit has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SPECIAL INVESTIGATION UNIT CORRESPONDENT: We met 8-year-old Sierra Factor and her family amidst an emergency, the seriously ill girl was being transferred to Arnold Palmer Children's Hospital in Atlanta. Sierra has a genetic disease called spinal muscular atrophy, SMA. She also has kidney problems and a restrictive lung disease. Since age 14 months, she's been in and out of hospitals.
SHEILING ACKERING (ph): There's no cure for her these. All three of her diseases are terminal.
GRIFFIN: In August, Sheiling Ackering (ph) will take daughter to a clinic outside Shanghai and pay $26,500 for six injections of what she believes will be embryonic stem cells. All she knows of the clinic is from this website, stemcellsChina.com.
ACKERING: We're really are just kind of walking into it blindfolded. It is scary, but everybody says everybody's so nice over there.
GRIFFIN: Testimonials on the web site talk of amazing results but also lack any scientific proof. We asked the Chinese website for backup to the claims, but haven't yet received a reply. Sierra's father divorced from her mother, says the testimonials are enough.
You've done a lot of research, can I ask you have the evidence is?
A.J. FACTOR, SIERRA'S DAD: On their website, Chinastemcell.com and some of that stuff.
GRIFFIN: How can it be true? That's just it. Experts on spinal muscular atrophy and the Food and Drug Administration says there's no evidence stem cell treatment works. Stem cells show promise say researchers, but results are years away. Even so, Lucy Bruijn, head of scientific research for the ALS Association, says many with the debilitating ailment known as Lou Gehrig's disease have gone to Peru and Mexico for just such treatments.
When anybody or a doctor says to a patient, I have a stem cell treatment for ALS that's going to make you better, that's just not true.
LUCY BRUIJM, ALS ASSOCIATION: No, it's definitely not true. And certainly you hope that that's going to come from an ALS commission who's very knowledgeable and the likelihood is that they would say there are things being developed and in progress, and it's very promising but we don't have anything to offer you now.
GRIFFIN: But that is not what this man is saying. Dr. Bert Feinerman says he can treat Lou Gehrig's disease. You might be surprised to learn what else he says he can treat, not here in the U.S., but in a clinic in Peru; Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, cancer, multiple sclerosis.
These are very serious incurable things that you are treating.
DR. BURTON FEINERMAN, STEMCELLREGENMED.COM: Formerly the doctor would say go home and write your will. We offer not hope but we offer science and realistic expectations.
GRIFFIN: The International Society of Stem Cell Research says these experimental treatments do not work and the only thing that should be done if you're a patient is to enter into them without paying for them, because if you pay, you are most likely as you say being scammed.
FEINERMAN: I didn't say that.
GRIFFIN: You said 80 percent of the people in this business are scammers.
FEINERMAN: Well, that's true.
GRIFFIN: That seems like good odds you're going to get scammed.
FEINERMAN: I think that when someone makes a decision about having stem cell treatments, that they should look at who are the players.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRIFFIN: Lou, on the very day we met Dr. Bert Feinerman, he was scheduled to fly to Peru, meeting up with three very sick American citizens paying thousands of dollars for this unproven treatment. DOBBS: Drew, thank you very much. Tomorrow, Drew will have a greet deal more on this stem cell approach and the number of scams involved. Please join us tomorrow for Drew's report. Drew Griffin with the story.
Demands for much tougher scrutiny of Supreme Court nominee Judge Sonia Sotomayor and our face-off debate tonight, two very different views on how to deal with illegal aliens in our jails and prisons.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The Obama administration is expanding the so-called Secure Communities program, which is designed to identify criminal illegal aliens in our jails so they can be deported. That's the subject of our "Face-off" debate tonight. My guests are Congressman Steve King. He's the ranking member of the Immigration Subcommittee, who says Secure Communities is a program that's misguided, and Congressman David Price, chairman of House Appropriations Subcommittee for Homeland Security, who says Secure Communities is viable.
Gentlemen, good to have you with us.
Let me start with you if I may, Congressman King. This program seems to make some considerable sense. Why do you think it is misguided?
REP. STEVE KING (R), IOWA: I think that parts of it will be very, very helpful. But the other component is that they're really only looking to pick up those criminal aliens for deportation, and in the process of doing so, they're missing the other component of this, which is that all of those eligible for deportation should be deported. And that's my issue with it.
I think that it's an important component. It adds to the cause, but if it's exclusively the verbiage that we hear from the Obama administration that we're only going to be enforcing against those criminal aliens, those who have committed crimes while here in the United States, that's not enough. We need to do at all.
DOBBS: Congressman Price, your thoughts?
REP. DAVID PRICE (D), NORTH CAROLINA: I think that's a very strange interpretation of what Secure Communities is all about. I guess some people are determined to pick a fight no matter what you're doing, but it seems to me if there's one thing liberals and conservatives and everybody else in between can agree on, it's that the first priority for deportation ought to be those illegal aliens who have proved their willingness and their capacity to do us harm, namely people who have committed serious crimes. And that is the impetus, that's the thrust that Congress under Democratic leadership two years ago mandated that it's not acceptable. I remember the very first time -- I was the chairman of the committee, chairman of the subcommittee, the head of ICE came before us and said -- and he had to admit that tens of thousands of criminal aliens were being turned out back on the streets of America every year without us even knowing who they are. DOBBS: What do you say to that, Congressman King?
KING: First of all, I would agree with Mr. Price to a certain degree, and according to his own records, there are 600,000 illegal aliens locked up in our jails today. That's about 26 percent of the overall prison population. If they're committing 26 percent of the murders, 26 percent of the rapes, there's a tremendous amount of crime and a tremendously high number of Americans that are victims to these crimes.
But we need to be preventative too. This is a de facto amnesty. It says if you're not a criminal, but you're eligible for deportation, we're not going to be really focusing on deporting you. So I don't think it's strange at all to take the position that if you're legally eligible for deportation, we should deport all of those who violated the law in that fashion. It's that simple.
PRICE: It's a bizarre interpretation to say that if you're going to focus on criminal aliens as your first priority, then by definition you're ignoring everybody else. Who's saying that? Nobody's saying that.
KING: Well, I hope that's right. I hope that's right. But I heard the briefing that came from all of our border patrol people for an hour and a half, and their focus down there was they were going to turn and try to intercept illegal money and guns that became illegal when they got to Mexico, and in an hour and a half only once mentioned the illegal drugs coming into America and the illegal aliens coming into America. I'm seeing a shift of this administration. I hope I'm wrong, but my interpretation is that it's going to be more exclusive and focused on some of these areas like this and let some of the rest of it go.
DOBBS: Is Congressman King wrong, Congressman Price?
PRICE: This isn't about the Mexican drug cartels. That, of course, is an important problem and we can discuss that. We have redoubled our efforts to deal with that problem. What we're talking about here is people who have committed crimes, who have been convicted of crimes and are in our prisons, are we going to deport them or not?
DOBBS: Let me ask you both this question. We know after the experience of the border patrol, the deportations, that customs and border patrol are deporting people, but there is almost no way to stop their return to the United States. So how will we judge the success of this program, Congressman Price, if we know that our border remains a sieve, our ports remain a sieve and we know full well that people are crossing our border after being deported six, eight, nine, ten times?
PRICE: First of all, we need to stop that, and I must say Congress in the last couple of years under Democratic leadership has committed more border patrol agents to the border, has committed more to border security than had been done previously. But the question is, what about these people who have done us harm? In no way should the deportation proceeding trump the criminal justice proceeding. These people should do time. They should do time. They should serve their full sentences and then they should be slated for deportation.
DOBBS: Congressman King?
KING: Lou, I take this position, that all levels of law enforcement, at local levels, state and federal should all be engaged in a cooperative effort to enforce all of our laws including our federal immigration laws, and when people who are eligible for deportation are encountered by local law enforcement, they should not be a allowed to turn them loose anywhere except to ICE for deportation.
DOBBS: OK.
KING: And I have a bill that I've drafted that is ready to be introduced, and I would hope Mr. Price would join with me in it, that would suspend their funding and require them...
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: I'm sorry, we're going to have to end it here, I'm sorry, Congressman, we're out of time. Congressman King, Congressman Price, thank you gentlemen both for being with us.
PRICE: Thank you so much.
DOBBS: President Obama offering Iran what many say is a major concession.
And GM vice chairman Bob Lutz has just told us there's nothing sinister behind that deal not to tell everyone about the sale of Hummer to a communist Chinese company. Our radio roundtable will arbitrate on that issue, and others. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Joining me now three of my favorite radio talk show hosts from Austin, Texas, KSEV and KBCE Dan Patrick tonight. Good to have you with us, Dan. In Baltimore WOLB, Larry Young. Larry, great to have you here. And here in New York, WOR's Joey Reynolds. Joey, thank you for being with us.
Let's start with, well, Judge Sotomayor, it seems, Dan Patrick, that she's getting relatively light treatment at this stage. Senator Sessions having a good time, it seems.
DAN PATRICK, KSEV IN AUSTIN: Well, one of the things I think that's interesting, Lou, is you're not hearing much protest from the pro-life groups and one of the reasons is there may be an indication that she may be more pro-life than David Souter, who she's replacing, so that's an issue so far that has not been a big issue on the table. Secondly the Democrats have 59 votes. It's just a matter of time before she is approved but I think the Republicans are framing the argument and we're going to have to talk about some of the issues, some of the statements she's made and she's going to have to be held accountable and so far the pacing of the way the Republicans are handling this so far I think has been effective.
DOBBS: Larry?
LARRY YOUNG, WOLB IN BALTIMORE: Quite frankly, I think we're going to look at about an 80-20 vote margin for her. I think the Obama administration was smart with the vote that we're looking for already for the next election. The Hispanic community, the black community, the general community, his popularity. It was a smart move.
DOBBS: A smart move. Do you agree, Joey?
JOEY REYNOLDS, WOR IN NEW YORK: I like everybody involved in the party. I think it's really wonderful to have representation, you know, this country was built by everybody who came from somewhere else except the guys that owned the casinos, and I love the idea that we have somebody who is Latin involved. And we needed it for a long time.
DOBBS: We needed it. She said, I hope, and let's put this up, because this is a subject that has everybody focused. "I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion as a judge than a white male who hasn't lived that life." Does that make sense to you?
REYNOLDS: I think sometimes people say things --
DOBBS: It wasn't an offhand remark. This was printed in a law journal. This was a speech before a law group. This isn't some, you know, some barroom discussion.
REYNOLDS: Even Mother Teresa had doubt. I mean everybody ...
DOBBS: If that's our standard, do you agree?
YOUNG: Well, first --
PATRICK: Mother Teresa didn't have much doubt.
YOUNG: On first impression, I think what she said politically speaking; it could have been said better. But at this point, she --
DOBBS: It was a clear endorsement of group identity politics, Larry.
YOUNG: She was able to explain herself, and once it was explained, I think she'd like to take her words back. We're going to move forward and she's going to be a tremendous jurist.
PATRICK: Lou, I'm always amazed that there's a double standard. If a Democrat or a liberal says something, it's always a mistake and it's OK. Had any Republican nominee for the Supreme Court said anything like that, they would be dismissed totally and run out of town. So, she's going to get a pass on this. Again, there's nothing the Republicans could do to stop her. I wish this were not the choice, but she's going to pass.
DOBBS: Joey, you said that -- you've said that the president made mistake when he fired Rick Wagoner at General Motors.
REYNOLDS: Oh, yeah.
DOBBS: You have some evidence it looks like they fired him and the next thing you know General Motors is in bankruptcy. What's the deal?
REYNOLDS: Well, the deal is that I drove the hydrogen fuel cell car for about ten weeks in the summer. I met Rick last year. He's a visionary. He said he was going to move the office into the car. And this last year at the consumer electronics show, the president of Ford partnered with Microsoft and they are doing the same thing that Rick had done with Onstar with the nav system. The plans were set, but the money just wasn't there. And I think if we - last week we took away $100 million for the hydrogen fuel cell program and I think it's the direction we need to go in. It's zero emissions, please the planet, provides employment and keeps it in America. And I don't want to be driving a Chinese junk.
DOBBS: OK.
PATRICK: I don't want to be driving American junk either.
REYNOLDS: You don't have one. I have a Cadillac and it's the greatest car in the world. I have the CTS.
PATRICK: I drive an American car as well, but let me make this point, and that is when government starts taking over private business, you're going to have all the influence of government in, and they're going to end up with the product we always get from government which is a poor product. This was a mistake from the beginning to pour money into here. It should have been a company that was allowed to dissolve, sell off the best brands and not waste taxpayer dollars. It was a big mistake and it continues to be a bigger mistake.
YOUNG: The issue for me is when I woke up this morning and looked at the morning paper and looked at the geographic region that would be impacted, the loss of jobs and the devastation it would bring, I'm excited we're talking about solution and I'm hoping and praying it will be about the business of giving these people some hope and turn the --
PATRICK: Give them hope.
DOBBS: Let's talk about hope. We've got a president on his way to Egypt, to Saudi Arabia, and then over to -- on to Europe. Going to give a major speech from Egypt, to the Muslim world. This is high- risk politics. Do you think it's smart politics? REYNOLDS: Another mistake. I think Turkey is not an Arab nation, but it's a Muslim nation. Iran is not an Arab nation, but it's a Muslim nation. We go back to this partner principle that I gave with Ford and Microsoft. Partner with healthy nations. I think England needs to talk to Russia. I think Turkey needs to talk to Iran. That's the way it goes. I don't think a president needs to be putting himself in a dysfunctional family of man you should not be putting yourself out and rewarding children.
YOUNG: This president, Barack Obama, is no doubt about it, he's articulate. He's got -- he's brilliant. He's going to go over. He's going to lift up the aspiration of the world and looking at America for positive sake. I think you should give this man encouragement and let him go forth and do what he can do to lift up the aspirations of Americans.
PATRICK: Just because he's articulate --
YOUNG: He's going to be an exceptional leader of this world and I think he should be given every opportunity to say what he should say.
PATRICK: What needs to be telling the Muslim world is they need to clean up their own act and remove the radicals from bringing down the entire religion and the world with it. That should be the message.
DOBBS: All right. Dan Patrick, Larry Young, Joey Reynolds, thank you all, very much, appreciate you gentlemen for being here.
Our poll results tonight, 97 percent of you say you are outraged of this fourth delay of the most effective program, the government program to fight the illegal immigration. That is the e-verify program. Thanks for voting.
And let's take a quick look at some of your thoughts.
Art in Georgia said, "Hey Lou! I have a message for Communist China while Tim Geithner is visiting. Keep him!"
Cathy in Connecticut said, "Lou, you are the man. When I watch you I get excited because you ask all the hard questions and don't let up until you make sure you get to the truth." I try to do it that way. Thank you.
And each of you whose e-mail is read here receives a couple of my book "Independence Day." And by the way, all of the e-mails were absolutely uniformly positive or otherwise I would have added one or two negatives for the day.
A reminder to join me on the radio Monday through Friday for "The Lou Dobbs Show" 2 to 4 p.m. each afternoon on New York's WOR 710 radio and go to loudobbsradio.com to get the local listings in your area for the show. Join us here tomorrow.
For all of us, thanks for watching. Good night from New York. Here now, Campbell Brown.
