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Iran Election Fallout Continues
Aired June 20, 2009 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN NEWS ANCHOR: We're closely watching events in Iran. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
Mass rallies planned by those opposed to the recent elections have not happened. The two reformist leaders have not been seen, but there have been confrontations involving police and protestors. We are hearing of people trying to make their way to the rallies, only to be met with teargas and water cannons. CNN and other international media are being kept far from the action. So, the images you are seeing are coming to us from eyewitnesses in the streets.
Iran's state-run press TV reports two people were killed, eight injured in southern Iran in a blast at the shrine where Ayatollah Khomeini is buried. He, of course, led the Islamic revolution back in 1979 which led to the overthrow of the shah and taking of the U.S. embassy.
All right, CNN is working all the angles of this story from various regions around the world. Christiane Amanpour, our chief national correspondent, is in London, just back from Iran.
Kate Bolduan is monitoring reaction at the White House. And Ivan Watson at our Iran hub at the international desk in Atlanta where we are watching and keeping track of all of our sources. Octavia Nasr, as you see right there, as well, all at the Iran desk, trying to keep tabs on all the information that is pouring in that we're trying to monitor.
One more time if I could hear from my producer.
All right, here are some of the latest images we are able to get via cell phone, various social networking outlets. These are the images out of Tehran. You know that yesterday the Ayatollah Khomeini already sent out a very stern message, any kind of protest that would be taking place in Tehran or anywhere else in Iran would be considered illegal and various efforts would be met by these protestors if they indeed chose to take to the streets.
What you are looking at right now people who are running. We are not clear, it's not clear why they are running, what they are being met by. Our Christiane Amanpour is in London.
Christiane, what are you learning about what protestors are being met by once they have chosen to take to the streets?
Christiane, are you able to hear me?
All right, looks like we're going to try to work out our audio, there.
Grainy images right here, out of Tehran. It's unclear what exactly is taking place on the ground. How many people are involved. We're still trying to work out those details. But, as you can see, and I'm watching it for the first time along with you, clearly you are seeing some kind of plumes of smoke, there, perhaps some teargas canisters that are being used if people have collected there in the streets.
So, as the U.S. waits to see how things play out in Iran, I spoke to former Secretary of State Colin Powell about the challenges that U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton faces as the U.S. deals with so many hot spots around the world, including Iran.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
There's a lot going on in this world right now. And as it pertains to U.S. diplomacy, which is close to your heart, when you think what happening with North Korea, Iran, do you envy the duty of Secretary Hillary Clinton, right now, or do you feel her pain that there is so much to juggle that, there is a real balancing act that has to be made?
GEN COLIN POWELL, FMR SECY OF STATE: That's always been the case in any period of history I have lived through and I've been through 51 years of history, now, in a position of service and I am quite confident Secretary Clinton can handle these challenges. But, most importantly, we have to remember there are great opportunities that have been created.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: All right, that was Colin Powell speaking at the National Infantry Museum opening. I asked him about U.S. diplomacy and the duties of the U.S. secretary of state as it pertains to Iran and North Korea. You noticed that he did not reiterate the name Iran, but he did talk about and commended the secretary for having done a good job so far juggling so many balls in the air.
A greater length conversation with him, coming up later on today.
Meantime, president Obama being very careful, as well, about how he words his response to the escalating tension in Iran. Some congressional leaders want to hear something a bit tougher. But, the White House disagrees. Our Kate Bolduan is at the White House with more on this -- Kate.
KATE BOLDUAN: Hi there, Fredricka. Despite calls from some lawmakers and some that the president come out more forcefully in response to the situation in Iran, the White House has really maintained throughout a measured cautious tone, kind of a hands-off approach to the development in Iran since the elections have taken place.
The White House says at least it struck the right balance here, albeit a delicate balance in supporting the Iranian people and not interfering in what is domestic affairs of that country. The president has said he doesn't think it would be productive to be seen as meddling in with what is going on in Iran and he also doesn't want the U.S. to be drawn in and become part of an issue of the political debate that is going on over in the country. Listen here to president Obama's interview Friday with Harry Smith of CBS News.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA (D), UNITED STATES PRESIDENT: The last thing I want to do is to have the United States be a foil for those forces inside Iran who would love nothing better than to make this an argument about the United States. That's what they do. That's what we're already seeing. We shouldn't be playing into that. There should be no distractions from the fact that the Iranian people are seeking to let their voices be heard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLDUAN: Now, yet today no word from the White House, coming out of the White House, today. Big question is, how would the white house respond if there is an escalation in violence, if there is force when it comes down to cracking down on possible demonstrations and protests over there? That is a big question and will be interesting to see if the president and the administration will change its tone if that would happen -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: And Kate, give me an idea what kind of activity may or may not be taking place there at the White House. We know the White House, State Department, Department of Defense all have been working in close concert together. This is a Saturday, you don't ordinarily see a number of those administration people coming in and out of the White House. But, is there anything different today as a result of what's taking place many miles away at Iran?
BOLDUAN: Well, we've been definitely checking in with the White House and right now no word from the administration. But you can be sure that the administration from the White House to other agencies, like state and other agencies, are keeping a close eye on all the developments coming out, obviously, as this situation develops and trying to keep an eye on exactly what is going on and how the U.S. would need to be involved, if at all. But, so far, no additional word from the White House this morning.
WHITFIELD: All right, Kate Bolduan, thanks so much. We'll check back with you to see if anything develops or changes throughout the day.
All right, we've been getting a lot of responses from Iranians, Iranian-Americans and others about what is going on in Tehran, today. And you can join the conversation at CNN/newsroom or on FaceBook at Fredricka Whitfield CNN and we'll get your comments and some of your questions to our experts, actually, on the air.
All right, well many of the faces of defiance in Iran are those of women, both young and old. As CNN Mary Snow explains, supporters in the U.S. are making sure their message is not swept under the rug.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Outside the Iranian mission in New York, 28-year-old attorney Bitta Mostofi organizes this prayer and protests. She is un-phased by the Ayatollah Khomeini declaring a victory for President Ahmadinejad.
BITTA MOSTOFI, IRANIAN-AMERICAN: What I have seen is people have really taken these amazing risks in the belief of something greater than themselves, of what freedom and exercise of your democracy and civil rights means. And I think that's so profound that at the minimum, we can stand in solidarity.
SNOW: From Iran to the United States, seeing Iranian women front and center in demonstrations following last week's election gives hope to Azar Nasifi who marched in the streets in 1979 and later wrote her memoir, "Reading Lolita in Iran."
AZAR NASIFI, AUTHOR, READING LOLITA IN TEHRAN: I feel very proud. And that is why I'm not discouraged by either the violence that Mr. Ahmadinejad has been propagating, nor the position that Ayatollah Khomeini has taken today. My faith is with those young women in the streets of Tehran and here.
SNOW: Nasifi says over the past 30 years women have been at the forefront of demands for nonviolent change in Iran and this election many women's hopes were raised by opposition leader Mir-Hossein Mousavi's wife, Zahara, an admired academic seen as a symbol of change.
Unlike the past, social networking sites have proven to be key. Kelly Gornush Niknejad, who runs the online newspaper "Tehran Bureau" in Boston, says they are empowering yet safe for women.
KELLY GORNUSH NIKNEJAD: You can make up any name, you can make up any moniker, you can make up any avatar. That's in itself like a veil, so it allows you to wear a veil and do something, you know, from behind the veil that you wouldn't be able to do.
SNOW (on camera): And author Azar Nafisi adds, if you want to know where Iran is going, look at where its women are going.
Mary Snow, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: As we continue to update you on the goings on in Iran, our Ivan Watson is at the international desk, which is also the Iran desk with the very latest information. You've got new developments, some very significant details that you want to share with us.
IVAN WATSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Fredricka, we've been monitoring this situation there because our team in Tehran has been banned from reporting by the Iranian authorities without first getting permission from the Iranian officials. They have basically tied our hands in Iran.
Now, let me show you something very important, the first images from Iranian state media of protestors trying to protest and being pushed back by Iranian security forces. Take a look at this. This has come across Iran state television, the IRINN network and we see the security forces there, moving around in the streets, some people being hit. We see riot police as well as some of the guys in the white shirts that you see, they are probably Basij pro-government militia. They are supported by the state, they are often the people that are called in to break up protests. They've been used in the past, they see themselves often as the enforcers of morals in Iranian society, as well. They are loved by some Iranians, feared by a great many Iranians, as well.
And in some of the other video that we've seen coming across from Iranian state TV, it's clear that teargas has been used to disperse the crowds. And that fits with all the descriptions we've gotten from protestors that we've talked to on the phone, through e-mail, from Twitter, descriptions of teargas being used on the ground, security forces firing in the air, clubbing people.
One protestor who fled the scene described seeing dozens of people between the age of 16 and 30 being forced to kneel on the ground as the security forces search them. So, these are very important, the first images coming across on Iranian state television of how the security forces are dealing with this.
Take a look at this, here you see what is clearly teargas being used, canisters being fired into the crowd. This is how they pushed back those demonstrators who were rallied by the opposition candidates, Mir-Hossein Moussavi, Mehdi Karroubi. Two opposition candidates in last week's very controversial presidential elections. The candidates who claimed that the government rigged the elections to allow the incumbent, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, to win that election.
So, you see protestors there choking back tears trying to cover their faces as the teargas comes out. They're running away from the Basij forces from the police who have been very effective at crushing street demonstrations in the past in Iran. In 1999, student protests were crushed by Basij and security forces. Again in 2003, and we've seen -- you see them there chanting, there, waving their fists. And what we've seen from some of the video that's come out is they've been making chants like "death to the dictator," "Death to this deceptive government."
Let's look at other video that we've seen. Look at this, this came across YouTube. And you can hear the crowd there chanting, this looks like a huge crowd with a helicopter monitoring overhead. It's very difficult for us to determine where exactly this was filmed and the source, but it fits with some of the descriptions.
Look, the crowd here, Fredricka, they are not carrying signs, they are not wearing the green colors that Mr. Mousavi's supporters, that green wave, the symbols that they used and a reason might be because they were trying to get past the security forces who were even blocking, according to one man I've been e-mailing with, blocking people from coming out of the subway stations to come and see, to participate in this protest. A really large group of people you see gathered there and evidently broken apart by the security forces. I am going to show you one last thing here. We've been following social networking. This is the opposition candidate's FaceBook site where we've gotten some information. It's difficult to be 100 percent sure of what is coming out of here, but these are the restrictions we're under. Now, a translation of these postings here says that Moussavi, the opposition candidate, the No. 2, former prime minister, by the way, of Iran in the 1980s, that minutes ago in the center of the crowd he announced, "I prepare myself for martyrdom."
Again, this is on his FaceBook site, we're not 100 percent sure about this, but this is some of the information that's coming out via social networking. And another statement on here, the second one, "Urgent, based on the news we've seen from Mir-Hossein Moussavi, he gave a message to many people in Jihoon (ph) Street." OK, so difficult for us to confirm these statements, we're having a tough time with this, but this is part of the problem when there is an almost complete media blackout preventing foreign reporters from reporting on the ground in the Iranian capital -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: And Ivan, I know you were seeing some of those images just as I was, the newer images that were just now coming in, is there any way of knowing any other source that can tell us roughly how many people were there? I know you said that Iranian state TV was supplying some of these images, which is interesting because really, in fact, maybe the government's way of letting the public know this is what happens if you defy the order of Khomeini, by coming out to protest, this is what potentially could happen. But, is there any way of knowing how many people are actually defying that rule set in place yesterday?
WATSON: No, that's very difficult to know. And from the accounts of people we've spoken with from the eyewitnesses and protestors, they described hundreds, perhaps thousands, pockets of people trying to converge on central squares in Tehran, but then being very effectively broken apart, as you saw on this video and you see now by the security forces. And they've used other methods to stop people from gathering.
One eyewitness we spoke with said this entire cell phone network in downtown Tehran was shut down. And I've seen that myself reporting in the past in Tehran in 2005 that one way they can use to disburse people is they shut down the cell phone network and they can't communicate. It's difficult for people to get together. And of course, we know that the text messaging, which is popular method for many young Iranians to communicate to get mobilized, but has been shut down for days, as well as a number of important Web sites used by these folks, as well.
Despite this ban, despite the supreme leader saying on Friday saying that he will not tolerate street protests, you see hundreds, if not thousands of people trying to get to the downtown area, trying to rally to protest against the controversial results of last week's presidential elections -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right, Ivan Watson at the Iran desk, thanks so much, we'll keep checking back with you to get the latest updates because some of this information is streaming in by the moment and in other times it's kind of at snail's pace.
So, our chief international correspondent, Christiane Amanpour, was in Iran for this last election, she was there last week, now back in London. She is with us now. Looks like we've worked out the audio issue.
So, Christiane, I don't know how much of what you could hear from Ivan's report about the new images coming in of the protests. We're seeing a different, I guess, set of behaviors. A, there is the color of green is no longer present. We're not seeing that the protestors are wearing black either in honor of those who were killed. What do you make of the protestors who are being defiant, who are coming out in large numbers and in the face of the message from Khomeini yesterday?
CHRISTIAN AMANPOUR, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think the biggest single question today is to try to figure out what numbers they're coming out in. So far those riot pictures we are seeing, including those that we're seeing there on the screen, are showing pockets and Ivan has described and other eyewitnesses have described pockets of perhaps hundreds, thousands and I've been on the phone and e-mail contact with people in Iran who say that they're even spreading around some neighborhoods shouting and chanting slogans describing it as they won't let them go and protest in the center so, these people are spreading around.
So, that is as far as we know. I'm waiting to see whether there are pictures. These helicopter pictures, trying to figure out where those were taken and when they were taken, and if they are being shown on Iranian state television, what are they pictures of? Because, the crucial is to figure out whether there have been huge defiance of Ayatollah Khomeini's order and his ultimatum yesterday or not.
WHITFIELD: And it seems as though, at least from some of the grainier images that we saw prior to this latest image, it looked like mostly young men. Is there anything to read into the people, the protestors have been coming out within the past few hours?
AMANPOUR: Well, that's hard to tell, as well. When we were there, all the reelection rallies, all the post election rallies, certainly the Moussavi rallies, were heavily populated by men and women, older and younger, students of all ages and certainly both men and women and traditional dress and more modern western dress. So, that's hard to tell why -- I mean, I can't tell from looking at that picture, whether it's just men, but if that is from today and it's a pro-Moussavi rally, it looks big from that vantage point, but again, hard to tell from so far away.
WHITFIELD: And do you see that the state-run television images that are being broadcast, really is a message directly being sent from the government, that if you turn out in defiance of what the ayatollah said yesterday, this is what potentially could happen to you? There's the teargas and perhaps some rough treatment by any of those that are confronted by police?
AMANPOUR: Well, certainly Ayatollah Khomeini warned people yesterday during his speech that if they came out again that there would be consequences to that. And he also held the leaders of the opposition responsible or whoever was to call out the rallies. And today the police chief in Iran, in Tehran was quoted on the state television, both TV and on the main news agency, there, saying that now the rallies were illegal and that they would not be permitted and if they did happen, then the full force of the law would come down upon them.
And we had eyewitnesses telling CNN of some smoke grenades, perhaps some teargas canisters being launched. And we heard Press TV talk about water cannons to try to disperse the crowds. And those at the time, were described as pockets of perhaps hundreds or thousands. Interestingly, we spoke to a key reform leader, a key supporter of Mir-Hossein Moussavi by phone and that person told us that they were trying, and this is before the rally was due to start several, several hours ago, they were trying to reach the Moussavi camp to urge them not to bring the rallies out, not to call out the rallies because they were concerned about the consequences on the young people who turned out into the streets.
WHITFIELD: All right, Christiane Amanpour from London, thanks you so much and we're going to be checking back with you momentarily.
Meantime, we're going to take a short break and many Iranian-Americans have a lot to say about what they're witnessing so many miles away in their homeland. Some perspective, right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: We are going to get back to our coverage in Iran in a moment, this breaking story out of Afghanistan. The "New York Times" reporting that one of its journalists, David Rohde, who was kidnapped by the Taliban about seven months ago and has been held against his will ever since, has somehow made a break for it by climbing a wall where the compound where he was being held and found his way to a Pakistani army scout, was able to get help and now we understand, according to the "New York Times" reporting that he is at an American base in Bagram, Afghanistan. David Rohde, I hope I'm pronouncing his name correctly, a journalist with the "New York Times" escaping captivity while in Afghanistan for seven months. We look forward to hearing more of this story and more of his escape. This reporting coming from the "New York Times".
Meantime, I want to return now to our continuing coverage of Iran and that's taking place, there. Thousands of people have converged on the streets of Tehran in defiance of the Ayatollah Khomeini order yesterday that any protesters who do take to the streets are doing so by breaking the law.
Our next guest is a woman who is keeping close tabs on the situation in Iran. She has friends, she has family, there. She lives here in the United States she's also an author of a book here. Melody Moezzi, and Iranian-American author of "War on Error: Real Stories of American Muslims."
Good to see you, Melody.
MELODY MOEZZI, NPR: Great to see you.
WHITFIELD: OK, you have been having conversations with your friends and family, just as soon as a few moments ago when I saw you on the phone trying to have a clear conversation, but it's not easy, especially when it involves a landline. Explain to me what vocal gymnastics you have to do when you reach out to friends and family, there.
MOEZZI: Well, I've been calling friends and family to talk to them and hear what they have to say and it turns out that the second I say, well, what it's situation like? I learned this early on, and once I said, "what's the situation like?" immediately when I was on a landline it cut off. This happened to me twice in a row. Ultimately, I figured out how to say, well, you know, well, I know you support Ahmadinejad, I know that you're supporting the government, but just tell me what is going on with the opposition. And some of my family and friends do support Ahmadinejad.
WHITFIELD: Everyone, you and the party involved are all certain the government is listening to conversations or you feel like it's a strange coincidence?
MOEZZI: I don't know why it's getting disconnected. Yeah.
WHITFIELD: It's a strange coincidence to be cut off.
MOEZZI: Yeah.
WHITFIELD: So, when you see the numbers of people who are taking to the streets, whether it be earlier in the week or even now in defiance of the ayatollah's order, do you suspect that anyone you know may have taken to the streets or anyone that you know who is expressing fear or concern for those who do take to the streets?
MOEZZI: Yeah. I mean, I know people are going and I know that some of my friends will be going and it makes me very nervous. And I'm scared, but more than that, I'm so proud. I am so proud to be Iranian and especially today. I think I'm more proud to be Iranian today than I've ever been.
WHITFIELD: Why? How are you calculating what is taking place there?
MOEZZI: I think it's the most historic thing that's happened in my lifetime. I was born the year of the revolution. I did not see that, but I have lived it. I saw what life was after the revolution. And I hear stories of what life was like before the revolution and it wasn't great, but it was very different. And the possibility of things changing from what I've known my entire life is amazing, and that my generation would lead that is astonishing to me. And I have so much pride for Iran today.
WHITFIELD: It's been about 10 years, am I correct, since you were last there?
MOEZZI: Yeah. WHITFIELD: Yet watching it long distance and having that connection, family, friends still there, is there a part of you that says, you want to be there now to witness this part of history no matter which side you may be on, just to see for yourself or experience it for yourself?
MOEZZI: In my heart that's where I want to be, but I have a head, too, and my head tells me I don't want to be there. I've written things and publically said things that are against the government. I write for the "Huffington Post" and have been writing lately. And the things that I have been writing...
WHITFIELD: Are you saying it would be difficult for you to be allowed to enter?
MOEZZI: I think I may be allowed to enter, because I do have Iranian citizenship, but in terms of what will happen after I enter the country, I'm not sure. That's why I think it's so important that the people who are outside Iran, Iranian-Americans in particular, we have the freedom to say what we want to say. They are stranding up and risking their lives, the least we can do is stand up and say, you know what, maybe this will mean I can't go back to Iran, but they may die. You know, maybe I won't be able to go back, but I fully believe thatI will go back to Iran. I just will go back to Iran when it is no longer a so-called Islamic republic, which is highly un-Islamic to begin with.
WHITFIELD: Well, what's very clear, there is no monolist thinking and the same can be said about your family, whether you have family members here or even in Iran, everyone feels differently about what's transpiring there. And so, I'm curious to know what kind of dinner table conversations, even long distance dinner table conversation are taking place. Are you all engaging in real passionate discussions about how you all see this differently or how you might be in agreement?
MELODY MOEZZI, AUTHOR: It's like the parents and the kids -- and I count as a kid in this situation -- the parents saying, be careful. We've seen what happened with our revolution. We thought it was going to go well. It didn't turn out like we thought it would. A lot of people who supported the revolution in 1979 did not expect it to turn out like it did; did not expect a theocratic state to come into Iran.
Iran, if it's an Islamic state, Islam teaches in the Quran that there should be no compulsion in religion. So a lot of Iranians thought, OK, so they take that to heart when they created an Islamic republic. A true Islamic republic is a secular republic, a secular democracy. And I think that's what the people there are headed for. I think the kids are talking to their parents, and their parents are like, watch out. And they're like we've had enough; we're 30 years old, we've been living under this government for 30 years. Give as break.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR, CNN NEWSROOM: What really is interesting because you bring up the age 30, half the Iranian population under 30, or at least under the age of 25, and that is astounding because there is a real movement that we are seeing here, which seems to be led by that younger generation.
MOEZZI: Yeah, that's really exciting to me. The majority of the Iranian population is younger than the revolution itself. That's the situation. I've always seen it, like I said, I've been in the streets of Tehran with my mom. I remember once specifically we were about to cross the street, which is an effort in Tehran. We were about to cross the street and she started crying. I said what's wrong? She said I never thought this would happen. I never thought this would happen. So just so many people who initially supported that revolution, it just turned on them.
That's what we are afraid of. Because we know what we do not want. We don't want a. We don't want to go back to that. We don't want American imperialism. We want to be independent. That is the great thing that the Ayatollah Khomeini brought to us was independence, and then - but we moved past that, you know? So we, at the same time we don't want the status quo. We don't know what we do want. We know what we don't want, but when it comes to figuring out what we do actually want, we don't know what to do.
I was saying, I write for the Huffington Post. I had written something recently about Shirin Ebadi (ph), who is the 2003 Nobel Peace Prize winner. Inside of Iran she's an attorney, she used to be a judge. And what I wrote was, the title was "Shirin Ebadi (ph) For President." And it probably won't happen, but that's who I -she's a woman, a very strong woman, very powerful, internationally respected. And that is who I thought should be the president.
And you would not believe how many e-mails I got back from that single article just saying -
WHITFIELD: In support of, or?
MOEZZI: In support of. "Are you starting an organization?" I don't know. But if Shia Abazi (ph) is listening we want you to run. I think a woman leading this, a woman at the head of this is what we need.
WHITFIELD: Melody Moezzi, thank you very much. Very outspoken.
MOEZZI: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: Very interesting. And I would love to be on the phone as you and family members talk just to see how electric it gets.
MOEZZI: We'll arrange that sometime.
WHITFIELD: Good deal. All right, Melody, thank you so much.
MOEZZI: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: All right. The latest on the Iranian protests, right here, from the NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Welcome back. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
We told about a breaking story moments ago. A "New York Times" reporter who was taken hostage by the Taliban, allegedly, seven months ago, according to "New York Times" reporting, has since made a break from his captors, and has actually found refuge at an American base in Bagram, Afghanistan. Our Nic Robertson, who has spent an awful lot of time in Afghanistan, right now, he's in Islamabad. He joins us with more on this.
Nic, what can you tell us?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INT'L. CORRESPONDENT: Fredericka, David Rohde was captured late last year, in the fall of last year, by the Taliban. There were immediate efforts to try and get him released from the Taliban. Those efforts stalled. "The New York Times" really kept the profile of his story and the efforts to gain his release low profile, out of the headlines, out of newspapers.
What we are hearing now from "The New York Times" is that he has found sanctuary. What I am learning from my sources here in Pakistan, and at the moment this is just from one source, is that Pakistani troops were actually involved in getting David Rohde released. I know because I've been tracking David Rohde's situation for time from a number of different American and Afghan sources, who have believed for a long time that David Rohde is being held by the Taliban inside Pakistan and in North Waziristan.
What I'm told by my sources here is that the Pakistani military today helped David Rohde escape from his Taliban capture. Pakistani authorities, then, I am told by this source, passed him over to U.S. authorities here, who then allowed him and helped him to get back to Afghanistan and get back to base in Afghanistan. We have very, very few details about how his escape actually took place. But it is very, very interesting right now, Fredricka, of course, the Pakistani government cracking down massively on the Taliban here.
They asked defections among the Taliban, here Pakistan, to the government's side, now at this time David Rohde, who was believed by U.S. officials just in the past couple of weeks as being held inside Pakistan by the Taliban, has now affected an escape with the help of Pakistani troops. These are the earliest details we have. And, of course, David Rohde, a very accomplished journalist winning a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on Bosnia in the 1990s.
He was the journalist that went all alone into the Bosnia-Serb territory and discovered those mass graves of about 7,000 or 8,000 Bosnia Muslims who were massacred by Bosnian Serbs in the town of Srebrenica, in the summer of 1995. David Rohde, a very famous journalist.
No doubt his family at this time will be absolutely relieved after the heartbreak and pain and suffering they've been going through over the past number of months, Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: We are looking at his picture right now. So, just correct me. I think I may have reported that incorrectly then, Nic. He is no longer in Afghanistan, but he is in Pakistan after coming across the Pakistani forces? He is not at an air force base in Afghanistan, or he is?
ROBERTSON: We believe he is at the moment in an air base in Afghanistan.
WHITFIELD: OK.
ROBERTSON: These details are sketchy. We're only just getting them. Sources here in Pakistan saying that Pakistani troops helped effect his release or escape from the Pakistani Taliban, inside Pakistan, where in the last few weeks U.S. officials believed he was being held, Fredericka.
WHITFIELD: Oh, good. Thanks so much. I thought for a second I misspoke.
So, Nic, you have time to tell me a little tell me about Waziristan. It is certainly a Taliban stronghold. It would make sense if he's going to be held captive with the Taliban, that would be the place where the Taliban feels more protected, most engaged in their activities.
ROBERTSON: And safe from the majority of incursions by U.S. troops. Obviously, there are drones that fly over that area, that have been targeting Al Qaeda and Taliban leaders in that area. It is a place where Taliban have, until now, felt reasonably safe. It is an indication that the tables have been turning on them as the Pakistani military here increases their pressure on the Taliban.
I spoke with a Taliban spokesman, for the Afghan Taliban, just a few weeks ago. And I asked him, at that time, about David Rohde. What he told me was the Taliban had released two different proof of identity videos, if you will, of David Rohde to show they had him captured, to show that he was in custody. What that particular Taliban spokesman told me at that time they demanded negotiations. They wanted certain Taliban leaders who were in U.S. captivity to be released, that they wanted money.
Of course, these are the sorts of demands we have heard from the Taliban in other situations like this in the past. And David Rohde's situation in particular is something his newspaper has been dealing with very carefully and very cautiously. They are the ones who have broken the news tonight that he is now free with U.S. troops at Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan.
WHITFIELD: Nic Robertson, thank you so much. Great news for the family of David Rohde. "The New York Times" reporter being held captive for seven months by the Taliban.
And we understand, tomorrow, on John King's "State of the Union" program, "The New York Times" executive editor, Bill Keller is actually a guest on Sunday. And no doubt he will be elaborating a little bit more, as best he can, on how David Rohde is doing. We know that David Rohde has already had a conversation with his wife Kristen Mulvihill. Hopefully, he is recovering just fine as he is now with U.S. forces, there in Afghanistan.
Nic Robertson, thanks so much for that latest report.
Of course, we are continuing to monitor the situation in Iran, particularly the media. What they are, and are not, revealing publicly about the activity going on in Iran, and beyond, in Iran.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
Welcome back. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
Iranian Americans are watching events unfold in Tehran with apprehension. One is a youth activist Pantea Beigi, in Los Angeles, joining us.
Good to see you, Pantea.
With apprehension, what are you most concerned about as you continue to watch the development overseas?
PANTEA BEIGI, IRANIAN-AMERICAN YOUTH ACTIVIST: It's good to be here.
I think the main concern is the people's safety. I think they are being incredibly brave putting their lives on the line to hope that they can create some great change. And I think the biggest concern for all of us, from outside, is their safety. We do not want bloodshed. That's what we are most concerned about.
WHITFIELD: Even though it appears as though a change is not coming in the form of the government, since the ayatollah and others are resisting recount, or a revote, et cetera, really by osmosis as a result of all these protests taking place, has there been change in Iran, in your view?
BEIGI: I think this stands for incredible change. You have to realize this is 30 years in the coming. It is not really only about this election. Mousavi serves as somewhat of a symbolic figure, but this is really about the threshold that the young people of Iran and the people of Iran have finally come to. And I think it just so happens that it's about this election. It happened over this election, but it's really something that's been in the working, it's been coming very slow. And they really paid big prices for it in the past 30 years. They've had many deaths. They've had many arrests. And so I think it's already standing for incredible change by incredible bravery that all these people are taking upon themselves to go out there and do this.
I think even if we don't see very visible change within the channels of the current government, there is no way that someone could stand and watch this and say that there's been no change created, at least in the way in which the people are going to take the affairs of their country from now on, because they're showing that the old ways are no longer going to happen. They're not going to sit by and watch injustices happen to their people, or their rights taken away. I don't think they're necessarily trying to have a big revolution or a big overthrow of their government, but they're simply saying, hey, you put these limitations on us for the past 30 years. We've been cooperating, but at least give me my vote, give me the right you promised me you know, on Friday.
I think this is a great start for them to really utilize the legal channels of their own regime right now to do this, which is huge.
WHITFIELD: Do you feel any concern that this momentum, it may backfire when you hear, at least, according to our reporting and the translations of what some of the protestors are yelling in the streets today, "Death to the dictator," "Death to deceptive government," that, that might help precipitate more violence, or reverse any kind of progress that some of the protestors feel that they are bringing to this country?
BEIGI: There is great concern for their safety right now, especially after Khamenei's address yesterday, and now the reaction of the protestors to him today. And, essentially, saying, down with our supreme leader. There is great risk there. They've never done this before. We are definitely concerned. I know Dr. Shirin Ebadi has been in Geneva, and the Hague, in the past three days. She has been meeting with U.N. Human Rights High Commissioner Madam Pillay and they are working on resolutions. They are doing calls to action.
She's worked with Nobel Women's Initiative, which comprised of six Nobel women peace laureates, that are all working very hard with the international community to ensure the security of the protestors that are out there. Because I really do think that if they do not - you know, if they do continue going the way they are, yes, there is great fear that there will be bloodshed, that the government will be reacting extremely harsh and violent in order to control the situation.
I also think that if the protests don't stop there is a great chance that the government will issue arrest warrants for Mousavi, himself, or Hashemi Rathsanjavi for hatami (ph) that is also very possible. Because I think when it's really hard to control a mass of 1 million people, particularly most of them young people. It's much easier to issue arrest warrants for the so-called leaders that are calling for these protests to happen, in hopes that the people might get scared and return home. Like I said, I really don't think this is wholly about Mousavi himself. I think this is about a freedom movement that's been very slow in the coming and happening by the people for the people.
WHITFIELD: Iranian American youth activist Pantea Beigi, thanks so much, joining us from Los Angeles.
All right. Iran's supreme leader promised to crack down on protestors. That was yesterday. Exactly what we were talking about. And it is exactly what's happening right now. People are still taking to the streets in defiance. Much more straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) WHITFIELD: New and scattered reports are filtering in from Iran about the pushback that protestors are getting from police. Some are facing water cannons, tear gas and the business end of clubs, so to speak. Octavia Nasr, our senior editor for Mideast affairs is monitoring this very tense situation.
The ayatollah said yesterday, don't go in the streets, if you do, you will feel and see the wrath of government. That is exactly what is transpiring here. We are seeing tear gas, plumes of smoke and two reported deaths, right?
OCTAVIA NASR, CNN SR. EDITOR FOR MIDEAST AFFAIRS: That is what we are hearing. We are trying to confirm -- we are very skeptical, obviously, just because we want to confirm. There a lot of information out there, a lot of misinformation, and disinformation.
Earlier in the day we were hearing reports that the demonstrations were not going to happen, they were called off. Then we heard reports that, no, people did show up. Then we heard there were pockets of people here and there, then we started to see video. And the video is showing more than just pockets, perhaps, groups in the thousands and in different cities.
Look at these images, for example. Again, we cannot verify. We cannot say exactly where this is, or what time it was taken, an exact date. At the same time, there is no reason to doubt that it is from today. We just can't authenticate as in give the exact details of what we are looking at. This is amateur video. People - as you can see them in this video. They are holding their cell phones up and taking pictures. They are shooting videos, they are shooting stills.
Look at that. Then they go and upload them on the Internet. We get them on the other end and we tell their story with a limited amount of information that we have.
So the confirmations are hard at this point, especially with the restrictions that are imposed on our crew in Tehran. They can't leave the bureau. They can't go to these rallies and cover them. They can only report once a day out of the bureau.
WHITFIELD: So, is there great risk those who are sending us these images, via their cell phones, or computers, however they are doing it, that they are running a great risk. If they were get caught, if someone were to pinpoint who is helping to transmit these images, what might happen?
NASR: You know, the minister of interior in Iran already called these demonstrations illegal. There is no doubt about all these people showing up for the demonstrations, they are right now committing an illegal act, punishable by law. They have laws for this from arrests to restraint, to all kinds of things that the government can do, basically, because this is illegal. They did not get a permit to -- they did request a permit, but they didn't get it. It wasn't approved to have a demonstration.
WHITFIELD: Even our last guest who is an Iranian who lives here stateside, Pantea Beigi, said she is concerned about arrests that may follow, not just of the protestors, but maybe the arrests of Mousavi, maybe even Rathsanjavi (ph), the cleric. I mean, how likely is that to happen and I don't know if there is any follow-up to what was reported earlier on the Facebook site, for Mousavi. That he actually, was considering, himself - he was preparing to give himself to martyrdom for this cause.
NASR: He said, I'm ready. I cleanse myself, and I'm ready. Again, this is what we are getting from his Facebook page. We don't know that he actually said it himself. We did not hear him say it, but his official page on Facebook is saying, basically, that during his speech this is what he says. We are taking their word for it.
Again, being transparent with the audience, saying this is what his page says. We did not hear it from him.
Can he be arrested? Of course. The ayatollah did say that first of all, he does not want people to demonstrate in the streets. He said that he will hold Mr. Mousavi responsible for any attacks, for anybody who gets hurt, for any property that gets damaged. So, that is known. It's a fact.
WHITFIELD: I think everybody believes that.
NASR: Everybody believes that. What is happening right now in Iran, and we are sensing that on those sites, what is happening is that people are very concerned for their own safety, for the safety of their loved ones, their family members, who went to these demonstrations. Some of them, we're hearing, did not return, or are on the way, but they don't have any - they're not in touch with them.
WHITFIELD: So, lots of concern.
NASR: So, that is what's lots of concern for safety of individuals who are participating in these demonstrations.
WHITFIELD: Arab affairs editor, Octavia Nasr, thank you so much.
We have new images that are coming our way as well. Ivan Watson is the Iran Desk. We'll have much more of these new images and his reporting, right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Welcome back, you're in the CNN NEWSROOM, where the news unfolds live this Saturday, June 20th. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
We're continuing to follow breaking news out of Iran. Mass rallies were planned and people turned out in defiant protest of the recent election. But they never made it to the squares in central Tehran. Instead they were met by police armed with tear gas and water cannons. CNN and the other international media were kept far from the action, so the images that you have been seeing are actually coming to us from eyewitnesses in the streets, and from Iran's state-run television. Those images from them directly as well.
