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Campbell Brown
South Carolina Governor Under Fire; New Violence Erupts in Iran
Aired June 24, 2009 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CAMPBELL BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: (voice-over): Tonight, here are the questions we want answered. First, the one everyone is asking: Mark Sanford, what were you thinking?
GOV. MARK SANFORD (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: I have been unfaithful to my wife.
BROWN: A rising star in the GOP runs away to Argentina for a rendezvous with a woman, um, not his wife.
SANFORD: It began very innocently, as I suspect many of these things do, in just a casual e-mail back and forth.
BROWN: His riveting confession.
SANFORD: And all I can say is that I apologize.
BROWN: And the fallout for the Republican Party.
SANFORD: I'm going to resign as chairman of the Republican Governors Association.
BROWN: Plus, the streets of Tehran erupt in new violence today.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All of a sudden, some 500 people with clubs and woods, they came out of the (INAUDIBLE) mosque, and they poured into the streets, and they started beating everyone.
BROWN: Tonight's breakout, an eyewitness report.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is your only source for news. CNN prime time begins now. Here's Campbell Brown.
BROWN: Hi, everybody.
Those are our big questions tonight. But we start as always with the "Mash-Up," our look at stories making an impact right now and the moments you may have missed today. We are watching it all, so you don't have to.
Tonight, of course, the unfolding mystery of South Carolina Governor Mark Sanford. Yes, he went missing for five days. No, he was not hiking in Appalachia. He was in South America with his mistress. Today, Sanford came home and came clean.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANFORD: The bottom line is this. I -- I have been unfaithful to my wife.
I developed a relationship with a -- what started as a dear, dear friend from Argentina. It began very innocently, as I suspect many of these things do.
But, here, recently, over this last year, it developed into something much more than that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: And I can honestly tell you that was an extraordinary news conference. We're going to bring you much more of Sanford in his own words later in the show. But his statement was only the beginning. Check out what unfolded next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't even know where to begin.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think any of us watching this news conference thought we were going to get the amount of information and detail we got.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Choked up, fighting back tears, the Republican begged for his wife, his family and the citizens of South Carolina to forgive him.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Here again, the family values argument gets a slap in the face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sanford's wife, Jenny, handed out a statement saying she had asked the governor to leave her home two weeks ago, but would try to forgive him now.
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: She writes, "To maintain my dignity, self-respect, and my basic sense of right and wrong, I asked my husband to leave two weeks ago."
STEVE OSUNSAMI, ABC NEWS: Tonight, the South Carolina paper that helped break this story published e-mails between the governor and his mistress.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In them, he writes about his attraction to her, saying: "You have the ability to give magnificent, gentle kisses. I feel a little vulnerable because this is ground I have never -- certainly never covered before. Please sleep soundly, knowing that, despite the best efforts of my head, my heart cries out for you."
BLITZER: When contacted by CNN, a spokesman for the governor would neither confirm nor deny the authenticity of these e-mails.
You talk to some in the Republican Party, and they -- they -- they describe it as like a bad episode of "Survivor."
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a whopper, Jeff, an absolute whopper.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: The South Carolina newspaper that published the governor's e-mails says it has more. Those are going to be out tomorrow.
Sanford gave no indication today that he plans to resign.
In Iran tonight, bloody clashes between protesters and police, this as the supreme leader declared he would not be pressured into calling for a new election.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Anti-government protesters beaten, beaten like animals, that's a direct quote from one of them, and it's just one ugly account we're getting today of the latest unrest in Iran.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Protesters had come today expecting to see opposition leader Mir Hossein Mousavi. Instead, they met overwhelming force.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The militia, often in plain clothing, and loyal to Iran's supreme leader, has used crude weapons, using sticks, axes, chains and machetes.
KATIE COURIC, HOST, "CBS EVENING NEWS": Mir Hossein Mousavi, the defeated presidential candidate, who initially led the protests, has not been heard from in a week. But today his wife posted a message online blasting the government for acting as if it had imposed martial law.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Again, reporters have largely been banned from covering the violence. Iranians are left to tell their own story through any means possible. We are going to have more harrowing accounts coming up later in the show.
The Obama administration, meanwhile, has disinvited Iranian diplomats from State Department Fourth of July celebrations. The invites were meant to be an olive branch, but, in the aftermath of the Iranian election, they quickly turned into a P.R. nightmare.
Reporters grilled State Department spokesman Ian Kelly today, asking if the Iranians were still welcome. He wouldn't say. An hour later, the White House press secretary made it clear they were not. Here, the administration flacks now struggling to stay on message.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) IAN KELLY, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: As I say, we're closely watching what's going on. We're monitoring what's going on, on the streets. We're going to make judgments based on what we see, based on our -- on our national interests. We're closely watching what's going on. And we're going to make judgments.
QUESTION: So, can we write that you are considering withdrawing these...
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: I'm just telling you right now that we're -- we're closely watching everything going on and we're going to make judgments, decisions going forward based on what we see.
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Not surprisingly, based on what we see going on in Tehran, nobody has RSVPed.
KELLY: As far as I know, not a single Iranian has accepted one of those invitations.
GIBBS: No, I said nobody has RSVPed.
QUESTION: Had somebody RSVPed, would they have been allowed in the door?
GIBBS: Well, I appreciate the hypothetical that no longer exists on God's green earth. But...
QUESTION: Are those invitations rescinded is the question.
GIBBS: Yes.
QUESTION: Yes?
GIBBS: Yes.
QUESTION: OK.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Tonight, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton sent out a note to her diplomats around the world. Her message, Iranian attendance at their Fourth of July festivities is -- quote -- "no longer appropriate."
Retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor made the TV round today. She pitched her kids book about her life as a cowgirl and talked about how happy she is to see another woman in line for a seat on the high court.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDRA DAY O'CONNOR, FORMER SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: I served at the court over 10 year as the only woman on the court. And it made a difference to me when we got the second woman, Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg. And she is now alone again, and I'm sure it will matter to her a great deal to have another woman on the court.
We have a tremendous number of qualified women in the country who are serving as lawyers, so they ought to be represented on the court.
There's too much media attention to the one woman, if that's all we have on the court.
Our nearest neighbor is Canada. And Canada has also a nine- member Supreme Court. Their chief justice is a woman. And four of the justices are female in Canada.
That's worked out rather well in Canada. So, I hope the United States will do some catching up in that regard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: When pressed about some of Judge Sonia Sotomayor's controversial statements, Justice O'Connor gave a big fat no comment.
And now for the punchline. This is our pick from the best of last night's late-night comedy stylings. And, no surprise, pretty much everybody took a shot at the missing South Carolina governor.
But Stephen Colbert's bit had a real wow factor. Check it out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, "THE COLBERT REPORT": No one is more qualified to speculate on the governor. Since last year, I got to better know him and enjoyed the opportunity to lavish him with praise.
You are incredibly boring.
(LAUGHTER)
COLBERT: You are a manila envelope glued to a beige wall.
(LAUGHTER)
COLBERT: Of course, I saw this whole thing coming over a year ago.
Tell me about the Mark Sanford nobody knows about.
SANFORD: Well, I guess it would be a degree to which I love solitude. I love to be out in the woods with my boys.
COLBERT: Can I just change the subject for a moment?
(LAUGHTER)
SANFORD: OK.
COLBERT: Tell me about the Mark Sanford no one carries about.
SANFORD: Well, I would go back to the same guy who loves solitude.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Stephen Colbert got a little bit lucky with that one.
And that's tonight's "Mash-Up."
Tonight's newsmaker, Governor Mark Sanford. Who else? What in the world was he thinking? It was the news conference that left political junkies speechless.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: Are you separated?
(CROSSTALK)
QUESTION: ... separated?
SANFORD: What's that?
QUESTION: Are you separated from the first lady?
SANFORD: Well, I -- I don't know how you want to define that. I mean, I'm here and she's there. I guess, in a formal sense, we're not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Welcome back, everybody.
Tonight's newsmaker couldn't be anyone other than South Carolina Governor Mark Sanford. It is not just his scandalous affair that has everybody riveted. His rambling 18-minute confession liberally sprinkled with apologies to everybody from his family to his staff to people of faith, well, you really have to hear it in his own words.
Here now, Mark Sanford unplugged.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANFORD: What I have found, in this job, is that one desperately needs a break from the bubble, wherein every word, every moment is recorded -- just to completely break.
I talked about the profound frustrations that I have felt over this last legislative session, in the battle that was in place with regard to the stimulus package, the $700 million in play, and how, at an emotional level, I found it exhausting.
So all those things we talked about this morning were true, but they're not the whole story. And that's obviously why everybody's gathered here right now.
And so let me lay out that larger story that has attracted so many of you all here. I'm a bottom-line kind of -- kind of guy. I lay it out. It's going to hurt, and we'll let the chips fall where they may.
In so doing, let me first of all apologize to my wife, Jenny, and our four great boys, Marshall, Landon, Bolton, and Blake, for letting them down.
I would also apologize to my staff because, as much as I did talk about going to the Appalachian Trail -- and that was one of the original scenarios that I would thrown out to Mary Neil (ph) -- that isn't where I ended up.
I -- I want to apologize to good friends. Tom Davis came over to the house. He drove up from Beaufort. And he has been an incredibly dear friend for a very long time.
In my first race for governor, he moved up and he lived in the basement of our house for six months, and we called it Jurassic Park because it was the kids' dinosaur sheets and all kinds of different folks were living there in the campaign.
But I -- I guess where I'm trying to go with this is that there are moral absolutes, and that God's law indeed is there to protect you from yourself. And there are consequences if you breach that. This press conference is a consequence.
And so the bottom line is this, I -- I have been unfaithful to my wife. I developed a relationship with a -- which started out as a dear, dear friend from Argentina. It began very innocently, as I suspect many of these things do, in just a casual e-mail back and forth, in advice on one's life there and advice here.
But here recently over this last year it developed into something much more than that. And as a consequence, I hurt her. I hurt you all. I hurt my wife. I hurt my boys. I hurt friends like Tom Davis. I hurt a lot of different folks. And all I can say is that I apologize.
QUESTION: Are you separated from the first lady?
SANFORD: Well, I -- I don't know how you want to define that. I mean, I'm here and she's there. I guess, in a formal sense, we're not.
But, you know, what we're -- what we're trying to do is work through something that, you know, we've been working through for a number of months now.
SANFORD: What's that? Yes.
QUESTION: Is this the first and only time you've been unfaithful?
SANFORD: Yes. Yes, sir.
(CROSSTALK)
QUESTION: Did you break off the relationship?
SANFORD: Obviously not.
What's that?
QUESTION: Were you alone?
SANFORD: Obviously not.
QUESTION: Did you break off the relationship?
SANFORD: The -- no, it was interesting in how this thing has gone down, John.
To give you way more detail than you'll ever want, I met this person a little over eight years ago, again, very innocently.
And then, as I said, about a year ago, it sparked into something more than that.
I have seen her three times since then, during that whole sparking thing. And it was discovered...
(CROSSTALK)
SANFORD: Let me finish -- five months ago.
And, at that point, we went into serious overdrive in trying to say, where do you go from here?
And so, oddly enough, I spent the last five days, and I was crying in Argentina so I could repeat it when I came back here, in saying, you know, while, indeed, from a heart level, there was something real. It was a place based on the fiduciary relationship I had to the people of South Carolina, based on my boys, based on my wife, based on where I was in life, based on where she was in life, and places I couldn't go and she couldn't go.
And that is a, I suspect, a continual process, all through life, of getting one's heart right in life.
And so, I would never stand before you as one who just says, "Yo, I'm completely right with regard to my heard on all things." But what I would say is I'm committed to trying to get my heart right.
QUESTION: Will you resign as governor?
Joel, is the governor going to resign?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BROWN: That news conference by the governor was just the beginning today.
It was followed by the release of salacious e-mails between him and his mistress, and a heart-wrenching statement from his wife, who didn't stand by his side today.
Republicans in full damage control, a marriage in tatters, and the big question tonight: How in the world did he think he could just disappear for a few days as governor with his mistress, and no one would notice? We are going to ask one of his close friends, South Carolina state lawmaker Tom Davis.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANFORD: And I suspect, if I would really put this other person first, I wouldn't have jeopardized her life, as I have. I certainly wouldn't have done it to my wife. I wouldn't have done it to my boys. I wouldn't have done it to the Tom Davises of the world. This was selfishness on my part.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Governor Mark Sanford, in his extraordinary confession today, repeatedly apologized to his friend, Tom Davis, a South Carolina state senator. It caused him to even tear up at one point.
And, in fact, Sanford mentioned Davis five times, as many times as he mentioned his own wife, who he cheated on.
Senator Tom Davis is joining me right now with his reaction to today's news.
And, Senator Davis, tell us what you thought, listening to your friend today.
TOM DAVIS (R), SOUTH CAROLINA STATE SENATOR: Hey, Campbell.
It was very painful. I have known Mark Sanford for 30 years. He and I went to Furman together. We went through school. I was on his first campaign in 1994 when he ran for Congress. I left my law practice to help run his first gubernatorial campaign in 2002.
Thereafter, I served in various capacities and ultimately as his chief of staff. I consider him one of my closest friends, a 30-year friend. And this is the last person in the world I expected to hear this from.
BROWN: When did you find out about this?
DAVIS: This morning, Campbell.
There was the -- the media discussion over the weekend in regard to his absence from the state and, some said, inability to reach him. And I thought there was going to be a press conference in regard to that.
When I went to Columbia, I sat down with the governor for about an hour-and-a-half, and we had a discussion about this. And he told me about the situation and indicated to me that he was going to use the opportunity at this press conference to go ahead and confess his sins and to ask for forgiveness.
And it was very painful to have to watch my friend go through that. And it's also very painful for his family. I know his wife, Jenny. I have known Jenny for 20 years. I know all four boys. My thoughts and players are with Mark and his wife, Jenny, and the children. I just -- I can't imagine how difficult this time must be personally for them.
And I just wish them the best.
BROWN: Given that you probably know him better than anybody, how do you explain his behavior, primarily the disappearance, without alerting anybody to where he was going?
DAVIS: You know, it's -- Mark is a person that's very private and Mark doesn't confide much. And the fact that he didn't share this information with me, while not necessarily surprising, is shocking.
You know, as far as him, you know, leaving the past four or five days, he's done that in the past. Back when I was his chief of staff, after a legislative session, Mark would typically leave for about five or six days, usually go to the (INAUDIBLE) farm, where his family has a place in Beaufort County, or he would go hunting and fishing.
So, it wasn't out of the ordinary for him to take off after a legislative session. And he always had his cell phone with him, and he could always be reached. Leave a message, and he would call you back.
This time around, I'm not on Mark's staff. I'm in the state senate now. So, I wasn't really privy to the circumstances behind this recent visit. But it doesn't surprise me, because Mark does go on these trips. And, so...
BROWN: But -- but you're not only a friend. You're also a lawmaker. And you have heard some of the criticism. A lot of people have said, what if something had happened in the state of South Carolina and our governor is MIA?
Does that concern you, as a lawmaker, at all?
DAVIS: Well, first of all, you have to understand the nature of executive branch. And even the federal level, it doesn't depend upon the president being awake at all times.
You have protocols that are put into place. You have chiefs of staff. You have deputies. You have various other duties that are delegated to you.
BROWN: Right. But, I mean, come on. If the president disappeared for that extended period of time, it would be a huge deal. You know that. I mean...
DAVIS: Yes. But, Campbell, the premise of your question is that the governor actually disappeared. He was reachable by cell phone.
And I realize that's a fine distinction, but it is a distinction, because if the governor needed to be reached -- and I have talked to the chief of staff, and I have talked to other members of the governor's staff -- if he had to be reached, he could have been reached.
The fact that he was not in communication with anybody from Thursday through Sunday evening, I believe, was simply because no one tried to reach him. There was no emergency, and that, when they did try to reach him, he called back and he came back home. So -- or Monday, excuse me.
So, I think he was reachable. Even though people may have not known his exact physical location, he was accessible by phone.
BROWN: Do you think he should resign?
DAVIS: You know, I take the governor at his word.
And I'm going to read from what I -- what he said in the statement today, that he's going to spend the rest of the time in his office devoting his energy to building back the trust of the people of this state. And I think he deserves the chance to do that, Campbell, although I will note that the burden is very high on the governor in that regard.
And people be will watching for his sincerity. I think there's an incredible capacity in the American people for forgiveness. What they will not forgive is hypocrisy. And, so, I think the next few days are going to be very critical for the governor.
BROWN: Senator Tom Davis, a close friend of Governor Mark Sanford, appreciate your time tonight. Thank you so much.
DAVIS: Thank you, Campbell.
We have heard now from the governor, of just then from one of his closest friends. Next up, we're going to be joined by James Carville and one of the reporters from the newspaper that broke the story.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are other e-mails that we're going to publish in the print edition tomorrow.
BLITZER: Just basically more of the same kind of stuff, sort of a graphic love affair described?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wouldn't call it a graphic love affair. But it explains their relationship. It gives us some insight into what the governor was thinking.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Until this scandal broke, Mark Sanford was a rising star in the GOP. In fact, he was considered a prime presidential candidate in 2012. And that's looking a little shaky right now.
So, what was he thinking and what happens now?
Joining me to talk about that, John Avlon, who is a contributor to "The Daily Beast," Republican consultant Alex Castellanos joining us from Washington, Leroy Chapman from the Columbia, South Carolina, newspaper "The State," and CNN political contributor James Carville, from down in New Orleans.
My question, guys, is, what was he thinking on so many levels, the affair, leaving without telling anybody where he was going, and in large part this news conference today?
James, watching it all, what did you think?
JAMES CARVILLE, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I mean, first of all, he wasn't thinking very much. But, normally, when people get into these kinds of things, they are not thinking very clearly. They are not thinking with their brains for sure.
I couldn't help but feel sorry for him as a human being. I mean, I -- look, he dug his own hole. It was his actions. It was -- he suffered consequences for what he did.
However, you just couldn't be a human being, and see someone in that much angst and that much pain, and not have some measure of compassion and sympathy for him.
And maybe the good that will come out of here is, we won't listen to any more nauseating pontificating about family values and what do we tell the children and all that other garbage we heard. Maybe we can just say, everybody is human being, everybody is prone to human failings. And that might be a good thing for us.
BROWN: Let me go to Leroy on this, because, Leroy, you have covered him. You certainly know the state, the people down there.
How are they going to interpret this?
LEROY CHAPMAN, GOVERNMENT & POLITICS EDITOR, "THE STATE": Well, Governor Mark Sanford was immensely popular for a long time. He's obviously been elected twice in the state. And, among a lot of people, he was probably -- he's probably the most popular Republican that we have.
But, given this, I think this is obviously the biggest of a couple of things I think that have eroded his popularity of late. The stimulus fight I think probably hurt his popularity a little bit. And certainly the unemployment -- the fight over unemployment benefits was -- was another. But -- though, all three of these things together I think have certainly hurt him. And it's a matter of trust, because I think people will see this issue as looking at him leaving, not being in communication, and wondering about the question of the succession of power. Who was in charge while Governor Sanford was missing?
And that was the question that loomed over the state for several days. And they -- his staff was unable to provide a credible answer to that.
BROWN: Alex?
ALEX CASTELLANOS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, this is, you know, tough for the Republican Party, as well as governor of South Carolina. Right now we're a party that's out of power and it's hard to find your voice when you don't have the bully pulpit of the presidency.
We're also trying to find our voice, who we are, where we take the country as opposed to President Obama. But we're also looking for leaders, a new generation of leaders, and nothing grew -- no new leaders grew in the shade of the big Bush tree. We're just starting to develop that new generation of leaders.
You know the Democrats have had their generational transformation with Barack Obama. We're just looking for that now and it seems like a lot of our new leaders seem to be self-emulating here. And so that's -- makes it tougher.
BROWN: Alex, also address James's point about the hypocrisy.
CASTELLANOS: Well, that's -- you know, I think James is...
BROWN: Which has been an issue for the Republican Party. The hiking of family values thing.
CASTELLANOS: You know I think James is just about 100 percent wrong on that. I know James may prefer to live in a value-free society where nothing is wrong and everything is right and we can do anything we want. But we do need rules.
And just because some people can't live up to them doesn't mean we should live in a valueless world. And yes, we should expect our leaders to set example.
James, it doesn't mean government should tell you how to run your life. But, you know, our leaders should do that. Lead. And that doesn't mean just write laws. It should mean set examples.
BROWN: James, go ahead. I got to let you respond. I don't think you want to live in a valueless world.
(LAUGHTER)
JAMES CARVILLE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I don't want to live in a valueless world. I just don't need some... CASTELLANOS: We can have values as long as we don't use them?
(CROSSTALK)
CARVILLE: Again, I'll -- Alex, let me finish. I don't need pontificating politicians screaming what will we tell the children or people like Mark Sanford calling Bill Clinton a rascal, or people like Mark Sanford being the first person to call Bob Livingston to resign.
What we need is some forgiveness and some humility in the world and the recognition that people are human.
CASTELLANOS: Oh James.
BROWN: Let him talk.
CARVILLE: And, by the way, forgiveness is a value.
CASTELLANOS: Yes.
CARVILLE: It really is.
BROWN: Let me bring...
(CROSSTALK)
CARVILLE: At least one I was taught.
BROWN: Let me bring John into this.
JOHN AVLON, CONTRIBUTOR, "THE DAILY BEAST": I appreciate James's comments here. I mean I think he is exactly right. We should know by now that neither party has a monopoly on virtue and vice. And this was a -- we're all damaged. We're all broken in some way. This was a forthright man. It was a heart-breaking press conference.
He made a mistake. He's acknowledged his sins. Hypocrisy is the unforgivable sin in politics. And it's important for folks to remember that while Mark Sanford is a strong fiscal conservative he never got on the social conservative soap box. And that's an important point for us all to remember tonight.
BROWN: Well, let me ask though. I thought the news conference was compelling to say the least. But I mean I was struck by the fact that he felt the need to share incredible details about the progression of this affair with -- you know, the world.
Alex, what was going on?
CASTELLANOS: I think there was a lot of narcissism there masquerading his honesty. This was someone who, I think, wanted to let us know how he got into it. What happened. How he felt. But unfortunately, this is just not all about him.
There were kids involved. There's a state involved. There's the executive responsibility involved. So yes, it was self-indulgent. And I don't think that helped his case. So, you know, I think someone in that situation might have been better served he's getting out there saying he made a mistake, he was wrong, and he's going to go heal.
AVLON: Alex, I mean, Governor Sanford was the one saying what he did was selfish. He acknowledged all those points you just tried to attack him with.
CARVILLE: And he selfishly spent 18 minutes doing it.
(CROSSTALK)
CHAPMAN: I'll say this.
BROWN: Go ahead, Leroy.
CHAPMAN: Being around Governor Sanford -- being around Governor Sanford and having known him, he's an unscripted guy and that's part of -- I think his charm. I think with a lot of people that he has been unscripted and today was just in keeping with that.
BROWN: Hardly charming today.
(LAUGHTER)
CARVILLE: Right.
CHAPMAN: Well, yes, certainly not charming today but the point is, is that he was unscripted and he didn't walk out with a statement, read it and walk out and do the staging that I've seen politicians do before with the wife, and it becomes all staged and nothing about it is authentic. I thought he was very authentic today.
BROWN: James, you get the last word.
CARVILLE: I did do. Yes, you know, I made that trip to Buenos Aires 20, 25 times in my life. I don't think that that man hasn't gotten a lot of sleep in the last four, five days. And he looked emotionally spent to me. I mean I did -- you're right. I do see he dug himself a hole. It's his actions and everything else.
He felt like he had to step out. He needs some rest. I mean I don't think he ought to resign because of a sex scandal. I don't think anybody should resign for a sex scandal. But he just looks like a man that has emotionally been through the ringer pretty tough. And I hope he gets himself together and gets his family back together because, you know, you don't wish that on anybody, particularly those four boys.
BROWN: All right, we got to end it there, guys. Many thanks to the panel. To all of you. Appreciate your time.
When we come back we have some new details we're going to share with you about the secret organ transplant that saved the life of Apple founder Steve Jobs. Plus a chilling new account of the brutality on the streets of Tehran. The world heard it live on CNN today. Listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They pulled into the streets and they started beating everyone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Now a look at some of the other must-see stories of the day. Erica Hill here with tonight's "Download."
ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: And Campbell, we begin blood shed in Iraq today just days before a key deadline for U.S. troops. At least 62 people killed when a bomb ripped true an outdoor market in Baghdad's Sadr City neighbor.
That attack coming just days before U.S. troops are due to pull out of all Iraqi cities and towns, and move back on to bases, leaving security to the Iraqi government.
A popular high school football coach in Iowa shot to death in the school's weight room today in front of several of his players. It happened in Cedar Falls about 100 miles northeast of Des Moines.
Police say the gunman is a former player but there is no word tonight on a motive. No one else was hurt.
The world's second richest man says the economy isn't on the rebound just yet. Here's what Warren Buffett told CNN's Susan Lisovicz today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WARNER BUFFETT: There's no uptick yet. There will be. I want to assure everybody that. This country always comes back. I mean if you -- you know, we've had the civil war, we've had the Great Depression, we've had Pearl Harbor. We've got a lot of unpleasant surprises, but we always overcome them. And we will this. We haven't yet and it doesn't look to me like it's imminent. It will happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: Just not quite yet.
Also today, California's budgets crisis is deepening. The state says it will have to start paying its creditors with IOUs next month because of a $24 billion deficit.
And in a Memphis hospital where doctors gave Steve Jobs a liver transplant denied the Apple CEO received any special treatment. Doctors say they performed the rare surgery two months ago because he was the sickest patient on the waiting list.
Jobs is due back to work by the end of the month. He has reportedly been spotted in Apple headquarters in California already. Somehow I'm not surprised. Doesn't seem like he would take too much time off even after a liver transplant.
BROWN: Even after a liver transplant. Erica Hill, for us tonight. Erica, thanks.
Politicians behaving badly. Today's story is just the latest in a long list of political scandals. But it does raise an important question. Why is it that politicians think they can get away with it? We'll talk about that when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Today, the mystery of missing South Carolina governor, Mark Sanford, gave way to an explosion of shame as he confessed to cheating on his wife. And in doing so, he joins the growing list of powerful politicians who became powerless against temptation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT: I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky.
GOV. JAMES MCGREEVY (D), NEW JERSEY: I engaged in adult consensual affair with another man, which violates my bonds of matrimony. And so my truth is that I am a gay American.
SEN. JOHN ENSIGN (R), NEVADA: Last year, I had an affair. I violated the vows of my marriage.
GOV. ELLIOT SPITZER (D), NEW YORK: To every New Yorker, and to all of those who believed in what I tried to stand for, I sincerely apologize.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Now just like when those other politicians were ultimately caught, it begs one to ask, why do they possibly think they can get away with it?
Let's bring back our panel, James Carville, John Avlon. Back with us. We're going to welcome psychologist and radio talk show host, Joy Browne, also, and psychiatrist Gale Saltz as well.
You guys saw the list there. We forgot John Edwards.
James, what is it about politicians, and you had a close relationship with Bill Clinton, that -- is there an element of narcissism, of -- you know, risk taking that exist in these people?
CARVILLE: It's not just politicians that do this kind of thing. You know? It goes on all over society. And you know -- and a lot of them don't get caught. I mean, you know, people have had a lot of affairs that we don't hear about. But look, they're not thinking, and you know, obviously in a situation like this. Look, we have a senator from Louisiana who's -- you know, who's involved with a prostitute. I mean...
BROWN: David Vitter. We forgot David Vitter on our list as well.
CARVILLE: Well, yes. Sure.
BROWN: But with politicians, what I mean by that is they're living in the public eye, and so they're obviously at greater risk at being caught. And I mean, Bill Clinton, certainly, than the average Joe, per se.
CARVILLE: People don't think about that when they engage in this kind of stuff. It's not something that you sort of like calculate. It's just stuff that's gone on for a long, long time. And I don't know -- they don't think they're going to get caught.
I mean very few people come into it and think -- I don't think that Mark Sanford ever thought, when he started sparking, or whatever it is with this woman down in Argentina, that he would end up in the situation that he is today. But the thing got out of hand on him and he obviously couldn't control his emotions.
My father once told me the thing about affairs to remember is they're easy to get into but very hard to get out of. Very wise.
(LAUGHTER)
BROWN: Joy, I mean, is there -- but for a powerful person, is there a different element of play here?
JOY BROWNE, PSYCHOLOGIST: I think there is. I think, first of all, there's a sense of entitlement. I think, second of all, you're surrounded by people who basically watch out for you. Have your back. Third of all, I think that power is an aphrodisiac. That's what Henry Kissinger said and he certainly didn't look like most of these guys.
James sounds like he may actually have some -- I don't want to say personal experience in this particular area but I think he's right. It's a very human thing. The problem is, that these guys have responsibilities that presumably, they're role models, and I think the issue with here, his wife can forgive him. We probably should.
But he disappeared for five days. I mean that seems to me -- and it's really interesting in this press conference, he talked more about disappointing his friend than anything else. You know I think what we should do is get all the politicians who are not having affairs and put them on.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: Gale, let me get your take.
GALE SALTZ, PSYCHIATRIST: You know I think there is a tendency for this group to be at risk for this, and that is because they are risk takers. It's part of what helped them to have the career that they have that, you know, they are people people. They want to go out. They want to push the envelope. They do want power. They are somewhat narcissistic.
They -- that power does go to their head. They feel they're special and to some degree the rules may not apply to them. And that's -- they use that in a good way for their careers in some ways. But this is the potential downfall.
And I do think that his wife made incredibly eloquent and intelligent sounding statement which a lot of women are potentially going to be bothered by -- well, how could she consider stand by him and how could she consider getting back together. But in fact, there's a family involved and many women do stay with their husbands after infidelity.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: She wasn't standing there today.
James, hold on one second. I just...
CARVILLE: I just don't -- I don't buy this. I think non- powerful people like to have sex, too. I mean somebody in power may have more opportunities, but I think that, you know, the janitor, you know, he's probably -- would like to get -- you know could get caught up in something else, though. I mean...
BROWNE: He doesn't have as many aides.
CARVILLE: I don't know if politicians have any more problems to do these things than people in general.
BROWN: Do you agree with James?
AVLON: Of course -- of course, pride come before the fall. We all know that. And this is not an original sin in politics. But I think Mrs. Sanford's letter reminded us is at the end of the day, no one knows what goes on in a relationship except the two people in it.
BROWN: That's right.
AVLON: And that's important to remember.
BROWNE: Can I bring up one other thing? Is that there's a possibility. I'm a psychologist, I know you're a psychiatrist. But people do things for a reason.
SALTZ: Yes.
BROWNE: And James is suggesting, which I think is quite accurate, that people do things for a sexual reason. But this is a guy who's 49 years old.
SALTZ: That's right.
BROWNE: He's in the second term.
SALTZ: Correct. BROWNE: He's in a long-term marriage.
SALTZ: Yes.
BROWNE: And he is -- it has been mentioned he's the front- runner. Maybe there's a part of him that says is this all there is? And there's nothing like having an affair and disappearing for five days that says I'm tipping over the traces, mid-life crisis.
(CROSSTALK)
SALTZ: Well, this is a guy also who's been going to make some decisions that has made him sort of the enemy, and...
AVLON: An unpopular, all I'm saying.
SALTZ: And he -- unpopular and he may have some driving reasons that we don't know about to do that.
AVLON: And you know, what we do know is -- I mean politicians do have a higher obligation than your average folks.
BROWNE: Yes.
AVLON: You cannot take on big fights and make powerful enemies unless you make yourself not vulnerable in your private life.
(CROSSTALK)
BROWN: All right, James, you get the last word.
CARVILLE: I just really don't buy this. I mean, look, priests have (INAUDIBLE) obligation to do thins right. Look, they fall -- we all do. I happen to grow up in rural America and some of the stuff that went on, you know, where I grew up in small town America, people come home and said -- they're not shocked by this. And it's not like just politicians and powerful people and everything.
BROWNE: Oh James, see a shrink.
CARVILLE: People fall astray. This is all psycho babble.
BROWN: All right. Well, this is what happens when I mix the political experts with the psychiatrists.
Many thanks, but we got to go, guys. To James -- thanks, James, and everyone here.
BROWNE: Let's get James on our couch.
(LAUGHTER)
BROWNE: Let's do that now.
BROWN: Yes. Be careful. You should go. Escape now while you can. Larry King is just minutes away with a lot more on Governor Mark Sanford and his lost weekend in Argentina. Larry?
LARRY KING, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, what we're covering -- you're right, Campbell. More on that surprise confession today from the Republican governor Mark Sanford after he re-emerged from being out of sight for a week. The governor's stunning admission. Sex, lies, secret trip.
Why do powerful men risk marriages, careers, representations to cheat? We're going to get into it, following up what you've been doing all ahead on "LARRY KING LIVE." Campbell?
BROWN: All right, Larry, we'll see you in a few minutes.
Coming up our breakout story tonight. Eye witness reports of increasingly brutal clashes between protesters and police in Iran. How much longer can the opposition hold out?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The black-clad police, they stopped everyone outside the -- they let -- they -- they emptied the buses, they're taking people there. They let cars go on...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Welcome back, everybody. There was a moment today when we all stopped and watched this unexpected moment when a voice from Iran broke through. The voice belongs to a young woman in Tehran. Her firsthand account perhaps as frightening as anything we've heard in recent days. She spoke to CNN's Ivan Watson. Here's tonight's "Breakout."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was at 5:30 I was going towards Baharestan with my friends, and this was everyone, not only just supporters of one candidate or the other. Everyone, all of my friends, either going to Baharestan to express our opposition to these killings these days and demanding freedom.
But the black clad police, they stopped everyone at Aazadi. They let -- they emptied the buses that were taking people there. And let the private cars go on. And we went on until (INAUDIBLE), and then all of a sudden, some 500 people with clubs and woods, they came out of the (INAUDIBLE) mosque. And they pulled into the streets and they started beating everyone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Ivan Watson joining us right now live from CNN's Iran desk in Atlanta.
And I know, Ivan, you have some breaking news for the first time since the violence started. The Iranian government has talked to CNN. What are you hearing?
IVAN WATSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This is the Iranian ambassador to Mexico, Mohammad Hassan Ghadiri. He spoke to CNN Espanol. He accused the opposition of being a minority, that is refusing to accept the victory of majority in these June 12th elections.
He painted this as law and order issue and he accused the terrorists, the demonstrators, rather, Campbell, of being terrorists who are setting fire to buses, setting fires to banks. And he says the reason that police are arresting them in their homes after midnight, is because they're standing on roof tops throwing rocks at police. Campbell?
BROWN: All right. Ivan Watson, for us tonight. Ivan, thanks.
In tonight's "Political Daily Briefing" newly released tapes from President Richard Nixon shows us even more of what was going on inside the oval office.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD NIXON, FORMER PRESIDENT: I want it on his private phone, too. We can get that, can't we?
CHARLES COLSON, PRESIDENTIAL COUNSEL: I think we can.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: We'll tell who Nixon was talking about. And you're going to hear his candid views on issues still dividing Americans today.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Time for the PDB, that's our "Political Daily Briefing." Erica is back. And it's pretty astounding after all these years that Richard Nixon's presidency continues to offer us these surprises.
HILL: He's a gift that keeps on giving in an interesting way. Some more details tonight from the tapes just released from the Nixon Presidential Library. As we mentioned last night over 150 hours worth of recordings from January and February of 1973. It's taking us a while to get through them. But they really cover a wide range of topics.
I want to share a little better than that with you tonight, including Roe v. Wade, that landmark decision, of course. It's just been handed down by the U.S. Supreme Court. So this exchange really stood out to us. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIXON: There are times when an abortion is necessary. I know that. When you have a black and a white.
COLSON: Or a rape.
NIXON: Or a rape.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: Interesting take there. Nixon also said at one point he believed more accessibility to abortion could lead to sexual permissiveness.
BROWN: I mean that's -- it's astounding to me that you have Chuck Colson pointing out, oh yes, and rape.
HILL: Oh yes, by the way, not just interracial, you know, birth which he apparently had a problem with but yes, rape would be perhaps something to consider.
BROWN: And another interesting nugget, I think, an order by Nixon for the FBI to keep tabs on Kissinger.
HILL: Yes, for Henry Kissinger, then national security adviser, of course. This is interesting to the way he goes about asking for it, saying yes, this is what I need, I want them on personal lines, too. This absolutely has to be tapped, I got to follow this guy.
BROWN: And then first-hand account of how he deals with the media.
HILL: He does. There's one exchange where -- I don't think we have time for the sound but he talks about how he calls Barbara Walters and gives her the interview. She says she doesn't remember.
(LAUGHTER)
BROWN: All right. Erica, thanks very much.
