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CNN LARRY KING LIVE
Michael Jackson's Will Revealed
Aired July 1, 2009 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LARRY KING, CNN HOST: Tonight, Michael Jackson, shocking will revealed. There are big surprises about who gets the kids, who controls the songs, who inherits the fortune estimated at more than half a billion dollars. Will that cover the debts? Michael's mother Katherine is in it. His father Joe is not. Someone is specifically cut out by name. Who? And what does he want from Diana Ross?
Plus, the nurse who says Jackson begged her for drugs is here. What she's saying now about Michael and medications, and ominous warning she delivered to the king of pop.
The Michael Jackson death mystery grows deeper next on "LARRY KING LIVE."
Good evening a quick programming note. We'll be live tomorrow night from Michael Jackson's Neverland Ranch. "LARRY KING LIVE" from Neverland on Thursday night.
Michael Jackson's will making news tonight. Before we get into that, let's get right to the latest. Let's go no Neverland with Kara Finnstrom. Kara, what's the latest on?
I must let you know I spoke with Kenny Sunshine today who now represents the Jackson family. And he said nothing will tack place at Neverland this weekend at all. There will be a service of some kind on Monday. Is that what you've learned?
KARA FINNSTROM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. A crazy day out here. just the latest development what has really been the drama around Michael Jackson's death.
About 24 hours ago, the media converged here all expecting to see a big tribute or a memorial to Michael Jackson. And the news, of course, from this new P.R. group for the Michael Jackson family today that that won't be taking place here.
So throngs of media still out here, fans still coming out and getting word of this. And it's just kind of a day of everyone listening to all the rumors out there, and trying to figure out what's next? We're still waiting to hear for official word what the plans will be.
KING: Let's check with Susan Roesgen. She is our CNN correspondent at the Jackson family home in Encino. What do you hear is going to take place Monday and where? SUSAN ROESGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's what we like to hear, Larry. I know that the family behind me, they know that the reporters are here, we have been waiting. We have not left since Michael Jackson's death last Thursday. But they are not coming out, not yet, anyway, Larry, to tell us where they like us to go, where they like the public to know the funeral is going to be.
KING: We know it's not at Neverland, and we know it's going to be someplace else. Are you geared to go wherever it is, Susan?
ROESGEN: Sure. We'll go where it is. But we have not heard yet.
KING: A will was released today. We'll read some small portions o fit a little later. Anything surprise you, Susan, then Kara. Susan, you first.
ROESGEN: Oh, absolutely, Larry. I was surprised by a couple of things in particular.
In case there was any doubt about it, any doubt at all, Michael Jackson used this very specific language in this 2002 will. He said "I intentionally omitted to provide for my former wife Deborah Rowe Jackson." That's it, Larry. He cut her out, very specifically cut her out.
And I think the other thing that was intriguing was that he has nominated his mother, Katherine Jackson to be guardian of the children. But again, this will was written in 2002, and at that time he said in case my mother should die before I do or is unwilling or unable to be the children's guardian, I nominate Diana Ross to be their guardian.
I think those are two of the most surprising parts of that will, Larry?
KING: Good point, Susan. I'll read them exactly as written. I have the will write front of me -- "Except as otherwise provided in this will or in the trust referred to in Article three hereof, I have intentionally omitted to provide for my heirs.
I have intentionally omitted to provide for my wife Deborah Jean Rowe Jackson."
And on another page right before he signs it, and I'll show you where he signed it, "I, if any of my children are minors at the time of my death," which of course is the case, "I nominate my mother Katherine Jackson as guardian of the persons and estates of such minor children.
If Katherine Jackson fails to survive me or is unable or unwilling to act as guardian, I nominate Diana Ross as guardian and persons and estates of such minor children. I subscribe my name to this will the 7th day of July, 2002."
And you can make it out there. There's the Michael Jackson signature at the bottom of the will. I hope I'm not hiding it. It's right there.
And we'll be asking lawyer friends about it in a little while. What do you make of that, Kara?
FINNSTROM: Larry, the other interesting thing is just the fact that he doesn't talk about his wishes for after he dies. That's been really discussed out here today because a lot of people say he wouldn't have wanted to be buried here at Neverland.
He discussed a couple of times how he had some really negative feelings attached to Neverland after those 1993 molestation accusations that he faced, the boy, of course, saying that the molestation took place at Neverland.
So a lot of people say this isn't where he would have wanted to be buried, and that they would have liked to have seen some direction from him as to how he would have liked to have been laid to rest.
KING: Susan any hints at all of when you receive definitive news about Monday?
ROESGEN: I wish I could tell you, Larry, but no, not yet.
I'll go knock on the door. I will go knock on the locked gate, Larry, and try to get them to talk to us.
KING: If anyone will, you will.
Anything at all, Kara, out there, any word at all?
FINNSTROM: I'm sorry, Larry, I lost you for a minute. Any definitive news Monday -- if that was the question, no.
That's the thing. We now know there's not going to be anything taking place here over the next few days at Neverland. But we still don't know what the plans are.
KING: Thank you both very much, always on top of the scene.
We'll be inside Neverland tomorrow night in a prime time exclusive. That was Kara Finnstrom and Susan Roesgen.
Next, more on the will. Page by page, see what Michael Jackson wanted and what he didn't want. Stay with us.
KING: Joining us now, Roger Friedman senior correspondent for the "Hollywood Reporter." And Roger also writes the blog Showbiz411.com column. And Mark Geragos, former defensive attorney for Michael Jackson who represented Michael during the early stages of the controversial child molestation case.
Just for both of you, news just in. The Drug Enforcement Agency, the DEA, has joined the investigation into whether prescription drugs were involved in the death of singer Jackson. The source who did not want to be identified because he could not comment publicly said DEA agents will be looking at various doctors involved with Jackson.
Does that surprise you either of you?
ROGER FRIEDMAN, SENIOR CORRESPONDENT, "HOLLYWOOD REPORTER": No, that totally makes sense.
KING: OK, Rog, you've read the will, Mark, you've read it. Anything grab at you?
FRIEDMAN: The first thing that grabbed at me, of course, I broke the story this morning before the will was filed that Diana Ross was named as the successor Guardian if Katherine Jackson can't fulfill her duties. A surprise to Diana Ross --
KING: Does that surprise you?
FRIEDMAN: Not really actually. Diana Ross raised five great kids, and Michael saw that. He was very close to her when he was growing up, and he saw she was a good mother.
KING: Mark, I know it's not your specialty.
KING: From lawyer to looking -- how well was this document prepared?
MARK GERAGOS, FORMER JACKSON ATTORNEY: It looks like a standard last will and testament. I know that John Branca whose named in here was often on affiliated with Michael throughout the years, and I think was instrumental in consummating the deal of obtaining the Beatles catalog. So it was somebody he trusted for a long time.
KING: Anything surprise you?
GERAGOS: No, not really. I think the fact that the kids are with Katherine, who I had -- my experience with Katherine is she's wonderful and his biggest supporter. And the kids adored her. And if Grace is back in the pictures, the long time caregiver, I think that's great.
And it couldn't be a better place for the kids.
KING: Is Katherine with Joe?
KING: They are separated?
FRIEDMAN: They have dysfunctional marriage, as many people in America do.
GERAGOS: They live separately?
FRIEDMAN: They live separately most of the time.
FRIEDMAN: Sometimes they live in the same house, but they're not really a couple in a certain sense. She lives in Las Vegas, really.
KING: The day before the will surfaced, attorneys for Katherine and Joe Johnson filed documents saying the family believed Michael died without a will. Does that suggest they may challenge this?
GERAGOS: Not necessarily. I think that generally when people go to make a will, they don't advertise it. They don't tell people about it. I know I've had plenty of lines of Don Hill's, and their wives did about their wills. So it certainly doesn't surprise me that the mother or father or brother doesn't know about the will.
I don't think it's something you advertise. I think you keep it there -- and one of the reasons is because you can change it. There's --
KING: You can change a will every day.
GERAGOS: Right. In fact, I'm not saying in this case. I don't have inside information. But it would not surprise me, because it often happens, that this may not be the last iteration of the will. This is 2002. You can have a 2003, a 2004, there could have been a will two months ago for all we know.
KING: Three days ago. A will can surface at --
GERAGOS: At any time.
KING: Do you expect, Roger, with your experience in all of this, this kind of money, there's going to be a fight?
FRIEDMAN: I don't know. First of all, it's very interesting, because, for many years, Michael, as Mark promos, Michael had a series of managers and lawyers representing his music side after John Branca. It was mess, it was a big mess that went on. It was a constant changing of guard. It was very willful.
And then just recently John Branca came into the picture. Frank DiLeo, who was this great during the "Thriller" era came back, Joel Katz, who was the lawyer for the Grammy awards was brought in, and suddenly Michael has this terrific team. And this terrific team was going to put together these London concerts and go forward with them.
So I think it's a very solid group. And John Branca having done this, means it's solid. I don't think there's much to challenge in it.
I do know that one problem with it, that it's Michael's choice, in the trust, he only mentioned three of his nephews and three children, who are cousins. But there are 20 other nieces and nephews who are pretty put out at the moment.
KING: Eliminating the ex-wife, common, Mark? GERAGOS: Yes. In fact, I think, as I said before, this is probably no area I know less about, but generally speaking, you have to name. And if you don't name there's a problem.
FRIEDMAN: She was welcome compensated earlier on.
KING: Katherine, the mother, is 79, legal guardian. Does this mean that is a pretty good bet that she will get custody, permanent custody, or not because of age?
FRIEDMAN: I don't know that Debbie Rowe, the mother of the two oldest children, won't do something. But I do know speaking to her on Sunday that she wanted to wait until the funeral was over and that she wanted to speak with Katherine Jackson exactly about what her role would be.
I think she's interested in --
GERAGOS: I can't exercise enough. I haven't been around the kids in four years or so. But when I was there, I saw the interaction between them and Katherine, and I saw the interaction with Grace, who has been around forever.
If Grace is in the picture, and Katherine is there, and with all of the family -- what you have to remember is you have all brothers and sisters. There are various kids there and the cousins there. I can't think of a better, more nurturing environment than to be with Katherine.
KING: What if, god forbid, something happens to the mother? Can Diana Ross refuse this?
FRIEDMAN: You can't force kids on anybody.
But what I think would normally happen is that they would look to see if they can keep the kids with the biological family if at all possible. That's what courts like to do.
GERAGOS: I think the mother, she got her parental rights restored about four years ago. And I think that there's going to be interest from her.
KING: More coming up. We'll get into lots of things.
We have a special show tomorrow night live inside the Neverland Ranch.
Next, Michael made a special request of Diana Ross. See what she said about him on this show some years back in 60 seconds.
KING: Diana Ross sat down with me in 1991 for an in depth interview years before Michael Jackson became a father, more than a decade before he nominated her as backup guardian for his kids.
This is what Diana Ross had to say about Michael then. Watch.
KING: You had such a long relationship with Michael Jackson back when he was a young recording star. There are rumors that he changed his looks to look like you. How do you describe Michael Jackson - Diana Ross? What is that?
DIANA ROSS, SINGER: You see, we actually love each other. And he is like one of my children. When he started his career, I introduced him on their very first television show, which was the "Ed Sullivan Show."
And then I had my own television special at that time. And I introduced them, the Jackson Five, on the television special. And I took a special interest in him. And we were very close.
When the boys came from Indiana, they stayed with me in my house in California, and I was their house mother. And I took care of them until their parents came. So we just built a relationship in the early days.
And then he went on to have his own career, which he's very, very talented. And he became so very, very successful. Just like skyrocketed, the whole family, actually.
KING: Are you as close now?
ROSS: Not as close now. I don't get to see him very much. And that's because, again, my life has just gone in a different direction. I live in Europe a lot of time with my husband.
And so it's just that we don't see each other half as much as I would like to see him. I did see him maybe a couple months ago and introduced him to my sons, my boys. And my little one, Evan, loves music and wants to look like Michael Jackson.
KING: Do youth he wants to look like you? Do you buy that?
ROSS: No, I don't buy that at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Roger, you wanted to say something?
FRIEDMAN: It's just, people always say that Michael Jackson was so flaky. Your interview was 10 years before he drew up the will, and she lives here in Los Angeles most of the time. And he saw something, it's so interesting.
I think it was kind of genius for him to pick her, because she has this great family. People think of her as a diva, and probably the she's throwing her fur down all the time. But she's not. Her kids are always with her. Whenever I see her -- (CROSSTALK)
KING: He was bright great guy, wasn't he?
FRIEDMAN: He was a bright great guy, and he saw something there, that she would have the money and heart to do it.
KING: He was your client, Mark. Was he bright?
GERAGOS: He was incredibly bright. Sometimes he's so -- there's such a caricature. But this is a guy who got the Beatles catalog. He's controlled the Mijac catalog. Those are some of the shrewdest moves.
And he saw, he's always ahead of the curve as long as I ever knew him.
KING: How much does Michael Jackson stand to make in death? Will the cover has substantial debts? More after the break.
KING: We're back. Live tomorrow night from the Neverland Ranch, it's a primetime exclusive.
We're with Roger Friedman and Mark Geragos. Before we talk about the dollars, we don't know anything -- we know it's not at Neverland this weekend. Do you know anything about anything, Roger?
FRIEDMAN: Well, I'm reporting on showbiz411.com for my sources. There will be a funeral on Tuesday morning at the Staples Center. We call it L.A. live, from New York. It's Staples Center, the Nokia theater, it's the whole thing.
And AEG live, which owns all of that, was doing the concerts from London. They're a great company, and I think they're putting together the security. I know they wanted me to announce it.
KING: CNN cannot confirm that Rog.
FRIEDMAN: L I'll see you there.
KING: What's going to happen with all of these sales now, do you think, Mark? He's selling records. They've gone through the roof?
GERAGOS: It goes to the estate. A lot of people said the same thing demonstrably happened after Elvis died. So, the great thing about it is that he's getting recognition that was long overdue. And I think that all of this is a great testament to what a great talent he was.
KING: How much money does he owe?
FRIEDMAN: I think he owes about $400 million. This is how it breaks down. He owes $325 million dollar, $350 million dollar loan secured by his interest in the company called Sony-ATV Music, which owns the Beatles catalog.
KING: So that he could sell and wipe that out.
FRIEDMAN: You know, everybody wanted him to sell it for the whole time is had it, so that he'd have some money. And he refused to do it because he knew that was his leverage.
KING: Will it work now?
FRIEDMAN: Yes. Now, I think, I'm not a lawyer, you are, but I think the situation is that to settle the estate -- they have to sell it to Sony, by the way. That's the deal. Sony is--
KING: So that would get him out?
FRIEDMAN: That would get him out and give him a nice piece of change besides.
Then there's about $50 million dollar against Neverland held by a company called Colony Capital and a very smart guy named Thomas Barrett Jr.
KING: What's Neverland worth?
FRIEDMAN: Hard to say in this economy.
And they had this idea even before Michael died of turning it into Graceland, putting all his tchotchkes into it and bringing people up there.
But it's not possible, because Neverland is on a long country road. It's two lanes. There's no way to do it. The people of the neighboring towns don't want it. And I think it will be sold eventually and told into a corporate compound or private home or a vineyard.
KING: But they control it?
FRIEDMAN: Colony Capital controls it with Michael's estate.
KING: How long is this going to go on, Mark?
GERAGOS: The media sensation will go on at least until after the memorial service and funeral. And then I think that every time you have any kind of court proceeding, you're going to see a flurry of activity, until there's some other story that comes on. And it would have to be a whale of a story to eclipse this.
KING: Why is the aftermath such a big story?
GERAGOS: It's so surprising.
KING: The death is surprising. Why is the aftermath. GERAGOS: Because as long as you have investigations, as long as you have speculation, when you have somebody that's so well-known and so well-loved worldwide.
I remember when the search warrants were executed on Neverland, that I got the -- back then I was wearing a pager. And I was paged immediately. And I remember our Web site going down. He must have gotten 500,000 hits just on my law firm Web site.
And most of them were from outside of the United States, and all of them a great deal of affection.
KING: Roger, does this rank with Presley, Diana?
FRIEDMAN: It's sort of like -- it's turning into Princess Diana for us, which I always thought was peculiar in Britain.
But you know, the thing about Michael Jackson is he has legions of fans. They are so devoted. And the numbers are huge. I get emails from them. They have fan clubs. They are connected from all over the world. They come from all over the world.
During the criminal child, they came -- Santa Maria is not a glamorous place.
GERAGOS: It's got great barbecue.
FRIEDMAN: It does have great barbecue.
Kids came -- kids, who were -- I was Michael's age. These were kids that were much younger. They came from all over the world and took jobs from Burger King and McDonald's overnight so they could be in the courtroom during the day.
KING: I was in the courtroom, I know. I almost testified?
KING: Judge wouldn't let me.
FRIEDMAN: There was a huge fence up, and they were ten deep sometimes waiting to see him or catch a glimpse of him.
So this is going to go on for a long time. It's a fervor, almost like a cult. It's very strange.
KING: Lawyers going to make a lot of money, Mark?
GERAGOS: Lawyers always make money.
KING: In this case.
GERAGOS: In any case where there's assets, and here there's clearly large assets, the lawyers make a lot of money.
But the great thing about the way this was set up is I think that the kids will be taken care of. The family will be taken care of. His legacy is taken care of.
KING: The kids are the most important thing. Whatever is in 2nd Pl. is a distant second.
GERAGOS: The oldest two are great kids.
FRIEDMAN: You know, it's a strange thing. You see on these tabloids and these blogs people saying, especially TMZ or whatever it is, they're always saying Michael foretold his death, he wanted to die. It was at the end of his life.
He loved these kids. He wanted to be with them all of the time. He had no interest of being dead. That's a really important thing.
KING: Roger Friedman, Mark Geragos, as always, thank you. and I guarantee one thing, you'll be back.
The nurse who told us yesterday that Jackson begged her for drugs is here next. Hear what she's saying next. Stick around.
KING: Cherilyn Lee is a registered nurse family practitioner. She says she worked with Michael as a nutritional counselor, claims Michael was so distressed by insomnia that he begged her for the powerful sedative Diprivan. She joins us here.
Since you went public, have the police contacted you at all?
CHERILYN LEE, REGISTERED NURSE: No.
KING: Nobody want to know more about it?
KING: Now, Diprivan, as we understand it, I recently had Diprivan when I had a cataract fixed. That's the thing that puts you to sleep. And you wake up right away, right?
LEE: As far as I know, yes.
KING: And it's given intravenously?
LEE: This is what I read.
KING: So when he asked you for it, what did you say?
LEE: When he asked me for it, I was not aware of it.
KING: You didn't even know what he was talking about?
LEE: I didn't know what he was talking about.
KING: What did you say to him? LEE: I said, let me go and find out what this is. If it's something IV, I don't think it's something you want to do at home.
KING: How did you come to start with Michael?
LEE: About the latter part of January, I had a call that he wanted someone to see his children. They had a slight little cold. And I was asked to come and see them.
KING: How did he know about you?
LEE: Through a friend.
KING: So you went and saw the kids?
LEE: I went to go see the kids.
KING: And then?
LEE: And then from there, we had a little tea party, some Vitamin C for their little cold. And then Michael asked me, what do you do? I said well, what's going on with you? And so he started telling me that I'm just tired. I've just been a little fatigued. And I said OK, well, why don't we just set up and do -- anyone that's fatigued, if they present in clinic, we do a complete lab work. So we find out, you know, what maybe might be draining their body or what's going on in a pathological sense, to see what's happening with them, on a nutritional basis --
KING: What did he say?
LEE: He said fine. That's great. I would like to know. So he asked can we do it that day? I told him no, I have to go back to my office, and I can schedule to come back later. He said, well, can you come back tomorrow? I said sure. So you need to fast tonight and don't eat anything, so I can draw your blood tomorrow. He said OK.
KING: What did you learn from all that?
LEE: From all of that, I learned --
KING: Did you check his blood out?
LEE: And medically, or nutritionally, I didn't find anything other than just a little low blood sugar.
KING: Did you then look up Diprivan?
LEE: I didn't know about it then. He wasn't talking about it. This conversation did not come up for a couple months.
KING: That came much after this? LEE: Much after.
KING: Diprivan would never be given in a home, right? it's a hospital drug?
LEE: Yes. I recently just found out about it myself. This was months later, when he said, I'm just having a lot of trouble sleeping. I would love for you to come up --
KING: I got you. Did he ask for any other drugs?
KING: Sleep drugs?
LEE: He never asked for sleep drugs. He said he only wanted one that he knew of, as time went on, months later that was going to help him to sleep. He said I know it would help me sleep.
KING: Have you worked with addicts?
LEE: Yes, I have.
KING: Did he signal you in any way that he was one?
LEE: No, he did not. I just saw him as a loving, caring father, nurturing father, and passionate about his work. Very creative. He loved mankind. And he never said a negative thing about anybody or anything.
KING: What did you think when he died? Other than being shocked, was there a part of it not surprising to you, since you had gone through some medical things with him?
LEE: The only part -- I was shocked. I was very shocked because of the fact that I didn't understand it. I didn't understand what happened. And I do know that --
KING: On the other hand, you knew he had some -- sleep problems?
LEE: He had sleep problems. I do know one day -- it was Father's Day -- he calls me and I hadn't seen him in three months. And he called me. He said -- and he was a little frantic. He said, I'm not feeling well. He didn't say it as calmly as I'm saying it right now. But he said I have these symptoms. I don't feel well. One side of my body is very, very hot. One side is very, very cold.
Three months prior, when I learned of the medication, I told him I didn't know what it was, I would investigate it. And I called a physician, a friend, and I asked him about it. He told me what it was, and I said -- I went back and told Michael. I said, Michael, this is something serious. You don't want to take this. You just don't want to take this.
KING: What do you think of the hot and cold thing? LEE: When he was giving me his symptoms, I was in Florida. I happened to have been in the ER myself when he was telling me his symptoms. I told him, I said this sounds serious. I don't know what's going on with you. For you to say one side of your body is hot and one side is cold.
The reason I feel out he reached to call me on Father's Day is because three months prior I had a chance to take my PDR back to his house and show him the side effects of this medication.
KING: Do you think maybe he got it? He got the medication from somewhere else?
LEE: I was concerned.
KING: We're going to do more on this. Thank you for coming for this. I know it's not easy for you. You've been dragged into this.
LEE: Thank you.
KING: We have a big show planned tomorrow. We're live at Neverland Thursday night. We'll take you inside Michael Jackson's home. It's a prime time exclusive.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins us. By the way, Cherilyn will stay for that, because we want Dr. Gupta to comment on what she said. Don't go away.
KING: Our registered nurse friend, Cherilyn Lee, remains. We're joined by Dr. Sanjay Gupta here in Los Angeles, CNN medical correspondent, practicing neurosurgeon and associate professor of neurosurgery as well. If you are going to get Diprivan, Sanjay, it has to be intravenous and in a hospital, right. You're not going to get it in your house?
SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF: MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: I have never heard of it --
KING: It's not a pill.
GUPTA: Not only is it intravenous, but it's a continuous intravenous thing. If you stop giving it, within a few minutes, the person wakes up. So you have to give it continuously.
KING: It's given for colonoscopy, cataract surgery. You can wake up fast.
GUPTA: Right, the person goes down quickly and they wake up quickly. It has what's called a very short half life. So that's one of the attractive natures of it.
KING: What would the appeal be, as you would guess, to a layman?
GUPTA: It's interesting. I have talked to lots of different anesthesiologists today who use this regularly. It's not really creating sleep. It's creating sort of an anesthesia, almost like a medically induced coma. The idea is that when you first start taking it, you do get sort of a high type feeling, and they you're out. Not only are you out, you're what is known as amnestic. You don't remember anything about that time period.
KING: I had it. I can attest. I was out. I asked when the procedure was going to be done. They told me it was done.
GUPTA: You were already in recovery, probably.
KING: When you looked it up, talked to your doctor friend, were you a little surprised that Michael was asking for this?
LEE: I was very surprised. I was very concerned.
KING: Did you tell him what this was?
LEE: I told him what it was. I showed him the PDR, the Physician's Desk Reference. What it detailed -- it showed him in detail this is something you don't want.
KING: What did he say?
LEE: He said, as long as I'm being monitored, I'm OK. He said, as long as somebody monitored me, I'm OK. Can you find somebody to monitor me? I said no, absolutely not.
KING: Where would they do this? I guess he could come to your house.
GUPTA: You need -- Monitoring involves checking the oxygenation.
KING: You couldn't do it at home?
GUPTA: It would be very hard to do at home. I was curious as well. He may have had this before because he had lots of operations, just like you've had in the past. I've had it in the past as well. But did he ever indicate to you that he'd had it somewhere outside of the hospital before?
LEE: He said he had it before and that --
GUPTA: Outside of the hospital?
LEE: Outside the hospital he didn't say. He just said, I had this before. As soon as it dripped into my veins, I was asleep.
KING: If he had it, then it wasn't surgery. Some doctor was helping him out in a hospital. That would be strange. Nurses would be around, right?
GUPTA: It sounds weird.
KING: We're giving anesthesia to someone who is not going to have a surgery? GUPTA: It's almost criminal. There are potential side effects.
KING: Would it be given for plastic surgery?
GUPTA: It could potentially.
KING: So he could have had it then.
GUPTA: For some of the procedures that he's had in the past.
KING: Would it show up in an autopsy?
GUPTA: It's great question. I actually tried to get to the bottom of that question. It's interesting. There's not a clear answer. Here's the issue: it has a very short half life, so it disappears from the body very quickly. Technically, if you took some of these blood specimens or urine specimens or tissue right away, you might be able to find it. But some of the doctors I talked to say it's not something that's routinely tested for, because it disappears so fast.
KING: Did you give him vitamins?
LEE: Yes, I did. He receives vitamins, vitamin shakes.
KING: Nutritional supplements?
LEE: Nutritional supplements. He was feeling great. They even showed him on television, said he had never looked --
KING: He was apparently rehearsing well.
LEE: He was rehearsing well. He was feeling good.
KING: This could have been a sudden heart attack, couldn't it?
GUPTA: Yes. What we know is that he was not breathing, but he had a faint pulse.
KING: Which tells you what?
GUPTA: It tells me that most likely this was a respiratory problem, a breathing problem first, and a cardiac problem second. He had a trouble breathing for some reason, either because of drugs or something else, and, as a result, he wasn't getting enough oxygen in his blood. And that's what causes your heart to fail.
KING: Will the autopsy be definitive? Sometimes they are not.
GUPTA: Sometimes they are not. The coroners have been very clear. They say they're going to have an answer. As you can see, Larry, even as we're having this discussion now, things are coming up that say, I don't know if you can figure that one out.
KING: Thanks again, Cherilyn. Probably going to be back. As always, Sanjay. More on the mysterious death of Michael Jackson. The DEA is now involved. Back in 60 seconds.
KING: The DEA is now involved in the Michael Jackson death. Once we heard that, we called on our investigative correspondent, one of the best in the business, Drew Griffin. He is here to tell us what he knows.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Just confirmed from a federal law enforcement source that the DEA joined today to look at whether prescription drugs were involved, Larry. The source said the DEA would be looking at various doctors involved with Jackson, their practices and possible sources of supply.
We asked specifically about Propofol, Diprivan. Oddly enough, that may not be a controlled substance. So the DEA would not actually be looking at that. It's not unusual that they would be called in to an investigation like this.
KING: One of the world's greatest sleeping pills.
GRIFFIN: That's right. Because it's not abused to a wide scale, it's not on the DEA list.
KING: If the DEA finds that doctors acted improperly, what powers do they have?
GRIFFIN: They can bring federal charges. They have done it many times in the past.
KING: They can suspend the license?
GRIFFIN: Suspend a license. I have to get back to you on that. I think the medical board would have to suspend the license. What I've seen is that licenses have been voluntarily given up. But you remember Chris Benoit, the wrestler. It was the DEA that went in after the fact and actually brought charges against the doctor involved.
KING: So boy, this gets curiouser and curiouser, huh?
GRIFFIN: It sure does. I want to say, it is somewhat a matter of routine. The LAPD and the DEA work together all the time. The DEA gets called in on these things because they are the ones who can go into the federal registries to see about drug dispensing. They have those kind of powers.
KING: They talk to the doctors? They can talk to --
GRIFFIN: They would presumably talk to the doctors. If they went into Michael Jackson's home and they found out who prescribed those drugs, they are going to go back and find out from the doctor who did it. KING: Thank you, Drew. Drew Griffin, always on top of things. The salute to Michael goes on at the Apollo in Harlem. Here's at look what happened there today.
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KING: Let's go out to Gary, Indiana, to Michael's boyhood home, where Mayor Rudy Clay is standing by, the mayor of Gary. We understand you've reached out to the Jackson family, asking that the body be laid to rest in Gary. Why, mayor?
MAYOR RUDY CLAY, GARY, INDIANA: First of all, Michael Jackson is our favorite son here in Gary, Indiana. Of course, he was raised here. In fact, they made a song called "2300 Jackson Street, Always Home." And I'm standing right here at 2300 Jackson Street. It's located in Gary, Indiana. I love -- you must understand, I love and Gary, Indiana has been since Michael came out of the womb. We have loved him --
KING: All right.
CLAY: -- then and we love him now.
KING: What did the family say to you?
CLAY: Well, let me say this. I want to make this perfectly clear. We respect whatever the family wants to do. All we're saying is here in Gary, Indiana that we would like to have Michael lay in state in Gary, in the home where he was raised, and where he's very much loved at the present time. You see --
KING: All right.
KING: No, I understand. You will hear from them. You've made the request, right?
CLAY: Right. You know, I mean, we are the children that Michael was raised with, and we love him and we love the family. And there are plans -- go ahead.
KING: Are you planning a memorial service anyway, no matter what?
CLAY: July 10th. I'm glad you asked that question. July 10th, all roads lead to Gary, Indiana, to have a memorial service for the world's greatest entertainer, our favorite son, at our baseball stadium on Fifth Avenue. So all roads lead to Gary, Indiana, because we want to have a memorial service that's fit for a king, the King of Pop.
KING: That would be -- that would be a week from Friday, the 10th. There's been talk of a family museum in Gary. Is that talked about?
CLAY: Well, you know, I want to congratulate and compliment Joe Jackson, the matriarch, the father of the Jackson family. We've been discussing that. He was in Gary last year. And that's been on the drawing board. Because he want to have a -- the legend of the Michael Jackson and the Jackson family to go on forever. And we've been discussing it. There's been work on that.
So I want to congratulate him for doing a good job.
KING: Thank you, mayor, so much. That memorial service is Friday, July 10th in Gary. And we thank the mayor.
Another son of Gary, Indiana, the wonderful guy, Oscar-winning actor Karl Malden died earlier today. He was 97. His many film credits include "Patton" and "Bird Man of Alcatraz," and "Streetcar Named Desire," for which he won a supporting Academy Award. TV viewers knew him as Lieutenant Mike Stone on the streets of San Francisco, and as a spokesman for American Express.
Karl Malden was a good guy and a good friend of this show. Our thoughts are with his family. We're live from Neverland tomorrow night. Back after this.
KING: We wind up things tonight with Thelma Gutierrez, our CNN correspondent at the Los Angeles Grammy Museum. Reaction to Michael Jackson's death, the museum has extended an exhibition about his style. Tell us all about it, Thelma. What's happening?
THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Larry, I can tell you, if you are a fan, this is definitely the place to be. It is a great exhibit.
Take a look at the three jackets right in front of me. Michael Jackson had these made for his own personal wear, the way that you'd have a sports coat made to wear out to dinner.
This jacket that you see right here was actually inspired when he was walking down the street. He saw a gum wrapper, took the gum wrapper to his designer, and said, make me a jacket.
Now, all of these items here, Larry, were about to go down just last week, when they learned that Michael Jackson had died. The exhibit had run its course. They were taking it down. They found out, and then instantly they had to scramble to get this exhibit back up.
Now, Bob Santelli is the executive director here of the Grammy Museum. Bob, tell me, how did you go about selecting some of these things? I understand Michael Jackson actually reached out to you. He said, I want to be included.
BOB SANTELLI, EXEC. DIRECTOR, GRAMMY MUSEUM: Well, really, it was a curator's dream. Because out of the blue, we get a call of one of Michael Jackson's representatives, who says, Michael knows about the Grammy Museum. He's won 13 Grammy Awards. He would like to be a part of this. Would you be interested? Of course, we said yes.
Inside of a week or so, we were at one of Michael Jackson's warehouses and had the opportunity to go through and select the artifacts for the exhibit.
GUTIERREZ: You said that you selected these items because you wanted to tell a story about Michael Jackson. What does this tell?
SANTELLI: When you are putting together an exhibit, you always want a point of view. And lots of things have been said about Michael Jackson in the past, many, many things. What could we bring to the Michael Jackson story that hadn't been told?
We come up with the idea that he was the King of Pop, and he certainly dressed like royalty. So the idea was to select artifacts, select objects that reflected his royalty status. That's what we did.
GUTIERREZ: One of the most iconic suits that you have in here is the white suit, the suit that millions of people around have seen. He wore this on the "Thriller" cover.
SANTELLI: That's right. The interesting thing about this suit is notice the way it's situated in the exhibit, because everything around it is very elegant, very flashy, very royal like. And yet the suit, it's a Hugo Boss suit, very plain. But this is one of the most iconic artifacts, one of those most iconic outfits.
GUTIERREZ: Then you have the jacket up in the corner. He wore it during the Hollywood star, when he got the star on the walk.
SANTELLI: When he got the Hollywood Walk of Fame honor in 1984. That is what he wore there, exactly. The thing about this -- I mean, the exquisite quality -- these are not jackets that you buy off the racks, so to speak. These are all hand made. They're done by very famous and celebrated designers. Michael always played a very prominent part in helping the design.
GUTIERREZ: The two jackets at the end, very flashy. They were actually on tour, weren't they?
SANTELLI: This one here, this is a beautiful one, because it's from the Victory Tour. And it's really what he starts out wearing. And then from this particular point, if we move over to here, you will see he goes to this kind of look in the tour. And the difference is rather significant.
But he begins to see the military look. And then you can see the military look here. GUTIERREZ: The jacket.
SANTELLI: Very nicely. The interesting thing, Thelma, about this is, I want you to pick this up. Feel how heavy this is. It is amazing to --
GUTIERREZ: Yes --
SANTELLI: This is 15 pounds.
GUTIERREZ: This is very heavy. Hard to imagine, Larry, that Michael Jackson, who weighed 110 pounds, could wear this, and then to dance with this kind of a jacket on, that weighed 15 to 17 pounds. Really amazing stuff here.
KING: Thanks, Thelma. Good reporting. A special note, of course, Michael Jackson was a 13-time Emmy recipient. Good reporting all around tonight. Emmy, rather, recipient. And he won Grammies, too. Oh, 13 Grammies. We'll see you tomorrow live from inside Neverland. Now here in Los Angeles, Anderson Cooper and "AC 360."