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Diprivan Confirmed Found in Michael Jackson`s Home

Aired July 3, 2009 - 20:00:00   ET


JEAN CASAREZ, GUEST HOST: We begin tonight with breaking news. The mystery surrounding the sudden death of music icon Michael Jackson intensifies. As we go to air tonight, The Associated Press is reporting the powerful sedative Diprivan has been found in Michael Jackson`s home, this on the heels of reports Jackson begged for the intravenous sedative to battle insomnia. Even more questions swirling tonight as we learn Michael Jackson traveled with a mini-clinic, an IV pole and an anesthesiologist who would medicate Jackson while he was on tour. The California attorney general is now joining the multi-pronged investigation, zeroing in on prescription drugs.

Jackson`s concert promoter releasing stunning video of the music star`s full dress rehearsal recorded just hours before Jackson`s death. But the release of this video is very questionable as the promoter reveals insurance will cover them, they say, for accidental death. Insurance will not cover death from natural causes, they say. But what if the death is ultimately determined to be a homicide?

After announcing on last night`s show that tickets would be sold to attend Jackson`s memorial, a complete 180. Fans now will not be charged. The venue, Staples Center in Los Angeles, where Jackson performed for the very last time hours before his death. But the vultures still circling Jackson`s dead body, trying to make a quick buck. Reports T-shirts from Jackson`s farewell tour will be sold at the memorial. And with the fate of Jackson`s children still unknown, will Debbie Rowe fight for custody?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news. The Associated Press is now reporting law enforcement officials have found the sedative Diprivan inside Michael Jackson`s rented home, the one in Bel-Air where he died last week.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There`s a lot of speculation mounting about Michael Jackson`s death and whether it`s related to prescription drugs. A nurse who worked with the superstar is making some pretty shocking claims. She says that Jackson suffered from severe insomnia and claims that she rejected his request for an extremely strong sedative called Diprivan.

CHERILYN LEE, REGISTERED NURSE: He said, I really just need something that`s going to help me to sleep. And he was very persistent about it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Diprivan is used as a general aesthetic. It is not a sleep aid. It`s not available for general use even with a prescription.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We do not know how the drug got there. We do not know who provided it. But a state database keeps track of every prescription so they can be traced back to the doctors who write them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shocking claims about Jackson`s alleged drug abuse. They`re coming from a former friend and psychic, Uri Geller. He said this tragedy was bound to happen.

URI GELLER, FRIEND OF MICHAEL JACKSON: I screamed at him. And I used the words, Michael, if you continue this, you will die. Michael, if you don`t stop, this will kill you.


CASAREZ: Good evening. I`m Jean Casarez of the legal network In Session, in for Nancy Grace tonight. The Michael Jackson death investigation intensifies.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New reports about the powerful sedative Diprivan, now found in Michael Jackson`s home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You cannot have insomnia as a diagnosis and get a prescription for Diprivan. It`s restricted to anesthesiologists.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This powerful drug is used in operating rooms to knock out patients.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The attorney general`s office is now involved with this death investigation, working to track down where those prescription drugs may have come from.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Your name is obviously associated with Michael Jackson, and people said that there was a question of whether or not you gave anesthesia to him while he was on tour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m very upset. I`m distraught. I can`t talk about it right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... a nurse who says that Jackson repeatedly asked her about a powerful IV anesthesia drug. The drug is called Diprivan. The nurse is Cherilyn Lee.

LEE: I said, Look, this is a very serious drug. At first I almost wondered if he understood what he was telling me. And he said, Yes, I know exactly what it is. I`ve had it before. There`s no side effects. He said, It is safe. I said, Michael, it isn`t. The bottom line, it can cause death.


CASAREZ: Let`s go straight out to Paul Vercammen, CNN producer that is live at the Staples Center tonight. Paul, what have we learned today about Diprivan?

PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN PRODUCER: Well we have only learned about Diprivan that -- this is the Associated Press (INAUDIBLE) say they have confirmation there was, indeed, Diprivan in Michael Jackson`s home. And of course, this is all part of the larger picture in which many people said that they believe Michael Jackson was relying on increasingly powerful drugs to help him sleep. In fact, I talked on background to a security guard, and he said one of the big problems was that he felt is that a lot of people within the Jackson inner circle were turning a blind eye to whatever drug use or whatever Michael Jackson wanted to do in terms of ingesting these drugs.

CASAREZ: Paul, I`m sorry, do we know exactly how many times law enforcement went to the home to collect what could be evidence at some point in time?

VERCAMMEN: I would say several. I don`t know if we can pinpoint it exactly because we`ve got a situation where, as you know in law enforcement, detectives come and go and they come in different clusters. We do know how many agencies are involved right now, though. Certainly, it`s LAPD. Then they brought the DEA and the feds, and now the state attorney general has also jumped on board. So all of them are going to be looking into however Michael Jackson might have allegedly received these very powerful drugs.

CASAREZ: You are so right. We have local agencies, state agencies and now federal agencies involved.

Out to Natisha Lance, Nancy Grace producer. What has CNN reports been saying, their sources, in regard to Michael Jackson during the History musical tour he made in the 1990s?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Jean, what they`re saying -- this was a source who spoke to CNN`s Dr. Sanjay Gupta. And what this source is saying is that Michael Jackson traveled with a mini-clinic of sorts, and this included an anesthesiologist, as well as an IV pole. And with this IV pole, there is, obviously, medication going on for Michael Jackson to help him sleep.

He was traveling with an anesthesiologist by the name of Dr. Neil Ratner. Now, Dr. Ratner was contacted. He did confirm to CNN that he -- that Michael Jackson did have a sleeping problem. He did have insomnia issues. However, he is not confirming these other allegations about this mini-clinic.

CASAREZ: OK. So if we heard you right, you just said, Natisha, sources -- according to CNN sources, traveling with an anesthesiologist, an IV pole and an IV system to monitor him.

All right, let us go out now -- I think Dr. Marty Makary -- we need an MD tonight to talk to us -- from Johns Hopkins University. First of all, I want to ask you about Diprivan. It is a controlled substance, I understand. How do you get it? Can you just write a prescription for it? Do you go into your local pharmacy and pick up some Diprivan?

DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, JOHNS HOPKINS: No, no, Jean. This is not a prescription medication in the sense that any pharmacy in the United States carries it. It is only available in hospitals, in the supply room, and it is only used for anesthesia.

CASAREZ: So what you`re saying is a doctor would have to procure it. A patient couldn`t go anywhere and really get it themselves.

MAKARY: A doctor, Jean. But you know what? Not just any doctor. Hospitals designate which special doctors can use Diprivan because it is such a toxic special medication. It has what we call a small therapeutic window, which means if you go a little bit more than the recommended dose, you die. Most medications, if you take a ton of extra stuff, it takes a lot to overdose. With Diprivan or what we call propofol, you take a little more than is recommended and you die.

CASAREZ: How do you administer it? Is it an injection? So what`s the IV for?

MAKARY: It is only given IV. It needs to be administered directly into the vein. And it sounds like, evidently, that was known and that`s what an IV pole would be used for.

CASAREZ: OK. Let`s go to John Lucich, former criminal investigator and president of High Tech Crime Network. I want to ask you because the state -- the U.S. attorney`s office -- California state attorney is getting involved because of a computer system in California that monitors physicians that administer and prescribe controlled substances. How does that work? And wouldn`t a doctor be found out via that computer system, what they`re doing?

JOHN LUCICH, FORMER CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: Absolutely. There`s going to be a trail. Finding Diprivan on the site is a major part of this investigation. In fact, there`s a huge difference -- I`m not a doctor, but there`s a huge difference between anesthetizing somebody and putting this out -- putting somebody out, you know, with regular sleeping pills. There are so many pills on the market that this guy could take, there`s something going on here.

And I think that the real story here is the AMA has got to really step up and look at what these doctors are doing because this is not the first case where a doctor has -- might have been involved with giving too much drugs and the wrong type of drugs. I think there`s not only legal problems here, there`s major ethical problems.

CASAREZ: Well, let`s go to Mary Margaret. She is the senior news editor from You are reporting today something that I think many of us wouldn`t even think about. Why don`t you tell us.

MARY MARGARET, RADARONLINE.COM: In terms of the Jackson family, one thing in terms of the memorial news that came out today was the fact that they decided not to charge for admission. And one thing that we put out was the fact that they, of course, had initially agreed to charge $25 per person. But once a big surge of bad press hit the airwaves, the family decided it wasn`t worth it and they pulled the plug.

CASAREZ: That`s right. It`s going to be free. In regard to, though, the investigation, I understand that broke the news today that they believe and have confirmed that there could have been some international sales of Diprivan?

MARGARET: Well, yes. I mean, the thing with Michael Jackson is the biggest question of where did he get these drugs. And obviously, with aliases that he had enlisted, he kind of had a wide swath of networks of enablers that helped him reach this really sad addicted level. And one of those is international sources that was able to feed these drugs to him wherever he was in the world.

CASAREZ: It would be a way to get around regulations in this country.

MARGARET: Exactly.

CASAREZ: Let us go out to the callers. We`ve got a lot of callers already. Sherri in Indiana. Hi, Sherri. Good evening. Your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. My question is if the MD was so cognizant of the potential for respiratory depression, did he really monitor the patient, or was he intending harm?

CASAREZ: OK, I think that`s a good question. I think we can go to the attorneys, and we will do so. But I want to go back to Dr. Marty Makary, MD. If it is true, CNN reports, their sources are saying that an anesthesiologist traveled with Michael Jackson to monitor him in regard to this, Dr. Murray, the last doctor at the home shortly before he died -- he was a cardiologist. If all this is true, could a cardiologist not monitor it as an anesthesiologist could?

MAKARY: It`s possible. I got to be honest with you, though, Jean. These private doctors, they`ve got a reputation in medicine. These are not the sort of doctors you want. When you`re the employer and the patient together, these are doctors who have lost their license off and on. These are doctors who really don`t know what they`re doing. And they`re doctors, really, that follow orders. If you can get these medications or these illicit drugs into a jail, and prisoners say they smell them every morning, you can get it when you`re a multi-millionaire.



NANCY GRACE, HOST: Getting all lost in the sauce are his three children.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Who will take care of Michael Joseph Jackson, Jr., Paris, Michael Katherine Jackson, and Prince Michael Jackson II now that their father has died?

GRACE: Not Rebbie, not La Toya, not Janet, Marlon, Randy, Jackie, Tito. No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jackson name his mother, Katherine Jackson, as guardian of his children. If she`s unable or unwilling, he names singer Diana Ross.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But this is, to put it mildly, not an ordinary situation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Debbie Rowe, Jackson`s former wife and mother of his two eldest children, told a Los Angeles television station that she wants custody.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rowe has said that she was concerned about splitting up the three children. She also said she would accept custody of the youngest child.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s not the biological father of the three children. There is a world full of sources who have said this now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a tempest in a teapot. And the reason it is that way is that these children were born to Michael and Debbie during their marriage.

GRACE: He never formally or legally adopted the three children. So look, it`s not like common law marriage. You don`t have common law children.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The best thing for these children is that they are surrounded by people that they love, normalcy, and don`t get in the way of the media and all of the bad press. This is still their dad. They`re suffering a great loss.


CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez of the legal network In Session, in for Nancy Grace tonight. This is so outrageous, it doesn`t even seem real. But CNN sources are saying that Michael Jackson had a history of traveling with a mini-laboratory, a mini-clinic, an anesthesiologist and IV pole.

I want to go out to a very close friend of Michael Jackson tonight. He`s known him for many, many years, been around Michael, been around his children. Firpo Carr, thank you so much for joining us. And I know we`re talking about this as an investigation. You have lost a friend and I can imagine what that must feel like. Did you ever know Michael, though, to suffer from insomnia?

FIRPO CARR, FORMER JACKSON FAMILY SPOKESMAN: Not only Michael but his entire family. I`ve lived with Tito -- pardon me -- I`ve lived with Randy. I`ve been around numerous Jacksons, Rebbie, Katherine Jackson. And guess what? They`re all insomniacs. It`s amazing. In fact, Randy one time stayed up so late, 3:00 o`clock in the morning, keeping me up -- we`re living -- we`re roommates now. He had the remote control. Real interesting situation. He had the remote control, trying to turn up or down the television. And then when he asked me a question and I wasn`t speaking loud enough, he turned the remote control to me and tried to turn it up, if you can imagine that. I`m saying all that to say this. All of them are insomniacs, not just Michael Jackson.

CASAREZ: Well, what would Michael -- as a good friend, what would he do to help him with insomnia? Because a person has to sleep.

CARR: Absolutely. He does have to sleep. And you know, what I`ll say is this about that, is did the same thing, I would imagine -- and I don`t want to go into specifics -- that the others did. Namely, Hey, listen I have to stay up until I fall asleep. But Michael had something that the others didn`t have. There was another element to it, another component. And that is, he was in intense pain often. So they didn`t have that and they were still insomniacs. Now you have Michael Jackson, who`s an insomniac and who has intense pain, as well.

CASAREZ: You know, Firpo, what is so very, very sad about all of this -- because this is a death investigation right now. Agencies are getting involved. But the reality is, I don`t think he had to die. And that is the saddest thing of all.

I want to go to the attorneys right now. First of all, Alexis Martin Neely, estate attorney,, Greg McKeithen, defense attorney, and Bradford Cohen, also a defense attorney.

There are so many corroborating factors right now. First of all, you have CNN sources saying that during the History tour, anesthesiologist and IV pole. You`ve got The Associated Press reporting now law enforcement has told them that Diprivan was found in the home, which is something that is used intravenously. And then you`ve got the nurse, Cherilyn Lee, that came out earlier this week saying that Michael wanted Diprivan, all independent sources. What does it mean? To Bradford Cohen, defense attorney.

BRADFORD COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I mean, obviously, it`s showing a pattern that`s involved here. But the problem is going to be whether or not you can find the actual doctor that was administering this. There`s so many doctors that are involved in this case and so many people that have had their hands on a prescription or wrote a prescription for him or maybe possibly got this from overseas that it`s going to be difficult linking that to one single doctor. I know they`re going to try, but it`s going to be very difficult to do.



GRACE: You want to see a dogfight? Well, you are about to.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it`s possible to have a dramatic will, Michael Jackson has a dramatic will.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And that`s the $500 million question that we don`t know. Exactly who gets what?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In the will -- and this is key -- Jackson leaves his entire estate to the Michael Jackson family trust.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If it all goes through and he does this, who gets the money?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One thing that can invalidate a will, Nancy, is another will. Don`t forget there are people that say that there might be another will out there.


CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez of the legal network In Session, in for Nancy Grace tonight. CNN sources are reporting tonight that during the History tour in the 1990s, that Michael Jackson`s doctor, Neil Ratner, would keep medical equipment in the hotel room to monitor his vital signs, quote, "to take him down" and to, quote, "bring him back up."

Let`s go out to a caller tonight. Wanda in Florida. Good evening, Wanda.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Jean. Thank you for taking my call.

CASAREZ: You`re welcome.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: First of all, I`m heartbroken over Michael`s death, as we are all.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, doctors use Narcan to reverse the effects of heroin. If the doctor who was with Michael had administered the Narcan drug, would that have reversed the effects of the Diprivan?

CASAREZ: Well, let`s go out to Dr. Joseph Deltito, MD, professor of psychiatry but also a pharmacologist. You have a lot of knowledge, Dr. Deltito. Your response to that question?

DR. JOSEPH DELTITO, PSYCHIATRIST: Yes, Narcan reverses so-called opioid medicines, of which Diprivan is not. But remember, we don`t know exactly that he took Diprivan or he took Diprivan alone. And certainly, if he was taking something else -- like, I believe there was a report that he was taking -- got a shot of Demerol recently. The Narcan would work definitely to reverse the effects of respiratory suppression from the Demerol. But I don`t believe it would have a direct effect on the Diprivan.

CASAREZ: To Alexis Martin Neely, attorney out of Los Angeles. You`re in the very jurisdiction where all of this is happening. I think this investigation`s going to go on for a long time. But if you have numerous doctors with numerous medications, what does that say to you?

ALEXIS MARTIN NEELY, ESTATE ATTORNEY: Well, what it says is that they may not be able to pin this on anyone. The fact of the matter is, is that all these doctors were being paid. This is what Michael wanted. And so how are they really going to figure out who is responsible here? Listen, my feeling is Michael was responsible here. He`s a grown man. He was asking for this medication, and I really don`t think that they should be trying to pin it on anyone.

CASAREZ: Well, to Greg McKeithen, defense attorney, what are your thoughts?

GREG MCKEITHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I would agree. First of all, you got to make sure we can show that there`s a connection or a link between whoever provided the medicine, and in fact, prove that Michael was under its influence or that it was actually administered to him.



MICHAEL JACKSON, POP ICON: This is the final -- this is the final curtain call.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Something happened between 12:30 when he left us and the morning when I had to rush to the hospital.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He said, "I want an I.V., and because I know that the first drop, when I look at it and I see the first drop hit my vein, I`m asleep. And I sleep very well."

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: We do not know what, if any, drugs Michael Jackson was taking for insomnia.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The DEA has now joined forces with the coroner`s offices as part of this death investigation.

JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: Sources tell CNN, while touring back in the 1990s, Jackson traveled with what amounted to a mini clinic, complete with an I.V. pole and anesthesiologist who would medicate him.

COOPER: Is it odd to as a medical doctor to have an anesthesiologist with somebody on tour?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All I can tell you is that I`ve seen Michael in situations where I was extremely concerned for his health and his life.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: A source said Michael Jackson often appeared groggy, and when the source asked Jackson about all this equipment, he just said he needed sleep.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When do doctors become responsible?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No doctors are going to jail here. If it wasn`t those doctors, he would have found other doctors.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But the insurance broker told us that he passed with flying colors, OK, and that the only issue was this some slight hay fever.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Something is rotten in Denmark.

ANNOUNCER: Hold for applause. Hold for applause. Slow umbrella, fade out.


CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez of the legal network "In Session," in for Nancy Grace tonight.

I think what differentiates this case from many other cases we`ve looked at is that when you`re talking about a drug such a Diprivan, you`re talking about an I.V. pole, I.V. equipment, that`s not something you could administer yourself. So, on the issue of personal responsibility, I think there`s a limit and it`s a physician that has to give it to you.

Let`s go straight out to someone that knew Michael Jackson very well, a very, very famous composer, David Michael Frank.

You are a composer. You have written arrangements with Michael Jackson. You have spent time with Michael Jackson. Even working on a current project, I believe, with him. When was the last time you saw him?

DAVID MICHAEL FRANK, COMPOSER (via telephone): About two months ago.

CASAREZ: What was he like?

FRANK: He seemed very animated. He was very thin but not frail. He was very excited because he wanted me to work on a classical project with him. He wrote classical music and was very interested in recording it with a full orchestra.

CASAREZ: Was there any difference in his personality two months ago from in the past when you knew him?

FRANK: I hadn`t worked with him in close to 20 years. So, I couldn`t -- I couldn`t really tell.

CASAREZ: What about his children? Did you see his children at all when you were there?

FRANK: Yes, the whole time. His children kept running in and out, playing. He actually used the kids to help him. He was not very computer literate and he had to get Prince, the oldest boy, to make a CD for me and later, Paris went and got a CD player. And -- so yes, I saw them a lot.

Every time they went by or if we walked by them, because we had to go to the pool house where he had a keyboard, they would go, "I love you, daddy. I love you, daddy." He goes, I love you, Paris, or Blanket or whichever. And they seemed very warm and very loving.

CASAREZ: Where was he when you went to work with him two months ago?

FRANK: He was at the house on Carolwood, the one he died in. This was -- we were in his living room and then his bar where he had this computer set up. And then we went to the pool house and the kids were playing in the pool and screaming. And I do remember him asking them to be more quiet because of tour buses going around.

CASAREZ: Well, it sounds like a very, very loving relationship with the children and that brings us to an issue of custody. There may be a custody fight in this case. It is brewing even before there is a funeral and a public memorial.

Let`s go back to Paul Vercammen, CNN producer, live at the Staples Center. What is the latest on a possible custody fight here?

PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN PRODUCER: Well, interesting note. Yesterday, Debbie Rowe, who is the mother, of course, of two of the Jackson children, her attorney came out and said, "Right now, Debbie Rowe is not sure if she`s going to continue to fight for custody." So, that is still up in the air.

One thing that`s also certain, though, you may have noticed on the will that Michael Jackson had deliberately cut out Debbie Rowe. In other words, this does happen in some cases where you have somebody pass away and they still want to sort of honor the right of the mother of the children to go ahead and raise those kids. Jackson certainly did that. And that was a rather pointed effort, I think, to snub Debbie Rowe, Jean.

CASAREZ: Right. And we learn in law school that if you just omit someone, it could be a mistake. But if affirmatively exclude someone that truly is to show the intent of the testator, the deceased, Michael Jackson.

Let`s go out to Alexis Martin Neely, an estate attorney, in California.

You practice California law, the jurisdiction. Debbie Rowe still remains her parental rights. She did give them up. But then, due to children not being represented by an attorney, the children, her children, she got them back. What do you see happening in this case if she does try to gain custody?

ALEXIS MARTIN NEELY, ESTATE ATTORNEY: I think that there`s going to be a big battle. She is their mom and if she did not affirmatively cut off her rights, then she technically does have the right to have a relationship with these kids. What I hope is that the court will appoint a guardian ad litem in this situation, and will identify what is in the best interest of these children.

All three of them staying together obviously has to be the number one priority. And what is too bad is that Michael did exclude her from taking any money under his will, but he didn`t actually exclude her from guardianship. He didn`t say, "I affirmatively do not want Debbie Rowe to be the guardian of my children if something should happen to me." That`s what I would like to have to see.

CASAREZ: That`s a very good point.

Out to Greg McKeithen, defense attorney out of the Atlanta jurisdiction.

The fact is, Debbie Rowe has come out publicly, so many times, saying that Michael is to be the father. She wants them to raise the children. She doesn`t want to be a part of it. She even gave up visitation rights. I think she regained them back in 2004. But we don`t know how much she knows the children if she knows them at all. Isn`t that going to enter into the judge`s decision?

GREG MCKEITHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: That may enter into the decision. I would submit change of circumstances would warrant a different result at this time.

CASAREZ: Oh, well, we will see. Let`s go out to a caller, Judy in Florida.

Hi, Judy. Thanks for waiting.


CASAREZ: You`re welcome.

JUDY: You know, tell Nancy that we love her and her show, and we appreciate her and she`s just wonderful. And thank you all.

CASAREZ: Judy, I will. You know, I want to say I am so honored to sit in the seat when Nancy is not here. Believe me, we all love her. Judy, what`s your question?

JUDY: Well, new song that we`re hearing, it sounds like a new tune to me. Now, are there any other new songs? And what`s going to happen to those?

CASAREZ: Well, that`s a very good question. Why don`t we go out to David Michael Frank, composer, close friend of Michael Jackson, working with Michael Jackson.

You are currently working on an album with Michael Jackson in the midst, right?

FRANK: Yes, he told me actually that he was working on two albums at the same time he was working on the tour. One was going to be a CD of all new songs. Then the other was this classical project that he wanted to record with an orchestra and I was involved in the classical project.

It was -- these were instrumentals without lyrics and rather like classical music and he wanted to record it with a full symphony. We`re going to record it either in Los Angeles or London.

CASAREZ: How far had you gotten on the project, very far?

FRANK: Well, he had -- he had the tunes pretty much worked out, except one of them, he only had in his head. So, I recorded it. And while he was playing the keyboard and I guess it`s the only version of it now that exists. And hopefully, someday, his family or someone will want to do this, because I think it will be a wonderful tribute and show that he was more than just a song writer.


FRANK: He could write something more serious.

CASAREZ: To Kathy in Michigan.

KATHY, CALLER FROM MICHIGAN: Hi, Jean. Thank you for everything you do.


KATHY: I have a question. Those children were always with him. And if he was in all of this kind of stuff going on with the drugs, they were subjected to a lot of stuff.

Did anybody ever think about what`s going on with them and how that affected them, and, I think, to keep them in that type of situation? Other people obviously knew what was going on, to keep them living in that. Those are very dangerous stuff, I think.

CASAREZ: You know, Kathy, it`s quite a question. And let`s go to Firpo Carr, a close friend of Michael Jackson.

He sounded like a loving father. His children were around him constantly. If anything happened, would he have had allowed his children to watch it?

FIRPO CARR, JACKSON FAMILY FRIEND: Absolutely not. In fact, when I was with Michael`s family, there were extenuating circumstances. I had in the room with me, Katherine Jackson, Rebbie Jackson, and, of course, Grace, the nanny, as well as the two children, Paris and Blanket. And Michael, backing me into the next room, he said, "Hey, listen, I need to talk with you. I like to talk with you in private.

And if you like, I can tell you on the other side of the break .

CASAREZ: All right.




CASAREZ (voice-over): After Michael Jackson died, Diana Ross said in a statement she couldn`t stop crying, that she was praying for Jackson`s children and his family. Jackson`s will shows how highly he regarded her. The will says if Jackson`s mother Katherine died or was unable to take care of the three children, that Ross should be named guardian.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is fitting if you think about that, in the people that he trusted, Michael didn`t have very many people around him for a long time, including some of his family members that he trusted.

CASAREZ: Jackson knew Ross most of his life. She lent her star power to the young Jackson family. Their first album was called "Diana Ross Presents the Jackson Five."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of times, when they were visiting Los Angeles before they had a house there, they would stay at Diana`s home. He would often seek refuge there when things were very bad at home. She really was a surrogate mother to him almost.

CASAREZ: As Michael Jackson got older, he remained close to Ross. Two of them seen here in "The Wiz" in the late `70s performed together at times.



CASAREZ: I`m Jean Casarez of the legal network "In Session," in for Nancy Grace tonight.

Let`s go back out to Firpo Carr, a very close friend of Michael Jackson, former spokesperson for the family.

All right. You just told us before the break that Michael ushered you into a private room. He wanted to talk with you alone. What did he say?

CARR: What he said was that, "I need to have you study with my children, teach them the Bible, I was raised as one of Jehovah`s Witnesses. And I like them to be raised the same way." He also indicated in his own way, he -- because they were there, he couldn`t say to them. He had told them, "Hey, listen, I need to talk with him alone."

But Paris, especially, said, "No, no, I want to come, dad. I want to come. I don`t want you out of my sight and you know how much I love you." Michael said, "I know that but I`ll be right out." Still, she came in. He allowed her and he says, "OK, but you have to be quiet now." And, of course, Blanket came in as well, his son.

Then we all talked -- actually, he talked to me, gave me -- among other things -- instructions towards his children. "I want you to teach them the way I was taught, once again. And of course, since my mother is one of Jehovah`s Witnesses, I like to have my children be part of that same religion."

So, that`s what he emphasized. And once again, he said other things that I`m not at liberty to discuss. But I will say he was a loving father, they loved him. I have never seen anything like it before. They were so attached to each other.

CASAREZ: Yes, breaks your heart to hear it, Firpo, it really does.

CARR: Yes, it does.

CASAREZ: Back to the investigation, you know, AEG is the owner of the Staples Center, that`s where the public memorial is going to be. They were, in fact, the promoter for this huge international tour that was just about to begin.

I want to go out to Bradford Cohen, defense attorney.

Now, he was just yesterday that they released a minute and a half of video from less than 48 hours before he died. They released this video to show how healthy Michael Jackson was, how fit he was. It seems a little odd.

What do you think about that on a legal basis?

BRADFORD COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think it`s all about the cash. They didn`t release it to show how healthy he was. I mean, obviously, you know, that`s -- that`s one of reasons to say why, hey, to say, like, "Oh, look, this guy was perfect. We had our doctors checked him out, he was perfect. Allegedly, that`s the reason they released it.

It`s more like, to me, it seems like it`s a teaser for a new video that`s going to be coming out that I`m sure they`re going to try and sell, try and recoup some of their money. They said they were out $20 million to $30 million. They`re going to try and cash in on that insurance policy, and I`m sure they`re trying to figure out other ways to make money off of this.

I`m not saying that they are specifically, you know, doing it against the Jackson family or anything like that, but, obviously, they are a business. They are looking to recoup their money and if not, just make more money than what they were originally were out, which is like $20 million to $30 million.

CASAREZ: Right. Buzz word, you just said, to cash in on the insurance policy.

Let`s go out to Paul Vercammen, CNN producer.

What do we know about the insurance policy that AEG had with Lloyds of London.

VERCAMMEN: Well, that`s great question, Jean, because here`s a Hollywood accounting. And, you know, it can be extremely nebulous in the show business. After all, you have movies that make, you know, hundreds of millions of dollars and they tell everybody they broke even. We don`t know great details about that and we don`t know also, if at one point, they went ahead and told the doctor that he needed to sign something and he was responsible for Michael Jackson.

I`ll look for all of this to come out in the coming weeks. And let us see if we can decipher just exactly what the particulars were of that insurance policy.

CASAREZ: Right. And I think that the fine print will rule because AEG is saying that if this was an accidental death, a drug overdose death, that insurance proceeds will cover it. If it`s a natural death, it won`t. If it`s a criminal negligent homicide, what happens then. The medical death investigation, it continues.

Let`s go out to Ricki in Florida. Hey, Ricki, good evening.

RICKI, CALLER FROM FLORIDA: Hi. Good evening. I have a question about the nurse, Cherilyn Lee. She made a comment to CNN that Michael mentioned an anonymous doctor in the past that dispensed Diprivan to him. Is this doctor`s identity revealed? Could he be charged with dispensing the Diprivan?

CASAREZ: All right. Let`s go out to Dr. Marty Makary, M.D. from John Hopkins.

If a doctor has prescribed one of these drugs, whether it be internationally, they got it or nationally, it can be traced in some way, can`t it?

DR. MARTY MAKARY, M.D., PHYSICIAN: Yes, it absolutely can be traced. And you better believe that if this doctor gave Diprivan, there`s going to be potential manslaughter charges, because Diprivan is not to be given out of the hospital, not to be given without special accreditation and doctors are specialized to give it, not just anyone can give it.

CASAREZ: Now, could the cause -- can the cause of death be determined to be Diprivan? How do they do it? Through the hair, through tissue, through blood?

MAKARY: That`s exactly right, Jean. They`re going to be looking at the Diprivan levels in the blood and they`re going to find a level that`s too high if that was the cause.

CASAREZ: What about in regard to Diprivan through the years. Can they determine that, or would they just be able to establish close to death?

MAKARY: Just close to death, Jean.

CASAREZ: All right. Let`s go out to Mimi in Missouri.

Hi, Mimi.


CASAREZ: Thanks for waiting.

MIMI: Thank you. How are you?

CASAREZ: I`m fine. I`m fine. A very sad story to have to report about. But the investigation is going on. The legal issues are here. What`s your question?

MIMI: It`s just heartbreaking. My question is this: can Diprivan be entered -- I mean, administered via the veins directly? Because I haven`t heard anything about an I.V. or an I.V. pole or any kind of equipment being found at the house.

CASAREZ: All right. Dr. Joseph Deltito, how is it administered?

DR. JOSEPH DELTITO, M.D., PROFESSOR OF PSYCHIATRY: It`s administered only intravenously. And you have to have somebody assist you because it can work so quickly that if you try to self-administer, there would be the danger of him just falling asleep while the apparatus was still stuck in him inappropriately.

CASAREZ: And that is what leads this case down a road to possible criminal charges.

And now CNN Heroes.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Heroes.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have an explosion in tower one (ph). There`s smoke all over the place. (INAUDIBLE).

CAROLYN MANNING, COMMUNITY ORGANIZER: My brother-in-law was killed in tower one on September 11. Now, after September 11th, I saw a picture of an Afghan family who had also lost a family member because of the Taliban and they had to flee their family.

Our family has five kids. We lost a family member, too. We just naturally went from that to let`s show the refugees that we welcome them.

My name is Carolyn Manning and I had started the Welcome to America Project to help refugees in Phoenix, Arizona.

How are you? Are you doing well?

The families that we help come from places where there`s been war and genocide. And some refugees have never lived with indoor plumbing and they`ve never flushed a toilet.

All right, let`s go.

The Welcome to America Project is the community. And it operates by community volunteers.

My husband and I, many of times, have been out here pulling furniture in. Before work, after work, this is our life.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you very much for all your help.

MANNING: All right. Let`s go on to the next family.

When they step foot in the United States, they have been invited here. I want the refugees to feel that this is their home.

Welcome to America.


MANNING: And that`s what America has been built on. It`s our history, it`s who we are, -- and they`re part of it.

ANNOUNCER: Tell us about your hero at



CASAREZ: Tonight, the mystery surrounding the sudden death of music icon and international superstar Michael Jackson, dead at the age of 50.


NANCY GRACE, "NANCY GRACE" HOST: It seems to me that it is a case of CYA, cover your assets, by AEG, trying to make sure that they are cleared of any wrongdoing, pushing Michael Jackson to perform.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People with AEG said, before they began this, "We want to release this tape and show to everybody because we`re sick and tired of this thought that Michael Jackson was absolutely sick and on his death bed." And they then played the tape.


GRACE: Prince Michael Jackson II. He had two kids named the same thing, whatever. Mother says none. N-O-N-E.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Exactly. Exactly.

GRACE: So, there`s no mother.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Exactly. I don`t know how that birth certificate got done that way.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And he did what he always does when he has pressure. He turned to a drug for answers. And this time, he needed a drug that was beyond all the other drugs he`s been taking all these years.

GRACE: What`s the name of the drug, Mike Walker?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s a drug that must be used in the hospital under controlled conditions where you can have the patient ventilated.

GRACE: Wait, wait, wait, wait. Ventilated? You mean a tube down their throat?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. That`s probably .

GRACE: We`re just lawyers, Doctor. Help me.

They`re proving -- trying to prove so hard how healthy he was but yet, they were assuring he had a doctor around the clock? Something doesn`t ring true to me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe that the media must take much of the blame for his slow destruction and eventual death.

GRACE: Sir, I do not believe the media is responsible for him taking illegally obtained drugs.


CASAREZ: Tonight, let us stop to remember 39-year-old Army Sergeant First Class John Beale from Riverdale, Georgia. He served the Army during Operation Desert Storm, then reenlisted in the National Guard after 9/11. His father said he was born to be a soldier.

He loved volunteering with youth programs and career days at local schools. He leaves behind his grieving father William, his stepmother Dolly, two brothers, widow and high school sweetheart Crystal (ph), and two children.

John Beale, he is an American hero.

Thank you to al of our guests and for you at home for being with us. See you tomorrow night, 8:00 o`clock sharp Eastern. Until then, good night, everybody.