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Jimmy Carter: Racism Linked to Obama Criticism; Authorities Search For Yale Killer

Aired September 16, 2009 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: This man, accused of a racist beating of a woman and her child at a cracker barrel. The FBI on it and so are we.

UNIDENTIFIED MAN: You get a tin and you bury it down in there.

SANCHEZ: ACORN, you fund them and they're caught doing this?

There's a health care deal, but I'll tell you what you need to know about the leader of the pack. His money connections may astound you.

President Carter says what many of you told us. He says the Joe Wilson debacle smacks of racism. And Roland Martin has plenty to say about it in our weekly "R&R) segment.

ROD BLAGOJEVICH (D), FORMER ILLINOIS GOVERNOR: Thanks for reading the book, by the way. I appreciate that. I really do. You're unusual in your profession. Some of your colleagues don't do that.

SANCHEZ: Thanks. But what about the accusations of you shaking people down? And then he hits me with a bombshell about his former chief fund-raiser.

(on camera): Wait a minute. Are you saying or intimating that the pressure put on him by Fitzgerald and his gang is what led this man to take his own life?

(voice-over): Facing off with Blago and also Baldwin on your national conversation for Wednesday, September 16, 2009.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: And hello again, everybody. I'm Rick Sanchez, coming to you from New York today, with the next generation of news. This is a conversation. This is not a speech and, as always, it's your turn to get involved.

Yale University is where we're going to start. It's the place where a woman disappeared and then found murdered. She was actually stuck in a wall, stuck in a wall. Well, now we have just learned from police that she was strangled.

Annie Le was a 90-pound grad student voted most likely to become the next Einstein in her high school. And get this. She was just two days away from getting married, two days away. In fact, she was found on the day that would have been her wedding. Wow.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THOMAS KAPLAN, "YALE DAILY NEWS": Just the idea that a Yale student was killed in a busy academic building in broad daylight, it's just really horrifying I think to everyone in this community.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Yes. You know what? Parents are horrified as well.

Look, if your son or daughter went to Yale, you would probably want to know what in the world is going on up there right now. And right now there is no single suspect in this case, no single suspect.

Stay with me here. However, there is a person that is being investigated, whatever that means, still not officially arrested, by the way. I know. It's very confusing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES LEWIS, NEW HAVEN, CONNECTICUT, POLICE CHIEF: At this point, looked at about 700 hours worth of video. We have interviewed over 150 people. Some we have interviewed a second time. We have got over 150 pieces of evidence seized so far.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: You ready for this? Here's what's even more surprising about this case. I'm going to just take you through the facts, folks. Overnight, that man that was being held that I just told you about who apparently is not a suspect but was taken into custody, well, he was released.

He's a Yale lab technician who's described as now a person of interest in this case. Let me tell you more about him. He's 24-year- old Raymond Clark, put in handcuffs, hauled away from his apartment, so police could collect DNA from his hair, from his saliva, and from his fingernails.

We decided that we wanted you to hear from an expert on this case, because, frankly, I'm confused and you're probably confused as well.

Here's retired police officer Lou Palumbo.

Lou, thanks for being here.

LOU PALUMBO, FORMER NEW YORK POLICE OFFICER: Thank you for having me.

SANCHEZ: I'm confused. I'm confused, first of all, how it's possible that this guy could end up being not a suspect, but yet taken away, handcuffed by police.

PALUMBO: Well, there's no confusion. He was arrested and he was a suspect. In order for them for them to take him into custody in the manner in which they did, they needed to have probable cause. He has already submitted to a polygraph exam, which I understand he failed. He has some injuries to his body that might be consistent with someone who was defending themselves, coupled with the fact that from the videotape that they reviewed, all 700 hours of it, they can probably account for his coming and going. And I'm sure there's a timeline he fits into.

SANCHEZ: The whole thing is just weird.

By the way, hey, Dan, back in Atlanta, I got mix minus, so I'm hearing myself as I talk, if you can get a chance to fix that.

Is there a constitutional issue here? Can you just -- can the police in the United States pick somebody up, handcuff them, throw them in the back of the car, take them away, and then start questioning them, and then say, oh, but that's not an arrest?

PALUMBO: Yes, there is a little constitutional problem. And it's a little ironic that the same agency that just supported them, the FBI, if they're careful, might be investigating them.

The simple fact of the matter, Rick, is, if I prevent you from your freedom of movement, you're in a state of arrest if I'm a law enforcement agent. Once I handcuff you, you are conclusively in my custody. And you then have to support that with probable cause.

You just cannot, how would you say, arbitrarily take into custody and release people. He's not a person of interest. He's a suspect, number one. Let me finish what I'm about to say to you, though.

The other concerns with this individual is that, with all of the information that is floating around here, I have a feeling they have real good reason to think that this individual did it, and they released him. Clearly, he's a flight risk, as O.J. was.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: But you know they have got nine, 10 people watching him at every moment of the day, right? Please.

PALUMBO: You're assuming that. You're assuming that.

SANCHEZ: Please be doing that.

PALUMBO: I -- well, here's the thing. If they had at least charged him, right, and he had gone through an arraignment, a judge could have ordered him to wear a kind of surveillance device as we have become familiar with on his ankle so we could account for his whereabouts.

What we're alluding to now is that they have released him from custody. And he's floating around freely. And what restricts him? Have they taken his passport? Are they restricting him from leaving his city. What are the other come-alongs with this thing? And if you're saying to me I hope they put a surveillance on him, I'm agreeing with you.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

PALUMBO: But I would not make that assumption.

SANCHEZ: Well, what is interesting about this case is that, as we have been watching it, we have also seen some of the unbelievable assertions that they have made so far that are downright scary, by the way.

We're expecting a news conference from police in New Haven, probably within the hour. If it comes prior to that, we're going to run it, so you can see it for yourself. But some of the things that they are talking about is the fact that he's worked there, the fact that he has been in touch with perhaps other coeds, and the fact that he may have stuck her in a wall.

Have you put this together in your head yet? Have you ever heard of anything like this?

PALUMBO: No. The only word that could define what this young man did was called deranged. Obviously, his familiarity with the surroundings allowed him to become familiar with an area similar to a water closet, where you would have pipes intersect, so you they could have shutoff valves in the vent you had flooding.

SANCHEZ: I see.

PALUMBO: Right. You understand what I'm saying, Rick. So, he had intimate knowledge of the...

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: So, this picture we have in our heads of some trapped door or something, where he actually had to do drywall work and put her in the wall and take her out, since none of us know yet, we're imagining this, it's probably not that complicated?

PALUMBO: NO, I don't believe that it is.

And what I had said earlier in reference to this case was, I believe they were going to take somebody into custody based on just the dynamics surrounding this case and that it was somebody who was familiar with this building, probably working there in some capacity or another student, someone that had the opportunity to become familiar with that landscape.

SANCHEZ: Well, if this proves to be the guy who's guilty of this, as police seem to be intimating, but not acknowledging yet, then you probably nailed this one.

PALUMBO: We're going to see.

SANCHEZ: Lou Palumbo, thanks for being with us. Good to see you in person, by the way, in New York.

PALUMBO: My pleasure. Nice meeting...

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: All right, let's talk about this now, caught on...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What you're going to have to do is say that you're getting a gift from somebody.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, but the money's got to go in the bank.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: These are ACORN employees who are caught on camera giving illegal advice to the public. And they're doing so at your taxpayer expense. This is important stuff, and I'm going to share it with you.

Also, we finally have a health care bill. But I promised you that I would be all over the money angle of this story, and I'm going to be doing just that for you. Guess how much this Democratic senator, Senator Baucus, has gotten over the years from health companies? You can't even imagine how much it is. Should it matter? What do you think?

Also, Twitter is atwitter today with this story, which is why I'm doing it, a racist, hateful attack on a woman at a Cracker Barrel. That's what police are calling this one. So, we're looking into it for you. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back.

Let's continue this conversation. I'm Rick Sanchez in our New York studios today. Why did I say New York? New York studios today right here on Columbus Circle at the Time Warner Center.

We call this a national conversation. So, let's have a conversation. Let's go to our Twitter board, if we possibly can.

I want you to pay particular attention to the very last one. It's the one where Louise is writing. See it right there? "ACORN is corrupt from top to bottom" -- yes, ACORN is in the news -- she writes, "using taxpayer dollars and union money as hired thugs to promote a liberal agenda."

All right, let's talk about ACORN. What is the deal with ACORN? This is a balanced look at the good, the bad and the really ugly. And what am I talking about when I say really ugly? I'm talking about a just-released videotape. We have got that videotape. And we are going to be drilling down.

Let's start with the video. Here it is. The workers are caught, they say set up, by a filmmaker giving advice on how to run a prostitution ring. Now, this sounds like a scene from a "Borat" movie, but this is serious.

I'm going to take you through it. I'm going to let you listen to what they say. Here's part of it. All right, I'm going to take you through its implications, its implications to the president of the United States, its implication to Republicans. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez in New York.

All right, let's talk ACORN. If you're like a lot of people, you're scratching your head and you're asking yourself, shouldn't I know exactly who ACORN is? Everyone else knows, right? Well, yes. Look, if they listen to right-wing radio or TV, absolutely they know. They have been covered extensively, ACORN has, in the past for stories that some say are of arguable importance. Some might even say it's an agenda-driven story.

But now along comes this, video of ACORN employees doing and saying things that clearly question their ethics and their viability. Yes, the filmmaker who's shooting this video is an admitted right-wing advocate, but that doesn't explain away that this group, who backed President Obama, is caught on camera suggesting illegalities. Those are the facts.

And, more to the point, it's a group that was funded by you, by you, the taxpayer. They have received $53 million since 1994.

Now, here's the balance you may not get elsewhere. ACORN has helped renovate hundreds of homes damaged by Hurricane Katrina. They have won millions of dollars from predatory lenders for people facing foreclosure. They have intervened in court on behalf of gun control supporters. And they have lobbied for higher wages and for public schools.

That's important as well. It's the big picture in all of this, as you watch this report by CNN's Abbie Boudreau.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ABBIE BOUDREAU, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The three videos show ACORN workers apparently offering help and advice to a couple posing as a pimp and a prostitute. ACORN spokesman calls it a right wing setup.

SCOTT LEVENSON, ACORN SPOKESMAN: It's a sham is what it is. It's an orchestrated sham. It's journalism by Borat that they're attempting to create news rather than report the news and are doing so in a deceiving, not genuine way and trying to trick people who are trying to help people. BOUDREAU: So far ACORN has fired four of the workers from the videos and has started a nationwide review of its local offices. Yet, it questions the motivation of the filmmakers and it suggests the tapes were doctored, though it's not been able to produce any evidence to back that claim.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have been demanding the raw footage, the unedited tape, the un-doctored tape to really try and figure out what was really going on.

BOUDREAU: In the latest undercover video from Brooklyn, New York, filmmaker James O'Keefe and his colleague Hannah Giles walk into an ACORN office looking for help setting up a fictitious brothel using underage girls trafficked in from El Salvador. Rather than call the police, a staff member advises the couple to hide their illicit income in a tin can.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You get a tin and you bury it down in there and you put the money right in there and cover it and put it and you tell a single soul but yourself where it is.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A tin -- I put the money in a tin...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In a tin and put it in there (INAUDIBLE) and cover it with grass and put the grass over it.

BOUDREAU: In an earlier video, D.C. workers advised a pimp about how to get his money and protect his good name, after he tells them he intends to run for Congress someday.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What you're going to have do is say that you're getting a gift from somebody.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, but the money got to go in the bank.

BOUDREAU: And Baltimore weighed in on how to hide the fact that the brothel was going to be staffed by young girls brought in illegally from El Salvador.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The girls come -- they're really not going to be employees because you're not going to issue them W-2s at the end of the year.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Under 16.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So you don't worry about that. But on the other (INAUDIBLE) you can use them as a dependent...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can use them as a dependent because they live in your house, especially if they're under 16.

BOUDREAU: We tried to contact all of the workers in the three cities without success.

Abbie Boudreau, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: This is a complicated story, and it involves complicated issues, not just in the story itself, but how the story was gathered and who gathered the story. That's important. And that's getting a lot of reaction as well, including some -- I read to you just moments ago a comment from somebody who can't stand ACORN and thinks they're nothing but a liberal lapdog.

Well, here's somebody who comes from a different perspective on this. Listen to this. This is on MySpace. I got it while you and I were watching this report on the air.

Go to MySpace, if you can. There it is. It's from Chris (ph). And Chris said: "Right-wing filmmaker exposes a place like ACORN and he's a hero in the eyes of the media. Michael Moore makes a film that exposes the corporate greed, and he's considered the communist. That shows how fair and balanced our media really is."

Interesting perspective. I thought you would want to hear it.

Here's a couple of other ACORN notes, by the way. At least two Republican lawmakers now have asked the Department of Justice to investigate the group, including allegations of voter fraud. The latest call comes from Senator Mike Johanns of Nebraska.

He sent a letter yesterday to Attorney general Eric Holder. During the last election, you should note, ACORN staged a massive get- out-the-vote effort, but ended up being accused of falsifying voter registration forms.

We also have learned today that ACORN has halted new hires, pending a wide-ranging review of all internal operations. So, there's movement on this story as we speak. It also has ordered immediate restraining for what it calls it's front-line staff.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLAGOJEVICH: Hey, thanks for reading the book, by the way. I appreciate that. I really do.

SANCHEZ: Well, if I say I want to interview you, and you wrote a book, I want to read your book. It's just...

BLAGOJEVICH: You're unusual in your profession. Some of your colleagues don't do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Rod Blagojevich drops a bombshell after that about the death of his chief fund-raiser during my interview with him. I'm going to let you hear what he says, his exact words.

By the way, is what he did really different from what other politicians do when it comes to fund-raising? I mean, think about it, because that's an important question.

I'm also going to next show you this story because -- well, because I can.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: It's a naked man riding a motorcycle on a Florida interstate. And guess what? He's arrested. You say, what? If he wasn't naked, then you probably wouldn't show me that story, Rick. If you say that, yes. And your point is? Both those coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez, fired up, as ever, and I'm coming to you today from New York City.

I want you to watch this conversation with Rod Blagojevich. The former governor comes across actually very forthcoming and certainly very revealing. Is he telling the truth when he says he's no different than the rest of the politicians who are taking money for their campaigns? After all, the way is system is set up, all politicians have to raise money for their campaigns. Or is he a shakedown artist, a shakedown artist, as the feds seem to charge?

Listen to this, when I asked Blagojevich about the allegations that are made by U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald. Let's start there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: If Fitzgerald was here and I could interview him, and I wish I could, I have a feeling -- and let me not try and speak for him, but let me say what many other prosecutors might say -- yes, that is the system, Rick, and politicians have to go out and scrounge for money from people to get elected.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: But this guy, Blagojevich, he went beyond the pale. Listen to what he did. He was shaking down a children's hospital to not give them the funding until he got from them apparently some campaign contributions.

He told "The Tribune" -- I'm reading again from what he said -- he told "The Tribune" and sent a message to "The Tribune" that if they didn't fire their editors, he wouldn't work with them.

So, he's saying that you went beyond the pale. Did you?

BLAGOJEVICH: I did not.

And, as you say those things, those are completely false and completely a travesty of what the real truth is. In both of those cases, when the full story comes out, you will see that it's upside down.

SANCHEZ: Right.

BLAGOJEVICH: In fact, when it comes to children's health care, I was the first governor in American history to give every children -- every child health care in Illinois. And in the case of that particular hospital, there's a lot of information that you don't hear, because that prosecutor who took snippets of conversations won't let me tell you what's on those tapes, and, frankly, won't let you hear those tapes.

I'm the accused. I want you to hear those tapes. My accuser has gone to court preventing you from hearing those tapes. Something, Rick, is upside down here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: OK. So, let's move on to the next issue. This is important, speaking of the feds. Is Blagojevich right when he drops this bombshell on me yesterday when we were talking about prosecutors pressuring a man, prosecutors pressuring a man to commit suicide to get information on the former governor, on Blagojevich?

That man is Chris Kelly, who was Blagojevich's former chief fund- raiser. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLAGOJEVICH: It appears that there's a pattern emerging, and that is that my accusers were not satisfied with the jail sentence that he had in those cases, and they were putting pressure on him, offering possibly to reduce his sentence, I have been told by lawyers, if he would lie about me.

He chose to tell the truth, refused to lie about me, accepted his wrongdoing and his responsibility, and then sadly he took his life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: That's a heck of a charge, a heck of a thing to say.

So, obviously, as you might imagine, if somebody were to say that about you, you would somebody to call you in the media and say, is that true? So, we did. We called Patrick Fitzgerald's office in Chicago today to say, you know, this former governor is going around saying that you pressured this guy to kill himself. What's your response?

So far, unfortunately, the only response we have gotten from Fitzgerald is no comment. By the way, you can see my entire interview with the former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich on my blog -- you can go there right now -- and a whole bunch of other stuff, by the way -- CNN.com/ricksanchez, CNN.com/ricksanchez.

When I come back, there is a new health care proposal. Is this the one to finally make it through?

And this is an even more important part of the story that I want to tell you about. We have been looking into this. And there's a story out. The AP is reporting just how much money Senator Baucus, the guy who's in charge, the leader of the gang of six, as they're called -- how much money do you think he has raised, how much money has he gotten from health care industries? You're not going to believe this figure.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: As we roll along, let's get you involved in this conversation.

Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

Here's what you have to say on Twitter.

Let's go to our Twitter page, if we can, Atlanta.

We're going to start with Pamela. She says, "Look, shouldn't Blago be a little more worried about the court of law and a little less worried about the court of public opinion?" And then, o the ACORN, we've got Angela saying, "ACORN had good intentions, however, they need to hire educated people to give advice." That's pretty good advice.

And then, Galaxy says, "No comment! In other words, it's true. We aren't telling though." That's obviously on the Blagojevich story.

My thanks to all of you on all the stories that we're covering today.

All those town hall meetings, all the shouting and all the fighting that we've been bringing you on this newscast as well as many others -- well, today, we've got a product that has come from this long, ugly, arduous debate. It's an $856 billion health care overhaul bill whose cheerleaders say stands the best chance of making it through both houses of Congress and eventually on to the president's desk.

And there's the man who's designing it, by the way, and he backs it, and admits that zero Republicans on that so-called "gang of six" negotiators are signing off on this so far. That's Montana Democrat Max Baucus. He's the man who incidentally is a huge, huge recipient of health care industry money.

I promised you that on this newscast, we're going to find out who these players are and how much they get in campaign contributions. So, here you go, Mr. Baucus, we're going to tell folks at home right now how much you get.

Here's a dollar figure, nearly $4 million since 1989, $4 million. That's more than everybody except the president of the United States. That's what Senator Baucus has collected in contribution from the health care insurance industries. This is according to the non- partisan Center for Responsive Politics.

Is that important? Is that a big deal? Darn tootin'. I mean, his bill, by the way -- and this is another important part of this -- looks pretty good to the health care industry, mainly because of the missing government-run insurance option. I'm going to tell you where you can read that whole bill in a minute. But I want you to watch this first. It's Senator Baucus, trumpeting his bill, just a couple of hours ago on CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MAX BAUCUS (D), MONTANA: Delivers on the vision for a meaningful health care reform. I share it with President Obama and millions of Americans of all stripes that goal. It meets the criteria laid out by President Obama and it can achieve our common goals for health care reform. It reflects months of work, and more than a year of preparation by our committee. It represents an effort to reach common ground and a real chance for health care reform. And it is balanced, a common sense bill that can pass the Senate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: But then, there's that campaign contribution issue, which might make one wonder if, not just Baucus, but perhaps others, might be tainted in this argument as they try and negotiate what's best for us. Is it best for us or is it best for the people who are giving him the campaign contributions?

Look, it's a fair question. Now, you don't think that I would be reporting this to you without giving him a chance to respond, right? And you're right. We've called his office all day long. We've asked him to respond. Here's what he's done for us, he's given us a statement. It's essentially a statement that he issues to anybody whoever asks this question of his office. It seems to be like a form letter.

But I'll read it to you to be fair, from Senator Baucus. "For more than 30 years, I have served the people of Montana, and my only litmus test is the way what's right for Montana. No one gets special access, no one gets special treatment, and money plays no influence on how I make my decisions. I resent any implications that I'm influenced by special interests. I pride myself on calling decisions as I see them and doing what's right for the people of our state, if it's right for the folks of Montana, after all, they're my employers. It's right for me."

Four million dollars almost -- you decide.

All right. If you want a scan of this whole bill, by the way, as it was unveiled today, we've got it, go to Money.CNN.com. It's Money.CNN.com. And you can look there for the link.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN BALDWIN, ACTOR: Since Baby Stevie has, you know, become the Jesus freak, it's not easy. But here's the thing...

SANCHEZ: Do they call you a Jesus freak?

BALDWIN: No. No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He's talking about Alec Baldwin, by the way. This is kind of funny, but it's also good. Because think about this, what's it like to be a Baldwin brother, and how much courage does it take to come out on national television and admit that you are broke?

Stephen Baldwin recently called me at home one day when I was there hanging with my family, because he told me he wanted to share his story with you. So my interview with him which includes, by the way, a great impression of his brother Alec. That's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Hey, by the way, I just wanted to remind you -- hold on prompter, I'm just going to ad lib here a little bit. I told you at the beginning of the news and I have mentioned to you again, that there's been this case that the police are calling a hate crime, perhaps a racist incident in -- a part of Morrow, Georgia. I should let you know that we're going to be talking about that in just a little bit. I know it's a story that has really taken off on the Twitter world and in the blog world.

Roland Martin is going to join me in just a little bit. And it's just been confirmed as well that tonight at 8:00, I'm going to be doing the show here at 8:00 on CNN, that we're going to be interviewing the woman who says or who police say was racially attacked at this Cracker Barrel restaurant.

And we've also just learned -- a programming note -- that the leader of ACORN, the administrator of ACORN has called and said that she's willing to come on tonight to give her version of the story, tonight here on CNN at 8:00. So, stand by for those. I'll be doing that shows.

Meanwhile, tough question for you -- if you were broke, if you couldn't make your mortgage payment, you filed for bankruptcy protection -- oh, and you happen to have one of the most famous last names in all of show business, would you feel bad and want to like hiding in a corner somebody and not wanting to look at anybody or talk to anybody? Or would you go on national television, would you go on CNN with me, go to Rick Sanchez and talk about it?

Well, I know one guy who would. In fact he did. His name is Stephen Baldwin. We had actually a fantastic conversation yesterday. He happens to be a regular viewer of our show. He likes what we do here every day at 3:00. He reached out to me personally, and he wants you to hear his story, straight from him. And now, he went from the showbiz fast lane to struggling to pay his bills.

Here's a little bit more of our discussion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: A lot of Americans are going to find themselves or do find themselves at the present in the same situation you are. Notwithstanding your celebrity status...

BALDWIN: Right.

SANCHEZ: ... it's actually a common place where you are right now at this point in our history. By the way, you mentioned Alec, what are your -- what are your brothers saying to you as you go through this ordeal?

BALDWIN: Well, the huge support, just like my walk of faith. I mean, nobody has stood by me as much as my immediate family and my wife and my kids and all of that. What's interesting is, you know, with such opposing ideology and political point of view -- I mean, Alec and Billy are the best. I mean, we're still brothers at the end of the day. So for me, it's -- they've been a great blessing.

SANCHEZ: So, you're saying they're tend to be a little bit more progressive, whereas you see yourself a little more as a conservative, but it doesn't get in the way of your relationship?

BALDWIN: No, not at all. I mean, sometimes, I can see things in certain public forums where I get that phone call.

SANCHEZ: Do you have arguments at family get-togethers.

BALDWIN: No. We don't have arguments at family get-togethers.

SANCHEZ: Where do you have arguments then?

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: We have arguments down in the basement like we used to. But...

SANCHEZ: The Baldwin brothers are kind of an all-American family. I mean, I grew up in a family of three boys too, so I wonder how you guys do it.

BALDWIN: Well, it's -- I mean, since Baby Stevie has, you know, become the Jesus freak, it's not easy. But here's the thing...

SANCHEZ: Do they call you a Jesus freak?

BALDWIN: No. No. But they -- but I'll give you an example. I -- you know, not too long ago, in my outspokenness as for conservative points of views which can be aligned with the Republican Party and this and that, my brother and I were sitting there and smoking a cigar, and he turns to me and he says, "My God, who would have ever thought?" I said, "What?" He said, "Steven, 20 years sober, born again, and a Republican." I said, "No, no, no, I'm not a Republican." I said I'm registered an independent. Long pause, he goes, "You may be registered independent, but we all know you're a Republican sympathizer."

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: So, and he's joking.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: It's a fascinating interview. I mean, talk about a guy who's very comfortable with himself talking about some very real things. And as we continue this interview that I did with him -- it lasted about 15 minutes, so we can't give it to you in one long chunk, we'll give you more tomorrow -- you'll hear what it's like for him to have to try and beg a bank or a creditor to try and give him a break, and they're saying, "I'm not giving you a break, you're a Baldwin, you should have plenty of money, come on." And he'd say, "No, I'm really broke." It's a great story.

All right. Next: There's a fight at a baseball game. There's a naked -- there's a naked guy on a motorcycle. Yes, those stories probably don't belong together. But hey, this is this thing we do. It's called "Fotos Del Dia!" Stay there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

Oh, by the way, that interview that I was doing just a little while ago with Stephen Baldwin -- I was going to say Billy Baldwin, I get all the Baldwins mixed up all of a sudden -- somebody commented on it. So, let's take this MySpace if he can right here.

"He's not the only one. There are people who agree. My husband is a cop and I am an EMT," emergency medical tech, right? "We are now almost lamenting the fact that our career choices didn't include the other kind of public service. A pimp and a prostitute seem to have a much better chance of getting a home loan that we do." That's an interesting perspective.

All right, police officers, they're not supposed to pull a driver over unless they have probable cause. Does that probable cause include being naked? Let's do "Fotos."

(MUSIC)

SANCHEZ: This guy right here, riding a motorcycle in the raw. Look close, that's right. Mr. Breezy here was going down the highway completely naked. I got to laugh out at Roland; he's sitting next to me. His reason, Mr. Breezy, is for doing so, is he doesn't exactly know why he did it.

But we do know this -- it may have something to do with the alcohol, because he failed a breathalyzer test. And he was arrested for being drunk while riding a motorcycle naked. Thought you ought to know.

Last night, the Yankees versus the Blue Jays. Did you see this? Yankees pitcher hits a Toronto Blue Jay, and he hits another batter right after he's done with that one. So then, finally, in the eighth -- finally in the eight inning, Blue Jays pitcher Jesse Carlson threw at Jose Posada. He missed him but he almost stepped behind him. Posada took offense, anyway, finally he gets on base, brief shouting and posturing takes place.

But then, did you see that right there when Posada goes by him and he brushes him? Now some -- oh, yes, Katy bar the door, a few minutes later, the dugout's all empty. He bumped Carlson and everybody knows it. He took offense, punches are thrown, both benches clear, equipments scattered everywhere, an umpire goes missing.

I mean, this is no basic brawl. This is a serious one. Posada and Carlson end up both getting ejected. And if you get this whole baseball bean ball thing, please Twitter me and explain it to me, because I still do not understand the bean ball principle of baseball. I know it has something to do with honor, I know that.

ROLAND MARTIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: It's called pay back.

SANCHEZ: Well, I supposed. Roland, getting ready to tell us what he thinks. Look at this -- look at this one, Roland. Semper paratus is the Coast Guard motto, did you know that?

MARTIN: Oh, no.

SANCHEZ: It means "always ready, always prepared."

MARTIN: I don't swim.

SANCHEZ: Well, here they are prepared and ready to save some lives again in the Gulf of Mexico. They manage to fish five men out of the water after the men's boat started taking on water. The rescue went off without a hitch. And fortunately for us, the Coast Guard filmed the entire thing. It's amazing.

I got to tell you -- just on a personal note, I've lived near the ocean most of my life, I'm an avid boater, so, I can tell you, for the record, nobody works harder, nobody does a better job, these guys, the U.S. Coast Guard, they're tops in my book.

MARTIN: Yes.

(MUSIC)

SANCHEZ: Here's what everybody is talking about -- sorry, it's my friend Roland over here who's got some jabs coming my way already.

MARTIN: Blame it on the brother.

SANCHEZ: You know, you're here early by the way.

MARTIN: Blame it on the brother.

SANCHEZ: Jimmy Carter says racism has motivated the animosity against the president of the United States. Strong words, wouldn't you say, from a former president? And then, we've got this incident in Morrow, Georgia. We're going to put the two together for you and ask the general question, what's going on in this country as it pertains to race?

Stay there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

One week after fast becoming the most famous heckling of a president under the Capitol Dome or infamous -- depending on your perspective -- South Carolina Congressman Joe Wilson's shout of "You lie" at the president of the United States is raising new question about race and politics in America. Look, this is something many of you had twitted me about and I never report it or I never said it because we didn't -- we just didn't want to go there.

But somebody else has gone there and raised the specter or the issue of racism in this and it's Jimmy Carter -- former president of the United States, weighing in, saying that Wilson's outburst is part of a disturbing trend -- a trend based in racism.

Listen to what the former president told NBC News yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIMMY CARTER, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: An overwhelming portion of the intentionally demonstrated animosity toward President Barack Obama is based on the fact that he is a black man, that he's African-American. Racism inclination still exists, and I think it's bubbled up to the surface because of the belief among many white people -- not just in the South but around the country -- that African-Americans are not qualified to lead this great country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: He's from Georgia. And guess what? There's another story out of Georgia. We have just learned that this woman who the FBI and police are saying was beaten up by a man who was beating her up in front of her daughter and while he did so, he was calling her the "N" word. She's going to join me tonight here on CNN for an exclusive interview at 8:00.

And there's something else I've got to share with you now because Roland is standing by right here.

Roland, guess what? MARTIN: Yes.

SANCHEZ: I was just told by my producer that we have just acquired that video of the president of the United States saying an off-the-cuff comment about Kanye West. Did you hear about that?

MARTIN: No, I didn't hear about that.

SANCHEZ: Well, the president apparently...

MARTIN: Yes, I did hear about that.

SANCHEZ: Help me out here, will you?

MARTIN: Yes.

SANCHEZ: You've got to help me out.

MARTIN: Of course.

SANCHEZ: All right. What did -- what did he say? Did he say something about...

MARTIN: He called Kanye West a jackass.

SANCHEZ: OK. Well, apparently, that was a report that's been read. We've now got it. We've got the video and will be able to play it.

MARTIN: Right. It's initially an off-the-record conversation.

SANCHEZ: Yes. I wonder if it was really off-the-record.

MARTIN: Well...

SANCHEZ: You and I will have that argument -- hold on, you and I are going to have that argument in a minute.

But first, stay right there. We're going to go to break. When we come back, you'll hear the president of the United States calling Kanye West, am I right, a jackass.

MARTIN: Yes.

SANCHEZ: OK. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: All right. Welcome back.

This is the video that we received moments ago -- it's actually audio. You're going to be able to hear the president of the United States.

Is it video? OK. Great, thanks. This is video of the president of the United States calling Kanye West a jackass after Kanye West went out the other day during the MTV awards and decided that he should be the guy who decides who wins an award over Beyonce. It's kind of interesting. We want you to listen to it and then we're going to talk about it with Roland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The young lady seems like a perfectly nice person. She's getting her award. What's he doing up there?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why would he do that?

OBAMA: He's a jackass.

(LAUGHTER)

OBAMA: No, now, this -- all this stuff...

(INAUDIBLE)

OBAMA: I'm assuming all this stuff.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's going on here?

OBAMA: Come on, guys. Cut the president some slack.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: There it is.

All right. In our "R&R" segment today, we're going to talk about that. Here's Roland standing by.

Let's do that first. There's two other stories that I want to catch you up on.

MARTIN: All right. SANCHEZ: Let me just go to the facts here. Is there a possibility that the president of the United States didn't do this on purpose? I mean -- didn't do this as a mistake, that he knew that by calling this guy a "jackass," there's a lot of people in a certain constituency who will say, "See, he's calling out the brother here, you know" -- no?

MARTIN: I think that frankly is irrelevant. I mean, here you've got a guy who's a father, two children, a guy acts a fool, prominent story. Young girl who wins, young lady who wins the award. That's what it is.

SANCHEZ: So, this president is beyond Machiavellianism, beyond politics.

MARTIN: No.

(CROSSTALK) SANCHEZ: He doesn't do everything he does thinking, you know what, how is this going to serve me?

MARTIN: First of all, anything is possible.

SANCHEZ: Right.

MARTIN: But I don't look into every action of any president, whether it was President Obama or Bush or Clinton and say, hmm -- there's a political angle of him making this comment.

SANCHEZ: I've been doing this journalism thing my entire life. I always look for that angle.

MARTIN: Good.

SANCHEZ: But you're not -- you're not seeing -- you think he just said what everybody else is thinking black or white.

MARTIN: Right.

SANCHEZ: That that was stupid.

MARTIN: Right. Because first of all, you say -- look, I've had instances interviewing politicians where you're talking about things that are not related to the subject and then, frankly, you're not going to report elsewhere -- and that is a part of the give-and-take.

SANCHEZ: Let me talk about something else now. Two stories about racism I want to tell you about now, both in the news. One is the macro version, the big picture. The other is the micro version, a more focused first.

First the macro. Former President Jimmy Carter saying opposition to President Obama and Congressman Joe Wilson's outburst by saying "You lie!" -- the president says it's based -- don't run this sound bite here, Dan -- is based on racism. Now move up, prompter. Some would argue that the president has jumped the gun, that he may be wrong, that some people are really just concerned about the president's policies. OK, fair enough.

Now, I want to tell you about the other story. It's the micro story, all right? It's about an army reservist. Her name is Tashawnea Hill. She's with her 7 year old daughter. She's coming out of a Cracker Barrel. Are you ready?

MARTIN: Right.

SANCHEZ: She's coming out of a Cracker Barrel. She opens the door, another man is coming in at the same time. As he opened the door, he hits her daughter with the door. The man rather than apologized continues on and the woman says, you've got to be careful, you almost hit my son or you almost hit my daughter.

MARTIN: Right. SANCHEZ: And it turns out that he beats her up, calls her the "N" word. Now, it's a hate crime investigation. The FBI is looking into it.

That and the Carter thing, is that the state in America of what's going on with racism? And I hate to say this but we're down to 20 seconds.

MARTIN: They are examples. That is an example of having Tammy Bruce, a conservative, who called the first lady trash is an example. There are wide examples. There are people, frankly, who discredit the president is simply because they disagree. It's not always just because of race. But we cannot deny the reality that people do look at this through a racial prism.

SANCHEZ: Let me hold you there. You and I tonight at 8:00 together. This woman is going to join us. I want you on set, OK? This woman...

MARTIN: No, I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: I want you to join me. You and I are going to do that together. We're also going to hear from ACORN.

MARTIN: I'll be there.

SANCHEZ: We'll see you at 8:00. Meanwhile, here is Wolf Blitzer.