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Roadblocks to Reform; Setting the Strategy; Limiting Further AIG Bonuses; Fight Against Death; Dow 10,000 Watch; One Health Care Reform Bill Passed; California Storm Dangers; End of E-mail Era?; Crackdown on Paparazzi

Aired October 14, 2009 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We are now closer than ever before to passing health reform. But we're not there yet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: The president praises a Senate panel's passage of health care reform. Now comes the hard work of merging it with other plans.

Suspended animation. Bringing people back from the dead. For one doctor, it's personal.

And has e-mail become the horse and buggy of the communication super highway? You're telling us what's good and bad about the new services.

Good morning, everybody. I'm Heidi Collins. It is Wednesday, October 14th. And you are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Two stories on our radar this morning. One, health care reform and the future of it. Also, U.S. commitment in Afghanistan. Today what will be happening on Capitol Hill, closed door meetings regarding the future of health care reform. The merging of two, maybe more than that, plans. How long is it all going to take?

Our Brianna Keilar is going to be opening a window into those discussions. We'll get to her.

And also two senators are going to be weighing in on the chances of getting some type of health care reform before the year is through. As a Republican throws her vote behind the Baucus plan.

And also, our Suzanne Malveaux at the White House this morning where the president's war council convenes for the fifth time.

One big health care hurdle jumped. But a lot more to come on this long distance reform course. Here's what we know at this point. The Senate finance committee passed an $829 billion plan to extend coverage to an additional 29 million Americans.

In the 14-9 vote, Republican senator Olympia Snowe was the only committee member to cross party lines. Senior Senate Democrats now begin talks to find a consensus between the finance committee bill and a more liberal measure from another committee. House members are continuing their work to merge three other reform bills.

So what are the roadblocks now to this final reform bill? CNN congressional correspondent Brianna Keilar takes a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With millions of eyes around the country watching, the call came down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 14 ayes, 9 nays.

SEN. MAX BAUCUS (D-MT), SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: The ayes have it.

KEILAR: Senate Finance Committee's hotly debated plan for health care reform passed, thanks to 13 Democrats and 1 lone Republican, Olympia Snowe of Maine.

SEN. OLYMPIA SNOWE (R), MAINE: Is this bill all that I would want? Far from it. Is it all that it can be? No. But when history calls, history calls.

KEILAR: The plan has an $829 billion price tag. It prevents insurance companies from denying coverage based on pre-existing conditions and requires all Americans to have insurance. That would be done in part by expanding Medicaid and offering subsidies to people who can't afford it.

OBAMA: We are now closer than ever before to passing health reform. But we're not there yet. Now is not the time to pat ourselves on the back. Now is not the time to offer ourselves congratulations. Now is the time to dig in and work even harder to get this done.

KEILAR: And the road to getting health care done is still long and winding. The first hurdle a government-run insurance plan. The so-called public option isn't in the finance committee's bill but it is in another Senate proposal. Those plans now have to be blended together and lawmakers remain divided.

Another big sticking point, paying for reform by taxing high-end private insurance plans. Critics of that idea are already sounding off, including labor unions. Many of them gave up pay increases to get better health care in the first place. And this morning, less than 24 hours after the finance committee's vote, their opposition is in black and white in the morning papers.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS: Brianna Keilar joining us now live from Capitol Hill. Yes, I've seen some of those advertisements, Brianna. Explain to us if you would, though, the similarities and the differences of these plans that are in the committees. Because we're talking about two, three, maybe even more plans? KEILAR: Two plans in the Senate. And let's take a look at those side by side. The Senate Finance Committee bill which passed yesterday and the Senate Health Committee bill, a more liberal bill that passed in July.

So on the public option, well, actually, these are the -- sorry. These are the common ground right here. This is how they agree. Both of these bills say that insurance companies could not deny coverage on the basis of pre-existing conditions.

COLLINS: Right.

KEILAR: They couldn't also cap benefits you get from your insurance company either annually or over the course of your lifetime. And both of them include subsidies to help low-income Americans and middle-class Americans buy insurance. They have some stark differences, though.

So let's take a look at them side by side. The Senate Finance Committee bill, which as I said is more conservative, on the public option, it does not include a public option. The Health Committee bill does include one.

On the employer mandate, forcing employers to contribute to the health care of their employees, again, the health committee includes that. The finance committee does not. And then on the price tag, I think this shows something very differently. $829 billion for the finance committee. And an estimated $1 trillion for the Senate Health Committee.

This is what these group of lawmakers, a few Democratic lawmakers as well as White House officials, begin talking about today. Heidi?

COLLINS: Yes. Hey, Brianna, I just wonder with that higher price tag coming out of the plan in the Senate Health Committee, does that mean that more people would be covered? Because we know in the plan right now there are still 25 million Americans that won't be covered.

KEILAR: Well, it may be an issue of when you look at the subsidies because of really the generosity of the subsidies, that may be it.

COLLINS: All right. Very good. A lot to go through. I know we're going to be talking about it for many, many more days, Brianna Keilar on Capitol Hill for us this morning. Thank you.

We are hearing more from Senate Finance Committee member Olympia Snowe this morning. A little while ago she talked on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING" about the effort it will take to get a final health care reform measure passed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SNOWE: I believe in solving problems and trying to work through the legislative process to get it done. It's a monumental issue. It's very complex. It takes time. It should take time. That's what the American people expect. So we just got to, you know, give it the time and the patience that it deserves to work through the legislative process to get this to be in the best place for the best policy possible on such an issue that affects every American.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Two other senators are going to be joining us to talk about the prospects for final agreement on health care reform and some of these conversations that are going to be going on today behind closed doors. We're going to be hearing from senators Bill Nelson and Orrin Hatch coming your way at the bottom of the hour.

Setting the strategy for Afghanistan and Pakistan. President Obama meets today with his national security team for the fifth time.

CNN White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux joining us now live from Washington with more on this.

All right, Suzanne. What can we expect to come out of the meeting today?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Heidi, we've already seen some really heavy hitters here alt the White House. General David Petraeus, who's the top commander in Iraq. He just arrived here at the White House for these meetings.

Obviously, this is the fifth one. This is important. Because in previous meetings, you would -- they would talk about the security situation in Afghanistan or the security situation in Pakistan.

They'd take stock of where they are with al Qaeda, the Taliban, even the people in Afghanistan themselves, how are they living, how vulnerable are they to potentially being influenced by terrorists.

Well, today what they're going to be looking at obviously is resources. This involves troop levels. This involves training. At the same time the president's still trying to convey to the American people that the goal here is a consistent goal. That they're trying to dismantle al Qaeda, to prevent al Qaeda from being able to plot and carry out a terrorist attack against the United States.

And that this is a matter of resources. How do they divvy it up? How do they parcel it out to meet various aspects of that single goal?

I want you to take a listen to how the president described it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The military security that's provided and our ability to train Afghan forces is one element of it. Another element of it is making sure that we are doing a good job in helping build capacity on the civilian side, in areas like agriculture and education. And I would expect that we will have a -- a completion of this current process in the coming weeks.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: So, Heidi, I've been e-mails with several senior administration officials to get a sense, what is the president talking about when he says in the coming weeks?

COLLINS: Right.

MALVEAUX: Well, clearly, this is the fifth meeting. They're going to have a sixth meeting next week. They're going to take a look at all of these different things that they've been focusing on in these meetings. It is in weeks, not months.

And one senior administration official saying the most important thing is that this is an effective strategy. And that is the point of a lot of debate, still, at this White House. Heidi?

COLLINS: Yes, effective meaning price tag and as you said, number of troops and strategy all combined. So, obviously, a lot of issues to be talked about here. We're going to bring in our Pentagon correspondent as well to talk more about this in the 10:00 hour.

Suzanne Malveaux, in front of the White House, appreciate that.

Two teenagers are dead, three others are wounded in a drive-by shooting in Washington. They were standing outside an apartment complex when shots were fired into the crowd. The police chief tells the Associated Press the shooting could be part of a conflict that's been going on for some time in that neighborhood. Police are asking witnesses to come forward.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF CATHY LANIER, METROPOLITAN POLICE DEPARTMENT, WASHINGTON, D.C.: It's time for this kind of drive through a neighborhood and just open fire on people standing outside to stop. And we're already getting calls in from people who want this to stop.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: And an update now on a story we first told you about yesterday. Police in Florida arrested five teenagers accused of lighting a 15-year-old schoolmate on fire. Officials say it looks like revenge over a $40 video game and a stolen bicycle.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF AL LAMBERTI, BROWARD COUNTY, FLORIDA: It's retaliation because he reported somebody stealing his dad's bike. And whether or not it was whether they owed him money, they deliberately sought him out, poured alcohol on him, and set him on fire.

The suspects in this case, they need to be prosecuted. The victim in this case is probably going to be in the hospital for five months. He's currently in Jackson Memorial Hospital. Second-degree burns over 80 percent of his body.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: The teen who lit the rubbing alcohol faces an attempted murder charge. The others are charged with aggravated battery. Police say all five of the suspects had previous run-ins with law enforcement.

More bonuses for the financially troubled AIG? Some people were furious when they learned about the payouts earlier this year. Will anyone stand in the way now of the insurance company doing it again?

ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: And I'm Rob Marciano in the CNN Severe Weather Center. The storm out in California continues to hammer SoCal. One notable mudslide already. Will another one be on the way? Weather is coming up when the CNN NEWSROOM comes right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: The Treasury didn't stop AIG from paying out bonuses earlier this year after the insurance giant received billions in bailout money. So will the department step in now that AIG plans to do it again?

Christine Romans joining us now live from New York on this. Obviously, Christine, a lot to talk about here as there was the last time around. Inspector general for TARP in his report today is critical of the Treasury over this issue.

Are we still talking about executive bonuses or are we talking about mid-level workers who rely on these bonuses as pay?

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: We are still talking about the same $475 million in bonuses for the financial products division that we were talking about last year. This is the same pool of money that we are still trying to figure out what is appropriate to pay out and what is not.

Heidi, some of that has been paid out. A little bit of it has been returned. About $237 million of it paid out. And $19 million has been paid back to AIG. They're expecting by the end of the year a little bit more.

You'll remember that AIG executives, people who had gotten at least $100,000 in retention bonus, were asked to give up the money. And many of them have. There are more who still have money to turn in. Forty million will not be paid.

That means, Heidi, look at that green chunk of that pie.

COLLINS: Yes.

ROMANS: $198 million is still owed from that bonus pool from last year. And the TARP watchdog, the person who is the watchdog over this, is going to testify later today in his report. He says that the U.S., the Obama administration, the U.S. government is going to recommend that that money not be paid out. At least not all of it. So we still don't know how they're going to try to reel that back in or not pay it out or, you know, how much they're going to try to keep in. We might hear more about that later today. But, in fact, they are still wrangling over this AIG bonus money, Heidi, these many, many months after that year is even -- is done and we are well on our way into a recovery after the depths of the crisis last fall.

COLLINS: Yes, but is it important to point out bonuses to whom exactly in these companies?

ROMANS: Well, it's interesting. This particular pool of money, the TARP bailout watchdog, the bailout watchdog, he points out these weren't just retention bonuses for the top, although the people at the top got an awful lot of money. He even points out there are retention bonuses in here for people who worked in the kitchen staff and people who worked in other jobs.

This had nothing to do with retaining that talent to try to unwind those complicated positions of the financial products division over at AIG. He also points out that there are so many different pay structures and payroll groups at AIG that the company is even struggling to try to figure out who is owed what.

It operates in 103 different countries. And there are different laws in a lot of different countries that make it very difficult to figure out who owes -- who deserves what at this point. It's really turned out to be a big mess. And still trying to unravel it.

Remember all that outrage in March? We are still trying to figure out what is appropriate in terms of the bonuses for the AIG people.

COLLINS: Yes. Understood. All right. Christine Romans, let us know when you get it figured out. Appreciate it.

(LAUGHTER)

COLLINS: Rob Marciano joining us now, talking about California today. A lot of storms in the south, too.

(WEATHER REPORT)

COLLINS: OK. Yes, very good. All right, Rob, thank you.

MARCIANO: You got it.

COLLINS: From the left and the right, two senators talk about the obstacles that they face to reform America's health care system.

And to the brink and back. Dr. Sanjay Gupta shows us how a scientist is hoping to buy more time for the critically ill and why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: The first look at a kidnapping victim 18 years after she was taken. People.com posted this photo of Jaycee Dugard this morning. She also gave the magazine a statement saying she's happy to be back home with her family.

Dugard is now 29 years old. She was only 11 when she was kidnapped in California in 1991. Phillip and Nancy Garrido have pleaded not guilty in the case.

One hurdle cleared. Several more ahead on health care. The Senate is holding closed door meetings today trying to merge two different reform bills. The finance committee passed one yesterday with only one Republican vote.

That version does not have the public option. The other one does. A similar job ahead in the House with three different versions.

A health care reform bill makes it to first base in the Senate, as you know. But not all lawmakers are happy about it. We'll hear from two senators from both sides of the aisle, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLLINS: Our next story may sound like science fiction. An experimental drug that could one day put critically injured soldiers in a state of suspended animation and then later bring them back.

For one scientist, it has become his life's work. It is among the stories featured in the book, "Cheating Death," by our own Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay tells us all about it.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Heidi, all week long we've been talking about trying to buy time. That's an essential component of cheating death. For example, the new type of CCR you can buy more minutes. With hypothermia you can buy hours.

And there is something known as suspended animation. As you mentioned, this could help you buy a lot more time. We wanted to introduce you to the scientist who's working on this right now. He's a bona fide genius. And he's been -- he really has a personal mission as to why he's doing this as well. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GUPTA (voice-over): Mark Roth is a biologist in Seattle. He's at a Fred Hutchison Cancer Research Center. Here in this lab he developed the approach of cheating death through suspended animation.

(on camera): Is the premise that if we can buy doctors or health care professionals a little bit more time?

MARK ROTH, FRED HUTCHINSON CANCER RESEARCH CENTER: The whole emergency medicine had -- you know, having it -- it's a time dependent thing. And somebody either has enough time or they don't.

GUPTA (voice-over): Enough time. But there's something else. For Roth, the fight against death is also personal. It's grounded in a family tragedy.

(on camera): What happened to your daughter? ROTH: She passed away when she was 1 after spending a month in the ICU. Following a heart surgery.

GUPTA: Do you think that that had an impact on your choice of scientific pursuits?

ROTH: Oh, it did. Yes. Yes. So I spent -- there's things that happen. You get -- it focuses the mind when certain things happen to people. And it certainly focused mine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GUPTA: Heidi, let me explain briefly how this works. We're talking about simply trying to eliminate all the oxygen from the body. So, for example, we're breathing in 21 percent oxygen right now. If I took that concentration down to 2 percent, we would likely die. If I took it down to .0002 percent or a really small amount, we could live as long as there was some sort of fuel for our cells.

That's exactly where Roth and his team are focused. Give something that can block the oxygen in the body but also provide fuel for the cells so they don't die. And that's what this shot is all about.

The scenario that was painted for me, you imagine someone in a war zone, for example, that's received a mortal wound. Something that just doesn't seem like it can be treated in the war zone and there's nothing that his fellow soldiers can do. So they actually inject a shot that puts the person into a state of suspended animation.

Their heart stops. They stop spontaneously breathing. But they're not dead. They're just suspended. Eventually they put that patient on a helicopter, move them to a hospital, get the whole health team in place, reanimate and go to work.

That's sort of what's possibly down the pipe. Now it's going to be some time. I mean they're just recruiting for human trials now so I imagine seven years at least. But that gives you a glimpse into the future.

Heidi, back to you.

COLLINS: And don't miss the primetime debut of Sanjay's special series, "CHEATING DEATH," this Saturday and Sunday 8:00 p.m. Eastern only on CNN.

After months of wrangling, a key Senate committee approves a health care reform bill. But the debate ain't over yet. Two senators, one Democrat, one Republican weigh in on the bill and what's ahead as the negotiations push forward.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: Live in the CNN NEWSROOM, Heidi Collins.

COLLINS: On Wall Street, we're on Dow 10,000 watch. The blue chip average got closer earlier this week. But today could be the day, finally, thanks to a batch of upbeat earnings. We're going to tell you about these corporate earnings coming in.

Susan Lisovicz at the New York Stock Exchange now with details as we await the opening bell.

Good morning to you, Susan.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. And there is applause this morning as we await the opening bell.

Heidi, it bears repeating that the stock market is a reflection of what's happening around us. And since March, we've gotten a steady stream of information that things aren't as bad as they once were, and in some cases, we're seeing actual growth. That is the case today and that is why we're gearing up for a triple-digit jump at the open, which could be enough to send the Dow over the 10,000 mark, which is something we haven't seen since last October.

We have several catalysts for the bull run. Quickly, one of them is Intel, which offers those great clues into the PC market. Intel, of course, makes computer chips. We're seeing shares right now up -- yes. Up 1 percent. Intel's profit, end sales beat estimates, even better, Intel expects sales in the current quarter to top analysts' projections. That's what Wall Street's looking for - signs of actual spending.

We're also hearing from a big bank. Shares of JP Morgan Chase up 3 percent right now. The bank made more than $3.5 billion last quarter. That easily beat analyst estimates. JP Morgan still uncertain about the near term. It saw defaults of mortgages and home equity loans rise. Adding to the optimism, retail sales, that weren't as bad as expected last month, sales fell 1.5 in September. That's the biggest drop this year. But it's largely due to a dropoff in auto sales after the cash for clunkers program expired. Checking the early numbers, right now the Dow is up 86 points at 9958. Less than 50 points to 10,000. The Nasdaq, meanwhile, is up 1.25 percent. We're on Dow 10,000 watch. The Dow, I should also say, Heidi, first closed above 10,000 a decade ago.

COLLINS: Wow. We're watching. I think we should not talk about it anymore. Maybe it will actually happen today.

LISOVICZ: Yes. I think we're just going to watch the numbers and we will let the pictures tell the story.

COLLINS: Absolutely. All right, Susan. We'll check back later on. Thank you.

LISOVICZ: You're welcome.

COLLINS: One big health care hurdle jumped, but a lot more to come on this long distance reform course. Here's what we know. The senate finance committee passed an $829 billion plan to extend the coverage to an additional 29 million Americans. In the 14- 9 vote Republican Senator Olympia Snowe was the only committee member to cross party lines. Senior senate democrats now begin talks to find a consensus between the finance committee bill and a more liberal measure from another committee. That's the senate health care committee. House members are continuing their work to merge three other reform bills. A lot to talk about. A lot of grueling work ahead for both sides before we actually have health care reform. So to talk about it, two senators this morning. The first is Senator Bill Nelson, obviously a Democrat. Senator Nelson, appreciate you being with us this morning. How big of a deal is it that this finance committee bill passed?

SEN. BILL NELSON (D), FLORIDA: Well, it had to pass in order to progress through the legislative calendar. This was the first step. But it's a long road ahead. And now the task is to the majority leader. He's almost got to be Houdini to put together a package that can get 60 votes to cut off debate so that we can get to the bill.

COLLINS: What do you mean Houdini? What does he have to do?

NELSON: Well, he's got to take a little here and take a little there to satisfy 60 senators out of 100 senators in order to be able to get the bill to advance. Take 60 votes to cut off debate so that you can then get to the bill and start amending the bill.

COLLINS: So obviously this more liberal bill that's going to be talked about with the senate health care committee, it has the public option. Correct? Is that the main sticking point here? How will those two merge in order to get the amount of votes that they need to get for the next passage?

NELSON: Well, we don't know at this point. I think there's going to be some version of the public option. But Olympia Snowe of Maine is quite key here. And if her vote is critical in the future, then she may insist what is a kind of public option, it doesn't take effect until you would not have the competition among the insurance companies in this health insurance exchange that's being done for people who don't have insurance and for those who can't afford the insurance that they have.

COLLINS: Well, speaking of insurance, I know you had some very tough words for the insurance industry in the report that came out the other day regarding premiums. We're going to go ahead and listen to some of what you said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NELSON: Is it any wonder that now that they see there's going to be a bite on them to look out after the overall health, they come out at the 11th hour with a report that says, oh, this thing is all flawed?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Senator, do you have any evidence that premiums will, in fact, not go up? And, particularly, when you represent a state like Florida, we're talking about a significant group of seniors in your state that are concerned.

NELSON: Well, this is the whole point of health care reform. You want to make health insurance available, and you want to make it affordable. And who among us have not heard these horror examples of people that can't get health insurance or they get their health insurance canceled. Now, Medicare is a different thing. Medicare is a program that people that are 65 or older are very satisfied with. We don't want to penalize them. But there are certainly efficiencies that you can get out of Medicare.

COLLINS: Will seniors lose any benefits? Especially when we're talking about even the more specialized Medicare advantage?

NELSON: Well, that was my amendment in the finance committee. To make sure that on -- right now seniors getting Medicare advantage are grandfathered in so they're not going to be taken away. You can do the better competitive kind of bidding for Medicare advantage in the future, but not take away from anything from the seniors now.

COLLINS: All right. Obviously there's a lot of discussion ahead. We know those closed-door meetings are happening as we speak. So we'll continue to follow that. Senator Bill Nelson, Democrat from Florida, thank you. Appreciate that.

As you know, this reform bill, or at least the first one, the Senator Max Baucus bill that we've been talking about for days, did get passage yesterday. 14-9 was the vote. There were a lot of eyes, as we were hearing from Senator Nelson, on the Republican Senator, Olympia Snowe of Maine. She ended up throwing her vote behind this bill. And now as we move forward today, the discussions about that particular bill that got the passage it needed, and this more liberal bill now from the health care committee will be merged in some way. So how will that final bill, as we move forward here, end up looking? Let's go ahead and talk to Senator Orrin Hatch now from the Republican side of things and get his take on what went down yesterday. Senator, thanks for being with us. How big of a deal is it to you and the Republican Party that the senate finance committee got passage yesterday?

SEN. ORRIN HATCH (R), UTAH: Well, it's a big deal. Because, you know, we knew they would pass it out of the committee. Now comes the hard part. Because they're going to try to merge it with the health committee bill which is a totally partisan, democratic bill. And then you got a tri-committee bill in the house which is also a totally partisan, democratic bill.

COLLINS: Why totally partisan democratic?

HATCH: Well, they just -- they didn't ask for any Republican advice or any republican help. And every republican amendment that came up was voted down on a party line vote, 13-10.

COLLINS: So if, in fact, you had been asked according to how you say this happened, what would you have said? What would be the suggestion from the Republican Party?

HATCH: Well, I think, you know, we're willing to work on something that would really work. But this particular bill, I mean, just for starters, they're going to take a half trillion dollars out of Medicare. I remember back in 19 -- or 2005, rather, in the budget act, we had $22 billion coming out of Medicare. And the democrats accused us of immorality and being awful. It was just $22 billion. They're taking a half trillion dollars out of Medicare to try and finance this thing. We all know that's not going to work. Medicare is $38 trillion in unfunded liability. That's what happens when you have the government run things.

COLLINS: But Senator Nelson just said that, especially regarding seniors, they're not going to lose any benefits. Many of them will be grandfathered in.

HATCH: Well, that's not true. They're taking $130 billion, approximately $130 billion out of the Medicare advantage program, which is the program particularly for seniors, and especially in rural areas where it's very difficult to get health care to them. It's a little more expensive. And that's one reason the democrats have jumped on that. They jumped on that because they consider it a republican approach. It's worked amazingly well. 95% of the people on it really love it.

COLLINS: Well, I know that you commented yesterday on the vote. Let's go ahead and listen to some of what you said yesterday.

HATCH: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HATCH: I wish we could work with our colleagues. I wish we could get together. I wish we could do a bipartisan bill. I might add, one person is not bipartisan. You can call it that, but it really isn't. Although I do deeply respect that one person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Senator Hatch, did you speak with Olympia Snowe yesterday?

HATCH: Oh, yes. We sat right side by side. I happen to care a great deal for Olympia. Look, I have no problem with her voting that way out of committee. I think -- but she made it very clear that if they change it very much or they don't improve it the way she thinks they ought to, that her vote might go the other way. I suspect in the end that she's going to go the other way, because they're going to add some version of a public plan to this. Now, look, when you have -- when they did Medicare back in 1965, they said everything would be on a level playing field. They soon then started to set prices. Now today doctors are 20 percent less on Medicare. Hospitals are 30 percent less. And everybody else has to pick up the cost. And Medicare is $38 trillion in unfunded liability. So these are things that really bother me. We've got to work on them and solve, not just brush aside.

COLLINS: Well, I want to ask you quickly as well about this insurance industry report. What's your take on it? Why did the industry wait so long to put this report out? And is it 100percent accurate?

HATCH: Well, let me just say this. We know the prices are going to go up. One of the interesting things here is, is that the head of the CBO made it very clear that he didn't have time, nor did the democrats give him time, to do a premium analysis. And they've always done premium analyses on other health care bills. But they just didn't have time here. It's like they're trying to ram this through. I think they realize that the American people aren't going to allow them to do it if they really find out what's in the bill. So they're trying to ram it through.

COLLINS: Obviously we actually have the quote. I know exactly what you're talking about from the Congressional Budget Office chief, Douglas Elmendorf, who said this. "We cannot assess the effects on national health expenditures. There are so many conflicting forces; we have not been able to assess the effect on premiums." So certainly something for everyone to be thinking about. It seems like nobody really knows the end result here. So I hope the discussions go well today between both sides of the aisle. We will report on them very closely, obviously, here on CNN.

Thanks so much, Senator Orrin Hatch.

HATCH: OK.

COLLINS: Time now for a check of some of our other top stories we're watching this morning. The self-help expert at the center of the Arizona sweat lodge deaths is now speaking out. James Arthur Ray says he doesn't really know how best to handle the tragedy, but he's hired his own investigators to look into the incident. Two people died when they were overcome by heat. Several others were hospitalized.

A US military official tells CNN turkey canceled a planned joint military exercise in order to exclude Israel. Turkey's foreign minister says there was no political motivation. Turkey has been vocal in its opposition to Israeli insurgency to Gaza last year. Israel and the United States were supposed to take part in the military maneuvers.

Now to the wildfires. Flooding, rains and possible mud slides, people across California on high alert.

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COLLINS: A powerful storm has people across California on alert. Look at these pictures. Roads are flooded, trees and power lines down and the more it rains, obviously the greater possibility of mud slides, especially in areas scorched by wildfires and that includes the Santa Cruz Mountains.

About 60 families there have been urged to evacuate. Near Bakers Field, before the rain, strong winds kicked up a dust storm. 11 vehicles crashed into each other. Three people were killed and five others hospitalized. Boy, nasty situation in California.

Rob Marciano is standing by to talk a little bit more about this. I remember what you were telling us yesterday and the day before; this is sort of the remnants of a typhoon.

MARCIANO: It is, kind of combining with an Alaskan low. But the key here Heidi, is that it still has some energy from that typhoon and more importantly still has a lot of that tropical moisture. And that's why we've seen so much rain.

And as you mentioned, especially over the burn areas we have concern of that rain becoming muddy and debris flows.

Check out some of these numbers. Kentfield, California, 6.14; Fairfield, California 4.6; Napa seeing over three and a half and these are only 24 hour numbers; and San Francisco and Sacramento both seeing two and a half plus and those are record breaking numbers.

We can go in a little bit farther. These are some automated rain gauges. Every particular color represents a different rain gauge. We'll kind of zoom into the Monterey Bay area and talk about Watsonville. This is where -- a spot where one of the -- one of the mud slides happened, probably right in this area; 7.49 inches of rainfall.

So you go up higher elevations, obviously we start to see higher amounts of rainfall just from that orthographic lifting. A little farther down to the south in parts of southern California, the burn areas of the station fire, some reports there between two and four inches of rainfall.

So this is certainly a concern with more rain coming into especially southern California. We're zoomed into Santa Barbara. And you can kind of see here where all the moisture kind of just slamming right into the Santa Barbara coastline and the mountains just north and east of there.

So those areas are certainly areas of concern. East of Fresno as well and the station fire as I mentioned, for the next 6, 12, 18 hours, Heidi, it's a nervous go here. So if we can get through today, I think we're looking at, you know, maybe a positive situation for the California area. Because they're in such a bad drought, that certainly would help.

But we've got to get through today...

COLLINS: Yes, exactly...

MARCIANO: ... without any more of that (INAUDIBLE).

COLLINS: OK, understood. I know you'll stay on top of this for us. Let us know if we need to come to you with more info there. Thanks so much.

MARCIANO: You got it.

COLLINS: Rob Marciano.

Is it the end of the e-mail era? Is it true? Our Josh Levs is going to show us just how often people still use e-mail and how things are changing.

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COLLINS: So get this. The e-mail era is over. That's what "The Wall Street Journal" is reporting, and it's creating quite a bit of buzz online. Not on e-mail of course.

Our Josh Levs is here with a look at how much people are really using e-mail and what is possibly maybe for some people taking over.

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Are you one of the many Americans who are a little skeptical about this claim, Heidi?

COLLINS: Yes.

LEVS: Yes, I can see that. And the thing is a lot of people are but it's got a lot of people talking. This is it behind me from "The Wall Street Journal." "Why e-mail no longer rules." And basically, what they point out is that people are moving more and more to some of this other social media.

Let's go straight to this craft because I have a quote for you here that kind of summarizes what their point is. I pointed to this. I've pulled out some of these numbers that they point to here in the story.

What they found is that there was a study across several countries, right? And what they found is that in these several countries e-mail users, 277 million. But when you look at other stuff like Facebook and Twitter and these other online social media, that has now passed e-mail. They have 300 million there.

And on the next screen you see a quote from the story that summarizes how they trying to say that you know what? Things are really moving in a different direction. This is it, I pulled up these numbers for you. And this is the reason that they say people are really moving on.

Instant messaging is a lot faster, they say. Your questions get answered without you having to ask. If you use Facebook you can check someone's Facebook page and to say hey, what are you up to? Are you in town? What are you doing? They also say that this whole idea of getting attachments from e-mail seems kind of outdated these days.

Whereas in Facebook you can put in some links right there that people can see the information without the old attachments. And they say just physically it's boring.

So Heidi, that's the position they're taking here. And they are saying, you know what, it's just not the way things are going. What do you think?

COLLINS: Well, my father who is older than 70. I'll be generous to him. They were just traveling in Europe ok, in northern Italy and Austria and Switzerland and you know that the guy who set up a blog and blogged his way through Europe.

So yes. Obviously there are definitely other entities out there. But don't you to have an e-mail account to get access to all of these other things? How does that work?

LEVS: Well, that is a point. Yes, you actually, as a rule you sign in via you're e-mail, so you have your e-mail but the idea is it's something you just access once in while...

COLLINS: So then go and use it.

LEVS: ... and you don't spend that much time on it anymore if you've move over to this other stuff.

Can we show this quote, I think we have it, it's a quote from the story itself. And it says "the shift promises to profoundly rewrite the way we communicate in ways we can only begin to imagine."

Anyway, a lot of people disagree, you can agree or you can disagree, you've got my Facebook, my Twitter page is JoshLevsCNN; CNN.com/josh. Feel free to tell us it's a crazy concept or you think it's exactly right. We would love to hear from you.

COLLINS: You just put that I my Face, you've got my e-mail, my Twitter and my Facebook, yes, yes.

LEVS: See I do have those things.

COLLINS: All right, Josh, we'll check back later on. Thank you.

LEVS: Thank you Heidi.

COLLINS: There's an awful lot going on this morning. We do have our crews in place to bring it all to you.

Let's get a look ahead from our correspondents beginning with Suzanne Malveaux at the White House. Good morning to you Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: Good morning, Heidi. We just saw General Petraeus, David Petraeus. We saw Secretary Gates as well as CIA director Leon Panetta; all of them here arriving at the White House for President Obama's fifth war council meeting if you will to look for what's next in Afghanistan.

I'll have much, much more of what we expect out of that meeting at the top of the hour -- Heidi.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: I'm Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. More troops for Afghanistan? Where are they going to come from? We'll have that at the top of the hour. MARCIANO: I'm Rob Marciano in the CNN Severe Weather Center. That storm out in California continues to batter them especially across southern California. Will there be another mudslide or more today? A discussion at the top of the hour -- Heidi.

COLLINS: All right. Very good. Thanks so much guys.

Also, a look at who is feeling the pain of the recession the most and how it affects the rest of us.

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COLLINS: Caught on camera. This is Maria Shriver. The pictures supposedly show California's first lady breaking state law by talking and driving. Her husband Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger promised swift action. Schwarzenegger is also cracking down on the paparazzi but not because of these pictures.

CNN entertainment correspondent Kareen Wynter has more.

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KAREEN WYNTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Flashing lights. Invasive cameras. Glaring lens of the paparazzi as celebrity photographers jockey for that perfect shot. That one picture tabloid magazines, Web sites and TV shows will pay big bucks for. But now those who earn a living trailing the famous are on an even tighter leash.

MATTHEW BELLONI, "THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER": The paparazzi underworld is a shady, shady business.

WYNTER: An amended law just signed by California's governor broadening the scope of who is liable.

BELLONI: The media organizations in business with some of these paparazzi essentially saying that if you do business with someone who is acting illegally in getting you these images, you as the media organization could be liable.

WYNTER: This is not the first paparazzi crackdown by Arnold Schwarzenegger. Three years ago he tripled the damages in suits alleging assault against the paparazzi. Now stars can go after the media for publishing photographs or videos improperly obtained by the paparazzi.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just like anybody out there, you should have the right to your privacy.

PAULA ABDUL, SINGER: Every little step makes you feel a little safer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it's actually a deterrent, I think that's awesome.

JESSICA BIEL, ACTRESS: It sounds like it's probably a positive thing for a lot of people.

WYNTER: for some the amended law poses a threat to the first amendment. The California Newspaper Publishers Association released this statement. "Even meritless lawsuits have a chilling impact on the right to gather and publish the news and the public's right to know."

And there in lies the debate. The line between the public's right to know and the star's right to privacy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Taxi. Pull out. Thank you.

Kareen Wynter, CNN, Hollywood.

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