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American Morning

Health Care Bill Clears Hurdle in the Senate; Senator Olympia Snowe Pulls a Surprise Vote in Favor of Health Care Reform; President to Meet With National Security Team to Discuss Afghan Strategy; US Versus AIG Bonuses; Art Offending Life

Aired October 14, 2009 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: And good Wednesday morning to you. Thanks for joining us on the Most News in the Morning on this October the 14th. I'm John Roberts.

KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Kiran Chetry. We have a lot of big stories we're going to be telling you about in the next 15 minutes.

First, health care reform clears a major hurdle in the Senate entering a whole new phase today. Critics are already mounting attacks after the finance committee passed its version of reform arguing that it could make trips to the doctor more expensive. We're taking a look at where this heads now and a new battle that will begin today.

ROBERTS: And it was one vote for one Republican that gave Democrats a symbolic win. A win that now makes them able to claim a small shred of bipartisan support in the make or break health care battle. So why did Republican Senator Olympia Snowe of Maine vote with the Democrats? We're live in Washington.

And a white supermodel posing in black face for a photo spread in "Vogue" French magazine. Is it high fashion or just highly offensive? Is blackface ever OK?

Jason Carroll digging deeper on those questions.

ROBERTS: We begin this morning with a major hurdle cleared in the critical health care debate after months of back and forth, dozens of hearings and more than $120 million in television advertising.

The Senate Finance Committee approved a broad bill to remake the nation's health care system, but the fight is far from over. In fact, if you thought the debate was intense this summer, you haven't seen anything yet.

We're all over this developing story this morning. Jim Acosta is live in Washington with a look at the wild card in this debate. The only Republican to support the plan, if you don't know her name yet, you certainly will. But we begin with Brianna Keilar and a look where the health care debate goes from here.

Hi, Brianna. BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, John. Well, the next debate actually begins today with combining this more conservative Senate Finance Committee bill which does not have a public option with a more liberal bill that came out of the Senate Health Committee back in July.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR (voice-over): With millions of eyes around the country watching, the call came down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fourteen ayes, nine nays.

SEN. MAX BAUCUS (D-MT), SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: The ayes have it.

KEILAR: The Senate Finance Committee's hotly debated plan for health care reform passed thanks to 13 Democrats and one lone Republican, Olympia Snowe of Maine.

SEN. OLYMPIA SNOWE (R), MAINE: Was this bill all that I would want? Is it all that it can be? No. But when history calls, history calls.

KEILAR: The plan has an $829 billion price tag. It prevents insurance companies from denying coverage based on pre-existing conditions and requires all Americans to have insurance. That would be done in part by expanding Medicaid and offering subsidies to people who can't afford it.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We are now closer than ever before to passing health reform, but we're not there yet. Now's not the time to pat ourselves on the back. Now's not the time to offer ourselves congratulations. Now is the time to dig in and work even harder to get this done.

KEILAR: And the road to getting health care done is still long and winding. The first hurdle, a government-run insurance plan. The so-called public option isn't in the finance committee's bill, but it is in another Senate proposal. Those plans now have to be blended together and lawmakers remain divided.

Another big sticking point, paying for reform by taxing high-end private insurance plan. Critics of that idea are already sounding off, including labor unions. Many of them gave up pay increases to get better health care in the first place. And this morning less than 24 hours after the finance committee's vote, their opposition is in black and white in the morning papers.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: And a full-page ad, in fact, as you can see. This is from "The Washington Post" what you just saw in close-up there on your screen. And unions, 28 of them here, in fact, key constituents for those Senate Democrats who are negotiating this next phase of health care reform in the Senate. And, John, sources tell me we likely won't see a vote on this Senate bill once these bills are combined until the week of October 26th, the week after this next one.

ROBERTS: And, of course that just begins the next process after that as well. Right?

KEILAR: Exactly. And everything is going on in the House in parallel at this point. So once the Senate votes on its bill, the House votes on its bill. You know, they have to smoosh their bills together as well, and then have the final vote which would end up on President Obama's desk.

ROBERTS: And all that time, the lobbying will continue. Brianna Keilar for us this morning. Brianna, thanks.

CHETRY: Well, with Democrats in control no one really question whether the bill would actually win the committee's support. But what was in doubt, the vote of Maine's Republican senator, Olympia Snowe.

CNN's Jim Acosta is live in Washington with more on Senator Snowe. And, you know, she really kept everyone guessing up until the very end. She was certainly the "it" senator yesterday.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is absolutely right, Kiran, and she remains that senator for some time to come. You know, Senator Olympia Snowe's vote on the finance committee's crucial health care bill ended a Washington guessing game that went on for weeks. But in the end, she sided with the president. A vote her party won't soon forget.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA (voice-over): The day started with a 50/50 chance of Olympia Snowe.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you going to sign this?

SENATOR OLYMPIA SNOWE (R), MAINE: What? (INAUDIBLE) I'm always evaluating it.

ACOSTA: Calls were once again flooding her office with questions pouring in asking how the Maine Republican would come down on the Senate Finance Committee's version of health care reform. Even her committee colleagues were waiting in suspense.

SENATOR TOM CARPER (D), DELAWARE: It's a question on a lot of people's minds. Senator Snowe is a great, thoughtful and deliberate legislator.

ACOSTA: The wait finally ended.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ms. Snowe?

Ms. Snowe, aye.

ACOSTA: Snowe who had voted to pass President Obama's stimulus bill again gave the White House a crucial victory.

SNOWE: When history calls, history calls. And I happen to think that the consequences of inaction dictate the urgency of Congress to take every opportunity to demonstrate its capacity to solve the monumental issues of our time.

ACOSTA: In doing so, she defined a party that's fought the White House agenda at nearly every turn.

SENATOR ORRIN HATCH (R), UTAH: It's going to be an arm and leg of everybody and it isn't going to be better health care in the process.

ACOSTA: The risks for Snowe were not lost on the president.

OBAMA: And I want to particularly thank Senator Olympia Snowe for both the political courage and the seriousness of purpose that she's demonstrated throughout this process.

ACOSTA (on camera): What made you decide to cast the vote the way you did?

(voice-over): Contrary to her GOP colleagues, Snowe told us she voted to lower health care costs.

This will lower costs for consumers? That's your view?

SNOWE: It is. Absolutely. Ultimately, we want to make sure that that is the case, and making sure it's affordable at the outset.

ACOSTA: Her staff knows the senator has a history of fierce independence that extends outside the world of Washington. Orphaned as child, Snowe's first husband died in a car accident, experiences that made her self-reliant. To reaffirm that independent streak, she told us her support for the final health care legislation is anything but a sure thing.

(on camera): And it's still not clear how you're going to vote in the end? You made that clear today?

SNOWE: That's correct. Yes, because a lot of changes could along the way. I think that everybody shares that, you know, trepidation and concern about how it materializes and unfolds.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: So, she will keep everybody guessing for now. Even though Democrats did not need her vote to pass the bill through the finance committee, Snowe's support was historic becoming the first Republican to back Democratic efforts for health care reform. Snowe has signed on to a bill that has advanced this initiative past where President Clinton had his health initiative killed back in the '90s, Kiran.

CHETRY: All right. It is a major hurdle as we've said, but there's no guarantees that she's going to stay onboard as this moves through as we said?

ACOSTA: No, Kiran. That's right. Yes.

She said yesterday if there's a public option in this bill she is likely not to vote for it unless it's that so-called trigger she has talked about for many months. So that is why it is going to be very interesting to watch this next process, how the Senate majority leader merges the two bills in the Senate and how that public option will take shape, Kiran.

CHETRY: Yes, and how do you juggle all of the competing goals of what a lot of different constituents have? So we're going to talk to her about it actually.

Jim Acosta for us, thanks.

She's going to be joining us at 7:30 Eastern Time. Senator Olympia Snowe will join us live, and we'll ask her why she supported this bill when all of her Republican colleagues did not.

ROBERTS: Seven minutes now after the hour. And also new this morning, they are bracing for the worst in parts of Southern California. Right now, a powerful storm threatening to unleash dangerous flooding and mudslides in areas that were ravaged by wildfires over the summer.

The storm is expected to dump three to six inches of rain. Flash flood watches are in effect in and around Los Angeles County. People stacked sandbags and heavy concrete barriers against hillsides to try to keep the earth in place.

CHETRY: A new study shows more than 25 percent of people who ended up in the hospital with swine flu also have had asthma. Federal officials say it surely don't even know if there was a direct link because many people admitted for H1N1 had nothing else wrong with them. The government is also ready to back a clinical trial trying to find the best way to safely give people with asthma the swine flu vaccine.

ROBERTS: And a 500-year old fingerprint points to a genuine Da Vinci portrait. The painting was thought to be a German work from the early 19th century, but Da Vinci scholars are convinced that it is the work of the renaissance master because it appears to have his fingerprint on it.

The painting sold twice in recent years for less than $20,000. If it turns out to be a Da Vinci, it will be worth a lot more than that because the price tag for a Da Vinci, about $175 million.

CHETRY: All because of one little fingerprint.

ROBERTS: All because of one little fingerprint.

CHETRY: Well, we're going to talk more about the president meeting again with the National Security team on Afghanistan, but is this administration any closer to deciding strategy troop levels? We're going to talk more about it in a minute.

It's nine minutes after the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROBERTS: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. The Environmental Protection Agency releasing an e-mail that it sent to the Bush administration two years ago. In it the agency called for regulations on the release of six gases that it concluded were linked to global warming and dangerous to the public. The EPA officials who wrote the memo says the White House never opened it. The Bush administration rejected the findings.

CHETRY: Rush Limbaugh hitting back at critics who oppose his bid to buy a stake in the St. Louis Rams. The conservative talk show host is saying that he's a victim of "totally made-up and fabricated quotes attributed to him."

Meanwhile, the owner of the Indianapolis Colts says that he would vote against Limbaugh, and NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell says that Limbaugh's divisive comments would not be tolerated.

ROBERTS: And a bad economy good for the military, reporting its best recruiting year in more than 35 years. The Pentagon says it's the first time since the draft ended in 1973 after the Vietnam War that every branch of the military met its annual recruiting goals. Military leaders credit higher pay and bonuses and a lack of jobs out there in the private sector for the spike in enlistments.

CHETRY: No matter how many troops the president sends to Afghanistan there is still a high risk of failure. That's the sobering assessment from the military's -- president's military commander.

General Stanley McChrystal's request for more troops has been kept under wraps, but the Associated Press is reporting it contains a gloomy view of our prospects for victory in Afghanistan. General McChrystal expressing concerns to the president about rampant corruption in the Afghan government that could ultimately derail efforts to defeat the Taliban and al Qaeda.

And the president will meet again today with his National Security team. Suzanne Malveaux is live at the White House.

And, Suzanne, we've seen several of these meetings now. Any idea what the focus will be today?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Sure, Kiran. This is the fifth meeting with his war council. Before what we saw was a full assessment of the security situation in Afghanistan and Pakistan, the quality of the Afghan government, even taking stock of how people live in Afghanistan. Do they fall prey to the Taliban? Are they actually vulnerable to terrorists? That kind of thing.

What we're going to hear today, what they're going to be discussing is obviously resources. We're talking about troop levels, and the president also at the same time wants to make it very clear that the goal has remained consistent. It is about diminishing, dismantling al Qaeda, al Qaeda's ability to plot out these terror attacks against the United States and at the same time he is saying that there are resources that have to be parceled out for different components to meeting that goal.

I want to take a listen to how he explained it yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The military security that's provided in our ability to train Afghan forces is one element of it. Another element of it is making sure that we are doing a good job in helping build capacity on the civilian side, in areas like agriculture, and education. And I would expect that we will have a -- a completion of this current process in the coming weeks.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: So, Kiran, what is he talking about when he says the coming weeks? Obviously a very important meeting today here at the White House. Meeting number six is going to happen next week. There will be a real deliberate process, the debate that is taking place. And in the coming weeks, weeks, not months, he'll make those decisions about those troop levels -- Kiran.

CHETRY: Suzanne Malveaux for us this morning at the White House. Thanks.

ROBERTS: The SIG TARP is going to be back in the spotlight again today. I love that.

CHETRY: The special inspector general about the...

ROBERTS: Troubled...

CHETRY: Troubled Asset Relief Program.

ROBERTS: Relief Program, yes. And he's going to be talking about AIG bonuses. There's still millions and millions of dollars to be paid out.

Our Christine Romans takes a look at a new report from the SIG TARP coming up.

It's 15 minutes after the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHETRY: Perfect song.

ROBERTS: Apropos choice of music this morning. Christine Romans here - is here this morning, "Minding Your Business" and Neil Barofsky's going to be back up on Capitol Hill today, talking about AIG and bonuses, and the money just keeps on rolling on.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: It does, you know...

ROBERTS: (INAUDIBLE) the training.

ROMANS: And he says that, you know, Treasury made some mistakes that should have been onboard and known what was going on with the AIG bonuses earlier and that, he says - you know, Barofsky, who was the - the TARP watchdog, the bailout watchdog, he basically says that the Obama administration is going to try to rein in the bonuses that still need to be paid off.

Oh, yes! There still are millions and millions and millions of dollars that are destined to go to AIG executives, some of them in this division - this - Financial Products (ph) Division that helped bring down the global economy. Two hundred thirty-seven million has been paid out. Of it, $19 million has been paid back to AIG. By the end the year, $40 or $45 million supposed to be paid back and - and $19 has come back so far. This is from people who got $100,000 and more bonuses. Forty million will not be paid at all and $198 million is still owed to people at AIG - $198 million in bonuses still owed to people at AIG, and it sounds as though the Obama administration is going to try to rein that back. Not all that's going to be paid out.

So that's what, you know, Barofsky's saying in his report this morning.

CHETRY: We just have to sit back and watch it, right?

ROMANS: And look, this has been going on how long? We've been - people have been screaming about this since March, and it still is not resolved. It still is not resolved. So Treasury, in its response to - the Treasury Department's response to this criticism from, you know, Barofsky and the - and the watchdog say that they are, you know, that they're looking at making some changes so that they - that they are better communicating this sort of stuff, but, you know, we still haven't - and...

CHETRY: Meanwhile, if you work in Wall Street - if you work in Wall Street, it's like last year didn't happen, right?

ROMANS: Yes. If you still have your job in Wall Street. Ten of thousands don't work there anymore.

CHETRY: But you're talking about them - you're showing us this page of bonus breakdowns, and it's as if we didn't almost go off the ledge.

ROMANS: Yes. OK. So that brings me to my "Romans' Numeral" which you're all going to love - $143,400. This is supposed to be the average - according to "The Wall Street Journal's" projections, the average projected pay and benefits on Wall Street this year. That's up $2,000 from 2007. That would be a new record. And when you look at some of the...

ROBERTS: And that's the average across all of the investment houses, right? But when you break it down, this graph that you've got here, some of the investment houses, they're doing it a little better than some of the others.

ROMANS: Blackstone, $4 million average pay. Goldman Sachs, $743,000 average pay. JPMorgan Chase, $133,000 average pay. It's - it's - it's remarkable. You're right. It's as if last year didn't happen. If you still have your job - it's been a great year, I mean, for some of the businesses that these guys are in, it's been a very, very good year. Stock market's up strongly, you have the government basically back stopping (ph) every kind of risk you could possibly take. All of the government support in the markets.

So, yes, we'll be seeing - we'll be seeing if not record pay, pretty darn close to it on Wall Street this year.

CHETRY: There's a lot of talk - and this is just one thing that is a total disconnect - a lot of talk about understanding what the average person was going through. I mean, that's what everybody was saying in the government when this was all happening, and it seems like we're back to people at home saying I'm struggling. I can't pay my bills. I'm in record debt and there's a party going on in the financial markets. How is - how does that square?

ROMANS: A lot of people - a lot of people lost their jobs. I think in all of finance, more than 200,000 people lost their jobs over the past few years, and that's, you know, people on the top end, that's people on the low end of the line, but...

ROBERTS: Those who survived, though, are doing pretty well.

ROMANS: Those who survived are doing pretty well, and if there's been a comeback this year, a real comeback this year, and that's - that's just the way it is.

ROBERTS: Christine Romans, "Minding Your Business" this morning and depressing all of us.

CHETRY: Well, we still have room to be talking about something that's quite controversial. Have you seen the cover of French "Vogue"? If not, it features a Caucasian model dressed in blackface and some are now saying that this is not fashion-forward, this is just plain racism. Our Jason Carroll is exploring.

Twenty-two minutes after the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROBERTS: Twenty-five minutes after the hour. Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning.

French "Vogue" magazine is famous for pushing the fashion envelope. A photo spread in this month's edition, though, has triggered outrage in Europe and the United States over a white model posing in blackface.

CHETRY: Some are asking is this high fashion or is it just highly offensive? Our Jason Carroll is following the blackface controversy which just extends beyond the fashion world right now. Good morning, Jason.

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. You know, a lot of folks scratching their heads on this one because when they look at French "Vogue" they think of a place where historically black women were honored, really, even before American "Vogue", so a lot of people wondering what's going on here.

But, you know, when you look at the larger issue, the image of blackface has for the most part not been used in the mainstream media here in the United States for years. But that case is not what is happening internationally.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CARROLL (voice-over): The imagery, an embarrassing chapter in American entertainment - blackface. Popularized decades ago in minstrel shows and movies, like 1927's "The Jazz Singer" but not a relic of the past.

Pictures from French "Vogue's" latest edition showing a white Dutch model in blackface and body paint, wearing ethnic-inspired clothes. Editors may say it's high fashion, but it was something far more offensive to most of those we showed it to.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think anybody in this day and age splatters black paint on a white face and expects, you know, everybody to just be OK with it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They think they're pushing the envelope, but, really, they're just being offensive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's clearly for fashion. You know, it's - it's not made for any political purpose.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I mean, I think there are a lot of beautiful black women who could have probably played that role.

CARROLL: French "Vogue" did not return our calls for comment. Critics say, without context, readers are left to assume the worst.

CHARLTON MCILWAIN, NYU PROFESSOR, RACE AND MEDIA: What you see simply is another white performer being dressed up in blackface for the amusement, for the profit of whites.

CARROLL: The issue, coming a week after a popular Australian talent show ran into trouble for this. American judge Harry Connick Jr. criticized the group's depiction of the Jackson 5. The show's host later apologized

HARRY CONNICK, JR., MUSICIAN: You. know, we've spent so much time trying to not make black people look like buffoons, that when we see something like that, we take it really to heart.

CARROLL: Outside the United States, it's not just Australia where blackface is still entertainment. In Japan, a popular soul group called Gosperats sells out shows. In Mexico an offensive- looking comic book character ended up one of the country's national stamps in 2005. Despite criticism from the White House, the stamp was never pulled.

MICHAELA ANGELA DAVIS, BET CONTRIBUTOR: While we've come a long way, baby, baby, we had a long way to come from, and we still have a long way to go in terms of our global image.

CARROLL: Pop culture experts say other countries may not have experienced civil rights movements and national conversations about race the way America has and therefore may not have the same sensitivities. So, it might be a while before blackface finally fades from the limelight.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CARROLL (on camera): Well, that issue of French "Vogue" was supposed to celebrate supermodels that featured names like Kate Moss and Claudia Schiffer, no black supermodels made their cut.

ROBERTS: Really?

CARROLL: Really.

ROBERTS: How (ph)?

CARROLL: You know, that's a question for French "Vogue" and, you know, it's interesting, because when you look at those who put this issue together, there are some people who are out there who are saying, you know, what was the artistic point you were trying to make? You know, share it with us and maybe, perhaps, if they had done something like that, there would have been a little bit more understanding, but, you know...

CHETRY: You know, (INAUDIBLE) social commentary is attached, it maybe makes it a little bit different. But, you know, they're also getting a lot of attention for this right now and they love to do that.

CARROLL: Right, but is this the kind of attention you want, and at what cost?

CHETRY: Yes. Jason Carroll, we want to know what other people think about it as well. Jason, thanks so much.

Is blackface ever OK? We'd like to have you weigh in on our blog, cnn.com/amfix.

Right now we're coming up on half past the hour. We check our top stories this morning. It is safe to say that the hard part starts today now that the Senate's Finance Committee has passed its health care reform bill. But one Republican vote, the two Senate bills and then the three House bills have to be combined to produce one bill that can pass both Houses. Right now there are two key sticking points, government provided insurance, the so-called public option which four of the five bills contain and also, of course, how to pay for it all.

ROBERTS: The Supreme Court has decided to hear an appeal by the disgraced former CEO of Enron, the energy giant that collapsed back in 2001. Jeffrey Skilling was convicted in 2006 on conspiracy and wire insecurities fraud. He is currently serving a 24-year sentence. Skilling claims he could not get a fair trial in Houston after Enron failed and that the government misused a fraud statute against him. The justices will hear the case early next year.

CHETRY: Right now, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is in Russia. She's visiting a Muslim-dominated area east of Moscow. Earlier this morning she met with students at the University of Moscow and during her trip, Secretary Clinton held closed door meetings with Russian officials over Iran's nuclear program. She's going to be heading back to Washington later this afternoon.

ROBERTS: And as the secretary of state wraps up her trip, there's been a lot of talk inside the Beltway about her role at the State Department. When asked by NBC News this week if the White House has marginalized her, Secretary Clinton called that notion, quote, "absurd."

And our next guest says finally free from presidential politics, Hillary Clinton has been able to hit her reset button.

Let's bring in editor-in-chief and co-founder of the "Daily Beast." Tina Brown is with us this morning.

Good morning, Tina.

TINA BROWN, CO-FOUNDER, THEDAILYBEAST.COM: Good morning, John.

ROBERTS: So just three months ago back in July you wrote a piece in the "Daily News" in which you called for President Obama to let Hillary Clinton to take off her burqa. That whole thing didn't go over too well with people close to Hillary Clinton. You suggested she was becoming the invisible woman at the State Department.

What changed since then?

BROWN: Well, it's very interesting to see that, in fact, she does seem to have taken off the burqa and she's out there right now being a real face for this administration and doing very, you know, important things for Obama.

I do think there was a rocky patch for her in the State Department in the terms of allowing her to have the kind of breathing room to express what she can do and that has changed.

Really as Obama has become more and more comfortable with her extraordinary ability to be such a high-level team player, because Hillary really is right now bearing a lot of load. She is very useful to the president because of her star power. You know, in Ireland, she went this week and helped to shore up the peace process. She's been in Russia. He knows confidently that she's going to be able to represent this administration with all of the heft that she brings to it and also with her extraordinary forensic mind for detail.

ROBERTS: In about the time you wrote that piece back in July, she had also broken her elbow. So she was playing hurt as well and that eclipsed her travels easily.

BROWN: Sure. She had a rough time.

ROBERTS: Let me just pull a quote from the piece that you wrote about her this week. You said, quote, "Perhaps losing your life's dream or being freed from it, depending on how you look at it, pushes the reset button like nothing else. After some rocky moments Hillary seems to have found in the heart of her chief rival's administration an unexpected comfort level. The static around her has evaporated. She communicates a deep lack of insecurity."

She feels very secure about her role and she was -- when she was talking with Ann Curry on NBC, she said I don't know. Maybe it's a woman thing. I don't need to be in the spotlight. Now she had sort of shunned any talk of gender issues but now seems to be embracing her womanhood.

BROWN: I actually think that this is really why she's doing so well right now. You know, during the campaign Mark Penn wrote a famous strategy memo which urged her to put aside any kind of idea of herself in the candidacy as, you know, I am a woman and not -- and to become very much a kind of guy, you know, sort of out there being, sort of the iron -- like Mrs. Thatcher was referred to as the iron lady.

Be the commander in chief, he said. Not the sort of warm, fuzzy woman, you know, which of course our men tend to stereotype. Of course, Hillary's never going to be that. But what she has been able to do I think in this administration is show how the collaboration skills of women are very good.

You know they don't have to be the ones sort of flashing the male ego, competing in that sort of particular one-on-one confrontational way. She can hold her own in any situation intellectually. But she can also sit back at times and let the big boys' ego clash. While she really gets on with the big work that she's doing.

She's always been very good at that, Hillary, and she's showing really how mature she is about not always have be to be the one who grabs the limelight. Like she said, I don't have to return around having my face in the paper every day. She's had enough publicity to last her forever.

ROBERTS: Three of the last four secretaries of state have been women as to the point where Madeleine Albright told me the other day that her granddaughter said, her 7-year-old granddaughter said, you know, all secretaries are women, right? How...

BROWN: It's so great. ROBERTS: How is she different from the other two?

BROWN: Well, for starter, Hillary brings this immense background in the White House. She has relationships all over the world anyway. When she goes to Northern Ireland, you know, she played a big role in that peace process with Bill, and they were constantly in Ireland. And she was very much a sounding board for him during that whole process.

So she has this background, anyway, relationships all over the world and also at this point she's immensely experienced. You know she has had years in the Senate. She's got these relationships in Washington that are deep. She has intellectual relationships. She has State Department relationships.

She has -- she's just got a lot to offer and bring to the table. At a certain point, the president has so many things on his plate. He's now loving the fact that she's her own sort of center of charisma.

ROBERTS: And she's dealt with the Bill factor as well. Let me pull a quip from what you wrote. She said, quote, "She's got Bill under control at last. From the moment she entered Foggy Bottom, he's been as good as gold. The big dog's in his kennel and she's holding the leash."

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: Sure. It's actually great for Hillary right now. I mean she has never more secure all across the board because Bill really can't make a move without asking permission.

You know it used -- you know, before he was all over the world, doing -- and he still travels a lot but he is very much somebody at the moment who is subjugated a lot of his own activities in order to let her have the limelight, in order to let her play the role of State Department, not be a kind of rogue foreign secretary of state running around.

ROBERTS: She also said she doesn't want to run for president again. Now she couldn't really -- would be bad political form to do it in 2012 if Barack Obama decides to seek re-election. She could do it again in 2016. She'd be 68 years old, a year younger than Ronald Reagan once when he first ran. So well within the age range of being able to do it and there's a lot of time between now and 2016. Should we really rule it out?

BROWN: I don't think anybody seriously rules that out with Hillary Clinton. I think she might right now feeling, looking at her very long brutal days that she's working. Think to herself, wouldn't it be great at some point if I'm over that particular...

ROBERTS: Just sit or read a book. Yes.

BROWN: But you know, she could also become -- in a second Obama administration, she could wind up as vice president if Biden didn't want to stay.

ROBERTS: Yes.

BROWN: And that would mean that she was extremely well placed for 2016. That's the obvious Democratic candidate heir to Barack Obama.

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: But let's not rule that out.

ROBERTS: Nobody wants to let the idea go. Tina Brown, great to see you this morning. Thanks for stopping by.

BROWN: Thank you.

ROBERTS: All right.

CHETRY: All right. Well, still ahead, there's a program -- I mean everybody knows that when you're addicted to heroin, it can be one of those devastating things. Very, very difficult to overcome and get back to your life.

They use methadone and other ways to try to help heroin addicts but there was a new program under way in Britain right now treating heroin addicts with heroin. Does it work? Paul Newton live in London.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHETRY: Thirty-nine minutes past the hour. Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning.

Heroin is one of the most dangerous drugs available, and getting clean is notoriously tough. Right now in England there is a controversial program that's underway to treat addiction. It's one that gives heroin to heroin addicts at the taxpayers' expense.

Our Paula Newton is live in London and -- with more on this. And when I first read about this, I find it fascinating. We know about methadone clinics over the year, but how does this program help or make a dent in this horrible addiction?

PAUL NEWTON, INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: The point is here, Kiran, is that it takes heroin off the streets. Now that means that the government is actually the drug dealer of choice. What's hard to ignore at this point, though, Kiran, are the results. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NEWTON (voice-over): This is heroin.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look for the right syringe for the right client.

NEWTON: Ninety-seven percent pure better than anything sold on the street.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just place it (INAUDIBLE). That's it.

NEWTON: And the British government is giving it to addicts for free in an effort to make them drug-free.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So this is pure stuff. This is clinical stuff. This is a clinical procedure and this is medication.

NEWTON: A safe, steady supply of heroin is apparently just what the doctor ordered. A recent study suggests it's working. Reducing the use of street heroin by three quarters and the crimes committed in trying to get that drug, by two-thirds.

For Sarah, a steady fix of heroin dispensed at a safe clinic with wrap-around support has worked where nothing else has.

SARAH, DRUG THERAPY CLIENT: You'll always be an addict, basically. It's about managing it and leading a positive life.

NEWTON: After 20 years, the morality of it was stripped bare for addiction distilled to its physical essence.

SARAH: It quite quickly became, well, I do want to stop actually. I don't really want to. I have to stick needles in me for the rest of my life.

NEWTON (on camera): It seems to be that taking heroin off the streets is making a difference. Treating it like any other dangerous but necessary drug and then matching that with intensive therapy and counseling.

JOHN STRANG, KING'S HEALTH PARTNERS: The intensity of the program is quite striking. The bond formed and the commitment that's established between the patient coming in for treatment and the staff is far greater than you'd ever ordinarily see.

NEWTON: Mr. Strang says the key seems to be treating heroin addiction like any other illness. Having the patience to see the treatment through. Even if that means the government is the drug dealer of choice for months, if not years.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NEWTON: You know, the jury is still out on this study as to what it actually does to get people off heroin permanently and get cleaned. The results on that, though, too, Kiran, encouraging.

Something to think about here. This program costs a lot. $22,000 a year but keeping a person in prison here in this country costs almost three times that much.

CHETRY: Yes, and you mentioned, you know, they're still trying to figure out whether long-term they can eventually lead these people to being clean and sober. Proven over the years to be very difficult particularly with heroin. Has this helped in that way at all? NEWTON: It has. You know the person I just spoke to, Sarah, she now is on oral treatment. She's no longer injecting heroin with the government or otherwise, and she feels that after 20 years she can finally get her family back.

She's a mother of four. This is the first time, Kiran, she has seen the light at the end the tunnel. Again, this is anecdotal so far, but as radical as it is, for some it is really working.

CHETRY: Wow. Fascinating. Paula Newton in London for us this morning. Thank you. John?

ROBERTS: Big storms moving into the west coast in this nation. There are evacuation orders out. People are watching out for mudslides and potential coastal erosion. Our Rob Marciano is tracking all of it. He'll have the very latest for us coming right up. It's 43 minutes after the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHETRY: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. A pretty shot this morning in New York City at 46 minutes past the hour. It is 43 degrees. We all feel that winter's coming a little early around here. Can be 54 for a high today and mostly sunny in the Big Apple.

ROBERTS: Look at that. A UFO moving through the screen where the Empire State Building. Rob Marciano is tracking the extreme weather across the country. He is at weather center in Atlanta. We're looking at the West Coast today, which is in for some real problems, Rob?

ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yeah. It started yesterday, and they got a lot of heavy rain and heavy winds. Power knocked out for a lot of folks across much of California from Northern California to Southern California as well and winds on top of the rainfall. They got some of the numbers, Kentfield, California. There are 24-hour number just over a half of foot. Fairfield, California 4.69, Napa 3.5, and over that San Francisco and Sacramento also seeing record amounts of rainfall today.

This is what it looked like yesterday across the bay area. Obviously, people just kind of getting through town, but it was outside of town, really, where most of the damage has been done. The Santa Cruz Mountain specifically is where we've seen most of the rainfall, and in many cases, evacuation orders for Watsonville and near the Santa Cruz Mountains where there was a slide.

So, they're watching for potential slides today, and that's going to be the main concern, I think. And just a few minutes ago, another flash flood warning posted for Fresno County, Central Fresno County until 9:00 local time for rainfall amounts that have exceed in some cases, the USDS limits for potentially land moving. Basically, when the USDS has these limits and said "hey", you know, they got a certain amount of rainfall over the burn areas over the past couple of years.

Without that vegetation, that land is going to move. We certainly have seen that. I think most of the rainfall today going forward will be up into the Sierras and also the Santa Barbara Mountains, Santa Barbara just North of Los Angeles. That's where there also is concern for flash flooding.

And then also across the South, guys, Atlanta seeing more rain potentially flooding there into parts of South Carolina. And the northeast looks pretty nice today. So enjoy that.

ROBERTS: They're just right in the middle of the grape harvest there in the Napa Valley too. Aren't they?

MARCIANO: They are, and if there is a signature, an early season signature for El Nino, it will be this storm and also what's going on across the Southeast.

CHETRY: If we paid (ph) anyone to taste test just to make sure it's all going fine.

MARCIANO: That's a good point.

ROBERTS: May want to fix that story.

CHETRY: All right. Rob, thank you.

You know, how many times have you been splashed by a car driving by in the rain and a big puddle? These people taped what they were doing. Making huge splashes on school kids waiting at the bus stop. Now, they could be in legal trouble because of it. Jeanne Moos explains. Forty-eight minutes past the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHETRY: Fifty-one minutes past the hour. Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. This video is making quite a big splash on YouTube. It shows a car driving into a humongous puddle, and it gives a group of school kids quite a soaking. The driver could now be in legal hot water after they posted on YouTube. Here's Jeanne Moos.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know how kids like to play in puddles? Well, driving through a puddle has left a 29- year-old British motorist in a legal muddle.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's mean.

MOOS: Kerry Callard and her boyfriend seen here on her Facebook page where in their car, she was driving, he was in the passenger seat providing colorful commentary.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here we go. Ready to drench the kids. Look, look for hale bus stop coming up.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's not funny?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here we go. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, goodness.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here we go.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Juvenile.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up kids at the bottom of the hill.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's not very nice.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on, come on. Yes! That was brilliant! Awesome!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh I hope they got their thrill, a foolish thrill.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Rude and dumb.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dumb is what I agree with.

MOOS: The couple's problems started when they put the video on YouTube and several people complained to police. The driver explained that the kids had called out to them asking to be splashed. So, the couple made this their second pass.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up kids, at the bottom of the hill.

MOOS: The driver told the local paper "The Herald," "If the kids weren't saying splash me, splash me, I certainly wouldn't have done it. I'm not a serial splasher." In slow motion, the kids seemed to have their backs to the road as if expecting to be doused.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My kids would love it. The wetter the better.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'd do the same.

MOOS: You'd do the same? You mean you'd splash those kids?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah. Why not?

MOOS: Why not? Police say that driving through standing water could have caused the driver to lose control. They forwarded Kerry Callard's (ph) file to a prosecutor. In Britain, there's a law against driving without reasonable consideration, and splashing people is considered inconsiderate. There is a fine of up to $1500. There are accidental splashings and deliberately mean ones.

This one really caused a splash.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were these kids dirty or what? Did they need a bath?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on! Come on! Yeah!

MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was brilliant.

MOOS: New York.

CHETRY: Be careful what you post on YouTube.

ROBERTS: Can I just say something?

CHETRY: Yes.

ROBERTS: Can I take a -- my journalist hat, and just play, render an opinion here?

CHETRY: Yes.

ROBERTS: Because there are no end to the level, the increasing, the exponentially increasing level of stupidity in this world. Seriously.

CHETRY: How much time do you have?

ROBERTS: Unfortunately not enough. Just say we got to go.

It's 54 minutes after the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROBERTS: Go back to the Most News in the Morning. U.S. relations with Cuba thawed just a little bit. You might think that information will begin to flow more freely from the time at this country. One woman who created a popular blog is trying to do just that. So, why does the government want to shut her down? Our Shasta Darlington found the blocked blogger who says, "The blog must go on."

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, John and Kiran. There's been a lot of talk lately about America restricting travel to Cuba, but we've talked to a woman who wants to fly to New York and has been barred by Cuba from leaving.

Armed with a laptop and a flash drive, Cuban blogger, Yuwani Sanchez (ph), is breaking down barriers. Her feisty and often courageous blog Generacion Y gets more than a million hits from around the globe every month.

YUWANI SANCHEZ (ph), BLOGGER: I think the goal is to express myself, and that expression is the biggest hammer against the wall.

DARLINGTON: Last year, "Time" magazine named her one the 100 most influential people in the world, but she does run up against obstacles. Cuba has blocked access to her blog. And this week, the government denied Sanchez permission to travel to New York to receive a journalism prize from Columbia University.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's very unfortunate, unfortunate for her, because she deserves to be recognized, but also unfortunate for the world, because it's freedom of the press that's going to really give us the information we need to be able to think about the great issues of global society.

DARLINGTON: Sanchez isn't bitter.

SANCHEZ: I don't let things drive me crazy. I can't be at the ceremony, but I travel virtually every day. I'll celebrate it with friends.

DARLINGTON: Sanchez pens write commentaries on life in communist Cuba, shedding light on taboo topics like police harassment and the thriving black market. She is openly critical of the government. In one recent entry, she complains she can't find detergent in stores, despite warnings about the spread of swine flu.

Sanchez was a pioneer. Now, despite restricted access to Internet, there are dozens of independent Cuban bloggers. They send posts into cyberspace and use flash drives and CDs to share entries at home. Their voices resonate in the country where all mainstream media is controlled by the state.

SANCHEZ: The blogger phenomenon is they're pushing against the wall which isn't going to be brought down by kilowatts or posts, but it helps.

DARLINGTON: Sanchez writes her blog at home, saves it on a flash drive or laptop and then wanders Havana trying to get it into a cybercafe or hotel business center. One way or another, she gets her message out.

She told us she hasn't come under any direct pressure from the government to stop her blog, but she does believe that her phone is intercepted and that she's followed everywhere she goes. John, Kiran?

ROBERTS: Shasta Darlington for us this morning at Havana. Shasta, thanks so much.