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American Morning
Child's Comment Raises Questions About Balloon Incident; Dems Face Tough Fall; Medical Advances in Suspended Animation May Help Stave Off Death; Women Work More, Less Happy; Smoking Bans Increase Public Health; Smoking Bans & Heart Health; $123,000 in the Red; Bariatric Tourism
Aired October 16, 2009 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning once again. We're -- it's 8:00 Eastern right now. It's Friday, October 16th. I'm Carol Costello, in for Kiran Chetry this morning.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm John Roberts. Thanks for joining us on the Most News in the Morning.
Here are the big stories will be telling you about in the next 15 minutes here.
Millions of people were riveted, a 6-year-old Colorado boy missing and feared trapped in a homemade helium balloon thousands of feet in the air. Then the boy is found safe. He'd been hiding the whole time. But now, there are doubts about the entire story because of six words that the child said to our Wolf Blitzer last night.
COSTELLO: In Washington, the debate over health care heating up and Democrats not only fighting with fellow Democrats, they're also battling Republicans, unions, and lobbyists at almost every turn. So, just how ugly is this going to get? John King, host of CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION," will join us live.
ROBERTS: And rain, wind, even snow, some nasty and rather early winter weather is moving across the Northeast. There's still a threat of flooding along the coast as well and temperatures in some places -- listen to this -- 30 degrees below average.
Coming up: We head to the extreme weather center to check in with our Rob Marciano.
We begin the hour, though, with a 6-year-old boy who had the whole world riveted to their televisions and computers. And the statement that he made that has some people wondering if his whole ordeal was a hoax. A homemade helium balloon built by a storm-chasing dad flying thousands of feet in the air, a family fearing that little boy was trapped inside. Hours later, little Falcon Heene was found alive hiding in the attic.
Our Thelma Gutierrez is in Fort Collins, Colorado, this morning.
And this feel-good story took quite a turn last night because of something the little boy said to CNN's Wolf Blitzer. THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, exactly. In fact, when the parents had asked him why he didn't come out when he knew that everybody was looking for him, he said, because he was doing it for the show. And now, the parents are saying that perhaps the little boy was confused because there were many cameras right outside of his house as this whole ordeal was playing out and that he may have confused all the cameras for a show.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD HEENE, FALCON HEENE'S FATHER: Did you hear us calling your name at any time?
FALCON HEENE, "BALLOON BOY": Uh-huh.
R. HEENE: You did?
MAYUMI HEENE, FALCON'S MOTHER: You did?
R. HEENE: Then why didn't you come out?
F. HEENE: You guys said that we did this for a show.
R. HEENE: Yes.
GUTIERREZ (voice-over): It was that curious response from a fidgety Falcon Henne that went over like a lead balloon.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR, "SITUATION ROOM": What did he mean, we did this for the show?
R. HEENE: Let me interrupt this real quick because I think I see the direction you guys are hedging on this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTIERREZ (voice-over): Could it be that the Hennes staged the disappearance of their 6-year-old son for publicity. The family is not camera shy.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: This is my brother Ryo, Falcon, and my mom shooting the camera, and we're in the middle of hurricane Gustav.
GUTIERREZ: They're storm chasers appearing on TV many times before, frequently submitting iReports to CNN. They've also been on ABC's reality show "Wife Swap" twice.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
R. HEENE: Mayumi (INAUDIBLE) and really, really don't want to hear that.
(END VIDEO CLIP) GUTIERREZ: That background and Falcon's comment about doing it for a show had many CNN viewers questioning the integrity of the story on "ANDERSON COOPER 360" last night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR, "ANDERSON COOPER 360": I'm guessing 90 percent, 95 percent of the people think this is some sort of a hoax.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTIERREZ: Law enforcement officials say they have absolutely no reason to believe Falcon's ordeal was a publicity stunt.
SHERIFF JIM ALDEREN, LARIMER COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT: They were, besides themselves, was worried, and it was real obvious from their demeanor early on that they thought he was in the balloon.
GUTIERREZ: Still, the questions, the doubts clearly upset Falcon's father.
R. HEENE: I'm kind of appalled after all of the feelings that I went through, up and down, that you guys are trying to suggest something else.
We were on "Wife Swap" a couple of times. So the camera crews out there, I would imagine, they'd ask him a couple of questions and in reference to this, and I believe, you know, he meant something to do with that.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GUTIERREZ: And, John, the parents both say this has been a very long, draining experience for them. They say that when they found out that their son was fine, when he suddenly appeared in the room out of nowhere, they collapsed to their knees, completely relieved that their son was alive - John.
ROBERTS: You can imagine how they must have felt. Thelma Gutierrez for us in Fort Collins -- Thelma, thanks so much.
COSTELLO: And while local investigators insist there's no reason to believe Falcon Heene's ordeal was just a publicity stunt, they are confirming they will be talking to the Heene family again.
Just a short time ago, the Heenes appeared live here on AMERICAN MORNING. Richard Heene explained to John, his son, Falcon, may have been confused after reporters brought the child into the family's garage to show them the attic where he'd been hiding.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
R. HEENE: I ended up walking to the garage, open up the garage door, and Falcon's climbing in the joist, showing the media the garage door is wide open. And there was like 30 guys out there with cameras, showing -- somebody had ask him if he would show them how he got up for some TV show. So, he told me that that's what he was referring to when we were talking about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: You know, I just think we keep forgetting this kid's 6 years old.
ROBERTS: Yes. And how much can you really understand when you're 6 years old. As you said, they'd been involved in reality TV before.
COSTELLO: And he'd just gotten in trouble from his dad. He was hiding in the attic because he feared being punished. So the kid was scared. There are TV cameras all around him. And he's 6.
ROBERTS: Yes. Well, the great thing was that he wasn't in that balloon flying around the Colorado state.
COSTELLO: I know, because I know how I felt when I watched that thing land on national television.
ROBERTS: Yes.
COSTELLO: It was a scary moment.
ROBERTS: Well, the future or your health care. Lawmakers are meeting behind closed doors to try to hash all of that out. But so far, the plans are getting rip apart by not only both parties, but lobbyists and unions as well.
Joining me now is CNN's chief national correspondent and the anchor of "STATE OF THE UNION" on Sundays here on CNN, John King.
So, John, you've got five different bills out there that all have been to be reconciled to pass the respective houses of Congress. And then they got to be reconciled in a conference committee.
And with the millions of dollars flying around on all sides of this issue, how ugly is this likely to get in the coming weeks?
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it already is pretty ugly, John, as the Democrats debate internally about the public option, about just how to pay for this, about whether it's a surtax on "Cadillac" insurance plans or whether it's a surtax on the wealthy. So, it's pretty contentious and ugly right now, and it's only going to get more ugly because there is so much money being spent on all these television ads from the competing sides.
But the bottom line is this: this is exactly what the president wanted it. It's a little later than that he wanted it. But what he said was, "Let Congress run its course, let them write all this different legislation, then we'll get in a room and we'll fix it, and we'll get one bill to work on."
Can he get there? They're increasingly optimistic at the White House, but it is very messing.
ROBERTS: A lot of fighting as well just on the Democratic side over a public option, whether to have it, or whether not to have it. The Senate Finance Committee says no, the House committees and the health committee in the Senate say yes.
There's also fighting over -- interparty fighting over whether or not there should be a troop increase for Afghanistan. There's also the ethics probe of the Ways and Means Committee Chairman Charlie Rangel.
What kind of shape are the Democrats in in the fall of 2009, John?
KING: Leadership comes with great privileges and it also comes with great burdens -- meaning you're responsible for just about everything. And that is the situation the Democrats find themselves in, John. They have a president, they have both houses of Congress, they have a nearly 80-seat majority in the House and they have 58 or 60 votes if you count the two independents in the Senate.
So, if you travel the country, if you look at public opinion polling, the American people increasingly want them to get things done. And even members of their own party, even Democratic supporters, are increasingly frustrated. They say, "Where is the health care bill? Why don't you do a second stimulus package?"
On the other side, you have Republicans and independents saying, "Washington is spending too much money."
And you mentioned the other big question, Afghanistan. You know, the big political debate right now in Washington is health care, but the president's decision in the next couple of weeks on Afghan troops, he's getting pressure from the left. They say, at least no more troops. Some -- a few want a time line.
So, this president -- look, he was elected, he has said himself so many times, he believes there are more big challenges confronting the country and confronting its president than at any time at least in his lifetime and he has to deal with many of them. Between now and Christmas, we're going to learn a lot about our first-year president.
ROBERTS: And, John, here in Manhattan, it's earnings season, of course. We saw the earnings from JPMorgan Chase, Goldman Sachs posting more than $3 billion for the third quarter in earnings. Not the same on Main Street, though, a lot of people are still out there hurting. Many analysts believe that unemployment will top 10 percent.
So, you know, you've got people struggling, and at the same time, you're talking about record earnings on Wall Street, and people screaming, "Where is the regulation? What is Capitol Hill, what's the White House doing about all this?"
KING: And that disconnect, John, that you just outlined right there is a key factor in why, at least at the moment, next year looks so difficult for the Democrats. Now, the White House says this part isn't fair. They say, look, those banks are paying back the bailout money. The government is actually making a profit.
But if you travel Main Street, as you just said, unemployment, 9.5 percent, 15 percent in the state of Michigan, you got 13 percent in the state of Kentucky. When you go to these places, they say, "Wait a minute. Where's the stimulus money?"
Even though it might have helped their state, it might have kept firefighters on the job, it might have helped the economy a bit -- people don't feel it. Some of them say they're still having a hard time getting a refinancing done. How come Wall Street and the big banks are doing so well?
So, right now at least, and 13 months is a long time to election day, but there is a perception still that all that change the president promised hasn't really changed. And the well-to-do, the too-big-to-fail get the help and the little guy isn't.
Now, the White House insists that's not reality, but they have a very tough job ahead of them, as the Democrats do in the next six, eight, 10 months to try to reshape the political psyche, if you will, for next year's election. Otherwise, it's -- historically, it's a tough year for the Democrats. And if you travel the country right now, it looks like it will be.
ROBERTS: And who is joining you this Sunday, John?
KING: We'll have people who can answer the very questions you're raising. We're going to have the White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel with us at the top of the show, live in studio. He's a very busy man right now, deeply involved in those health care negotiations, deeply involved in the debate over Afghanistan.
We'll also have the Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman John Kerry, the Democratic senator from Massachusetts. He is in Afghanistan. He's there right now to get a sense, will there be a runoff. He's meeting with the generals to hear them say, they need more troops.
He is a key voice in Congress, a health care voice, too, but also on Afghanistan. Senator Kerry will join us on Sunday on "STATE OF THE UNION."
ROBERTS: Looking forward to it. John, thanks very much.
KING: Thank you.
ROBERTS: Don't miss the next generation in Sunday talk, "STATE OF THE UNION WITH JOHN KING," this and every Sunday beginning at 9:00 a.m. Eastern.
COSTELLO: Have you gone outside yet this morning?
ROBERTS: If you haven't -- well, depends on where you live. If you go outside in Miami, you'll be quite happy about this.
COSTELLO: Yes. But anywhere else, you probably won't be. It's snowing in the Midwest and parts of the Northeast. It's storming out west. What is going on?
Rob Marciano -- he's been working his fingers to the bone trying to figure this out. He'll tell us what he's figured out after the break.
It's 11 minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC)
COSTELLO: It's killing me too.
It's 37 degrees outside in New York City. And guess what, we're going to get showers later today. We're going to do to -- we're going to head up to 43 degrees. But I should not complain.
ROBERTS: The whole 43 degrees. So generous of you.
COSTELLO: We shouldn't complain because it's worse in other places.
Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. So, we've established it's cold here in New York.
ROBERTS: And windy.
COSTELLO: And windy.
ROBERTS: And raining.
COSTELLO: And gross. But take a look at this -- snow. It's snow in Upstate New York, Connecticut, Ohio, and New Jersey. It's the middle of October!
ROBERTS: Yes. It's a little early for snow, don't you think?
COSTELLO: I think so. Some places actually expect up to a foot of snow and temperatures 30 degrees below normal.
ROBERTS: Isn't that nice?
COSTELLO: No, it's not nice. Let's blame Rob.
ROBERTS: I feel like I'm back in Canada, Rob.
(LAUGHTER)
ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes, it's very Canadian. Leaves are still on the trees. That's what throws your mind into tizzy, you see these beautiful fall leaves changing color, but they're still on the trees, as opposed to be on the ground. And then you got snow covering those leaves.
So, yes, you're scratching your head. You should be. This is extremely unusual, especially for Pennsylvania, where snows are accumulating. Kind of a one-two punch, you'll get a pulse of moisture today, a bit of a break tonight, and then another round will come up with this area of low pressure. So, the hits will just keep on coming.
Check out the name of this town, Stormstown, Pennsylvania -- Isn't that appropriate, 4 inches of rainfall there. Very close to state college, p.a., where Penn State University is, has a huge meteorology program. So they're going to see the snow continue to pile up here. Cause look at the radar map - still seeing a big deal here as far as snow is concerned. And then you'll see more snow kind of wrap around throughout not only today
But as I mentioned, the next round of precip will come in through tonight and probably last through tomorrow morning -- 4 to 12 inches of snow possible. It's just going to shatter records. We have seen the snows -- the main records have been like 1.5 inch, we've already blown those out and this storm is not halfway over. Temperatures today, will yes, be very chilly -- 44 degrees in D.C., 4 in New York City. That is 20 to 25 in some cases -- 30 degrees below average -- so definitely chilly. And when you throw in that moisture, you'll see winds as well today, at the airports, it's going to be a bit of a nightmare as far as delays are concerned. New York metros, D.C., and Philly will see the brunt of those travel delays. Guys, enjoy your weekend.
CHETRY: Oh yea we will. But at least we're breaking records. That makes the misery so much easier to bare.
MARCIANO: If you're going to go, you might as well go big.
ROBERTS: Exactly, Rob, thanks so much.
Speaking of going big, remember it was a week ago that we were surprised to hear that President Obama had been given the Nobel Peace Prize. Well, a week later, Time magazine's Joe Klein has got some suggestions for the President on how he should approach this whole thing with the Nobel Peace Prize. He's coming up.
But right now, take a look at this. It's the most extraordinary video of the day, caught on tape at a train station in Melbourne, Australia. And we want to let you know here that everything turned out already, despite the fact that a baby just fell on to the train tracks and was ran over by a train.
CHETRY: Oh, God! That sounds so bizarre.
ROBERTS: Well, watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: But it's true.
ROBERTS: Off the edge of the platform, boom, down into the tracks. The train comes along. There's mom, her hand it looks like it actually gets smacked by the train there and then she goes into convulsions, you can imagine what was going through her mind. But what apparently happened was the baby held in tightly by the restraint in the seat there bumped his head, got pushed along by the train. Thankfully, it was at the end of the platform and wasn't going too much further. All the baby had was a bump on its head.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: I can just -- that's unbelievable. That's just sheer luck. I mean it's just sheer luck.
ROBERTS: Unbelievable.
CHETRY: Just sheer luck. Somebody was smiling upon those people in Australia.
ROBERTS: I think the baby was in god's hands. There's no question about that.
CHETRY: Absolutely.
ROBERTS: 17 minutes after the hour, Joe Klein coming up next stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: My little ear piece must be dead. So I'll just trudge on without it. Take a look at Washington, D.C. a light drizzle falling there and colder than normal there 42 degrees and there'll be some rain later. Highs only expected to be 44 degrees. Welcome back to the "most news in the morning." it's been a week now since the Nobel Prize winner was announced and you could hear the reporters gasp when it was announced it was President Obama.
ROBERTS: Yea because they weren't expecting it because nobody knew that he was even in the running. But critics blasted the win surprise, saying the President didn't deserve it, at least not yet. There's been a lot of pressure, and our next guest says it almost guarantees disappointment, for more. Let's bring in Time magazine columnist Joe Klein this morning. Morning Joe.
JOE KLEIN, COLUMNIST, "TIME" MAGAZINE: Hey John, how are you?
ROBERTS: Good. Let me read a little bit from your editorial here. You say, quote, "the Nobel Peace Prize, presented prospectively, a triumph of hope over inexperience threatens to become a central metaphor for Barack Obama's turbocharged political career". In what way do you think it's going to become a centerpiece?
KLEIN: Well I -- I think that he has a history now of being recognized for who he's not, George W. Bush, being celebrated for who he's not, and for who he might be, but not for anything that he's actually done. You know I think that his foreign policy has been a move absolutely in the right direction. And there are initiatives that may well be paying off, but they haven't paid off yet.
CHETRY: Could this be dangerous for him politically. This weird no man's land he occupies right now?
KLEIN: Sure. If you, if you, you know he could be the empty balloon.
(LAUGHTER)
CHETRY: This is very appropriate...
(CROSSTALK)
ROBERTS: You just had to go there.
KLEIN: But you know, if nothing -- if all of the -- none of this pans out, that's the danger. I happen to think that much of it may well pan out. I mean, there have been developments in the Iranian negotiations that are very positive. And there are other opportunities for him, especially in unlikely places like the Middle East.
CHETRY: But is one big success, won't that fix everything? I mean, if he has one humongous success, like with Iran?
KLEIN: I think that the general idea that we negotiate; that we do diplomacy rather than going in and sledge hammering people would be a tremendous success. I f he was able to bring that off. But in the Middle East, all of a sudden, he has an opportunity because under the radar, things are getting very good in the Palestinian areas of the West Bank. Security has improved enormously, because this U.S. General Keith Daten has trained a really good security force for the first time for those folks. Also, there's been cooperation between the Israelis and Palestinians on economic matters. The economy is growing at 7 percent in the West Bank. And so there are people like David Makosky, of one of the Washington think tanks, a big Israel supporter, who thinks you, can make a move now to establish real borders.
ROBERTS: But there's nothing to indicate that they're ready to do that. The meeting he had at the United Nations General Assembly was seen by many people as really as not much of anything to talk about.
KLEIN: Right. And on the surface, there's not all that much going on. But, there's the potential for things to go on. Because if he takes 5% -- you know, 80% of the Israeli settlers live on 5% of the West Bank. And Makosky believe ifs you do a 4% land swap, you give the Palestinians 4% land next to the West Bank and you take those settlements and make them part of Israel, Israel gets a real tangible asset. Which is something that Netanyahu always talks about. This is possible.
CHETRY: On the subject of Afghanistan, you know, the President wins the Nobel Peace Prize. Is there any pressure on him now, on what he eventually will decide to do in Afghanistan.
KLEIN: I don't think the Peace Prize has anything to do with Afghanistan.
CHETRY: It's just weird...
KLEIN: There were three big things that was something to do with Afghanistan. One is the Afghan elections. And what that foretells for that government.
CHETRY: Not looking good right now.
KLEIN: Number two, and this is very important, is the improved intelligence that we have on Al Qaeda which may make the war in Afghanistan less necessary.
And number three, cutting the other way, is the situation in Pakistan, which is getting very, very shaky and may really, you know, the Pakistanis need to know that we're going to stick around.
ROBERTS: Yea the same day that you penned your column on the Nobel Prize, Tom Brokaw, former NBC Anchor, who I'm beginning to sound a little like with this cold...
CHETRY: He does a great - he does the most fantastic impression.
ROBERTS: He did an op-ed as well, and which he said that when President Obama goes to Copenhagen that Copenhagen goes to Oslo to pick up to the award, he should bring with him an on-stage -
KLEIN: He's going to Copenhagen too.
ROBERT: Yea I know not the award. He should bring on stage with him a wide-ranging delegation which includes the Secretary of State, Admiral Mike Mullen, Chairman Chief of Staff Greg Mortonson, who wrote the great book "Three Cups of Tea," the International Rescue Committee, Refugees International Care, Bill and Melinda Gates and others, everyone who will participate in what the administration is going to do in the coming years. What do you think about that?
KLEIN: Well you know, I think that there are a lot of suggests like that going around. I mean, you know, military families, perhaps, since the U.S. military has made the world safer, a lot of people, American taxpayers, perhaps, because they funded this, you know, this American enterprise. I think that his initial take of humility, you know, with I am not worthy, I am not worthy, is the right thing. And what he needs to do is to celebrate our country, to take this as a celebration of our country and of the, you know, the standards and ideals that we represent in the world. Because we really do, I mean, I was in Iran during the elections. And it is no accident that the street demonstrations, the people started coming out into the streets, within 24 hours after Obama gave his Cairo speech, he really does represent hope in the world. And our country represents hope in the world, when we're at our best. And I think that's what he has to reflect in that speech.
ROBERTS: Joe, always great to see you. Thanks for coming in this morning.
KLEIN: Good to be here.
CHETRY: Thanks. Let's talk about women now. Isn't that your favorite subject?
ROBERTS: Oh, wow. CHETRY: I just like to taunt him, make his life a living hell. Anyway, studies show that women will soon outnumber men in the workforce. So soon, of course, women have always ruled the world, but now we have the facts to back us up.
ROBERTS: I'll hand it over to you. Let's see how you can do it.
CHETRY: Well I'm going to talk to two very smart ladies about what this means for our culture, for our society. It's 27 minutes after the hour.
ROBERTS: Looking forward to that. I'll just be doing the dishes.
(LAUGHTER)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Is there such a thing as life after death? A school bus driver who suffered a heart attack behind the wheel went without a pulse for almost an hour.
CHETRY: That's just amazing. She says she floated out of her body and she saw family members before she was brought back to life. Dr. Sanjay Gupta shows us the story of her near-death experience.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CAN MEDICAL CHIEF CORRESPONDENT: For Geraghty, who's a grandmother and school bus drive from North Attleboro, Massachusetts, that day started like any other. She was on her final morning run to Newton South High School when the trouble began.
My stomach hurt really bad. A really sharp pain I'd never had and I thought it was heartburn.
GUPTA: She was able to park the bus, but then something happened.
Pain went right up my arm and right into my chest. At that point I said, uh-oh, I'm having a heart attack.
GUPTA: Newton South nurse and a CPR trainer came running with the school's new automated external defibrillator. The next 30 seconds went fast she felt week and then she couldn't catch her breath. And like that, she was unconscious.
She was definitely gone.
GUPTA: As far as on lookers could tell Laura Geraghty was dead, flat on her back right there, not 50 feet from the doors of the school. But Geraghty says, in fact, she was somewhere else.
LAURA GERAGHTY, HAD NEAR-DEATH EXPERIENCE: I floated right out of my body. It just -- my body was here and I just floated away.
GUPTA (on camera): What did you see?
GERAGHTY: What did I see? I seen white -- it was very peaceful.
GUPTA: When you look at your body, were there people working on you?
GERAGHTY: I had seen people, but I kept going. I went to see my mom, and I seen my ex-husband and they both came, and it was very peaceful. It was so peaceful and it was white and it was beautiful.
I remember trying to reach out to my ex-husband, and he would not take my hand. And then they floated away. And then I was just there in this massive energy, just this powerful -- very powerful energy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GUPTA: I'll tell you, John and Carol, a lot of things that Laura Geraghty was describing can be explained by what's happening in the brain.
For example, during cardiac arrest, you're not getting enough blood flow to your brain, specifically your retina, and if you lose your peripheral vision because of your retina, then you start to see those tunnels that Laura was describing.
Also, the bright lights can be explained the same way, and even that out of body experience. There's an area of your brain that's responsible for your spatial relationships. If you're not getting enough blood, it could sort of simulate an out-of-body experience.
Having said that and having interviewed lots of people like Laura, I think these near-death experiences are a perfect example of that intersections between science and spirituality, worth exploring.
John and Carol, back to you.
ROBERTS: Sanjay Gupta this morning. And Sanjay, by the way, stopped by "Tonight Show" with Conan O'Brien and explained some of his cheating death theories last night. And he got some interesting questions from Conan and actor John C. Reilly. Have a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONAN O'BRIEN, HOST, "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Do you think it's possible that someone could sustain a life-threatening wound and you could use hydrogen sulfide to sort of get their body -- almost put a pause on everything for a little bit.
GUPTA: So the scenario that was painted for me is that someone takes a mortal wound in a war zone, for example. Medics run over, determine they don't have enough time to actually do something for them. They just don't have it.
And so instead of trying to stop the bleeding, they inject this substance, and the person completely suspends. They turn gray, their heart stops, the bleeding stops. They get the person on chopper when they can, fly them to a hospital, get the entire team ready to go, and then they reanimate him and they go to work.
O'BRIEN: It's science fiction, but this is something that's going to be a reality.
GUPTA: Yes.
JOHN C. REILLY, ACTOR: How long before people in Beverly Hills start using this to slow down their aging?
(LAUGHTER)
(APPLAUSE)
You're going to get my career going. In a few years, you can save my looks. It's like in that sitcom.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: Just think, if you could suspend your life for eight hours a day every time, that would add up, wouldn't it?
Don't forget, Saturday and Sunday, 8:00 p.m. Eastern, Dr. Sanjay Gupta shows us the medical miracles that are saving lives in the face of death. "CHEATING DEATH," tomorrow and Sunday at 8:00 eastern, only on CNN, the worldwide leader in news.
And checking your top stories now as we cross the half-hour, Pakistan hit with another round of deadly and brazen violence. Today's target, police officers in Peshawar. In all 13 people were killed when a car bomb exploded outside the gates of a police station.
In the past two weeks, terrorist attacks have killed more than 150 people across Pakistan.
It's looking more like a runoff presidential election in Afghanistan. A senior aide to incumbent President Hamid Karzai says it's likely that the vote will enter a second round. Karzai's top challenger, Abdullah Abdullah claims the election in August was rigged in Karzai's favor.
Plus, a major loss for the nation's biggest lender. Bank of America says it lost almost $2.25 billion in the third quarter. Like a lot of other banks, B of A has been hit hard by customers unable to pay back what they borrowed. The company's stock is down in premarket trading this morning -- Carol?
COSTELLO: It wasn't long ago that the offices depicted in "Madmen" were a reality, male dominated, smoke-filled, with women primarily in secretarial positions or not there at all.
Boy how times have change -- 40 years ago women are made up a third of the workplace. Now they make up roughly half and are expected to pass men in the next few months in the number of jobs they hold. So how is the modern woman handling all of these changes? Joining me now is Nancy Gibbs. She contributed to a special report by "Time" magazine on the state of American women, and Joni Evans, the cofounder and CEO of wowawowc.com, a Web site aimed at women. Welcome to you both.
NANCY GIBBS, "TIME" MAGAZINE EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Thank you.
COSTELLO: So we've always known that women rule the world, but soon we will rule the job market. So you wrote this big long article in "Time" magazine. So in talking to people, how are women taking this?
GIBBS: What is extraordinary is how many of the things that we think of as part of the battle of the sexes, the things that men and women argue about, we just can't afford to.
It's as though we're too busy and concerned with making this all work, balancing our work and our families, our jobs, our homes to be worrying over who's taking out the garbage or who has the bigger office.
Men and women agree on so much more of their goals and priorities and needs that they're not in opposition to each other in the way I think we had gotten used to for so long.
COSTELLO: So men are OK with this too?
GIBBS: They seem to be happier. I mean, all the myths that they were going to be fighting us, I think they're sort of enjoying us.
COSTELLO: Really? So men have come to the conclusion that, hey, it's OK that my wife makes more money than me, that I help with the kids and the housework? Have we gone to that, like open-minded...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In our survey, which is a very big national survey, overwhelming majorities say that the rise of women in the workforce has been good for the economy, good for society, that it's fine -- they're perfectly fine with women earning more than men, with men having a bigger role at home or being primary caregivers at home.
The traditional gender roles, they just don't work in this economy, in this social structure. And I think both men and women are comfortable with that and that flexibility is really the key word that both are looking for.
COSTELLO: OK, having said all of that, you know, we saw this study coming out, saying that women are unhappier than ever. Women are unhappier than ever, even though we've gotten everything we've wanted to over the years. Are we really unhappy because of what we've gotten, or is it something else?
JONI EVANS, FORMER PRESIDENT AND PUBLISHER OF SIMON AND SHUSTER: I don't think women are unhappier than ever. I think women are so happy, and so happy not to have to get married, and so happy not to have to stay at home with their children, et cetera. Perhaps what they're measuring -- are women able to speak more honestly than they ever did before, and women are out there with the same economic competition pressures that men have had all this time? And so for the first time, they're discussing what, you know, what it's like to be a bread winner. And I think that's all it is.
COSTELLO: Because, does any woman wish for the time when we didn't have choices?
GIBBS: I think, even the economists who is did this study, which I admire at them is they say there is no tidy theory to explain this.
It may well have to do with the fact that women's happiness is now spread over more arenas. It's not just how things are going with their husbands and children. It's also at work and in their community.
There isn't an easy explanation for it. And so -- and as other people will say, feminism was never, necessarily, about happiness. It was about many things. But happiness may not have been what its main goal was.
COSTELLO: On the other hand, the "Don Draper syndrome," a lot of women, especially young women really like that character, Don Draper from "Madmen." Don Draper is a sexist guy. He's an old-fashioned, traditional man, and his wife stays at home.
So why would so many women be attracted to this character if women really have embraced their freedom?
EVANS: They're watching that character on television. That's not their boss, right?
COSTELLO: True.
EVANS: I don't think they're -- I think it's charming to have a sort of nostalgic feeling about this character. If this character were my boss, I'd kill myself.
COSTELLO: Me too, most definitely.
So what should we take in the end from this? I mean, how has -- I know it's not an easy question to answer in a short period of time, but how has this changed our culture for good?
GIBBS: Well, one thing I think that's important to remember is that when you ask people about sort of traditional family structures of one parent working, one at home, a majority of both men and women still say that they think that's better for children.
And I don't think these are contradictory. I think what that speaks to is the fact that there is still a feeling that our institutions, whether it's our businesses, employers, governments, churches, haven't done enough to adjust to how much has changed.
And until those supports are there that makes the balancing easier, there's still going to be some nostalgia for what felt like a simpler division of labor.
COSTELLO: Right, because it's nice to think that you can stay home and have someone financially support you and hopefully treat you better than the Don Draper character treats his wife.
Thanks to you both. I could talk to you about this forever. Really appreciate it -- John?
ROBERTS: If you don't like Don Draper as your boss, imagine how you would feel if he were your husband.
It's 39 minutes after the hour. All these smoking bans across the country, there's an interesting effect they're having. Apparently they're improving the health of the nation. A new study and what it shows, coming right up. You're going to want to hear about this. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning.
Now 21 states and the District of Columbia have comprehensive smoking bans in effect for restaurants, bars, and other public places. But are we any healthier as a nation as a result? A new study suggests there are major health benefits to snuffing out smoking in public.
Joining us now from Washington is Dr. Lynn Goldman. She's a professor of public health at John Hopkins University and was directly involved in this study. And Dr. Goldman, I'm wondering, what did you find? Are the health benefits of these smoking bans that have been put in place across the country?
DR. LYNN GOLDMAN, PROFESSOR OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS UNIVERSITY: Well, what we found is very clear evidence that there's a cause and effect association between these bans and reductions in acute coronary events, that is, heart attacks, anywhere between 6 percent in one of the studies to 47 percent, a fairly large range, but very clear benefits in terms of preventing heart attacks in the population.
ROBERTS: I know what people at home might be thinking -- isn't lung cancer the major risk of smoking. How does heart disease factor into it?
GOLDMAN: Well, that is interesting. I mean, we knew that if we reduced exposure to secondhand smoke that we could protect nonsmokers from lung cancer.
But it appears that nonsmokers also are susceptible to some of the cardiovascular effects of smoke. And when in fact people breathe secondhand smoke, you pretty quickly see that they begin to form blood clots and there is constriction of blood vessels, and now we're pretty convinced this can lead to heart attacks even in nonsmokers.
ROBERTS: When we talk about acute coronary events or heart attacks as a result of secondhand smoke, what level of exposure would you need to have?
GOLDMAN: That's not easy to define. We reviewed the studies very carefully, and we couldn't come up with a precise level at which these effects are triggered. And, in fact, in all the studies that we reviewed at all levels we could see increases in risk.
And so what we wound up concluding is that the smoking bans would be beneficial, and I guess my advice would be to just try to avoid exposure to secondhand smoke wherever possible.
ROBERTS: So many in cities, we've taken smoking out of the workplace. I don't know anywhere in this country where you can actually have a cigarette in a corporation. Maybe you can in a private office, somewhere, but certainly not in a corporation.
It's been taken out of bars and restaurants in my cities across the country. But those folks now congregate, to a large degree, outside of the buildings by those smokers' posts. And during cold weather, very often people will sort of huddle near the entrance because they do get a blast of warm air wherever somebody exits the building.
But that person who exits the building then is going through a potential cloud of smoke from the smokers who are gathered around the entrance. Does that present a risk to people?
GOLDMAN: Well, it might present a bit of a risk. I, personally, don't get worried when I walk past a cloud of smoke like that. I mean, I think what we're really more concerned about is the cumulative impacts over time. And say, if there's somebody who works all day around that cloud of smoke, that could certainly be of much more concern.
But there are many parts of the country that don't yet have smoking bans in place and where restaurants and public spaces still have smoking and where people who work in those places are literally exposed to secondhand smoke for eight hours a day.
ROBERTS: So how do the results of this study, then, factor into the debate across the country about whether or not to institute these smoking bans on a national level. Obviously, you can't legislate it nationally, it would have to be either done state by state or municipality by municipality, but the drive to ban smoking in public places across the country, what does this study suggest about the prudence of that?
GOLDMAN: That there's a great urgency to do so and that we will receive benefits in terms of health very quickly. And here we are concerned today about the cost of medical care and we can drive down a lot of those costs, prevent a lot of deaths and hospitalizations from heart attack just by imposing smoking bans. It's very urgent to do so.
ROBERTS: Dr. Lynn Goldman from Johns Hopkins University, good to talk to you this morning.
GOLDMAN: Thank you very much.
ROBERTS: Thank you so much. Carol?
COSTELLO: Are you trying to get out of debt and still keep your head above water? Well, here's story that should make you think that that is possible. A Wisconsin family was $123,000 in debt, yet they managed to pay it off and they're sitting pretty now.
We'll tell you how they did it after a break. It's 46 minutes past the hour
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Hey, check this out. Because of the bad economy, iPhone is coming out with a series of apps that help you save money. Yes, the best one is an app called sell your iPhone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: I'm loving that. That's just common sense. It's true.
Welcome back to the most news in the morning. It's something many Americans know all too well. Getting into debt is not hard to do.
ROBERTS: But digging yourself out of $123,000 worth of debt in less than five years, that can't be done, right? Wrong. And one family in Wisconsin is proving it.
CNN personal finance editor Gerri Willis has got their remarkable story and she's here to share. And one word, I guess, how?
GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR: That's a great question, right?
Terrific family, how did they do it? They bought generic everything. They cut costs everywhere they could. And of course, they picked up a second job. One of the things they did, they didn't have lettuce for a year. But what really made a difference is that the whole family pulled together.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WILLIS: Let me open that up for you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
WILLIS: The family favorite at the Hildebrandt's dinner table, egg noodles, crackers, and cream of chicken soup.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is mama's cracker casserole.
WILLIS: A meatless dish. One small way this family of five dug themselves out of a mountain of debt, more than twice their annual income, $123,000, the result of 16 years of overspending.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It didn't happen overnight. It was a few thousand every year.
WILLIS: The tipping point?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We had been assessed about $1,544 in finance charges just for one month and 11 credit cards.
RUSSELL HILDEBRANDT, PAID OFF $123,000: We honestly feel all the same, how did we get to that point? We've always been big dreamers.
WILLIS: But the dreamers didn't take the easy way out, ruling out bankruptcy, and opting, instead, to pay off their debt. Candy cut the budget so much that at the end of the month, she often had less than $5 to spare.
KANDY HILDEBRANDT, PAID OFF $123,000 IN DEBT: We quit eating out and that was right away. We quit buying some of our favorite brand name things that were costlier. We would go down to the generics.
WILLIS: The Hildebrandts saved $70 a month doing their own car repairs. $250 by stretching leftovers and eating dehydrated hash browns. They saved $150 a month by buying at thrift stores, $200 by cutting their own hair. No more CDs and DVD purchases, only essentials.
Russell got a second job, working nights as a janitor in addition to his day job as a chemist; sleeping only a few hours a night.
R. HILDEBRANDT: Some nights, I admit, I didn't think I was going to make it. But I knew one thing that whether I made it or not, I was going to give it the best try that I could give.
WILLIS: to save on gas money, he slept in his car.
R. HILDEBRANDT: I put my hood on and then I would just put my pillow over and snuggle in for the night.
K. HILDEBRANDT: That's what they like, is the topping.
WILLIS: Dinner time became family time.
K. HILDEBRANDT: It isn't so much what's on the table is what took place while we were here.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WILLIS: Well, the Hildebrandts are still debt free and they've even bought their first house. And it shows, you know what, you can do it too if you're out there and you have a lot of debt, it can be done. You can pay it off.
COSTELLO: I just admire them. It would have been so much easier for them just to declare bankruptcy and start over. WILLIS: They didn't want to do that. They said it was a bad example for their kids. They refused to declare bankruptcy. They did everything they could to pay off this debt. And he told me, I was going to give it my best effort or die trying.
COSTELLO: So they didn't get any help from anybody else.
WILLIS: They did get some help from a credit counselor. And in fact, these folks negotiate down your interest rate on your credit cards. So instead of paying 30 percent, 28 percent, 15 percent, they were paying 1 percent and 2 percent on their credit card debt, which was most of their debt. And if you're looking for help out there, you can also contact the National Foundation for Credit Counselors at nfcc.org.
ROBERTS: Boy. Some extraordinary measures to get to where they got, but good on them for getting there.
WILLIS: They're going great now.
ROBERTS: Wow.
COSTELLO: Kudos to them. That just makes me feel good.
It's like a work ethic and setting a good example for your kids and how America used to be. Thanks, Gerri.
WILLIS: You're welcome.
COSTELLO: Medical tourism. What is it? When you cross the border for cheaper surgery. How often does it go on?
ROBERTS: A lot.
COSTELLO: More often than you think. We'll have the story on that after the break.
It's 53 minutes past the hour.
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ROBERTS: Good morning, Atlanta. Where it's mostly cloudy right now, it's 53 degrees; later on today, partly cloudy with a high of just 62. So, yet another not so nice day in the southland.
It's not just the great weather in the beautiful beaches that are drawing tourists to Mexico these days. Many people are heading south of the border for bariatric surgery.
COSTELLO: Costs a lot less to get the weight loss procedure down there. But CNN's chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta tells us, there are risks.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GUPTA: It's 10:00 a.m. in San Diego and Sharon Howell was just arriving on a flight from Atlanta. But she's not here for vacation. She's heading south to Tijuana to have laparoscopic banding obesity surgery.
SHARON HOWELL, BARIATRIC TOURIST: Well, I attempted to have the surgery back in the states and the insurance company made it extremely difficult.
GUPTA: So, Sharon decided to become a medical tourist.
HOWELL: We all looked up the facility, the physician; saw that he was highly credentialed.
GUPTA: Her experience, so far...
HOWELL: Incredible.
GUPTA: And the price tag, about $6,000. That's less than a third of the cost in the United States without insurance.
PAULO YBERRI, DIRECTOR, HOSPITAL ANGELES TIJUANA: It's a different economy, different cost structure. Insurance costs for the facilities, for the doctors, a bunch of different factors that if you add them up, some up to lower costs, but it does not in any way affect the standards of quality.
GUPTA: but there can be risks when seeking care abroad. So says Emory University's Dr. John Sweeney.
DR. JOHN SWEENEY, CHIEF OF BARIATRIC SURGERY, EMORY UNIVERSITY: The issue is long-term follow-up and continuity of care that is going to be (AUDIO GAP).
GUPTA: Also, it is important to research the types of certifications both the hospital and the surgeon hold. And patients should be prepared to pay out of pocket for complications that may arise once they return home. Those who receive poor or damaging treatment abroad often have no legal recourse.
But Sweeney does note, just because a hospital is outside U.S. borders, doesn't mean it's bad.
SWEENEY: We tend to be very close minded and not realize that, hey, there's companies outside the United States that do this as well as we do, or better.
GUPTA: As for Sharon, she says all the travel has been worth the cost savings.
HOWELL: I work at a hospital institution, and this is very well run.
GUPTA: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, reporting.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTS: Continue the conversation on today's stories. Go to our blog at cnn.com/amfix.
And that is going to wrap it up for us on this Friday morning.
Thanks very much for being with us and we'll see you back again early on Monday morning. Have yourself a wonderful weekend.
COSTELLO: I know -- I'm trying to survive the weather, but they're expecting up to a foot of snow in parts of the Midwest.
ROBERTS: If you're traveling anywhere between the Midwest and the northeast today, check in with the airline, because there's bound to be lots of delays.
COSTELLO: There are already delays in Washington and Boston in New York. So good luck out there.
We want to pass it on to CNN NEWSROOM and Heidi Collins.
