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American Morning
Balloon Boy Drama Publicity Stunt?; General Petraeus in Pakistan to Discuss Military Offensive Against the Taliban; Republicans Question Dems Privately Crafting Compromise Health Care Bill in Closed Doors; Reform Behind Closed Doors?; Frustrated with Wall Street; Outsourcing Sewing; Separating Political Fact & Fiction; Gen. Petraeus in Pakistan
Aired October 19, 2009 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: And a good Monday morning to you. It is the 19th of October. Thanks for joining us on the "Most News in the Morning." I'm John Roberts.
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Kiran Chetry. Glad you're with us. Here are the stories we'll be breaking down for you in the next 15 minutes.
Felony charges now could be coming against the parents who claim that their 6-year-old son was in that homemade balloon that broke free and took off. The sheriff now saying it was all a hoax. It was a publicity stunt by a father who would use all means necessary to get on TV.
ROBERTS: Heavy fighting reported as Pakistani troops moved deeper into a Taliban stronghold near the border with Afghanistan. The area has long been considered a launching pad for insurgent attacks in Pakistan and on U.S. troops in the region.
Meantime, General David Petraeus is in Islamabad this morning along with Senator John Kerry. We spoke to the senator just moments ago. We'll have that report coming up for you just ahead.
CHETRY: And three Senate Democrats continue to craft a compromise health care bill this week. It's happening behind closed doors, and that has some Republicans steamed. They claim they're getting cut out of the process and they say the president is breaking his promise.
ROBERTS: But first, the homemade flying saucer that sailed across the Colorado sky last week and television screens nationwide. Now evidence in a bizarre criminal case.
Authorities say the whole thing was an elaborate hoax, scripted by Richard Heene, that is, until their story unraveled right here on CNN. Dan Simon is live for us this morning in Fort Collins, Colorado, and the authorities, Dan, not seeming to cut the Heenes a whole lot of slack this morning.
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, John. The sheriff confirmed what millions had suspected all along. Here's how this went down. Authorities say they were able to lure the father, Richard Heene, to the sheriff's station over the weekend by saying he could pick up what was left of that balloon. At that point, they were able to separate the family, do some independent questioning, and that's apparently what led the sheriff to announce to the world that the whole thing was a hoax.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SIMON (voice-over): That home video, the interviews...
RICHARD HEENE, FALCON'S FATHER: I'm really sorry I yelled at him.
SIMON: The call to 911.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Are you sure that he's in that?
RICHARD HEENE, FALCON'S FATHER: Yes, we looked everywhere.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SIMON: All of it, authorities say, part of an elaborate hoax orchestrated by the 6-year-old's parents, Richard and Mayumi Heene.
SHERIFF JIM ALDERDEN, LARIMER COUNTY, COLORADO: These people are actors. Not only have they appeared in several reality television shows and on YouTubes, we have since determined that, in fact, they met together -- the way that they met, established a relationship, was in acting school in Hollywood.
SIMON: And the motive, according to the sheriff, was so the Heenes could better market themselves for a reality TV show. The alleged plot to pretend that 6-year-old Falcon was inside that runaway balloon he said was hatched two weeks ago. What made authorities believe it in the first place?
ALDERDEN: They granted us complete access to their children to interview independently. After Falcon was found, they didn't even hesitate to allow us to talk to him outside of their presence.
SIMON: But Falcon, investigators believe, spoke the truth during the family's live appearance on CNN's "LARRY KING LIVE," only hours after the drama unfolded. The widely played interview proved to be the turning point.
R. HEENE: Did you hear us calling your name at any time?
FALCON HEENE, BOY TAUGHT TO BE IN BALLOON: Mm-hmm.
R. HEENE: You did?
MAYUMI HEENE, FALCON'S MOTHER: You did?
R. HEENE: Why didn't you come out?
F. HEENE: You said that we did this for a show.
ALDERDEN: If you look at the nonverbal responses as well as some of the verbal cues, it became very clear to us at that point that they were lying.
SIMON: Still, even after authorities became skeptical, they publicly backed the family, admitting now to misleading the media so the Heenes would trust them. The couple could face multiple charges, including three felonies -- conspiracy between the husband and the wife to commit a crime, contributing to the delinquency of a minor and an attempt to influence a public servant. Their attorney says they should be presumed innocent.
DAVID A. LANE, ATTORNEY FOR RICHARD AND MAYUMI HEENE: When you're willing to turn yourself in and you've made that known to law enforcement, that should be good enough for law enforcement. I said call me. You know my number. I will have them down at the sheriff's department within five minutes.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SIMON: So, where was 6-year-old Falcon during those tense five hours? Remember, his parents said he was hiding in the garage attic. Well, now the sheriff says that may be a lie as well, that he could have been just a couple blocks away hanging out at the park -- John.
ROBERTS: If you believe the sheriff, this whole thing coming unraveled to a greater degree moment by moment. And what about, you know, when we saw the balloon take off and it was tipping back and forth and the way it was blowing around in the sky, a lot of people were looking at it, observing, well, you know, if it had of a 40-pound 6-year-old in there, would it be tipping around so much? And there's a scientist there in Colorado who's actually done an analysis on that point, Dan.
SIMON: That's exactly right. The sheriff confirmed with a scientist from Colorado State University. He looked at that balloon and determined that there is absolutely no way that a 37-pound boy, 6- year-old Falcon, could have flown in that balloon. It simply wouldn't have even lifted off the ground. So that's another component to this already bizarre case, John.
ROBERTS: It's an opinion that would have been good to have on Thursday, isn't it, Dan? Dan Simon for us in Fort Collins this morning.
SIMON: You bet.
ROBERTS: Yes. Thanks very much, Dan.
The story getting deeper this morning. Here's more for you in an "AM Extra."
Police now talking to Richard Heene's former self-described research assistant, Robert Thomas, in a paid interview with the Web site gawker.com. Thomas said that Heene had been cooking up a publicity stunt involving a weather balloon in the hope of landing his own reality TV show. Thomas told the Web site the original proposal did not involve Heene's kids.
So, what do the Heenes have to say about all of this now? Coming up at 6:45, we're going to talk with their attorney, David Lane.
CHETRY: We're also following the latest developments right now out of Pakistan. General David Petraeus, head of the U.S. Central Command, as well as Massachusetts Senator John Kerry both now in Islamabad. They're meeting with political as well as military leaders there.
And this visit comes as Pakistani forces surge into Taliban territory. They're targeting a Taliban and al Qaeda strongholds in South Waziristan near the Afghanistan border. The Taliban claims it's inflicted heavy casualties and is vowing to fight to the "last drop of blood" to defend its territory.
Our Reza Sayah is live for us in Islamabad. And first to General Petraeus and his meetings in Pakistan. Do we know what he's going to be talking about with leaders there?
REZA SAYAH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he's going to be talking about the U.S. fight against extremism. Of course, Pakistan is perhaps the most important ally in the U.S. fight against extremism in this region. Both General Petraeus and U.S. Senator John Kerry, who's also here in Islamabad, continued to maintain that al Qaeda is based in Pakistan's tribal region along the Afghan border. The Obama administration says if al Qaeda and if the Taliban want to hide, they go to this region. If they want to plot and plan attacks, they go to this region.
So, they are here keeping an eye on the offensive currently going on targeting the Taliban in South Waziristan, and these two sides, Islamabad and Washington, haven't always had the best of relationships. It has been an up-and-down relationship. There's been a trust deficit with a lot of finger-pointing. Oftentimes, Pakistani officials blamed the extremism in their country, in what they called an ineffective foreign policy across the border in Afghanistan.
And of course, plenty of times we've heard U.S. officials, NATO officials blame the insurgency in Afghanistan on an ineffective fight against extremism here across the border in Pakistan. So, Kiran, look for some relationship-building going on here, too, as well.
CHETRY: So, that's on the diplomatic front. Meantime, how about this surge in Pakistani forces? How significant is this offensive that's going on right now to try to root out the Taliban?
SAYAH: Well, one Pakistani official calls it the mother of all battles. Twenty-eight thousand Pakistani troops moving into the hub of Taliban activity at South Waziristan, right along the Afghan border. They continue to say they're making progress, going deeper into Taliban territory, but what's interesting is the Taliban is delivering a very different account of the first three days of this offensive.
In a phone call to CNN, Taliban spokesperson Assan Tarik (ph) saying it's Taliban fighters who killed 68 Pakistani soldiers over these first three days. The Pakistani army rejects those claims, calling it propaganda, Kiran.
CHETRY: Reza Sayah for us this morning in Islamabad, thank you. Coming up in the next hour, by the way, 7:45 Eastern, we're going to be hearing from Senator John Kerry from Massachusetts. He is in Islamabad today, and we're going to talk to him about what's going on there.
ROBERTS: And it's eight minutes after the hour. Other stories new this morning that we're following for you.
The Justice Department set to issue new guidelines on medical marijuana today. Federal prosecutors will be told that it's not a good use of their time to arrest people who use or provide the drug in compliance with state laws. That's a significant change from Bush administration policy. Medical marijuana use is allowed in 14 states.
CHETRY: Autopsies are expected today on three runners who all died during the Detroit marathon yesterday. All of them were running the half marathon. One was just 26 years old. Another man 36 years old. All three of them collapsed within 16 minutes of each other at the time the temperature was about 34 degrees.
ROBERTS: The Louisiana justice of the peace who refused to marry an interracial couple says he has no plans to resign. Louisiana's governor, Bobby Jindal, and Senator Mary Landrieu are two of the many leaders who have called on Keith Bardwell to step down. Bardwell says he has no regrets and would make the same decision again.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEITH BARDWELL, JUSTICE OF THE PEACE: Everybody hates me. I mean, really. And I don't know why. I mean, I treat people, you know, I figure equal, good. I have one problem with marrying mixed- race marriages, and that is the offspring.
BETH MCKAY, DENIED MARRIAGE LICENSE: It's overt racism, and we are used to the closet racism, but we're not -- we're not going to tolerate that overt racism from an elected official.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: It is just bizarre, is it not?
CHETRY: Yes, and we're going to hear from them. Beth and Terence McKay were actually married. They found a justice of the peace and they did get married, and they're calling on Bardwell to step down and they're getting support from some of the leaders of the state, including the governor. And so, we're going to hear from them firsthand, what this whole ordeal has been like, 8:30 Eastern on the "Most News in the Morning." ROBERTS: All right. And it's ten minutes after the hour. Stay with us. The health care debate continues to rage in Washington. Jim Acosta live in Washington with the very latest chapter. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Good morning, Washington. Thirteen minutes past the hour right now. It's clear and 40 degrees in our nation's capital. A little bit later, it's going to be sunny, going up to a high of 59.
Welcome back to the "Most News in the Morning." This could be a critical week for health care reform. A compromise bill being crafted by a handful of Democratic senators could be completed in the next few days.
Now the big question, will it contain a public insurance option? As we know, Republicans are against it, but they don't have a say in it right now.
Jim Acosta's live in Washington. So forget bipartisanship, right? If this happens, it's going to happen with the Democrats, and the big debate is, is there going to be a public option in whatever bill they finally decide on?
JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is the big question right now, Kiran. Forget bipartisanship and forget doing it out in the open right now.
Later today, Senate Democratic leaders and White House officials are expected to be back behind closed doors, putting together that compromised bill on health care reform. That process has raised a key question -- why is the debate over the public option not open to the public?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Thank you so much.
ACOSTA (voice-over): It was an Obama campaign promise, the crafting of health care reform would be out in the open.
OBAMA: This whole thing is going to be televised on C-SPAN. Everybody is going to be watching.
ACOSTA: But now that the major reform bills have cleared committees, they're being merged in private by congressional leaders and White House advisers. Republicans ask, where's C-SPAN?
SEN. JON KYL (R), ARIZONA: The bill that's being written right now is being written in Harry Reid's office, behind closed doors with Chris and Max Baucus and the leader and others. No Republicans need apply to come into that room.
RAHM EMANUEL, WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: The entire health care process has been fully public and...
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is the most important part.
EMANUEL: Yes. And everybody is going to continue to be involved.
ACOSTA: The process also worries Democrats who fear the White House will cave on a government insurance public option before any votes are cast. Some in the party vow they won't back down.
SEN. ARLEN SPECTER (D), PENNSYLVANIA: I'm not prepared to recede at all. I think the public option is gaining momentum.
ACOSTA: Administration officials say the president is open to compromise on the public option.
VALERIE JARRETT, SENIOR WHITE HOUSE ADVISER: Push for it, certainly, but he's also realistic to say we've got to look at all options. He has said very clearly he thinks it's the best option, and we'll see what happens.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, he's not demanding that it's in there?
JARRETT: He's not demanding that it's in there. He thinks it's the best possible choice.
ACOSTA: But that willingness to cut a deal has irked some Liberals who want the president to get tough. It's an undercurrent picked up by Presidential Historian Douglas Brinkley, who told "National Journal Magazine" "Mr. Obama has created an atmosphere of no fear. Nobody is really worried about the revenge of Barack Obama because he is not a vengeful man."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We make him angry, he turns - he turns into "The Rock Obama!"
ACOSTA: Even "Saturday Night Live" joked about whether the president can get tough with Congress.
DAVID AXELROD, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR POLITICAL ADVISER: I think people want toughness, but they also want to have thoughtful leadership, and that - and that requires reviewing these issues, thinking them through clearly and bringing people along, and that's what he's doing.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA (on camera): Now, the sign the GOP has latched onto this issue, Sarah Palin is using her Facebook page to call out the president for not putting the current health care talks on C-SPAN.
Kiran, she can see a new issue from her house this morning.
CHETRY: There you go. All right, Jim Acosta for us this morning. Thanks.
ROBERTS: All right. Well, we have yet another apology this morning. The artist who made the famous Barack Obama "Hope" Poster now admits he lied about the photo that he used to design it. The "Associated Press" had sued street artist Shepard Fairey for using one of its photos for the famous artwork. It claims that he had no right to it, that he didn't alter it enough to be covered under "fair use laws."
Fairey sued them back, insisting he used a different AP photo of Obama, one that originally had actor George Clooney in it, that was significantly altered for the poster, but now he admits he lied about which photo he used and has apologized.
There - there is a veritable epidemic of prevarication going on in this country these days! I can't (ph) believe the sheriff out there in Larimer county and they'll - who's not lying these days?
CHETRY: Yes. That's pretty shocking.
ROBERTS: You're not lying (ph). You never lie.
CHETRY: Well, I try not to. Little white ones like, "Oh, it's so nice to see you!" you know? Well, not you. I'm just saying, "you"...
ROBERTS: Yes. Not me. No...
CHETRY: "You" in general. Anyway, so, you know, Christmas season's coming around.
ROBERTS: Oh, change the subject!
CHETRY: And people are worried about, you know, getting out there and getting discounts on some toys. Well, now there are allegations of price-fixing at Toys 'R' Us. Maybe they're going to apologize, too. You never know. We'll find out. We got the details right after the break
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: A shot inside our Control Room on this Monday morning. Just the fact that we're all awake is really a gift.
It's 20 minutes after the hour. Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning.
You know, Target has stopped selling a controversial, illegal alien Halloween costume. It comes with its own orange jumpsuit, a space alien mask and a fake green card. There is another version with a space alien mask, a dark handlebar mustache and a baseball cap. We showed one first, then the other (ph).
Target said the costume was inadvertently uploaded to its Web site due to a data entry error. Despite the controversy, some costume shops say that the illegal alien costumes have actually been a hit.
ROBERTS: Toys 'R' Us reportedly the target of a price-fixing investigation, according to "The Wall Street Journal." The Feds want to know whether the store forced customers to pay higher prices for things every new parent needs to buy, like strollers and car seats. Calls and e-mails on Saturday to the store were not returned.
CHETRY: The White House talking about the disconnect that still exists between Wall Street and the working class. On CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" yesterday, White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel blasted banks for planning to pay out big bonuses this year. Wall Street firms neglected their responsibilities, according to Emanuel.
ROBERTS: Right. And David Axelrod also out there yesterday, saying that these bonuses are offensive, yet, at the same time, this administration put in place policies that allowed these banks to flourish, to make these big bonuses, and now they're trying to tap into that public anger by saying things like they said yesterday.
STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes. They came out as a team.
ROBERTS: They're trying to have it both ways?
ELAM: Yes. Well, they came out yesterday as a team basically to say, look, you guys have to realize - and it was just last year. It was just last year when we saw what happened on Wall Street. Granted, two of the biggest banks have reported earnings that were much stronger - JPMorgan and also Goldman Sachs, they've already repaid their money to the government, but that's not what they're focusing on here.
When you listen to Rahm Emanuel and you listen to David Axelrod, their point is you've got to do your part to society here. We helped you out, so you need to help out everybody else. You need to increase your lending and fighting (ph) regulation reform, which is part of the issue. They're saying that they're hearing people on Wall Street fighting to make changes so we don't have the catastrophes that we saw last year, to make sure that that stops. They also say think about what you're doing when you're handing out these really large bonuses, having these large bonus pools when you think of unemployment nearing 10 percent in the country, and on top of it you've got wages, really their lowest in nearly 20 years, as David Axelrod pointed out.
This doesn't make people feel warm and fuzzy about Wall Street, needless to say, and they're also pointing out that there needs to be more consumer lending and for people who need to go out there, if they're trying to get their business started, if trying to get that home, they need to get lending and they're saying lending is still very tight and that is an issue, so they're talking about that.
CHETRY: You know, they're talking about it and they're chiding them publicly, but are there any teeth to any of this? I mean, when - when this whole bailout happened, they said that they're - we're going to have deregulations in effect so this doesn't happen again.
ELAM: Well, that's the thing. The regulation part of that takes longer to put into effect and to get that going. They're saying right now, while things are still being worked out on the regulation side, do your part and help out. So kind of going out and putting out this concerted message, but yes, sure, there needs to be more done on the regulation side to really make sure that there are teeth and that there are fences and walls to keep people from doing this on Wall Street. But right now, it is business as usual, as it seems, and people feel like, you know, out there, if you're living in Kentucky, they're not caring about you on Wall Street and it just looks like...
ROBERTS: And Wall Street heavily lobbying against these new regulations, too.
ELAM: Heavily lobbying, yes.
ROBERTS: All right. Steph, good to see you this morning. Stephanie Elam "Minding Your Business."
CHETRY: Well, on the health care debate, there's been a lot of statements and claims put out there. Who's telling the truth and who's stretching it? Phil Adair with his "Truth-O-Meter" joins us next.
It's 24 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. Alina Cho's favorite song there.
You know, buying American-made products is good for the economy, but what if it's almost impossible, say in the world of fashion? Our Alina Cho shows us how much of the clothing we buy is actually not made in America these days, and we'll tell you, it's staggering.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And here, in a few short blocks on Broadway, between 34th and 40th Streets, is the heart of the American garment industry, the industry that makes clothes for you.
ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): New York's Garment District, once bustling, now bust. In its heyday, New York City's number one employer, today, sewing machines sit idle. Most of the jobs are gone.
CHO (on camera): What's going on?
FERN MALLIS, SVP, IMG FASHION: Well, you know, greed. Greed is a big part of it.
CHO (voice-over): Designers, many now owned by huge conglomerates, are watching the bottom line more than ever, making clothes cheaper by shipping the work overseas.
MALLIS: Made in America means something, and it used to mean so much more. I mean, we invented blue jeans. Where are they made now? Everywhere but in America.
CHO: It didn't used to be that way. In 1965, 95 percent of American clothing was made in the USA. Today, it's down to 5 percent. The subject of a new HBO documentary called "Schmatta: Rags to Riches to Rags."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The garment industry is a microcosm of everything that's going on in this country.
CHO: Shining a light on a section of New York that once was emblematic of the American dream.
NANETTE LEPORE, DESIGNER: What's disappearing is the idea that people immigrate here and they come with a craft and they can get into a job and they can build their life.
CHO: Like Linda and Doug (ph) Kesselman. Their factory makes garment trimmings, but business is down 30 to 40 percent in the past year alone. What's worse, the Kesselman's lease is up in 2011, and it's not up for renewal.
LISA KESSELMAN, CO-OWNER, KESSELMAN TRIMMINGS INC: We're losing our identity. We were built on manufacturing, we were built on craft. This is our identity. This is what our ancestors came to do. We're becoming just a - a nation of farming it out.
CHO: If the Kesselmans go, so too will their workers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's sad, because for people like me, raising a family with really no skills, you know, we depend on the Garment District.
KESSELMAN: Give us a fighting chance. This is ridiculous. We had - we are backed up against a wall with no place to turn. And it wouldn't just be us. It will be everybody who does this.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHO: So, what does that mean for fashion's future? Well, Fern Mallis who runs "Fashion Week" tells me students who were coming to New York to study fashion are doing so to learn from the best, but, guess what? They're being forced to go back to Asia or Europe to work because there are simply no jobs here in the United States, guys, and, as Fern says, you know, we're bailing out the auto industry, but last I checked, nobody's driving naked, you know? So, what's wrong with bailing out a smaller industry? And - and she's saying the government needs to get involved.
The other thing is, you know, people say buy in America, buy in America. The problem is, only 5 percent of American clothing is now manufactured in the United States. That's increasingly hard to buy in America when there's no clothes available that's actually made here.
ROBERTS: So, 7th Avenue becoming Fashion Avenue in name only very quickly.
CHO: That's right. And interestingly enough, Nanette Lepore, one of the designers, told me, you know, it's a place for tourists now. You know, you walk down the street, you don't see those racks of clothing go down anymore. I mean, you've been down there. It's not the way it used to be, certainly. And, of course, those in the fashion industry are hoping it will come back.
By the way, very quickly...
ROBERTS: Got to be more of hope.
CHO: That's right. If you want to watch more of this, "Schmatta" premieres tonight on HBO at 9:00.
ROBERTS: Can you get an American-made Schmatta?
CHO: Let me check on that. I'll get back to you.
ROBERTS: All right. Thanks so much.
And we're crossing the half hour. And checking our top stories.
The top U.S. commander for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan right now focusing on the situation in Pakistan. General David Petraeus and Massachusetts Senator John Kerry are in Islamabad meeting with military and political leaders. The discussions come at the same time Pakistan's ground offensive against insurgents enters its third day. So far, both the Taliban and Pakistan are claiming early victories.
CHETRY: Well, the investigation growing now into allegations that American Airlines flew jets that put passengers at risk. According to the "Wall Street Journal," regulators say that the airline flew at least 16 jets that needed repairs, including one considered unsafe to fly at a normal cruising altitude. People familiar with the investigation say the airline could face millions of dollars in fines. American airlines told the paper it's responded to the agency's letter of investigation.
ROBERTS: The search is on this morning for the person who killed a University of Connecticut football player. Police say cornerback Jasper Howard was stabbed to death early Sunday morning in a fight outside a school dance. He had just been given the game ball for his performance the day before. Another student was hospitalized and released. Right now, police do not believe it was a random act of violence.
CHETRY: And now to politics and our weekly check on who's telling the truth and who's stretching it.
Health care is still a big topic in Washington, and Bill Adair at PolitiFact has been busy running many claims through his Truth-O- Meter.
Bill is the founder and editor of the Pulitzer Prize winning PolitiFact.com. He's in Washington this morning.
Good morning, Bill. Good to see you.
BILL ADAIR, POLITIFACT.COM: Good morning, Kiran.
CHETRY: All right, let's start with a stat that's floating around out there about doctors being unhappy with proposed health care reform measures. You guys were fact-checking a statement from political commentator Glenn Beck. This is from his October 12th show.
And here's his quote, "Especially consider that the percentage of doctors who say they'll quit if this is passed is only 45 percent. No worries. Ha. You'll be able to find a good doctor. Really, you will."
So, that's Beck's statement. And he's basically saying 45 percent of doctors will quit if health care reform is passed.
How did you rate that statement on your Truth-O-Meter?
ADAIR: That one earned a false on our Truth-O-Meter. And there are a couple of reasons. First, he misstates the poll. Doctors didn't say they would quit. It said they would consider quitting. And so, you really need to look at the wording of the question. But also, there's some questions about the validity of the poll. It was a mail survey to doctors. It had a very low response rate, particularly compared to another survey. And one pollster we talked to said that the wording of the questions was such that it really could affect the results. So, Beck earns a false for that one.
CHETRY: I got you. But interesting enough, though, that anecdotally, there are, there do seem to be concerns among doctors, right, about what shape health care reform will take? Perhaps the poll, as you said, was not necessarily conducted the way that you'd want it to conduct, but is there a feeling out there, a concern out there that there are a group of doctors who may feel it's not in their interest to continue to practice medicine if health care reform happens?
ADAIR: Well, I think what we need is another poll, something that's truly, thoroughly gets at the question. I'm not sure this poll did, nor another one that was also done of doctors that was funded by the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation. I think it would be interesting to see a news media poll in this that really took a more thorough look and examined whether doctors really would quit. I know there are a lot of doctors who are unhappy with the plan.
CHETRY: Right.
ADAIR: But there are also doctors who are supporting it. So, it would be good to see another poll about it.
CHETRY: All right.
Well, let's move on to another claim. This is from a group called Save Flexible Spending Plans, which said recently that the bill from the Senate Finance Committee would, quote, "drastically restrict the use of flexible spending accounts in order to help pay for health care reform."
Now for people that don't know flexible spending accounts, this is money that you're allowed to put away, tax-free to pay for your medical expenses. A lot of people who get their insurance through work use them. So, any truth to this statement. ADAIR: Yes, there is some truth. We rated this half true on our Truth-O-Meter. And the reason is that, indeed, the Baucus bill, which is one of the main Senate bills, does restrict the benefits under flex spending accounts. Right now, there's not a limit. Employers set their own limits, usually somewhere between $2,000 and $5,000. The Baucus bill would limit it to $2,500 and not index it for inflation, but that's not quite drastic. So, we rated that one half true on our Truth-O-Meter.
CHETRY: All right. And, finally, you're tackling H1N1. You know, there's been a lot of fear and a lot of questions about swine flu virus, swine flu vaccine, and you latched onto a pretty sensational claim. This is circulating in an e-mail chain. And here's what it said. It's about the state of Iowa.
"The State of Iowa has an internal document that was recently re- leaked on the Internet that provides for a state roundup of Iowa citizens who might be exposed to swine flu virus."
So it really does say a lot about the questions and confusion out there, and a lot of the tension. This e-mail actually points to an official document. What does the Truth-O-Meter rate it?
ADAIR: The Truth-O-Meter gave that one a False. Like so many chain e-mails, if you get something like this in your inbox, you can pretty much bet that it's wrong. The case here, it actually does rely on an old document that was created back when there were even worse fears about the seriousness of H1N1. And Iowa officials drew up a draft document that somehow got posted on the Internet that talked about this, but Iowa officials have responded to this chain e-mail and said, no, they don't have plans to do this. That hasn't stopped people on the Internet from raising fears about it. In fact, there's one YouTube video that has a Lego figure of what one of these concentration camps might look like. So, this one gets a False on the Truth-O-Meter.
CHETRY: OK. Well, as we said, there is a lot of fear out there, and a lot of false claims about swine flu and swine flu vaccines, so, glad you're clearing it up for us this morning.
Bill Adair, as always, great to see you. Thanks.
ADAIR: Thanks, Kiran.
CHETRY: And we want to let everyone know, you can check out some of the other claims that Bill has run through the Truth-O-Meter by going to our blog, CNN.com/AMFIX.
ROBERTS: Well, you know, a lot of people suspected it after 6- year-old Falcon said to our Wolf Blitzer, that you told me "we did this for the show." Was the balloon incident across Colorado a hoax? Well, the sheriff of Larimer County now says it was a hoax. It was a publicity stunt. So, what's the family saying?
We'll check in with their attorney coming up in just a few minutes. Thirty-seven minutes now after the hour.
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UNIDENTIFIED BOY: What we're going to do is we're going to try to kill the bad guys by beaming them in the head with these dirt clothes, and we're going to try to find the biggest pieces.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ha, ha, ha! You didn't see that coming!
UNIDENTIFIED BOY: Fun for cover!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, you'd better run!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, wait!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: And there you go. The kids book now a hit on the big screen. Spike Jones's adaptation of "Where the Wild Things Are," took in $32.5 million. The film were reportedly cost $80 million to make and it will have to battle some mixed reviews in week two.
Rounding out the rest of the weekend's top five, the violent thriller "Law Abiding Citizens," as well as the Box Office phenom "Paranormal Activity," Vince Vaughn's comedy "Couples Retreat" and a remake of "The Stepfather."
ROBERTS: That was one of my favorite things when I was a kid, you know.
CHETRY: "Where the Wild Things Are"?
ROBERTS: No, no, no, no, dirtball fights. You'd go to a building site. You know, they'd be building a house, they'd excavate the basement and you'd get on both sides of the excavation and pitch dirtballs at one another.
CHETRY: Yes. You know, these days, you can't let kids do that. They can slip and fall.
ROBERTS: It was a derivative of, you know, the famous Scottish game of rocks, which of course follows my heritage, where they would stand about 15 paces away from each other and chuck rocks at each other. We just did it with dirtballs.
CHETRY: Right. That's how you learned how to duck.
ROBERTS: And so, Rob, what kind of games did you play when you were a kid?
ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Spitballs -- I didn't play the rocks game. That wasn't popular in my neighborhood. Of course, we're not quite as tough as that. Kick the can, you know, that kind of stuff.
CHETRY: What did you say about spitballs?
MARCIANO: Did I say that? Oh, no, I didn't say that. Did that come out of my mouth? No, come on. What kid did that...
CHETRY: You remember, you used to hollow out the inside of a ballpoint pen.
MARCIANO: Oh, yes.
CHETRY: You know what I'm talking about?
ROBERTS: I can see you doing that.
MARCIANO: In case one of those spitballs got caught in somebody's larynx, you could use that as a first aid (INAUDIBLE) to clear out the larynx.
(WEATHER REPORT)
ROBERTS: Rob Marciano this morning for us with the weather and lessons on how to do an emergency tracheotomy using a big pen.
CHETRY: Not really a visual I want at 6:43.
MARCIANO: No. Safety first. Safety first.
CHETRY: Yes, absolutely.
ROBERTS: Rob, thanks so much for that.
MARCIANO: Guys, see you.
CHETRY: Balloon boy.
What's going to happen? Do you think his parents are going to do jail time?
ROBERTS: I don't know. But, you know, if the sheriff has his way, they may certainly face charges, if not felony charges, at least misdemeanor charges.
So, what's the family saying about it? Well, they have retained an attorney, and he's joining us coming up next. Stay with us.
It's 43 1/2 minutes after the hour.
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ROBERTS: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. We were duped! That's essentially what the sheriff investigating the runaway balloon in Colorado is saying from Thursday's backyard launch to the frantic calls for help. Authorities say it was all scripted. Now, criminal charges against Richard and Mayumi Heene could be on the way. Joining me now to talk more about this is the family's attorney, Richard Lane. Mr. Lane, the sheriff Jim Alderden from Larimer county said yesterday that evidence is that this was a publicity stunt done to further market themselves -- the Heenes -- to a reality television show. What do you say about that?
DAVID LANE, ATTORNEY FOR RICHARD AND MAYUMI HEENE: First of all, it's David Lane. But second of all, you know, I need to see what the evidence shows in this case. The sheriff isn't required to share their evidence with me until charges are filed.
I have not seen anything other than a press conference by law enforcement. And until that point, where they have to give up their evidence, you know, I'm shooting in the dark until they have to share it with me.
ROBERTS: Right, and what have they shared -- but apologies for the name, first of all -- what have they shared with you so far?
LANE: Absolutely nothing, other than what they shared with the world at a press conference, and you know, you get some interesting tidbits from the press conference, but that's different than looking at all their reports and seeing exactly what they've got, if anything.
ROBERTS: Right. Richard Heene said to the Associated Press yesterday -- obviously, he's getting a little bit upset about all of this -- that this thing is "convoluted." Any idea what he's talking about there, what his state of mind is these days?
LANE: Well, I mean, his state of mind is what you would expect someone's state of mind to be after law enforcement has searched your house, seized your property, held a press conference announcing you're about to be charged with criminal charges. Your state of mind would be rather upset and you would feel somewhat under siege, which is exactly how the family feels at this point.
ROBERTS: The way you characterize that seems to indicate that you think that the sheriff has acted unfairly in this case?
LANE: You know, I can't say that until I see what they've got. So I mean, if they have probable cause to make an arrest, then make an arrest and give me the evidence and we can -- it's analogous to a batter standing in the batter's box waiting for a pitcher to throw a pitch. You can't swing until they throw the pitch. Throw the pitch and then we'll see.
ROBERTS: In terms of you say that you haven't heard much from Richard Heene -- and I think that extends to Mayumi Heene as well - have they at least profess their innocence to you?
LANE: I never said I haven't heard much from them. They're my clients, so I've heard a lot from them. And yeah, I mean, at this point, -- and obviously, this is something the public rolls their eyes at, unfortunately, but the presumption of innocence should be given to them, and the sheriff having a press conference saying that they're guilty does not make them so. ROBERTS: Right. I mean, there are plenty of law enforcement agencies across the land that do that every day. It's part of the process. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but did you just say in another interview that they had taken a polygraph test?
LANE: Yeah. The sheriff put both of them on a box and they have not shared with us whether or not they passed or failed. I have said that polygraph evidence is inadmissible in Colorado courtrooms for a reason, and that is, it's just generally unreliable under the law.
ROBERTS: How are the children doing? Because if what the sheriff says is true, they were being manipulated, told to lie. We saw Falcon on Friday morning on two television interviews. He was so upset that he threw up twice in those interviews. So, I'm just wondering how the kids are doing today?
LANE: You know, the kids were in my office yesterday. By my own observations, as the father of three of my own sons, they seem to be perfectly normal, happy, well-adjusted kids that are being insulated from this process as much as possible, and you know, they seem like good, happy kids.
ROBERTS: You know, there was also this rap video that we spoke to Richard Heene and Mayumi heene about on Friday. This is something that they put up on YouTube, in which kids who now are 6, 8 and 10 years old were talking about words like the "P" word, which George Carlin made famous, the "F" word, and the "F" word that is derogatory use to refer homosexuals. You know, there is obviously going to be a character issue talked about here with this case going forward.
Do you believe it's appropriate for the parents of children who are that age to be producing a video for them in which they use those words?
LANE: You know, I am representing Richard Heene on potential criminal charges, and I am not his mother, I'm not his father. I'm not here to give parenting advice to my client. All I can do is see what criminal charges are coming down the road, see what the evidence against them is and defend those charges.
ROBERTS: But there's...
LANE: So, I tell people, I'm not your priest, I'm your lawyer. I'm not your banker, I'm your lawyer, and I'm not your mother, I'm your lawyer.
ROBERTS: But there is also an issue here, Mr. Lane, as to whether or not child protective services in the state may get involved. Do you expect that they will?
LANE: I expect given the profile of this case, just about every agency under the sun is going to take a good look at what's going on. And absent some compelling evidence of child abuse, they just need to back off and leave this family alone.
ROBERTS: You have sent notice to the police that the Heenes are willing to surrender to the authorities if they do face charges, and that any attempt to arrest them "will be deemed merely an effort by law enforcement to aggrandize themselves at the expense of the Heenes." Do the Heenes really believe they're in a position to dictate terms?
LANE: It's not a matter of dictating terms. I think it's child abuse for law enforcement to slap the cuffs on a couple of parents in the presence of three kids and haul them off to jail when those parents are facing low-level charges and have expressed a willingness to turn themselves in. That's child abuse. That's traumatic for kids.
And that's why I reached out to Larimer County and said, "look, just call me if you've got a warrant, I'll have them turn themselves in." They agreed to do that. Let's see if they're true to their word.
ROBERTS: Now, when you say low-level charges, I assume that you're talking about potential misdemeanor charges that have been talked about. But what if they're charged with a felony? That's not exactly low-level.
LANE: In the world of felony charges, these are going to be low- level felonies. These are not charges that are going to carry mandatory prison time or jail time or anything else. This is a family that is established in the community. They're not running from the law.
There's no reason for the perp walk other than for law enforcement to slap themselves on the backs for the TV cameras, and you know, this is a group of people that I've reached out to to say, look, the Heenes will turn themselves in. All you have to do is make a phone call, they'll be there. There is no need for a perp walk for media consumption at the expense of these kids.
ROBERTS: Right. You know there was substantial expense that was incurred in chasing that balloon across Central Colorado. Are your clients at this point willing to make any restitution to the state?
LANE: Well, I mean, you know, search and rescue operations cost money, and just because there is one doesn't mean somebody has to pay for it. If they are criminally responsible for any costs incurred, then that will be resolved in court. If there is no criminal responsibility, then they shouldn't have to pay a penny.
ROBERTS: David Lane, the attorney for the Heenes. Thanks for joining us this morning. I appreciate your time, sir.
LANE: Thank you for having me.
ROBERTS: 54 minutes now after the hour.
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