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Campbell Brown
Investigating Alleged Fort Hood Shooter; Tropical Storm Ida Hits Gulf Coast
Aired November 09, 2009 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CAMPBELL BROWN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Tonight, here are the questions we want answered.
Did the Fort Hood alleged gunman try reaching out to al Qaeda? Tonight, the prime suspect is awake and talking. And investigators want to know, does he have links to radical Islam?
DR. VAL FINNELL, FORMER CLASSMATE OF MAJOR NIDAL MALIK HASAN: I know another student actually approached the faculty about him and called him a ticking time bomb. He was very extreme in his views.
BROWN: Plus, does Wall Street still not get it? The bonus gravy train is barreling down the tracks again, some of the biggest firms handing out nearly $30 billion in bonuses, while one in 10 Americans are unemployed. What is wrong with this picture?
Breaking news, state of emergency. Tropical Storm Ida hits the Gulf Coast. How have things changed since Hurricane Katrina? Tonight, we revisit a boy whose life was turned upside-down.
CHARLES EVANS, HURRICANE KATRINA VICTIM: I think that Katrina changed everyone's life for a reason.
BROWN (on camera): Yes?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: Do you really believe that?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: And for the better?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN (voice-over): Charles Evans, four years ago, his story touched many hearts. Now he's a young man. And I went back to New Orleans to see how he's doing.
Plus, 20 years ago tonight, the Berlin Wall and communism tumbled in Berlin.
JAMES BAKER, FORMER U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Our efforts changed the world back there 20 years ago. BROWN: Our newsmaker tonight, former Secretary of State James Baker.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is your only source for news. CNN prime time begins now. Here's Campbell Brown.
BROWN: Hi, everybody.
We're going to start tonight as we always do with the "Mash-Up," our at all the stories making an impact right now, the moments you may have missed. We're watching it all, so you don't have to.
And there is breaking news to get us started tonight, the Gulf Coast bracing for Tropical Storm Ida and already getting pounded by high winds and heavy rain. But look out, because the worst is yet to come.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BETTY NGUYEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And want you to take a look at this picture live from Pensacola Beach, Florida. You see the waves crashing there. The winds are blowing. We're talking about Tropical Storm Ida.
CHARLES GIBSON, HOST, "WORLD NEWS": Gulf Coast residents from Louisiana to Florida are being warned tonight to take Tropical Storm Ida seriously.
KATIE COURIC, HOST, "CBS EVENING NEWS": In El Salvador over the weekend, rain from Ida sparked mudslides and flooding that killed 134 people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: CNN severe weather expert Chad Myers is tracking Ida for us tonight.
Chad, what's going on?
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Campbell, a couple things. It's getting very close to land now, almost about to Mobile, about 100 miles away or so, maybe a little bit less.
And a large line of severe weather developing on the south and east side of it. That will affect Florida. I know, Florida, you're a long way, let's say Tampa and Miami, long way from this thing. But this is the area that I'm most concerned about tonight for the potential for severe weather.
Let's get rid of this, 38 miles an hour, 37 miles an hour in Mississippi there, Mobile 32, Pensacola, 24. The winds are blowing. They're not too bad right now. But they will pick up. This is still a 70-mile-per-hour storm. There's the center, to the south of Biloxi, east of New Orleans, and it continues to move up to the north. Coastal flooding across parts of the Gulf Coast, from almost Fort Walton Beach right into Destin and maybe even to Mobile. It then turns to the right and affects all of this area.
Literally, Campbell, we get 10 inches of rain in some areas. That will cause additional flooding as well.
BROWN: All right, Chad Myers keeping an eye on it for us. I know you will update us if and when things change. Chad, thanks.
We are going to move on to Texas and new details tonight about Army Major Nidal Hasan, the suspect of course in the deadly shootings at Fort Hood. The big question tonight, does he have ties to Islamic terrorists? Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The official says intelligence agencies intercepted communications from Hasan. It is not clear who Hasan was communicating with. The communications included comments on things such as suicide bombings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. officials say by the time he arrived in Fort Hood in July, Major Hasan had already been in contact with one of al Qaeda's top recruiters. Anwar al-Awlaki is an American who operates an English-language Web site out of Yemen urging all Muslims to wage jihad against the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Awlaki, who was on the imam at the Virginia mosque Hasan attended, is an influential voice spewing anti-American rhetoric from his exile in Yemen. He had known connections with three of the 9/11 terrorists and he's an ongoing inspiration for radicals. Today on his Web site, al-Awlaki praised the rampage.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Members of Congress are already demanding to be told more about what the Army knew about Hasan before the shooting. The first congressional hearing on the shooting is already scheduled for next week.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: A hospital spokesman says Major Hasan is now awake also and talking. What exactly is he going to tell authorities? We are going to have much more on that and the investigation coming up in a moment.
In Washington tonight, the fight over health care reform now becoming an emotional battle over abortion. The bill the House passed on Saturday severely restricts abortion funding in insurance plans. Abortion rights supporters want that amendment stripped from the final bill. Where does the president stand? Today, his spokesman dodged and weaved.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: Does he support the abortion funding restrictions in the House bill?
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We'll iron out differences as they come.
QUESTION: But what's his position on abortion funding restrictions?
GIBBS: We'll continue to make progress.
QUESTION: Can Barack Obama, who campaigned as a pro-choice Democrat, sign legislation with this language?
GIBBS: Ask me that right before Christmas and the end of the new year. We will work on this and continue to seek consensus and common ground.
I'm going to leave it at the earlier answer that we're going to continue to work through and make progress.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: President Obama tonight also treading gingerly in an interview with ABC News, saying -- quote -- "This is a health care bill, not an abortion bill."
The president says when it comes to abortion, he doesn't want to do anything to -- quote -- "change the status quo."
And we move now to Iran and tough new charges today against those three American hikers. They have been behind bars since July, when they were arrested while hiking the Iran/Iraq border.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN ROBERTS, CO-HOST, "AMERICAN MORNING": This is definitely not good news for the families of Josh Fattal, Sarah Shourd, and Shane Bauer, the three Americans who have been detained in Iran after they allegedly crossed over the border between Kurdistan and Iran. According to the state news agency IRNA in Iran, the government of Iraq has charged the three detained hikers with espionage.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: You can see the hikers here clowning around in this video just before they entered Iran from Iraq July 31. Their families say they unknowingly strayed into Iran.
HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: We believe strongly that there is no evidence to support any charge whatsoever. And we would renew our request on behalf of these three young people and their families that the Iranian government exercise compassion and release them, so they can return home.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Now, obviously, the new espionage charges not a good sign and in the past have been a signal that Iran does intend to put these Americans in this case on trial. To Germany now and an incredible scene unfolding in Berlin today. It's been 20 years since the wall fell uniting a nation and ending the Cold War.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Twenty years ago tonight, history turned. It turned for all of us. Whether we realize it or not, everyone's life today, there's something about it that's different because of this night in Berlin.
RONALD REAGAN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And because of your courage, two Berlins are one, two Germanies are one, and now two Europes are one.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): Finally, we had reached the end of the Cold War, an era of unity began of law and of freedom all over Germany and all over Europe.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And together, let us keep the light of freedom burning bright for all who live in the darkness of tyranny believe and hope for a brighter day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Secretary of State James Baker will be with us in a moment to talk more about that extraordinary moment.
And new criticism today for Andre Agassi from a fellow tennis legend. Agassi admits in his new autobiography, as you may have heard, that he used crystal meth and lied about it. That does not sit well apparently with Martina Navratilova.
Agassi talked about it on "60 Minutes" last night. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COURIC: Martina Navratilova was especially harsh. She said: "Shocking, not as much shock that he did it as shock he lied about it and didn't own up to it. He's up there with Roger Clemens as far as I'm concerned."
ANDRE AGASSI, FORMER PROFESSIONAL TENNIS PLAYER: The one thing that I would hope, some compassion, that maybe this person doesn't need condemnation. Maybe this person could stand a little help. And I had a problem. So, I would ask for some -- some compassion.
MARTINA NAVRATILOVA, FORMER PROFESSIONAL TENNIS PLAYER: Let me just say that I am a compassionate person, as I have proved it this morning when I rescued a tree frog from my sink and released it into the wild.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Well, we will ask Martina Navratilova about that tree frog, also Andre Agassi, when she is our guest here right here tomorrow night.
From the bad boy of tennis to the bad girl of soccer. She's the latest YouTube star who has set a new bar for unsportsmanlike behavior. Red card, anyone? Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Check out number 15 for New Mexico in the red. She throws more punches than Tyson. Only thing she didn't do was the ear bite. But she does that, grabs the BYU player's hair so hard that the player hits the ground.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cameras zeroed in on New Mexico's number 15, Elizabeth Lambert, a junior who had been involved in a series of rough plays, including this one-two punch to the head of an opponent.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But look at the follow-up with the right hand right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And this blow with her fist after receiving an elbow.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, if the referee missed that one...
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The hair pull has become the new head butt. Remember Zinedine Zidane, the French captain who head- butted an Italian player at the World Cup.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my goodness.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my gosh. How rude.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: And we should mention that Lambert's team lost the game. She has been suspended.
And that brings us to the "Punchline" tonight. This is courtesy of Wanda Sykes, who has some advice for President Obama.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WANDA SYKES, COMEDIAN: He's the president. He's supposed to be doing too much. Shoot, I get mad when he takes a break. I'm like, what the hell is he doing walking Bo? Hey, unless Bo ate your health care plan, you (INAUDIBLE) back into the Oval Office.
(LAUGHTER) (END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Wanda Sykes, everybody.
Her new show, we should mention, premiered over the weekend. And that's the "Mash-Up" tonight.
Tonight, we are learning a lot more about the man accused of gunning down his fellow soldiers at Fort Hood, including possible links to radical Islamists overseas. We will have more on that.
Plus, as Tropical Storm Ida sweeps toward the Gulf Coast, we're also going to catch up with a young survivor of Hurricane Katrina who shot to fame in the days after the storm. You may remember him. His name is Charles Evans. And I met him outside the city's Convention Center four years ago. Well, now he's back in New Orleans, but we will tell you why he wants out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: You would leave New Orleans?
EVANS: Yes, I would.
BROWN: You want to leave New Orleans?
EVANS: Yes, I do.
BROWN: Why?
EVANS: Because I just feel that there's more out there in the world for me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: New developments to tell you about in the Fort Hood shootings, this just coming in right now. This is according to the Associated Press. Investigators say there is no indication that the Fort Hood suspect was directed to attack or had help in this attack.
Now, we have learned that the suspected gunman here, Major Nidal Hasan, has been taken off a ventilator, that he's talking to doctors. However, the AP also reports that Hasan's newly hired attorney has asked investigators not to speak to his client right now.
One thing those investigators are going to want to know is, did he have ties to radical Islam? Was he reaching out, if not being directed?
And to try to flesh some of this out, we have with us tonight Drew Griffin of CNN's Special Investigations Unit, CNN national security analyst Peter Bergen, and former Army prosecutor Thomas Kenniff, who is joining me on the set.
Welcome to everybody.
Drew, let me start with you and first get your reaction to this new report, investigators saying again that he doesn't appear to have been directed in these attacks in any way. But I know that you have been looking into his connections to a mosque where some of the 9/11 hostages (sic) worshipped. Give us a sense for what you found.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Right.
Well, first, the breaking news that we have just moments ago from the FBI, that there are no co-conspirators at this point and that this was not part of a broader terrorist plot. If that's true, they can kind of slow down a little bit. We don't have to worry about other terrorist attacks.
But what they're looking at is a mosque back in 2001 where a now radicalized imam or cleric who is thought to be over in Yemen was preaching there. In April of that same year, 2001, we know from the 9/11 Commission that two of the 9/11 hijackers were in that mosque.
And then, just weeks later, Nidal Hasan, who we're not sure if he regularly attended the mosque, but he certainly had a funeral for his mother at this mosque, all these kind of ties, dots that are not drawn together yet. But it's kind of what they're looking at, whether or not there was a radicalization process here in D.C., where he was at least first exposed to some of these anti-American beliefs.
BROWN: And, Drew, also I know a former U.S. counterintelligence agent apparently told CNN that they previously intercepted communications from Hasan. What can you tell us about those messages?
GRIFFIN: Yes, that's more details in that same FBI release just moments ago.
It was December of 2008 where the FBI says Major Hasan came to the attention of the FBI in December of 2008, an unrelated investigation being conducted by a joint terrorism task force. Apparently, they were looking at somebody else and saw that Hasan had communicated with this person, talking about suicide bombings.
You may have heard this over the weekend, that he had made some postings about suicide bombings. Here's what the joint terrorism task force did. They reviewed the communications. They looked at the context of the communications, the follow-up of any communications there, and they determined that -- and I'm reading here, Campbell -- the communications consistent with research being conducted by Major Hasan in his position as psychiatrist at the Walter Reed Medical Center.
Because the content of the communications was explainable by his research and nothing else derogatory was found, the joint terrorism task force concluded that Major Hasan was not involved in terrorist activities or terrorist planning. That's December of 2008.
BROWN: All right.
Peter, let me bring you in here. Given this new information, given what Drew just laid out for us, what's your take on this?
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, I think the fact that Major Hasan worshipped at the same mosque as a couple of the 9/11 hijackers doesn't really amount to very much.
After all, there were 19 hijackers. They worshipped at mosques all over the country. And this particular mosque where both Hasan and two of the 9/11 hijackers worshiped also has thousands of other worshipers. So, I don't make really very much of that.
Was he reaching out to a radical cleric in Yemen? Apparently. That is something. Was he having mental problems and sort of that led him in a more radical direction? That's very possible. It's hard to tell, really right now because we still don't know a lot of quite important details that would help us fill out the portrait of this guy, who seems somewhat disturbed. A number of very big events had happened in his life, the death of his mother, the death of his father, the potential deployment to Afghanistan.
All these things obviously made him snap. But clearly there is a religious dimension to us. After all, he was shouting Allahu akbar as he gunned down his fellow soldiers. So, that's really where we are. It's a sort of rather murky situation right now in terms of making a definitive portion of this guy.
BROWN: Let me bring Thomas in here, because you know this process.
His ventilators have been removed. He's talking to staff, apparently, from what we heard. Lawyers saying he doesn't want his client to talk. But what's the process? Will interrogators be allowed to put him through the...
THOMAS KENNIFF, FORMER ARMY JAG OFFICE ATTORNEY: Yes.
BROWN: ... the process? Walk us through it.
KENNIFF: OK.
First of all, the fact that he hired a civilian counsel, who is now saying that he doesn't want his client interrogated, means absolutely diddly-squat as far as...
BROWN: Well, how come?
KENNIFF: Because he needs to invoke his own right to counsel.
In other words, myself as an attorney, I can't invoke my client's right to counsel for him. And the military is even more liberal when it comes to questioning suspects than in the civilian world.
BROWN: Right.
KENNIFF: So, he will be advised of his rights before he's questioned. There's no question about that. He has his right to counsel, right to remain silent, so on and so forth. But if he voluntarily after being advised of those rights wants to submit to this interrogation, his civilian attorney in Washington, D.C., or wherever he is, is not going to be able to prevent that.
BROWN: Give us your take, though, also. He's, Hasan's lawyer, already questioning whether he's going to be able to get a fair trial. This is going to be a military trial? It seems to be what authorities are indicating.
KENNIFF: Military, no question, has their claws in him right now, because he's a uniformed service member who committed a crime, multiple crimes, on a military installation against U.S. soldiers. So, there's no question that this falls within the jurisdiction of the commanding general of Fort Hood, who will then act through the JAG Corps to prosecute him.
BROWN: Could there also be civilian charges, though?
KENNIFF: There could be.
It depends on what is going to happen or what -- what the investigation reveals with respect to all this terrorism. If it can be shown that he was acting as part of al Qaeda or a terror cell or any sort of large organization that made this an act of terrorism, then what I think you can see unfold is he can be prosecuted and will be prosecuted in the military, he can be tried, he can convicted, he can sentenced to the death penalty.
If there's enough to prove that this was independently, in addition to an act of murder, an act of terrorism, you could then have the federal authorities charge him and prosecute him in federal civilian court with committing acts of terrorism. He could possibly face an independent trial, where capital punishment is also the potential consequence.
BROWN: Right.
All right, still a lot to sort out here as we learn all this new information.
Many thanks, Tom, Peter and Drew as well. Appreciate it, guys.
When we come back: President Obama is going to travel to Texas tomorrow. He will be attending a memorial service for the victims of the Fort Hood shootings. And we should mention here that we will have special coverage. That's live tomorrow at 1:30 p.m. Eastern time. You can also watch the memorial service on CNN.com/live.
And breaking news now we want to update you, the Gulf Coast under a state of emergency as Tropical Storm Ida heads for land.
Plus, when we come back, how the world is Wall Street -- how in the world, rather, is Wall Street walking away with $30 billion in bonuses? The outrage of the day, we will talk about that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) (NEWS BREAK)
BROWN: When we come back, we have a story very near and dear to my heart about a young boy I met covering Hurricane Katrina. Though he was only 9 years old, Charles Evans gave voice to so many people. He became kind of an instant celebrity. But now, four years later, he's needing help more than ever. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: You think you can stick it out?
EVANS: I think I could, but I don't want to.
BROWN: You will do whatever you have to do?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: I know. You are a survivor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Breaking news tonight from the Gulf Coast, where Tropical Storm Ida is slamming the region with heavy rain and high winds. The governors of Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, and Louisiana declared states of emergency today. American Airlines has canceled 40 flights into the region.
Meantime, the National Weather Service says that Ida could hit New Orleans with 30 to 40 mile-an-hour winds and gusts of up to 60 miles an hour. Pretty dangerous storm in a city that is still struggling to recover from Hurricane Katrina.
I was just recently there. It was a trip back to reconnect with someone I met in those frenzied days after Katrina. And some of you may remember him. He was a little boy then, an extraordinary young boy who spoke truth to power in ways that we don't often see. And his story touched a lot of people.
I had hoped that time would be good to him, but it has been, frankly, a real struggle. See now for yourself.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALES AND FEMALES: We want help. We want help.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All the people you see, they're dying.
BROWN (voice-over): I will never forget the day I met Charles Evans. It was boiling hot, chaotic, thousands of frantic people crammed into the New Orleans Convention Center, an overwhelming sense of desperation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALES AND FEMALES: We want help. We want help. BROWN: I was reporting for NBC News, trying to convey the depth of the tragedy playing out before me, when a 9-year-old boy approached our camera and laid it out better than I ever could.
EVANS: We just need some help out here. It is so pitiful, pitiful and shame that all these people out here -- we have over 3,000 people out here with no home, no shelter. What is they going to do? What we going to do?
BROWN: The nation heard Charles on NBC News that night and he became an instant sensation, the innocent face of the storm.
EVANS: Hurricane Katrina survivor.
BROWN: Immediately offers of help started pouring in. Charles was profiled in "Vanity Fair." He was whisked off to Los Angeles for a special appearance on the Emmy Awards. Something about this child spoke to millions of people. And one of those people was businesswoman Wanda Felton.
WANDA FELTON, BUSINESSWOMAN: I felt the need to do something personal, not just write a check. I felt the need to roll up my sleeves and touch somebody directly and he touched me and I felt the need to touch him.
BROWN: Cameras followed as Wanda became Charles' guardian angel, helping he and his grandmother make a new life with relatives in Mesquite, Texas. For a while, it seemed like he had finally caught a break.
FELTON: He enjoyed it. He liked the school. He was doing well. He was living like a normal kid.
BROWN: But about two years ago, Charles' grandmother decided she wanted to leave. She packed him up, moved them back to New Orleans, back to the Ninth Ward, still reeling from Katrina. Their first stop, a FEMA trailer. After that, it was hard to keep track.
FELTON: In a span of less than a year, Charles moved three or four times, changed schools. It was pretty disruptive.
BROWN: Today, Wanda and I traveled to New Orleans to check up on Charles.
FELTON: Can I get a hug?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: He's a teenager now, and living with an aunt in an unfinished house on a street lined with abandoned boarded up homes and buildings.
(on camera): It's quiet in the neighborhood today.
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: A lot of empty places, huh?
(voice-over): For Charles, this place feels familiar but it doesn't feel like home.
(on camera): So, you got to catch me up a little bit because it's been a long time.
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: Tell me what it was like coming back here.
EVANS: It was really like hard for me, because I didn't want to come back.
BROWN (voice-over): In Texas, Charles had stability, a warm home, a good school, where he had lots of friends and where he wasn't hounded by bullies. Here, all that is gone.
(on camera): You came back here because your family wanted to come back here.
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: How did you adjust? How did you --
EVANS: It was really hard, because like the people were different. The students at my school were different. You know, the teachers were different because I felt that I was learning so much more in Texas.
BROWN: Yes.
EVANS: And I even feel the same way now.
BROWN: So it's a little frustrating?
EVANS: Yes, it is.
BROWN: How are your cousins doing?
(voice-over): We go inside.
(on camera): This house got pretty beaten up in the storm, too, huh?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN (voice-over): Charles lives here with five other people and his grandmother is visiting.
EVANS: And this is my room.
BROWN (on camera): Hi, Ophelia.
OPHELIA EVANS, CHARLES EVANS' GRANDMOTHER: Hi.
BROWN: It's Campbell. How are you?
O. EVANS: Oh, I'm fine. All right.
BROWN: You OK? Are you taking care of her?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: Just like old times.
EVANS: Yes.
O. EVANS: Same old thing.
BROWN (voice-over): He is taking care of her but who is taking care of him?
Wanda remembers when Charles came to visit her in Brooklyn about a year ago. She overheard him talking to a friend on the phone.
FELTON: He was saying things like I had a hot breakfast. Now, that's not typical. These aren't things that a child normally remarks on. He wasn't talking about the things we were doing. He was talking about having basic necessities.
BROWN: Wanda has shown Charles life beyond the Ninth Ward.
FELTON: The city is slumped over there.
BROWN: Which convinced him of one big thing, he's got to get out.
(on camera): You'd leave New Orleans?
EVANS: Yes, I would.
BROWN: You want to leave New Orleans?
EVANS: Yes, I do.
BROWN: Why?
EVANS: Because I just feel that there's more out there in the world for me. Before Katrina, I was trapped in New Orleans. I didn't even know that a different world exists. I thought that, you know, everything was here. But now I've seen and, you know, I still have more to see.
BROWN: Do you think you can stick it out?
EVANS: I think I could, but I don't want to.
BROWN: You'll do whatever you have to do?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: I know. You are a survivor. EVANS: Yes.
BROWN (voice-over): Right now, Charles thinks his best option is an out-of-state boarding school. He has his sights set on the Milton Hershey School in Pennsylvania which provides free education for disadvantaged kids.
EVANS: If I get into the Milton Hershey boarding school, I'm going to take that option.
BROWN: Unfortunately, Charles didn't get in this year. But he is still optimistic and sees college in his future. And that's the funny thing about Charles Evans. Even after all he's been through, the terrifying storm, his own fleeting celebrity, the country moving on from the shock of Katrina, leaving him right back where he started, even after all that, he still hasn't given up hope.
EVANS: I think that Katrina changed everyone's life for a reason.
BROWN (on camera): Yes? Do you really believe that?
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN: And for the better?
EVANS: Yes, I think so.
BROWN (voice-over): We go back to the convention center where we met after the storm.
(on camera): Do you remember that? There was a blanket set up right here.
EVANS: Yes.
BROWN (voice-over): And after all these years, I can still see the wise, defiant little boy who approached that NBC News camera.
EVANS: We don't know what we're going to do. So we just need some help and support.
BROWN: Charles Evans is getting some support these days, but it's not enough. He deserves more.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: And you can find much more on Charles Evans online. Read my blog posted at CNN.com/Campbell.
And there are lots of other young people, we should say in New Orleans in the area there who still need help. And to learn more about what you can do, visit our "Impact Your World" page at CNN.com/impact. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BROWN: Ready for another outrageous story of Wall Street excess? Well, just as unemployment hits that very scary 10 percent mark, today we're learning some financial firms that you bailed out are getting ready to distribute even more big, fat bonuses. Take a look at the numbers.
Bloomberg reporting today that the numbers -- or lined up the numbers today for us. It is a staggering amount if you look there.
Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, JPMorgan Chase, all set to dole out, you see the number, nearly $30 billion. That is up 60 percent from last year. Worldwide bonuses at financial firms up 40 percent this year. So do you get the sense that there is one set of rules for these big companies and another set for the rest of us? Is anybody reining these guys in?
And with me now to talk about this is our chief business correspondent Ali Velshi and Democratic Congresswoman Marcy Kaptur of Ohio who sits on the House Appropriations Committee.
Congresswoman, welcome to you.
REP. MARCY KAPTUR (D), OHIO: Thank you.
BROWN: I'm going to start with Ali on this to have you explain it. Mind-boggling numbers.
ALI VELSHI, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely.
BROWN: What's going on?
VELSHI: It's hard to believe. I think it's even hard to receive for some of the recipients this is what we're talking about, bonuses of this size. The issue is that the companies that these people work for are making money. These are companies that have been involved in Wall Street. They are involved in investing. And in fact, most of the money that's been made on Wall Street in the last year has been because they invested.
Now we've all seen the stock market is way up. These people are getting paid as part of their structure, because their companies are making money. So there'd be more outraged if the Dow were actually down, and no one could have made money than these folks are. But there's a real sense of outrage that we're suffering unemployment. People are still losing their homes. Home prices are still low, and these folks are getting credit.
BROWN: And there's no credit, by the way. You can't borrow and then --
VELSHI: And you can't borrow but those who started with some money are making off with even more.
BROWN: So, do you think it's justifiable in any way?
VELSHI: I think there's a lot of justifiable anger about it. I think the anger is justifiable because we're suffering. People are suffering.
BROWN: But no. But talk about the company.
VELSHI: Well, the companies are making the money. So if they weren't paying their executives, they're still making the money. It's not that companies are not making money. These are not TARP recipients. These are people who paid back the people of America and they're now paying their people.
BROWN: OK. But here's my question with this. And you're the expert. I don't -- I'm still trying to learn about this stuff, but I'm reading the story by Jonas Serra (ph)...
VELSHI: Yes.
BROWN: ... who is a reporter for "The New York Times." It's not just about you borrowed TARP money and you paid it back.
VELSHI: Right.
BROWN: He goes through this laundry list of all the ways that the taxpayers have supported these companies.
VELSHI: Yes.
BROWN: And if I read this list, it would take up the entire segment. But the bottom line, he says, is that the biggest benefit they get is that we now know no matter what happens, no matter what risks these companies take, they are too big to fail. You've heard the line.
VELSHI: Yes. And they're bigger now than they were when we first thought.
BROWN: And that the government will do anything in order to save them.
VELSHI: Yes.
BROWN: So how is this fair? Like, if I have a company, I don't get that sort of guarantee.
VELSHI: Yes.
BROWN: And why should these guys be compensated?
VELSHI: You've hit on the point, but there are two issues. The companies are protected. The companies are making money. They are too big to fail, and they are paying their people with the money that they're earning.
So two separate issues. We are tired of people who got us into this financial mess getting paid. These aren't necessarily the people who got us into the financial mess. They just happen to be in a very highly paid industry and they're paid so much more than the average American. That is frustrating. BROWN: Do you agree with that? Are these not the guys who got us into this mess, Congresswoman Kaptur?
KAPTUR: I think what's happening is outrageous. It's almost unpatriotic. $30 billion in bonuses translates to 600,000 jobs. We'd like just three percent of those dollars out here in our region of the country in northwestern Ohio to put the people who are out of work because of what Wall Street did, back to work.
I say to myself, where are the great leaders on Wall Street today? We used to have Bernard Baruch (ph). You think about our country. We had great military leaders like George Marshall. You think about Jonas Salk, who didn't even have a patent on polio vaccine. I don't see any of that coming out of Wall Street.
$30 billion. So I have a bill to take it away, literally to tax their money and to pay some of the debt back that we owe to everyone else in the world because of their imprudent behavior.
VELSHI: I think that's a terrible idea but that said, I think you're absolutely right, Congresswoman, on the idea of leadership. That is what has been absent. There hasn't been a mea culpa. There hasn't been, and I'm sorry there hasn't been and I feel your pain. And let me share in the pain of Americans.
I think you're dead on on that. I think it is very, very dangerous to be taxing people's income back. These people haven't broken a law. They haven't done that. We are just angry at them and some of that anger is justified.
KAPTUR: Yes, we're angry at them. You know, $600,000 a year in just bonus rewards? Out here in our region, people's average income is $35,000. And those very same companies that are getting all this money to their top executives, they're not doing mortgage workouts out here. We're seeing the very same companies that caused the crisis come in and clean up on these properties.
Eighty percent of the properties being sold out here are from outside investors and companies formed by the very same people that did this. So it's like a circle. The American people have a basic sense of fairness. What is going on is truly unfair and the net yield of what's happening is our banking system is becoming more concentrated.
The five big ones now...
BROWN: Right.
KAPTUR: ... they have almost 40 percent of the deposits in this country in 12 institutions control the credit card business in this country.
BROWN: And that is a much bigger discussion. But that is obviously what we have to get at. Congresswoman Kaptur, we appreciate your time. Ali Velshi, as always, thanks for coming in. Ali, thanks so much. We'll be back in a moment. Berlin, of course, we're going to talk about it in a minute. A very big party happening there tonight. Check it out.
Germans and revelers from frankly around the world celebrating the day the Berlin Wall came down 20 years ago.
Also tonight's newsmaker, we'll be talking about this as well. Former Secretary of State James Baker who remembers the real life or death fears of Americans in the years before the wall came down.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAMES BAKER, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: In the Cold War, we went to bed every night fearing the potential of nuclear annihilation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: This has been a night of celebration and triumph in Germany, marking exactly 20 years since the Berlin Wall came crashing down. The wall was, of course, one of the most prominent symbols of the Cold War and the Soviet communist stranglehold on Eastern Europe, today brought back the emotion of that momentous time as the wall was brought down, symbolically, as a set of dominoes, just like the domino effect of freedom that swept through Eastern Europe back in 1989.
Tonight's newsmaker, former Secretary of State, James Baker. The Berlin Wall came down, of course, during his watch and we spoke with him just a short time ago. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Mr. Secretary, welcome to you.
JAMES BAKER, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: Thank you.
BROWN: You probably better than anyone can put this in perspective. Talk to us about what a momentous event this really was.
BAKER: Well, it was a huge event, when you think about the length of the Cold War and you think about the period of time, the lesser period of time, of course, that the Berlin Wall separated East and West Berlin. When you think about the geostrategic environment that those of us in my generation had known all of our adult lives and it was obviously coming to an end. I mean, when the wall came down, that was the symbolic end, in my opinion, of the Cold War.
BROWN: You write this week, and talking about this time before the wall fell, that back then Americans had a common goal. You know, from the government down, everyone was united against communism. But in your view today, are we achieving this sort of similar unity of purpose, especially when it comes to fighting this war on terror?
BAKER: Oh, I think we have a unity of purpose in fighting the war on terror. I don't think there's any lack of unity of purpose on the part of the American policy, whether it's the right wing, the left wing, the center, whoever it might be, whether it's Republicans or Democrats. The mechanism, the way you go about it, there may be some differences on that. But that's not, again, that's not unhealthy in my view. I think that those differences are to be expected. But I don't think there's any lack of commitment, if you will, on the part of any American to keeping the country safe and fighting terror.
BROWN: So, but when you put it in perspective with what, you know, you went through, you know, during your time in government, you think about fighting communism, comparing that to fighting terrorism. Is it just the fact that it's a lot harder to fight a terrorist than it is when you're at war with a country or you have an actual government that you're opposed to?
BAKER: Well, you can say it's a lot harder. But I've got to tell you, the risk to our existence are no greater today and probably not as great as they were in the Cold War. You know, in the Cold War, we went to bed every night fearing the potential of nuclear annihilation. And we don't have that anymore.
And, therefore, I take issue with those who somehow try to find -- or who somehow think there should be nostalgia for the good old days. They weren't the good old days. They were bad days, and we had a lot of challenges that we had to deal with.
BROWN: You do look at though, you talk about challenges, some of the complications that resulted from how the Cold War was fought. You had Reagan funding anti-communist regimes like the Mujahideen in Afghanistan.
BAKER: Right.
BROWN: And obviously, we're living with the consequences of that now. I mean, do you regret some of the decisions made along the way?
BAKER: Oh, I don't regret that at all. I think it was the right thing to do at the time to eject the Russians or do what we could to eject the Russians from Afghanistan. After all, we've been engaged in an ideological struggle with the forces of communism for 40 years. And we knew that they were going to try to continue to extend their reach and their grasp and that their goals and philosophy was very inimical to that of the United States and the West.
So, no, I really don't. I think we -- I think we did that we should have done back then. And frankly, Campbell, I think we're going to do what we need to do today.
BROWN: And this final question, very big picture here. But the fall of the Berlin Wall certainly brings up the question of just how much the U.S. can and can't influence foreign events around the world. What's the lesson that you think you learned from it? Especially about how much our efforts can ultimately change the world.
BAKER: Well, our efforts changed the world back there 20 years ago. You know, people today in retrospect somehow think maybe German unification was inevitable. But it wasn't. Particularly not the shape of it.
And I still feel that the indispensable nation, if you want to use that term today, is still the United States. We are the one nation in the world that's in a position to lead. And it's really important that we do lead.
BROWN: Secretary James Baker, so appreciate your time tonight. Thank you so much.
BAKER: Thank you, Campbell.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Coming up, we join forces with Oprah Winfrey tonight. Well, she joins forces with CNN.com. And you can actually be part of it.
Up next, a preview. It's tonight's live online chat, part of Oprah's book club.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: In tonight's breakout, Oprah Winfrey, the woman with the power to turn obscure books into instant best sellers. And her latest book club selection echoes a cause near and dear to her heart -- the plight of children in Africa and what they face every single day. Oprah is talking to CNN's Anderson Cooper about it tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sometimes it's hard to get people in the United States interested in Africa. There was some criticism early on in the schools that, you know, why are you opening up schools in South Africa, why not here at home where there's plenty of problem with the education system?
OPRAH WINFREY, TALK SHOW HOST: Well, you know, I feel strongly and believe in education here and support, you know, education here. But the real -- the real story in the United States is that you have to go to school. If you don't go to school, somebody comes looking for you to say why aren't you in school? Not only do you have to go to school, but you get to go to school and you get education for free.
As you will recognize when you read this great book of short stories, say you're one of them, that is not the case for children throughout the world and particularly in many countries in Africa where boys are allowed to go to school, girls aren't allowed to go to school. Where if you do go to school, you've got to be able to pay for your uniform and pay for school fees. And many times families have to choose between do I educate my son or daughter, or do we eat? And when you have that choice, people choose to eat or to do whatever they can to scrape by.
So, you know, I believe that education is the greatest, greatest gift that you could give to anybody. And I'm really excited that we have so many people throughout the world who are reading this book and really thrilled that we get to partner with you guys, CNN, and oprah.com to have this webcast.
COOPER: And that's --
WINFREY: I mean, it's like having the world's greatest classroom.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: And you can see the rest of Anderson's interview with Oprah tonight at 10:00 Eastern Time.
Also tonight, CNN.com hosting Oprah's biggest book club event ever. But you do have to register by the top of the hour. It starts in just a few minutes, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time. I mean, seriously, you've got only a few minutes. Right now, go to CNN.com/Oprahbookclub.
Also at the top of the hour, "LARRY KING LIVE" has the family of the D.C. sniper on the eve of his execution. That coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Tomorrow, a rare look inside one of America's oldest and most powerful secret societies. We examine the mysteries of the freemasons.
"LARRY KING LIVE" starts right now.
