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Fire at Lebanon Raceway Horse Track; American Student Sentenced to 26 Years for Murder; European NATO Countries Step Up Their Burden In Afghan War, But Some Say They Could Do More
Aired December 05, 2009 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, everyone. Happy Saturday, I'm Brooke Baldwin in for Fredericka Whitfield and you are in the CNN NEWSROOM.
First up a 22-year-old American college student convicted in Italy of murder. Was the verdict fair?
And President Obama says we are emerging from an economic storm. Why his Republican critics disagree? We will have that are much more coming up in the next hour.
But first, I want to begin with the tragedy strikes outside of Cincinnati where two people and as many as 65 horses have been killed in this pre-dawn fire there at the Lebanon Raceway Horse Track. The fire as we understand it just ripped through this barn, the size of a football field.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPT. KRISTEN WYATT, LEBANON, OHIO FIRE DEPARTMENT: Our first engine arrived to find barn 16 fully involved in fire. The roof had already collapsed into the building.
SHANE CARTMILL, OHIO FIRE MARSHALL'S OFFICE: We have no idea who this individual could be. Of course we have circumstantial things. People that may have been there last night but of course that changes daily.
WYATT: The other thing that will complicate looking for victims and animals as well is because of the similar bone structures of the animals to the humans. So we want to make sure that we are very thorough. We are not going to rush through.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Again, we are hearing two people died. We have confirmed those two individuals are both men. The cause of the fire is still under investigation. Track officials though have cancelled today's races. We will take you live to Lebanon, Ohio coming up next hour for more on that.
Attorneys say they will appeal Amanda Knox's murder conviction in Italy. The 22 year old American college student was sentenced yesterday to 26 years in prison. And Knox's Italian ex boyfriend got a slightly shorter sentence as in 25 years. Family members visited Knox in prison this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EDDA MELLAS, AMANDA'S KNOX'S MOTHER: Amanda, like the rest of us is extremely disappointed, upset about the decision. We are all in shock. We are all heartened by the support not only from the people here, but Italians and people from all over the world have been sending us messages of support all through the night. The media has been supportive. Amanda got great support when she came back to the prison.
UNIDENTIFED FEMALE: What did you say to her?
MELLAS: We told her she's going to get out of here. It's going to take a little longer. She's strong.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What kind of night did she have?
MELLAS: She had a rough night. She had a lot of support. Everybody there, the inmates and guards were all taking great care of her. They care a lot.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: You can hear her mother is trying to remain optimistic. But Amanda Knox and her boyfriend both convicted of murdering a British college student, she was Meredith Kercher. And Kercher's family said that verdict was just.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LYLE KERCHER, MEREDITH KERCHER'S BROTHER: We are pleased with the decision. It's not, you know, it's not time for celebration at the end of the day. It's not a moment of triumph. As we said before, we are all gathered here because our sister was brutally murdered and taken away from us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Well despite the verdict some people are really questioning as to whether or not Amanda Knox got a fair trial in Italy. Judy Bachrach, of "Vanity Fair" she lived in Italy for some four and half years and she has been reporting on this case. She discussed the verdict on the "Situation Room" with CNN's Wolf Blitzer just yesterday when that verdict came down.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUDY BACHRACH, "VANITY FAIR" Magazine: It didn't surprise me at all. This was a carefully choreographed trial. Everybody knew from the beginning that the prosecutor had it in for Amanda Knox. The charges are pretty much trumped up. There was no motive for her to kill her roommate. The defense wasn't even allowed to produce evidence of their own DNA experts. From the beginning, this was carefully choreographed. They wanted to find her guilty, they have kept her in jail for two years even before trial, and they did find her guilty. This is the way Italian justice is done. If you are accused, you are guilty.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: You have to prove you are innocent as opposed to putting the ominous of the verdict. A lot of people have said that about the Italian system. If the prosecution goes ahead and charges you, the burden is really on you and your defense attorneys to prove that you are innocent.
BACHRACH: That is true. Also, the prosecution --
BLITZER: Take a look at these pictures --
BACHRACH: Sorry.
BLITZER: Those are pictures of people coming and going.
BACHRACH: The prosecutor Mignini had it in for her, because he didn't like the way she conducted her life, he didn't like the fact that she had a lover. He didn't like the fact that condoms were found in her purse. She basically had been convicted based on her social life and on the fact that she took drugs. There's not an ounce of real, hard evidence against her and all of Italy should be ashamed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: So obviously that was her opinion. Meanwhile the prosecutor in this case as he believes he presented a strong case. Now under Italian law the jury has 90 days to submit an explanation as to how they reached their verdict.
Some welcome news on the job front here. According to the latest figures only about 11,000 jobs were cut last month bringing the unemployment rate down to 10 percent, down just 2/10 of a percent from the last month. In his radio and internet address today the president says the improvement indicates the country is emerging from what he called an economic storm, but the leader of the house of Republicans I should say disagrees with that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT UNITED STATES: In the coming days, I'll be unveiling additional ideas aimed at accelerating job growth and hiring as we emerge from this economic storm. So that we don't face another crises like this, again, I'm determined to meet our responsibility to do what we know will strengthen our economy in the long run. That is why I am not going to let up in my efforts to reform our health care system. To give our children the best education in the world. To promote the jobs of tomorrow and energy independence by investing in a clean economy. It's a deal with the mounting federal debt.
REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R) MINORITY LEADER: I can tell you, the policies being proposed by this administration and their Democratic allies in Congress are causing employers to sit on their hands. They have a stimulus bill that's not working, spending that's out of control, deficits that are out of control. And national energy tax and now, the government takeover of health care. It's causing employers to wonder what the policies here in Washington are going to mean to their future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Job numbers to approval numbers. Take a look at this our latest poll shows the president's popularity has slipped below the 50 percent mark. This is the first time it's happened. A CNN senior political correspondent Candy Crowley has the numbers and a closer look to what may be behind Mr. Obama's slide.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Trouble on the home front is eating into his political capital as the president's hard sell on Afghanistan did the job.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE U.S: I'm convinced that our security is at stake in Afghanistan and Pakistan. This is the epicenter of violent extremism practiced by al Qaeda.
CROWLEY: The latest CNN poll found that a majority of Americans still oppose the war in Afghanistan. But 62 percent favor the president's plan to send 30,000 more troops there, 36 percent are opposed. In the good news/bad news category for the president --
OBAMA: These additional American and international troops will allow us to accelerate handing over responsibility to Afghan forces and allow us to begin the transfer of our forces out of Afghanistan in July of 2011.
CROWLEY: Two-thirds of Americans favor the president's exit plan from Afghanistan. But 59 percent think it was a bad idea to announce it. Despite his success in gathering public reinforcement for more troops in Afghanistan, the president's overall approval rating has fallen below 50 percent for the first time in a CNN poll.
The latest CNN Opinion Research Corporation Poll numbers show 48 percent of Americans approve of the way he's handling his job. That is a seven point drop in less than three weeks. Partially fueling this descent is this, just 36 percent of whites who never attended college approve of the way the president is handling his job. An 18 point drop from Americans most likely to work in mining, construction and manufacturing the three hardest hit areas of the recession. With his numbers so far into the positives on Afghanistan policy, it's abundantly clear what's dragging down the president, jobs, jobs, jobs. It's not a wonder he was in Allentown, Pennsylvania Friday.
OBAMA: Americans who have been desperately looking for work for months, some of them maybe for a year or longer. They can't wait. We won't wait. We need to do everything we can right now to get our businesses hiring, again.
CROWLEY: The president is promising to send new jobs initiatives to Congress next week.
Beyond the obvious urgency of getting jobs to desperate people, there's political urgency, too. The president can afford to take a hit over high unemployment right now, but Congressional Democrats can't. A third of U.S. Senate seats and all of the House seats are up for re- election in 2010. And a 10 percent unemployment rate in the new year is no place to start.
Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Really, in this economy, who isn't worried about their own finances? So what have we done? We brought in five ladies, beauty and brains here. They call themselves the Smart Cookies, there they are. You can wave ladies, live here on CNN sitting with me in the studio. Five women with five different takes and different ways of expertise, ways to save. They say two of the biggest things people ask them, how do you get out of debt and how do you get ahead. We'll tackle those topics with the Smart Cookies coming up in the next half hour.
Now, the Senate is busy, busy right now in this rare weekend session debating health care reform. What is this? This is part of Senate majority leader Harry Reid's push to get the bill passed by Christmas. There were some heated moments earlier today, you see this, between Senator's John McCain and Max Baucus over home healthcare, lobbyists and money.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN, (R) ARIZONA: They are not to interested in seeing --
SEN. MAX BAUCUS (D), MONTANA: The time being equally allocated on this. Mr. --
MCCAIN: I don't know what the deal was.
BAUCUS: I'm going to tell you. I'm going to tell the deal.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Senator for Arizona has the floor.
MCCAIN: I don't know what the deal was, but we'll find out what the deal was. Just like the deals were cut -- it's full of lobbyists. I can't walk through the hallway without bumping into one of their lobbyist. If the Senator keeps interrupting he's in violation of the rules of the Senate, I thought he would have learned them by now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: How about that? By the way we did hear today that the president himself will be on Capital Hill listening and speaking with some of these Senators tomorrow. Expected to see him right around 2 pm Eastern Time.
To world weather we go. About this time of year, we expect to see snow, right? But, in Alabama? We will take a look at some weather that is seasonable but unreasonable. And also, NATO will help with U.S. troop bill in Afghanistan but that help comes with some strings attached. We will tell you about that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Does it exactly happen very often before Christmas, we're talking snow in the Deep South. Karen McGinnis tracking all this winter stuff for us in the CNN Weather Center. Karen I have to say it is kind of funny because as you mentioned, it's the Florida-Alabama game going on at the dome which is kind of almost attached to us here at CNN. I feel like other than the fact you can hear all the screaming, a lot of these Florida fans are wearing shorts. It's a little chilly.
KAREN MAGINNIS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: It is. The sun is shining now. But across the deep south we were just dodging a bullet a little bit as far as the snowfall is concerned. I want to show you this it will start out bright white. This was the view of a tower cam. There was snow as we look at this. This was at Tennessee, Knoxville, Tennessee. Yes they get a little bit of snowfall. Not a lot this time of year. Let's take a look at Huntsville, Alabama. They get a little snowfall. They are looking at the potential for black ice tonight as some of this melts a bit. You'll get the patchy areas. It could be dangerous as far as the driving is concerned.
Where will we watch for tonight? It is going to be across that northeastern corridor and into New England. Already from Washington, D.C. to New York up towards Boston, Boston you are right on the fringe now. I think some of that rain-snow mix is going to change over to all snowfall. You are going to see your first plow able snowfall event for this evening as that area of low pressure remains just offshore. So, it throws that moisture back on shore and you get, kind of that brisk wind. You will start to see some gale force winds here during the overnight hours.
Let's go ahead and show you what happens as far as our airport delays are concerned. What we are looking at are some delays coming out of Newark. We have delays in LaGuardia and Boston was probably going to be in the firing line here as we go into the next couple hours, so watch out for that. Philadelphia, ground delays for the next 45 minutes. Meaning if you are ready to go to Philadelphia, you are going to sit on the ground for a little while, at least for 45 minutes or so because visibility is greatly reduced. Washington, D.C., we had a picture out of Washington, D.C. of the capital. It was beautiful. The snow is coming down. It's going to do that for a little while longer.
Miami, I just checked Miami. They have some snow showers there. Rain showers, getting the rain and snow mixed up. Many Miami, we have some of the rain showers taking place there now. Temperatures in Billings, it's going to be 19. The normal highs about 36 degrees.
Brooke.
BALDWIN: That's a little chilly. You had me with snow in Miami. I was like are pigs flying? Rain in Miami.
MAGINNIS: Snow in Alabama.
BALDWIN: All right. Karen thank you.
MAGINNIS: OK.
BALDWIN: All right. We see a lot of funny videos, right? Look at this, surprise, you haven't seen it all. This is a little kitten. CNN Josh Levs will be joining us for the week's best video.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Each and every week, tons of videos are up loaded to CNN, you tube and other sites. But of course no one actually gets to see them all. But never fear, Josh Levs is here with some highlights of our new feature. This is kind of fun, this is the firstish, "Viral Video Rewind."
JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Never fear. Because people have that fear right?
BALDWIN: People are hooked on YouTube.
LEVS: Seriously. I keep looking at the numbers. Some have hundreds of millions. It's just wild. You know what we are starting off with. You can never go wrong with kittens apparently; there is always a kitten video. Well this week everyone was passing around the one now known as Surprise, kitty. If you have not seen it yet, take a look. Oh, my goodness.
BALDWIN: That is so cute. I'm sorry. I'm not a cat fan and that's cute.
LEVS: I know, you have to love it. This is adorable. Here is another kitten; we just had to watch a couple. This is pretty amazing. Take a look here. You are going to see two cats, one of them, Buzz, has figured out how to open the bathroom door.
BALDWIN: No!
LEVS: You might think -- check that out. That's real, not fake. You might think that he's pretty smart, but we think the other one is smarter, he's making Buzz do all the work.
BALDWIN: You open the door and I will go in after you.
LEVS: The next challenge is for Buzz to learn to open the can opener. We know some videos go viral not because the actual video because someone is adding something extra. Check out this. It is called hey, Alan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(UNIDENTIFIED MALE): Alan. Alan. Alan. Alan. Alan. Alan. It's not Steve. Steve. Steve. Steve. Steve. Steve. (END VIDEO CLIP)
LEVS: Most annoying. People are having a field day about it. Oh, this is where the sharks get together and make the sound from "Jaws." It keeps going. Some people have way too much time on their hands. But you know what sometimes that's how great entertainment is born.
BALDWIN: Exactly and how it makes it on CNN.
LEVS: Good point they are getting it. All right. Time for what might be my favorite this week. Having a child. The holidays are here. You are probably going to see a lot of parents especially moms dealing with small children throwing tantrums. This is TV commercial has something gone viral because it is a take on a situation that so many parents relate to.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(UNIDENTIFED FEMALE): Chance to spread and develop.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: That is funny.
LEVS: I am so trying that.
BALDWIN: That kid is like, sorry, mom.
LEVS: That might be the best piece of advice ever aside from financial advice as we are getting from you know the experts who are here. I got one more thing for you.
BALDWIN: OK.
LEVS: In the spirit of the shopping season. Parking lots, this is one of my personal pet peeves, people who just cannot park inside the lines. I don't mind them anymore. Look, this driver apparently thought no one saw what happened. Drove over two cars, two of them, flattening them, eventually left. This is when viral videos come into help, we found out that because of this the driver was found and will actually appear in court this month. Hundi came along and stepped up and replaced the damaged car.
BALDWIN: No way.
LEVS: You know what? Good can come out of the viral world.
BALDWIN: That reminds me of this, did you ever see "Fried Green Tomatoes"?
LEVS: The ladies just laughed.
BALDWIN: They get it. Josh is like, what?
LEVS: Honey, can you get us the DVD on Netflix? If you have one you like, send it our way. CNN.com/Josh, Facebook and twitter Josh Levs at CNN. Yes, Brooke we're going to hang out with the best videos. We'll have them for you.
BALDWIN: I like that, "Viral Video Rewind." It is official every Saturday. Josh thank you.
Still to come, they laughed at my joke. They are smart cookies. Also, they are really smart. Because they have a lot of financial advice. In fact I'm going to put Angela on the spot. Angela how did you become a Smart Cookie?
ANGELA, SMART COOKIE: We actually started as a money group. We had more than $50,000 of consumer debt. So we essentially formed a support group for our finances to get ahead and get on track.
BALDWIN: Did you say 50 k in debt?
ANGELA: Yes.
BALDWIN: We'll talk about that and we will go there. We'll talk about a lot of other issues that we probably all can relate to, coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: The Pentagon moving ahead with President Obama's plan to boost troop levels in Afghanistan. Pentagon officials confirming to CNN the defense secretary Robert Gates did sign an order yesterday to deploy the very first wave of these reinforcements. A total of 30,000 additional U.S. troops will be sent to Afghanistan by sometime early fall. The first wave of these forces from the army and the marines.
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton welcoming a pledge by NATO allies and other nations to send 7, 000 more troops to Afghanistan. But she is pushing for even more participation at a NATO meeting there in Brussels. Clinton has asked Turkey to contribute more troops and she is urging the Netherlands to reconsider plans to pull out its 2100 troops next year. Pressure also mounting on countries like France and Germany to add reinforcements as well.
While U.S. officials say international commitment in Afghanistan is crucial to succeeding there, crucial to that mission. U.S. forces are still doing the heavy hitting with troops from some NATO countries, passing on the most dangerous combat missions. Here now is CNN's Pentagon correspondent Chris Lawrence.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice over): In Afghanistan, some U.S. troops joke that the coalition's code letters ISAP should stand for I saw Americans fighting. It's a dig at the restrictions some other NATO countries put on their troops, like keeping them out of the most violent areas. When we look at the map, and look at where the countries are set up, we know that Germany can only operate in the north and we know that Turkey can only operate here. What are some of the other specific caveats that nations have placed on their troops? Things they can't do? JEFF DRESSLER, INSTITUTE FOR THE STUDY OF WAR: There are restrictions on forces that they cannot patrol at night. There are restrictions on forces that they cannot leave their armored vehicles when they patrol. And this is particularly problematic when you are in an insurgency fight and the goal is to make connections with the local populist to walk amongst them and to build relationships.
LAWRENCE: The NATO nations have reduced the number of caveats from 83 to around 70. NATO's former commander in Europe called that, "progress, but not near enough."
General John Craddock says some nations ignore the larger war outside their area. Quote, "They don't want to do anything else when asked by ISAF to accommodate operations across the entire country."
British, Polish, Dutch and French troops are also fighting in those violent areas. But for some the clock is ticking on their commitment.
LAWRENCE (On camera): So, we know the Taliban is very strong here in the south. And that is also where the Canadians, when I was in Afghanistan just a few weeks ago, I saw the Canadians out on a lot of missions down there with the Afghan army. They are due to leave in about 18 months.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's correct, Chris. And the thing about that is that if we can't get an additional commitment from the Canadians, for a longer stay period, what that means is General McChrystal is going to find forces to replace the Canadians.
LAWRENCE: Ideally that would be the Afghan army, if its soldiers are up to snuff by then. Now Defense Secretary Robert Gates says he 's encouraged by how many of the caveats have already been dropped. But, honestly, officials can't push these countries too hard out of fear they will pull their troops out all together. Chris Lawrence, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: They are Smart Cookies, five women, five different ways to save.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: As we mentioned, yes, there is some good news on the job front. According to the latest figures only about 11,000 jobs were cut last month, bringing the unemployment rate down to 10 percent. Down from 10.2, the previous month.
But experts say, yes, they are still worried about this growing jobless gap. The unemployment rate for whites is about 9 percent, for blacks, more like 15 percent. Teenagers still having a tough time finding jobs. The unemployment rate for teens, more than 26 percent .
Yes, the economy has a lot of you worried about when to spend, and what to save. Some of us better than others. These five women, here, to my left, started the Smart Cookies Money Club three years ago and have their own money makeover TV show in Canada. They are the authors of book, here, "Smart Cookies Guide to Making More Dough."
I like the sound of that. They are here to give us some of their best ideas. And I have to say, a lot of guys, very excited about having five lovely ladies on. T.J., earlier, was like why do you get to do that? Why weren't you on in the morning? And I appreciate you all sticking around and doing this.
Really the theme here, and I want to ask each of you, individually, because you all have your area of expertise.
But during the tough times, and yes, they are still tough, just looking at the numbers. We want to just ask how people can get through, right now? So, I have my cheat sheet, my chart here.
Let me start with, Andrea Baxter, you are the debt buster.
ANDREA BAXTER, SMART COOKIE FINANCIAL ADVISER: I am.
BALDWIN: Boy, oh, boy, a lot of people can relate.
BAXTER: I am. And I certainly came into the group with the most consumer debt. I was finding a way to start tackling it. I had credit cards in collections. I just maxed everything out. For me, coming to the group was getting to a point to find me accountable, and get to my goals, essentially.
BALDWIN: So, if somebody out there watching now is in debt, what is your quick bit of advice?
BAXTER: Well, my biggest thing, I had debt in about three different areas. So, I really needed to consolidate it. Figure out a way that I could get it all in one lump sum, on a low interest rate, and then actively start paying it down. I started paying it down automatically, it is coming out of my bank account. And that is really how I started paying it down and building my credit score.
BALDWIN: Like, automatically coming out of the bank account? Don't even think about it.
BAXTER: Yes, that's the key. Just have it come out.
BALDWIN: OK, Katie Dunsworth, oh, Smart Cookie, because you are the numbers cruncher.
KATIE DUNSWORTH, SMARK COOKIE FINANCIAL ADVISER: Numbers cruncher.
BALDWIN: I like that. So, when it comes to crunching numbers, right now, what kind of numbers should we really be paying attention to?
DUNSWORTH: Well, you own personal numbers and that is what's in your bank account and checking account. And also what's coming in and what is going out. That was shocking for all of us. We really didn't know how much we were making and more importantly, who much we were spending. This is the month you are buying holiday gifts and you are out there spending, spending, spending.
Get familiar with what's coming in. Make a budget. This is the perfect time to make a budget. And start to budget for things. There's going to be a lot of unexpected expenses in this month. So, gifts, wrapping paper, shipping, travel perhaps, so build a budget.
BALDWIN: Account for it and pay attention.
DUNSWORTH: Yes, yes.
BALDWIN: We are all trying to do better in that way.
Robyn Gunn, the cash counselor.
ROBYN GUNN, SMART COOKIE FINANCIAL ADVISER: That's right.
BALDWIN: Counsel me.
GUNN: My number one tip is start a money group. For us, we had all tried individually to get out of debt. It wasn't until we came together and held each other accountable and really challenged each other on the spending we were doing and supported each other that we made any sort of progress.
BALDWIN: Meanwhile, let me just reiterate what Angela said, earlier. You all came together with $50,000 in debt. There's no angels here, initially, right?
DUNSWORTH: No.
BALDWIN: You can all relate. OK, Sandra Hanna, the savvy spender.
SANDRA HANNA, SMART COOKIE FINANCIAL ADVISER: Yes.
BALDWIN: How can we be savvy these days?
HANNA: We are all still spending money. And for us, it was really looking at what's the smartest way to pay for things? So, initially we went to the cash system. But there were two problems with that. One, first of all we had really damaged our credit, so we weren't helping out credit by using cash. So we needed an option. And really we live in a society where you have to use plastic. I was flying the other day and you couldn't buy a snack on the plane.
BALDWIN: I was on a Delta - on a flight, recently and you can't use cash.
HANNA: You can't use cash. So, what do you do? So for us we looked into the charge card option. Now, we all personally carry American Express charge cards. But the difference is you have to pay the balance off every month. And you are building your credit, and you are earning rewards, and you are protected. If, for example, you buy a Christmas gift for the holiday season and the store won't return it, you can return it, using your charge card. You are getting extra protection. Which I think for consumers goes a really long way.
BALDWIN: I like that. Especially, because for me, you know, you use your AMEX, as you mentioned, but you want to accrue those miles or rewards. You can still do that with a charge card.
HANNA: Absolutely. You have to pay it off every month. So it is like plastic will power. You have to do it, right?
BALDWIN: Yes, I like that. Plastic will power.
OK, Angela Self, the real estate expert.
ANGELA SELF, SMART COOKIE FINANCIAL ADVISER: Yes.\
BALDWIN: Everybody laughs. Good luck with that, real estate these days.
SELF: Well, just on the topic, too, I just wanted to add on Sandra's point.
BALDWIN: Yes.
SELF: We were talking about points. This is a perfect time, especially over the holidays, to take a look at the points you have accumulated. All five of us carry charge cards and we use it for gas and groceries. You know, anything that you have to spend your money on, because we work hard for our money, so our money should also be working for us at some point. We challenge ourselves, in our money group, to spend as little as we could or purchase all of our gifts on points. And so we did that. We came to about $1,000 value, that we were able to get with our points.
DUNSWORTH: That is everything. I looked at my points cards, just last month, I had from grocery points, I was earning, air plan points, my membership rewards points, $1,000 in value. I bought everything for the holidays, just using points on things I had already spent on.
BALDWIN: Where can people go to get those easy how-to's? Is there a website, where you can find those deals? Or you know about the rewards?
HANNA: People have been skimming through using our web site, and we have been really busy this holiday season. We have been really trying to go through all of those different web sites, so if you come to SmartCookies.com, we have a daily tip that goes out, that will help you, you know, use your points in the smartest way.
We did one recently were there was an app you could download, called Save Benjis, that will help you actually scan if you are going to purchase something. Save Your Benjis. It is so cool. But it is all those little things that, you know, you can use it in your day-to- day life just to really make your dollar go further and help dig yourself out of debt, if are in that situation.
BALDWIN: Because at the end of the day, we all want our dollar to go further. Let's get Josh in on this mix. Josh wants to talk to you all, as well.
JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Of course, I do. Of course, I do.
(CROSS TALK)
So does everyone who is at home and trying to email us right now.
BALDWIN: We are sticking with this segment, that's for sure.
Josh, are we getting e-mails? Do people have questions for them?
LEVS: Yes, they do. I'll tell you what. Let me do this, because you all know best who is going to handle which question. I'll toss a few of our viewer questions at you, you just grab it as it goes, OK?
Let's go to this first one here. This one come to us, we're going to Nick. This is interesting. He says he is a "recent graduate trying to make a smart start. I have a job, but not a career. I want to start saving in a 401(k) but don't have one. I know the alternative is an IRA. Is it prudent to open one?"
All right, who fields that?
DUNSWORTH: I can talk to that. I mean, we have to preface that we don't have, we are not financial planners, we are not financial, like, we are not designated in that area.
One of the things I would ask back to this viewer is, are you in debt? Certainly, if you are just entering a career, I suspect you have some student debt. We always, really, really encourage anyone that is coming out of school to first focus on getting out of debt, getting that great job, then looking at, OK, I'm in my job, here is the best option. You know, as someone who, I mean, I do personally invest. I recommend you have to do your research on is a 401(k) better than an IRA? And that is something that is really important to investigate.
LEVS: Let me follow up with you guys, on that quickly. About debt, because when you guys had to make some serious financial decisions to turn your own lives around financially. When you were trying to tackle debt, did you also put some focus on paying down mortgage and that kind of thing? Or was it simply school debt, credit card debt, then start your basic investments?
BALDWIN: Good question.
SELF: Yes, the first debt that we tackled was our consumer debt. The highest interest debt that we had, then we worked there.
BAXTER: For me, it was really like -because I was paying down like maxed out credit cards, and stuff. It was, for me, paying it down. Getting a system down where I was regularly doing it, because I had to build up my credit score. I had pretty much killed it. And through that I was also efficient in starting to save a little bit more money, and still sort of keep up with my investments. You have to be smart about it.
HANNA: It was interesting, because as we went further along in the money group and got out of debt and started looking at investing. I know, Katie and Nick own property. You looked well, should we be investing or is it just smarter to pay down the mortgage.
BALDWIN: Right.
HANNA: And you guys have.
DUNSWORTH: Yes.
HANAN: You have paid down a huge chunk of your mortgage.
DUNSWORTH: Yes and that was something that was a personal goal of mine. Something that I think people should consider, too, is do you have a match program at your work? And if you do, and it maxes at a certain point, that's money your employer is giving you. Take it.
BALDWIN: Take advantage of that.
(CROSS TALK)
LEVS: Let me get in one more question here. It's really interesting to get your perspectives. So often, it's the paid financial planners, the professional financial planners. And here, you have people who admit the situations they were in, you all had to turn yourselves around. Here is an interesting one. I bet you get this a lot. I want to go to this question from Terence. Because we keep talking about unemployment. "Advice please, for what/how to spend when on unemployment."
Obviously, save, save, save is the key. But you have to spend. What are your priorities and how do they change when you are facing unemployment?
HANNA: I think you want to look at anything that's going to invest in helping you get a job, too. If it is one of those things where you want to be looking at investing in a new computer or a maybe a few new work clothes, you want to absolutely look at those things, too.
LEVS: That's great.
BALDWIN: And the Dolan's talking earlier, Josh, remember how we were talking about unemployment. They made that point, that kind of like unemployment for some people is almost like this psychological cushion. Like they don't have to go ahead and start job seeking. Obviously, you need to get out of the PJs and start looking for a job.
DUNSWORTH: Yes, get out there.
LEVS: Speaking of job seeking, let me toss in one more. This is also interesting. It comes to us from Kelley. And she, like a lot of people, people like Kelley get left out when we hear about this. Kelley wrote us: "I'm grateful I have a job, but severely underemployed."
And this is a good point, because we hear jobs -unemployment is going down, but underemployment is millions of Americans.
She says, you know what, "the baby boomers are holding on tight to their jobs."
And you can't blame them. If you are facing unemployment, do you guys have advice for what to do to try to fill that gap?
DUNSWORTH: Well, we got really creative and this is partially what our book is about, is making more dough. And finding the hidden money in your life. What we really looked at was things we weren't using. We always joked, we'll sell anything we haven't used in the last few months. So, that is eBay, that is Craig's List, it is consigning clothes. Those things are in your life, and they are worth something. So, you can make a little bit of money doing that. We walked dogs. We took on any kind of work we could to make a little bit more and put that down on our debt.
LEVS: You know what, I hear some people say nothing is beneath you. Like you might not have wanted to be a dog walker -- although that sounds fun -- but I understand, the idea is -and a lot of people, you have to look lower right, to get the little bits that you can.
I know we have to wrap this segment. I want to thank you all. I see your website, I like it by the way, SmartCookies.com. Plus, you got the domain. It wasn't taken.
And Brooke, our producer, Eddie, is insisting that I inform you, you too, are smart cookie, hence, six Smart Cookies up there.
ALL IN UNISON: Ah!
BALDWIN: Thanks, Eddie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are!
BALDWIN: I've got the book. It will go on my bedside table, I have a feeling. We can all learn a little from the "Smart Cookies Guide to Making More Dough" Ladies, thank you so much.
ALL IN UNISON: Thank you.
BALDWIN: So great. OK, I smell a segment, but anyway.
Checking today's top stories here.
An attorney for an American student Amanda Knox says his client is angry about her conviction on murder charges. Knox and her former Italian boyfriend were convicted of killing Knox's roommate during a sexual assault at their home in Italy. Knox was sentenced to 26 years in prison. Her boyfriend received slightly lower, 25 years. Both planning an appeal.
Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev demanding the harshest possible punishment for the people responsible for a nightclub fire that killed more than 100 people there, in the city of Perm. Officials say this performance artist was juggling fireworks. Apparently tossed them too high, set the club's ceiling on fire.
Look at all of these people just trying to get out.
In addition to the deaths, about 130 people were injured, many of them critically. Five people have been detained in the investigation, including the club's owners.
A racetrack fire outside of Cincinnati has killed two people and scores of horses. This pre-dawn fire there, at the Lebanon Raceway, broke out in a barn the size of a football field. Investigators now, just working to figure out what caused it. Today's races, as you can imagine, have been cancelled.
One of the hottest toys this holiday season could be a hazard to your child's health. The Consumer product testing company, Good Guides, says Zhu Zhu pet named Mr. Squiggles contains high levels of a potentially toxic chemical. The robotic hamsters have been one of the top selling toys this year; flying off store shelves across the country. Warning about that.
One good deed deserves another, right? Well, it doesn't always happen does it? But it did during this robbery attempt, there in New York, and next we will bring you part two of this very unusual story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Have you heard about this crime story out of New York? It had an ending very few would have predicted. This would-be robber was actually given a second chance by his victim. And now months later that suspect reaching out to show his own appreciation. Here is CNN's Mary Snow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): We first brought you Mohammad Sohail's story in June, when he showed mercy to a would-be robber who came into his store demanding money. The ordeal, all captured by surveillance cameras. Sohail grabbed a rifle and said the man began crying saying he needed to feed his family. Sohail gave him $40, a loaf of bread, and made him promise never to rob again.
Six months later the 47-year-old Sohail says that promise was returned in a way he never imagined. He recently received a letter with $50 inside, and no return address.
MOHAMMAD SOHAIL, CONVENIENCE STORE OWNER: What is that? And when I read the letter, there's the same person, you know, the guy come try to rob my store.
SNOW: He read it for us.
SOHAIL: Now, I have a good job, making good money, staying out of trouble, and taking care of my family. You give me $40 and a loaf of bread. Here is the $50. Thank you for sparing my life, because of that you changed my life.
SNOW (On camera): Did you cry when you got that letter?
SOHAIL: Absolutely. Because all the time I'm thinking my mom. My mom say, help anybody if anybody need help.
SNOW (voice over): The letter is signed your Muslim Brother, and the writer states he's now a true Muslim. During the aborted robbery, the man told Sohail he wanted to be a Muslim just like him, and Sohail recited an Islamic prayer and told him he was converted.
While the man's life may have changed, things are also different for this Pakistani immigrant. At his store in Shirley, New York, he displays letters he's received from across the country.
SNOW: "Dear Mr. Sohail, I want to say this, that no person has ever moved my spirit the way you did." Wow, from an admirer. Your biggest admirer. Do you know who Lee is?
SOHAIL: I have no idea. People are sending me the letters.
SNOW: And some have sent checks. Sohail says he's received a couple hundred dollars and now offers free bagels, rolls, and coffee for several hours during the day, and he vows to help others.
(On camera): Would you, one day, like to meet with this anonymous mystery man?
SOHAIL: Of course. I would like to see him. I want to see him. If he hear me, if he listening to me, this person, come to my store.
SNOW (voice over): While Sohail says all is forgiven in his eyes, the Suffolk County police say this is still an open investigation, as they have yet to find the mystery man. Mary Snow, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: Hunting down those who committed unspeakable acts during World War II. They devoted their lives to bringing war criminals to justice. We'll introduce you to one of the very last Nazi hunters.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: In Germany retired U.S. autoworker John Demjanjuk is standing trial for some of the most heinous of crimes. Prosecutors say this 89-year-old served as a guard at a Nazi death camp and had a direct role in the murder of thousands of people, of course, mostly Jews.
Ever since the end of World War II a dedicated group of people have really just devoted their lives to bringing those who carried out the Holocaust to justice. And CNN, two of our own producers have profiled one of the last remaining Nazi hunters. Here is a portion of their documentary. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
EFRAIM ZUROFF, SIMON WIESENTHAL CENTER: It's very important to remember that the Holocaust was not a natural disaster. It wasn't a tsunami, a volcano, or an earthquake, but rather a disaster carried out by men and women against their fellow human beings.
From Vienna, 1703, Anne Frank from Holland, Pasternak, 1900.
I'm named for a person who was killed in the Holocaust, but that was never made a big deal out of, the fact that my mother's uncle, Franz Zuroff (ph), was a great Talmud scholar was far more important than the fact he'd been killed in the Holocaust. And I don't think that even my grandparents knew the details.
In order to understand the significance of this place is to imagine, or to recreate in your mind, the crimes that were carried out here. And ironically it's exactly the same with the case of the Nazi war criminals we are trying to bring to justice today. Because if you look at them, what you see is the elderly individuals who look absolutely harmless. But what I have said to people is that you have to look at them and imagine them as young people who carry out murder. Young people who have no mercy on their victims. Young people who organized the murder of innocent men, women, and children.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: Well, John Demjanjuk was brought to trial after more than 30 years of legal wrangling. And coming up here in our next hour, we're going to talk to both of these producers of the CNN documentary and find out why time has become another enemy of the people trying to bring Holocaust perpetrators to justice.
