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Prism

U.S. Military Command Gets Grilled On Capitol Hill on Obama Afghan Strategy

Aired December 09, 2009 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

STAN GRANT, CNN INT'L. ANCHOR, PRISM (voice over): Just how will the additional 30,000 U.S. troops in Afghanistan be used? The new U.S. war strategy front and center on Capitol Hill.

With a temporary freeze on settlements like these, Israeli settlers plan a show of force in Jerusalem, mobilizing outside the house of the prime minister.

And in our "Prism Segment" tonight, one of the world's biggest emitters of greenhouse gases is not yet required to cut those emissions. So how much longer will China be considered a developing country?

From CNN Abu Dhabi in United Arab Emirates, this is PRISM, where we take a story and look at it from multiple perspectives. I'm Stan Grant.

We begin with the war in Afghanistan and the barrage of questions being asked now on Washington's Capitol Hill. Lawmakers are quizzing the U.S. commander who lead the so-called surge in Iraq, along with the U.S. ambassador to Kabul.

Our Jill Dougherty is following it all at the U.S. State Department.

And, Jill, they have the extra troops now on the ground, or soon on their way, is it going to be enough to get the job done?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN INT'L. CORRESPONDENT: Well, Stan, that is part what they are talking about. Certainly, you know, numbers, but what I think you are seeing emerging in these two days, and officials have been up for two days, on Capitol Hill, is really how is the strategy going to work? And how are those troops, 30,000 American troops, and probably 7,000 to 10,000 NATO troops. How are they actually going to be carrying out their mission? And a big focus of this is on the Taliban and Pakistan, and other issues.

But getting back to Petraeus, he is the person who did carry out the surge in 2007, in Iraq. And he made that analogy today, comparing it to Afghanistan. Here is what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEN. DAVID PETRAEUS, U.S. COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Well, certainly difficult, different, and in some ways tougher than Iraq, Afghanistan is no more hopeless than Iraq was when I took command there in February 2007.

Indeed, the level of violence and number of violent civilian deaths in Iraq were vastly higher than we have seen in Afghanistan. But achieving progress in Afghanistan will be hard and the progress there likely will be slower in developing than was the progress achieved in Iraq.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOUGHERTY: And then part of that, of course, is the question of the Taliban, and how they fit in both in Afghanistan - in Afghanistan, and what to do with them. And that's emerging as another really key issue, Stan.

GRANT: Jill, this has been called the view from the ground. So, what are we actually hearing from the ground in Afghanistan?

DOUGHERTY: You know, I'd have to say this hearing, and I've listened to the one yesterday and now today, this hearing very, very much on Pakistan. And you heard it from the chairman, John Kerry, who began talking about it.

He said, "What happens in Pakistan, particularly, on the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan will do more to determine the outcome in Afghanistan than any number of troops or any shift in strategy."

And that was also said, essentially, by Petraeus. That what you have there, you can see what they're trying to do; what they are saying is deal with the Taliban, you can't kill every Taliban, but you can -they believe - degrade them to the point that the Afghan security forces, beefed up and trained by the United States and NATO, will be able to do that.

And then, that is definitely going to push some of the Taliban over the border into Pakistan. That's where they are hoping that the Pakistanis will, as Petraeus said, take their catcher's mitt, baseball terminology, or a net and get the Taliban as they are going across the border.

GRANT: Jill, thank you very much for bringing us up to date on that. Jill Dougherty joining us there from the U.S. State Department.

And you can hear from General Stanley McChrystal, the commander in Afghanistan, live in a one-on-one interview with Christiane Amanpour. That will be a special edition of "AMANPOUR" in just over four hours, at 21:30 GMT, 1:00 in the morning, here in Abu Dhabi.

Well, the Afghan president's pledge to clean up corruption appears to be off a rough start. The mayor of Kabul was back at work today, even though the attorney general's office says he is no longer in power. The Mayor Abdul Ahad Sahebi was sentenced Monday to four years in jail on a corruption charge. But he is free pending an appeal and insists he is still mayor. It is not clear yet what action, if any, will be taken if he shows up for work tomorrow.

Iraqis are demanding answers, the prime minister is calling for patience, and Baghdad is burying its dead after a string of coordinated bombings that killed nearly 130 people and wounded hundreds more. Tuesday's attack shattered what had been a time of relative calm in the Iraqi capitol. Isha Sesay joins us now live from CNN Baghdad with more.

And so many questions, Isha, being asked about security and how this attack was able to happen with so much security around.

ISHA SESAY, CNN INT'L. CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, Stan. That is a question you are hearing from ordinary Iraqis on the ground. Who, indeed, are saying you have this number of security checkpoints that litter Baghdad, how is it possible that these terrorists continue to strike, striking in August and in October. Of course, in October claiming the lives of 155 people. Then again, on Tuesday, in these coordinated attacks. You know many questions, many questions being asked.

You know we have some of the local papers that we have been looking at throughout the day. And this one here, "Al Shaka Alsad" (ph), and the headline, you see the picture there, of the devastation and shell-shocked people. If you can make that out. The headline saying quite simply, "Baghdad Wakes Up to Another Bloody Day". Another one to share with you, this comes from "Azamam" (ph), another popular newspaper. Again, just pictures of the devastation, of the carnage, and they say, "Another Bloody Day In Baghdad" and calls for the removal of the security chiefs, reaches a climax.

We heard those calls in the parliament yesterday, where a pre- arranged session ended up being dominated by security issues. And lawmakers on all sides, different political groups, different sectarian groups all saying that they need answers. Demanding that the prime minister, the minister of defense, interior and security chiefs, appear before them on Thursday to answer their questions, Stan.

GRANT: Isha, thank you for that. Isha Sesay joining us live there from Baghdad.

Late last month Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu announced a temporary freeze on new home construction in the West Bank. Now Israeli settlers have gathered outside his home in Jerusalem to show him how outraged they are. Our Ian Watson is at the protest now.

Ivan, what are you seeing?

IVAN WATSON, CNN INT'L. CORRESPONDENT: Well, Stan, this is a show of force. A show of protest by the Israeli settler movement. They have gathered in downtown Jerusalem to voice their opposition to this freeze, this temporary freeze, of 10 months on settlement building in the West Bank, that was declared two weeks ago by Prime Minister Netanyahu. It is a 10-month freeze. The signs behind me say, "Oppose the Freeze, We are Going to Break the Freeze."

And what we have seen over the course of the past two weeks is settlers actually obstructing government inspectors who have been trying to go in and inspect construction sites. There has been some criticism of this decision made by Prime Minister Netanyahu, coming from the left and also from the Palestinians, saying it doesn't go far enough. In fact, that municipal buildings, schools, can continue to be built in West Bank settlements, which the U.S. government considers illegitimate to this day.

The settlement movement in the West Bank is about a quarter of a million people and the settlement movement has called for a gathering here to show their opposition to this decision, to this settlement freeze, not only to the Israeli government, but also to foreign governments that have put a lot of pressure on Prime Minister Netanyahu to stop the construction of these settlements in the West Bank.

This is a very organized movement. Let's take a list to what one Israeli analyst has to say about the settler movement in this country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HIRSH GOODMAN, ISRAELI POLITICAL ANALYST: On the ground, I can almost guarantee you that there is going to be a lot of movement underground. The settler movement is one of the most organized, dedicated, focused and politically suave movements in the country.

They are tight. They have all got military experience. The know how to communicate. They know how to move big implements. They are very good at what they do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATSON: Now, Stan, the settler movement, the pro settler parties got about 20 percent of the vote in the last elections. The point here is for the settlers to show the Israeli government it is going to cost a lot to try to put any freeze on growth of these settlements, in the occupied West Bank, Stan.

GRANT: Yes, Ivan, let's just pursue that point a little bit. Because we heard from Benjamin Netanyahu when he announced this, he said it was one of the most difficult things he had to do. It goes to the identity of Israel. Just how much of a cost will there be for him? How do ordinary Israelis, apart from those in the settlements, feel about this?

WATSON: Well, this is difficult for Prime Minister Netanyahu, especially since one of his campaign promises, he promised to expand the settlements in the occupied West Bank. I think that you would find that Israeli political opinion is split depending on where people fit in on the ideological spectrum. There is significant opposition from the Left to the settler movement. It is not popular in all circles. But again, the settler movement has shown that it can use force. For instance, defying government inspectors trying to show up to inspect whether or not construction is being made. We have seen settlers actually, the leaders, ripping up the government commands, making a big show of this. It is a direct challenge to the government and its recent orders that have gone out. They are showing that this is going to be a major battle, domestically, for Prime Minister Netanyahu, Stan.

GRANT: Ivan, thank you for that. Ivan Watson joining us there, from that protest, in Jerusalem.

Well, intense negotiations and outrage over a leaked draft memo. We'll check in on the third day of the controversial U.N. climate change summit in Copenhagen.

And a massive iceberg is on the move and it may finally pose a problem for somebody. We'll explain in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRANT: Welcome back.

Delegates from 192 nations are talking, in Copenhagen, about climate change, but in Rome members of Green Peace were getting a bit more active to tackle the problem. Demonstrators climbed halfway of the Coliseum to promote a new climate agreement. They left a banner behind. Other activists on the ground said the conference must act now to end global warming.

Well, as the climate conference unfolds the gap between developed and developing nations is more evident. In our "Prism Segment" this evening, examining China's developing nation status. Should China be subject to the same standards as industrialized countries? In August 2008 the Center for Global Development reported that China surpassed the United States as the world's biggest emitter of carbon dioxide, from power generation. That doesn't make it the worst polluter, Shen Jiru (ph), a Chinese researcher see the Copenhagen summit this way, "China, as a large and responsible developing country has voluntarily made an important commitment which has been widely praised by every country in the world. It will be a contribution to the conference."

Jiru is referring to China's pledge to make what it calls notable cuts to its emissions. So, is it just talk or will real cuts be made? Helen Clark with the U.N. development program offered her thoughts, in an interview with CNN's Chief International Correspondent Christiane Amanpour.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HELEN CLARK, U.N. DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS: The developed countries will have binding targets in the treaty, I hope. But the developing countries are also making their own moves. And it seems to me that when China puts its reputation out there, saying it will do this. When India puts its reputation out there, I believe they are going to do it. I think the moral pressure to do it is incredible, but I think they want to do it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRANT: What China has pledged to reduce is not an absolute number, but what it is called its carbon intensity, or energy efficiency. Which means that as China's economy continues to grow so will its carbon output.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREAS CARLGREN, SWEDISH ENVIRONMENTAL MINISTER: It seems that under some circumstances and with high economic growth in China, which should be expected, it could also mean a significant, raise of their emissions. It means their bid could also, cover a significant increase of emissions. And that is, of course, not in line with the global ambitions. The Chinese, they know very well, what EU expects from them.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRANT: Well, the blogosphere is very active with commentary on the climate change summit. We found an editorial on TreeHugger.com about China. It reads, in part: "With China already demonstrating leadership on renewable energy and energy efficiency efforts and with both the developing and the developed world hanging on Beijing's every word, the success or failure of Copenhagen will large part depend upon China."

We want to turn to our Correspondent Phil Black now. He's in Copenhagen with some perspective on the summit.

And no doubt, Phil, China front and center and the developing world very concerned about what it sees as an effort by the developed world to put them at a disadvantage. What is going on here?

PHIL BLACK, CNN INT'L. CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Stan, we have seen some very strong passionate reactions in the last few days that really give a sense of just how vast the differences are between the rich and poor countries.

At this, I guess, approaching a mid-point in the conference almost, and time is ticking here and the differences do seem quite large. What has been getting all the headlines here is something known as the "Danish text", which Denmark says is just a consultation document. Something designed to provoke reactions in the leaders to this conference. But it is being seen by the developing world as a real threat. They believe that it is the developed world that has sort of ganged up together secretly negotiated what they would prefer to be the outcome at this conference in such a way that it really does deliver on their interests. And give them all the power when it comes to moving forward on climate change. The cuts for the developed world would not be enough. That they would control the funding, the international funding that hopefully will be committed to here, in order to help the developing countries deal with climate change, and so forth.

Now, this paper, although, it is really informal, it has not official status here yet. Because it has not been entered into the formal discussions, we know that for a fact. We don't know what sort of role it is playing, but it is highlighting, as I say, the vast differences that really do exist between these two blocks, globally, Stan.

GRANT: Phil, China, let's just take its position. Its position has always been that while the developed world, the West has had time to build its economy, the developing world needs the same, and they shouldn't be put at a disadvantage. But you are talking about a country that is looking to put a man on the moon. That is on the verge of overtaking Japan as the number two economy in the world. Is that still a viable argument?

BLACK: Well, China certainly says it is, but under the conventions of this conference, under the U.N.'s rules by which they negotiate on climate change, yes, China, although it is a massive booming economy is still labeled as a developing country. And even the United States does not necessarily argue with that. But the belief is that all future carbon emissions from here, the real growth in carbon emissions are going to come from these big growing countries. They may not be as developed as the West, but they are developing. They are developing rapidly and as a result their carbon emissions are soaring. And they are soaring well past Western countries.

The U.S. says quite distinctly that not only is China now the only, the single biggest emitter in the world but its numbers are really going to get bigger from here. And today, the U.S. lead negotiator here, Todd Stern, arrived in Copenhagen, and he really stressed the importance of China and the role that it is going to play in the coming days. And you really get a sense that it does come down between China and the United States and what they are prepared to offer. But take a listen to Todd Stern's comments regarding China and just what role he believes they need to play at this conference.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TODD STERN, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY ON CLIMATE CHANGE: The country whose emissions are going up dramatically, really dramatically, is China. And that is the reason that we can't have an agreement that doesn't have a real commitment by China. I mean, right now China is the biggest emitter in the world. By 2020 it is going to be 60 percent larger than United States, by 2030 it is going to be 80 percent larger than the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACK: Pretty much everyone will tell you, here, that the United States and China are the two biggest players. They both put offers on the table, in the lead up to this conference. They did so within one day of each other. And there is a real sense that these two countries are staring each other down, unwilling to give more until they see what the other one is doing, Stan.

GRANT: Phil, thank you very much for that. Phil Black joining us there from the climate change conference in Copenhagen. As he was saying, there, they talk about a G8 or G20, now they are talking about a G2. The United States and China, very much at the forefront at this battle on c climate change. Differing views on China and climate change in our "Prism Segment".

Up next, we'll take a look at your worldwide weather picture. Also it is twice the size of Manhattan, and it is on the move. We'll tell you where this monster iceberg is headed. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRANT: This is big, really big. A massive iceberg, twice the size of New York's Manhattan Island, is drifting closer to Australia. It broke off an Antarctic ice shelf a decade ago. Still the 140-square kilometer ice chunk remains 1,700 kilometers from Australia's west coast. Scientists say the warmer waters will likely cause it to melt before it gets too close - coming from Australia, I would hope so!

Checking in with Mari Ramos, now at the CNN World Weather Center.

(WEATHER REPORT)

MARI RAMOS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Let's go ahead and head to a place that is a little bi warmer. I really wanted to show you this, these pictures, Stan.

Hawaii, surf it way up. Look at the size of those waves. They actually have their extreme competition for surfing, because this time of year would be the time of year where you see these huge waves. And they actually have a high surf warning still in effect across parts of Hawaii. Some of those waves were five stories high. The guy who won this won $55,000.

And I know that you like to surf too, Stan.

GRANT: Not in those waves I don't, Mari. I'll put my hands up, I don't have that much courage. But my sister-in-law lives right on that beach. So, there you go.

RAMOS: That's fun.

GRANT: She's got a bird's eye view.

Fantastic. Thank you, Mari.

And that's it for me, Stan Grant, in Abu Dhabi. "BUSINESS TRAVELLER" up next after we update the headlines.

END