Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Tonight
Rising Drug Prices; Climate Change Summit; Obama's Agenda; International Custody Battle; California in Crisis
Aired December 16, 2009 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Tonight a potentially bad drug deal for Americans, prescription prices are soaring. Why did lawmakers say no to cheaper imported drugs.
An international custody clash, a Brazilian court rules an American father can finally take his 9-year-old son home, but is the fight really over?
Also California's not so golden future, the state's troubled school system, once the nation's gold standard. Things have changed, our special series "California in Crisis" continues.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN TONIGHT live from New York. Here now, John Roberts.
ROBERTS: Good evening and thanks very much for joining us. American drug makers beat back efforts to allow cheaper, imported drugs from hitting the market. The Senate voted down an amendment that would have eased restrictions on drugs from places like Canada and Europe. It was part of the larger health care legislation. The vote was considered a victory for President Obama despite the fact that he had supported the idea of importing drugs in the past. Meanwhile, drug costs are soaring. Americans pay some of the highest prescription drug prices in the world. Bill Tucker reports on why that may not be changing any time soon.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Prescription drug prices are rising, up nine percent over the past year according to the AARP. By comparison overall inflation at the consumer level has risen by roughly two percent as measured by the government's consumer price index. The drug price increases would seem to fly on the face of President Obama's announcement this summer about a deal reached with the drug companies.
BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The pharmaceutical industry has committed to reduce its draw on the health care system by $80 billion over the next 10 years as part of overall health care reform. TUCKER: That agreement was intended to be a part of any health care reform legislation before it's signed into law. Consumer advocates say that at the current rate of drug price increases the first year's projected savings from the so-called deal will be wiped out before any bill takes effect. Ironically it was concerned that that agreement could fall apart that led to the narrow defeat Monday night of a Senate amendment to allow pharmacies to re-import drugs from countries such as Canada, where drug prices are lower.
The AARP released this statement in reaction to the vote, saying quote, "The AARP is disappointed that the Senate rejected this smart bipartisan legislation to help bring down prescription drug prices for millions of Americans." But a study partially funded by the pharmaceutical industry questions whether there are significant savings in re-importing drugs.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: Now that study done in 2005 found that Americans do pay more for brand names than people in other countries but we also pay less for generic drugs. However, one of the authors of that report says drug prices since that report was issued have in fact been rising faster in the United States, John, than they are in other countries.
ROBERTS: So Bill, why rising faster here?
TUCKER: Well two reasons really -- one, we use a lot of the drugs. The number of people alone on Lipitor in this country is equal to half the population of Canada and the other is...
ROBERTS: That would be, what, about 16.5 million people?
(CROSSTALK)
TUCKER: ... million people and the other is that most of those countries have drug price controls -- John.
ROBERTS: All right, Bill Tucker for us tonight -- Bill, thanks so much.
The health care debate continues to divide the nation. The latest poll suggests the majority of Americans remain unconvinced that health care reform will save them money or even provide better quality. A new ABC News/"Washington Post" poll shows 53 percent of the public sees higher costs for themselves if the propose changes making their way through Congress become law. The poll also indicates that only 37 percent of those surveyed say the quality of their health care would be better under the proposed changes.
Turning overseas to the climate change summit -- in Copenhagen, about 250 protestors were arrested today after more violent clashes with police. Police struck demonstrators with batons outside the site of the conference. This latest protest comes as President Obama plans to leave for Copenhagen for the final days of what's being called high-level negotiations. Our White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux joins us now with more. Suzanne, there are rising tensions between the United States and China at this summit as well. What is the issue between the two countries?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: John, absolutely. I have been on the phone with a number of officials who are on the ground in Copenhagen and they really say it's crunch time now, it's deal or no deal. And they say that all indications now is that China is not yet ready for a deal, perhaps they don't even want a deal.
There was a draft resolution that was put before -- four different countries rejected it. It was China as well as India, Sudan and Brazil. They had not yet seen the text according to sources who are familiar with how this all went down earlier. The big problem, China still feels officials believe that they're being singled out for opening up and taking a look at how they are cutting their own emissions.
They believe that this is really a violation, if you will, of their own sovereignty and that this is not something that they should be subjected to. I pressed Robert Gibbs today and said look, you know what is the United States offering? Carrots or sticks or anything to move the position of the Chinese? He said we are making the case that this is common sense. That you've got to be able to verify that you're cutting your emissions, otherwise, this deal, this treaty makes no sense at all.
He also pointed out the fact that we are in a different place than we were just two weeks ago. Before, you may recall, John, it was not likely that the Chinese were even going to agree to a target to cut their emissions. Well now they have. It was unsure whether or not they were even going to attend this climate summit. Well now they are and so there is some movement, some progress, but we're really going to have to see the next 48 hours if these leaders when they sit down can make some breakthrough here -- John.
ROBERTS: The president has been reaching out to a number of nations. He's been working the telephones, calling a lot of leaders. What does he hope to accomplish?
MALVEAUX: Well he's actually been on the phone. He's been having conference calls, video conference over the last 24, 48 hours. Prime minister of Bangladesh, as well as Ethiopia, also the leaders of Germany, France, other leaders that he is reaching out to. Essentially, the message here is that we heard before from Secretary Clinton that the United States has not always really been there when it comes to pushing for climate change.
In her words "a blind eye to climate change for too long" -- that is what President Obama is saying here. He's saying look you know we haven't always gotten to where we need to be. Now we're at a different place here. Just take a look at what we've done over the last 10 months or so within his own administration dealing with climate change, perhaps that will motivate some of the others to get involved and to sign this treaty.
ROBERTS: Suzanne Malveaux for us tonight at the White House -- Suzanne, thanks.
The president this week gave himself a grade of B-plus for his week so far. You might remember that, but will that grade change if two of the president's major initiatives, health care and climate change stall? Joining us now our senior political correspondent Candy Crowley -- so Candy, the president has got a lot riding on these next few days, how badly does he need some form of health care reform legislation to pass, first of all?
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: In the long term, and when I say long term, let's say between now and the 2010 elections, he really needs health care reform. This was a signature part of his campaign. This was the one he pushed the hardest, the one he talked about the most. It's what he put out there as priority number one in January, to have a Democratic House, a Democratic Senate and a Democrat president and go up into next year's elections without a health care bill would be very, very damaging to the Democratic Party. Obviously he's not running for reelection, but he needs those Democrats up there and he may need more considering what we're seeing now.
ROBERTS: Right. The last time that the president went to Copenhagen, it didn't turn out so well. He didn't come back with the Chicago Olympics. He is going there tomorrow to try to push for a deal on climate change. Is this another risk for the president?
CROWLEY: Always. I think that every time -- I mean most people when they look at foreign policy have always said that a U.S. president should not go somewhere unless he knows he is going to come back with something. And certainly a week ago, when the president changed his schedule and decided to come at the end of the conference there was some hope that there would be something that he could bring home.
Now that looks pretty much in doubt, as you were just talking about. So you know President Obama has also had a different sort of take on these. And he has taken a number of trips, had a number of high-level meetings that produced nothing tangible he could bring home, so there is always that risk that the next time will be the time people saying boy, it's great. We are really popular over there but it really hasn't panned out into anything truly significant.
So I think a trip overseas, certainly one as high profile as this, is always a bit of a risk. It's certainly not anything that would do major damage. And if he can sell it as another step and having made progress, as you're seeing they're already doing by what Suzanne just said, then you know perhaps he can sell it that way.
ROBERTS: And it's not just the president that is weighing in on climate change this week. There is a pretty heated battle going on among two Republicans as well. What can you tell us...
(CROSSTALK)
ROBERTS: What can you tell us about that? CROWLEY: Whoever said the Republicans didn't have a big tent. It was California Governor Schwarzenegger and Sarah Palin. You know she wrote an op-ed not too long ago in "The Washington Post" and said the president should boycott Copenhagen that any kind of benefit you would get from reducing carbon emissions with (INAUDIBLE) so-called cap and trade program is far outweighed by the damage it would to the economy, so I just want to read you two quotes.
Schwarzenegger responded to that and said "is she -- is Palin really interested in this subject or is she interested in her career in winning the presidential nomination". She fired back on Facebook and said "why is Governor Schwarzenegger pushing for the same sorts of policies in Copenhagen that have helped drive his state into record deficits and unemployment"? So you know they're having -- we know they have demonstrations on the streets, but lots of vitriol here inside the Republican Party, which basically is -- does have a great diversity of opinion on climate change, whether it exists, what one should do about it, but this is two pretty big rock stars there mixing it up.
ROBERTS: All right, well, you know comedy perhaps is not what it used to be. All right thanks very much, Candy Crowley.
CROWLEY: Sure.
ROBERTS: A Washington beltway power broker is "TIME" magazine's "Person of the Year" for 2009. He is Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke. "TIME" calls Bernanke the world's most important player guiding the world's most important economy. The magazine credits the Fed chief with guiding the nation through a weak recovery rather than a catastrophic depression in 2009. By the way, this afternoon, the Fed announced it is holding interest rates at the current record low level near zero percent.
And The Associated Press announced its "Athlete of the Decade" today and the winner by a landslide -- yes you probably guessed it -- Tiger Woods. Voters show that Woods' golf domination could not be erased by the last three weeks of scandalous headlines. More than half of the ballots were received after the late November car crash that plunged Tiger's life into turmoil. Woods has won 56 tournaments this decade including 12 majors. He earned more than $80 million from PGA events alone and has become the nation's first athlete to earn $1 billion.
Coming up, the custody battle over an American boy playing out in Brazil -- the court says his father can finally take his 9-year-old son home after five long years, but the fight may not be over.
Also our special series, "California in Crisis", tonight why is the state's one mighty school system now such a mess?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Some important new developments tonight in a story that we have been following closely. It now appears that 9-year-old Sean Goldman (ph) who was spirited away from New Jersey to Brazil five years ago may be reunited with his American father. Ines Ferre has the latest.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): David Goldman (ph) is a man who must contain himself in case there is another disappointment. He feels so close to getting back the son who was taken from him five years ago. Now in a 3-0 decision, a Brazilian court said Goldman's (ph) 9-year-old son Sean (ph) must be returned to his father in New Jersey.
DAVID GOLDMAN, SON ABDUCTED TO BRAZIL: I have been down this road many times. I have to keep my emotions in check. I'm hoping and praying for the best.
FERRE: Goldman has been in a legal battle ever since his wife Bruna Bianci (ph) went to Rio in 2004 with Sean (ph). He was 4 at the time. She never returned. She kept Sean (ph) in Brazil and remarried there. Bianci (ph) died last year and her family has been fighting for the boy to stay in Rio. The case has drawn international attention and high level discussions involving Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, even a House bill urging more compliance in returning children like Sean (ph) to the U.S.
REP. CHRIS SMITH (R), NEW JERSEY: Twenty eight hundred abducted American children all around the world. That's unconscionable. David Goldman has birthed a movement to help everyone else.
FERRE: The decision demands that Sean (ph) be handed over at the U.S. Embassy on Friday. But the mother's family in Rio was expected to quickly file an appeal. A stay is possible, but at this point this international family lawyer says it's very likely the boy will return to the U.S.
ROBERT ARENSTEIN, FAMILY LAW: I think the justices are on their toes trying to do the right thing because everybody -- the world is watching this case. This case is being watched by the entire world.
FERRE: With neither side giving up.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FERRE: And people close to this case have told us the general feeling is that the boy will be returning to the U.S. but until the child is on a plane, Goldman is very cautious.
ROBERTS: Yes, as you said, he has traveled this route before so he doesn't want to get his hopes up too high. We should mention, too that the family that has Sean Goldman (ph) right now is very well connected with the Brazilian government.
FERRE: Exactly. I mean this husband, a high profile case down in Brazil, as well a lot of politics that people say has played into this case.
ROBERTS: All right, Ines Ferre for us tonight -- Ines, thanks so much. Some breaking news just in to CNN -- professional football player Chris Henry was seriously injured after falling out of the back of a pickup truck in North Carolina. Police say the Cincinnati Bengal's receiver was having a fight with his fiancee. He was found on a road in Charlotte. His injuries are described as life threatening. Henry was rushed to Carolina's Medical Center, no further word yet on his condition. We will keep you updated though.
Coming up, will an airline strike ground travelers on two continents this Christmas? We'll have the very latest on that developing story. And our special series "California in Crisis", tonight we examine the state's education system, once considered a model for the nation. Now it's failing a generation of students.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Tonight we continue our special series "California in Crisis", the golden state is not only in economic and political turmoil, but education in the state is also suffering terribly. California's public education system was once considered a model for the nation. As Casey Wian tells us the system is now under funded, overcrowded and failing an entire generation of students.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Lisa McQuaid (ph) has two children, Kelsey a sophomore at the University of California Davis and Riley, a high school junior. The stay at home mom had brain surgery earlier this year, yet now she is struggling to find a job to help pay for her children's college.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's real discouraging after awhile. You kind of want to not walk in that door again because you're going to be told no again.
WIAN: California is raising tuition at its U.C. campuses by nearly a third because of the state's massive budget deficit.
LISA MCQUAID, MOTHER OF UC STUDENT: I was livid. You think that your child's education is going to cost you a certain amount of money. You go into the four-year plan thinking OK you know this is doable. We have put this much aside. We have this much you know financial aid here or there, scholarships and all of a sudden you're -- you know in the middle of a school year, your child has to come up with you know how many hundreds or thousands more dollars.
UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: (INAUDIBLE)
WIAN: Student anger over the tuition increase has triggered protests on university campuses reminiscent of the 1960's.
WIAN: Why are students so outraged?
KELSEY MCQUAID, UC DAVIS STUDENT: Because we don't have that money -- that much money to start off with. When I came here last fall it was about $8,000 per year and now it's over 9,000 and will be about $10,000 next fall. Our parents are already getting pay cuts. They are not making as much and the dollar is not stretching as far. And then to be told hey you need to come up with an extra $1,000 in the course of a year, it's just outrageous. I'm...
WIAN: Kelsey is worried she may not be able to finish her degree at U.C. Davis. Riley may not even get to start.
RILEY MCQUAID, HIGH SCHOOL JUNIOR: I would love to be able to go to a U.C. school but with having to go through a year of overlapping between my sister and I where we are both going to be at school and there is going to be a point where I mean there is not enough money.
WIAN: Los Angeles Mayor and former California Assembly Speaker Antonio Villaraigosa is a product of the U.C. system. He attended UCLA in the early 1970's.
MAYOR ANTONIO VILLARAIGOSA (D), LOS ANGELES: We were investing in institutions of higher learning at a rate much higher than most states in the country, that's no longer true. And let me tell you something. California will not maintain its preeminence economically if we continue to disinvest in our institutions of higher learning. And our K through 12 system that's the feeder system, if you will, for the economy.
WIAN: From kindergarten to college, California's once vaunted public education system is under severe strain. The Los Angeles unified school district this month approved 5,000 layoffs including 1,400 teachers. Statewide nearly one in three high school students don't graduate on time. Only two states have lower eighth grade math or reading scores.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When I hear that we're not doing -- that we're failing as many students as we are because our kids are disproportionately on the school lunch program, they are English language learners, their parents have a low level of education, they come from broken homes, I ask when I go into some of the poor neighborhoods of this city and I ask people how many of you were in one of those categories and you'll see all these hands go up. I was in one -- in a number of those categories and I can read and write. We got to stop making excuses. Every child can learn and we've got to invest in our children. We've got to set high expectations.
WIAN: Until this year Crystal Davis taught at Freemont High School in Los Angeles. In nearly every academic subject fewer than 10 percent of its students met state standards.
CRYSTAL DAVIS, TEACHER: It was more honestly just babysitting than actually educating. There wasn't really much interest in what the students were doing, just as long as they were present.
WIAN: The school's performance was so bad district officials this month decided to shut it down, fire everyone and start over. Davis got out just in time and is now at another urban public school that is graduating 97 percent of its students.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: Coming up, we'll explain how Crystal Davis' new school is succeeding despite being surrounded by failure -- John.
ROBERTS: Casey, looking forward to that. Casey, by the way, we're also going to check in with three experts in education to search for broader answers to the problems with education in America -- coming up right after the break. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN TONIGHT live from New York. Here again, John Roberts.
ROBERTS: Continuing our series "California in Crisis", more than a third of California students fail to graduate from high school. But there are some schools, even in violence-plague urban areas that are beating those odds. Casey Wian is back again with the inspiring story of one of those schools.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN (voice-over): Joaquin Hernandez is principal of the Hawthorne Math and Science Academy. The lofty sounding name is the first thing you notice that's different about this California urban public school. The next is Principal Hernandez's personal involvement with his students.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) above the waist, Jesse.
WIAN: In a neighborhood surrounded by gangs and in a state riddled with failing schools, Hawthorne Math and Science is graduating 97 percent of its students.
(on camera): Is there any kind of a stigma for these kids and their community going with such a high achieving school?
JOAQUIN HERNANDEZ, PRINCIPAL, HAWTHORNE MATH & SCIENCE ACADEMY: There is that stigma oh you are going to get nothing but smart kids. And it takes away from the fact that a lot of our kids are really hard workers. A majority of our population is just those grinders, those kids who come in every day, they do their thing. They work. They ask questions. They produce and they move on.
WIAN (voice-over): Charter schools like the Hawthorne Academy set their own academic standards.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our expectation is everyone is going to take four years of math, no excuses. Everyone is going to take four years of science, no excuses. Everyone is going to college preparatory English for four years, no excuses. Three years of foreign language, no excuses and so I don't care what your excuse -- I don't care what the reason is. I don't care that you woke up late or you're not very good at math or traditionally in your family we don't like English. I don't care. This is our program. This is what we do and this is with what we're going to do every single year. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
WIAN: Everyone here, students, teachers, parents are held accountable for their actions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A kid's world is two halves, the school and the home, and any time those two halves become separated, it becomes a crack. Kids fall in the crack and then we have a problem, so we have to maintain that connection between the two.
WIAN: Admission is based on an application process that is not academically rigorous that requires students and parents to meet deadlines. There are now 600 students and a long waiting list.
TANNER GRAY-SPENCER, HIGH SCHOOL SENIOR: The reason why I chose this school because well like where I come from there is not a really -- there's not a lot of great schools around my neighborhood.
WIAN: Where do you come from?
GRAY-SPENCER: And -- South Central. So basically like coming here, it was like a haven because it was like a place where I was actually challenged. It was hard. It was a shock to my system. Some days, like, I would like -- I would cry. Like, the first ninth grade year, I would just cry, just doing my home work. Like 3:00 in the morning, just trying to hurry up and do it, because like I knew, like, my teacher was going to expect my homework to be done.
WIAN (voice-over): Crystal Davis is in his first year teaching there at the Hawthorne Math and Science Academy. She left a failing Los Angeles public high school that will soon be closed because of poor performance.
CRYSTAL DAVIS, TEACHER: The school I was at before had over 5,000 students. There was just no accountability. The students just get lost in the system and there is no one to spent time with them if they're having issues or having problems. But the kids who come here do try and, again, just the expectation is that they will do well. And they live up to that.
WIAN: Christina Espinosa is a 16-year-old senior.
CHRISTINA ESPINOSA, HIGH SCHOOL SENIOR: They helped me become a better person and they really do prepare you for life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not an education. This is how we look at it. This is a place of business. And like in any other place of business there's things that you can't do. I mean you can't walk down the hallway and punch someone in the face because hey, they sent you the wrong memo.
You can't walk down the hallway and, you know, start kissing with someone else because, you know, you're infatuated with them. You know, these things you can't do in the workplace. So then why can you do them in school? Why not prepare them for real life by treating them like the way real life is going to be? (END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: While California schools overall are near the bottom of most national rankings, there are plenty of exceptions. Hawthorne Math and Science Academy is one of 20 California high schools ranked among the top 100 in the nation by "U.S. News and World Report." John?
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: Casey Wian, tonight. Casey, great story. Thanks so much.
The Hawthorne Math and Science Academy is clearly a model of success. So how can California and other states replicate that success?
I'm joined now by three leading experts in education, CNN education contributor, Steve Perry. Steve is the author of the book, "Raggedy Schools," and he's also the principal and founder of the Capital Preparatory Magnet School.
Pedro Noguera is a professor at New York University and executive director of the Center for Urban Education. Also the author of "The Trouble with Black Boys." And Sam Chaltain, the national director of the Forum for Education and Democracy is also with us. He is the author of "American Schools: The Art of Creating a Democratic Learning Community."
Steve, let's start with you. We can certainly do education in this country. We saw it there at Hawthorne when it comes to higher education. Eleven of the world's top 15 colleges are here in the United States. But broadly, why do we fail so miserably at public education?
STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATION CONTRIBUTOR: Failed schools are run by adults by children. The kids run the buildings. Successful schools are run and designed for children and controlled by adults. And there's a great deal of discipline there.
The expectations are high in successful schools. They're designed to be successful. They have longer school years and longer school days. Twenty years ago, we didn't know that there could be a successful urban school. And then we keep finding more and more of them, and every single time we find one of them, we call them an exception.
We know that they can be run effectively in the worst neighborhoods in America. Yet we keep designing large schools that are politically palpable but they fail from an academic perspective.
ROBERTS: So Sam, how to replicate Hawthorne across the board? You know you've got it right there in Los Angeles. Why can't you have more schools like in that same district and across the country?
SAM CHALTAIN, NATIONAL DIRECTOR FORUM FOR EDUCATION & DEMOCRACY: Well, what Hawthorne has in place is what we don't have in place across the country which is some real clarity about the rightful bull's eye of all education reform efforts.
Right now what we've created nationally despite the best of intentions is a culture of testing whereas what was created at Hawthorne, what's been created at Steve's school and others is a culture of learning that actually gives young people the skills and self-confidence they need to be successful in life, the workplace, and in our democracy.
So part of what needs to happen -- it's equivalent to changing the perspective of a basketball GM. If I were to announce that my strategy for improving my team was to go and only acquire players who hit doubles, I would be fired the next day.
Yet what we current have in this country is the equivalent, where the only current measure that really has any currency for determining whether a school is successful or unsuccessful are third and eighth grade reading and math scores.
Like doubles, it's not saying that that statistic is insignificant but it's clearly overvalued. And until we provide a more balanced perspective of what schools need in order to be successful so that they can be like Hawthorne, they can be like Steve's school, we're going to continue to identify certain schools as exceptions and wonder why we can't have them all.
ROBERTS: You know, Pedro, let's look at some of these statistics. From 2007, 6.2 million high school students dropped out that year. The 50 largest cities in America, one studies shows, only 53 percent of students graduate on time.
Those are tragic statistics by any stretch of the imagination. But, you know, in terms of this idea of -- creating all schools across the nation so that they actually teach children how to learn, where does that impetus, where does this drive need to come from? Does it come from Washington? Does it have to come from state capitals? Does it come from the individual municipalities? Does everybody have to get on the same page?
PROF. PEDRO NOGUERA, NEW YORK UNIVERSITY: Everybody has to get on the same page. It would help. It would help if we got local communities, the state government, federal government, all working together, private sectors, churches, families.
We have to recognize that more of what we've been doing is not going to get us different outcomes. We've been doing No Child Left Behind for the eight years.
ROBERTS: And not funding.
NOGUERA: And not funding it fully and we still end up with drop out rates, in some cities as high as 50 percent. So we need to rethink what we're doing wrong, and I think that Sam spoke to.
When you look at schools that produce success, they've created the conditions that allow teachers to be successful, that allows kids to thrive and to learn, and we need to basically do more of what works. And the thing is we have examples of schools like that. We also have examples of schools that have turned it around. And you don't need to search that. We're making this way too hard. And it shouldn't be as hard as it is.
ROBERTS: Steve, where do teachers and teachers' unions come in to all of this?
PERRY: Teachers unions are in the way. In many cases, they're one of the worst things to happen in the public education. One of the reasons why the budgets keep ballooning is because teachers unions, principals unions and all the unions that are in education don't realize that simply because it's another year, you shouldn't get a raise.
We can't expect to have money in the coffer when we've used all of it to account for the raises.
ROBERTS: Yet teachers, when you look at the importance of their position in society, are woefully underpaid.
PERRY: One could argue that we're public employees. We decided to do this. No one beat us into becoming education. We understood that we are not going to make as much as maybe folks who work at CNN. But what we are going to do is we're going to make an impact every single day.
You don't get into it for the love of the money. You get into it for the love of the game which is for us is changing children's lives. We have to understand that. We are the people on the front lines.
If this is not a calling, if you don't wake up on Monday morning fired up to do this, then get out of it because you're in the way. Schools are principals and teachers. When we talk about schools we act as if they're just something that exists out there. They're people who come to work every single day and if they are focused on committing to the children, then they can make great things happen.
ROBERTS: What about, Sam, this idea of merit pay that was kicked around during the election campaign last year? You know, as Steve said, the unions expect there to be a pay increase. Well, shouldn't teachers who are good, teachers who excel, expect to get paid more than teachers who don't?
CHALTAIN: Well, I think this is another example of the way that right now it's understandable why we do this but we're still looking for the simple answers to very complex problems.
So for example, my organization is part of many across the country that have launched a national grassroots campaign to try to restore the focus of education reform to its rightful bull's eye. Rethinknowlearning.com.
We've identified three pillars, learning is one. Teaching is the second and the idea that what we need to do is invest in a long term teaching profession rather than a short-term teaching force.
ROBERTS: Right.
CHALTAIN: So the idea of seeing merit pay, for example, as the sole solution, an extrinsic source of motivation for what as Steve described as a deeply intrinsic type of profession is missing the boat. It also encourages -- it could encourage a type of individualistic behavior when we all know that the best environments that support students are collaborative where adults work together in the interest of children.
ROBERTS: And Peter, finish us off here. There is this huge achievement gap in this country. And what is that doing to the economy? The McKenzie Corporation had a report recently which described the achievement gap as like having a permanent national recession, that GDP would be higher if we could close that achievement gap.
NOGUERA: Well, that gap we have to keep in mind is really a reflection of inequality. The kids who are at the bottom are -- come from the families that are already at the bottom with lower wages, less health care. You can't focus only schools. You have to focus on what else is happening on the lives of kids.
And we, in many ways, expect too much of schools. We expect schools to solve problems that aren't education in nature. I actually don't agree that you can just blame the unions. I think unions are part of it. But the south has many states where they have weak unions. These are not bad schools.
So if it was simply the unions, I think we'd see great schools in the south. We don't see that. There's more to this. There's the fact that many kids are coming to schools hungry in this country. Many kids are coming to school with asthma and need basic health care.
And schools are overwhelmed and under resourced. I think these (INAUDIBLE) poor kids. So I think we need to really look carefully and ask ourselves, as a nation, have we done what it takes?
We went -- we started with California. California created the best public universities in the country. They did in by investing in faculty. They did it by investing in the resources to create public institutions. We needed that for public education.
ROBERTS: Gentlemen...
NOGUERA: So we have models on how to do it.
ROBERTS: Gentlemen, great discussions tonight. Thanks all for coming in. Really appreciate it. We're going to have more of our series "California in Crisis". Tomorrow we'll take a look at the nation's largest cargo facility. . Business has suffered at the port but there are signs that things are starting to turn around.
And coming up tonight, President Obama may create a commission charged with slashing the federal deficit. But will that mean higher taxes for you?
Plus a massive airline worker strike may ground your holiday travel plans. That story is coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: The White House says it hopes to soon finish its review of its policy not to send condolence letters to the families of military suicide victims. President Obama is under pressure to reverse the longstanding policy after a huge public outcry.
As Elaine Quijano reports, hundreds of families are anxiously awaiting the decision.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): So far this year, at least 354 U.S. service members have killed themselves according to military statistics. That's more than the 335 killed by enemy fire in Iraq and Afghanistan this year combined.
The soaring suicide rate has not only prompted alarm but also questions about a longstanding White House policy that CNN first reported on last month. Not to send presidential letters of condolence to military families of suicide victims.
(On camera): Does the president believe that those families deserve a letter of condolence?
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president believes that the previous policy that didn't write those letters can and should be reviewed and that review is ongoing.
QUIJANO (voice-over): The secretary of defense doesn't write these letters either.
GEOFF MORRELL, PENTAGON SPOKESPERSON: I think you could talk to people in this building who believe that if you were to extend your letter writing to include suicide victims, then it would somehow diminish the sacrifice of those who have died in combat.
QUIJANO: The issue has touched a raw nerve. On CNN.com, the story prompted more than 400 comments, many of them highly emotional. There is, quote, "No honor in suicide," wrote one person who said he fought in Fallujah, Iraq in 2003, saying suicide does not deserve a hero's exit.
But from a self-identified Army spouse, a plea to the president to change the policy, quote, "You need to show the family that you acknowledge their sacrifice."
The family members CNN profiled last month were the parents of 25-year-old Army specialist Chancellor Keesling.
SPEC. CHANCELLOR KEESLING, U.S. ARMY: Today we'll be reading the "Cat in the Hat."
QUIJANO: He killed himself in Iraq in June. GREGG KEESLING, SPECIAL CHANCELLOR KEESLING'S FATHER: So we don't want to force the president to write a letter of condolence. We hope he would want to.
QUIJANO: Just days after that story aired, the president in his Afghanistan speech talked about seeing firsthand the terrible wages of war.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: As president, I have signed a letter of condolence to the family of each American who gives their life in these wars.
QUIJANO: But the Keeslings who e-mailed CNN moments after that speech say the president's words were hurtful.
(On camera): What would you say to that family?
GIBBS: Regardless of what happens, nothing lessens the amazing contribution and sacrifice that's made.
QUIJANO (voice-over): Yet Indiana Republican, Congressman Dan Burton, who's taken the Keesling's cause, insists the absence of a presidential condolence letter does diminish the sacrifice and service of military suicide victims.
REP. DAN BURTON (R), INDIANA: Are they any less an American who's fighting for us and the others? No. And so I think it's extremely important that they and their family are recognized for their service to the country.
QUIJANO (on camera): This week, Congressman Burton has joined with Democratic Congressman Patrick Kennedy in asking lawmakers to sign on to this letter to President Obama. The letter asks the president to overturn the policy and send a strong signal about not discriminating against service members with mental illness.
Meantime White House officials hope to conclude their review shortly.
Elaine Quijano, CNN, the Pentagon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTS: And if you'd like to share your thoughts on this emotional issue, service members who have died by suicide, you can go to CNN.com/feedback, and let us know what you think the White House should do.
Coming up tonight, an international airline strike could affect your holiday travel plans. We'll have the details on that.
And say it ain't so. The threat of more taxes and drastic spending cuts affecting millions of Americans on top of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) ROBERTS: More than a million air travelers face chaos at Christmas, thanks to a threat in strike. Tonight, baggage handlers and checking staff say they will join British Airways' cabin crews in a 12-day strike over the holidays.
Workers cheered the union's vote to walk out. The strike would likely ground most of BA's planes at the busiest time of year. Flights affected by the strike include routes between London, New York and Washington.
The airline is seeking an emergency court order to stop the strike that is due to start next Tuesday.
The nation's ballooning deficit may lead to new taxes and drastic cuts in federal spending. The White House is not saying anything publicly but it's a very different story behind the scenes as our Ed Henry reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Documents obtain by CNN reveal the president is privately considering an executive order that would create an outside commission to weigh sweeping tax increases and deep spending cuts to programs like Medicare that affect millions of Americans. All aimed at slashing the exploding federal deficit, which the president has promised to tackle after the economic recovery takes hold.
OBAMA: And I'm looking forward to working with the group of leaders that I just met today about how we can structure a plausible scenario to get to medium and long-term deficit reduction.
HENRY: The documents suggest a split within the administration. Some advisers arguing the commission should have a narrow mandate because it's too complicated to tackle reform of Social Security, taxes and Medicare all at once.
But other advisers, according to the documents, believe there should be, quote, "everything on the table."
SEN. JUDD GREGG (R), NEW HAMPSHIRE: We are on a path to bankruptcy as a nation and it's that simple.
HENRY: The White House is facing heavy pressure from senators threatening to block a large increase in the nation's debt ceiling. Unless the president signs on to their version of a deficit commission.
SEN. KENT CONRAD (D), NORTH DAKOTA: I believe a defining moment, 27 senators, 12 Democrats, 15 Republicans have signed on in just a matter of hours.
HENRY: The Senate version of the commission would give 10 Democrats and eight Republicans power to study the problem, and then vote after the midterm elections on a reform package that could include dramatic tax hikes and spending cuts. If 14 of the 18 members approve the package, giving it a bipartisan nod, it would force an automatic up or down vote in both the House and Senate.
White house officials, meanwhile, are considering their own version of a commission with more Obama officials on the panel to give the president more control. Though the documents obtained by CNN warned that also brings political risks, quote, "The promise of greater say over the deliberations and final product of the commission but the peril of being more deeply implicated in the event of failure."
(On camera): There's fear among some of the president's advisers that handing so much power to an outside commission could be dangerous. What if they recommend raising taxes on people making less than $250,000 a year? Breaking an Obama campaign promise. But other advisers say that this bipartisan commission could give the president the political cover to make the tough decisions necessary to cut the deficit.
Ed Henry, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTS: Joining me now, Laurence Kotlikoff, a professor of economics at Boston University, and Jeff Sachs, director of the Earth Institute at Columbia University, to talk more about this.
A $1.4 trillion deficit this, and next year it goes up to $1.5 trillion. And the debt ceiling has been lifted above $12 trillion. You heard Senator Judd Gregg say the country is at risk of going bankrupt.
Jeff, where is all of this headed?
JEFF SACHS, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY EARTH INSTITUTE: Well, you've been running these stories about California breaking down. That's where this country is headed unless we do something different. California 30 years ago had a tax revolt. They've locked the hands of government for 30 years. They said it's impossible to raise taxes.
No one wants to hear this but the fact of the matter is that we can't close this deficit simply by cutting government. We've got everything and we're already running basically on an empty tank. So everything is to dodge that simple fact.
We've seen this coming for years. We see it now. No one want to hear it. Everyone will hate to hear it. This is awful news, but it's the truth.
ROBERTS: Laurence, do you agree with Jeff? And if tax hikes are coming, how serious do they need to be?
PROF. LAURENCE KOTLIKOFF, BOSTON UNIVERSITY: Well, I agree with Jeff that we're in a terrible situation and I agree with Senator Judd that the country is essentially bankrupt given what it's doing. But I think we can -- we need to really think outside the box at this point in terms of restructuring more efficiently our health care system, and I like what's being proposed, our Social Security retirement system, and our tax system so that we can actually broaden the tax base and have a -- you know, not necessarily have higher rates but more revenue with a much broader tax base.
That's not -- the Republican line which is you cut taxes and get more revenue. Under the existing system, I think that's not really feasible. I think that's crazy.
ROBERTS: So how do you broaden it?
KOTLIKOFF: Well, most economists would argue that we need a broad-based consumption tax. And that can be very simple flat-rate tax with a demo (ph) grant (ph) that every household would get to make it very progressive. And then you get rid of the federal income tax, the payroll tax, the corporate income tax, and you have a very competitive economy that actually generates more revenue.
ROBERTS: So it's basically a consumption tax, then.
KOTLIKOFF: Right.
ROBERTS: You know, Jeff, you were warning us about this last year, that there was going to have to be a pretty dramatic increase in taxes to pay for everything. The president has said he will not raise taxes on people below $250,000.
Can he continue with that pledge? Does he have to break the pledge in order to get enough money? Can he get it all off the backs of high income earners? Or is everybody going to share this pain?
SACHS: Well, you cannot get it off the backs of just the high income earners, although they ought to pay more, that's for sure. And the Republicans are just waiting for that trap for him to break the promise then they're going to try to defeat him for re-election. He's fully aware that.
That's the trap that we're in. You got one party that just says tax cut, tax cut, tax cut no matter what. The other party says tax cuts for everybody except over 250. That also doesn't answer the question.
So basically, this is the trap. Now they're saying, we'll go to this special commission and they'll tell us what to do. That's actually what Congress and the president are for by the way. Not special commission, but actually to work out these things in open.
I don't even know about the constitutionality of saying that some small group is going to be able to decide and then it's an up or down vote. That's really not how our debate should actually function in this country.
ROBERTS: Laurence, what do you think of this idea of an outside commission? Certainly the government has gone to outside commissions before in issues like Social Security? Could this be a good way to try to figure out what to do outside of the bickering in Congress? Or could this just be political cover for the president during an election year? KOTLIKOFF: I think we need -- I agree with Jeff. We need leadership, not another commission. And the president has to start thinking outside the box and come up with something that actually can get us to -- a much more efficient equitable tax structure.
You know if you tax consumption, the Democrats think that's regressive, but it's actually with the demo grant and with the fact that rich people, as soon as they go and spend their wealth, are going to have to pay taxes on their, first of all, their wealth. It's really a wealth tax. It's much more progressive than most people think.
ROBERTS: All right, Laurence Kotlikoff and Jeff Sachs, good see you tonight. Thanks for coming in.
Coming up at the top of the hour here on CNN, "CAMPBELL BROWN." She's here early for a preview. Hi, Campbell.
CAMPBELL BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Hey there, John. Coming up at the top of the hour a big city wants to be the first in the nation to slap a very controversial warning on cell phones. We're going to tell what you it could mean for all of us.
Also the very latest on the health care fight in Congress. New indications tonight that there will be no final plan this year.
And Gloria Estefan at the White House. We have an exclusive look at her interview with President Obama.
All that plus our "Mash-up" of all the day's top stories in just a few minutes -- John.
ROBERTS: All right. Looking forward to it. Campbell, we'll see you soon. Thanks so much.
Coming up, the year on YouTube. What was the most watched clip of the year? We'll tell you coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: For the first time ever, YouTube has released an official most watched list of the year. 2009 had a lot of YouTube ready moments from Kanye West to the "Twilight" trailer. But neither of those cracked the top three.
At number three was "JK Wedding Entrance Dance" where a wedding party choreographed their entrance to the Chris Brown song "Forever." Nothing says everlasting love quite like Chris Brown, right?
Coming in at number two is "David after Dentist" which showed 7- year-old David Devore showing the effects of drugs after his trip to the dentist.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID DEVORE, 7-YEAR-OLD: I feel funny. Why is this happening to me?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's OK, bud. It's just from the medicine, OK?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: But the number one YouTube video of the year with more than 120 million views? Breakout superstar Susan Boyle. Susan Boyle's version of "I Dream the Dream" on the reality show "Britain's Got Talent" took the UK and the world by storm.
(MUSIC)
ROBERTS: Her YouTube popularity has turned into album sales as she holds the number one spot on Billboard for the third week in a row.
Imagine how much her life has changed in the last year.
Thanks for being with us tonight. We'll be back again tomorrow. And join me first thing tomorrow morning, 6:00 a.m. Eastern for "AMERICAN MORNING." We'll see you then. Sleep quickly.
Up next, "CAMPBELL BROWN."
ANNOUNCER: CNN Primetime begins right now.
