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Health Care Vote Set For Christmas Eve; Inside Mexico's Drug Wars
Aired December 22, 2009 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Making news right now on your national conversation: Did we let him get away?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had human sources who actually delivered food and water to him.
VELSHI: Now CNN national security analyst Peter Bergen weighs in. Eight years later, what really happened at Tora Bora?
A pregnant worker goes into cardiac arrest in a coffee shop while paramedics watch. Their advice? Call 911.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They felt that their break was more important than saving a life.
VELSHI: A beautiful young actress gone too soon, you will hear one of her final interviews.
BRITTANY MURPHY, ACTRESS: And that was a pleasure.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can really take that savings and put it toward something else in your household.
VELSHI: And see how she turned lemons into lemonade with the power of coupons. She can show you how to do the same.
Your comments on the air. This truly national conversation for Tuesday, December 22, starts right now. Let's go.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI: And hello again, everybody. I'm Ali Velshi sitting in for Rick Sanchez for this hour of the next generation of news. It is a conversation, not a speech, and it's your turn to get involved.
The troop surge to Afghanistan, 30,000 American military men and women, their mission is moving off of the drawing board and on to the ground. And here is what I want to know. I want to know your feelings on this. The man in charge of the mission of Afghanistan says, in addition to the security, the training, the fight to squash the terrorist insurgency, one man has to go.
General Stanley McChrystal has told a Senate committee this month that if al Qaeda is to be defended, Osama bin Laden must be killed or captured. I want to know if you agree? Tweet me. Message me on Facebook or on MySpace on Rick's or on mine. We're monitoring both, but consider this.
I'm about to talk to a guy who met bin Laden in person and just wrote an article, a great article that I have just read calls the definitive account -- this article is about the definitive account of how the al Qaeda leader got away eight years ago, December eight years ago.
Watch this first, though. It is Rick Sanchez and his conversation with a former CIA agent who hunted Osama bin Laden on foot in the weeks after 9/11.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: How did you know that bin Laden was actually there? Did you eyeball him or did you hear him?
GARY BERNTSEN, AUTHOR, "HUMAN INTELLIGENCE, COUNTERTERRORISM AND NATIONAL LEADERSHIP: A PRACTICAL GUIDE": We had human sources who actually delivered food and water to him at one point. We followed in with a 15,000-pound device, a BLU-82 to try to kill him. We killed a lot of his folks with that device. We were listening to him on the phone because all of his sophisticated comm had went down and they were using actually hunting radios at one point.
We had one of them, we were listening.
SANCHEZ: Could you tell us physically how bin Laden crossed from Afghanistan into Waziristan in Pakistan or wherever it is he ended up going?
BERNTSEN: Would have crossed into the (INAUDIBLE) area of the Federally Administered Tribal Areas.
SANCHEZ: Did he walk?
(CROSSTALK)
BERNTSEN: It was on the 16th of December he crossed. Yes, he walked.
SANCHEZ: He just walked across?
BERNTSEN: He walked across. There's no roads.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: He just walked across.
That was Gary Berntsen. He says Osama bin Laden simply walked over the Pakistan/Afghanistan border.
Now, Peter Bergen knows Gary Berntsen and he knows how he tracked bin Laden. And, Peter, you are the only man I know who has actually talked to Osama bin Laden face to face. Your article seems to agree with Gary Berntsen's evaluation that Osama bin Laden literally got away from U.S. troops who were at one point within two kilometers of him.
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Yes. I mean, Gary is one of the sources for the article that I wrote in "The New Republic," a couple of other CIA officials. There were multiple radio intercepts of bin Laden in the period between December 9 and 14. That was also confirmed by the way by an official history of the Afghan war that was produced by special operations command.
They were the command that had the few American soldiers on the ground. It is just an indisputable fact. He probably disappeared, as Gary said in that interview with Rick Sanchez, sometime around December 16. I think it was more like the 14th, but it's somewhere in there, almost exactly eight years ago, Ali.
VELSHI: But there does not seem to be a whole lot of dispute. There is not somebody out there who is saying Gary is wrong, you are wrong, he was never there, we were never that close.
BERGEN: Well, there was -- if you recall, in the 2004 election, John Kerry charged that bin Laden basically escaped at Tora Bora because of an incompetent military strategy. And there was a lot of pushback from General Tommy Franks, the head of CENTCOM, who controlled the operation.
He wrote in "The New York Times" that bin Laden could have been anywhere in a lot of different locations. He made the same points to me in an e-mail to me. But the fact is, is that we now know indisputably that bin Laden was there. And in fact that was well known at the time, both within the CIA and also further up the chain of command.
VELSHI: You make a good point in your article. And that is that today after we have seen everything that has happened in Iraq and the number of U.S. forces who have died in Iraq, it doesn't seem -- it doesn't seem to make sense that we could have put another 800 troops in there, which is what they were calling for.
But back then there was a real aversion on the part of the government and the Pentagon to putting more troops on the ground, for fear that they would get killed.
BERGEN: Indeed.
Part of it is that the U.S. military had scored a big victory in Afghanistan with a very limited number of soldiers on the ground, about 300, and about 100 CIA officers who played a critical role in this as well.
And at the time of the Tora Bora battle happened, in fact, there had been more American -- there had been more journalists killed in Afghanistan than American soldiers. So there was a risk aversion that is hard to recall right now. The last time that the United States had been involved in a fighting war before Afghanistan was Kosovo, where not a single American soldier was killed in combat.
And, so, if you rewind the tape, Ali, to that time period, there was a much more -- you know, much more careful about the possibility of casualties, particularly when it seemed that this campaign had basically been risk-free.
VELSHI: Right.
Let's talk about what General Stanley McChrystal has said, that Osama bin Laden has to die or be captured for al Qaeda to finally fall. Is that true?
BERGEN: I completely agree with that.
I mean, if Hitler had been killed on July 20, 1944 by von Stauffenberg in the -- which became the "Valkyrie" movie starring Tom Cruise, World War II would have ended a year early.
I'm not comparing these two conflicts. They're very different. But certain people do make certain differences. And bin Laden, he is the leader of al Qaeda. He is also the leader of wider jihadi movement. To capture or kill him would be incredibly effective, very demoralizing.
VELSHI: You have asked former commanders why they didn't simply flood Tora Bora with U.S. troops and overwhelm the fight there. What did they tell you?
BERGEN: Well, General Tommy Franks has basically said that the light footprint approach, so-called, basically they didn't want to change that around. They have -- you know, the intelligence was...
VELSHI: And when you say light footprint, you mean fewer U.S. soldiers on the ground, let local proxies do more of the fighting?
BERGEN: Yes.
And we have seen in Afghanistan that that idea continued past the battle of Tora Bora. There were only 6,000 American soldiers in Afghanistan in 2003. And that is why we are where we are today.
It turns out the light footprint approach, it does not really help you really secure a country, and that is why, of course, the Obama administration is putting in an additional 30,000 soldiers right now.
VELSHI: But, in your opinion, that maybe too late in terms of catching Osama bin Laden?
BERGEN: Well, he is going to be 53 shortly. He has still got -- you know, there's still some time left to find him.
VELSHI: You think that they can? Do you think we are ever going to get as close to knowing where he was as you say we were back in December of 2001? BERGEN: It took 15 years for the Israelis to find Eichmann in Latin America, not for a lack of trying. It is hard to find one person. And the world is a large place. However, by the law of averages, I'm confident that he will be found. It could be a year. It could be 15, but it will happen.
VELSHI: Peter, good to talk to you. Great article.
Peter Bergen has an article in "The New Republic" on the battle for Tora Bora. It seems as current today as the story that you're writing about that took place eight years ago. Peter, thanks for joining us.
BERGEN: Thank you, Ali.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL BLOOMBERG (I), MAYOR OF NEW YORK: They are human beings. Somebody is dying down the street and they say help them, and they just sat there. There is no excuse whatsoever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Pregnant woman collapses. Two paramedics are there, but they don't help her. How are they defending their actions? You have got to hear this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ROLAND BURRIS (D), ILLINOIS: 'Twas the night before Christmas and all through the Senate, the right help up our health care bill, no matter what was in it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Poetic offering from Senator Roland Burris of Illinois. It is a classic Christmas story, but with a health care twist.
And don't forget to call us, the hey Rick line. Even though Sanchez is playing -- he is somewhere else playing Santa, you can all us. In the United States, the number is 877-742-5751.
Tweet me at AliVelshi. Tweet Rick at ricksanchezCNN.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CALLER: Hey, Rick. This is Gina (ph) from Georgia.
And I just wanted to remind everyone that this health care issue that we are dealing with was not inexpensive and it didn't happen overnight. So, the solution to it is not going to be inexpensive and it is not going to happen overnight. It is going to take some money on the citizens' part, some spending on the government's part, and a whole lot of patience on everyone else's part. So, that is the only way we are going to fix this thing.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
VELSHI: Calling for patience, rare and noteworthy. Thank you for that.
Let's take look at some of your tweets coming into Rick Sanchez at ricksanchezCNN. We were talking about the capture of Osama bin Laden, how important is it.
MJohnson28 says: "Yes we must kill or capture Osama bin Laden."
WFCarl says: "It is not incompetence by the military, more like bad luck. A lot of planning goes into missions. That could be why."
Curious1996 says: "What happens if we find out bin Laden died years ago? Was this all a waste of time, money, but most of all innocent lives?"
And Gady_Mayan says: "Who would ever let bin Laden go? There is a multimillion-dollar reward for turning him in."
Fascinating story, Peter Bergen writing an article on it for "The New Republic."
Well, Senate Democrats voted on a timetable for extending -- for ending, I'm sorry, the debate over health care reform earlier today. But if the votes are in place, why is this dragging out until Christmas Eve?
Well, there are procedural votes. And rules say a certain amount of time has to pass between those votes. And in the meantime, senators get to talk on the floor, and talk, and talk, and talk.
And that includes Illinois Senator Roland Burris, who offered this twist on a Christmas classic.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURRIS: 'Twas the night before Christmas, and all through the Senate, the right held up our health care bill, no matter what was in it. The people had voted. They mandated reform, but Republicans blew off the gathering storm.
We'll clog up the Senate, they cried with a grin. And in the midterm elections, we will get voted in.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: And that went on for a while.
Now, even if the Senate does pass its reform bill on Christmas Eve, it still has to be combined and changed around with the House version.
Here is what we're going to do. We are going to break down the differences between the two. And that is just ahead. Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: How is it filming such a dark thriller?
MURPHY: It was -- I was very drawn to this because of its noir quality.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Late actress Brittany Murphy in one of her final interviews in December. Will it shed any light on what may have caused her mysterious death?
Joining us for the national conversation whenever you visit Atlanta. By the way, just call 1-877-4CNN-TOUR.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
CALLER: Hey, Rick. This is Brian (ph) from Indianapolis.
President Obama said that 30 million Americans will be covered in the health care plan. What about the other 250 million, 300 million Americans that are in the country? What is going to happen to their health care and how are they going to be covered?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: OK.
Talking about health care, we have got some breaking news. You think nothing ever gets done in Washington? Well, in fact, the Senate did its best to prove you wrong with another early morning vote today. They set a timetable this morning to end the debate on their health care reform bill and get this done by Christmas Eve. And that is the part that is just in.
The Senate has now decided to vote on 8:00 a.m. Christmas Eve morning, this Thursday, December 24. Of course, the two sides disagree on what -- whether going at this clip is actually such a good idea.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TOM HARKIN (D), IOWA: With apologies to Santa Claus, Christmas is going to be kind of anticlimactic this year, because we have already gotten the best possible gift, 60 votes in the United States Senate to create a health care system that works for all Americans, not just the healthy and the wealthy.
(APPLAUSE)
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), MINORITY LEADER: Americans woke up yesterday stunned to read that Democrats had voted to end debate on the latest version of the massive bill while they were sleeping. They will be stunned again when they learn about this second early-morning vote to advance a bill that most of them oppose.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: There are significant differences between the Senate and the House bill. So what will happen on Thursday is the Senate bill theoretically will get voted on. That is not the House bill. They still have to figure out how to make the two work together.
Our Tom Foreman broke them down on Campbell Brown's show last night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: How do you reconcile the differences between the Senate version of this bill over here and the House version over here? And let's talk about first the public option. This is something that the Senate said they will not have, which is to say a government-run insurance program for people to get involved with. They want to offer nonprofit private plans as an alternative.
Over here in the House, people said they wanted a public option. Now, everybody seems to agree the public option is dead, but bear in mind there are many Democrats over here in the House who have not yet really swallowed that bitter pill. You know it's going to come up some more and it's going to be tough. So the critical constituency to watch in this, the base, liberals.
Let's look at the next part of this equation, abortion restrictions. Here's what happened. Over here in the Senate, they said, yes, we will have abortion restrictions. Over here in the House, they said, yes, we will have abortion restrictions, so they agree.
The problem is there are significant numbers of Democrats in both chambers who don't want it. They only agreed to it as a procedural matter to keep this thing alive and moving forward. Now they want to strip it back out of this measure. And that's going to renew the fight because there are people who agreed who will not agree now if you take out these restrictions on the ability of federal money to be spent on abortion procedures for women.
So, the critical constituency, of course it's women. Let's move on and look at the next part, covering the cost. The CBO has looked at this and said these plans will ultimately be deficit-neutral. But that's ultimately. Right now, you still have to spend a lot of money to get all of this going if you want to make these kind of giant changes.
Now, both of them say that they have a way to cover the costs, so we can check that out on both sides. But they disagree on how to do it. The House over here likes the idea of just generally putting a bigger tax on everybody who has got a lot of money, the Senate, not so much. The Senate says let's go after those Cadillac health plans. Let's tax those plans. That's a problem because of another constituency, unions, for one, because many unions agreed to very lucrative health care plans, instead of pay raises. They don't want to be hit with the extra money now. And fiscal moderates are concerned.
And the last area I want to talk about here very quickly is illegal immigrant coverage. Over here the Senate says no. We do not want illegal immigrants to be covered at all. Over here in the House they say, if they want to buy it themselves, they ought to be able to buy it themselves, they're going to have to sort that out. And the issue, of course, is going to be the Latino vote.
This is a critical part of about this, Ali, that you have to bear in mind. Look at this. Liberals, women, fiscal moderates, unions and Latinos, all of these people played a tremendous role in giving the Democrats the power they have right now, and they're all right in the middle of this fight between Democrats watching to see how this has worked out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: OK. So, whether the Senate passes its bill on Christmas Eve morning or not, it won't merge with the House's bill, as Tom was explaining, until the new year.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEX PENA, COLLEGE STUDENT: All right. So this area we are rolling through right now is known to have gangs come together and plan their killings for the night.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: While his college friends were sunning on the beaches of Mexico, Alex was risking his life in Mexico's most dangerous city. We have the must-see video from his trip inside the drug wars of Juarez, Mexico.
And a pregnant woman goes into cardiac arrest, two paramedics see it, but they don't help. Wait until you hear why. That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: How many times have you heard it -- maybe you have even said it before -- I'm on break? It is annoying, but it's kind of understandable in these times, when the boss is asking you to work longer and harder and breaks can be scarce. They can hard to come by, but rarely is it deadly except in the case I'm going to tell you about that has New Yorkers outraged.
Listen to New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLOOMBERG: They are human beings. Somebody is dying down the street and they say help them, and they just sat there. There is no excuse whatsoever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: It happened in this coffee shop in downtown Brooklyn. It was a typical day, the customers having breakfast. Twenty-five- year-old mom-to-be Eutisha Rennix was fixing breakfast for them. Suddenly, Rennix has trouble breathing. Her co-workers spot a couple of EMTs, emergency workers, at a table having coffee and bagels.
People who were there say the EMTs told them to call 911 and got up and left. Rennix's co-workers did call 911, but by the time an on- duty emergency crew got there, it was too late. Rennix died. So did the baby girl she was carrying.
As for the EMTs, they have been suspended without pay while the fire department investigates. We will let you know how this one turns out.
Well, see that guy right here on the screen, this guy on the right? He spent his winter break from college documenting Mexico's deadly drug wars. He is going to share his compelling story next.
And, remember, you can join Rick Sanchez for his national conversation whenever you visit Atlanta. Just give us a call, 877- 4CNN-TOUR.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: In our "Conexion" segment today: He took it upon himself to go to Mexico and file his own iReports, and that is why he is today's Conexion."
If you hear college kids say they are spending winter break in Mexico, you might expect a sunny resort on Cancun or Cozumel. But one you're about to meet chose a very different trip to Juarez, the heart of the Mexican drug war.
Alex Pena is a junior at Florida Gulf Coast university. He took it upon himself to go to Juarez last week and file this iReport.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PENA: This scene here in a middle-class residential area of Juarez, a 36-year-old male named Yumaro (ph) now a victim in this ongoing narco war in Juarez, Mexico, a war being fueled by America's demand for illegal drugs.
Part of the way the police plan on combating the violence in the city is by patrolling the streets using these trucks and the soldiers.
All right. So this area we are rolling through right now is known to have gangs come together and plan their killings for the night. So, as a police patrol, they are hoping that they can get to them before they get ready, leave, and start killing for the night. As we were on patrol, we ended up back at the police station, somebody brought a body here, and possibly a scadio (ph), a hit man. Tonight, the victim is one of their own a police officer shot and injured in a vehicle-to-vehicle shooting. The hospital behind me is very well-guarded tonight, that's because there is a real possibility that the shooter will try to come back to finish off the victim inside of the hospital.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI: All right. Alex joins me now from Miami. Alex, how did that end? What happened to that officer who was brought to the hospital?
PENA: Well, fortunately, no gunman went back into the hospital, but the officer did end up losing his life to injuries sustained in the shooting. He was actually one of two that night who was killed and one of four who was killed that week.
VELSHI: All right. Alex, how old are you?
PENA: I'm 20 years old.
VELSHI: And have you ever studied journalism?
PENA: I am studying journalism right now at Florida Gulf Coast University.
VELSHI: All right. So you -- tell me how this worked out. You found somebody in Juarez who could show you around or set you up so that you could ride around with the police?
PENA: Yes. Well, through a series of networking, I made tons of phone calls, but I ended up getting in contact with a local journalist in the area who has done this for a while now, and he was able to get me in contact with somebody who would let me ride along with the police and kind of document what they do at nighttime in Juarez.
VELSHI: Now, you wanted to get some experience to become a journalist, you actually thought that you might become a war correspondent, and this was close to home and did it feel like a war zone to you?
PENA: It definitely felt like a war zone. I think it was definitely different from what I had expected it to be. I don't think I expected that many murders to be in the city. It is an average of eight to 10 murders a day. When I happened to get there, they had killed -- the Mexican officials had killed the leader of the Sinaloa cartel, one of the top officials.
And violence broke out in the streets. So with an average of eight to 10. When I was there it was actually 16 murders one day, 20 murders the next day, 20 murders the following day, so it definitely felt like a war zone.
VELSHI: Is there a sense of menace when you are in Juarez? Does it feel dangerous? Do people act as if there is danger around them? PENA: During the day it actually is a very well-functioning city. There are tons of people. It's a city of 1.5 million people there. And during the mornings and the early afternoons, there are people out selling, shopping, eating at the bars. Then once 10:00 rolls around, you see nobody on the streets.
And it is a very eerie feeling in the streets. And that is when it starts to feel like a war zone. In some of the parts you don't see any police officers, because they are either corrupt or they're scared to go there. And areas like that, you definitely feel a sense of menace and a sense of war.
VELSHI: And what do the police feel? I mean, do they feel -- those who want to fight crime, do they feel that this is a battle they can win or do they feel like they're just -- no pun intended, outgunned by the drug dealers, the cartels?
PENA: The ones who aren't corrupt, do they feel very outgunned? Patrolling with the police, talking to the soldiers, it almost seems like a lost cause to them. And to be honest, a lot of them are scared, because they're so outgunned. We were rolling through a city with one of my guides, and I looked over at him, I said, how come there are no police officers here? Just one block down, there was about four to five patrols within two blocks.
And he said, what are you crazy? Do you think they want to get killed. So if they are not corrupt, they are too scared. And if you are too scared to fight this war, there is really no end to it.
VELSHI: All right. Alex, your report is compelling. Obviously we don't advocate our I-reporters putting themselves in harm's way for a story. After all, Juarez is dangerous enough for professional journalists as CNN's senior Latin American affairs editor Rafael Romo can tell us. Rafael, just did a piece on Juarez a few weeks ago.
Rafael, thanks for joining us. Who are the major players here that Alex was talking about and what are they fighting over?
RAFAEL ROMO, CNN SENIOR LATIN AMERICAN AFFAIRS EDITOR: Well, Ciudad Juarez is the epicenter of violence in Mexico for a very simple reason. That's the part of Mexico where at least three different cartels meet. We are talking about the Juarez Cartel, we are talking about Sinaloa Cartel, and about the Beltran Leyva Cartel whose leader was shot by the Mexican army just a week ago in Central Mexico.
So now you have a vacuum of power there, and you are trying to -- these cartels are trying to figure out who the next leader is going to be. But you have a city of 1.5 million people, about 2,500 people have died so far this year. It is a record. And year after year, they are establishing records. Alex was talking about the lack of police.
Effectively, there is no police doing any drug law enforcement in Juarez. It is up to the Mexican army to do that, and President -- Mexican President Felipe Calderon sent about 7,000 troops earlier in this year in March. So far, the work that they have been able to do does not really amount to much. So you see the same kind of violence repeating itself -- Ali.
VELSHI: Rafael, what do you think of Alex having gone there, very creative, very entrepreneurial, is that a good idea?
ROMO: It is definitely not a very good idea. If you go to Juarez, especially with a camera, he was very brave and he was able to get access to an operation as far as I saw. Not a very good idea. It is -- Juarez is probably definitely the most dangerous city in Mexico. Some even say the most dangerous city in the world, far more dangerous than Baghdad. The murder rate in Juarez is higher than 40 per 100,000 residents, so it is a place that you don't want to be in, especially at night.
But definitely, Alex had a very good report and it was very brave of him. If he wants to be a journalist, he has a start.
VELSHI: He is on the way.
ROMO: Yes.
VELSHI: He has got his chops. All right. Rafael Romo, thanks very much, and Alex Pena, thanks very much for joining us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nothing has gone how we wanted, but we are working it out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: This one is crazy. This blushing bride waiting at the airport in her wedding dress, the groom is stranded hundreds of miles away. How weather delayed their big day. That is up ahead.
And next, have you done all of your holiday shopping? Why retailers in at least one part of the country are practically praying for last-minute shoppers.
And don't forget, the other way to participate in this "National Conversation," call us in the United States, the number 1-877-742- 5751.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: All right. It's 3:39 in the afternoon Eastern time. It is Tuesday. Do you know when Christmas Day is? It's Friday. Do to math. The poll today -- the poll we saw today says that almost half of you, 40 percent of Americans still have some holiday gift buying to do, if you are going to do it at all. That is a lot of people. That is the most in 10 years at this point.
There is a problem, one region of the country that retailers hope and pray is full of last minute shoppers remains hunkered down under a blast of dreadful weather. We've got more coming in in the Midwest. Let me get straight talk on this from Britt Beemer. He runs America's Research Group. And they study this sort of thing. Britt, thanks for joining us. What is going on? Retailers in this country seem...
C. BRITT BEEMER, AMERICA'S RESEARCH GROUP: Ali, merry Christmas.
VELSHI: And to you. Retailers seem pretty nervous, Britt.
BEEMER: Well, they should, because you know, when you look at our numbers over the weekend, not only were 42 percent of consumers not done, but a half of those that weren't done told us that they were upset because they weren't seeing 60 and 70 percent off. So the weather was part of the problem but the discounts were the other.
VELSHI: Well, this is definitely not the year that we had last year when you were seeing those up to 70 percent off at major retailers. Because of the weather in the Northeast and the weather coming into the Midwest, are retailers going to drop prices more? Is this going to get good tonight and tomorrow and Thursday? Or if you haven't done your shopping, should you just suck it up and go do it now?
BEEMER: Well, I think at this point, retailers' advertising plans have been set. There is no way they can change them at the last minute. I mean, the question is, will retailers even give the consumers 60 or 70 percent off after Christmas, because they have been pretty adamant about only doing 50 percent off even after Christmas.
I think right now what you are seeing, really honestly is that on Monday and Tuesday of this week many consumers who are going to be traveling on Wednesday to go on vacation, so yesterday and today were the two big days.
And if the weather is a factor, what you're going to see happen, which will be the other issue we saw a few years ago, is there are going to be a lot more cash gifts given. And that is the worst thing that can happen to retail, because last year when somebody got cash, 74 percent of those dollars went to either pay bills or buy groceries or go out to eat while only 26 percent of those dollars went into retail stores. So that is a big challenge.
VELSHI: All right. Britt, thank you for joining us, keeping an eye on this. We'll check in with you again. Britt Beamer, joining us from Phoenix.
Well, a young actress gone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRITTANY MURPHY, DECEASED ACTOR: (INAUDIBLE) dark thriller, I was very drawn to this because of its noir quality.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: That is Brittany Murphy. This interview was done in December. Will her last interview shed any light on her sudden death? And is a priest telling his congregation it is OK to commit a crime? This is one religious message that you're not going to want to miss.
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VELSHI: Lots of your reactions on Twitter to the story about the emergency medical personnel who told the coworkers of a dying woman to call 911. "Bobbysgirl1972" says: "It embarrasses me to be a New Yorker when a story like this darkens the airwaves. How can EMS workers stand by and watch someone die?"
"Selfish people," reads another one, who told me I (ph) pronounced (ph) her name right, so I'm not going to pronounce it. "Selfish people, who leaves a pregnant women to die?"
"RuggedCwby" says: "Cannot believe EMS on break let a woman die in front of them. How heartless can people be? My EMS people were great to me."
All right. Remember Brittany Murphy? She was adorable as the slightly pudgy tragically un-hip 15-year-old in the movie "Clueless." That was 15 years ago, back in 1995. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "CLUELESS")
MURPHY: You don't think that we mesh well? Why am I even listening to you to begin with? You're a virgin who can't drive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Brittany's Murphy's sudden death on Sunday was a stunner. She was 32 years old, no longer pudgy, in fact, she was rail thin. Listen to this, it is one of her last interviews on December 1st, at the premier of her latest movie.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why did June (ph) -- do you think June ultimately cheated?
MURPHY: By the way, "Phantom of the Opera" was filmed in the exact same studio which is no longer there. It was the oldest on the Universal lot. And...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)...
MURPHY: ... lost in the fire. Very sad. It was so beautiful, my goodness. And that ambience, of course, fed into a film such as this.
I'm sorry, what were -- you were asking me about June.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, why do you think that she ultimately cheated?
MURPHY: I -- I don't know June's actual reasons for cheating. I -- I'm very different from June. I'm very, very different.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Really quick, last question, is it easier -- do you find it easier to film comedies or thrillers? What comes more naturally to you?
MURPHY: Oh, lord. You know, for me, I have had the good fortune of being able to play characters that are stuck in the middle of comedic situations, comedic stories, ridiculous...
(CROSSTALK)
MURPHY: ... or tragic. And it all has to do with the story and the director and that is really where the decisions are made on my behalf.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: OK. Now, listen to what "Inside Edition" chief correspondent Jim Moret told me when I asked him about that interview.
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VELSHI: Jim, many of us don't follow Brittany Murphy closely enough to know whether to make anything out of that video clip. Did she look unusually thin? Was she carrying herself in a way that she normally would in an interview?
JIM MORET, "INSIDE EDITION" CHIEF CORRESPONDENT: Well, she did look thin to those people who know her. And also about a month ago she was fired from a movie she was working on. Her reps say it was creative differences, but reports indicate that she was, according to the producer or director, problematic on the set, that her husband was on the set constantly and he was a problem.
And there have been rumors plaguing her for years about drug use and anorexia. Now it -- whether or not they are accurate, they are relevant because they did affect her career. And I have talked to a producer who had hired her for a movie she was to be working on in just a couple of weeks, and he almost fired her because of those rumors she called him personally, and based on that conversation, he kept her on the movie which is now up in the air.
But, you know, she had developed a reputation, and she was trying very hard to regain her career, but she had been called by some producers a space cadet, because she seemed spacey. Whether she was anorexic, I don't know, but theoretically the tox reports will show something.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: You heard Jim refer to the toxicology reports that are holding up a final ruling on what killed Brittany Murphy. An autopsy was completed yesterday, but it's going to be weeks before the toxicology results are in and you need the toxicology results to complete the autopsy.
A rookie hockey player called up for his first day with the pros scores a big goal, but the team is less than impressed. That is next.
And don't forget to visit Rick Sanchez at CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta. Go to cnn.com/tour for more details.
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VELSHI: There are many hellos and good-byes said in airports every day, but you don't hear many "I dos." Time for Las Fotos del Dia.
All right. Florida, blushing bride waiting in Orlando, but her groom-to-be was stuck up north. Weather grounded all of the flights going in and out, but he managed to catch a late-night flight to Tampa, still hours away from his final destination. The bride and wedding party high-tailed it to Tampa, and there they surprised the groom with an impromptu ceremony in the airport. I can hardly keep my eyes dry on this one. You know the saying, nothing, nothing gets between a bride and her wedding day, not even the weather.
All right. Talk about a rookie mistake. Dallas Stars going down by a goal with one minute left to play. Rookie defenseman gets the puck, it's his first game with the pros. He can show his team why they brought him up from the minors, but oh no, he loses the puck off his stick, it slid all the way into the net of his own team, effectively ending the game. The Stars lost to the San Jose Sharks 4- 2.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sometimes appallingly shoplifting is the least worst option that we leave person with. Try every legal avenue that you can, and failing that, what am I to tell them, other than to survive?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Did he just say what I think he said? This priest in England is telling his congregation, yes, my hard-hit flock, go out and shoplift, but only as long as you don't take more than you need. Many people, including police, disagree, his comments have drawn a lot of criticism. But he is still sticking by his words.
She lost her job, but she found a good way to save a few extra bucks. And she can help you do the same.
And tomorrow at 3:00 p.m. Eastern, the family gets together, fuses get short, you resort to eating too much, drinking too much, maybe smoking is your thing. Sound familiar? Look, you've got to manage the feelings, you've got to manage the holiday stress, and tomorrow we've going to give you survival tips for the holidays.
I know you don't think you need them, but tune in anyway.
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VELSHI: OK. If you follow Rick on Twitter, which is kind of like saying, if you breathe, you saw something he posted this morning that impacts you. Starting January 18th, Rick Sanchez starts a new show, it's going to be called "Rick's List." It will air weekdays from 3:00-5:00 p.m. Eastern. Tune in to see who makes the list each day.
Give me a second. Take a cup of coffee in the break, I took a little bit of a cookie and didn't know we were coming back so soon.
All right. Last week, as you know, I hit the road. The CNN Express hauled me and my crew up and down the Eastern Seaboard looking for proof that we were on the "Recovery Road." No politicians, no analysts, no journalists, just Americans and their experience emerging from recession. And I found them, I found plenty of them.
Watch this. I want to introduce you to a woman who made a business out of an already smart way to save a few bucks.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SHANNON JUSTICE, SMARTCOUPONDEALS.COM: A year ago I was laid off from my job as a marketing director. And because of the economy and because of the needing financial help, we decided to start couponing, me and my friends.
And what has come back from that is that we've developed a Web site called smartcoupondeals.com, where we send out e-mail shopping lists to people, showing them where they can save with about 60 to 90 percent on groceries. And we match what the current -- the coupons are that are currently out there with the sales that are out in the local stores.
We charge $5 a month for our service. And we e-mail on the day that every single sale starts a list all of the people. And we actually do all of the hard work for everybody. We tell them we do the legwork for them, because couponing is really not an easy thing to do.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What I'll do is I'll take the sales fliers.
JUSTICE: My father is -- has recently retired, and he has just taken to couponing like a duck in water.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So this is my stash, as we say here.
JUSTICE: He has actually had to build on a second pantry onto his house, because he saved so much and he is buying so many things.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can walk in and spend $150 with my discounts, with my coupons, I can walk out with $35, $40.
VELSHI: Has this generated some income for you?
JUSTICE: Very little right now. We're just in our beginning stages. What we've done is we've started with Facebook marketing. Just in the month of October, alone, we went from having 100 fans on Facebook to about 2,067 fans. A lot of people feel that -- you know, that, well, we're not that bad off that we have to go use coupons. The point is that it doesn't matter how bad off you are, you can really, you know, take that savings and put it towards something else in your household.
VELSHI: So it's logical regardless of what your financial station is to try and save on the basics?
JUSTICE: I believe it is. And one of the things that we do too is we also promote charity, too.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the nice things that I found recently was glucose meters, you can go into some of the places like CVS, pay $20 for this here, and they'll give you $20 back in extra bucks, so you can use the $20. And in I'll take -- I'll do this, I'll donate it to the emergency ministries, one of the doctors' offices, so they can start their patients out with a glucose meter. And it just surprises me that there's not so many people that are out actually doing this.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI: Shannon joins me now on the phone.
Shannon, what has happened since we aired that piece? Because we got a lot of response to it on CNN.
JUSTICE: Hey, Ali, how are you? We've had a lot of response, too. We've had people -- we had a dramatic increase in sign-ups. I think that our co-founder and Web techie, Heather Harrington (ph), had told us that we had almost 898,000 hits to our Web site that day.
So, I mean, the -- what we're hearing is just that there's an interest in this, you know, for interesting...
VELSHI: And real quickly, I've heard from people saying -- I've heard from people asking you if you're going to go national with this, because a lot of your stores that you cover are national, but some of them are regional. Are you able to do more for those people across the country?
JUSTICE: We're looking at it. I mean, the thing that we do is we put all of the lists together by ourselves. So we need to be able to have access to what those sales are. You know, we're not relying on any other sites to get our information. We need to know that when a store is having a sale on something that they are indeed having a sale on that before we send or members there.
So there is discussion about increasing or grocery stores. The stores that we do carry that are nationwide, I think we pretty much cover them all, Wal-Mart, Target, Kmart, you know, and the drug stores.
But the room for growth is really with our grocery stores. So we've heard feedback and we're telling our members and our fans to just let us know what's in their area, what their coupon policy is, and we'll look into it. We definitely want to increase our service and try to help people throughout the whole United States.
VELSHI: Thanks, Shannon. Good to talk to you again. And thanks for helping out. Shannon Justice joining us from Florence, South Carolina.
That's it for us. Let's take it over to "THE SITUATION ROOM" with Suzanne Malveaux.
