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Joy Behar Page
Death of Brittany Murphy; Missing Mom Mystery; Humans According to Hawkeye
Aired December 24, 2009 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: Tonight on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, as police look into the strange disappearance of Utah housewife Susan Powell, the very strange behavior of her husband, Josh, is at the forefront of their investigation.
Then, from Joe "You Lie" Wilson to Tiger "You Dog" Woods, 2009 has been the year of the scandal. We`ll go through them one by delicious one.
And I chat with comedian and actress Mo`nique, who tells me what it`s like to be a Golden Globe nominee for her wonderful work in "Precious".
All this and more tonight.
I would like to start tonight talking about two tragedies in the news. I`ll get to the missing Utah mom Susan Powell in a second. But first, there are still a lot of questions following the death of actress Brittany Murphy. Most notably, how can a seemingly healthy 32-year-old woman drop dead from a heart attack?
Here to talk about this case are: Jean Casarez, correspondent "In Session"; Dr. Larry Kobilinsky, forensic scientist, John J. College of Criminal Justice; and Laura Saltman, correspondent with AccessHollywood.com.
Hi everybody.
KOBILINSKY: Hi.
BEHAR: Laura, I want to start with you. Access Hollywood did an exclusive phone interview with Brittany`s husband. What did he say?
LAURA SALTMAN, CORRESPONDENT, ACCESSHOLLYWOOD.COM: Basically he called in because our producer had gone through his Web site, telling him that there`s been some comments about you that are very harsh out there and we offer our condolences but would like to know if you want to comment about that.
So he actually called in to comment about that. He wanted to know from her who was saying these harsh things about her. And he kind of pushed her on that a little bit.
But eventually she kind of got him off that subject and asked him how he was feeling. And of course he said his world was devastated by this. Our producer has told me that he was very shell shocked when he was talking to her. A lot of long pauses, a lot of "umms"; he really couldn`t get his words out to her. A lot of difficulty talking about it, obviously, you know, his wife just passed away.
BEHAR: But he actually called Access Hollywood?
SALTMAN: Yes, he actually called back to us.
BEHAR: That`s interesting.
Now, her husband also addressed the rumors that Brittany was linked to bad influences. He said, "I don`t know why anyone would think that. She found love. We found love. Brittany didn`t get to where Brittany was with anyone controlling. Brittany was Brittany."
Ok, but her friends are saying something different. They are saying that she was being controlled by him to some extent. What do you make of all of that at this point?
SALTMAN: Well, it was interesting, because Jamie Pressly, a friend of hers, had been caught by some paparazzi yesterday and they asked her if they were still friends. She said no, I was until she met him.
So there`s something going on there where someone who is a good friend doesn`t want to be your friend anymore based on the man that you`re with. I think that`s something we can all deal with. And then you know, Kathy Najimi had gone on to her Twitter and she had said that she was worried about Brittany and she had gotten involved with the wrong people.
There`s a lot out there about this person now. They`re questioning who he is; some people are saying he`s a con man. There was an issue where on the set -- the movie did called "The Caller". They had some issues apparently down in Puerto Rico. And she had been let go from the film.
So there`s definitely some questions about who this guy is, and I think he`s now thinking listen, I need to defend myself against this. I`m not a bad guy.
BEHAR: Right. That`s why he called to Access Hollywood...
SALTMAN: Right. Exactly.
BEHAR: To defend himself.
Ok. Larry, the autopsy was done and they found nothing untoward, no problems yet. What do you say to that? How long until all the tests are in?
DR. LARRY KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: It`s still early. The autopsy of course is a physical examination from head to toe to determine if there`s anything obvious that was the cause of death.
We really must wait until the toxicology report is completed. That may take four to six weeks because we really need to know if there were any drugs in her system, legal or illegal, and what quantities they are in.
Right now, there`s a lot of speculation as to why a healthy young woman would die and one of the possibilities is drug overdose or drug interactions.
BEHAR: Speaking of that, TMZ, who knows everything -- I don`t know how they get all this information -- they report that empty bottles of prescription medicine were found next to her night stand, tapomax, fluoxetine and clonopin; one is a sleeping pill. Isn`t clonopin a sleeping pill.
KOBILINSKY: These are anti-seizure medications, there`s an anti- depressant in there.
BEHAR: Which one is it, fluoxetine?
KOBILINSKY: Well, flouoxetine is actually Prozac. That`s the other name.
BEHAR: So that`s the anti-depressant.
KOBILINSKY: And it is an anti-depressant. It can be used for a lot of different things, including eating disorders. There were lots of rumors about eating disorders in this case of Brittany Murphy.
But these other drugs, they`re muscle relaxants. They are again, anti-seizure medications. Tapomax is prescribed for pain and to stop migraines. So these are all drugs that...
BEHAR: And clonopin is to put you to sleep?
KOBILINSKY: And it can -- it`s a muscle relaxant. It has that effect.
These drugs can cause problems if you take them together. There`s no doubt about it. But we really won`t know until we actually have that tox report.
BEHAR: Ok. Now, Jean, these medications were all in different people`s names. They were in Brittany`s, Simon`s, and her mothers and an unidentified person. What does that say to you?
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": I think this is one of the big issues here and I think it`s the California attorney general`s office that may step in. I called them this afternoon to see if they would confirm that they are going to launch an investigation. They would not confirm or deny.
But Joy, in California, the attorney general`s office has a special division that monitors prescription drugs in California; the dispensing, the administering.
Howard K. Stern, perfect example. They launched an investigation that resulted in criminal charges. It has nothing to do with the death but has to do with the dispensing, the administering, the using of a known addict by a doctor, by someone close to the person.
Michael Jackson, they did confirm with me they`re in the midst of an investigation into his drug use. So California, through the attorney general, is really launching a campaign on this. So I think they could get involved.
This is where the investigation is going to be focused now.
CASAREZ: At this point and that can result in criminal charges and remember it`s not based on the death but based on the administering and the use of the drug, so the prescriber.
BEHAR: Just as a last point, her husband said that she had flu-like symptoms. She could have had swine flu, isn`t that possible? Could you just drop dead like that at that age from swine flu?
KOBILINSKY: Absolutely. In many cases you see signs in the lungs; you see hemorrhages in the lungs but not in all cases. So they really need to do the histology and the virology studies to rule that out.
SALLTMAN: And he had told us that she had laryngitis and had trouble talking when we spoke to him. That was one of her symptoms.
BEHAR: Thank you, Laura, very much, for joining us.
Now let`s turn our attention to the mystery that is currently unfolding in Utah. Twenty-eight-year-old mother of two Susan Powell is still missing and her husband, Josh Powell, still refuses to answer questions.
Today the police want to know why he put so many miles on a rental car he picked up two days after his wife disappeared. Ok. That is another thing.
Now, Jean, the husband rents a car because the police basically seized his car, and he puts all this mileage on the rental car. Now, where was he going?
CASAREZ: The police are saying this to the Deseret News which is a local newspaper there. Several hundred miles the police told the newspaper.
We don`t know where he was. You know, Joy, I was in the Salt Lake area the first week in December. I work on the story before it happens. But I can visualize Salt Lake. It`s a larger area, but it`s not that large. But Park City, Utah, there are mountainous areas that are very close to Salt Lake, which is sort of in a valley. And we don`t know where he went.
But this is so reminiscent...
BEHAR: And we won`t know where he went so easily, because there was no GPS in the car.
CASAREZ: But if he had a cell phone...
BEHAR: But it would have to be on.
CASAREZ: It would have been on, that`s right. But it could have been on.
BEHAR: So even if he didn`t make a call or anybody called him, just the fact that it was on would tell you where he went?
CASAREZ: The towers can ping and the towers pinging can provide a route. I`ve seen that in numerous cases...
BEHAR: Did they confiscate the phone? No. He could have thrown it into the Salt Lake.
CASAREZ: You`re exactly right, we don`t know.
I mean, obviously they know about this car.
(CROSSTALK)
CASAREZ: They obviously know about the car, right?
BEHAR: Yes.
CASAREZ: They know he rented a car. They`re making tabs of where he is. Could they have followed that rental car? We don`t know.
BEHAR: Why can`t they -- somebody said why can`t they figure out the mileage and then do a radius and just go all around there and see if there`s a body.
KOBILINSKY: Absolutely.
BEHAR: I guess that`s what they`re looking for.
CASAREZ: And talk to the rental agent. Did they say, are you going to the mountains, do you need chains. We provide chains. Maybe the rental agent or the car agency could provide information.
BEHAR: And also he rented the car and then after Susan`s disappearance, and then he returned the car 24 hours later. So he just needed it for one thing, who knows what that is? I`m not going to say.
Josh still isn`t talking to the cops.
CASAREZ: Not after that initial statement, he`s not. There`s an open invitation and according to local media reports, he has left the Salt Lake area going to the state of Washington to take the children so they`re with family members for the holidays, with a wife that`s still missing.
BEHAR: I know. The whole case stinks to me.
(CROSSTALK)
KOBILINSKY: Josh is definitely a person of interest here.
CASAREZ: Of interest, yes.
KOBILINSKY: You know, they were having a bad marriage. He was in great debt. The police interrogated him and they weren`t happy. He lawyered up almost immediately. He didn`t go into the third interrogation or interview.
The police are smart. They know what questions to ask. They listen very carefully. If there`s anything contradictory in there, they`re going to focus their attention on you.
BEHAR: Let me tell you what the "Salt Lake Tribune" reported.
They said today that Susan told her friends that she was A, worried her husband would kidnap their kids and ruin her financially if she divorced him. Josh they say was controlling and emotionally abusive.
She has set up a separate checking account because she was afraid he`s going to go into her money. She prepared an informal will -- that`s odd -- she`s a young woman. She arranged a place to stay if she decided to leave him.
Now, what does that all tell you?
CASAREZ: That tells me state of mind and it also tells me, not only her state of mind but something had to have happened for her to think those thoughts. You don`t just automatically think those thoughts.
And if this would ever get to a court of law, that may not come in, because it`s the state of mind of a victim. But everything else we`ve been discussing today, renting the car, driving hundreds of miles, prosecutors will want to bring that in under consciousness of guilt; and leaving the state when your wife is missing.
BEHAR: Why didn`t the friends say something before, though, about all of this to somebody? Or to the police?
CASAREZ: Isn`t that the way it goes?
BEHAR: If the husband is controlling and emotionally abusive, I guess you can`t report that to the police.
CASAREZ: No.
BEHAR: It doesn`t really -- they would say, what? That happens every minute.
CASAREZ: And there`s also a friend that had a falling out with Josh Powell.
BEHAR: Oh so it`s suspicious in that way...
CASAREZ: So when you look at the other side too, that it`s subjective.
BEHAR: Well, thank you very much.
CASAREZ: Thank you.
BEHAR: Jean and Larry.
KOBILINSKY: It`s a pleasure.
BEHAR: Very nice. Very interesting.
When we come back, my good friend Alan Alda will join me.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALAN ALDA, ACTOR: I happen to be an officer only because I foolishly opened an invitation from President Truman to come to this costume party. And as for my abilities as a doctor, if you seriously question that I`m afraid I`ll just have to challenge you to a duel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So what`s the (INAUDIBLE)?
ALDA: I`m thinking it`s a specimen bottle to 20 (INAUDIBLE).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are ladies present.
ALDA: Oh, sorry, baby.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Major to you.
ALDA: Oh sorry, major baby.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: That was Alan Alda as the legendary Hawkeye Pierce from "M-A- S-H". He`s won six Emmy`s, he`s written two bestsellers and he`s hosting "The Human Spark" on PBS in January. I`m joined now by one of my favorite people, Alan Alda.
ALDA: Hello.
BEHAR: Hi Alan.
ALDA: How are you?
BEHAR: So first of all, let`s when you were on "M-A-S-H," did people come to you for medical advice?
ALDA: One time, a friend`s husband collapsed in the bathroom in the middle of the night and her first thought was to call me. What am I supposed to do, run over and tell him a couple good jokes?
BEHAR: Really.
ALDA: Well, I mean, that`s crazy.
BEHAR: What did she expect you to do?
ALDA: I really don`t know. They are a little -- after a while, she came to her senses and called a real doctor.
BEHAR: They were really confused you were a doctor.
ALDA: And he came over and told a couple of good jokes. I mean, you can`t trust these people.
BEHAR: You know the thing about "M-A-S-H" and I know that you`re probably like -- all right, already, I did this 100 years ago.
ALDA: Well, that`s all right.
BEHAR: Yes, but the thing about it is that it endures to this day.
ALDA: Yes, yes.
BEHAR: It`s still on television.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: People stop you and call you Hawkeye, right?
ALDA: Oh, yes. Yes.
BEHAR: And is it the anti-war message, do you think, or is it the fact that it`s just a funny show?
ALDA: I think it`s good it`s funny. It`s funny and its -- but there`s a lot of stuff why that worked. And nobody really understood it. If they understood it, they would have had copies you know that would have done...
BEHAR: Yes, they never did make a copy of that.
ALDA: No, no.
BEHAR: It`s like the Lorena Bobbitt story, there`s no copycat there either.
ALDA: I know, I know, it`s gone on for so long. All kinds of edit jokes come to mind. You know, cutting.
But the thing that doesn`t get talked about much about that show is that it was about real people and they went through a really horrible time.
BEHAR: Right.
ALDA: And we took that kind of seriously in spite of the silliness of it.
BEHAR: Well, as you know, you know as a funny person yourself you just have to laugh at some things...
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: ... because otherwise you won`t survive.
ALDA: Yes. I think that was the idea that you sort of went crazy in order to survive.
BEHAR: Yes. And then the other thing that you did, you`ve done so many different projects. I love "The Four Seasons," I love all of your work, but 30 years ago you wrote and starred in the "Seduction of Joe Tynan" ...
ALDA: Was that 30 years ago?
BEHAR: Yes.
ALDA: Wow.
BEHAR: ... about a politician`s affair. Now that was very prescient of you but is this before the Clinton/Lewinsky scandal?
ALDA: I think they were having affairs in Greece.
BEHAR: Well, they...
ALDA: ... politicians you know.
BEHAR: Maybe I mean, Italy and in France.
ALDA: Yes, oh maybe, come on.
BEHAR: ... but an American, we never really heard of it before. Before -- 30 years ago you didn`t even know about Kennedy yet.
ALDA: No, I know. Yes, I know, I know and I mean, he was more active than Clinton was.
BEHAR: Kennedy...
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: Oh, I know. He couldn`t keep his pants up, its true.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: But you know, why talk about the dead in such a way? It`s so wrong.
ALDA: It doesn`t bother him that he`s dead. He`s still doing it.
BEHAR: He still does...
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: ... he`s still doing it. Well, Marilyn Monroe is dead too, so maybe they`re getting it on in heaven.
ALDA: Oh, yes, yes.
BEHAR: I would love to see that.
ALDA: You would really?
BEHAR: I would, I really would.
ALDA: I don`t want to see that.
BEHAR: Now, you know, I was looking through your book again, the stuffed old book, can you say the title again.
ALDA: "Never Have Your Dog Stuffed."
BEHAR: I know, I love the title.
ALDA: Yes, thank you.
BEHAR: But there`s serious stuff in that book.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: Very serious stuff.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: Like the first line of the book is, quote, "My mother didn`t try to stab my father until I was six." As soon as I read that, I sort of like laughed in a way, because only you would say that.
ALDA: You know, I have a granddaughter who she saw the book on the table. She was only about nine or something...
BEHAR: Yes.
ALDA: ... 8 or 9. Saw the book on the table and she says, oh, she opened it up and saw the first sentence and she said, that`s enough of that. And she never looked at it again.
BEHAR: Grandpa`s crazy.
ALDA: Yes, it sounded a little too tough, I think.
BEHAR: Yes, but anyway -- but you say, you went on to say, she must have shown signs of oddness before that. And I was so interested in that because you have such recollection of your early childhood...
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: ... with all the stuff your father was doing, the vaudeville and everything. What were the signs?
ALDA: Well, the poor woman was psychotic...
BEHAR: Yes.
ALDA: ... she was schizophrenic and paranoid and I would have thought that she would show signs that would scare people off, but she didn`t show anything apparently that scared my father off because he married her.
BEHAR: How long did he stay with her?
ALDA: Twenty-five years. And it`s very hard to be in a family with somebody that mentally ill.
BEHAR: Right. Certifiable, a really, really.
ALDA: Oh yes, she was in an institution for awhile. But what -- you know one of the things that made it much worse then, than I think it would be now...
BEHAR: Yes.
ALDA: ... is that nobody talked about it. We didn`t even talk about it -- my father and I never talked about it. I was the only child. he was the only one I could talk to. We just kept quiet because it was -- it was a shame. It was shameful to him.
BEHAR: Well, in those days they didn`t even say cancer. People were...
ALDA: No, that`s right-- I remember somebody said once the big "C". Yes.
BEHAR: The big "C" that was John Wayne.
ALDA: Did he say that?
BEHAR: I think he said it in an ad.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes, I died of the big, "Don`t smoke because you`ll die of the big C."
ALDA: Oh yes.
BEHAR: He said, because he couldn`t even say the word cancer.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: And then...
ALDA: Well, they didn`t know what any of this stuff was and they still don`t to some extent. But they don`t -- they -- it`s more permissible to talk about it because they`re more hooked into science. Science, they think, was going to get somewhere.
BEHAR: Right. Did you think you that would be mentally ill because she was? Did it ever occur that it was genetic or something?
ALDA: I think I -- I sometimes I worried a little bit not so much. And sometimes -- sometimes I thought that I brought on her episodes. You know what I mean, the kid -- it`s like the kids...
BEHAR: You took the blame?
ALDA: ... you know when the kid kicks the lamp post and all the lights in the city go out, he thinks he did it.
BEHAR: Powerful.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: Very powerful.
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: A lot of kids take the blame for the parent`s divorce. Kids are very vulnerable that way.
These are some fun things that you said also that I love. Is it true you said you wanted to live to 106 but only if you can still make love?
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: This is before Viagra you made this point.
ALDA: That`s right. That was true, it was.
And I said that because I was being interviewed all day long and I was so tired of hearing myself talk. This reporter asked me this question I never heard before, how long do you want to live? I said what do I say? So I didn`t know what I was going to say and I said 106 if I can still make love. Next day in the papers, "Watch out, girls."
So Arlene, my wife, reads this and she says, 106? Give me a break.
BEHAR: Ok. We`ll be back with more with Alan Alda in a minute. Stay there. He`s great.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Confiscated by the U.S. authorities, the chimp was given the name "Hondo".
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What does he mean by that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s just a hello and welcome to the neighborhood.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: That was a clip from "The Human Spark" with Alan Alda. It airs January 6th, 13th and 20th on PBS.
I`m back here with Alan Alda. So I`m very fascinated by animal behavior.
ALDA: You should have been sitting there by that window when that giant chimp slammed himself against the glass. I didn`t expect it. He scared the daylights out of me. It was scary. They`re big.
BEHAR: They`re big animals.
ALDA: I talked to somebody Franz Duval (ph) who does a lot of research on chimps at the (INAUDIBLE) Research Center. He said this really interesting thing about the difference between chimps and us.
He said, we pay attention to one another. We can cooperate with one another and in an unusual. New York has 10 million people in it. If you had 10 million chimps in New York, you would have a blood bath.
BEHAR: Of course.
ALDA: I mean, they just really don`t cooperate.
BEHAR: So they have 97 percent of our DNA or something?
ALDA: Even more, like 98-point something; 99-point something. I don`t know.
BEHAR: But that point something is a big difference, in most people.
ALDA: Yes. The one or one and a half percent -- in most people -- you`re right. I have a friend who says the difference between animals and people is you don`t see animals behaving like people.
BEHAR: That`s true.
I found a thing about chimps, they use erotic behavior...
ALDA: Yes.
BEHAR: To resolve social conflicts.
ALDA: That`s the Bonobos.
BEHAR: It`s the Bonobos.
ALDA: The Bonobos, they really don`t fight. They don`t even argue much. They just screw. They`re really into that.
BEHAR: It`s kind of like makeup sex in a way, isn`t it?
ALDA: I guess it is; except it`s like even before hand, they don`t have anything to make up.
BEHAR: They just do it.
ALDA: Don`t give me that look in your eye, here.
BEHAR: I`m fascinated by them.
ALDA: You are?
BEHAR: The Bonobo.
ALDA: Have you ever tried that?
BEHAR: Have I ever tried a Bonobo? No.
ALDA: No, I mean, what they do to get along.
BEHAR: Of course. We all have.
ALDA: Why not?
BEHAR: It`s like, come on, sweetie, don`t be mad at me -- whatever.
At a certain age, you get sick of the whole thing. You know what I mean? But you still try. You deal with make up sex, make up sex, whatever.
The Bonobo, the thing about I like about the Bonobo is that sex is not about reproduction, it`s about pleasure.
ALDA: Well, it`s really about getting along.
BEHAR: What else did you learn in this?
ALDA: The thing that the show is really about, I love this program. It`s three one-hour shows and it`s called "The Human Spark" and it`s about what makes us human. What is it about us that`s different from other animals, and how did we get this way? What was the process of evolution?
And then they take pictures inside my head for a whole hour to find out what there is in our brains.
BEHAR: Did they find anything?
ALDA: They found a whole bunch. It`s over here, you can`t believe Marilyn Monroe is right there.
BEHAR: And JFK is on the other side?
ALDA: That`s right. And they`re constantly getting together.
So one of the wonderful differences between us and chimps is this socialization. What we`re doing now, this connecting...
BEHAR: Yes.
ALDA: I`m looking into your eyes, you`re wondering what I`m thinking, I`m wondering what you`re thinking.
BEHAR: You know what I`m thinking.
ALDA: What?
BEHAR: I have to go to a break.
ALDA: Get out.
BEHAR: You said you could read your mind.
ALDA: I couldn`t read your mind with that. Except you always got to go to a break.
BEHAR: I always do. I`m sorry. It`s television.
ALDA: You should take a pill for that.
BEHAR: I always love seeing you Alda, on television or off television. Thank you for doing this with us.
Tiger Woods and the other scandals of the year. Stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: So 2009 is wrapping up and as a talk show host I have to say I haven`t failed to notice, nay, enjoyed the amount of ridiculous scandals this past year. Especially in politics. Now before I head out to the Appalachian Trail for Christmas break, I want to talk about the year in scandal with media commentator Sam Seder, Laurie Kilmartin, comedienne, and Gabriel Snyder, Editor and Chief of Gawker.com. Well, let`s just start with Tiger for a second. Do you think that was the scandal of 2009?
SAM SEDER, MEDIA COMMENTATOR: Well, it was pretty big. Here`s a guy who`s made a billion dollars as a shell for corporate America.
BEHAR: Yes.
SEDER: In some ways it does - it does sort of pull back a veneer about what we`ve been sold.
BEHAR: And there were hints, I think, all over the place. People sort of knew a lot, more than they let on.
SEDER: Not me.
BEHAR: No, no. You mentioned corporate America. They must have known stuff. But of course they`re not going to tell anybody.
SEDER: Well you`re talking about the accounting group for Enron.
BEHAR: A lot of money, yes.
SEDER: They got their own scout in their clouds.
BEHAR: Exactly.
GABRIEL SNYDER, GAWKER: I don`t see the scandal here.
BEHAR: You don`t see it?
SNYDER: I mean who is looking up to Tiger Woods as the role model? He is a robot who plays golf better than anyone else.
LAURIE KILMARTIN, COMEDIAN: I think little half black Asian kids were looking up to him as a role model.
SNYDER: Well -
BEHAR: And people who wanted to play golf. Not me or you, maybe.
SEDER: Well I mean he was sort of the pinnacle of, I mean he was so good, and he may still very well be, at golf. It`s rare that you see anybody in any sport or endeavor that is that much better than everyone else.
BEHAR: Absolutely but the most fun scandal for me this year was Governor Sanford. People hated it because he said his mistress was his soul mate. Let`s listen to his confession. I love this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOVERNOR MARK SANFORD: It began very innocently as I suspect many of these things do. But here recently over this last year it developed into something much more than that. I would also apologize to my staff. Because as much as I did talk about going to the Appalachian trails, that was one of the original scenarios I had thrown out, Neil, that is not where I ended up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: So he was going to the Appalachian trails but it turns out he was just chasing Argentinean tail. Now is this guy - was this the funniest scandal because or the most talked about sex scandal because of the soul mate business or because he was such a big loud Christian and the hypocrisy factor or what do you think made that so wonderful a scandal?
SEDER: I think it`s all those things. I mean the guy lied about where he was. I mean he`s responsible for a state.
BEHAR: Right.
SEDER: And he`s lying like I`m going out to get a pack of cigarettes and stealing away somewhere. I mean the most scandalous part of that scandal to me is that -?
BEHAR: Yes.
SEDER: Is that here`s a guy who is going to turn down the stimulus money because he didn`t want to waste the taxpayers money and was willing to jeopardize the jobs of thousands of teachers and school kids getting their lunches. And he`s using taxpayer money to go to see his mistress.
BEHAR: So it`s hypocrisy basically.
SEDER: Slightly hypocritical.
BEHAR: Yes.
KILMARTIN: Yes, it was therapeutic because Jenny Sanford didn`t put up with it.
BEHAR: Yes.
KILMARTIN: That was the thing that made it for me. She said no, she`s filing for divorce. That`s like the next evolution of political wives - is that you don`t take it, you file for divorce. And the next after that should be the revenge affair.
BEHAR: Yes.
KILMARTIN: Like how cool would it be if Tiger Woods` 15th mistress is Jenny Sanford?
BEHAR: Oh that would be so great.
KILMARTIN: That would be awesome.
BEHAR: But I mean you`re right, like Mrs. Edwards is still with him, probably torturing him. I would.
KILMARTIN: Yes.
BEHAR: I mean, Silda -
KILMARTIN: Silda Spitzer.
BEHAR: Silda Spitzer is still there. Jenny really - she really went for it.
KILMARTIN: It`s great.
BEHAR: Ensign is another politician who cheated but he got to keep his position. Okay, now some of them did, some of them didn`t. I have the list here. Sanford stayed. Ensign stayed. Spitzer, bye. Edwards, out. Vitter, these are last years, Vitter gone. Craig, Larry Craig, tap, tap, tap.
SEDER: Vitter`s still there.
BEHAR: He is?
Yes
BEHAR: Oh he`s not gone?
SEDER: No, he`s not.
BEHAR: Why is he still there? He was seeing hookers.
SEDER: Well because he was seeing hookers when he was a congressman. But now he`s a senator so --
BEHAR: Talk about can`t get his feet up the stairs.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: And of course, Bill Clinton, the poster child, kept his job. Now what do you think makes them stay and the others get kicked out, what happens there?
SNYDER: The only reason that these guys leave is that if they quit. Remember Larry Craig he tried to quit. Then he said oh, no, no, I want to keep my job. And then they said no, no, you already quit. You can`t have it back. But look at Spitzer. He`s come back; he`s talking about running again.
BEHAR: Yes.
SYNDER: I think it`s harder to find any of these guys who actually have paid a price for any of these scandals.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: Do you agree with that Sam?
SEDER: I think there`s some truth to that. But frankly, I don`t think there necessarily should be a price. I think its one thing to engage in behavior that`s illegal. But I mean if you have an affair, you have an affair. I - I am not -- I don`t particularly care unless you`re out there like a guy like Ensign or Vitter or Sanford saying, you know, talking about being a righteously moral person.
BEHAR: Well there`s hypocrisy and then there`s lying which is perjury, which is where they get them a lot of times, right?
SEDER: Right. And well it`s also apparently - it`s still illegal to go see a prostitute.
KILMARTIN: It seems like the guys that paid the price are the ones that --
BEHAR: Yes that`s right, they`re not in Nevada, and they should go to Nevada.
KILMARTIN: Well the ones that paid the price are the ones that crossed gender lines and not cheat on their wife with another woman but with a man.
BEHAR: With a man?
KILMARTIN: Yes.
BEHAR: Well, that`s the Republican Party gets very uptight about something like that, right? That`s the deal breaker over there.
KILMARTIN: Yes.
SEDER: Right where they had a much bigger problem with Larry Craig than they did let`s say Vitter or Sanford or what not. I mean the idea that --
KILMARTIN: And Foley, too.
SEDER: And Foley, they were genuine pariahs because they were having extramarital affairs that dealt with other men as opposed to women.
BEHAR: Well I think that the only time the country gives a damn about any of that is when these same politicians vote against gay rights in some way. Then they really deserve the wrath of the media when they do that. And that`s what happens, see the movie Outrage. Okay, aside from scandal, health care reform is also happening in D.C., one Republican Senator said this prior to an important vote. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SENATOR TOM COBURN, (R) OKLAHOMA: What the American people ought to pray is that somebody can`t make the vote tonight. That`s what they ought to pray.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Now, his office is saying he wasn`t wishing anybody harm, but if you say I hope someone doesn`t show up, maybe Robert Byrd won`t make it. I mean it`s a little evil, isn`t it?
KILMARTIN: Yes.
BEHAR: Nasty, nasty behavior, in my opinion.
KILMARTIN: I -- I have to say, I like the GOP`S like Old Testament take on Christianity. Like, if I can actually go to church and ask Jesus to kill people, I will return to church.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
KILMARTIN: For a long while but I have a long list.
BEHAR: Do you think that politics was nastier this year? Remember Joe Wilson, you lie! He started the whole thing. Was it nastier than previous years?
SEDER: Yes, I think you can go back and you can see a trend that when a Democrat wins the presidency, the Right wing becomes just foaming at the mouth.
BEHAR: Vicious.
SEDER: I mean there`s a reason why the Department Of Homeland Security came out with that report in saying look for a rise in Right wing violence. Because that`s what happens. And you know, I`m not suggesting that every conservative or every Republican is a racist, but they did have a strategy for 30 years called the southern strategy that was built around winning elections based upon some vague notion of racism.
BEHAR: Right, exactly.
SEDER: And so I think this is driving them crazy.
BEHAR: Exactly. Obama tries to be civil though. He really does try, he`s a gentlemen. I`ve always thought of him as a gentleman. Even when they turned on him for a couple things he said to Mrs. Clinton during the primary, I certainly said that you are likeable enough; I thought he was actually being nice there. I didn`t think -- I did, you know. Maybe he should just give it up and turn Rahm Emanuel on them, just sick Rahm Emanuel on these Republicans. I think he should just go for it now.
SEDER: There are a lot of people who are waiting for him to do that with health care and it hasn`t happened.
BEHAR: Well he has issues there, anyway. Thank you guys, thanks very much, everyone. More when we come back. My conversation with golden globe nominee Mo`Nique. See the movie? It`s good. "Precious."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Mo`Nique has already made a big name for herself in the standup comedy world. But now she`s blowing critics away with her outstanding dramatic turn in the movie "Precious." that performance has already earned we are a well-deserved golden global nomination and on the very day she got that news, I asked her how it felt.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MO`NIQUE, ACTRESS: Absolutely wonderful.
BEHAR: I mean, I cannot tell you how I was taken by your performance, Mo`Nique. It was so stirring and so deep and so interesting, the way you found things in the character for yourself. And she`s not likable character.
MO`NIQUE: Not at all.
BEHAR: She`s a monster. And, I mean, you just went down deep, girl. Where did you go?
MO`NIQUE: Well, you know, once I read the book, when you read that story, that character is very real. And I know Mary Jones. I know that monster. So when Mr. Daniels said action, I was very familiar with that character. And that character for me in my life was my oldest brother, Jerald. So when he would say action, I knew who she was.
BEHAR: I see. So - so it was, but you throw the baby on the floor in one scene. I mean that`s one most upsetting scene. And you had to live with that character for a while too. That must have been rough on you, every day.
MO`NIQUE: Well, you know, the beauty of it though is, Joy, I remember when I got the script and my husband and I read it and he said to me, momma, leave it on the floor. Whenever he says cut, leave it right there and don`t take it with you. And that`s really what we did. When Lee Daniels would say cut, we would leave those characters right there on that floor.
BEHAR: So right to craft services.
MO`NIQUE: Right to craft services, baby. Yes!
BEHAR: And the worst thing I heard is you were not allowed to wear any makeup in this part. That`s a burn.
MO`NIQUE: Joy, I got to tell you, when I`m not in front of a camera, I`m so not a makeup girl. I don`t look like Mary Jones. But I`m so not a makeup girl.
BEHAR: And you know you`re known for your comedy and films like "Phat Girls." and "Soul Plane." Basically Mo`Nique a comedian. This is quite a rare; it`s like Meryl Streep in reverse. She does drama and comedy and everybody is shocked and surprised. You did the opposite.
MO`NIQUE: Well you know, I think the word is we`re entertainers and everything comes under that. I was really appreciative when Lee Daniels didn`t put me into that box. He said I know you can make people laugh. But I believe you can bring these characters to life. And I was in a movie "Shadow Boxer" and in the movie "Precious." And he said, you know, I believe you can bring something to these characters. So I was so appreciative that he didn`t do the norm and say oh, no, she`s just a comedienne.
BEHAR: You know one African-American critic dubbed the film a Klansman`s fantasy. What do you make of that?
MO`NIQUE: A what?
BEHAR: In other words, the Ku Klux Klan would like this film because some people -- I guess in the black community are feeling as though it`s -- it doesn`t make the black community look good.
MO`NIQUE: Well here`s the thing, those characters just happen to be black. And, I always say the audience is very intelligent. They know this is not just a black movie This happens all over the world. Every race, every gender. If you can think of it, it happens everywhere. We just happen to be the characters telling the story and we`re black people. Does it happen in black America? Yes, it does, Joy. Does it happen in white America? Yes, it does. Does it happen in Asia? Yes, it does. Does it happen -- it happens all over the world. So what I would say to people is oh, it makes black people look this way or that way, it tells the truth. Are all people in that position?
BEHAR: Right.
MO`NIQUE: Of course not. Are all white people in that position? Of course not. We as human beings need to see the message of the movie and not get caught up in it. Oh got it depicted these two black women this way.
BEHAR: Right.
MO`NIQUE: It depicted a very true story.
BEHAR: Unfortunately, you`re right; it`s a cross cultural horror.
MO`NIQUE: Yes.
BEHAR: Don`t go away. We`ll be back with more from Mo`Nique.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MO`NIQUE: Now there was a time Precious had everything, and I even told her that. And me and Carl, we love precious. But you need to know that. We love Precious.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I`m back this morning with the woman who just this morning garnered a Golden Globe nomination for her stunning performance in "Precious," Mo`Nique. So you know you alluded to your brother in the last segment. I was wondering if you would elaborate on that. I understand you were sexually molested by your brother when you were 7 years old, is that right?
MO`NIQUE: Uh-huh, yes.
BEHAR: So you used him as the character that you were playing?
MO`NIQUE: Yes. You know, Mary Jones and precious, we know those people. And often times with this film I think that the impact was so hard because when you watch that film, you may have been Mary Jones watching.
BEHAR: Yes.
MO`NIQUE: And I really believe that if you are Mary Jones watching, it changes your life because sometimes you don`t know what you`re doing until you see it.
BEHAR: Yes. And since you experienced something similar to the victim in the film, I guess you used your family background. How old was your brother when he molested you?
MO`NIQUE: If I`m 42, I think Jerald may have been 14, 15.
BEHAR: And you were 7. So he was much older than you?
MO`NIQUE: Uh-huh.
BEHAR: And did you confront him at the time?
MO`NIQUE: Well, when you`re a child, you don`t know how to confront. But when you become an adult, and there were times I did confront it. I`m angry, I`m mad, I`m hurt, I`m crying. But doing this movie, Joy, and I have not spoken to my brother in years, but doing this movie made me say, you know what? I forgive. I forgive. And I wish that he would get some help and help that - that he needs so nobody else will go through it.
So in doing this movie and understanding Mary Jones and in the end, I got a call from Mr. Daniels when we shot that scene. And I never went to see the Daily. So he called me like a week later and he said I can`t believe you made people hate you and love you. Because Mary Jones is a human being who is mentally ill. It`s easy for us to call her a monster and throw her away, because that`s what this society unfortunately does. We don`t address it and deal with it. But understanding Mary Jones in her sickness really made me understand my brother and his sickness.
So when you understand it, you wish no ill, you just wish that they get the help so no one else will suffer at the hands of that illness.
BEHAR: Right. That`s a very good way to do it. She is mentally ill. Unfortunately the child is trapped in a family with a mentally ill mother
MO`NIQUE: Yes.
BEHAR: And a mentally ill father in this movie.
MO`NIQUE: Yes.
BEHAR: And it`s so sad to see that she has nowhere to go. And I would assume you as a child you must have felt that way too with your brother.
MO`NIQUE: Well you know the difference was I had both parents and I had the family. But understand when you go through that as a child, you don`t know which way to turn. You really don`t know what to do.
BEHAR: Did your parents try to protect you from him? Did anybody intercede on your behalf?
MO`NIQUE: I didn`t tell my parents, Joy, until I was 15 years old.
BEHAR: Oh.
MO`NIQUE: I didn`t even tell them.
BEHAR: Did he threaten you if you were to tell? That`s what happens sometimes.
MO`NIQUE: Yes, I think that it goes with it. It goes with it. And let me also say this, because in doing this movie, it`s made me open up to a lot of things. Not all molesters are bad people. We want to make them these monsters.
BEHAR: They`re also sick.
MO`NIQUE: It`s a sickness. It`s a sickness. And if we address it as a sickness and try to get help, we -- so many of us wouldn`t have a story to tell, because so many of us have a story to tell in reference to molestation.
BEHAR: So many. And I was reading that you`re in therapy or you were in psychotherapy. Is that a fact?
MO`NIQUE: Yes.
BEHAR: So you have tried to exorcise the demons from your childhood through psycho therapy. Has it helped you a lot?
MO`NIQUE: You know I won`t call them demons. When I went to therapy, therapy was extremely enlightening for me. Because it allowed me to get some things off of me that I don`t know if I would have ever said that. Because often times when you talk to people you know, they`ll judge it and have their opinions. But when you go to therapy, it`s just wide open. They`re not judging it, they don`t have an opinion, they just want you to get well because they really don`t know you. So I suggest to all of my sisters and brothers watching, if you got something on you and can`t live it off, to live a productive life, and not be the victim but celebrate the victory, go get you some help, baby. It works.
BEHAR: The talking cure. It`s very, very effective. I`ve been through it myself. It`s a very effective form of getting your life together and moving forward and not carrying stuff with you.
MO`NIQUE: It really is. It really is. I know Lynn Whitfield says something that was really incredible. She said often times we as women, we worry about what`s on our head but not what`s inside of our head.
BEHAR: Yes. I also admire the fact that you are very confident about the way that you look and you don`t judge yourself negatively when you put on weight. I`ve notice that you`ve lost some weight. Has that changed your attitude about weight in any way?
MO`NIQUE: Has it changed my attitude about weight?
BEHAR: Yes because I mean, you were the Fat and Fabulous thing that you were doing. And now you are a litter thinner. So now you`re sort of slim and superb.
MO`NIQUE: Oh well thank you so much Joy.
BEHAR: I mean -
MO`NIQUE: But I`m still 220 pounds, so --
BEHAR: You`re a light weight, you`re silk.
MO`NIQUE: So when it says has it changed my mind about weight? Well, the moment you know better, you have to do better.
BEHAR: Yes.
MO`NIQUE: And I was at one time 262 pounds at 38, 39 years old. So when you start doing the math, if I gained ten pounds over ten years, well, now I`m at 270.
BEHAR: Yes, not good.
MO`NIQUE: So if it keeps going up. And because we have these babies, David, and Jonathan and Michael, they`re 6 and 4 years old. We want to be around. I want to be around to Whelan`s children. He`s 19 years old. So you have the make the decision that is best for you.
BEHAR: Uh - huh. I want to talk about, a little bit about your marriage when we come back.
MO`NIQUE: Let`s talk about
BEHAR: Hang in there girl -- we`ll be back with Monique after this short break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with Golden Globe nominee, Monique. I think the Oscar might be on its way next.
MO`NIQUE: You think so, Joy?
BEHAR: Well, yes, you are going to get a nomination, I think. Absolutely.
MO`NIQUE: Ok, from your mouth to god`s ears.
BEHAR: Yes, a lot of people from the film should get nominated. And you definitely should win. The girl who plays Gabon - Sid - gabby.
MO`NIQUE: Her name is Gabby Sidibe.
BEHAR: Yes, she was brilliant also.
MO`NIQUE: Joy when I tell you, she was absolutely amazing.
BEHAR: Yes.
MO`NIQUE: Jaw dropping. What that young lady pulled off has never been done before.
BEHAR: And then Mariah Carey without makeup, I love it.
MO`NIQUE: Oh, Mariah, everybody -- Mariah was brilliant. Paula Patton, Lenny Kravitz, Sherri Shepherd, each one teach one young ladies. Everybody was just amazing.
BEHAR: I`ve got to give a little shout out to my friend Mary Shepherd. She was in the movie too.
MO`NIQUE: Corn row.
BEHAR: Just briefly, I`ve got some Twitters. You know, people tweet questions to me for you.
MO`NIQUE: Uh-huh.
BEHAR: Mo`s been outspoken, they call you mo. Mo`s been outspoken about an open marriage. Can it work for everyone? Tell me about that.
MO`NIQUE: Can it work for everyone, you know, I don`t know. I don`t know - and it depends on the two individuals to what makes it work for them.
BEHAR: What does it mean to have an open marriage to you?
MO`NIQUE: To be extremely, brutally, 100 percent honest. I refuse -- and this is my third marriage, Joy, who happens to be my best friend since we were 14 years old. So there are no secrets. There is nothing that I can say to Sidney that I`m going to be judged or looked at or I can`t believe you said that. There`s nothing he can say to me. There is not one wildest dreams, my wildest fantasies that I cannot share with my very best friend who happens to be my husband.
BEHAR: Well it sounds as though you`ve come to the conclusion - not the conclusion but you`ve come to a place where you know what it`s about. It`s about friendship and communication.
MO`NIQUE: That is it, baby.
BEHAR: That`s it.
MO`NIQUE: That is it. It`s about friendship and communication. And the one thing Sid and I have on our side is over 25 years of friendship. Before we even became husband and wife.
BEHAR: Do you have any advice for Tiger Woods, while I have you here?
MO`NIQUE: Tiger Woods, baby, I wish you and your wife the best. And the advice that I will have for the people, is mind your damn business. And let that man and woman work out their situation.
BEHAR: Uh-huh. All right well we wouldn`t have talked shows if we minded our business.
MO`NIQUE: Joy, mind your business.
BEHAR: If I minded my business, I`d never have a job. Well I have to say again, congratulations to you on a job well done. A beautiful job really. I`m so happy for you. I hope you win the Oscar, too.
MO`NIQUE: Thank you.
BEHAR: I know you`re going to get a Golden Globe. You`ve got to get it.
MO`NIQUE: Thank you baby, I appreciate that.
BEHAR: All right, now you take care of yourself.
MO`NIQUE: Ok momma, god blesses you.
BEHAR: Ok, thank you for joining me tonight. Good night, everybody.
END
