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President Obama to Speak on Terror Attempt; Al Qaeda Claims Responsibility; Crackdown in Iran
Aired December 28, 2009 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: We're pushing forward at the top of the hour with these top stories.
U.S. Marshalls release a mug shot of the man accused of trying to bring down a plane on Christmas. We're expecting a DNA hearing in the case today, but that's been postponed till next month; no explanation why.
Police in Massachusetts looking for an explanation and a possible arsonist. At least nine fires reported in a half mile radius yesterday. One of those blazes killed two people.
And state media is reporting at least eight deaths in the latest wave in anti-government protests in Iran. Activists say that security forces are now raiding opposition offices arresting people. Right now that cannot be independently confirmed.
President Obama on airline security, we are awaiting his first public comments since a man with a U.S. visa and hidden explosives allegedly tried to blow up a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day. Already, as you may know, the government has stepped up precautions on the ground and in the air, and a probe is underway into lapses on three continents.
The young suspect is out of a hospital and in a prison cell, but a court hearing on the Fed's request for DNA samples is on hold till the end of next week.
So did the system work or didn't it? The secretary of homeland security said one thing yesterday, another today. Here's Janet Napolitano with an assertion that was highly criticized, she says it was misunderstood.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JANET NAPOLITANO, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: One thing I would like to point out is that the system worked. Everybody played an important role here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NAPOLITANO: That's a phrase taken out of context. What I said is, moving forward, meaning once the incident happened, we were able to immediately notify the 128 flights in the air, as well as airports on the ground domestically, internationally. Our law enforcement partners, our other allies instituted immediate safety procedures to make sure that this could not happen on other flights and that people were watching for it on other flights, even as we focused on what went wrong prior to this one.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: All right. So here's what we know right now.
The suspect was put on a terror watch list last month, but there are at least four different lists. Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab was on the least restrictive list known as TIDE. It actually stands for Terrorist Identities Datamart Environment and half a million names are on that list.
Now, within that is a somewhat smaller group, about 400,000 people, and that's called the TSDB list, Terrorist Screening Database. Among those are about 14,000 on a selectee list. They undergo secondary screening before boarding flights.
And finally, the well-known no-fly list which you always hear us talking about. That's about 4,000 people forbidden to fly on any commercial aircraft.
OK. It's one thing to know the names of people who may pose a threat to the flying public. It's another to do something about it.
We spoke last night with Larry Johnson. He's the former deputy director of the Office for Counterterrorism at the State Department. This is what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY JOHNSON, FMR. DEPUTY DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF COUNTERTERRORISM: The point of having the list sometimes, it seems, is just to have the list and say, well, see, we had a list. It is frustrating, and Americans should be frustrated, if they could simply pull back the curtain and look at the state of what government really is when you recognize that this information -- this is like that scene from "Raiders of the Lost Ark," where the ark of the covenant is shoved into this government warehouse that has rows and rows of boxes, it disappears.
That's sort of what happens here. The system is not the kind of thing where people are used to in the movies to see someone sit at a computer, type in a name, and it pops up the information and the picture and all the information you need. That unfortunately is not happening here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Well, let's go to Hawaii now, where President Obama will interrupt his holiday to actually tell us what's being done to keep air travel safe.
Our senior White House correspondent, Ed Henry, is traveling with the first family.
So, Ed, when do we actually expect to hear these remarks?
ED HENRY, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, it's still a little bit fluid, but we expect it in the next couple of hours. The president and first lady, in fact, just wrapped up a tennis match on the north side of the island of Oahu here, about 20 or 30 minutes from where we are. They have been trying to have a vacation, but throughout that vacation, the president has been getting frequent briefings, updates from his staff, some of whom are traveling with him here in Hawaii, others back at the White House Situation Room, making sure he's in the loop on this terror investigation.
And what we expect the president to say today, number one, is to just address the terror incident, something he hasn't done yet at all, publicly, at least. And as you know, some Republican critics like Congressman Peter King have said the president should have come out almost immediately to try and reassure the American public that the nation is safe.
The White House initially rejected that and said there was no need for the president to go out right away, that he was still on vacation getting these updates, and his homeland security secretary, Janet Napolitano, and others could go out and carry the ball. But as you saw yesterday on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION," the homeland security secretary at one point said that in this incident, the system worked.
That raised a lot of eyebrows not just among Republicans, but some Democrats on the Hill as well, wondering what exactly she meant. In her full comments, she was talking about how after the incident, once the crew and passengers learned of that, they jumped in and did everything they could to sort of snuff this out.
The secretary, on "AMERICAN MORNING" and other shows today, sort of cleaned that up and said, clearly, before the incident, the system did not work. But obviously, this is now a chance for the president to sort of clarify all that and speak directly to the American people about, you know, sort of reassuring them that the U.S. government will get to the bottom of this investigation, but also make sure that aviation safety in this country is safe -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Well, a lot of critics saying why did it take so long for the president to speak publicly about this. Is it because of the criticism that's been out there?
HENRY: What's interesting, I can tell you from covering President Bush, and now President Obama, there is no doubt that these two leaders have a much different approach. I can guarantee you, having covered President Bush, that he would have been out there on Christmas night, or at least the morning after, commenting on that terror incident.
This president has a different approach. He just doesn't think it's worth his while to go out there immediately, while the story is still developing, number one. And number two, they don't want to sort of -- when you talk to White House aides, they say the president doesn't want to bring more attention to these kinds of terror suspects and sort of give them what they want, which is attention, fame, notoriety around the world, in the initial hours.
So they prefer to kind of let it play out a little bit. But, undoubtedly, we have to acknowledge that there have been Republican critics out there saying that maybe the president was dragging his feet here. So, him coming out now may, in part, be an answer to that.
But I can tell you, in recent days, the White House, in private, has been stressing that it's just about the president having a different approach than President Bush and not feeling the need to get out there in the initial hours. He wants to let it play out. Then when everything calms down, he'll come out and speak his peace -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: And you know, just to kind of expand on this a little bit, Ed, we talk so much about the threat of al Qaeda in Afghanistan and in Iraq, but we really haven't talked much about Yemen. Is it possible, looking at the background of this man that boarded that flight, and looking at the connection to al Qaeda, looking at the connection to Yemen, that we might see some type of renewed effort or focus on that country?
HENRY: I think you put your finger on it. And, in fact, even before this incident, the administration, very privately, has been trying to step up efforts in Yemen. And as our colleague at the Pentagon, ,Barbara Starr, was pointing out on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" yesterday, that it's sort of very covert, in the shadows, behind the scenes. And there are some terror experts who wonder whether maybe this incident was a reaction to that, that there have been these air strikes around Yemen taking out al Qaeda leaders.
It's been unclear whether it was the government in Yemen doing the air strikes or whether the U.S. government was involved gain in a covert way with those air strikes. Obviously, that's not something the Obama administration is going to talk about publicly. But I think you're right. More broadly, this administration is at least making the case -- and we'll see whether it pans out or not -- but they're making the case that this president is trying to wage a smarter war on terror than the previous president, pulling troops now out of Iraq, focusing more attention on Afghanistan, Pakistan and, yes, Yemen, where they think the al Qaeda threat really is -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Ed Henry, live in Honolulu.
Ed, thanks so much.
Fear and loathing in Iran, blood and death in Tehran. Anti- government protests facing a massive crackdown. We're all over that story.
Also, pioneering civil rights attorney Percy Sutton has died. He represented Malcolm X and his wife Betty Shabazz before branching out as a New York politician and radio mogul. He was known as the "Prince of Harlem" for his role in the neighborhood's second renaissance.
Percy Sutton lived a remarkable life, and he died at the age of 89.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Breaking news coming to us out of Cairo right now.
We are hearing that al Qaeda in Arabian Peninsula, that's AQAP, the sect of al Qaeda operating out of Yemen, is claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing of a U.S. airliner. As you know, since Christmas Day, we've been talking about this man, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab.
He was the man with a U.S. visa. He had hidden explosives, allegedly, tied to his legs, hoping to blow up a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day. As you know, it was a passenger that noticed something strange about him as he was sitting in his seat and overcame him, able to keep him from going forward with that explosion that he claims he set out to do, trained, he says, by al Qaeda in Yemen.
So, once again, AQAP, the organization we have been talking about, the sect of al Qaeda, claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing on a U.S. aircraft on Christmas Day.
We are working, obviously, this story, more information. We'll bring it to you as we get it. Our Nic Robertson trying to get us as much information as possible.
Well, a wave of arrests. That's what an opposition Web site says is happening in Iran right now. This actually follows deadly protests yesterday in Tehran.
Let's go over to our Iran desk with international correspondent Reza Sayah. He has been following this for us, actually working overtime in the past couple of days as this continues to develop.
Pretty powerful video once again coming to us since the uprising we saw over the summer.
REZA SAYAH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kyra.
Ever since that disputed election June 12th, Iran's hard-line leaders have done almost everything they can to snuff out and shut down this opposition movement. Based on what we have seen over this extraordinary weekend in Iran, not only is the opposition movement continuing to go, they are actually gaining momentum.
Let's look at dramatic amateur video that's come in to CNN over the past weekend. The video shows protesters attacking a security force van.
There you see protesters surrounding it. In a moment, you will see some of these protesters kicking it. And moments later, they're going to start rocking this van back and forth, and eventually kicking it over.
The protests, the clashes really nasty over the weekend. They started out on Saturday, culminating on Sunday. Based on what witnesses are telling us, the security forces were out en masse to deliver a harsh crackdown, as you watch that van tip over.
Let's go ahead and take a look at another piece of amateur video that we got over the weekend, where you see the aftermath of the security force crackdown. A lot of witnesses telling us security forces were going at protesters, smashing them in the head with batons. And there you one of the victims there with an injury to the forehead.
So, Kyra, over the past couple of days, things really escalating in Iran.
PHILLIPS: Now, it seems in recent days that the regime is actually targeting key opposition figures. What do you have on that?
SAYAH: Yes, no question about it. In the past few months they have certainly warned key opposition figures to back down, but now we're seeing Iran's hard-line regime getting more and more aggressive.
Let's look at remarkable video that came in to us on Saturday night. This is video of former two-term president Mohammed Khatami delivering a speech in Imam Khomeini's -- the late Imam Khomeini's former home in northern Tehran.
And what you're going to see in a few seconds is members -- quite possibly members of the Basij, certainly supporters of the government, start forcing this door open. Moments later, they're going to barge in. There's going to be commotion, mayhem, and they're going to disrupt the speech of this former two-term president who is a key figure in this opposition movement. And this really illustrates, as you see these members of the Basij come in chanting slogans, pro-government slogans, this really illustrates how this conflict is getting nasty.
Also, on Sunday, reports, not just from opposition leader Mir Hossein Mousavi's Web site, but from Iran's state-run news agency, that Mir Hossein Mousavi's nephew was killed during the protests on Sunday. And there you see Mir Hossein Mousavi's nephew pictured on the right. It is not clear if he was targeted in this killing or if this was a random killing, but certainly this shows how these key opposition figures like Mir Hossein Mousavi and Mohammed Khatami, the former president, are in the bull's eye of Iran's hard-line leaders -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Got it. We'll keep tracking it. Thanks, Reza.
New pictures now of a deadly suicide attack in Karachi, Pakistan. Here's what we know at this point.
A bomber blew himself up as people marched on the streets on a key Shiite Muslim holy day. At least 20 people killed, more than 50 wounded. Outraged Shiites then set fire to buildings and cars and threw stones at police. The government blames the attack on extremists trying to trigger a sectarian war.
Bloodshed in Pakistan a fixture in the headlines this past year, unfortunately, one of the many big stories we followed for you in 2009.
Some of CNN's journalists actually reflected on other stories of what they will remember the most.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAN LOTHIAN, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I'm Dan Lothian at the White House, where it's been a busy year, 2009, covering the president not only domestically, but all around the world.
I personally followed him to 12 different countries. But the story that really stands out to me is when the president delivered his speech to the Muslim world in Cairo, Egypt. During the speech, I broke out of the bubble for the first half of the speech, went to a local cafe where there were some English-speaking residents. They gave instant feedback to the president's remarks.
And then I left, went down the street. And with the help of a translator, went to a local grocery store and watched the remainder of the president's speech on an old black and white television set. And there, again got that instant feedback, some of it positive, some of it negative. But it was an interesting trip, something I will never forget.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It has been an unbelievable and emotional year in many ways. The Fort Hood massacre that I covered just a few weeks ago down in Fort Hood, a terrible story. We also covered the story of Jaycee Dugard's discovery up in northern California, and that was amazing in many ways.
There was also the story of the town of Philadelphia, Mississippi, electing its first black mayor. This was the town that was the setting for the movie "Mississippi Burning." I got to spend a day with that new mayor as he drove around town celebrating.
But the one person I'll be thinking a lot about this holiday season is a young Army private by the name of Bowe Bergdahl from Hailey, Idaho. He was captured by the Taliban six months ago during the summer in Afghanistan, and his family has been sitting and waiting and agonizing, waiting for any kind of news from their son who is still in Afghanistan, we presume.
So, I will be spending a lot of time here in the next few weeks, and in the coming year will hope to tell you the story and cover the story of Bowe Bergdahl's triumphant return back to Hailey, Idaho, and be able to maybe see a homecoming parade. So that's what I will be wishing for in this coming year.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) CHRIS WELCH, CNN ALL-PLATFORM JOURNALIST: I'm Chris Welch, along the banks of the Mississippi River here in downtown Minneapolis, where, this year, one of the biggest stories had to be the emergence of an alleged terrorist recruitment effort. Officials say about 20 young men, most of Somali descent, left Minneapolis for Somalia to train with the terrorist group Al-Shabaab. Now, many family members here fear brainwashing tactics were used on their loved ones, some of whom have even been killed at this point.
Now, on the other end of the news spectrum in Minnesota this year, the month of June saw the end of what was one of the longest election contests in U.S. history. You probably know what I'm referring to. Eight months after the election, after recount, then court contest, and another court contest, Democrat Al Franken was finally declared the winner over Republican incumbent senator Norm Coleman. His margin of victory, 300 votes out of three million.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Want to update you once again on the breaking news that we brought you just a few minutes ago. We've got a little bit more information with regard to that attempted bombing on a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day.
According to a radical Islamist Web site, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, otherwise known as AQAP, an offshoot of al Qaeda, is claiming responsibility for that attempted Christmas Day terrorist attack on that inbound international flight that was coming in from Amsterdam. The Web site, the radical Islamist Web site, as you can see here, saying that it was in retaliation for alleged U.S. strikes on Yemeni soil.
We've got our Nic Robertson working this story for us. He's going to join us in just a second.
We're going to take a quick break. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: More now on the alleged attempted bombing of a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day. Reports now coming from a radical Islamist Web site that AQAP, the al Qaeda in Arabian Peninsula, is claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing.
Nic Robertson working the story for us out of London.
Nic, we're now getting more information from this Web site as we're able to get it translated that, apparently, this Christmas Day terrorist attack was in retaliation for alleged U.S. strikes on Yemeni soil.
Are we talking about the U.S. cruise missiles fired at the al Qaeda training bases there in Yemen just a short time ago, just about a week ago, on December 17th?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's what this message is saying, Kyra. And they are also going beyond that.
They're saying that the strike on the aircraft on Christmas Day was direct retaliation for that. They're saying that they have people who've got proven bomb-making skills, that they have tested these bomb-making skills, and they sent Abdulmutallab out onto a aircraft knowing that he could get these explosives on the aircraft as a direct retaliation for that. And they go beyond that and they call for a wider uprising in Saudi Arabia, in Egypt, in Yemen against the governments there for working in collusion with the United States.
This really comes across as sort of al Qaeda trying to do a morale-boosting where it can because of the defeats and attacks it's sustaining in Afghanistan and Pakistan at this time. There is no confirmation here that we can say assuredly that they did send Abdulmutallab out on this particular attack. They are claiming it.
They want to make it look like it's them. They are putting all their grievances out there in this message, but it's no -- there is no surety that they were actually behind that particular attack. But they are managing to turn this message around in three days. That's pretty quick. They're wanting to capitalize on it as much as they can -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: You bring up an interesting point from what I'm hearing from you. You know, we've got all these efforts coming out of the U.S. that are going into Iraq and Afghanistan, two places that have nurtured terrorists that have been trained in Yemen and terrorists that have come out of Yemen.
So, I guess if we were to push forward and talk about, OK, what could be next for the president, what could be next for our military, how do we attack this problem, is Yemen a place of terrorist activity that we have sort of pushed aside, not paid a lot of attention to, so now we're seeing, I guess, these terrorists go back to their roots and start up yet a whole other problem for the Middle East, for us, for our fear when it comes to terrorist activity?
ROBERTSON: You know, Kyra, you certainly could look at it that way, that Yemen has sort of been the poorer cousin, if you will, for al Qaeda in many ways. I mean, look, they have ignored Yemen for many, many years, but it's become a place where they feel that they can perhaps be safer that they can be in Afghanistan and Pakistan and Iraq. And it's become a place of operation for them.
I think what you can say when you look at this message that's come out, it is classic al Qaeda. And they're trying to do exactly what they did in Iraq and they've tried to do in Afghanistan and Pakistan and say, look, these missiles are killing Muslim women and children, they're not killing and targeting al Qaeda camps. They are killing Muslim women and children.
And they're trying to do this -- they're saying this -- to try and stir up passions among young Muslim men that they would like to come and join the fight. So, if you take a look at it from the way al Qaeda is handling this, it has all the sort of hallmarks of what they have done in other places. So they, themselves, are trying to make Yemen into another, if you will, Afghanistan, into another Iraq, another rallying battleground, if you will, to mount as a base, potentially, to mount other attacks from. And if they are correct in what they are saying, and if what we have heard about Abdulmutallab from his family and from his own accounts, apparently, that he did go to Yemen to get training and then come and attack the United States, in the United States directly, then this is a new step for al Qaeda being able to project force outside of the region coming from Yemen, as they have done from Pakistan, as they have done from Iraq as well.
PHILLIPS: And Nic, maybe we can talk about some of the dots that have been connected here, because this is where it gets a little bit more frightening. Not only this attempted bombing, but how far this man got, how he got into the United States, how he was able to bring these supplies on him through Amsterdam.
But also, now, as more information is coming through, and we're finding out about AQAP, this offshoot of al Qaeda that he was allegedly tied to, and various leaders within this organization, they are even tied to the radical Yemeni American cleric that was linked to the gunman charged with the killing of 13 people at Fort Hood, Texas. So, that leaves a lot of people to wonder, OK, where else is there a connection here and, you know, should we be concerned about some other type of attack here on U.S. soil?
ROBERTSON: Well, the cleric you're talking about is al-Awlaki, and he is believed to be living in Yemen right now. He is believed to have inspired a large following around the world. And not just the sort of, if you will, among what one might class as radical jihadists, but in a much broader spectrum of the Muslim population.
That's a cause for concern for some people, that his teachings and that he should be such an inspirational figure. But what's interesting about this latest statement is -- at least on the first analysis here -- it doesn't seem to mention al-Awlaki, although he was, from what we were told last week by security officials, he was one of the intended targets of that missile strike that was targeting an al Qaeda camp.
So, in some ways, interesting that his name isn't mentioned here, isn't sort of tied into all of this by al Qaeda. But his message resonates with a lot of Muslims around the world.
It's a message that he's come out now openly and praised the Fort Hood shooter. He's come out and openly praised attacks against the United States. So, this is a man whose message is being listened to very, very broadly, and is based and able to do that in Yemen.
And this is something that for al Qaeda, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, or wherever, is a benefit. But is he directly tied with them? I think if we had seen his name tied into this message, one might have been able to say that. But perhaps here it's an indication that he operates in his own sphere and not, perhaps, under the umbrella of the al Qaeda at the moment -- Kyra. PHILLIPS: Let me ask you, too, while I have you, Nic, if you don't mind -- we're just getting more information coming out of the White House. And the deputy press secretary, Bill Burton, has released a statement saying that, "The president will address the public on the attempted terrorist attack on Christmas Day. He'll describe the immediate steps the government is taking to ensure the safety of the traveling public."
It goes on to say, "He will detail the two reviews that he has ordered on the watch list and our detection capabilities because he believes it is critical that we learn from this incident and take the necessary measures to protect future acts of terrorism." He will also reference the fact that we need to keep up the pressure on those who would attack our country.
You know, Nic, talking about these various watch lists, I think a lot of people don't even realize there is more than just one watch list, and that this attempted bomber was actually on one of these lists. And now, critics are coming forward saying, look, you know, these lists really don't mean much right now. They're lacking credibility. And a lot of people are wondering, is it worth all the effort?
ROBERTSON: Well, when the lists become so large that it means that it's very hard to sort of stop the movements of every person on that list, then perhaps to a degree, it becomes unwieldy. When lists become so large that the details get lost inside there -- we learned today from the British Home Office minister that Abdulmutallab was on a watch -- was on essentially a watch list in Britain. He had applied for a visa in May and had been turned down.
And the United States and Britain work closely together on counterterrorism issues and the British are saying that they would have passed back in May earlier this year, they would have passed that information -- that they weren't going to let him into Britain, that he was on a watch list for Britain, passed that information to the United States. So, you have to wonder why that didn't flag something up in May. So, perhaps we get the idea that when the lists become so big, they become unwieldy.
But you also mention another interesting point there that the president will address and that is sort of detection techniques and stopping these explosives getting on aircraft. I was with an explosives expert a few hours ago and he showed us, using a tiny, tiny fraction of the amount of explosives that we understand the accused bomber took on the aircraft -- I mean, something that would literally fit in the top of my pen here, that small amount of explosives, and he demonstrated that for us to show how it could puncture a hole in the fuselage or the skin of an aircraft.
So, when we're talking about detection systems here, we're talking about the need for them to be very, very sophisticated to catch what can potentially be very, very small amounts of these very dangerous explosives, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Nic, we'll continue to keep following this breaking news. Stay with us. Appreciate it so much.
Really, quickly, I want to tell you about other -- OK, actually, Nic, stay with me. We're going to get to other top stories in just a second.
But Larry Johnson, who is the former national security counterterrorism expert, we actually had a chance to hear from him last night. Actually, I was quoting what he had to say to Nic there.
Larry, I was remembering your interview last night talking about these various lists that exist. Now, you've seen what has happened here with this attempted bomber getting onto a U.S. airliner with the potential of blowing that aircraft up. And it brought to light the fact that he was on a list and there's not only one list but there's four various lists.
So, you know, bottom line, is this list stuff working for us? Larry, are you with us?
All right. We'll try to reconnect with Larry in just a second.
LARRY JOHNSON, FMR. DEP. DIR., STATE DEPT. COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICE (via telephone): I'm right here.
PHILLIPS: We'll go ahead and move onto our top stories. We'll try to get that interview connected for you and we'll continue with that conversation.
All right. Let's go and talk about top stories right now.
Tragedy strikes Starkville, Mississippi. Nine people died this morning in a predawn apartment fire. Six of the victims said to be children. No word on how this fire might have started.
And the Big Apple now a safer apple? Well, crime stats suggest that violent crime is way down in New York City. Today, Police Commissioner Ray Kelly is expected to announce the fewest number of homicides since 1962.
Also down in New York City, iPhone sales on the Web. AT&T suspended online iPhone sales just a few days ago. The exact reason isn't clear, but bloggers have their ideas. Some think there's just too much data congestion in the city. Others suggest there is a problem with mobile phone fraud.
We'll have more on that in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: We're going to stay on this breaking news that's developing right now. At about 2:40 Eastern Time, if you're just tuning in, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, an offshoot of al Qaeda, claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing on a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day. This is the radical Islamist Web site that we have been able to get translated over there at our international desk. And what it says is that the AQAP is claiming responsibility for the attempted Christmas Day terrorist attack on the inbound international flight, saying it was in retaliation for alleged U.S. strikes on Yemeni soil. The attacks we're talking about are the U.S. cruise missiles fired at al Qaeda training bases in Yemen just about a week ago or so, December 17th, actually. Not that long ago, a week before Christmas Day.
So, if, indeed, this was in retaliation for the U.S. strikes, in just about a week, this organization got it together for an attempted bombing on a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day here in the United States.
Larry Johnson, former deputy director for the Office of Counterterrorism, now a counterterrorism expert, was talking to us last night. He joins us back on the phone today.
Larry, one thing that caught my attention last night was how you were definitely critical about these watch lists. Apparently, this alleged bomber, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, was on a watch list and that led us to finding out even more about these lists, that there's more than one. There's actually four that exist.
JOHNSON (via telephone): Right.
PHILLIPS: And they're quite complicated. So, I guess, bottom line, are these lists worth anything to us in our security?
JOHNSON: They're worth something if they are used appropriately. You know, if you go into the government, they created in the aftermath of 9/11 what was supposed to be a fusion center, the National Counterterrorism Center was to be the place where we bring all intel together. So, what you find out if you go in and start probing, you find that there are multiple fusion centers around the country.
In my book, anytime you get more than two fusion centers, you wind up with confusion. And that's part of what's going on here. The fact of the matter is, that there is not a centralized depository. That we're pretty good at getting the information in, but getting the information out and being able to search it and access in a timely manner, that's still a big problem.
PHILLIPS: But, Larry, if we go back to 9/11, I mean, that was the problem with 9/11...
JOHNSON: Yes.
PHILLIPS: ... is there was -- there was not a fusion center that was working. That no one was talking to each other. Intelligence was going from one organization to another. And we saw what happened and how devastating that was.
JOHNSON: Right.
PHILLIPS: Then we had all these commissions, all these investigations, all these politicians up on the Hill saying, "OK, we're going to look into this, we're going to fix this, we're going to get this right." And what it sounds like to me is that we are in the same position that we were on 9/11.
JOHNSON: We're a little bit better than we were on 9/11. But let me just give you a real quick illustration. I was -- about a year ago I was working on a terrorism exercise for the U.S. military. And it involved a scenario in the United States. And so, we wanted to look up and see who the current contact was at FEMA, the Federal Emergency Management Agency, to -- that would be the point of contact. And I swear to God, when we got to their classified page and there was still Mike "heck of a job" Brown. He was on there and he hadn't been in the job for three years.
Now, that was on the government computer. They don't even update their own computers with guys like Mike Brown. They still showed him on the list.
So, you know, this image we sometimes get of government, that they are really on top of things and that they are, you know, moving the information back and forth -- the sad reality is, you get enormous volumes of information in. They don't have a real effective system for then taking it, processing it, and making sure that it's consolidated so that the point -- folks out there on the pointy end of the spear know who to go after, when and where.
PHILLIPS: All right. And the first thing that, of course, we're hearing now since this has happened is that the president, along with many others, asking for more reviews, more investigations, into why this happened and how do we fix the problem. And, you know, you laugh, but, you know, I think a lot of people are laughing right now. I mean, how many times are we going to see something like this happen? I mean, thank God he didn't blow up this aircraft. But how many times are we going to be having this conversation and laughing because we can't get our intelligence- gathering connected into one, as you say, fusion center?
JOHNSON: well, it's not so much even getting the intelligence- gathering connect into a fusion center. But we've known since December of '94 when Ramzi Yousef put a bomb onboard a Philippine Airlines flight that it detonated and killed a Japanese man that the al Qaeda was trying to bomb planes. And months later, they try to do the Bojinka plot to blow up 12 U.S. jumbo jets. Fortunately, they've been only able to operate sporadically -- Richard Reid in 2001, and now, this guy.
So, the good news is, they've been fairly inept. Let's hope that that continues. But we can't base our security on the hope that somehow al Qaeda is going to remain incompetent.
And that gets back to the point that we've known for at least 15 years that we need to have systems in place to detect passengers and carry-on baggage containing -- the possibility of containing explosives. We have not done that. And that has not been done as a concerted effort. It is being done for checked baggage, but it's not being done for carry-on and not for passengers.
PHILLIPS: Why? Why is it not being done? We put all the money, all the time, all the investigation, all reviews for years now. Why is this still not happening?
JOHNSON: It has not been made a priority. It is fairly expensive.
The problem is, there is no one magic technology out there. There are two major types of explosive detection systems. There are trace detectors, let's call it the dog's nose and sniffs, and there are the bulk detection system, like the CT technology, the CAT scan technology, that actually sees through layers.
The reality is, the bulk detection system is probably better than the trace detector because trace detectors can be defeated, but the bulk technology systems themselves are not complete. It's been a lack of dedicated funds on the part of the U.S. government to really put together, if you will, a Manhattan-style project to produce effective explosive detection systems. And the argument as well, because it is so rare.
And the reality is, you'd only -- even from al Qaeda, you've had a total of three attempts in 15 years. I'm not saying we should take comfort in that, but, you know, that's just the reality.
PHILLIPS: So, deputy press secretary to the White House, Bill Burton, has come forward, saying that the president is going to come out today and detail two reviews that he's ordered on the watch list and on our detection capabilities because he believes it's critical we learn from this incident and take the necessary measures to prevent future acts of terrorism.
Larry, if you could just sit down with the president, you obviously have so much insight. And you're critical of the systems here. What would you tell him his first step needs to be?
JOHNSON: First step needs to be: let's set up a specific budget item, dedicate the national laboratories. We've got all these national Department of Energy national laboratories. And make it the number one priority to develop effective explosive detection systems.
But, you know, you're looking at a project that's going to take two, maybe three years before you can get something developed. There are other technologies that need to be put in place immediately. And this is going to lead to a big scramble amongst a bunch of government contractors as they go out and try to be the ones who are brought to the fore.
But there at least needs to be a concerted effort on it because up to this point, while we didn't make a good effort with TSA, trying to put professional screeners at the checkpoints, requiring checked baggage to go through an explosive detection system, we still treated it in a piecemeal fashion. Make it a priority and let's focus on it and come up with a periodic review.
I mean, Congress itself has failed enforcing a periodic review of this. We've just -- we go through these phases. In August of 2003, there was a surface-to-air missile attack on a commercial airliner. For a month and a half, all we heard about was we need to have these systems. That disappears.
So, we just go through these cycles. It's like if it's a slow news day, we're going to talk about terrorism, and then it goes away, we get onto something else.
PHILLIPS: Yes, I can't disagree with you on that. I mean, here, we observe that news cycle. And you're right. I mean, it's happened Christmas Day and it's all that we've been talking about.
And you talk about time being so crucial. And I'm looking -- if indeed this radical Islamic Web site is coming forward, saying that this attempted bombing was in retaliation for alleged U.S. strikes on Yemeni soil, we're talking about attacks on behalf of U.S. cruise missiles fired at al Qaeda training bases in Yemen back on December 17th.
JOHNSON: Right.
PHILLIPS: That means -- if that's true, if that all pieces together, Larry, that means in eight days, this offshoot of al Qaeda -- this al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula -- was able to get this guy through the system and on an airplane with explosives.
JOHNSON: Right. But let's remember, they got a guy onboard a plane who was only good at setting his pants on fire, thank God.
PHILLIPS: Yes, he wasn't that bright. Yes.
JOHNSON: You know, not that bright. And the other thing is, this is going to give the United States now a better reason to go back to the government of Yemen and go in there and kill these people. I mean, the fact of the matter is, I hope they keep raising their head like this because when they raised their head, then we can go on and kill 'em.
And the fact of the matter is, you know, it is a bit of a war as far as with these particular people, and the government of Yemen, up to this point, has been cooperating with the United States to an extent. Those strikes over the last three weeks, there were two of them actually, they've had some effect. And every time they raise their head up, you kill them. And when you kill them, you kill the people that have the most expertise and training.
And what we can draw from this lesson, this guy may have been through a training course, but the trainers, I wouldn't be too proud of what they did.
PHILLIPS: Well, and you know, they don't have to be rocket scientists. They don't have to be bright, as we can see, Larry. They just have to be lucky.
JOHNSON: Yes. And we should not have a security system based upon luck.
PHILLIPS: Larry Johnson, former deputy director for the Office of Counterterrorism -- incredible insight that you've given us in the past 24 hours. I really appreciate it. We'll keep talking.
JOHNSON: Thanks, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Appreciate it so much.
Mohammed Jamjoom actually is going to join us after the break. He's going to join us live out of Dubai.
We're actually hearing from Yemeni officials for the first time since this news broke within the past hour.
We'll take a quick break. We'll talk to Mohammed in just a sec.
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PHILLIPS: All right. As you know, we're getting more information and developing news with regard to what we've been reporting in the past hour. And that is, we are getting word for the first time from a radical Islamist Web site, the one you're seeing here, that al Qaeda in the Arabian Gulf, also known as AQAP, an offshoot of al Qaeda, is claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing of a U.S. airliner.
We are digging deeper into the story, as we have since Christmas Day when it first happened.
I want to go live to Dubai now. Mohammed Jamjoom is standing by.
Mohammed, we've been talking a lot about the connection to Yemen all morning and all this afternoon as we're learning more about this alleged bomber, where he got his training, who he is -- with whom he's tied, and as you probably heard there from Larry Johnson, former deputy director for the Office of Counterterrorism, he said -- bottom line, these lists that we have continue to fail us, that our priorities have just not been put into the right place.
Can you give us the perspective now from Yemen as this news is starting to break and the - it's been targeted -- a lot of information targeted toward Yemen?
MOHAMMED JAMJOOM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, you know, Yemen's government hasn't officially responded to this latest claim, but everybody that I've been speaking with -- analysts, experts -- they're not surprised by this. I mean, people have thought since the near attack happened that it was going to be out of Yemen.
Yemen is a very dangerous country. Yemen is beset by a lot of different problems. And the reason it's become so problematic for the U.S., the Yemen government right now is battling three different battles.
They're battling a separatist movement in the south of the country. They're battling a rebellion by Shiite rebels in the north of the country. That violence is spilling over into Saudi Arabia, which is making everybody very nervous because that's America's key ally in the region and the biggest oil exporter in the world. And then you've got this battle against the very resurgent al Qaeda.
Al Qaeda from Saudi Arabia and al Qaeda from Yemen merged in the past year. They're now al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. They are stronger. They're resilient.
They have vowed to carry out attacks and they have done so. In last August, they almost assassinated Saudi Arabia's anti-terror chief.
When that happened, that sent shockwaves through D.C., through Saudi Arabia. People realized there's a lot more going on with al Qaeda in Yemen than even we had realized. We really got to get this under control.
Since then, we've seen high-level U.S. delegations go to Yemen to try to see what they could do. You've seen the U.S. saying that they're providing the Yemenis with intel, with money.
The U.S. has not yet declared that they've actually been out front with these attacks against al Qaeda, but a lot of people think they are.
And so, now, basically, the question is: what more can the U.S. do in order to help Yemen combat al Qaeda? Because the analysts that I speak with say, in Yemen right now, it's not just that it's failing state, it's a failed state. And that's causing a lot of concern -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: And we're learning more about AQAP and its leader, Mohammed, Nasir al-Wuhayshi, who apparently comes from a wealthy family, once served as bin Laden's personal secretary, we're told, and is believed to have very strong contacts with the head of al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden.
Also, as you mentioned, his deputy Saeed al-Shehri, a Saudi national and former detainee at Guantanamo Bay, apparently all working together within this organization, possibly tied to this attempted bomber with whom we've been talking about Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab.
Also something else, Mohammed, another tie that we've seen to this is with the radical Yemeni American cleric that was linked to the gunman that was charged with killing 13 people at Fort Hood.
So, you know, at what point do you think we will hear from Yemeni officials because so many links are being tied to Yemen? And this is going to be on the forefront of the president's speech when he makes comments out of Hawaii this afternoon.
JAMJOOM: Yes, absolutely, Kyra. I mean, people are wondering just that.
As you mentioned, the radical cleric, Anwar Awlaki -- I mean, people thought last week that he might have been killed in one of those air strikes. The Yemeni government came out and said that in one of those air strikes against militants, against al Qaeda in Yemen, that he had been at one of the sites that had been bombed and, possibly, he had been killed. Then just a couple of days after that, other sources were saying, no, he was alive and well. And just a day before those attacks, he was being interviewed by certain media outlets.
A lot of questions about this. How can these people get away with this? What more can the U.S. do in order to help the Yemeni government?
And when I speak to Yemeni analysts, when I speak to Yemeni experts, they say, you know, the situation just couldn't be more dire -- because even though there is this increased scrutiny on Yemen and this increased international and regional pressure, look, it's still a very, very poor country, still a very dangerous country. It's a hub for militants from -- not just the region, from Afghanistan, from Pakistan.
They get training there. They're supplied with the weapons. And the borders are very porous. It's very easy to get in and out of Yemen.
And so, it seems to be like this perfect storm of militancy where they can really export that and they can really launch these kind of terror attacks. And everybody I'm speaking with is saying, they just don't know what the U.S. is going to be able to do with the Yemeni government to combat this effectively at this point -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Mohammed Jamjoom out of Dubai -- Mohammed, thanks so much.
And, you know, Mohammed mentioned these U.S. strikes. Let's bring in Barbara Starr from the Pentagon.
Barbara, as we're learning more from this radical Islamic Web site, it's saying that this attempted bombing on this U.S. airliner was in retaliation for a U.S. strike on Yemeni soil. And that's being tied to those U.S. cruise missiles fired at al Qaeda training bases in Yemen just eight days before Christmas, on December 17th.
What are those within the Pentagon telling you with regard to action on behalf of the U.S. trying to take out these al Qaeda operatives and al Qaeda and offshoots of al Qaeda attempting to fire back?
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, I was just looking at this statement as we're talking and the al Qaeda statement talks about bombardment with the use of bombs and cruise missiles that were launched from American ships in the Gulf of Aden.
Now, the U.S. government -- let's be very clear -- has never acknowledged that it was involved in any of these air strikes, that any U.S. war planes, bombs or cruise missiles were used. There has been a very quiet acknowledgment that the U.S. provided intelligence, but not that U.S. armaments were used.
The claim of cruise missiles is very interesting. The U.S. is not saying that. And could it have really been cruise missiles off U.S. Navy warships? It's worth remembering that cruise missiles have a very long flight time. They fly perhaps for hours before they get to their target which is located by GPS, those satellite coordinates. They go against very specific fixed targets.
But what are the al Qaeda targets in Yemen? These are people, fighters, commanders, training camps, people that move and come and go very quickly. A missile in the air for several hours would be a very unusual choice to go against an al Qaeda target in Yemen because those fighters, those people can very quickly move down the road, leave a site, and you could accidentally really hit a large number of civilians.
So, this claim of cruise missiles is perhaps very interesting. We don't know the answer, but many of the sources we have talked to have raised some speculation about exactly what kind of weapons were used, where the U.S. participated, and where Yemeni military forces might have participated. They themselves have a very limited capability by all accounts. What is underpinning all of this right now is a very substantial, very stepped-up U.S. intelligence, U.S. military intelligence effort to help the Yemenis target and go after al Qaeda in their country -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon -- Barbara, thanks so much.
And if you're just tuning in, you're watching breaking news here on CNN. Al Qaeda is claiming responsibility for that attempted bombing of a U.S. airliner on Christmas Day.
Our breaking news coverage continues after a quick break.
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