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Nancy Grace

Cindy Anthony`s Deposition in Zenaida Gonzalez Civil Suit

Aired December 30, 2009 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Tonight, the desperate search for a 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee. Six months of searching culminates when skeletal remains found in a heavily wooded area just 15 houses from the Anthony home confirmed to be Caylee. Manner of death, homicide. A utility meter reader stumbles on a tiny human skeleton, including a skull covered in light- colored hair, the killer duct taping and placing a heart-shaped sticker directly over the mouth, then triple bagging little Caylee like she`s trash.

Tonight, grandmother Cindy on the hotseat, under oath. After telling a judge for weeks she`s too emotionally fragile to testify, she gives a sworn statement, testimony showing she`s anything but fragile. It`s all on video. Tonight, we have that videotape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please raise your right hand. Do you swear the testimony you`re about to give is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY`S MOTHER: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good afternoon. Please state your name.

CINDY ANTHONY: Cynthia Maria Anthony.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you have a daughter named Casey Marie Anthony, is that correct?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then had a granddaughter Caylee, as well, correct?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. I`m going to ask you some questions about the time period before and leading up to your granddaughter`s disappearance. And then we`re going to go through some other questions, OK? So right now, I`m going to ask some questions particularly about the household and the setup of the household, who lived there during the time period, let`s say about March or April of last year, OK?

CINDY ANTHONY: Explain to me the relevance of the question regarding the civil lawsuit with Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez, please.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ma`am, the attorney may have told you we`re going to ask questions in this case. He`s the one who objects. I need you to answer the questions because we`ve noticed (ph) this case. We`ve subpoenaed it. So if you can do your best to answer me. But I will say this. If you don`t understand what I`ve asked you...

CINDY ANTHONY: I`m not understanding what you`re asking for the relevance.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, ma`am...

CINDY ANTHONY: OK, I`m just asking the question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I appreciate that, ma`am.

CINDY ANTHONY: OK. OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ll try to make this quick if you can just answer what I do ask you. If you don`t understand what I asked you, not why I ask you something, but if you don`t understand what I`ve asked you, to let me know and I`ll be sure to repeat it.

CINDY ANTHONY: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In other words...

CINDY ANTHONY: Please repeat the question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, I`ll get to that in just a second. Let me tell you a couple other things first. I might talk confusingly a little bit, maybe too fast. If you don`t understand me, let me know and I`ll re- ask you. But if you do answer one of my questions, I`m going to assume that you did understand it. Is that fair?

CINDY ANTHONY: That`s fair.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Let`s go on back to about March of last year. What house did you live at?

CINDY ANTHONY: At 4937 Hope Spring Drive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And who lived there with you?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey, George and myself, and Caylee Marie.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Tell me a little bit -- how many -- how many bedrooms was the house?

CINDY ANTHONY: We have four bedrooms.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And did Caylee Marie have her own bedroom?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, she did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: During that time period, was it your understanding -- and this is in the beginning of last year. Was it your understanding that your daughter, Casey, had a job?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, it was.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Where was she working, to your knowledge, at that point in time?

CINDY ANTHONY: To my knowledge, Universal Studios and Hard Rock Cafe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that was something that she told you during that time period?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you ever learn from any other source during that time period that she was working there? In other words, did somebody from the Hard Rock Cafe ever call her for work? Did somebody from Universal ever contact the house?

CINDY ANTHONY: Not that I`m aware of.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So the only source of information would have been from your daughter, is that fair to say, from Casey?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And you also knew some of your daughter`s friends, is my understanding?

CINDY ANTHONY: Some of them, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Amy -- Amy Huizinga (INAUDIBLE)

CINDY ANTHONY: I had never met Amy Huizinga in March. I didn`t know Amy Huizinga...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... until July the 15th of 2008.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Thanks for clarifying that. So of Casey`s friends during, let`s say, the early time period of last year -- of Casey`s friends, did you ever hear from them anybody mention where, in fact, she worked?

CINDY ANTHONY: I didn`t talk to Casey`s friends.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, so...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I apologize. Do you want to go off the record (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. (INAUDIBLE) let`s just keep going.

CINDY ANTHONY: This is still not relevant.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

CINDY ANTHONY: It`s not relevant.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So my understanding, is what you`re telling me is that Casey`s the one who told you that she had a job back during that time period, is that correct?

CINDY ANTHONY: That`s correct. I actually was with her when she met her first boss...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... back in June of 2004.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Now -- but I`m talking about in 2005.

CINDY ANTHONY: I have never -- I never had a reason to believe she did not still have her job...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... which I did have knowledge of that she did have a job.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that first boss was who?

CINDY ANTHONY: You know, I can`t remember his name right now. It`s not on the tip of my tongue. I`ll probably remember it before this is over, though.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. What -- I`m sorry, what year was that?

CINDY ANTHONY: In 2004, I believe is when she started...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... the year before Caylee was born.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, did you or your husband claim Casey, your daughter, as a dependent on your taxes?

CINDY ANTHONY: No. I haven`t claimed Casey since she was 18 years old.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So it`s fair to say that she paid her own taxes or should have paid her own taxes?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Did you ever see any documents coming in, like a W-2, to the house?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, I have seen a W-2 form.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Another thing I should have told you earlier, and I apologize. I`m going to ask a question. You probably know what I`m asking you, but because we want to make this clear -- let me finish the -- I appreciate what you`re doing, but let me finish my question and then we`ll go from there, OK? So back during the 2004 time period, are you saying you saw a W-2 come in?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, I did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. How about in 2005?

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t recall.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, don`t recall seeing it. And how about going forward from there, 2006, 2007...

CINDY ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... and then 2008?

CINDY ANTHONY: No. The only reason is because that was her first W-2 and I actually helped her with her taxes. I did not need to help her do that after that year. So that`s why I would not have had a reason to look at her...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But on that point, after 2005, did you ever see her doing her taxes?

CINDY ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know if she ever received a tax refund?

CINDY ANTHONY: All I`ve seen was an H&R Block card from her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So as far as -- let`s go back now to the period when she was taking care of Caylee, and there were issues about baby-sitters I just want to focus in on. Your understanding was that she had a job that was the same job of the boss that you had met back in 2004?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, similar.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Similar. OK, was it at the same company?

CINDY ANTHONY: Not really because she never worked for Universal Studios. She worked at Universal Studios. These were companies that were contracted by Universal Studios.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Have you subsequently come to learn about when the last time was she actually did, in fact, have a job?

CINDY ANTHONY: I can`t remember the exact date.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it fair to say, though, that you`ve come now, at this point in time, to find out that she did not actually hold a job at Universal Studios back in -- about a year ago or so, back in March or April of last year?

CINDY ANTHONY: She never worked for Universal Studios.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Did she have any job that you`re aware of now in March or April of last year where she received a paycheck?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where was that?

CINDY ANTHONY: Through where my son works.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what`s that?

CINDY ANTHONY: Click and Park (ph).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sorry?

CINDY ANTHONY: Game Day, Click and Park. I`m not sure of the exact name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right...

CINDY ANTHONY: But I know she did receive a paycheck because she did help him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. How much did she receive, do you know?

CINDY ANTHONY: I have no idea.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what was her position?

CINDY ANTHONY: She just helped him with some of his work on the Super Bowl last year, a year ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, so that -- Super Bowl a year ago would have been in, obviously, the end of January, early February. Other than helping your son, Lee Anthony, are you aware of any other payments or source of income that she would have been receiving last year?

CINDY ANTHONY: Not -- no, not to my knowledge.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So is it fair to say your understanding is that she did not have a source of income, certainly from Universal or any of those other entities associated with Universal back in 2008?

CINDY ANTHONY: That`s correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, your husband has testified and we`ve heard from him about who watched your granddaughter. And it`s my understanding that she lived in your house, of course. Did you help contribute for feeding her and clothing her, all that type of stuff?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, I did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Paid medical bills, I assume?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I think I only paid one medical bill for Caylee, and that was right after Caylee was born.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Is it fair to say that you were involved actively in raising her?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And of -- my understanding is you work full-time.

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And where was it you were working back in 2008?

CINDY ANTHONY: Genteva (ph) Home Care.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what was your position?

CINDY ANTHONY: I`m a nurse manager.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And do you have a certain shift that you work?

CINDY ANTHONY: I work daytime.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is that 7:00 to 7:00 or...

CINDY ANTHONY: My day -- you know, I could go in at 7:30. I could go in at 8:00 o`clock. I could be there at 7:00 o`clock, just depending on what time I wanted to be there. But usually there at least by 8:30, and then until 5:00, 5:30, 6:00 o`clock or whatever.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is that a Monday through Friday?

CINDY ANTHONY: Monday through Friday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And home health nurse is what you are?

CINDY ANTHONY: I`m a nurse manager in a home health...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nurse manager. OK, I understand.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... company.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And so there`s different -- there`s night shifts and then there`s day, and that`s...

CINDY ANTHONY: Not in my company.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So just day shifts.

CINDY ANTHONY: Not for what I do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And your husband was also working back in 2008, is that correct?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what was his job, let`s say starting from January through December of 2008?

CINDY ANTHONY: You know, I can`t remember. George has had a couple jobs in 2008. I can`t remember what he had.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There were periods of time, though, that both of you were working, is that correct?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, at the times that George wasn`t working, would George be actively involved in the watching of your granddaughter?

CINDY ANTHONY: George was actively involved with Caylee when he was working and when he wasn`t working. We both were.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wasn`t clear in my question, so let me -- let me clarify it. And I apologize.

CINDY ANTHONY: OK. I thought you were finished. I apologize.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s OK. The -- what I`m saying, when he wasn`t at the office or wherever he was working, and he was at home, would he be the one that was in charge of watching her and baby-sitting for her, taking care of her?

CINDY ANTHONY: If Casey wasn`t there, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, if Casey wasn`t working during this time period and your husband was taking care of your granddaughter, do you know where Casey would have been going if she wasn`t working, or do you have any information on that?

CINDY ANTHONY: I have no idea.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Aside from you watching your granddaughter and George watching your granddaughter, and of course, Casey, of the three of you watching her, what would you say the percentage was you think that you and your husband watched her more than Casey back in the -- let`s say before 2008 and 2007 time period?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I think Casey watched Caylee more than any of us did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So say of 99 percent of the time, it was you or your husband, you`re saying that Casey watched her more often?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey watched her more often. I was -- Casey -- when I would come home from work, I would be there...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... and I would not necessarily watch Casey -- or I mean Caylee, but Caylee was in the same house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand.

CINDY ANTHONY: So unless Caylee -- you know, unless Casey was gone from the house, then I didn`t have to, quote, unquote, baby-sit her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand that.

CINDY ANTHONY: And on the weekends. So if I`m, you know, working Monday through Friday, 40 to 50 hours a week...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, out -- and if your understanding is that Casey doesn`t have a full-time job during this time period, if she wasn`t watching her and your husband wasn`t watching her and you weren`t watching her, did you all have any other baby-sitter during this time period?

CINDY ANTHONY: There was different people that baby-sat Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Well, let`s go ahead and kind of go on back on that. Would one of those people be Lauren Gibb (ph)?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what...

CINDY ANTHONY: But not in 2008.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Well, I appreciate you clarifying. Let`s go on back. Lauren Gibb would...

CINDY ANTHONY: Lauren Gibbs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gibbs. I`m sorry. Lauren Gibbs would have baby- sat her when?

CINDY ANTHONY: Right after Casey went back to work, which was three months after Caylee was born.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So do you know how long the time period was that Lauren Gibbs watched her?

CINDY ANTHONY: Lauren Gibbs watched her probably until about January, roughly. I can`t say for sure on the dates.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: January. And what year would that be?

CINDY ANTHONY: In 2006.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. And do you know if she was ever compensated or paid for watching her?

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t believe so. Lauren did that as a favor because she was Casey`s best friend.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Next, more of grandmother Cindy Anthony on the hotseat, under oath and on video.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: As lawyers try to identify Caylee`s baby-sitters, grandmother Cindy becomes combative, even laying the groundwork to later point the finger at tot mom`s ex-fiance, Jessie Grund, for Caylee`s murder.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And as far as other people in that same category, people who did it because they were friends with either you or your husband or the family, who else would be in the category of -- let`s call them baby-sitters? Who else would there be?

CINDY ANTHONY: I know her fiance at that time, Jesse Grund, watched Caylee. He watched her either at his parents` home or at my home. I know his father, Richard Grund, and his father -- or his mother, Deborah (ph) Grund, watched Caylee for Casey. while Casey would work. I know that Christina Chester (ph) watched Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: Holly Gagne (ph) watched Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me just stop you there. So we have Lauren Gibbs, Jesse Grund -- and Jesse Grund obviously knew the family and knew you, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Uh-huh.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have to answer out loud (INAUDIBLE)

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And Richard and Deborah Grund, you knew them and they also knew the family, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Holly Gag-nee...

CINDY ANTHONY: Gagne.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m sorry, ma`am -- Holly Gagne -- you know her, as well?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the family knows her?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then Christina -- what was her name?

CINDY ANTHONY: Chester.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jester -- that you...

CINDY ANTHONY: Chester.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chester.

CINDY ANTHONY: A C.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know her and the family knows her, as well.

CINDY ANTHONY: I did not meet Christina Chester until -- you know, I met Christina Chester briefly when Casey was pregnant. I met her at a, like, Babies `R Us, and that was the only really time that I met her before. I didn`t really know her that well. She was a schoolmate of Casey`s.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, fair -- somebody who knew Casey and you actually had laid eyes on and talked to, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Actually, because I ran into her one day when Casey and I were shopping for Caylee`s things.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And it`s your understanding -- correct me if I`m wrong -- that Holly Gagne, the Grund family and also Christina Chester, they all did it, again, because they were friends with the family and they weren`t compensated. Is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: As far as I know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you certainly never paid them.

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I didn`t.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you don`t believe your husband paid them, either.

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I didn`t. It wouldn`t have been our responsibility to do that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On that point, though, did Casey ever say to you that she`s paid any of these people to watch her child?

CINDY ANTHONY: We never discussed that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So no knowledge if she did or not?

CINDY ANTHONY: Never discussed it with her. It wasn`t an issue.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, all these people -- and again, we`re talking about the time period when your granddaughter was from an infant through being a toddler -- of all these people, though, they were all people that you could reach out to and get ahold of, if necessary. Is that fair to say? If something happened and there was something happened to either you or your husband...

CINDY ANTHONY: No, that`s not true. I never had Jesse Grund`s cell number. I never had Richard Grund`s cell phone number. I did not know where they live. I never went to their house. So no, that`s not correct. I never had Christina`s phone number. Lauren was the only one that I had a phone number for, and I knew where she lived.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, let me go on back, though. But you knew that Richard`s first name and last name, Richard Grund, and Deborah Grund, Jesse`s first name and last name, and you had actually met them.

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, I`m sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You had actually met them and they were people that you had -- if they walked in the room, you would recognize them, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes. Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, have we covered all the people?

CINDY ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, tell...

CINDY ANTHONY: There was other friends of Casey`s that watched Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, of the people that you know and that you`ve met -- and all the people you listed for me are people that you know and you`ve met.

CINDY ANTHONY: I wouldn`t say I know them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand. When I say "know," I mean, like -- like I`ve met you...

CINDY ANTHONY: I could identify them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve met you and you can identify me, I can identify you...

CINDY ANTHONY: I probably wouldn`t have been able to pick out Christina again, except that we got close after Caylee went missing. I would know her now. But prior to that, I wouldn`t have been able to pick her out of a lineup.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, did you -- at some point in time -- these were baby-sitters. Did anybody -- was anybody of these -- in this group, were they ever referred to as a nanny?

CINDY ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. It`s your understanding that a nanny is somebody who`s compensated or paid for their services?

CINDY ANTHONY: You`re assuming that`s my understanding of a nanny. I really have never thought of what a nanny is. A nanny is someone that helps watch a child.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Well, in your experience, then, a nanny generally -- and correct me if I`m wrong...

CINDY ANTHONY: Jesse`s the one -- excuse me -- that started calling Zanny the nanny, OK?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey`s called her the baby-sitter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I got you.

CINDY ANTHONY: So the nanny came from the Grunds.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fair enough.

CINDY ANTHONY: OK?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we`re going to get -- I haven`t even gotten there yet.

CINDY ANTHONY: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So I know you`re fast-forwarding to that, and we are going to get there...

CINDY ANTHONY: I just don`t see the relevance.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand, ma`am. We`re going to get there in a moment. So of all these people, though, it`s fair to say that the baby- sitters that you`ve listed for me are baby-sitters you knew, and if push came to shove, you could get ahold of them somehow. If something happened to you, your husband or Casey, you could get ahold of these people. Is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: I`m not sure at the time if I could have gotten ahold of the Grunds without contacting Casey. You know, there was other people. I saw pictures of Jeffrey Hopkins, the other gentleman that Zenaida watched -- Zanny watched, her son, Zachary (ph) -- I saw a picture of Zachary and Jeff.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: I could pick them out because I`ve seen pictures of them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: When we come back, grandmother Cindy Anthony under oath, and it`s all on video.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: In a bizarre twist, grandmother Cindy Anthony swears under oath she has numbers and addresses for Caylee`s so-called baby-sitter. But grandmother Cindy confirms she never once made a single try at locating the alleged nanny, Zenaida Gonzalez.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you ever seen a picture of Zanny?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I haven`t.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, I just want to clarify a couple...

CINDY ANTHONY: But I have a picture in my head...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand that, ma`am.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... from descriptions from the last two-and-a-half years.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unlike the people that you listed to me, because you`ve never met Zanny, I assume, you can`t -- you can`t tell me what she looks like from your own personal observations, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: That`s correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So this isn`t somebody that if something had happened to you yourself or your husband, that you had a method of reaching out and getting ahold of for...

CINDY ANTHONY: Actually, I had phone numbers for Zanny...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... at different times, and I had addresses at different times.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Why don`t you tell me the phone number.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t have it now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where it is?

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t have it now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where would it have been?

CINDY ANTHONY: It would have been in an address book...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... something that Casey had or I had.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right, so when you say you had -- let me just get this straight. You had addresses and phone numbers of Zanny. And Zanny, (INAUDIBLE) -- when you`re saying Zanny, and I just want to make sure -- Zanny is the person that you were saying was watching...

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey always gave me a phone number, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And these phone numbers, you`re saying they are in existence and you`ve written them down somewhere in an address book and they`re out there somewhere to be found, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: I gave all that to the sheriff`s department.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, so then the sheriff`s department will have all that.

CINDY ANTHONY: I gave it all to the sheriff`s department.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that would include the addresses of Zanny (INAUDIBLE)

CINDY ANTHONY: Anything that I had, I gave to the sheriff`s department.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So the phone numbers, do you remember, you know, the area code of them?

CINDY ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. How about the address, for instance, the part of town where the address was?

CINDY ANTHONY: For my knowledge, Casey told me there was, like, four different addresses over the course of three years, that she moved quite frequently.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And these four -- the addresses, then, and the phone numbers, they all came from Casey?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did Zenaida or Zanny, the person that you believed was watching Caylee -- did she in any way provide to you a phone number or an address?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, never needed to talk to her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did she...

CINDY ANTHONY: I never needed to talk to her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. If the need arose that you needed to talk to her or get ahold of her, you would have had to go to these addresses and phone numbers that Casey gave you, is that right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you ever dial or call or talk to this person?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I have not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Next, grandmother Cindy Anthony under oath on Caylee`s alleged baby-sitter, Zenaida Gonzalez, who tot mom claims kidnapped 2-year-old Caylee in broad daylight.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Grandmother Cindy Anthony confirms she`s never met or even seen little Caylee`s nanny. But she says she did hear of Zenaida from tot mom. Tot nom`s ex-fiance Jessie Grund and even says Caylee talked about Zanny`s dog, reasoning that the dog proves there is a Zanny the nanny.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just want to clarify some things. We have some things here I`m going to ask you about this and I just want to clarify so we`re clear on a couple of different things.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you ever seen or met that babysitter? Are you able to corroborate her existence?

CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S MOTHER: You know what? I have to, because I trust my daughter.

(CROSSTALK)

C. ANTHONY: I`ve never seen her. I have never seen God but I know he`s there. OK? I mean that`s the only thing I can say.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you have faith?

C. ANTHONY: I have faith.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did your daughter ever talk about her before your granddaughter disappeared?

C. ANTHONY: Yes, and the police are aware of that. And this person, whether her name is Zanny or whatever, she`s been part of our conversation, normal conversation, for the last three years prior to Caylee`s birth. So I don`t think this is somebody that`s been fabricated in the last, you know, week or two, to cover up tracks that -- so, again, I don`t have the strength and energy to think about this. OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me ask that question. The statement that you made there about this is the person who`s been in normal conversations about three years prior to Caylee`s birth, is that accurate?

C. ANTHONY: No, that was a misstatement.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: And that was a week after my granddaughter went missing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand. I just -- and the reason I say this.

C. ANTHONY: And that was one of the -- that was like three days after Caylee went missing and, you know what? That was a -- that was just a misstatement.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So -- and that`s fine. We`re clarifying. That statement there that this is somebody whose name you had heard.

C. ANTHONY: And probably no sleep for, you know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That statement just to be clear on the record that this is somebody whose name has been in normal conversation around your house for three years prior to Caylee`s birth. That`s inaccurate?

C. ANTHONY: That`s inaccurate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right.

C. ANTHONY: From about 2006 to clarify that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So you`re sitting here as we sit here today, and, again, this is in a different circumstance than that. Are you saying that her -- Zanny`s identity was conversed around your house from when until when?

C. ANTHONY: Zanny`s name came up back around when Jessie and Casey were engaged. And that was in 2006.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So in 2006, you first heard the name Zanny. Did you ever hear Jessie talk about Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jessie Grund talk about Zanny? OK. Did Jesse -- what did Jesse Grund say as far as.

C. ANTHONY: I can`t remember. I just know the name came up while he was.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. When I say talk about Zanny, I want to be a little bit more clear about that. Did Jessie Grund ever tell you he had met or seen Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So where the name came up it may have been in conversation, as you said, but it wasn`t like I just came from Zanny and.

C. ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zanny was watching Caylee, is that right?

C. ANTHONY: Right. Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me expand that question now a little bit. Is there any other person, besides your daughter, that has told you that they have met or seen Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: No, but Caylee talked about Zanny`s dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. We`ll get to that in a second.

C. ANTHONY: She`s another person.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I appreciate it. I just want to be clear.

C. ANTHONY: OK. Well, if there`s a dog that belongs to Zanny then there must be a Zanny.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fair enough. So.

C. ANTHONY: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Besides your daughter and Caylee saying that about the dog, is there any other adult that has said to you, I have met Zanny or I know who she is?

C. ANTHONY: Not that I`m aware of.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: This is not relevant. It`s just not relevant.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So -- I`m just going to hit this briefly on that point. You say Caylee talked about the dog. This is -- what time period are we talking about that was?

C. ANTHONY: Probably some time between March and May of 2008.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: March and May.

C. ANTHONY: May have been even before that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anything else besides this statement about the dog?

C. ANTHONY: She talked about her dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So.

C. ANTHONY: Caylee loved dogs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. So I assume there was a statement about the dog and that would be extent of it.

C. ANTHONY: Mm-hmm.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So sort of backing up then, as far as whether Zanny was somebody that any adult saw, you don`t have any knowledge that this Zanny person who was watching Caylee was seen by any adult, is that correct?

C. ANTHONY: I wouldn`t know if anybody saw her. You know?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s kind of what I`m getting at.

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You wouldn`t know because.

C. ANTHONY: Well, how would I know if you saw somebody? I wouldn`t know if she saw me. I`m not in someone else`s head. So I have no idea if anybody saw her. That`s the kind of question I couldn`t answer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Did anybody say to you hey, I met Zanny, she`s a nice girl?

C. ANTHONY: No, I never -- Zanny has never came up in conversation with anybody other than Casey typically.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So we`re saying here on Greta Van Susteren, and we`ve got the dates wrong, but you`re saying in normal conversation around your house, that normal conversation you`re talking about is from Casey and you, is that right?

C. ANTHONY: Right, or my husband George.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s your understanding that he had never seen Zanny either. Is that right?

C. ANTHONY: That`s correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And once again, as far as the phone number and how to get ahold of her or address, that would have been information that would have been given to you by Casey and you say you`ve turned all that over?

C. ANTHONY: Right. Casey would give me a new phone number for Zanny probably every three months because she said the girl changed her phone number almost like she changed her address.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did Casey tell you that she was paying Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: I never asked her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was your understanding of whether Zanny was doing it for free or whether she was getting come compensated?

C. ANTHONY: My understanding was that Jeffrey Hopkins was paying Zanny, who was his ex-girlfriend, to watch his little boy Zachary when Casey first met Zanny. And Jeffrey was compensating for both children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: And then later on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me stop you there and we`ll get to that in just a sec.

C. ANTHONY: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, is it your understanding.

C. ANTHONY: I`m just answering your question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are, ma`am. And I appreciate that. Your understanding is that Jeffrey Hopkins was the ex-boyfriend of Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And how did you gain that understanding or that knowledge?

C. ANTHONY: Because that`s what Casey told me. When she first met Jeff, she was working for -- I believe she was still working for Color Vision or Kodak, I don`t know when they changed hands. And Jeffrey was an IT tech at Universal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: And that`s when I saw his picture and Zachary`s picture.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right now, where is Jeffrey Hopkins today?

C. ANTHONY: I have no idea.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Now the information that Zanny was the ex-girlfriend or girlfriend of Jeffrey Hopkins came to you by Jeffrey Hopkins?

C. ANTHONY: No, I never met him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. How did you get that information that.

C. ANTHONY: From Casey.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. And I`ll finish the question and we`ll get it. You know what I`m asking and I appreciate it. The information about Jeffrey Hopkins being the boyfriend of Zanny -- ma`am?

C. ANTHONY: He just asked me a question how I got it so I answered it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I`ll re-ask. I appreciate that.

C. ANTHONY: I guess raise your hand when you`re finished and I`ll know that you`re done.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think you`ll know when I`m finished, ma`am. Jeffrey Hopkins.

C. ANTHONY: I thought I did, obviously, I was wrong.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeffrey Hopkins and this relationship between him and Zanny, and this being the boyfriend and also the part about him compensating Zanny, that information came from Casey?

C. ANTHONY: Yes, it did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`ve never spoken to Jeffrey Hopkins about this relationship between Zanny and him?

C. ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you ever spoken to Jeffrey Hopkins?

C. ANTHONY: No, I haven`t.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So the only information that you have -- and if there`s more, tell me. The only information you have about Jeffrey Hopkins having a girlfriend named Zanny who was watching the kids came from your daughter, Casey?

C. ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And there`s no other source out there?

C. ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So it`s your understanding based upon what Casey told you that Jeffrey Hopkins was paying for Zanny to watch both children. How long a time period was that and how did you learn that? Is that from Casey?

C. ANTHONY: From Casey. I think that was until December of 2007.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How about after December 2007? Obviously you had an understanding that she was being paid by Jeffrey Hopkins. Did you come to an understanding as to who now was paying Zanny after Jeffrey Hopkins was no longer paying?

C. ANTHONY: I didn`t ask. It wasn`t an issue.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, did you have an assumption in your head that Zanny was somebody who charges for her services?

C. ANTHONY: Again, the -- it never came up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: When we come back, grandmother Cindy Anthony on the hot seat under oath.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: While giving sworn testimony, grandmother Cindy reveals more details about the so-called nanny, Zenaida Gonzalez, and the timeline leading up to Caylee`s disappearance.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you have an assumption in your head that Zanny was somebody who charges for child care?

C. ANTHONY: By that time Casey and Zanny had been friends. So a lot of Casey`s friends volunteered to watch Caylee. Caylee was a delightful young child.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, ma`am.

C. ANTHONY: That any -- everybody liked to watch. So you ask me a question, let me finish it. What I`m telling you is, it never came up and I didn`t think about it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And just.

C. ANTHONY: And I answered your question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just so I`m clear. You had an understanding in your mind that at one point in time Zanny was being compensated by Jeffrey Hopkins. Is that correct?

C. ANTHONY: That`s correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that, as you said, ended around -- the end of 2007. Is that correct?

C. ANTHONY: From my understanding.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. And after that, do you have an understanding in your mind as to who, if anybody, was compensating Zanny for her child care services?

C. ANTHONY: No, because I was never -- I never spoke to Casey with that. So, again, Casey told me that she was being compensated by Jeffrey. When Jeffrey moved, I didn`t ask who was compensating Zanny. So I have no understanding. I do not know.

Again, Zanny was a friend of Casey`s, so she could very well have volunteered. That did not come up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did Casey say to you that Zanny my friend is volunteering to watch my daughter?

C. ANTHONY: The subject did not come up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So when you`re saying it could have happened that`s not something you know.

C. ANTHONY: I can`t speculate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ma`am, I appreciate that. Let me finish my question, if you don`t mind. When you`re saying it could have happened, that isn`t something you know by a fact that you`ve learned from anybody, is that right?

C. ANTHONY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So as far as whether she was volunteering, this Zanny person, or whether she was being compensated from 2007 on, you really don`t know?

C. ANTHONY: No, and I don`t know if Casey ever paid Lauren or anybody else either because I never asked them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I appreciate that.

C. ANTHONY: Again, that didn`t come up. So I never interviewed any of her babysitters to find out if they were getting paid or not. It wasn`t my position to do that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand that. That wasn`t my question, though. My.

C. ANTHONY: Well, I`m trying to clarify the question when you asked me specifically about Zanny. So I`m clarifying it wasn`t just Zanny that I didn`t have that knowledge of. I didn`t have the knowledge for any of them.

She asked several people to watch. I don`t know if she paid them or not. I assume they didn`t get paid. But again -- and Casey was working then so it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey was working.

C. ANTHONY: . irrelevant to the Zenaida Gonzalez. I`m sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. You said two things but let me just go back. During this time period, you have no specific knowledge if Zanny was doing it for free or whether she was being paid. Is that correct?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s answered the question over and over again.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, you can make your objection. You know you can make your objection. I just want to clarify. You have no specific knowledge that Zanny was doing it for free or being paid from 2007 on. Is that correct?

C. ANTHONY: As I stated, I have no particular knowledge.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now, when you said Casey was working after 2007, is this based on the information you told me before about her working at Universal or was it based on some other fact we haven`t talked about?

C. ANTHONY: Casey never worked at Universal Studios.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: It`s for Universal Studios.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right, well, I misunderstood when you said that before. Anybody affiliated with Universal Studios or Hard Rock Cafe, which you told me about earlier, do you have any understanding or information that Casey was working for any entity after 2007 when Jeff Hopkins was out of the picture going forward?

C. ANTHONY: At that point, I was under the impression that she was working. I do not have any proof that she was working.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you`ve come to learn that she was not working, is that correct?

C. ANTHONY: That`s correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So when you said before that Casey was working then, it`s your understanding now that Casey was not working then, is that right?

C. ANTHONY: My understanding now is that she wasn`t working at those particular places.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Or anywhere else.

C. ANTHONY: I don`t know that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you don`t have any information that she was working anywhere else?

C. ANTHONY: I don`t know that. I can`t answer that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So you told me before, you never talked to Zanny on the phone. Did you ever talk to Casey when she was with Zanny or said she was Zanny?

C. ANTHONY: Possibly.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don`t have a recollection specifically.

C. ANTHONY: I don`t have a specific date. That`s possible.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now.

C. ANTHONY: I know she called me from Zanny`s apartment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because she told you she was at Zanny`s apartment.

C. ANTHONY: Because she told me she was at.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Which apartment was that?

C. ANTHONY: Again, I can`t tell you that. I`d have to have a specific date to tell you about what -- and the town she lived on at that particular time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Let`s go general to make it easier. At what point in time was it that you were called from Zanny`s apartment knowing anywhere in town or any of the counties around here in (INAUDIBLE) and Sanford that she was calling from somewhere?

C. ANTHONY: Zanny only lived in Orange County.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. She only lived in Orange Country. And how do you know that?

C. ANTHONY: Because Casey told me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. When did Casey tell you that?

C. ANTHONY: Over the years that we talked about Zanny. That she lived -- the places that she described, the areas of town that she described was only in Orange County.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. So when she called from the apartment, did Zanny ever have a house or was it always an apartment?

C. ANTHONY: It was always an apartment, to my knowledge, except her mom had a house. I believe was a house. It could have been an apartment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re getting that information about her mom from?

C. ANTHONY: Casey.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey. OK. And so all the information you have about Zanny -- ma`am, if I may. All the information you have about Zanny comes from Casey?

C. ANTHONY: Of course, because Caylee is too little to tell me about it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. So when you`re saying that she called from an apartment, that would have been Casey telling you, I`m calling from Zanny`s and it`s wherever it is?

C. ANTHONY: Right. She`d say I`m going to stay at Zanny`s tonight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. How many times did Casey stay out of the house with Zanny and with Caylee? I mean before -- we`re talking about before the..

C. ANTHONY: What time frame?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. Let me narrow it down. How many times was it before June 15th that Casey stayed out of the house with Zanny and with Caylee?

C. ANTHONY: Maybe on an average once or twice a month.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And during this time period you`re saying that Caylee was able to speak and talk about where she had been or where she had gone?

C. ANTHONY: Well, Caylee has been speaking since she was 18 months in phrases. So -- but she`s 2. Unless I specifically asked her questions, her point of reference is what`s right in front of her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So she would never volunteer about -- other than the dog as you told me, never volunteer about, let`s say, where she was or anything like that?

C. ANTHONY: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Now -- so during this time period, and we`re going to go on forward here a little bit here, in the March time period, because we`re already into 2008, March through May of 2008, it`s your understanding that Zanny is the babysitter for Caylee. Is that correct, or a nanny, babysitter, whatever you want to use?

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. And that`s all again based upon what has Casey has told you essentially that she`s the one watching her, is that right?

C. ANTHONY: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: And that wouldn`t be very often.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. How often would it be?

C. ANTHONY: You know, just -- most of the time Casey was gone in the evening, so I would watch Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So when you said that there were times when she would stay over at Zanny`s house, that would be how many times would you estimate?

C. ANTHONY: I said once or twice a month.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Once or twice a month. So that we`re starting at what time period that once or twice a month she stayed over there?

C. ANTHONY: It would have had to have been she had to have gone while I was at work. Because if I would have been home she wouldn`t have needed to take her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And how about this thing over (INAUDIBLE) because she would be home every night?

C. ANTHONY: Right. But if she was already gone and I was at work.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So once or two times a month? OK.

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So -- and it`s your understanding that the Zanny.

C. ANTHONY: Most of the time Caylee -- Casey brought Caylee up to my office and dropped her off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

C. ANTHONY: And then I took her home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So -- just a couple of other questions here on the dog issue. What kind of dog was it? Was it ever described?

C. ANTHONY: You know, it was a little white dog. I don`t remember if it was a Pomeranian mix or what it was.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And when she`s saying she liked playing with the dog, how did she describe the dog?

C. ANTHONY: She just called it her -- the new puppy. I can`t remember the name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So.

C. ANTHONY: It was several months ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She talked about the new puppy but how did you get in your mind about Zanny and the new puppy?

C. ANTHONY: Because I asked her if it was Zanny`s puppy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that`s she responded yes.

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So there`s no other description besides of the new puppy and all that?

C. ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what time period was this, that that was said?

C. ANTHONY: I believe I told you somewhere between March and May and it could have been earlier than that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So when she stayed out of the house, let`s say, during the March to May time period, if it`s a couple of times, or once or twice a month, that would have been in March and May, is that right? From March going forward to May.

C. ANTHONY: It was all the time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All the time?

C. ANTHONY: Once or twice a month.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Going back to when?

C. ANTHONY: Probably December.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: December.

C. ANTHONY: Or January or December.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: January or December 2007 so you`re saying once or twice a month from January to December.

C. ANTHONY: Yes. January, 2008, December 2007.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. And, again, you never picked up either your daughter or Caylee at this apartment or location where that was?

C. ANTHONY: Never had to.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And never actually physically.

C. ANTHONY: The need never arose.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I understand. You never physically went there to this apartment?

C. ANTHONY: Correct.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Next, more sworn testimony from grandmother Cindy Anthony and it`s all caught on video.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Lawyers for plaintiff Zenaida Gonzalez grill grandmother Cindy Anthony under oath. We learn about tips in the investigation and evidence tot mom claims is actually from the nanny`s apartment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was there ever a time that you told law enforcement about Caylee talking about Zanny`s dog?

ANTHONY: I believe so.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Do you know if you were asked that by law enforcement?

ANTHONY: I don`t know if law enforcement knew to ask me about a dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Well.

ANTHONY: Well, actually, I do remember speaking to law enforcement about it, because there was a tip that came in from Texas in July. And the person fit Zenaida`s description and she had the same type of dog and the little girl at the pool said her name was Caylee and she fit the description of my granddaughter. So I did speak to them about it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. And this -- that was in response to the tip later on?

ANTHONY: Yes, and that was probably in July or August.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. All right. But what you told me that -- what you told me a few minutes ago that Caylee would talk about Zanny`s dog. Did you ever volunteer that to law enforcement?

ANTHONY: You know, I don`t know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No recollection if you did or.

ANTHONY: No. No. I volunteered a lot of stuff to law enforcement. I gave them Zanny`s curling iron. I gave them some movies that came from Zanny`s apartment that Casey had brought home. You know different items.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. And we`re going to get to the curling iron and movies in a second. Who was it at law enforcement that you talked to about the dog? Do you recall?

ANTHONY: It had to be someone from missing persons, and probably either John Allen or Yuri Melich because they were on the case. Or it could have been Nick Savage from the FBI because I spoke with them, too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Army Sergeant First Class Keith Callahan, 31, McClure, Pennsylvania, killed Iraq. On a fourth tour, awarded the Purple Heart, Bronze Star, Army Commendation Medal and Army Achievement Medal.

Lost his life protecting fellow soldiers. Loved sports, wrestling, baseball, football, and sharing care packages from home. Leaves behind grieving mom Joan, seven siblings, widow, Jody, three sons, one daughter.

Keith Callahan, American hero.

Thanks to our guests, but our biggest thank you is to you for being with us for this special "Nancy Grace Investigates." I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END