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Jane Velez-Mitchell
Will Michael Jackson`s Doctor be Charged?; Private Investigator Talks about Murdered Playboy Model
Aired February 01, 2010 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, fast-breaking developments in the Michael Jackson death probe. Have the walls finally caved in on Dr. Conrad Murray?
TMZ says Michael`s personal doctor will be charged with involuntary manslaughter as early as this week. We`ll have the latest on the investigation, and we`ll hear from MJ`s children as they captured hearts at the Grammys. Have they tossed off their masks for good?
And a killer is on the loose right in the middle of Miami. Who murdered gorgeous Paula Sladewski, the "Playboy" model who was found burning in a Dumpster. Tonight, we`ll get shocking insight into this horrifying murder, and we`ll talk to a private investigator working on the case.
Also, a fabulous guest, sashaying on to ISSUES tonight. We`ll be joined by the legendary RuPaul. Famous for "You better work, girl." Now he`s got a hit reality show and searching for his next supermodel.
Plus, the battle for the alleged John Edwards sex tape has erupted into a war of words. Former aide Andrew Young claims he`s been offered a gigantic sum of money to hand over the video. But don`t tell that to Rielle Hunter. She wants her tape back, and she`s not offering him a penny. In fact, she`s taking him to court. We`ll have all the juicy details, including claims that Young feared for his life.
ISSUES starts now.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jaw-dropping developments in the Michael Jackson death probe. TMZ reports Dr. Conrad Murray could be charged any minute now with involuntary manslaughter in the superstar`s death.
While the King of Pop was being celebrated at last night`s Grammys, were authorities closing in on his personal doctor? Dr. Murray admits he injected Michael with Propofol, a powerful knockout drug normally used only in surgery, right before he died. The doctor had earlier given Michael other prescription drugs but the coroner said it was the Propofol that caused a heart attack and killed him, and the death was ruled a homicide.
Dr. Murray ,reportedly the last person to see Michael alive, was shoved into the spotlight. Michael`s sister, La Toya, called it murder. Listen to this from TMZ.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you still believe in the conspiracy?
LA TOYA JACKSON, MICHAEL`S SISTER: It`s murder. I think someone did it. That`s my opinion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: After seven long months, will Michael`s family finally get some closure? Two of his children, Paris and Prince, spoke out eloquently at last night`s Grammy awards on CBS. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PARIS JACKSON, MICHAEL`S DAUGHTER: Daddy was supposed to be here, but daddy was going to perform this year, but he couldn`t perform last year. Thank you. We love you, Daddy.
PRINCE JACKSON, MICHAEL`S SON: Through all this songs, his message was simple, love. We will continue to spread his message and help the world. Thank you. We love you, Daddy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: That`s really the first time we`ve heard from Prince. Amazing.
Conrad Murray, meantime, denies any wrongdoing. Radar Online reports his lawyer says if there are charges, Dr. Murray will turn himself in to police. We talked to his attorney, and he said they don`t have any information about any of this from authorities.
I want to hear from you. Should this man be charged? Call me: 1-877- JVM-SAYS. That`s 1-877-586-7297.
Straight out to my truly fantastic expert panel. With the inside scoop, Jackson family friend Firpo Carr. And we also have psychologist Brenda Wade with us tonight. And delighted to have the author of "The Good Karma Divorce," Judge Michele Lowrance, as well as "In Session" correspondent, Beth Karas. But we begin with TMZ assignment manager Mike Walters.
Mike, you`ve been all over the story, breaking story after story. What is the very latest?
MIKE WALTERS, TMZ ASSIGNMENT MANAGER: You said it, Jane. The walls are coming in on Dr. Conrad Murray. We`re told on Friday there was a big meeting at the D.A.`s office with, you know, Cooley, the D.A., Walgreen, the deputy D.A. assigned to the case, all the heavy hitters got together to figure out exactly what they`re going to do this week in charging Dr. Conrad Murray.
We`re told from now until the end of this week, probably sooner than later, you`ll get that involuntary manslaughter charge, and there will be some sort of justice here in the Michael Jackson case.
Real interesting part of this story, though, you said -- you talked about Dr. Conrad Murray`s defense attorney, J. Michael Flanagan. This gentleman`s one of the only guys in town that`s actually tried a Propofol case with a criminal background and actually won. So he has a lot of experience when it comes to that drug and this sort of situation with death. He has been involved with this before. So this is going to get real interesting this week -- this week, very quickly, Jane.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now what kind of evidence do prosecutors have against Dr. Conrad Murray? Authorities raided the doctor`s Las Vegas home and office. They raided his Houston office, as well as a Houston storage locker, hunting for evidence. They took documents, a Rolodex card with FedEx information, two hard drives and lots more.
They did not find any Propofol during those raids, but there were significant delays between those raids. And a lot of critics said, "Hey, those raids had no element of surprise," that Dr. Murray would have had plenty of time to remove any incriminating evidence.
In fact, the person who runs the storage facility says people from Dr. Murray`s office actually visited the storage locker six times, and the last time they visited was the very morning of Michael Jackson`s death.
Mike Walters, what do you know about the goods that they -- the prosecutor`s have on Dr. Murray, if any?
WALTERS: Well, they`re taking their time, Jane. I mean, No. 1, they found Propofol in Michael Jackson`s house in a closet. So they did find more Propofol that apparently was being used to keep Michael Jackson asleep for some sort of insomnia, which is never used for that.
They also, you know, the evidence that you were talking about in Houston, the same day that he passed away, people from his office went into the storage locker and were seen carrying out boxes that were this size, you know, two foot by two feet. So there`s a lot of that kind of stuff.
So I think, you know, Dr. Murray and what he told the cops is the evidence. It`s all they really need in this case when he said, "Look, I gave him all these drugs over and over and over." In, like, a seven-hour period he gave him a whole bunch of narcotics, and you just don`t give someone that much stuff. And in the end he was using Propofol to help him sleep, which is never used for that. That`s what`s going to get him in the end, I think.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. And I`ve got to ask Judge Michele Lowrance, what`s taking so long? He died at the end of June. Here we are, the beginning of February, and as Mike Walters just said, the doctor himself admitted he injected Michael Jackson with Propofol. Propofol is only supposed to be used in a surgical setting. Not only that, he gave him a slew of other drugs before. So why not -- why does it take all these raids?
MICHELE LOWRANCE, JUDGE: Well, I think they want -- this is a very difficult case because this has to do with behavior that we have to ask ourselves way beyond the standard of care.
What`s so interesting about this is you wonder who was in charge of Michael Jackson`s medical care. Was it Michael Jackson or was it the doctor who deferred to him? The reasons that the doctor deferred to him is what`s interesting.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I don`t really think it matters, Judge, because I could go into my doctor and say, "Hey, hit me up with some methadone." Doesn`t mean the doctor is going to give it to me just because yes, Michael Jackson referred to this as his milk. He had tried Propofol before Dr. Murray, according to numerous published reports. He went around asking everybody, Nurse Cherilyn Lee and everybody else, for the Propofol.
So let me go to Beth Karas on this. What does it take to find him, charge him with involuntary manslaughter?
BETH KARAS, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": Assuming they go forward with that charge. There are two types of involuntary manslaughter. The one they would go forward with is committing a lawful act in a criminally negligent way, basically reckless.
It was entirely lawful for a medical doctor, with a DEA license, to possess all sorts of prescription drugs and to administer them. No one is saying that`s unlawful. It`s the way in which he did it, as the doctor just said. It is below the standard of care. He did it in a reckless way.
You do not give Propofol, which knocks someone out for only three to five minutes, and if he was truthful when he told the police 25 milligrams, that`s a very small amount. That would not have killed him. It was the toxic soup of the other drugs in him that kicked in once he fell into a deep sleep from the Propofol. This is what an anesthesiologist explained to me. Your airways get blocked. Your brain stem just stops giving you the will to breathe. You need to be in a surgical center or a hospital where the equipment is there to jump start you, to block -- to unblock your airways. That`s why you need suction equipment. You need ventilators. You cannot be in somebody`s home giving Propofol, which can have the reaction it had in Michael Jackson.
This was not his first time, though, and it probably wasn`t the first time Dr. Murray gave it to him. And as Murray is going to say, "I gave it to him before. He didn`t die. Another time he didn`t die, another time he didn`t die. I didn`t think he would die this time."
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, Firpo Carr, you`re inside the Jackson family, in essence. Are they waiting on pins and needles for this to come down or like wow, this is finally going to happen?
FIRPO CARR, JACKSON FAMILY FRIEND: Absolutely. They are. So is everyone else. A lot of time has gone by, and there is, at the very least, some suspicious behavior on the part of Dr. Murray and his associates who went to the storage facility. So there`s some unanswered questions, I should say, and everyone`s waiting.
Of course, they have inside information that`s not available to the public and that they`re not at liberty to talk about and neither am I. But everyone, we are all very excited about something going down, him being charged, finally, because at the very least he was there.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. More on the Michael Jackson death probe in just a bit. We`re just getting started here, people.
We`re also taking your calls on this: 1-877-JVM-SAYS. That`s 1-877- 586-7297. What do you think? Give me a call.
Plus shocking insight into the Miami murder investigation. Who killed Paula Sladewski? Her body found burning in a Dumpster. We`re going to talk to a private investigator who is on the case right now. But first, Michael Jackson`s kids, they have spent their lives in the shadows. Now they are finally shedding their masks. We`ll analyze.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PARIS JACKSON: Ever since I was born, daddy has been the best father you could ever imagine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, let`s get him on the floor.
ALBERTO ALVAREZ, SECURITY FOR MICHAEL JACKSON: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, let`s get him down to the floor. I`m going to help you with CPR right now...
Did anybody see him?
ALVAREZ: Yes, we have a personal doctor here with him, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, you have a doctor there?
ALVAREZ: Yes, but he`s not responding to anything, to no, no, he`s not responding to the CPR or anything, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, OK. Well, we`re on our way there, and if your guy`s doing CPR, as instructed by a doctor, he has a higher authority than me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, will Dr. Conrad Murray be charged in Michael Jackson`s death? That was the 911 call. It didn`t come in until 30 minutes after Dr. Conrad Murray began giving Michael CPR.
Dr. Murray`s attorneys admit there was a delay. He says it was because he didn`t know the exact address of Michael`s mansion. He was there every day. He said he needed to get somebody else in the house to make the call.
Murray has also gotten a lot of heat for giving Michael CPR on the bed when, as a doctor or really anybody who`s ever watched a medical TV show knows, you should move the victim to a hard surface.
Phone lines, lighting up. Matt in Tennessee, do we have you?
CALLER: Yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What`s your question or thought, sir?
CALLER: I love your show, Jane. My question is, OK, Dr. Murray, how did he obtain Propofol? This is not a drug that you can go to a doctor and get a prescription for. Although he is a doctor, he cannot go to a drug store and obtain this substance. He had to steal it from the hospital or some other place to take this and give this to Michael, which led to his death.
If I was caught with this substance, I would be put in prison immediately, because it`s an unattainable through a prescription.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, excellent question. Beth Karas, do we know anything about how this Propofol was obtained? I know that investigators were on a big hunt to try to find sort of a chain of custody, as it were, for this Propofol.
KARAS: OK. They found several bottles, 20 milliliter and 100 milliliter, which is how the two manufacturers distribute it, in those two size bottles. They found in one of the searches, in Dr. Murray`s possession, was a credit card receipt for a pharmacy in Las Vegas. They searched the pharmacy. They found records matching that credit card receipt, and it was Dr. Murray on May 12th of last year buying, those two sized bottles of Propofol. And the lot numbers sold by Allied Pharmacy in Las Vegas matched the lot numbers of the bottles in Michael Jackson`s room.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Wow. That is absolutely fascinating. Very good explanation, Beth, of a complex issue.
Anita, Alabama, your question or thought, ma`am?
All right. You know what, here`s the thing that I don`t get. This is what has continued to baffle me. Michael seemed incredibly healthy when rehearsing for his comeback tour, This is It. I don`t know if you`ve seen the movie. I have. The rehearsals were videotaped into this movie. Take a look at this clip from Sony Pictures.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL JACKSON, POP STAR: This is the moment. This is it.
It`s an adventure. It`s a great adventure. You want to take them places that they`ve never been before. You want to show them a time like you`ve never seen before.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, Brenda Wade, clinical psychologist, compare that with what he was supposedly taking at night. According to the affidavit, the search warrant and affidavit, on the night he died, for example, Valium, Lorazepam, Midozolam and then, obviously, the Propofol. I mean, how do you perform like that when you`re taking all this stuff?
WADE: Jane, this case is so tragic because every one of us knows somebody who is suffering with addiction, and it reminds us of the tragic price we can pay.
But I want to remind people of what really causes addiction. And I think Michael was suffering from this, and dancing and performing was his relief. I think he was suffering from emotional distress, coming from his very troubled childhood.
But I also think he was suffering a kind of spiritual emptiness that he was seeking to express in his work and to fulfill.
And, of course, anybody who wants to heal addiction has got to get emotional support and growth and has got to get spiritual support and growth. And Michael, in this -- I saw the film, too -- looked as if he was trying to turn a corner.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`ve got to jump in, because I`ve got to tell you that I was astounded at how fit and how energetic and how coordinated he was.
WADE: Yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And I find it hard to believe somebody who was doing all those drugs can wake up the next morning and perform. He was performing like a kid.
OK. Here`s my big issue tonight. Jackson`s kids unmasked. Michael was famously protective of his three children`s identities. We know he forced them to cover their faces with masks and veils in public.
Well, now, they`ve gone from that to well, they were covered in veils any time they left the house. Now they`re speaking in front of global audiences. Eleven-year-old Paris, 12-year-old Prince accepted an award for their dad at last night`s Grammys. Got to listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRINCE JACKSON: First of all, we would like to thank God for watching over us for these past seven months, and our Grandma and Grandpa for their love and support.
We would also -- we`d also like to thank the fans. Our father loved you so much, because you were always there for him.
Our father was always concerned about the planet and humanity. Through all his hard work and dedication, he has helped through many charities and donated to all of them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Firpo Carr, the kids living with Katherine, their grandmother. There have been some published reports suggesting that the kids are tired of all these tributes and want to move on, that it could be having a negative effect on them. What do you say?
CARR: There are mixed opinions as far as the family is concerned with regard to the children and the situation that you mentioned.
I`d like to say that, along with Taj (ph), Terrell and T.J., those were their cousins who were on stage with them, that they have a healthy environment. However, I did not see that Grammy presentation. This is my first time seeing it.
And the reason I didn`t see it is because Michael, I don`t think, would have agreed with such a presentation. He guarded the children. I was around him with those very two children, and he was very protective of them. So, I...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But Firpo, isn`t it healthier to let them show their faces and walk around and participate in life rather than wearing veils? I mean, it kind of proves that they didn`t need it.
CARR: It`s a big difference between every-day activities and speaking before, as you stated, a global audience. Michael himself complained about his childhood being somewhat traumatically impacted by overexposure, if you will, to a global audience at such a young age.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. We`ve got to leave it right there. We`re going to stay on top of this. As soon as those charges, if they do come down, come down, you will hear about it here on ISSUES.
Thank you, fantastic panel.
Just when you thought the John Edwards` sex scandal couldn`t get any sleazier, it does. New reports of two alleged sex tapes, are you kidding me? And a love child. What is going on there?
Plus, work it, girl. We`re going to be joined by RuPaul. You won`t believe it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, fascinating new insight from a private investigator working on the murder case of former "Playboy" model Paula Sladewski. It has been almost a full month since her charred body was discovered in a smoldering Dumpster in North Miami. Now, with the reward increased to $15,000, are there new glimmers of hope?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LT. NEAL CUEVAS, NORTH MIAMI POLICE DEPARTMENT: We have gotten some leads and tips from people that have reported an individual leaving the front of the club with Paula. And we`re pretty confident that, within the next few days, we`re going to be able to put together a sketch composite of that individual.
We also have processed several cars that we believe might have something to do in this case. Within the next week or two, we should have an official ruling on the forensics in this case.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: The last sighting of this 26-year-old beauty, that we know of was January 2, as she left a night club at 2 in the morning. Paula reportedly got into a fight with her boyfriend and left without him. Grainy footage shows Paula and a guy cops say is a bouncer. But it apparently offers little else for investigators to go on.
Meantime, we get some new surveillance video from HLN affiliate WFOR take a look at it. It shows -- it was shot at 3 a.m. on January 3 at a downtown Miami gas station. It shows boyfriend Kevin Klym basically showing Paula`s picture to the clerk. This would look like a desperate attempt to try to find out where his girlfriend is. Is this a significant development?
My next guest will answer that right away. Joining me now is David Wasser, private investigator, hired by Paula Sladewski`s boyfriend, the very person you saw right there.
Mr. Wasser, cops have called your client a person of interest in the past because he was the last one to see her who knew her. Do you believe this video of him going around trying to offer -- find out what happened to his girlfriend is proof that he was not involved in her murder?
DAVID WASSER, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR: Well, Jane, it`s only one piece of the proof. There`s many alibi witnesses we`ve talked to that apparently the police and the media have spoken with that all confirm what he`s telling is the truth.
He was a person of interest because he was there in the club with her, but after that, and after he left the club and went back to his hotel, things -- he had plenty of alibi witnesses.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. So it`s not him.
Now, here`s what baffles me about this case: how Paula`s body wound up where it did. For all intents and purposes she was last seen leaving Club Space in downtown Miami at about 7 in the morning. Cops say she left the area with an unidentified male. They`re promising a sketch of that unidentified man soon. We keep waiting.
Her body was discovered more than ten miles away in a smoldering Dumpster in North Miami. Cops say it was burned beyond recognition. So how did she get from point A to point B?
On Friday, Lieutenant Cuevas from the North Miami Police Department said he had processed several cars but declined to elaborate. Do you know anything about these cars that they -- the police have gotten a hold of?
WASSER: No. Typically, this is a one-way street, Jane. We give information to the police, but they don`t share information back. And rightly so. They are investigating an open homicide. They do not want any of their details to get out to the general public.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I`ve got to say we`re going to stay on top of this. As soon as they release that sketch, we will tell you.
Now, to something different. The one and only RuPaul is here, model, singer and author. And Rip Torn in big trouble.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: A fabulous guest sashaying on to ISSUES tonight. We`ll be joined by the legendary RuPaul; famous for "You better work, girl." Now he`s got a hit reality show and searching for his next supermodel.
Plus, the battle for the alleged John Edwards` sex tape has now erupted into a war of words. Former aide Andrew Young claims he`s been offered a gigantic sum of money to hand over the video. But don`t tell that to Rielle Hunter. She wants her tape back and she`s not offering him a penny.
That is next, but first, "Top of the Block" tonight.
Toxic secrets in an addict nation, alcohol can make people do very strange things. Just ask legendary actor Rip Torn. The 78-year-old was arrested Friday night after he allegedly broke into a Connecticut bank, but here`s the thing, he wasn`t trying to rob the place. Apparently he was so drunk he mistook the bank for his own home.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming through.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How are you doing?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Could he still be drunk? Has daylight broke? Cops say torn was carrying a loaded gun when he broke the window of the bank, but instead of going for the vault, he apparently took off his hat and boots and placed them by the door, treating the place like his living room.
Torn has pleaded not guilty to a slew of charges but today expected to make the all-important first step towards recovery, checking in to a rehab center. Seriously, that is the way to go, dude. I`m glad to hear that.
This isn`t the first time Rip has had trouble with alcohol and the law. I just hope this time he really can get the help he needs. He`s a funny guy but right now the joke is on him.
All right.
Tonight -- so excited about this -- the two sides of the eternal and prolific pop culture icon RuPaul. RuPaul, the famous drag queen of the `90s and RuPaul when he`s not in one of his gorgeous drag outfits.
RuPaul`s influence is so engrained in our pop culture that his wildly successful dance club anthem from the `90s Supermodel, "You Better Work is featured on the gender-bender section of MTV`s Web site.
But he`s more than just a model, singer and drag queen. He is host of RuPaul`s "Drag Race" on Logo Network. Season two starts tonight. Here is a preview for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s new glamour girls in town and they`re sitting on a big old secret.
RUPAUL, HOST, "DRAG RACE": I`m back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s right. We`re back. For an all new season of RuPaul`s "Drag Race", the search for America`s next drag superstar.
We have 12 hot new queens willing to do whatever it takes. Even if that means they`ve got to drop, drop, drop it like it`s hot.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ouch. But wait, there`s more. RuPaul is also out with a brand new book "Workin` It: RuPaul`s guide to life, liberty and the pursuit of style".
RuPaul, author, TV show host, glamour queen, business man, welcome to ISSUES. I am so delighted to talk to you. And I`m intrigued by the title. When you say "pursuit of style" does that have a deeper meaning?
RUPAUL: It absolutely does. I think style comes from the inside out. You know, once you find your own frequency, know thyself you can then decorate it, then you can find out what it is you need to present and how people see you.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to ask you about your childhood, because I was reading in your book, you said you always felt different. And so many kids feel different. I felt different.
You managed to take that and turn it into a positive. How did you do that?
RUPAUL: You know, it`s really -- again, know thyself. You know I always wanted to look under the hood of things, like Dorothy looking behind the curtain. I think it`s important to look deeper at every issue and to find out what`s really going on there.
And what I realize is that most people do feel different and most people haven`t come to terms with or learned how to negotiate their spirit with their ego. That`s really what "Workin` It" is about. It`s learning to negotiate and navigate spirit and ego.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I like it. RuPaul`s "Drag Race season 2" premiers tonight.
Let`s take another look. It`s absolutely fabulous.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUPAUL: Welcome to RuPaul`s "Drag Race".
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When I see RuPaul come into the room for the first time I`m in a state of shock.
RUPAUL: I am gagging at the lovely extra extravaganza; wonderful. Hello.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tatiana.
RUPAUL: Tatiana.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Holy (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am shaking the hand of a legend.
RUPAUL: Nicole Page Brooks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From Atlanta, Georgia.
RUPAUL: That`s right. The ATL. You`re Pandora.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pandora Box.
RUPAUL: Pleasure to meet you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pleasure to meet you.
RUPAUL: Great.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anybody who steps out of the house with a pair of high heels and a wig is my hero.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. So many questions: first of all, how long does it take you to go from you, a guy in glasses and a tie and suit, to RuPaul, makeup, dress, how long does that take?
RUPAUL: Well, depends on what I`m doing. If I`m going to do the television show or photographs maybe three hours. But you know if I`m doing a show in a night club, which I still do, I could do it in an hour if I had to, an hour and a half.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, do people treat you differently when you`re RuPaul, the guy in a suit and tie, and you`re RuPaul, the female, by all appearances? Do you get a sense of what it`s like to go -- it is gender- bending. Do you get a sense of what it`s like one minute to be a guy and how guys are treated in this world and the next minute get a sense of how women are treated?
RUPAUL: No. I`ve never known what it feels like to be treated like a woman. But the difference is, it`s me as the guy walking on the street and then me the celebrity. I was in a store today and I walked in and I had on, you know, some winter clothes, so they were very sort of shady to me initially, but once they found out it was me, the celebrity -- But you know I`ve never -- they treated me nicely.
You know, I`ve never been a woman, never wanted to be a woman, and women don`t dress like that. That is drag. And I talk about that in the book. Drag is something you put forth after you get -- we`re born naked and the rest is drag. But the drag that we do is a super glamorized, glamazon thing that is a hyper feminism -- commercial feminism, you know what I mean? It`s not really dressing like a woman.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. I totally understand you. What do you get out of it? What kind of charge do you get out of dressing like that because it happens throughout our culture.
RUPAUL: Well, I`ve had a very lovely career and I`ve got -- you know, it`s something -- it`s an angle. And in the book "Workin` It", it`s working an angle. Everybody can do it whether you work on Wall Street or at McDonald`s. If you understand how the human eye sees you or understand your own frequency you work an angle that works for you and that propels you to get what you want.
You know, I`ve done very well in terms...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And that`s why you better work.
RUPAUL: Yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. RuPaul`s "Drag Race" is nothing, if not unique. And it`s actually hilarious. You got to check this out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUPAUL: Gentlemen, start your engines. And may the best woman win.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There were no ladies on that set today. There were men running for curtains.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You pushed me. You pushed me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I got it first. This is mine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is on.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is mine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The rules of the challenge are pick a set of curtains and make your costume from it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What makes the -- what makes the really extraordinary drag queen? It`s got to be more than makeup, hair and a great dress. It`s got to be `tude.
RUPAUL: It is. You`re absolutely right. It`s between your ears. If you believe it we will see it.
Also, there`s -- you have to have a knowledge of pop culture and history. You know, the future belongs to those who can remember the past.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. If you look at plays, for example, in the history of plays, there were centuries ago where women were not allowed to be in plays and men had to play the part of women in the plays because women weren`t allowed to participate.
RUPAUL: You`re absolutely right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: In a sense that`s kind of like the history of what you`re doing.
RUPAUL: It is but taking it a step further. You know, drag has been throughout history as a reminder to the culture to not take itself too seriously. Because you can -- you are both male, female, night, day, you`re everything. And when you remember that, you can have a great, great time.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I love that concept. And it`s sort of like the yin, and the yang; the black, the white; the sweet, the sour; the male, the female. We have to remain in balance with all those polarities.
Rupaul thank you, great job on your show. I`m going to watch it and I`m going to download your latest song when I get home.
Thank you again.
RUPAUL: That`s right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. You better work.
Plus, a sex tape shocker. The hits just keep on coming in the John Edwards` sex child.
First a love child and now rumors there could be multiple sex tapes. We will have the really -- and I mean shocking, details next. We`re also taking your calls on this, 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297. That`s 1-877-586-7297.
And what about Elizabeth, how much more could she possibly take?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, mind-blowing details on the alleged John Edwards` sex tape; Edwards` former aide tells all in his new book. And tonight, another potential bombshell -- are you sitting down -- is there a possibility that a second sex tape exists?
Andrew Young used to be part of Edwards` inner circle, but with friends like him, who needs enemies? He knew all along about Edwards` affair with Rielle Hunter and admitted to being a willing ally. Now Young has changed his tune, he has written a scathing book about his former boss and the tape he says he found in a trash can.
Here`s what he had to say on ABC`s "Good Morning America."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW YOUNG, AUTHOR, "THE POLITICIAN": So it`s a sex tape of Rielle and John Edwards made just a couple of months before the Iowa caucuses.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Young says he`s been offered, quote, "gigantic amounts of money for the tape" but he says he is not selling, at least not yet. Also, was his life threatened because of the scandal?
Young told ABC yes, it was.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YOUNG: For several months, I used to get up every morning at 3:00 and walk around the house with a baseball bat and a knife and our kids slept with us every night for six or eight months.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a new question, is there a sex tape from 2006 floating around? I say if you make one sex tape you`ve likely made more.
Joining me now, my absolutely fantastic panel: Judge Michele Lowrance, author of "The Good Karma Divorce", psychologist Brenda Wade, self-proclaimed bad boy, Steve Santagati from badboysfinishfirst.com.
And we begin with chief correspondent for "Inside Edition" and author of "The Last Days of my Life" Jim Moret. Jim, it`s hard to know where to start with this. Every day, we think, well the story is kind of done and then boom, something else comes along. And the idea that this former aide is there on camera on national television describing a sex tape involving a guy who wanted to be president, it`s just mind blowing.
JIM MORET, CHIEF CORRESPONDENT "INSIDE EDITION": Well, you know, you said it a couple of seconds ago. With friends like this, who needs enemies? It`s interesting, because the numbers of betrayals just mount. You have the betrayal of John Edwards and his wife; John Edwards denying he`s Rielle Hunter`s baby`s father; and Andrew Young who worked with John Edwards now betraying his former friend. It just goes on and on. And nobody comes out clean in this.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely not. Now, Andrew Young seems pretty convinced about who`s on the sex tape. Here`s what he told ABC`s "Good Morning America" this morning. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YOUNG: I`m positive it`s John Edwards. You can clearly see his face. I can`t speak for the rest of the body parts.
With Rielle, it`s clearly a pregnant woman. It was taped several months before the election. There are distinguishing jewelry that she wore. It could have been another woman who wore the exact same jewelry and it was left in a box of trash right outside of a room that she had stayed in temporarily in our rental home. Sure. But I would -- we think and I think it`s hard to think that it would be anyone else but her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Steve Santagati...
STEVE SANTAGATI, WWW.BADBOYSFINISHFIRST.COM: God help us.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Why would a pregnant woman make a sex tape? Well, it just doesn`t seem to be something that meshes, pregnancy -- obvious pregnancy and a sex tape. Except in Young`s book, he said that Rielle thought this baby was going to be the reincarnation of a Buddhist monk that had died a few years earlier.
SANTAGATI: Yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: So perhaps she was trying to document it. And remember, she was a videographer, that`s what she was supposed to be doing on the campaign. This gives new meaning to the term campaign videographer.
SANTAGATI: Yes. Well, first of all, ask any pregnant woman, they want sex as bad as non-pregnant women. So there is -- that checks off that aspect. Second part of this is that you know, people do sex tapes because -- not because they`re journalists, because it`s something -- yes, I was going to go to journalism school but instead I made a sex tape.
No, they do it because it`s erotic and it`s fun. But let`s cut to the chase on this if I can just say one quick thing.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes.
SANTAGATI: All this is possible, these two morons monetizing their illicit behavior is because of people being politically correct. The bottom line is, if we would just accept people as being human beings and making mistakes, everything would be out in the open and idiots like John Edwards wouldn`t be allowed to hide things. Because he would like, oh I just say what I did because I`m a jerk and I made a mistake.
But instead...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But you know, I have to agree with you, Steve. I think that the cover up is so much worse than the crime in this case. People do make misjudgments. He`s been married a long time. It`s not the first guy in the world to have an affair.
SANTAGATI: Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s -- I don`t think it`s the affair that`s the offensiveness as much as the cover-up, a man who wanted to be President of the United States.
Michelle Lowrance, Judge...
SANTAGATI: Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: ...you`re the author of "The Good Karma Divorce" and this -- this lying. It`s almost pathological lying. I think that`s what really offends people.
JUDGE MICHELE LOWRANCE, AUTHOR, "THE GOOD KARMA DIVORCE": Well, Jane and I look at it from another point of view also. In these kinds of cases every time the media puts the knife into John Edwards, understandably, or any celebrity like that, they also put the knife into the children.
That`s the problem. The children need to be protected. Because the children feel they`re half the father or half the offender and half of them is flawed. The more flawed the father or whoever the offender is the more flawed the child feels they are. That`s a problem.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. It`s a problem all the way around. I mean, the idea that you would involve this many people in this kind of cover-up is naive to say the least.
Now, let me get to this whole issue of a second sex tape. Here`s where this comes from. Rielle had a restraining order demanding the return of a very private, very personal tape from 2006. Those were her terms and she mentioned that this was during the time she was having a relationship with John Edwards.
But she wasn`t pregnant in 2006, in other words, not visibly pregnant. She may have been pregnant but she was not visibly pregnant. She only has one baby and that baby was born in 2008.
So, Jim Moret, it would appears that either somebody has their dates confused or there`s a possibility that there could be two sex tapes. And before you answer, let`s hear what Young had to say about all of this on ABC this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, ABC HOST: In the restraining order Rielle describes a 2006 tape. Now, Rielle Hunter would not be pregnant in 2006, or are there two different tapes?
ANDREW YOUNG, AUTHOR, "THE POLITICIAN": Again, I can`t comment -- I don`t truly understand what it is she`s asking for. I`ve only seen one tape.
STEPHANOPOULOS: Well, you have a tape. You know she`s asking for that tape. Why not turn it over?
YOUNG: Well, it`s -- again, I`m not going -- I`m going to let my lawyers handle that. But I`m not sure clear that it`s hers. I`m not clear that anything -- I`m not clear that anything that she`s asking for is hers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jim Moret, what do you make of the discrepancy?
JIM MORET, CHIEF CORRESPONDENT, "INSIDE EDITION": Well, look, you`re right in saying whoever makes one sex tape is dumb enough to make two. We know that.
(CROSSTALK)
MORET: I cannot believe -- wait a minute. You`re running for president -- you`re running for president. You have an affair and then you document it. Think about the possibility of blackmail down the road.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Back with more in a moment.
MORET: I mean, it`s jus ridiculous.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
ELIZABETH EDWARDS, WIFE OF JOHN EDWARDS: John`s just relieved that this is behind him. I`m pretty sure. And I think that our whole family feels relieved.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Elizabeth Edwards formally split from John Edwards.
Phone lines lighting up. Anita, Alabama, your question or thought, ma`am.
ANITA, ALABAMA (via telephone): (INAUDIBLE) Anyone that makes a sex tape and thinks no one else is going to see it and it`s not eventually going to get out there, is not thinking very straight.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, I agree with you.
ANITA: Especially when you`re somebody important.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Steve Santagati, why would a guy who is trying to be president of the United States make a sex tape? Let`s assume these sex tapes exist.
STEVE SANTAGATI, WWW.BADBOYSFINISHFIRST.COM: What I want to know is how many times I have to say this. Ladies, please listen up. We can be politicians, PhDs from Harvard, it doesn`t matter, plumbers, whatever. We`re men first. We think with our GPS, which is called our global -- system. You fill in the "p" ok? So to speak.
That`s how we go through the world. These guys become sex dizzy and stupid and they didn`t have any experience when they were in high school and college like I did and now they make stupid foolish mistakes. Believe or not you can actually have a sex tape and it won`t be found out. This guy is just a moron.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What did you just say?
SANTAGATI: You can have a sex tape and no one is going to find it if you`re careful and not stupid.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: If you erase it right after you make it.
SANTAGAI: No, there`s plenty of places to hide it.
BRENDA WADE, PSYCHOLOGIST: Jane, I don`t think the point is hiding. I think the point is having integrity. I don`t think John Edwards or Mr. whoever his name is here can spell integrity and the harm it`s done to their families, to their children can`t be measured. I can`t imagine...
SANTAGATI: There`s a lot worse things going on there.
WADE: Someone with this low integrity running the country.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me say this.
Jim Moret, have we created a system where we create these sort of caricature stereotypes of, what a family man`s supposed to be, so that if somebody were to say, you know what, my marriage is falling apart, I`m having an affair, that would doom him from becoming president of the United States?
MORET: No, I think if he were honest at the beginning I don`t think he would be skewered right now. The fact is he had his aide cover up for him, lie for him about who is the father of this baby, made a tape that did come out. His own aide is now betraying him by saying, "I have a sex tape, too, and I`ve written a book."
No, I think he made mistake after mistake and lie after lie.
SANTAGATI: Yes, but Jane`s right. Jane`s right the fact what she`s saying about the fact he was under pressure because everybody thinks a family man is supposed to act a certain way. That`s not how it works.
WADE: It can work that way if you`re a mature man. I don`t agree. I think maturity and integrity are something you grow into and that doesn`t include betraying your wife, your family, your children.
Look at the harm that`s been done here. We can`t be casual about the harm that`s caused when there`s no emotional maturity. Grow up.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I certainly am not condoning what he did. I think it`s hideous and I think it`s just awful to what he did to his children, to this poor little baby, Quinn. But by the same token, you know, you hear about politicians actually dating someone just for the purposes of an election so that they can get elected because they have to have that image of they`re either dating somebody or getting married to somebody...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stability.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And it`s phony. It`s a bit phony. We`ve created a lot of phoniness and it`s coming back to bite us I think as a culture. Five seconds -- well, no, not even five seconds.
I think we have to leave it right there. But I want to thank all of you for joining us. And obviously we`re going to stay on top of this story...
SANTAGATI: So to speak.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Thank you for that one, Jim.
END
