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JOY BEHAR SHOW

Former Child Stars Discuss Drug Problems

Aired March 31, 2010 - 21:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


VALERIE BERTINELLI, GUST HOST: Tonight on the JOY BEHAR SHOW, it seems that nearly every day we hear about another child star falling prey to drugs, alcohol and the dark side of Hollywood. But many of them do survive and even prosper. I`ll be joined by four other actors who found fame at an early age and lived to tell the tale. Also I`ll reunite with my favorite Hollywood survivor, someone who was in the fox hole with me at "One Day at a Time," Mackenzie Phillips. And joining me in the studio to discuss all things fabulous, sex symbol, actress and author of "Raquel Beyond (INAUDIBLE)" Raquel Welch. I am so excited. All this, starting now.

Hi, everyone. I`m Valerie Bertinelli filling in for Joy Behar. Working and living under the glare of the bright lights of Hollywood can be stressful sometimes and that`s especially true if you grew up that way. The most recent case in point, Lindsay Lohan. Her father made a public plea yesterday for his daughter to get some help. Really, that`s not going to help her. So why is it that so many child actors seem to have a tough time transitioning into real life? Joining me to discuss this and much more are David Faustino. As a kid he played Bud Bundy on "Married With Children." He is now a star and producer of the web series "Starving." Erin Moran, Joanie from the legendary sitcom "Happy Days." Christopher Knight grew up as Peter Brady on the "Brady Bunch" and my girl, my co-star from "One Day at a Time," Mackenzie Phillips. Hi baby.

MACKENZIE PHILLIPS, PLAYED JULIE ON "ONE DAY AT A TIME: Hey Val. How are you doing?

BERTINELLI: How are you doing honey?

PHILLIPS: Really good.

BERTINELLI: So let`s start with the first question. By the way, how fun was that Super Bowl party?

PHILLIPS: Oh my God, that was a blast (INAUDIBLE).

BERTINELLI: Listen, we have a little bit of experience with this, but why do you think that child stars past and present are probably a little bit more -- do you think they`re more erratic than regular children across America?

PHILLIPS: This is an interesting question because there`s a little bit of both. We hear more about child stars because they`re in the public life. The kind of behaviors that are going on with child stars are going on in families and communities everywhere, but I believe that the spotlight exacerbates these -- the attention, the money, the age inappropriate people that one might hang out with. I think also if the family isn`t strong enough to be there and pull that kid back, then you`re going to have a recipe for disaster, case in point.

BERTINELLI: I was very lucky. We both experimented with drugs together, but my parents, God bless them, they were really -- you know my mom and dad.

PHILLIPS: Yeah, I sure do.

BERTINELLI: I love them. They really saved me and they helped me. So do you think that drug use is more prevalent with child stars than it is -- it is pretty prevalent. Look at what`s going on in Mexico right now.

PHILLIPS: I`m sure that it`s very prevalent. I know it`s very prevalent with child actors. We read about it every day and the prescription drug abuses that are going on all over the country, all over the world are terrifying. But I`m not sure. I mean, I don`t know the statistics, but it sure seems like it`s more prevalent with child stars. But then again, I mean look on every street corner in every neighborhood in America and you`re going to find some kid acting out with drugs.

BERTINELLI: Right, right. Then it comes back to parents, again. Chris, are you there? Can we talk to you?

CHRISTOPHER KNIGHT, PLAYED PETER ON "THE BRADY BUNCH": I`m here.

BERTINELLI: What do you think is the most important factor, keeping the child star straight and narrow, the caring parents, the manager. By the way, hi, Chris. It`s been a long time. What about education? What do you think is going to keep a child star on the straight and narrow?

KNIGHT: How do we all break out? It`s the individual. I mean, if an individual is prone to be an addictive personality, I don`t know if a parent has much -- I mean, that`s nature, not necessarily nurture.

BERTINELLI: Did you ever have a problem with drugs?

KNIGHT: I grew up in the `70s and `80s.

BERTINELLI: I hear you, boy. I hear you. Hello.

KNIGHT: Sort of just experimented, but I`m not an addictive personality so I didn`t have an ongoing problem with drugs. But I do believe that because we`re, you know -- we have means and through those means we`re able to do more damage. We have -- there are more people that hang on and that are perhaps not the greatest influences. I call them the glow stealers.

BERTINELLI: I caught them breathers.

KNIGHT: When your career is growing, you kind of have a glow and there are friends around you might like to think are friends but, in fact, they`re there for that glow and around for what you might be able to provide.

BERTINELLI: Right. I`m sorry, Chris. Did you want to finish?

KNIGHT: It`s OK. I`m good.

BERTINELLI: Cory Haim and Brittany Murphy they just recently died possibly from drugs. So like I asked them, do you think that substance abuse is common in child stars?

DAVID FAUSTINO, PLAYED BUD ON "MARRIED WITH CHILDREN": I think substance abuse is common across the board like Chris said. I think a lot of people -- some people have addictive personalities and do a lot of drugs. I know other actors who don`t do any. However, the difference I think is that --

BERTINELLI: You have to be on camera.

FAUSTINO: We`re on camera. Everybody is offering it to you and you have money. Drugs cost a lot of money and you`re able to afford them, which makes you -- so I think if there`s a difference, that might be it. And just the fact that, you know, you`re used to getting your way all the time.

BERTINELLI: Very few people say no to you. You go to a set, and it`s like can I have some water. People are bringing you things and you get used to this entitlement.

FAUSTINO: Absolutely.

BERTINELLI: I think kids feel entitled anyway. So when you put them in that environment, the entitlement just kind of exponentially grows.

FAUSTINO: Exactly, exactly.

KNIGHT: You`re able to rebel.

ERIN MORAN, PLAYED JOANIE ON "HAPPY DAYS": They bring you water and stuff?

BERTINELLI: They didn`t do that on "Happy Days"?

MORAN: No. Maybe for Henry but not me.

BERTINELLI: So do you think -- take Michael Lohan for instance. It can`t be easy being Lindsay with a father like that. Do you think parents add to the problems of child stars?

MORAN: Yes. Of course they do.

BERTINELLI: Really. What are your parents like?

MORAN: My mom was always on set. She took me to all the interviews and she was always on set for me.

BERTINELLI: That`s my mom. She gave up her life for that.

MORAN: She gave up her life for me. I`ve got parents coming up to me and saying, look at my kid. I want to put them in the business. I say, well, OK. Here`s the choice. All right? You take -- you got to be with that child night and day, day and night, and you be there for them because otherwise they`re going to be screwed.

BERTINELLI: You have to be that soft place to fall. That`s what my parents always were. I don`t believe -- I mean there`s some people that are able to do it -- I don`t know. I don`t know if any of your parents were your managers. Mine never were.

MORAN: No.

BERTINELLI: Because I needed mom and dad at home. I couldn`t have them be my managers. I had very good managers that, they weren`t my parents and I think that made a very big difference. Because whatever my manager told me -- sometimes he had to be brutal, but I always had mom and dad to go back for that soft place to fall. It doesn`t look like some of them have that.

FAUSTINO: I want to add to that. My parents luckily as crazy as they are -- we`re all crazy. I was raised by a really strict like Italian, Sicilian Catholic father. He was all over me. That was actually a saving grace, because I couldn`t get away with a lot, because my dad would just kick my butt.

BERTINELLI: Yeah. So Chris, do you think it`s easier being a child star with peers because you worked with a lot of kids. I know it made it easier for me and Mack to work together I think right Mack?

PHILLIPS: Absolutely.

BERTINELLI: I think we hung out with the guys from what show was that -- that we did school with?

PHILLIPS: Sam and what`s his name.

BERTINELLI: Yeah.

PHILLIPS: You know.

BERTINELLI: But we had school on the set with another show that was filming at Tandem.

FAUSTINO: By the way, I want to say hi, Mackenzie. We haven`t seen each other since acting class.

PHILLIPS: How`s it going?

MORAN: I want to say hi to you, too, Mackenzie.

PHILLIPS: Hey, Erin.

MORAN: How you doing honey?

PHILLIPS: Aren`t we friends on Facebook?

MORAN: Yes, we are. Yes, baby.

BERTINELLI: I can`t do Facebook.

MORAN: My husband does it.

BERTINELLI: It`s enough that I can tweet. Chris, I want to bring you into this again. Do you think it`s easier being a child star because you worked with so many, obviously. It`s a story of a married lady. So as opposed to being the only child star on the set?

KNIGHT: Absolutely. I think in our case, because we had such a wholesome environment built for us, it actually was a structured, decent environment. I wouldn`t allow my kids to be in the industry if I had any because the chances of having an environment like we had with "The Brady Bunch" are rather remote. I wouldn`t send a child into show business to find health, but because we had kids on the set, we were able to be kids. Still, you`re introducing a child to an adult environment with adult pressures and adult stresses. I think that there is a time for a child to be a child and adulthood is going to come soon enough anyway. In our particular case, though, because there were other kids, we had some semblance of normalcy around us.

PHILLIPS: I want to say think about the socialization of school, right? Sending your kid off to school in the morning and Valerie and I, we attended school together in an office with a teacher for all of high school. I think that there you`re missing out on a great deal and I always used to say I don`t know what it would have been like because I didn`t do it. I didn`t go to a high school football game. I didn`t do those things.

BERTINELLI: I did do those things, because half the year when we weren`t doing "One Day," I was going back to high school. I would go to my brother`s games. I brought you to a few of them.

PHILLIPS: I was at a school which was on Hollywood Boulevard and Western. When you think about the different things that we experience as children and the different way that our experiences color our future, retrospectively I always said I didn`t know what it would have been like because missed it. My son got to do all of those things and I remember he came to me -- our next-door neighbor was an actor. And he said mom I want to be an actor. I was like OK. You want me to pick you up at school and you go home and you get dressed and we`re going to go to auditions and then you are going to come home and do your schoolwork and then you`re going to take a bath and go to bed. And he was like, when am I going to I ride my bike? And I said exactly. I want him to look back and he`s able to do that and say I had a blast when I was a kid. Instead of I worked really hard when I was a kid.

BERTINELLI: He`s an excellent young man. You did well honey.

PHILLIPS: Thank you, so did you.

BERTINELLI: Mackenzie thank you. We`re going to be back with more in a minute. Love you.

FAUSTINO: Bye Mackenzie.

PHILLIPS: Bye guys.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERTINELLI: I`m back discussing how to survive child stardom and why so many young actors have trouble with that. Joining the conversation is Lisa Whelchel who played Blair Warner on "Facts of Life." She is the author of "Friendship for Grownups." Hi Lisa. How are you doing?

LISA WHELCHEL, PLAYED BLAIR ON "THE FACTS OF LIFE": I`m great Valerie. How are you doing?

BERTINELLI: Nice to see you.

MORAN: Hi, Lisa.

WHELCHEL: Hello.

BERTINELLI: Erin.

MORAN: I know. Let`s not bring that up.

BERTINELLI: So Lisa, do you think it was embarrassing to go through puberty in front of the world?

WHELCHEL: Oh, yeah. Going through puberty is hard enough. Going through puberty on television is just a whole other level, yes.

BERTINELLI: You want to tell me a little bit about your book, because I think it`s a very interesting theory because I feel the same way a little bit about you. It`s a friendship for grownups. I don`t think we really learned how to be friends because we were around so many adults growing up. A quick synopsis of your book.

WHELCHEL: It`s just my personal story kind of like what Mackenzie was talking about. I didn`t go to junior high and high school, so I didn`t learn in a safer environment. I know that`s a relative term how to navigate relationships. And so it wasn`t until my 40s that I realized, wait a minute what I missed out on my childhood, I really didn`t miss out on what it means to know how to be a friend and to have a friend. So I jumped in thinking, OK, I want to learn about friendship. Let me just say learning about friendships in your 40s is incredibly awkward and embarrassing just like in junior high, but now you`re in your 40s. So it`s my own journey, but what I discovered though is a lot of grown-up women feel like they don`t know how to do friendships either and they didn`t grow up on a set. Maybe they had different reasons for not understanding how to navigate the friendship. So I guess it`s kind of a blessing, because I have some hindsight and experience to be able to watch from the outside in of what it is like to learn how to do friendships in your 40s.

BERTINELLI: A great idea for a book. You can help a lot of us. Thank you.

WHELCHEL: Thank you.

BERTINELLI: Erin, do you think that it`s harder or more difficult being a female child star than it is to be a male child star? Maybe you can give us --

MORAN: Gosh, yeah. Are you kidding me?

KNIGHT: I have to disagree on this one.

MORAN: Look at Scott Baio. All the men, the boys, they have such an easier time than women.

KNIGHT: Not Cory Haim.

BERTINELLI: Chris, you can jump in too (INAUDIBLE).

KNIGHT: How do you make that equation work, really? How do we know? I`ve never lived the life of a woman to really know what it was like to live as a child star as a woman. I think that (INAUDIBLE) I think that it probably is imbalanced the same. I think that women have a lot more attention that can be difficult as a young child and then later growing up into a man, it`s pretty difficult when you`re career is over and you`re disempowered.

BERTINELLI: You know what? You`re right. I think sometimes we don`t give men enough credit or leeway to be a sensitive human being. You want to jump in, David?

FAUSTINO: Again, I mean, I think it`s really up to the individual and how acclimated to life you are. I think it was Christopher or somebody brought up about relationships and that`s, I think, one of the most difficult things. Like you`re so used to getting what you want, you`re so used to people catering to you, no one saying no and then when you get into a relationship with a lover, they start to get tired of that.

BERTINELLI: They get tired of the world revolving around them?

FAUSTINO: Exactly (INAUDIBLE) That`s my most difficult challenge.

BERTINELLI: The world does revolve around me, doesn`t it? Right?

FAUSTINO: Of course.

BERTINELLI: Right, honey? I had it wrong all these years? Chris, do you want to be on -- you did a reality show, correct.

KNIGHT: I did, yeah.

BERTINELLI: Are you still doing it?

KNIGHT: No, I`m not doing it now and sort of decided not to do any for the foreseeable future. That`s so personal. For me, I`m not built for that kind of inspection. My wife is.

BERTINELLI: She can do one, then.

KNIGHT: It`s difficult.

BERTINELLI: OK. Did your parents force you into being in the business, or did you ask them? Did you want to be. How did it go about that you got the job?

KNIGHT: You know, I think I was walking down the street one day and my dad said I got you an agent. My dad was an actor. My dad was a Broadway actor. And you know, I grew up -- I think one of my salvations was I grew up with a father who was a struggling actor, really struggling to the point where with respect to feeding us, he suggested to my mom that she feed us every other day. It`s sort of how he managed his own personal life and it`s ridiculous. I look at actors and they`re like -- they`re in this predicament of being nearly homeless and highly educated by their own doing. If you look at this industry, it`s a terrible industry. The chances are really remote that you`ll ever have the lightning strike.

BERTINELLI: If you look at SAG, I think only 1 percent of actors in SAG actually do make a living at acting. Lisa, before you have to go, you have children, correct?

WHELCHEL: Three.

BERTINELLI: You`re not acting any longer. You`re a stay at home mom, which is by the way, good for you. That`s the hardest job in the world.

WHELCHEL: In commenting on what Chris said, I hadn`t thought about that as far as I had always thought that it was more difficult for girls to be in show business because of the pressure to look a certain way. But I never thought about what Chris said and that makes so much sense to a male that so much of what they do defines who they are. I think that it was easier for me to transition from a hit television show to going into being a wife and mother and that was a whole other wonderful adventure because show business really never did define who I was. It was an easier transition. That makes a lot of sense, why that would be difficult for male actors.

BERTINELLI: Everybody, stick around because there`s going to be more when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERTINELLI: I`m back with a few folks you probably recognize. David, tell me about what you`re doing to -- just tell me about it.

FAUSTINO: I mean, basically what I was saying before, is I think a lot of the angst and the craziness comes from you finish a show and it`s like now what? I had definitely some time in between when I was trying to figure out what I`m going to do with my life and that`s when I was most unhappy and sort of messed up. I think as I --

BERTINELLI: How old were you then?

FAUSTINO: I`m 36 now. So I got off "Married With Children" at 25, I think. So what I found to help me is by putting -- is by finally doing some work and getting creative and creating another outlet and that right there takes so much angst and strain off of trying to land a job.

BERTINELLI: This is your web series.

FAUSTINO: This my web series. I created it for Sony. Sony put it, it`s on crackle.com, it`s on hulu. It`s all over. It`s called "Starving" and it`s basically about me 10 years after "Married With Children" and it`s completely exaggerated over the top crazy, but it`s based on how screwed up child stars can be. I`ve got the full cast of "Married With Children" and --

BERTINELLI: They come by,

FAUSTINO: They come by.

BERTINELLI: That`s very cool.

FAUSTINO: It`s a cool --

BERTINELLI: Do you still talk to Ed O`Neill?

FAUSTINO: I do. We do an episode where they find out they`re casting me for a "Married With Children" movie and of course, I show up on set and they have hired Seth Green to play me.

BERTINELLI: That`s rich. That`s rich.

BERTINELLI: I don`t want to leave this conversation without talking about the positiveness, because we all -- we`re all survivors. We`re up here and there`s some really good role models out there. They`re not all Lindsay Lohan. What advice would any of you have, any, all of you, Lisa, Christopher including that you have for the child stars of today like Miley Cyrus, Denny Labato (ph), Selena Gomez.

FAUSTINO: Are these the positive ones?

BERTINELLI: These are the positive ones. They really are. I met Selena Gomez and I know why she`s such a positive because she`s got two great parents. Tom and I had dinner with them. She`s such a beautiful, graceful young lady. She`s got her head together. Her mom and dad are there with her all the time and not leeching off of her.

MORAN: Not being stage mom or stage dad.

BERTINELLI: What advise can we give to these people that are -- I think people like Lindsay Lohan, I don`t know if she`s past it or not. Can she be helped? Let`s focus on all the good things that are out there.

KNIGHT: I like to think that adulation, if you think of it as a privilege as opposed to something that you deserve, perhaps when it`s not there anymore, you can handle the disappointment. You know, I believe --

BERTINELLI: Your character is built that way. Your character is built is not how many times you fall down but how many times you get up.

MORAN: Get back up on the horse.

KNIGHT: There`s a theory that I know that Gary Marshall believes in very strongly. It`s called the feet of clay. We all are built with feet of clay. We`re all going to fall over and just -- you have to live your life knowing that it`s going to happen.

FAUSTINO: Can I add to that?

BERTINELLI: We have 30 seconds.

FAUSTINO: I was going to add that it`s really a lot of this is attitude. If you`re grateful for this thing and you keep a positive attitude, great things can happen. If you complain about it, you`re going to --

BERTINELLI: I wake up every morning and I say a nice little prayer to God about gratitude. Lisa, how about you?

WHELCHEL: Absolutely. I think also I mentioned a little bit if we`re not defined by what we do and who we are. And a lot of it has to do with whether we are able to connect in relationships and know who we are, and that we`re great whether anybody else says so. It makes all the difference in the world.

BERTINELLI: Absolutely. Thank you so much. Thanks every single one of you. (INAUDIBLE) Up next is the one, the only Raquel Welch.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERTINELLI: Raquel Welch was a sex symbol at 29, but at age 69 this woman is hotter and sexier than ever. If you didn`t - if I didn`t love her so much, I could resent her in a very big way. In her new book, "Raquel Beyond The Cleavage", which is a fabulous title by the way. Raquel opens up and talks about Hollywood, heart breaks, and how to look so damn good, seriously, Raquel welcome. And how do you look so damn good? What a question, right?

RAQUEL WELCH, ACTRESS: I don`t know.

BERTINELLI: OK tell me this then do you feel as good as you look?

WELCH: Well I don`t get up in the morning looking like this. I mean this takes a lot, a lot of effort.

BERTINELLI: I saw you on the airplane, you had almost no makeup on, you looked gorgeous.

WELCH: I had lots of makeup on.

BERTINELLI: No you didn`t -

WELCH: Yes, I did.

BERTINELLI: Tons of Americans. Just give me your secret! God bless America, just give me your secret.

WELCH: I don`t have a secret.

BERTINELLI: I`ll pound it out of you. OK, yes do you feel as good as you look?

WELCH: I do actually.

BERTINELLI: Really?

WELCH: I do, yes, because the older I`ve gotten more comfortable in my skin. Really, honestly.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: Honestly, that is absolutely true. I don`t know why youth is so painful in so many ways. Emotionally I always felt very you know out of sorts and ill at ease, and I was -- I felt like, well, you don`t know a damn thing about what you`re doing, so fake it.

BERTINELLI: Right, right.

WELCH: And while I was faking it, I was in a lot of pain.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: Do you know what I`m talking about?

BERTINELLI: I know exactly what you are talking about. We both started at a very young age. And there was a lot of attention give to us.

WELCH: Yes. You were much younger.

BERTINELLI: You in a much bigger way.

WELCH: No but no, no, not necessarily.

BERTINELLI: Well the - those skinned bikini blew everything out of the water. Yes?

WELCH: That, that was kind of pivotal. Yes, it is true.

BERTINELLI: Yes and wasn`t that your very first big reaction or feeling of what it was like to be in the spotlight?

WELCH: Yes, and it was shocking to me, because I didn`t know that it was happening because I had been away on this volcanic mountain in Tena Refe actually - which is, it`s in the Canary Islands off the coast of Africa. It`s just -- the most remote place you can possibly be. And some production shot that they got of me while I was making this movie --

BERTINELLI: you didn`t know they were taking that picture?

WELCH: Well I knew they were taking a picture, but I never saw the pictures.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: So, then I get off the plane coming back into Heathrow and London, and everybody was like Raquel, Raquel. Raquel, Raquel -

BERTINELLI: Wow.

WELCH: And I was going how do they know my name? What is happening here?

BERTINELLI: Wow.

WELCH: And I was like, what, what? Yes, yes, pretty soon I realized the whole thing had happened because of this one single photograph.

BERTINELLI: Extraordinary picture.

WELCH: But you know what`s strange about that is it is a picture. It`s just an inanimate object.

BERTINELLI: It`s a split second of your life.

WELCH: Exactly because of that, not that I wasn`t really happy for the break, because I was a single mother with two small kids and I was like praying, please, god, I mean let me break through this pretty quick because I don`t think I can stand much more of this.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: And but by the same token, I really -- it was not something I wanted necessarily to be. I found it flattering.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: I found it very, very lucky, and fortuitous, but I also felt like, wow, they, it`s all about that, the way I look?

BERTINELLI: And what happen here, like about what`s in here? Do you care about that?

WELCH: Yes but how do you live up to that? They keep saying these amazing crazy things like what you just said about me, I`m like the second coming or something, you know, I`m so beautiful, and so fabulous.

BERTINELLI: You are.

WELCH: come on. So now it`s after that every morning you`d wake up and go, oh. How are you going to leave the house?

BERTINELLI: Do you feel the pressure because --

WELCH: Yes, you do.

BERTINELLI: And well, how about - as age - thank you for being so up- front about your age by the way. Because I always have been. I`ve been around too long to lie about my age. But you actually had a hard time coming out. You came out when you were 40, and you had a difficult time with that. Not you, but everybody else did. You were happy.

WELCH: Well I thought I looked pretty good, and I thought what`s the problem? Let`s celebrate this.

BERTINELLI: Exactly.

WELCH: Let`s say 40 is nothing, baby. This is terrific.

BERTINELLI: This is what 40 looks like.

WELCH: You know come on, girls. The water is fine. Jump in.

BERTINELLI: Right, right.

WELCH: The water is fine. 40 is really -- you got a bad rap, and especially for my generation you`re younger than me by a long shot. But you know we had already started this whole fitness revolution. We were into it. So we looked a lot different than my mother did when she was 40.

BERTINELLI: Exactly. Uh huh.

WELCH: And that has just sort of progressed on down the line. Plus, all the other innovations that have come into the picture so that you`re just not looking the same way as your grandmother or mom did at the same age.

BERTINELLI: No.

WELCH: And I think that it`s good not because I think we should be in denial but because I think that it`s really just the fact that you want to participate in life. You don`t want to be put on the sidelines.

BERTINELLI: Right, at any age.

WELCH: No. If you can be interested in other people and other things and, you know, it gives you something to live for in a way.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: It can be a man, but it doesn`t have to be a man.

BERTINELLI: Yes, you talk about that in your book, too.

WELCH: Yes, I do because --

BERTINELLI: Where you finally came to a realization at one age where you thought, you know, what, I don`t have to live myself for -- live for a man to be who I really need to be.

WELCH: Exactly that. And because I realized after I got to whatever age it was -- I think it was 50.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: It took me that long. I was so --

BERTINELLI: Hey, I`m there with you. I`m going to be 50 next month, and I`m finally think I`m starting to get --

WELCH: I could be your mother.

BERTINELLI: Well, yes, you should be. You could be.

WELCH: I could be and yes. I would be happy to have you as my daughter.

BERTINELLI: Oh thank you.

WELCH: I would, I would be very proud.

BERTINELLI: I`d love it.

WELCH: I would be proud.

BERTINELLI: I love you too, mom. But yes, go ahead, please. God we`re so much alike in so many ways.

WELCH: I know, you -- it`s true. Yes but go ahead.

BERTINELLI: No, I wanted to get back to -- because I think it is important that we do honor and celebrate our age at every age, but you got a little bit of a backlash when you came out at 40.

WELCH: I did because everything seemed to be working great for me. And then there was a little altercation with me in a studio.

BERTINELLI: Do you want to talk about "Canary Row"? You don`t have to.

WELCH: Well I could.

BERTINELLI: You don`t have to.

WELCH: But it`s so complicated. But just I was in this movie with Nick Nolte called "Cannery Row." And at one point, I think it was about a month into production, or something like that. They just called one Sunday and removed me from the picture and didn`t give a reason.

BERTINELLI: Hmmm.

WELCH: And then later on they puts in the trades and around in some of the entertainment magazines and publications well I just couldn`t cut it as an actress and I was always late.

BERTINELLI: That`s wrong.

WELCH: So my the way my professionalism was in question.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: My abilities as an actress were in question. And none of that was at all true.

BERTINELLI: And you`re being attacked.

WELCH: Yes but when it finally got to court and I went -- I took them to court over it, what came up was this famous thing that they thought everybody would relate to in the jury, and that was that, well, you know, she`s 40 years old. You know she was 40 years old. I mean, she was too old --

BERTINELLI: We should put her out to pasture now.

WELCH: She was to old to play this part. Now mind you I was playing opposite Nick Nolte. I thought I was age-appropriate to play opposite Nick.

BERTINELLI: You were age appropriate - and they ended up giving it to a much younger actress.

WELCH: Well that`s OK.

BERTINELLI: It`s not her fault. Yes, yes.

WELCH: No, no, that part I don`t mind. I mean if I were producer I wouldn`t mind having Deborah Winger in my role - in my part either.

BERTINELLI: But not after you`ve been going at it for a month - OK let`s talk about, men --

WELCH: They just used the age thing.

BERTINELLI: Right and they shouldn`t have.

WELCH: Yes.

BERTINELLI: You write in your book that you`re not the kiss and tell kind. You know which is true because this book is so much more than just that. That`s what I love about it. But I still want to hear about the men. You spent a lot of time with very, very handsome leading men. So can I just go down the list and you give me a couple words about them.

WELCH: Yes well you were married to a pretty dishy guy yourself?

BERTINELLI: I was and now I got a real dishy guy, too. You haven`t met him yet, he`s back there. He`s like yes, Tom, peek your head over, honey.

WELCH: Tom, show -

BERTINELLI: Just peek your head over, Tom. There he is right there. I don`t know if you can see him. Anyway, very dishy.

WELCH: Tom.

BERTINELLI: Anyway let me hear just a few words about each one, if you don`t mind. Dean Martin.

WELCH: Well yes, Dean was a doll.

BERTINELLI: There`s a fabulous picture of you and Dean in here.

WELCH: Yes well, when I was a little girl growing up, you know, Dean Martin was like just this fabulous crooner, and then I got to do in movie with him and Jimmy Stewart at the same time. I hit the jackpot.

BERTINELLI: Oh in heaven.

WELCH: I went, oh, my goodness. You know where did I go right? Then, you know, he was my love interest. He was just the height of cool. That what I loved about him. He was want a grandstander.

BERTINELLI: Very mellow and smooth and --

WELCH: But the thing that was interesting about him is even though he didn`t come on strong and kind of like, you know, some of the -

BERTINELLI: Like some men can.

WELCH: Like some the Italian men that we know that may swash buckle around a little bit.

BERTINELLI: I`m with an Italian Sicilian now. So I know exactly what you are talking about.

WELCH: Well he always had this kind of quiet power, and people would come to him.

BERTINELLI: Yes, yes.

WELCH: So everybody would gravitate to Dean, because he wasn`t going to you. He was -- and you just came to him because he could wait there like the king.

BERTINELLI: Speaking of that, how about Frank Sinatra?

WELCH: Well Frank was so charismatic. I mean, I had a total crush on him.

BERTINELLI: Really?

WELCH: Oh, yes. We were in Miami making this movie called "Lady In Cement" which should have remained in cement.

(LAUGHTER)

WELCH: It should be dropped to the bottom of the ocean somewhere and stay there had. But he, I mean -

BERTINELLI: You got to play with Frank.

WELCH: Who could turn that down.

BERTINELLI: Yes.

WELCH: You know, working with old blue eyes.

BERTINELLI: And then another one, Elvis?

WELCH: Well yes. I was just -- I had nothing to do in that part. I was just gaga because he`d been my first big heartthrob when I was you know a teenager growing up at 13. I had all his records.

BERTINELLI: Sure, right, so did he flirt with you?

WELCH: That`s 45 --

BERTINELLI: Right. I remember 45s.

WELCH: You don`t.

BERTINELLI: Yes I do, I had my first 45 was Ben by Michael Jackson. Absolutely.

WELCH: Oh I couldn`t - I didn`t think they had that long.

BERTINELLI: Yes, I`m only 19 years behind you. Not that far. How about Burt Reynolds.

WELCH: Oh I love Burt.

BERTINELLI: Yes, Burt has a great sense of humor right?

WELCH: He`s got a great sense of humor and I really think the man has a heart of gold. He really does.

BERTINELLI: Yes. OK.

WELCH: He`s got a softness there. He`s got a very compassionate quality.

BERTINELLI: That`s nice to know. That`s nice to know.

WELCH: If he feels like anybody`s vulnerable or, you know, insecure or anything or they might be getting a bad rap somehow in the way they`re being treated on the set, he`s just right there.

BERTINELLI: He`s there, that`s nice to know.

WELCH: He`s great.

BERTINELLI: OK we are going to sit tight. We have a lot more to talk about, so you`re not going away. Back with the fabulous Raquel Welch after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERTINELLI: I am back with the legendary and timeless beauty and now author Raquel Welch. It was hard to believe when you first came to Hollywood, you were turned down by modeling agencies?

WELCH: Oh, yes.

BERTINELLI: Are they insane?

WELCH: They didn`t like my shape at all. I was not tall enough to be a model, and they didn`t like my shoulders too broad and my bosom too big and waist too small.

BERTINELLI: And now everybody is trying to look like you.

WELCH: Well, but you know they would not let me show clothes? I had to be only the fitting model. They kept me in the back room and pinned the garments on me but they would not let me walk the catwalk.

BERTINELLI: That`s unbelievable to me.

WELCH: They wouldn`t let me wear their clothes. Seriously, I had a severe complex. I did well --

BERTINELLI: Because someone else is telling you what beauty is to them, and you knowing.

WELCH: Yes.

BERTINELLI: That`s what -- did that take you more on a journey of figuring out what beauty really is?

WELCH: Well you know it`s funny because I had one beauty contest like in my hometown.

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: Love Ms. La Hoya, and miss San Diego and even you know Miss California at one point, but you know, I thought well, it`s just -- when you`re a small town beauty contest winner, that`s one thing. When you`re in Hollywood, the standard is so much higher. You`re just not going to be able to get arrested. So I never, ever thought about that, if you know what I mean.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: OK, I thought I`m passable. But I have talent, and I`m going to prove it. Well, they didn`t give a damn about my talent. They so didn`t care.

BERTINELLI: What`s that great story with -- oh, my god. It was a director I worked with, too. I think I have it in my notes. Don Chafee.

WELCH: Oh you worked with him?

BERTINELLI: I did. I did a movie with him too.

WELCH: Kidding.

BERTINELLI: What did you say to him when you had an idea for --

WELCH: Oh Don I`ve been looking at a script and I have this idea. And he said and I`ve been thinking.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: And he said, don`t. Please, do not think. You see that rock over there? That is rock A. Over here is rock B. When I call action, you run from rock A to rock B. When you get in the middle, you envision a giant turtle coming over the hill. You scream, and we break for lunch. Got it?

BERTINELLI: Lovely, lovely.

WELCH: That was it.

BERTINELLI: What did you say to him? Did you just shut your trap and go okay, this is going fob interesting?

WELCH: I was so livid I thought better of saying anything, because I had a few things, choice words, and I thought maybe not.

BERTINELLI: It`s amazing. Now you have a voice, right? You have your voice? You use your voice.

WELCH: That`s why I wanted to write this. Not that I`m some poor put upon sex symbol. No, not at all.

BERTINELLI: Well tell me why you wanted to write the book. Because it is interesting that you waited this long because your life is incredibly fascinating and it - And I --

WELCH: Well I hadn`t lived enough really.

BERTINELLI: Biography. Right, right.

WELCH: I hadn`t lived enough really. I do think that it takes a while -- at least for me, I`m a slow learner.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: I thought it took me a while to really understand very much about myself and about how I felt about lots of things and to come to my own ideas because I didn`t -- I have this thing against borrowed opinions. You know there`s so many other people that have opinions about things.

BERTINELLI: That`s a good phrase.

WELCH: And I believe a lot of us are much happier to adopt a borrowed opinion so we don`t really have to really think about it ourselves.

BERTINELLI: Or try to stay in the pack. We are not as - right.

WELCH: And we don`t want to go against the herd, we don`t want a different point of view because it might not be popular.

BERTINELLI: Be different, right.

WELCH: And as it goes back to high school. I just kept thinking, I`ve got to graduate and find out what I really feel. And so it took me a while to get it to that.

BERTINELLI: And you wrote this all by yourself?

WELCH: I did. And I think it came from the fact when I go out and promote a project of any kind, I find that women kind of, you know, will wait outside for me and ask me a lot of questions about a broad range of things.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh, we`re very interesting creatures, aren`t we?

WELCH: I think we are, and there`s a sisterhood. And they seem to want to share. And I thought, you know, if they really seem to think that they`d like to know more about what I think and what my point of view is and how I do this and that, well, maybe I should share it.

BERTINELLI: Thank you for sharing, too. You talk about frownies. I don`t -

WELCH: Uh huh.

BERTINELLI: I think -- we`ll just talk quickly about the way some women look in Hollywood now. And I look at you, and you look like Raquel Welch. You haven`t changed your face. You are not like this -- it`s not like where did Raquel go. You look at some women, and I`m not going to talk about some of these women because -

WELCH: We can`t.

BERTINELLI: I`m not going to there`s no - I mean that`s not nice. But you look at them and you go, what happen, where is that face, where is that face we fell in love with.

WELCH: It`s sad.

BERTINELLI: When you talk about frownies on Mike Man, I`m going to go get some frownies. If that`s what works.

WELCH: But -

BERTINELLI: But plastic surgery has become so crazy in the town that I live in, it makes me run the other way.

WELCH: Yes I think you`re right. The thing is people do stuff they don`t need to do.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: You know -

BERTINELLI: You talk about all different kinds of procedures here, what`s good, what you think is appropriate for women, what you should stay away from. You`ve did research on this for us.

WELCH: I did a lot of research on this thing because I think it fascinating women, and because women have choices to make. And it doesn`t hurt for you to try to maintain your property.

BERTINELLI: Of course not.

WELCH: You know, but you know, do so with, you know careful choices because it`s not something you can fool around with and get away with.

BERTINELLI: It`s your face. It`s the first thing people see.

WELCH: You see great beauties and very famous faces that suddenly are --

BERTINELLI: They don`t look like that any longer.

WELCH: They`ve ruined the -

BERTINELLI: What we love -

WELCH: Yes, they`ve ruined exactly the thing that we loved about them

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: And probably that thing they hated most about themselves -

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: As it always turns out. There was one wonderful director (inaudible) who --

BERTINELLI: Hang on to that story.

WELCH: OK.

BERTINELLI: They`re telling me right now we have to go. I want this story.

WELCH: OK.

BERTINELLI: I want to hear it. We`ll be right back. Don`t go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERTINELLI: I`m back with the beautiful Raquel Welch. Inside and out she is beautiful. So tell me the Vittorio de Sica story.

WELCH: Well Victorio was working with me on a movie. And he`s a fantastic director. And I was very self-conscious. And he came to me one day and he said, Raquel why do you try to change yourself? And I said, well I want to be perfect. You know, people are watching me and I want to talk right and I want to move right. I want everything to be right and I want to - and he says ah, but darling, the defector is so important.

BERTINELLI: Oh. I like him. I like -- because that`s what makes us original and unique --

WELCH: Yes. And I thought, oh, he`s so right.

BERTINELLI: Yes.

WELCH: I always wanted an uppy nose but I have a downy nose. And I thought, you know -

BERTINELLI: Right.

WELCH: I always wanted this, that about myself to be different. I wanted my voice to be registered down in.

BERTINELLI: Oh, I`ve always wanted to lower my voice.

WELCH: There are all these things you think about yourself. And this is the thing that`s happened now with the complex of plastic surgery. Is we find this funny little things that we hate about each other.

BERTINELLI: Get rid of it.

WELCH: About ourselves, and then we go and fixate on it and decide we`re going to change it and it ruins the whole --

BERTINELLI: It ruins the entire look of your face. Right but without ruing your face, let`s be a little bit more clear about frownies. Since I never - you talk about them in the book.

WELCH: The frownies are really quite amazing. Because they`ve been around since I think the `20s. OK, Gloria Swanson was --

BERTINELLI: Yes, you have a great story.

WELCH: I do. But here`s the way they operate. They`re just little kind of patches.

BERTINELLI: Like band aids?

WELCH: They`re not band aids. Because they have a harder surface if you could -- they`re not pliable --

BERTINELLI: They`re tougher. OK they`re not pliable.

WELCH: They`re not pliable. And they have a stickiness on the one side of them. So that what you do is wet that wet side and stick them here.

BERTINELLI: Uh huh.

WELCH: You can stick them here, you can stick them here, you can stick them here --

BERTINELLI: All the places I need them.

WELCH: And those are the main areas that you get lines.

BERTINELLI: Noninvasively as opposed to putting Botox in your face.

WELCH: Yes. Here`s the thing, you know what Botox does, it sends little poison --

BERTINELLI: Yes, you`re putting poison in your face.

WELCH: Exactly. What it does is it paralyzes the muscles so it can`t contract. Well the frownie just doesn`t let the muscle contract. So by not contracting it doesn`t form the wrinkle.

BERTINELLI: Right. Well I`m getting some. This has been way too quick. I wish you could be here for the entire hour. I`d pick your brain forever. I love it.

WELCH: You`ve been a doll, I`ve enjoyed it.

BERTINELLI: Thank you so much for her new book "Raquel Beyond The Cleavage." please go buy it, it is such a great read, I loved it. Now before I go, you probably caught Joy on the "Tonight Show" last night. But what you did not see is what happened backstage. And luckily we had a camera following her. And you can catch all the behind the scene action by going to cnn.com/joy. Here`s a sneak peek.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: Do you feel upset about Conan? Do you feel bad about Conan?

JAY LENO, HOST: Conan got screwed. I got screwed. This is TV. The reason show business pays a lot of money, so when you get screwed you have something left over.

BEHAR: That`s right.

LENO: If you`re a nurse or cop and get screwed out of your pension you`re screwed out of your pension. TV, you walk away with money. Conan was treated terribly. I was treated terribly. Guys make a decision.

BEHAR: Right.

LENO: I think Conan will come back and be strong and we`ll all compete against one another. Should be me against Letterman against Conan against Kimmel and you see who wins. You know how that works.

BEHAR: Kimmel was a little bit of a turncoat.

LENO: Yes.

BEHAR: He`s a comic. We`re all comedians.

LENO: We`re comedians. All comics are friends. When you go on stage your job is to blow the other guy of the stage. I get it. That`s the way it works.

BEHAR: Yes.

LENO: You don`t impede somebody else`s opportunity.

BEHAR: No.

LENO: But it`s when you go out there, that`s what you do.

BEHAR: Right. See now you don`t have to come on my show. We just did the interview.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERTINELLI: Thank you, all, so much for watching. Good night, everybody.

END