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Joy Behar Page
Joran Behind Bars; Miley Photo Controversy
Aired June 17, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: Tonight, Joran Van Der Sloot is locked up in a prison that would make Abu Ghraib look like Club Med. Gee, that`s too bad.
Then Perez Hilton tweets a photo of Miley Cyrus looking like she`s not wearing underwear and gets 2 million views. But it turns out, Miley was wearing panties all along. Perez, you got some explaining to do.
What do Helen Thomas and Kathy Griffin have in common? Well, they both blurt out whatever comes into their heads. Kathy will join me for a little one on one.
That and more right now.
If Joran Van Der Sloot is convicted of the murder of Stephany Flores, he could eventually find himself in Peru`s most notorious prison, considered to be one of the worst and the most dangerous jails in the world.
Here now to talk about that and the latest from Peru is Jean Casarez, correspondent for "In Session" on TruTV.
Jean, you took a tour today of the prison, and I understand that you saw Van Der Sloot there. The Castro Castro prison, right?
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": I did.
BEHAR: Tell me about that.
CASAREZ: I did. I just, just got out, Joy. We just got back a little bit ago. And we did get exclusive access into Castro Castro. There really were no limits except some of the cells that had four to six inmates, for security reasons. They didn`t want to take us into those general population areas.
But we did see Joran Van Der Sloot.
Here`s how it all happened. They were giving us access to go into his cell, which we did. I was in his cell, Joy. But they moved him out of the cell so we could go in, and that`s when he walked outside and we got some shots of him.
He had an orange shirt on. It looked like a brand new shirt; he had light colored pants on. Really stood out, Joy, from everybody else that was there.
But he was pushed into another room. We went into his cell. His cell was -- it`s very small, but it wasn`t as bad as it could have been.
BEHAR: Really?
CASAREZ: It had a cot, it had a mattress and it was probably five, six inches. And it was a really soft mattress. I kept putting my hand on it to see what it was like -- what it would be like to sleep on it. It was comfortable.
He had --
BEHAR: Maybe you want to move in, Jean.
CASAREZ: He had hooks on the wall. It wasn`t that.
He had hooks on the wall.
Listen to this. He had hooks on the wall and his clothing were on the hooks on the wall. And do you remember that red shirt that he had on when he was arrested and we`ve seen him in video? It was hanging right there on the hook. And he had beige pants, they were on the hook.
Now, here`s the bad part. Here`s why I will not be going there, Joy.
BEHAR: Why?
CASAREZ: The toilet was a hole in the floor.
That was the toilet.
So all the stories we`ve heard, it`s true. But there`s a little sink there that had some running water that sort of drips continually. But he had water. And he had shampoo. I saw deodorant, I saw two containers that looked like they were toothpaste on his bed, brand new, still in their boxes. The Bible was on his bed.
BEHAR: Oh, sure.
CASAREZ: A number of books were on his bed, mainly in Dutch, but I could tell some of them were religious books.
And right outside, Joy, there was a pastor that had visited him today. A Dutch pastor had flown over from the Netherlands. He was there from now.
He told me that he was here for all of the Dutch prisoners in Peru. He said there are over 100. But lo and behold he comes right now and he spoke with Joran. He wouldn`t tell me what he said. It violated confidentiality. But he said he`ll be back again in November, maybe sooner.
BEHAR: So were there any rats?
CASAREZ: Any what?
BEHAR: My biggest nightmare would be trapped somewhere with a lot of rats. Are there rats in the prison?
CASAREA: Well, here`s what -- first of all, you`re in like a central area and you see all these cells in there. They`re hanging over them basically. Their feet are hanging over, their heads are hanging over, they`re waving. But they told me they never have any problems there. That`s what they said.
They took us to the bakery. You know, they all have different jobs. The bakery or ceramics. And I was -- I mean, they walk freely in there.
And I was amongst murderers, but I spoke with them, interviewed some of them, interviewed someone that was from Los Angeles. Spoke great English, so we got a good interview. He said it`s not that bad here. He`s going to be in for a long time. He`d love to be out. But he`s in charge of his ceramics area making pottery all day.
BEHAR: Really? It sounds like camp.
CASAREZ: It was -- and we have video of it all Joy. It`s really something.
BEHAR: You know, Jean, this whole idea that it was going to be so horrendous, you make it sound like camp for chumpy teen.
(CROSSTALK)
CASAREZ: Yes. I know. And I haven`t even told you about the kitchen and the bakery. You wouldn`t believe it. They wanted us to see these things. That was obvious.
BEHAR: All right.
CASAREZ: They wanted us to go in and see all these things they do for rehabilitation. But the fact is it is one of Peruvian`s high security prisons, that`s the fact.
BEHAR: Ok. I`ll make a reservation next month. Thanks, Jean.
Now, I want to turn to my panel: journalist and syndicated crime columnist Diane Dimond; and international criminal defense attorney Michael Griffin.
Ok. Now, Michael, let me start here with you. You`ve been to all these prisons, right? You have -- you visited them.
MICHAEL GRIFFIN, INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: In over two dozen countries.
BEHAR: Yes. In two dozen countries. So how bad are the Peruvian prisons? She makes it sound like it`s not bad.
GRIFFIN: He`s in a holding -- protective holding area, which is very unusual. After he gets convicted, he`s going to go to Lurigancho, which is where most of the foreign prisoners are. That is entering the gates of hell.
I represented Billy Hayes in the movie "Midnight Express in the Turkish prison". The Turkish prison is like a Ritz Carlton compared to Lurigancho.
BEHAR: Oh, my goodness.
DIANE DIMOND, SYNDICATED CRIME COLUMNIST: There are rats. I`ll bet anything there are rats.
BEHAR: There are rats there. See that would be like a real deal- breaker for me.
(CROSSTALK)
GRIFFIN: How do you mean that?
BEHAR: I mean the four-legged ones.
GRIFFIN: In Lurigancho, there`s going to be 10,000 prisoners for 3,000 spaces. He`s going to be in a dormitory with 600 people in rooms 25x15 with 35 prisoners, 7 or 8 will sleep on the floor, hole in the toilet. Showers -- 12 showers to 600 people. The showers work 15 minutes a week. The food are made in hot tub sized vats where hoses come out of the ground where there`s excrement and insects.
BEHAR: What?
GRIFFIN: When I was down there, they had these groups called the shining path guerrillas who tried to overthrow the country. And I had to - - I had to hire two prison guards to walk through. They had an arrest -- one day they had a little riot, 124 got killed in one day.
DIMOND: A little riot.
BEHAR: Now, Diane, you know Van Der Sloot.
DIMOND: Yes. I have followed this case for a long time.
BEHAR: Do you think he can survive in this type of environment? Is he going to make it?
DIMOND: Well, right now he`s not in that horrible place.
BEHAR: No, but he will be.
DIMOND: He`s in Castro Castro. It was so great, they named it twice for a dictator. But I`ve seen video of that place. And you know, I think he might be all right there because he`s got this special little cell that Jean just described.
And remember, this is a guy who`s 6`5. Looking at the video of people at Castro Castro, these prisoners are emaciated. Many of them don`t have any teeth.
BEHAR: It`s inhuman treatment really.
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: That seems to be above and beyond the punishment level, isn`t it?
DIMOND: Right. And I think right now Van Der Sloot is young, he`s only, what, 23 years old. He`s healthy, he`s 6`5. They`re all 5`10 or something. I think he`ll be ok where he is right now. But once he gets to the big house --
BEHAR: What`s going to happen to him? What`s going to happen to him then?
GRIFFIN: Well, he`s going to be -- when he`s sentenced --
BEHAR: Are they going to rape him?
GRIFFIN: Let me tell you what happened with Castro Castro. Castro Castro had complaints to the inter-American court about brutality towards prisoners. There were 600 lawsuits including 135 women about brutality and beatings and things of that sort. And they were found guilty of this. And they were ordered to pay reparations. There were dead bodies that have never been returned.
BEHAR: My goodness.
GRIFFIN: But if you`re ready for this -- put your seat belt on, Joy. They had a new warden in Castro Castro a couple of years ago. The first day he showed up, he was murdered.
BEHAR: The warden was murdered.
GRIFFIN: He was murdered the first day.
DIMOND: But you see they`ve got Joran Van Der Sloot --
BEHAR: They have no respect.
DIMOND: Not at all. Not at all.
They`ve got Joran Van Der Sloot in a special place right now. He gets his own special brand new orange outfit to wear. He`s getting special food. He`s even getting a clergyman to come in.
So I think that they -- I mean correct me if I`m wrong, Michael, you`re the lawyer here. But I think what they want to do is they want to make sure this kid gets to trial, that he`s convicted, and then all bets are off.
BEHAR: Let`s explore a little bit, the guy that you know about. On ABC`s 20/20, in an interview tomorrow, they`re going to talk to his high school sweetheart, a woman named Melody Granadillo.
DIMOND: I`m glad you had to say that name, and not me.
BEHAR: Yes, see I said it best. She said that he was sweet and romantic. She called him Mr. Wiggles.
DIMOND: Him Mr. Wiggles? Or part of --
BEHAR: So I mean, what could have happened to him? She also said that he cheated on her and that he started to lie. You know, obviously, he lies when he cheats.
What do you make of this guy? Did he turn into this guy that we see now, this alleged killer? Or was he always a bad guy?
DIMOND: Well, I think, if I`m reading what this girlfriend said in the right way, he`s a pathological liar and he has been for a long time. You don`t wake up one day at the age of 20 and say, now I`m a pathological liar. You are born.
And so, the big red flags went up way back then during that relationship and how he related to women. She said, well, we wrote love diaries to each other and we had these nicknames. Oh, yes, ok, what don`t young boys do to get young girls in bed?
BEHAR: Exactly.
DIMOND: You know? So he`s very nice to her and now she`s aghast that he might have a horrible side. Every time there`s a murderer what do the neighbors say?
BEHAR: He was always so nice.
DIMOND: He was so quiet.
BEHAR: Quiet -- we never heard the man.
DIMOND: We called him Mr. Wiggles, for goodness sake.
BEHAR: Until he sneaked in and killed me.
DIMOND: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes.
GRIFFIN: Didn`t Eva Braun call Hitler, Shangri-La (ph) or something --
BEHAR: A love story that won`t disappear.
Mike, was Natalee Holloway`s disappearance the start of this -- like you know, did something happen there that made him even worse than he was then?
DIMOND: Yes.
BEHAR: What happened there? What do you think?
GRIFFIN: With Natalee Holloway?
BEHAR: Yes.
GRIFFIN: I think that night is I think that she had a drug overdose. Because he told Peter (INAUDIBLE) that we put her in the cloth that she was shaking. And --
BEHAR: She had her drug overdose, you think.
GRIFFIN: Yes.
DIMOND: He dosed her, I think. Yes.
GRIFFIN: Yes, he dosed her. And he then got nervous that he`d given her these pills and rather than have to fess up as to what happened, he made some story that she disappeared. That`s why I think that --
BEHAR: And where do you think -- where do you think she is buried or whatever?
GRIFFIN: I think she`s buried in Aruba or -- or was dumped in the ocean.
DIMOND: In the ocean.
GRIFFIN: Yes.
DIMOND: Yes.
BEHAR: So that if he says, oh, I`m going to bargain -- bargain with you in Peru and tell you where Natalee is, who could believe him? Who could believe him?
DIMOND: Unless you find the bones.
BEHAR: Yes.
DIMOND: You know there are too many cliffs to throw a body over where there are sharks below --
BEHAR: Right.
DIMOND: Michael has got a great idea, get our U.S. Embassy to work with the Lima people to get Joran Van Der Sloot in a room and say, you tell us right now and we`ll waive the possibility --
BEHAR: Yes.
DIMOND: -- that we`re going to try you for murder.
BEHAR: Yes, right or we`re sending you to -- what is the name of it?
GRIFFIN: Lurigancho.
(CROSSTALK)
DIMOND: He`s going there anyway.
BEHAR: Ok, thank you guys very much.
DIMOND: Thank you.
BEHAR: Up next, Perez Hilton joins me to explain his role on the Miley Cyrus up skirt scandal.
That was interesting.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up a little later on the "Joy Behar show," the unpredictable Kathy Griffin drops by to talk about how her life on the d-list has propelled her to the top of the A-list. Now back to Joy.
BEHAR: Miley Cyrus, was she or wasn`t she wearing underwear? Only her blogger knows for sure. Perez Hilton caused some controversy this week when he tweeted a provocative photo of 17-year-old Miley Cyrus in which she appeared to be going au natural. He has since removed the image, but the fallout continues.
Joining me to tell his sized of the story is Perez Hilton. Hey, Perez, how are you?
PEREZ HILTON, BLOGGER AND FOUNDER, PEREZHILTON.COM: Hello. Good evening, Joy. I`m happy to be here.
BEHAR: Good.
HILTON: And get to speak about this for the first time.
BEHAR: yes. I`m very happy to have you here to do that.
Now, Miley is actually wearing underwear in the photo, as you have now pointed out, but you pixelated it -- this is my information -- you pixelated it in order to make it look like she wasn`t wearing underwear. Why did you do that?
HILTON: I didn`t pick it for her to look like she wasn`t wearing underwear. The point of me choosing that one photo is because it was showing Miley getting out of the car in an unladylike fashion. And I just thought that was funny and in keeping with her shocking behavior of late because she was very well aware that she was in a public place at a video shoot and that there were paparazzi present.
BEHAR: yes, but the pixelating of it made it look as though there was something there to hide. That`s what it looked like.
HILTON: I did not pixelate anything. I did not photo shop anything. There`s been a lot of inaccuracies being perpetuated about what happened in the media. And I just chose a photo that showed her getting out of the car. You didn`t see anything down there. I can`t help it, Joy, if America has a very dirty imagination.
BEHAR: Ok. Then why did you take it down if it was so innocent?
HILTON: I did not take the photo down. I didn`t even post the photo on my Web site. I want to clear that up as well. I merely linked to a photo that I found on the Internet on my twitter. Then that Web site that I posted a link to; they`re the ones that took it down.
I would have posted the image on my site had I been able to. But it was taken by one photo agency that I don`t have a deal with. So I`ve learned my mistake in the past about using photos that I don`t have licenses to.
BEHAR: Well, I think that it was a mistake to put that picture up there, my own personal opinion. Because it`s one thing to show crotch shots of Paris and Britney, but Miley is only 17 years old. So that there`s a lot of buzz that you could possibly be charged with child pornography. What do you think about that? This is a serious issue, Perez.
HILTON: I think it`s insulting to children to accuse that of child pornography. If you want to look at the definition of child pornography, it is not an image like the one I posted. It is explicit behavior designed to arouse, engaged in sexual activity. You don`t see anything from Miley`s private parts. You just see her in an unflattering vantage view getting out of her car.
BEHAR: But you posted the unflattering vantage view of it. And it could be considered arousing. And you could be in very deep trouble. That`s the point.
HILTON: The point is that it`s not child pornography. And if I was aware that it was or that she was not wearing underwear, I would not have posted it. But I knew the opposite Joy. I saw other photos from that video shoot. I was very well aware of the fact that Miley was wearing underwear.
BEHAR: Ok. You responded to your critics in an online video. Can we look at that?
HILTON: Yes.
BEHAR: Ok.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILTON: Do you think I`m stupid enough to post a photo of Miley if she`s not wearing any underwear down there? No. Sure, I like to be controversial, but I don`t want to go to jail.
People, snap out of it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Now, Perez, you didn`t really apologize there. Are you purposely trying to downplay this now? Is that what you`re doing?
HILTON: I`m learning from my mistakes. I`ve made the videos where I`ve been angry and screaming. So I thought, let me try a different approach when addressing this situation.
BEHAR: Yes, because you`re a little scared, I think, huh?
HILTON: No, I`m not scared at all.
BEHAR: No?
HILTON: I don`t regret what I did. I would do the same thing again.
BEHAR: You would put that picture up again?
HILTON: I would. In fact, if the photo agency that took that photo let me, I would, because it`s not showing anything inappropriate. It`s not actually doing anything worse than Miley herself has been doing recently from grinding up on her 40-something year-old director, to pole dancing, to all the over-sexualized things that she has been doing and turning herself into this creature.
BEHAR: Well, Miley has responded to the controversy on Ryan Seacrest`s radio show. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
RYAN SEACREST, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Do you care when people criticize how provocative everything is?
MILEY CYRUS, SINGER: Well, the record isn`t provocative. So if you like --
SEACREST: I don`t know. I saw some pictures of you somewhere on stage.
CYRUS: Well, there`s always going to -- that`s not my record. That`s like some idiot being an idiot. That`s not me. You know what I`m saying?
So like, for my record, you`re buying that. You`re not buying whatever somebody with no life that -- isn`t that funny that things like that that are so negative have to come out right before my record?
BEHAR: Ok. Perez, stay right there, we`ll continue this discussion in just a minute. You can respond then.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with blogger and provocateur Perez Hilton. Now, you know, in that little sound that I showed you, she`s basically saying you`re an idiot.
HILTON: I would agree with her.
BEHAR: Ok. Good.
HILTON: I would say I`m a very big idiot.
BEHAR: Now you`re on the right track. Ok.
HILTON: But I`m having fun.
BEHAR: Well, I wonder if she`s having fun with this. I`m not so sure. The advertising backlash on this has set in. ABC has already pulled ads for "The View" from your site. Have any others followed suit?
HILTON: No, ABC is the only one. Hopefully they`ll come back. I find it odd, though, because I didn`t post that photo on my Web site. I linked to it on Twitter. Yet they`re removing ads on my site. That`s fine.
BEHAR: Well, yes.
HILTON: I really do wish I could post that picture, because a lot of people, the media and folks are getting upset over an image they didn`t see. And I feel like if everyone saw this image in question, they would clearly see that you`re not seeing anything down there that you`re not supposed to. It`s definitely not child pornography and it`s definitely not illegal.
BEHAR: But is your defense that you posted it on Twitter and not on your Web site? Is that what you`re saying about the advertisers pulling?
HILTON: Yes. I put a link to the photo --
BEHAR: I don`t get that, Perez, because Perez Hilton is Perez Hilton. Wherever it is, you are a brand and ABC doesn`t like it.
After all, Miley Cyrus is a Disney employee. And they don`t want to see that. And they`re not going to support your Web site where you make money by putting this picture up there of one of their stars. You can understand that.
BEHAR: I get it. Absolutely.
BEHAR: Good.
HILTON: And Miley`s going to be on "Good Morning America" tomorrow morning -- plug, plug -- which is probably another reason why they decided to do that.
BEHAR: By the way, can I just say that I have actually seen the photo. We`re not going to show it here because we don`t want get in trouble the way you are in trouble.
HILTON: Yes, I sent you the photo because I wanted you to see it.
BEHAR: I did see it. And I think that it`s unfortunate that a girl cannot get out of a car -- she`s got a short skirt on, without people taking pictures of her and making it look suggestive that she has no underwear on when the girl is in fact wearing underwear. It`s an invasion of privacy. And I don`t think it`s right.
HILTON: I wouldn`t say it`s an invasion of privacy if she was in public at a music video shoot aware that there were photographers there.
BEHAR: It`s an invasion of her private parts maybe. I wouldn`t like that at all.
HILTON: Well, you know, Miley has been around the block. And that`s exactly why I linked that picture.
BEHAR: What do you mean she`s been around the block? What does that mean?
HILTON: Meaning she`s been in the business for a long time. And she should be aware and she is aware that if there`s paparazzi on set you should be careful how you exit a car.
BEHAR: But that doesn`t make it right. If she isn`t being indiscreet -- let`s say she is or she`s being careless, that`s none of your business. You still don`t have the business to go there and take a picture of it or to post the picture on your account. It`s still wrong. She`s only 17 years old.
HILTON: Absolutely. But it`s not pornographic. It`s not illegal. So it is my business.
BEHAR: I don`t know if it`s specifically pornographic.
HILTON: You may not like it --
(CROSSTALK)
BEHAR: But it`s highly suggestive. I saw it. And she is still a minor, Perez. That`s why you`re in trouble.
But you`re digging your way out slowly. And I think this interview -- I hope it helped you.
HILTON: Well, I`m just happy that, you know, I got to tell my side of what happened. Thank you.
BEHAR: Ok. Thanks very much.
Up next, another troublemaker, my pal Kathy Griffin.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Cruel, evil, ruthless, Vlad the Impaler? No. Kathy Griffin. Who travels far and wide to torment women, men, and yes, even children. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KATHY GRIFFIN, COMEDIAN: Nothing says wow like a middle-aged woman dressed as a naughty cowgirl. Kind of like this, wow.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That cowgirl routine was just flawless.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: She was what?
GRIFFIN: I think she said flawless, actually.
BEHAR: With me now is the star of Bravo`s "MY LIFE ON THE D-LIST." author of "Official Book Club Selection" now out in paper book. And tireless self-promoter, Kathy Griffin.
GRIFFIN: A new bonus chapter where I talk smack about the people that should have called me with muffin baskets for how nice I was in the original book. So the bonus chapter is worth it.
BEHAR: OK now, what did that kid say that was flawless?
GRIFFIN: I believe the child said I was flawless because I`m obsessed with kiddie pageants in a way that I know is wrong. I get it. It`s wrong.
BEHAR: I find them really, really creepy those kids.
GRIFFIN: They`re creepy and disgusting, and yet I find them fascinating. And I watch "TODDLERS AND TIARAS." I watch, I think there`s one called "KING OF THE CROWN."
BEHAR: Were they freaked out by you or not?
GRIFFIN: There`s a great line I want to have on t-shirts because at my show I sell merchandise and sometimes I sell up to seven t-shirts. Anyway, I told them I`m a little older, I`m 26 years old. And then one of the littlest kids with the flipper and the hair, and she goes, you are not. You`re 49 100. So I`ve decided that`s my new age.
BEHAR: Forty nine 100.
GRIFFIN: Forty nine 100.
BEHAR: It`s a good year.
GRIFFIN: I`m putting it on the map, it`s the new 49 99.
BEHAR: Now you know I did not even recognize you with your clothes on, to tell you the truth because --
BEHAR: I`ve got a banging bikini bottom.
BEHAR: You`ve been taking your clothes off everywhere --
GRIFFIN: Yes.
BEHAR: Even at THE VIEW the other day, walking around - in your undies and bra.
GRIFFIN: But you know what started it. I like to walk around in my panties. I blame Paris Hilton. I blame two people in this world for everything wrong in my life.
BEHAR: Your mother.
GRIFFIN: My mother and Paris Hilton.
BEHAR: Uh huh.
GRIFFIN: Because last year we were doing the "D-LIST." Paris went poolside, and of course, she has her Paris Hilton body. And then as a joke I put on a bikini and it turns out I have a way hotter smoking bikini bod than Paris. And if you notice, she`s been kind of sad, depressed since then.
BEHAR: Yes, she has. She on medication since that day.
GRIFFIN: A lot of medication.
BEHAR: Yes, I heard that.
GRIFFIN: And could move in with the Lohans, god willing.
BEHAR: OK now -
GRIFFIN: Now when are the coming on here?
BEHAR: The Lohan`s?
GRIFFIN: Are they coming anytime soon?
BEHAR: I don`t think so.
GRIFFIN: Can I run into them in the hallway?
BEHAR: No it`s not going to happen. Why are they on your list?
GRIFFIN: I`d love to have any kind of Lohan interaction.
BEHAR: Really?
GRIFFIN: In particular - here`s why, there`s a younger one coming down the pike. There`s a boy Lohan. And I think the dad has plans to put -- like skippy Lohan. Or skippy low - nevermind, I`m really low. I`m really dating myself with that. That`s such a -- but anyway, I`m looking for any Lohan. Any Lohan will do.
BEHAR: OK, maybe we can arrange that.
GRIFFIN: Thank you.
BEHAR: Our frat hookers will fix you up with one. Your mother - I think your mother is not happy with you parading around half naked.
GRIFFIN: OK, don`t take her side. Just because she`s old.
BEHAR: I`m just saying.
GRIFFIN: OK, just because the two of you enjoyed a glass of wine -
BEHAR: I`m just saying.
GRIFFIN: Doesn`t mean you have to gang up against me with Paris Hilton.
BEHAR: I`m just asking you. Does she or doesn`t she?
GRIFFIN: She`s not on my side. She likes to throw me under the bus. And when I walk in the room, I hear ding, ding, the bus is coming, and then I go under it.
BEHAR: OK, the other thing -
GRIFFIN: But you know that there`s been a particularly low blow that happened to me yesterday. This is hot off the presses. OK? I don`t know if you heard about this.
BEHAR: No.
GRIFFIN: But last night on the Bill O`Reilly -- I`m sorry "THE FACTOR," Bill O`Reilly made my mother the patriot of the week.
BEHAR: OK let`s look at this
GRIFFIN: OK that`s like a dagger --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL O`REILLY, HOST: Comedian Kathy Griffin, not a big fan of FOX news, but apparently her mom is.
GRIFFIN: My mother loves FOX news, and she loves bill O`Reilly. We get into big fights about it. She calls bill O`REILLY her boyfriend because she`s crazy.
O`REILLY: Griffin`s mom is certainly not crazy. She`s a patriot.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Are you embarrassed by this?
GRIFFIN: OK hold the phone. Hold the phone. Excuse me. Who went to Iraq and Afghanistan and entertained the troops? Not Maggie with her box of wine, but Bill O`Reilly makes her the patriot of the week because she --
BEHAR: She agrees with him.
GRIFFIN: But she`s also delusional because they`re not dating.
BEHAR: That`s true.
GRIFFIN: They`re a good couple.
BEHAR: They make a couple.
GRIFFIN: My mother, OK so I call my mom in her new building because she lives half in my place and half in what we call the manor, if you know what I`m saying, because it has buttons on the wall in case she falls. You know how sometimes she has a little wine and accidentally falls. Anyway, so she has this new building, and so now she can finally get acceptance because that tool Bill O`Reilly made her patriot of the week.
BEHAR: I know. Well, he doesn`t like people who disagree with his politics, I guess. Calls me a pinhead.
GRIFFIN: We`ve been pinheads together.
BEHAR: Oh, together? Love that.
GRIFFIN: We`ve made it. We`ve arrived.
BEHAR: How did you get to be so liberal with such a conservative mother?
GRIFFIN: Well, I don`t know. I do it to irritate her, mostly. But my dad was very liberal. We came from one of those Irish Catholic households where we argued at the dinner table every night where my dad was the liberal and my mother was the conservative. And so we just went at it --
BEHAR: Was there a lot of drinking?
GRIFFIN: How dare you. Irish Catholics in Chicago, I`m appalled. Bottoms up. Yes there is nothing but drinking and fighting. And also, you know, I`m a gay man with boobs.
BEHAR: I know, I`ve heard that about you because you keep saying it.
GRIFFIN: Well I know.
BEHAR: What makes you a gay man?
GRIFFIN: Wait, hold on. I`ve got a ho newsflash. I got asked out on a date.
BEHAR: Oh by a straight guy?
GRIFFIN: Yes.
BEHAR: Wow that`s news.
GRIFFIN: This is really breaking news. This is bigger than the patriot. And I got a jersey because he was in the all-star game. And he plays baseball. And his name is Curtis Granderson. And he sent me a baseball jersey. And last night, I went to watch him at a game, and I have a picture of him. And he`s hot and he`s straight. What about that?
BEHAR: Let`s see if the director can catch that. Closer.
GRIFFIN: Come closer.
BEHAR: Closer.
GRIFFIN: Come closer.
BEHAR: Oh, baby, he`s got what you call a six-pack.
GRIFFIN: That`s right. I`m going to turn it into a seven-pack.
BEHAR: Now he wasn`t to -
GRIFFIN: He wants to have sex with me.
BEHAR: He wants to go out with you?
GRIFFIN: He wants to have sex with me.
BEHAR: How do you know at?
GRIFFIN: I can feel it. He didn`t technically ask me. But I feel it. I`m a little psychic.
BEHAR: Let`s see if this guy`s straight. He`s holding you here.
GRIFFIN: Yes, this is our first date. And it`s in the hallway of the Yankee playing field or whatever.
BEHAR: So what are you going to do? Are you going to go out with him?
GRIFFIN: I`d like to have sex with him, then I got to go back on the road. I mean, he seems nice, but I got books to sell, I got a show. You know, I`m busy.
BEHAR: You`re also a dramatic actress these days.
GRIFFIN: You mean when I was on "LAW & ORDER."
BEHAR: Playing a lesbian.
GRIFFIN: An activist lesbian who they described to me as the White Al Sharpton.
BEHAR: Really?
GRIFFIN: Have you had Al Sharpton on the show?
BEHAR: Not only on the show. I`ve had him.
GRIFFIN: I love Sharpton -
BEHAR: No, kidding, kidding.
GRIFFIN: You know his wife is named Kathy. Because I`d be happy to be the next Kathy Sharpton.
BEHAR: I think he was on the show last night, wasn`t he?
GRIFFIN: I love Sharpton, yes.
BEHAR: Now, are you starting a new career as a dramatic actor or as a lesbian?
GRIFFIN: Who knows? I`m happy to be a lesbian, although that might ruin my new relationship with Curtis. The dude from the Yankees.
BEHAR: Yes.
GRIFFIN: But -- oh, by the way, I think this might mean that I have broken up with Levi Johnston.
BEHAR: Oh, him? You know, he`s back with Bristol. Get over it.
GRIFFIN: You mean now that I`m with Curtis Granderson?
BEHAR: He`s back -- now that you`re with Curtis and he`s with Bristol.
GRIFFIN: With the Yankees. Please. Outfield. I`m in love. That`s love, baby, don`t judge.
BEHAR: Sports is not your strong suit, like mine. OK, now you got emotional at one point during the taping of our show.
GRIFFIN: Yes, it was embarrassing.
BEHAR: Watch this.
GRIFFIN: It was embarrassing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRIFFIN: I feel so embarrassed every time I think I`m doing right or something.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re doing fine.
GRIFFIN: But I feel like I`m not getting it. I just feel stupid.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean, you know --
GRIFFIN: I know, I can`t be crying when they turn around because it will be a crying scene. I did a crying scene here. I`m the only person on the show who`s crying during a not crying scene.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: What are you, Glenn Beck?
GRIFFIN: I mean honestly, I was crying like it was Glenn Beck on a normal night. That was very embarrassing.
BEHAR: Why were you crying?
GRIFFIN: I cry every single day on "LAW & ORDER." I had explosive diarrhea.
BEHAR: Thank you for sharing.
GRIFFIN: A great diet. And also I was nervous. So every single day I was nervous because I was around those serious actors and I cried every day and had diarrhea every day. There, open book, baby.
BEHAR: OK and what about the kiss with Mariska, what happen there?
GRIFFIN: It was cut.
BEHAR: Why?
GRIFFIN: I don`t know why, Dick Wolf just decided to cut it, and --
BEHAR: Maybe he`s seeing it personally. You know how these guys are.
GRIFFIN: Are you kidding? Please. But I did get to kiss Chris Maloney.
BEHAR: And that was hot, he`s very hot.
GRIFFIN: He`s ridiculously hot.
BEHAR: So you cry on the set there.
GRIFFIN: Well I wasn`t crying on the set. The cameras caught me having, of course, a really embarrassing moment as happens on "MY LIFE ON THE D-LIST" Tuesdays on Bravo.
BEHAR: Shameless, shameless.
GRIFFIN: And you know it`s not all bikini shots, honey.
BEHAR: I know you work hard for a living, girlfriend. OK Kathy, sit tight. We have a lot of ground cover. We`ll be back after a quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with Kathy Griffin.
GRIFFIN: Did you say Griffith?
BEHAR: No.
GRIFFIN: I think I caught you. Are you sure?
BEHAR: I say Griffin.
GRIFFIN: OK.
BEHAR: Is it Melanie Griffin or Griffith?
GRIFFIN: OK, I`m Kathy Griffin. You know what, welcome to my day. Yesterday when I was at the Yankee game with my new lover, Curtis Granderson. The peanut guy came --
BEHAR: I`ll never forget what`s his name?
GRIFFIN: We`re very in love. The peanut guy came up to me and said, I love you, Ellen.
BEHAR: Oh really you look like Ellen DeGeneres?
GRIFFIN: That`s how d-list I am. From Kathy Griffith, to Kathie Lee Gifford, to now I`m Ellen?
BEHAR: It`s all about the name though. Kathy you are not the D- lister anymore, I know that`s the kind of --
GRIFFIN: Straight guys don`t know me. How do I get to the straights?
BEHAR: The straight guys?
GRIFFIN: They`re like aliens to me.
BEHAR: You sort of project, most of your acts are projected to gays?
GRIFFIN: I`m sleeping with them as much as I can. I am sore.
BEHAR: Hindering the career.
GRIFFIN: So you say sleep with them less, but reach out to them more.
BEHAR: Sleep with gay guys and reach out to the straight guys?
GRIFFIN: How do you reach out to the straights?
BEHAR: By talking about them. Instead of saying, you know, Bob and Adam are having a relationship. You have to go for Bob and Carol, like that.
GRIFFIN: Ted and Alice. All right, fine.
BEHAR: It`s not that complicated.
GRIFFIN: I`m going to try.
BEHAR: Now you took out an ad in the "Hollywood Reporter" begging for an Emmy.
GRIFFIN: You could have rephrased that. You could have said as a two-time Emmy award winner --
BEHAR: Why do you have to beg?
GRIFFIN: -- time for a little reminder to vote others that the network chose not to pay for --
BEHAR: Here is the picture of you.
GRIFFIN: It cost a fortune.
BEHAR: Why do you look Asian in this picture?
GRIFFIN: Because I did a photo shoot with Mike Ruiz. Kind of like Kevin Okwan (ph)? He had me channeling Betty Paige.
BEHAR: Oh, I see.
GRIFFIN: So I`m in this whole Betty Paige getup and it`s so air brush --
BEHAR: But you look more like Madame Ming.
GRIFFIN: It doesn`t matter who I look like -
BEHAR: Betty Paige.
GRIFFIN: Because people think I`m freaking Ellen and Kathy Lee Gifford, I just want the damn Emmy.
BEHAR: But don`t the studios do this type of thing? Why did you have to do this?
GRIFFIN: I maybe the studios do it for others. Maybe they do it for THE VIEW. But in the case of Kathy Griffin, she has to do it herself. And that means taking that one-nighter in battle creek or whatever it takes to pay for it. I took a two-page full color, the reporter, the envelope, variety, whatever it takes.
BEHAR: OK now let`s talk about your interaction with miss Liza Minnelli. How was that?
GRIFFIN: Oh it was fantastic.
BEHAR: It was on your show.
GRIFFIN: She did a great interview here.
BEHAR: She did.
GRIFFIN: She had a fantastic interview with her here.
BEHAR: Thank you, yes, she was great.
GRIFFIN: Yes well what was so great is that truly, when I -
BEHAR: She basically talked about her gay husband.
GRIFFIN: She`s very open about that.
BEHAR: David Gest, yes.
GRIFFIN: She`s wonderfully open about this.
BEHAR: How she had to pay for that wedding. I went to that wedding, you know.
GRIFFIN: Who didn`t?
BEHAR: Who didn`t, that`s right.
GRIFFIN: But you know what`s great is that she gets how bizarre that wedding was. Because I was afraid when you were asking her about the wedding, she was good to say what`s the problem?
BEHAR: I was afraid too but -
GRIFFIN: But when she said she pulled Michael Jackson aside and Michael Jackson said, what, I thought you liked him. It sounded like such a normal moment --
BEHAR: How do you have a normal moment with Michael Jackson?
GRIFFIN: I don`t know, she grabbed the glove off. She grabbed him and talked to him, they`re buds.
BEHAR: Now that you`re hanging with Minnelli and me in this movie.
GRIFFIN: Yes and you.
BEHAR: In the movie in your show.
GRIFFIN: I like you calling it a show movie, but yes.
BEHAR: It`s a show.
GRIFFIN: You are on it. She does the whole who cares? Who cares? It`s great. We talk about it. I do, I get her to talk about how SNL can spoof me and it just happens for you. He just does it. He chose to do it.
BEHAR: Yes so tell me about Minnelli on your show.
GRIFFIN: She gives me an acting lesson. Because when I go to do "LAW & ORDER" I really was nervous. And so I go over thinking who knows? It`s Liza. Maybe she`ll want to gossip. But she gives me this fantastic acting lesson and really helped me.
BEHAR: Like what?
GRIFFIN: She said it`s not the -- oh, no, I have to get this right. It`s not the how. It`s the why.
BEHAR: The why.
GRIFFIN: Yes, I thought it was the how. Turns out it was the why. But you know it`s great to go to her apartment with the Tony and the Emmy and the Golden Globe and the Grammy and she`s Liza. It`s dazzling.
BEHAR: So it`s the why am I doing this scene?
GRIFFIN: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s not how -
GRIFFIN: Because I was getting in my head, about how I say it, how do I look at this person. She just said relax and listen. And it`s the why -
BEHAR: Oh I thought it would be like how much are they paying me?
GRIFFIN: Well usually that`s my first question. But we have a lot of people this year, my mom getting hammered with Cloris Leachman. And that is a cockfight. I mean really --
BEHR: They`re both a hundred years old, aren`t they?
GRIFFIN: That`s the death -
BEHAR: How old is your mother?
GRIFFIN: My mom turned 90 last week.
BEHAR: Did you have a party?
GRIFFIN: Oh I`m sure Bill O`Reilly had something at his place. But anyway, yes, as a matter of fact, my mom, she had several party, actually. She was very celebrated. No joke, I wish I was kidding. She has a book coming out on June 29th. And it`s called "Tip It" and it`s a guide to people who enjoy life more through drinking boxed wine.
BEHAR: Really? Oh so she has a little career for herself.
GRIFFIN: It`s like the anti Dr. Oz. Her secret to longevity is boxed wine and like 7-eleven burritos.
BEHAR: Wouldn`t it have been nice to all jump out and yell surprise.
GRIFFIN: Oh Bill O`Reilly`s does it, and then Hannity is naked.
BEHAR: Yes, that would have been fantastic.
GRIFFIN: Or at least Greta.
BEHAR: Now did you read this thing about Cameron Diaz because Cameron Diaz --
GRIFFIN: I ran into her recently.
BEHAR: Oh really, and?
GRIFFIN: Shocking. So I do this photo shoot for "Shrek 4" which I had two lines in. And I`m standing next to Ryan Seacrest, which was a nightmare for her.
BEHAR: For who, for Ryan or for Cameron.
GRIFFIN: Yes, for Ryan. Right, now, Cameron, doesn`t care.
BEHAR: Why do you say for her, you outing Ryan Seacrest.
GRIFFIN: Because I like to tease Ryan Seacrest. And she has it coming. And she knows it. All right.
BEHAR: OK.
GRIFFIN: Well you do know that I believe that there`s a conspiracy against me. And I believe that Ryan Seacrest, Oprah and my mother are trying to kill me.
BEHAR: Care to elaborate?
GRIFFIN: Well I don`t think the patriot of the week helped. I didn`t sleep very well last night. Anyway, so I go to this photo shoot.
BEHAR: Hurry up we got to go to another -- we`ve got to take a break.
GRIFFIN: What`s your Cameron Diaz question?
BEHAR: Hold this for -
GRIFFIN: I`m a Diaz expert.
BEHAR: All right more with Kathy Griffin on the next thing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with the very funny Kathy Griffin.
GRIFFIN: You are giving me a list, you know I might say something inappropriate.
BEHAR: OK, let me as you about Cameron Diaz, we are about to go there.
GRIFFIN: Yes.
BEHAR: OK, OK, you saw her but the woman has basically said that if you have sex with a woman, sexually -
GRIFFIN: Right, OK -
BEHAR: You know have sex with -
GRIFFIN: Is this oral or does it involve -
BEHAR: Well wait a second, well whatever - what is the difference?
GRIFFIN: There`s a difference to the lesbians. Do you know how specific they are at the Dina Sure Golf Tournament. They are very specific the lesbians, I know a lot of them.
BEHAR: Well the question is if you have sex with a woman -
GRIFFIN: Yes.
BEHAR: Does that make you a lesbian? She says no, what do you say?
GRIFFIN: I had sex with Cameron Diaz. I do not feel that -- I have a show Tuesdays on Bravo. Look, I don`t know.
BEHAR: She says, I can be attracted to a woman sexually, but I doesn`t mean I want to be in love with a woman.
GRIFFIN: I don`t know. This is sort of a generational thing for me I feel like now a lot of young women are doing that at parties and to turn on the boyfriend. For me, here`s the deal. I don`t know too many gay men that will sleep with a woman occasionally, like once they`re gay, they`re gay.
BEHAR: Really?
GRIFFIN: Yes. How many gay guys do you know that you banging women on the side? Please.
BEHAR: The ones who are married are banging their wives.
GRIFFIN: Well that`s a whole other Oprah.
BEHAR: I know.
GRIFFIN: That`s a whole other Oprah on the brothers on the down low.
BEHAR: OK let`s move on to something else. How about Levi Johnston, what`s your relationship?
GRIFFIN: I`m not seeing anymore.
BEHAR: You are not? How about Justin Bieber?
GRIFFIN: I have a makeup tape with Justin Bieber that I am going to release, perhaps, in conjunction with "MY LIFE ON THE D-LIST," Tuesdays on Bravo.
BEHAR: Aren`t you robbing the cradle with Justin Bieber? I mean that`s really --
GRIFFIN: How old is she -- he?
BEHAR: He`s like 14.
GRIFFIN: Oh I didn`t know that, 14.
BEHAR: He`s really young.
GRIFFIN: Is that too young?
BEHAR: I really think you should watch yourself.
GRIFFIN: What about holding hands? I can`t hold hands with him?
BEHAR: He`s 16 years old.
GRIFFIN: What if I`m holding hands and Curtis Hansen from Dateline walks in.
BEHAR: Who?
GRIFFIN: To "CATCH A PREDATOR." It`s the greatest show on television.
BEHAR: Oh that guy, yes, that`s a good who.
GRIFFIN: And then we are in that weird kitchen and Bieber is in there - but would you like some sweet tea?
BEHAR: Kim Kardashian might be taking your spot as his girlfriend.
GRIFFIN: Kim Kardashian is in a lot of hot water because the Beliebers (ph) are very upset with her and they are army--
BEHAR: The who?
GRIFFIN: The Beliebers, hello, the clay makers? Well the Beliebers kicked your butts.
BEHAR: I don`t really keep up with this stuff.
GRIFFIN: Clay was just out here two weeks ago, you know the Claymates -
BEHAR: Oh the Claymates, yes.
GRIFFIN: Well now there`s Beliebers.
BEHAR: Yes.
GRIFFIN: And they are an army, and they shoot to kill. They defend their Justin Bieber. I didn`t know he was 14, I thought he was like 30.
BEHAR: Are you scared of Bieber`s fans though?
GRIFFIN: I`m not scared of anybody, bring it.
BEHAR: These kids -
GRIFFIN: Who am I scared -
BEHAR: Kim got death threats for the fans, did you know that?
GRIFFIN: Well I`m sure, Kim`s gotten death threats for other reasons, too.
BEHAR: I don`t know about that.
GRIFFIN: Come on.
BEHAR: Now did you know that they make Larry King pay for a book after he interviewed you?
GRIFFIN: Cash.
BEHAR: Is that true?
GRIFFIN: Right then and there.
BEHAR: Why?
GRIFFIN: Because he could afford it, that`s why.
BEHAR: Couldn`t you have given him the damn book?
GRIFFIN: Well, I`m not giving you that one, so don`t be holding that. It`s $15.
BEHAR: No, this one you already signed it for somebody else.
GRIFFIN: And she paid for it because of that awesome bonus chapter about I told my mother not to give away any of her books either. Someone has to pay for that damn home.
BEHAR: All right, I`m going to go with one twitter question.
GRIFFIN: It`s expensive. Maybe Bill O`Reilly can pay for her new rent because she`s such a patriot.
BEHAR: That`s possible. But here`s from a gay fan, a twitter fan -
GRIFFIN: Well that`s shocking -
BEHAR: When will Kathy get a sex change to become a real gay man? Before we go, would you like to answer that question?
GRIFFIN: You know what if it will help my ratings, I`ll just do it tomorrow.
BEHAR: OK.
GRIFFIN: I`ll schedule it tomorrow. I`ve had a face lift. Why would I stop there?
BEHAR: Exactly, very good. OK I think Dorothy Parker said it best, if you don`t have anything good to say about somebody, come sit next to me.
GRIFFIN: Thank you.
BEHAR: Good night, everybody.
END
