Return to Transcripts main page

Nancy Grace

Mystery 911 Call in Kyron Horman Case

Aired June 30, 2010 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Live, rural Oregon. Stepmommy walks a 7-year-old little boy down the hall of his own elementary school to the science fair. He`s never seen again. Tonight, why do police insist stepmom take a second polygraph?

In a stunning twist, 7-year-old Kyron`s dad files for divorce in secret, the court slapping stepmommy Terri Horman, the last person to see the boy alive, with a restraining order. It gets worse! Stepmom ordered to stay away from firearms and her own children. What exactly does Daddy know? At police urging, Kyron`s dad moves out of the house, taking the 19- month-old baby sister with him, tonight at a secret location, secret even from Kyron`s stepmother, the restraining order so explosive, the judge seals the file, keeping it secret so as to, quote, "not hinder the investigation."

Reports the stepmom has now taken two police polygraphs. And up until 45 minutes before being served divorce papers, she denies any and all marital discord. Also (ph) secret, so covert, even she didn`t know about it.

Bombshell tonight. Just uncovered, a mystery 911 call from the Horman home 5:45 PM Saturday. The emergency? Dangerous threats. Daddy moves out within hours. The 911 call also so crucial to the search for 7-year-old Kyron, police refuse to release the call, the focus of the investigation now stepmother Terri Horman, her own family divulging they fear she`s headed for an arrest. How -- how -- does a 7-year-old little boy go missing from his own elementary school classroom?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A major Horman family shakeup...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Reports now revealing there was a mystery 911 call at the couple`s home Saturday night reportedly regarding threats at the property.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In the weeks since Kyron vanished from Skyline school, rumors swirled Terri is a suspect.

GRACE: The bell rang. She waved good-bye. That`s the last time she saw him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s like a portal opened up at the school and he just vanished.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But who called 911? What happened?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Kaine Horman filed for divorce from his wife and Kyron`s stepmom, Terri Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what happened to little Kyron?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Kaine also filed a petition for abuse prevention.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But there must be proven some imminent danger to Kaine Horman or his 18-month-old daughter, Kiara.

GRACE: Both documents now sealed, so explosive the police fear if they are released, it will hinder the investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... or that there had been some past abuse by Terri Horman.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And breaking news tonight, live, Ohio. A gorgeous 17-year-old co-ed, honor student, number one in her class, volleyball star, last seen there in her own home with her grandmother, midnight. Next morning, Grandma wakes up 6:00 AM, Abbi`s gone, vanished without a trace. Tonight, mystery solved.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news. Missing teen Abbi Obermiller has been found.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... desperate search for Abbi Obermiller...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My daughter`s been missing for 21 days.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know that she`s dead and that the guy, Robert Young, killed her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... police calling 20-year-old boyfriend Bobby Young a person of interest.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know where she is. I have no idea where to start.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s clear that he (INAUDIBLE) text messages (INAUDIBLE) leave the house.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We do believe that Bobby does know where she`s at.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... allegedly hiding in the attic of her boyfriend`s apartment, both taken into custody. Obermiller reportedly tells the juvenile court judge she just wants to go home, breaking down in tears. Boyfriend Robert Young facing additional charges.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Stepmommy walks a 7-year-old little boy down the hall of his own elementary school to the science fair. He`s never seen again. Tonight, just uncovered, a mystery 911 call from inside the Horman home 5:45 PM Saturday. The emergency? Dangerous threats. Daddy moves out within hours.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s a shocking twist in the mysterious disappearance of little Kyron Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now we`re hearing there was a mystery 911 made from the Horman home over the weekend, the call reportedly about threats. Just who called 911, why won`t the police release the call?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Divorce papers cite irreconcilable differences.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dad files for divorce and a restraining order.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s a restraining order that blocks Terri from having any contact with their daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does that say that this little 18-month-old is in danger?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Terri Horman. She`s been under a lot of scrutiny in the case.

GRACE: She had been asked to take a second polygraph. Police don`t want a second polygraph if you passed the first one with flying colors.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Twenty-seven days later and still wanting answers to where this boy is and if he`s OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Kevin Miller, investigative reporter. Kevin Miller, this mystery 911 call from inside Kyron`s home Saturday just before 6:00 PM, about dangerous threats. Whatever it is, it is so volatile or so crucial in the search for 7-year-old Kyron Horman that police are refusing to release the 911 call. Typically, that`s public.

KEVIN MILLER, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER (via telephone): And Nancy, you are correct about that. And again, police disclosed that today. In addition to that, as you stated, Kaine then moved out. And then on Monday, as you disclosed, divorce papers served with a restraining order. And we go back to the 911 call. Police won`t say who called or the reasons why, except that it had to do with threats against the property, Nancy.

GRACE: Threats against the property?

MILLER: Threats at the property.

GRACE: Threats at the property. And tell me if I`m right or wrong. Kevin Miller, was the call from inside Kyron`s home?

MILLER: Yes, it was, ma`am.

GRACE: OK. Kevin Miller joining us, investigative reporter. Kevin, lay out the timeline. This call, the 911 call about dangerous threats inside the home, within a couple of hours that same day, it`s my understanding the father moves out.

MILLER: Yes. You have a call at 5:46. Then within a few hours, father Kaine takes Kiara and moves out. And then later on, we have -- we have Terri denying this on Monday to the reporter from "The Oregon," saying everything`s good. Forty-five minutes later, Nancy, she`s served with a restraining order and papers for divorce.

GRACE: OK. Maybe it`s just me, but I`ve got a disconnect right there, Kevin Miller. If he, the daddy, moves out with 19-month-old baby girl Kiara -- this is the natural daughter of Terri Horman, the stepmother -- Daddy moves out, how did she not know there was a problem? How could she deny, Hey, nothing`s wrong? Everything`s just fine. And he`s moved out on Saturday?

MILLER: Nancy, I would say -- and I`ll speculate on this, so I`ll just qualify it that way -- that would -- you would be correct. That would be highly -- you would not know that she would not know that there was a problem. She was putting on a front. That would be my speculation on that. But you`re right. Again, how would you not know if someone moves out and then you deny it to the press? Again, it goes to her credibility.

GRACE: OK, to James Pitkin, reporter with "The Willamette Week" newspaper. He`s joining us there at the school. James, what can you tell us?

JAMES PITKIN, "WILLAMETTE WEEK": Well, today we had some new developments. There was the reports of the mysterious 911 call. We also have reports that the FBI is searching sex offenders in the area. There are 143 in this vicinity, and so they have a lot of work cut out for them.

GRACE: Could you repeat? Did you say 143 registered sex offenders there in the area?

PITKIN: In the Portland area, that`s correct, Nancy.

GRACE: Now, those are just the registered sex offenders, right? That doesn`t even include people that have been accused of sex offenses.

PITKIN: Correct. These are people who have been sentenced to sex crimes, and they`re required to register with the state.

GRACE: Two Matt Zarrell, our producer on the story. Matt, what more can you tell me?

MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, what`s interesting is "People" magazine has a report where they spoke to a close friend of Terri Horman, and apparently what happened is Terri was called to the police station to talk to police on Saturday. She goes. She talks to police. When she comes back, her husband, Kaine Horman, and her 19-month-old girl are gone. They have moved out. She is shocked. She`s doesn`t know what to make of it.

GRACE: Everyone, a 7-year-old little boy -- we are learning more and more about his poor vision. He said he wanted to be a police officer. He loved science and math. Take a look at Kyron Horman. He`s only 3-foot-8, 50 pounds, brown hair, blue eyes, thick eyeglasses. He was last wearing a black T-shirt with "CSI," crime scene investigation, on it, cargo pants, color black, white socks, black sneakers with orange trim. Last seen 8:45 AM by his stepmother, walking down the hall to his 2nd grade class. The tip line is 503-261-2847. There`s a $25,000 reward.

Back to you, Matt Zarrell. It sounds to me as if the daddy moving out with a 19-month-old baby was all orchestrated because police come to take stepmommy for an interview, yet another interview, and while she`s down at the police station getting interviewed about Kyron`s disappearance, the daddy moves out.

ZARRELL: Well, yes, there are reports from friends of the family that said that police had suggested to Kaine Horman that he take his 19-month- old and he move elsewhere. So maybe this is us putting two and two together, Nancy.

GRACE: Let`s go to the lines. Heather, Indiana. Hi, Heather.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question or comment would be, did the school call the parents to say the child was absent?

GRACE: It`s my understanding, Heather in Indiana, that they did not, that the parents only discovered Kyron was not at school that day, or so they say, when they went to the bus stop together and he didn`t get off the bus. Then they find out he was never at school. And what that means, Heather in Indiana, is stepmom says 8:45 AM, she sees the little boy, she walks him down the hall, they get to his door, she leaves. He never made it in that door, Heather in Indiana.

With us right now, Marc Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation. We are taking your calls. As the days, the hours, in fact, the minutes pass, it becomes less likely this boy will be found alive, but there is a chance Kyron`s alive.

Marc Klaas, in my analysis, if the stepmother is involved -- and she has not been named a suspect -- then the child is most likely dead because she has not had a chance to go feed or take care of the child if he`s in hiding in some way, Marc?

MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, yes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A lot of attention has been focused on Kyron`s stepmom, Terri Horman. Investigations have circulated flyers asking people for information on her whereabouts the day Kyron went missing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Terri Horman`s father said there was a 50/50 chance Terri would be arrested.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shocking reports...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Reports now revealing there was a mystery 911 call at the couple`s home Saturday night.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... a major Horman family shake-up...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who called 911? What happened?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... restraining order to the stepmother of missing 7-year-old Kyron Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... a restraining order against her...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... restricting her from access to him, the child and a restriction to firearms...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The restraining order is now sealed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To take something so seriously as a baby away from a biological mother, it has to be a huge factual statement that is entered in there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... irreconcilable differences as the reason for the split.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The last known person to see little Kyron alive...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was the first person to pick him up, along with his father, at 3:45...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The worst hell I`ve ever experienced.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We will not stop until we find him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: I want to go back to Marc Klaas. He couldn`t hear me in that last segment -- Marc Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation. This 911 call, a mystery call, and the police are making it remain a mystery by not releasing it. You and I both know that`s typically public domain. But they are saying it touches on the investigation into the disappearance of the 7-year-old boy. So whatever the 911 emergency was inside the home touches on his disappearance.

KLAAS: Actually, Nancy, the police have released very, very little. At the beginning, they searched for 10 days. They let us know that there were 40 agencies from three states involved. They then said they were shifting from a missing person to a criminal investigation. Apparently, they told the family not to interact with the media. And they basically released absolutely nothing since then, which leaves us all, I guess, to speculate wildly about what might have been going on.

We can only surmise from the information we have at hand, which again, takes us back to the stepmother. The reality is, is that 77 percent of all kidnappings are conducted by a family member. That is reason enough to be focused on her as the last person to see him alive.

GRACE: Marc Klaas, you probably have these stats at your fingertips. You say 70 percent of all child kidnappings are by the family. But what about child murder?

KLAAS: Seventy-seven.

GRACE: That`s even worse.

KLAAS: Well, if children are murdered as a result of a kidnapping, again, about three quarters of them will be dead within the first three hours.

GRACE: Including by family members?

KLAAS: Absolutely.

GRACE: OK, Marc, I want to go...

KLAAS: Well, yes, if they -- yes, if they are kidnapped as a -- if they`re murdered as a result of a kidnapping, that`s across the board.

GRACE: OK. Marc, I want to go over a theory you brought up last night, and it`s not the first time you brought it up and it`s a very plausible theory, although in this case, I don`t see it. You`re saying the stepmother`s the last one to see him, Terri Horman. Now, let`s talk about the possibility that one of these 140-plus child predators were waiting in the wings. Break it down. That`s a great theory to just throw out there, to just toss it out and see if it sticks, but what are the practicalities? How would that have happened? How could that be? I mean, she already walked him to the door, practically, of his homeroom or his first class. How is this supposed to happen?

KLAAS: I have no idea how it happened, but one has to leave open that very, very narrow possibility that something else happened besides the stepmother having done it. Basically, she was within seconds of his disappearance, which means that she had to turn around and be outside the building before something happened, or something very silent happened and there was some pervert lurking in the wings somewhere.

And we have to remember it`s a very small school. There`s one road in, one road out. There`s one way into the parking lot, one way out of the parking lot.

GRACE: OK...

KLAAS: And for somebody to pull something like that off without being noticed by anybody is seemingly impossible.

GRACE: Well, I`m just -- and I`m not saying she did it. What I am saying is that I`m on a search. I`m seeking. I`m seeking the truth in what happened.

Now, with us there at the school -- hold on just a moment. Bret (ph), turn on the control room camera immediately! I would like to ask Dana (ph), who`s sitting in for Liz tonight, why do you keep showing Terri Horman`s body building photos in bikinis? Dana? OK, we`ve seen it. We understand. She was a body builder. Unless you can make some kind of a steroid connection, I`ve seen enough of it!

All right, let`s go back to James Pitkin. He`s there at the school. James -- there you go. Take it down, Dana! James Pitkin, at the school, have you been in the school? Have you seen where his class was?

PITKIN: I have not been inside. They had the school closed off to media when the school was still in session earlier this month. But if you think about it, this is a tiny school. It`s extremely isolated. There`s just farmland around and a couple of houses. If I were a predator and I wanted to snatch a kid from a school in Portland, this is the last one that I would choose, I can say that.

GRACE: OK, wait a minute!

PITKIN: So that`s always...

GRACE: Dr. Jeff Gardere...

PITKIN: ... been a big mystery in this case.

GRACE: Dr. Jeff Gardere -- don`t mean to interrupt, James, but I`m running out of time. Dr. Jeff, how the heck is a child predator going to blend -- blend into this rural elementary school? I grew up in one. I went to our public elementary school the whole way through grammar school. An outsider that`s not supposed to be there is going to be noticed.

JEFF GARDERE, PSYCHOLOGIST: Absolutely. I`m a father of four, and I can tell you when I take my kids into school, they know every adult who`s in that school, and they have you sign in.

The other thing is, why would she just take him to the door and not take him all the way in? So that sounds kind of fishy to me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re hearing there was a mystery 911 made from the Horman home over the weekend.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What happened to little Kyron?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The school was open between 8:00 AM and 8:45 AM.

GRACE: He never made it to his homeroom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From 8:45, the last time she says she said good- bye to Kyron, to when he was supposed to be on that bus at 3:45...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was one of the last people that saw him that day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Rumors swirled Terri is a suspect.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She appeared pretty calm, pretty collected, pretty demure.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`re pointing the finger at her and a 50/50 chance she`ll be arrested...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everything that we`re doing is to find Kyron.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We know that he`s going to come home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We have just received information that tomorrow morning, 10:00 AM, the family is going to have a media meeting. That`s what they are calling it. It sounds like a press release. It sounds like they`re going to answer questions, or at least address the media, but we`ll find out tomorrow morning at 10:00 o`clock. You can make sure we`ll be there.

And speaking of press releases, I noticed something very important. In a family statement -- it was a joint statement by all the family -- We`ve been briefed by law enforcement on the investigation. We`re in complete support of the investigation. We have asked the county sheriff`s office to facilitate releasing this statement for us due to their access to media. We understand we have free access but are limiting our statements. Any actions taken by the investigation or us are based on the interests of Kyron and Kiara, the little sister, and comply with the law. Beyond this, no comment. Notice it`s signed by Desiree, Tony (ph) and Kaine. The only adult missing from that is the stepmother.

Unleash the lawyers. James Elliot, Jr., city attorney, Warner Robins, Penny Douglas Furr, defense attorney, Atlanta, Randy Zelin, defense attorney, joining us out of New York.

First to you, James Elliot. Now, if I don`t smell a rat right there - - she`s the only adult that doesn`t sign off endorsing the police investigation?

JAMES ELLIOT, JR., CITY ATTORNEY, WARNER ROBINS, GEORGIA: Well, hello.

GRACE: What?

ELLIOT: That`s (INAUDIBLE) I mean, what do you think -- why would she be interested at all in participating in that statement?

GRACE: But at least for show, Penny, she should at least say, yes, I agree with the investigation.

PENNY DOUGLAS FURR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, they may not have wanted her to sign it, Nancy. She may not have been invited to sign it. Obviously, there`s a lot of pressure right now going on between the husband and wife that we don`t know about.

GRACE: Zelin?

RANDY ZELIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It`s isolation. I think the police have orchestrated this to isolate her, to really put a psychological noose around her to get her to crack.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There was intense questioning for stepmom Terri Horman, dad Kaine, biological mom, Desiree Young. And then not long after that, a 911 call from the Hormans` house.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Something definitely happened at the house that night. A call was definitely placed. We do know that Kaine and their child together did definitely leave the home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Something happened in that 911 tape or that 911 call that can either be used as some type of leverage to get information or really points them in some new direction.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The 911 call we believe is now part of the criminal case.

KAINE HORMAN, FATHER OF MISSING 7-YR-OLD BOY, KYRON HORMAN: Just keeping the focus on Kyron, and the investigation to find him. There`s a lot of distractions that can come up to that and we`re trying to limit those distractions.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Uncovered tonight a mystery 911 call from inside the Horman home this past Saturday, 5:45 p.m., within hours Kyron`s father has moved out. The fact that this restraining order, this emergency restraining order, filed against the stepmother, the last one to see Kyron alive, it`s sealed.

But the fact that it is filed and we know it bans her from seeing her own natural child, a 19-month-old little girl, and her child by another marriage. I believe that boy is 9 or 11 years old now. She can`t see either one of them.

It also bans her from being around firearms.

For those of you just joining us, we are talking about a 7-year-old little boy, Kyron Horman, who goes missing from his own elementary school.

How many of us take our children to, what, a play school, elementary school, vacation bible school, wherever, and you believe they`re safe?

Well, when the father and the stepmother go to pick him up off the bus, he never came off the bus. That`s when the father learned he had never been at school that day. Although stepmom says she walked him almost all the way to his first class. And the bell rang and he was going in.

That`s her story. Now I want to talk about -- we`re taking your calls live -- I want to talk about Sauvie Island. Sauvie Island.

James Pitkins, with the "Willamette Week" newspaper, joining us there at the school where Kyron disappeared.

Apparently the stepmother pings off her cell phone, and we found cell phone site were all around Sauvie Island. Now what is so --

JAMES PITKINS, REPORTER, WILLAMETTE WEEK: That`s what I`ve heard --

GRACE: -- so crucial about that? It`s only about nine miles away.

PITKINS: That`s crucial, because law enforcement sources say that it doesn`t line up with her account of where she was that day. Apparently she never listed Sauvie Island among the locations that she visited and yet her cell phone was pinging from that location.

GRACE: To Kevin Miller, investigative reporter, is it true that she goes so far as to deny she was at Sauvie Island?

KEVIN MILLER, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Well, that`s what investigators are trying to find out, Nancy. And again, they`ve wanted what we actually know in this case, yes.

GRACE: You`re seeing shots of Sauvie Island from SauvieIsland.org. It`s absolutely beautiful. And I understand the family, Matt Zarrell, would go there together to pumpkin patch every year, a couple of times a year. It is just beautiful.

Is that correct? Are we talking about the same place, Matt Zarrell?

MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE STAFFER, COVERING STORY: Yes, we are. And the family, when they were on the morning shows late last week, they were saying that they felt that that might have been one of the reasons why there were -- the cops were visiting Sauvie Island.

They did not want to comment on the investigation. That`s maybe why they didn`t want to comment on the report about the cell phone pings.

GRACE: To Mark Novak, former NYPD captain, the president of Global Security Group.

Mark, thank you for being with us. Mark, have you noticed, as I have, that very often killers will kill or dispose of the body or evidence somewhere that they are familiar. And I remember analyzing the Scott Peterson trial before -- case before the body of Stacey Peterson and her unborn child Conner washed ashore in San Francisco bay.

And by that time everybody knew about Scott Peterson`s pack of lies, and, you know, his mistress, blah blah. And I remember talking about him hiding the body somewhere where he would be at ease, at home.

I knew he was a hunter and I knew he was a fisherman. So those are two obvious places to find locations where he had hunted or fished.

Now I`m hearing that this stepmother frequently visited Sauvie Island. Now police have been out there dredging the waters.

MARK NOVAK, FMR. NYPD CAPTAIN, PRESIDENT OF GLOBAL SECURITY GROUP: You`re 100 percent right. My experience has been that if an individual is -- if let`s say she was involved or any individual who`s involved in some sort of crime, whether during the commission or after the fact.

They`re going to a place they`re comfortable with. It`s just human nature. You`re not going to go and try and dispose of a body, you`re not going to go and try and hide evidence in an area where you don`t know.

Is it populated? Are there people around? You`re not familiar with the terrain. So it`s a natural human response to go where you`re comfortable, go with where you`re familiar.

GRACE: I mean, think about it, Mark Novak. I mean look at Robert Blake. I know some cookie jury acquitted him, but come on, please, look where they found the murder weapon. This was his favorite Italian restaurant. He went there all the time.

Where is the murder weapon? Thrown in the dumpster. Right there where his wife was murdered.

Hello? You might as well have taken out an ad that said I did it.

NOVAK: Yes.

GRACE: And you see it over and over and over again.

NOVAK: And after the fact, the same holds true. You see these individuals, when somebody goes on a run, a lot of times they`re going to go right to the spot they`re most comfortable with, they`re going to go to an area that they`re familiar with.

It`s again, as I said, it`s just human nature. You go where you`re comfortable.

GRACE: Novak, you`re preaching to the choir. Every time I would have a perp disappear, I`d go, go to his mommy`s house and look under the bed. I`ll call you in 30.

NOVAK: Yes.

GRACE: There he`d be.

We are taking your calls. To Kathy in Washington, hi, Kathy.

KATHY, CALLER FROM WASHINGTON: Hi, Nancy. Thanks so much for taking my call.

GRACE: Thank you for calling.

KATHY: Love your show.

GRACE: What`s your question?

KATHY: My question is, a little earlier you mentioned something that has been on my mind, and that is, if the stepmother possibly using steroids, and somehow a road -- roid rage incident happened between her and Kyron.

GRACE: OK, Dana, sitting in for Liz, here`s your one chance where it`s actually relevant to show the photo.

Now keep in mind that these pictures were a couple of years ago. I don`t know that she is still body building. Let`s see a current-day of her, Dana. OK. There you go. Now she just looks like a normal mom. I don`t see that she`s still into the body building phase.

To Dr. Leigh Vinocur, University of Maryland School of Medicine, joining us out of Baltimore.

Dr. Vinocur, if someone had used steroids -- and again, we`re not saying she did or didn`t.

DR. LEIGH VINOCUR, M.D., UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: Right.

GRACE: OK. Don`t care. I`m also telling you she has not been named a suspect in the disappearance of her little stepboy shown right here. But if you were on steroids, how long could that affect your behavior?

VINOCUR: Well, I mean, I did look at the pictures. If you -- pretty much it could affect your behavior for the short term, maybe a week, or month or so but, you know, if you`re not using them anymore, and the pictures I`ve seen of her, she certainly didn`t look the way she looked in those body building pictures we saw.

Probably a lot of that would be out of her system so.

GRACE: With us, Dr. Leigh Vinocur from University of Maryland School of Medicine.

To Candice in North Carolina, hi, Candice.

CANDICE, CALLER FROM NORTH CAROLINA: Hi. How are you doing?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

CANDICE: I have a question. The photos that were taken, there would have been a lot of pictures taken that morning. Does anyone know if that picture was actually taken that morning, if it could have been Photoshopped or whatever, you know, possibly from another picture that they had?

GRACE: That`s a really good question, Candice, North Carolina.

Out to you, Matt Zarrell. We`re talking about -- I think Candice is talking about the photo of Kyron that morning at the science fair.

ZARRELL: Yes, this photo was taken in his classroom. The science fair was in his classroom. And then he went out to look at other classrooms to look at other science fair projects. Now the stepmother had posted the photo on Facebook after the boy`s disappearance. We don`t know exactly when it was posted, but the stepmom did post it very soon after.

GRACE: OK, Matt, are you telling -- there`s the picture. So those of you familiar with the Photoshop, you can tell me, his project was on frogs. There you see the red-eyed tree frog there in the background.

Now could this have been Photoshopped? I don`t know. But Matt, I want to get something down about the timing. Are you saying that after she would have known he had -- was disappeared, that`s when she posted it?

ZARRELL: We don`t know exactly when it was posted because her Facebook page has been private from the beginning. But we do know that within a few days of the disappearance this photo was posted.

GRACE: To Mark Smith, polygraph expert, VP of New Jersey Polygraphists joining us out of New York.

Mark, thank you for being with us. Mark, we know that her family has said she was asked to take another polygraph. In your opinion, why would that be? And how many questions -- what percentage of questions do you have to fail in order to fail a polygraph?

MARK SMITH, POLYGRAPH EXPERT, VP OF NEW JERSEY POLYGRAPHISTS: Polygraph is testing an issue using related questions. So if she doesn`t tell the truth on one question, she`s going to fail the test.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HORMAN: She was one of the last people who saw him that day. And again it just helps to associate things that were seen along with him on that particular day.

DESIREE YOUNG, MOTHER OF MISSING 7-YR-OLD BOY, KYRON HORMAN: Let him come home. We miss him and we love him and we need him.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Missing 17-year-old Abbi Obermiller has been found in an apartment allegedly rented by her boyfriend. Last seen in her grandma`s home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s not the type of girl who would not call or contact her parents.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Abbi`s parents say this behavior is very out of character for this 4.0 student.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She had been arguing with her parents. Apparently a big part of it about her relationship with this boyfriend.

ROSE OBERMILLER, ABBI OBERMILLER`S MOTHER: He didn`t want her to be around any of her friends. He wanted her all by himself.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He got angry and he strangled her.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Investigators quickly honed in on the attic where they found Abbi hiding in the insulation. The girl is safe but taken into police custody.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: I`ll tell you who should be in police custody is that boyfriend. And you know, frankly, this little girl, for putting her parents through pure hell, dragging them across the floor of hell. All this time, found hiding in insulation.

Have you ever been around insulation? I used to do insulation investigations when I was a fed. Hiding down in that pink or yellow insulation, in the fetal position, in the attic of her boyfriend`s apartment.

To Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer, what happened?

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, just about after midnight, early this morning, police got an anonymous tip that Abbi was in the upstairs of an apartment of a house on Main Street. They kicked in the door at about 3:30 a.m.

They found her boyfriend, Robert Young, in the apartment. They said there was very little furniture. She had no access to television other than watching movies on a VCR. They found her hiding up in the attic, down in the insulation.

GRACE: With me right now a very special guest. This is Abbi`s father, Jim Obermiller.

All I have to say is, news flash, praise the Lord, there is a God, Abbi has been found. She is safe. And now she`s in a whole heap of trouble.

Mr. Obermiller, I couldn`t be happier. Tell me how you found out that Abbi is alive.

JIM OBERMILLER, ABBI OBERMILLER`S FATHER: Well, about 4:30 this morning the -- my wife heard the phone, and she come down and told me that Abbi had been found. And I don`t think I ever got out of bed that fast at 4:30 in the morning before in my life so.

GRACE: I feel like crying just hearing it because when you were on with us last, we were all beside ourselves. And I could see you and your wife just wringing your hands.

What got into her? Tell me what your understanding of this is and where is Abbi tonight?

J. OBERMILLER: Abbi`s at DH tonight, which I fully expected. The -- how it happened?

Nancy, she -- Nancy, before I answer that, I want to tell you and your crew thanks. You got the word out. And there was an anonymous tip. So I just want to let you know that I appreciate all that.

GRACE: Well, I appreciate you saying that. But you can just thank the Lord because it could have easily gone sideways. Because, you know, I know they thought maybe they were in love or whatever they thought. But things have a way of going sideways when the heat`s on, the police are watching you, arguments happen. Things go wrong in a moment. And her life could have been over.

J. OBERMILLER: I understand.

GRACE: What do you think happened?

J. OBERMILLER: Well, from what I`m understanding, they thought they were going to elope. They was going to hide out until she was 18 years old, and elope and get married. I think they found a wedding ring, I guess.

GRACE: How far away is she from 18?

J. OBERMILLER: It would have been November. I don`t know if I have to live that long, to tell you the truth.

GRACE: To tell you the truth, I don`t believe you would because you looked so distraught. I really thought you were going to have a heart attack on the show the other night. You just -- you actually looked like you were in physical pain.

Have you spoken to her?

J. OBERMILLER: Yes, I have.

GRACE: What did she say? Is she the least bit sorry?

J. OBERMILLER: You know what? I believe that she`s starting to feel that -- as a matter of fact, she mentioned that -- obviously she`s frightened. She said she wants to come home.

GRACE: Well, she`s in juvenile hall. I guess she does want to come home.

J. OBERMILLER: Right.

GRACE: I would want to come home from juvenile hall.

J. OBERMILLER: I understand that part. But also she mentioned, she says, and the police have talked to her. She says, Bobby did -- Bobby was real possessive of his other girlfriend, too. She mentioned that to me. And I -- that`s a step. And she did -- you know, she did hold on to me and cry, you know. So, you know, it`s --

GRACE: Well, Mr.Obermiller, nobody can replace your father. Nobody. So you`ve got to see her in person and visit with her. Was she upset? Was she crying? Did she give any kind of explanation?

J. OBERMILLER: She was crying. She -- I don`t know if she even had a -- if she was actually offering an explanation. She just -- I talked to her about some of the things that went on there. They disturbed me a little bit.

But it was mostly -- mostly I was just trying to reassure her she was going to feel -- it`s not going to be easy for a while. But she`s young. She`s 17. She can make some mistakes and come back.

GRACE: Well, Mr. Obermiller, I don`t want our viewers to really get the wrong impression of her. She`s number one in her class. Straight-A student, a volleyball star. Her dream before she got hooked up with 20- year-old Robert Young, it`s the real deal, was to become a researcher in oncology and help find the cure for cancer.

I know people bandied that about almost as a joke now. But that was her dream. That has been her dream for a long time. And the loving parents that she had, and then she hooked up with this. There he is. Bobby Young.

To the lines, Diane, West Virginia, hi, Diane.

DIANE, CALLER FROM WEST VIRGINIA: Hi, Nancy. First of all, I want to commend you on all the wonderful work that you do, especially with trying to help bring home children, missing children. You`re just -- you`re a real godsend.

GRACE: Thank you.

DIANE: And what I wonder is are they going to charge this 20-year-old with anything? I mean the girl is 17. Are there going to be -- has anything been said about any charges being brought against him?

GRACE: Yes, what about it, Ellie Jostad?

JOSTAD: Yes, Nancy. Well, right now, as the father explained, she`s being held in juvenile hall. And she is charged with two things. One of them is obstruction of official business. The same charge her boyfriend is facing. And she`s also charged with unruliness, which is a charge, you know --

GRACE: Ellie, did they really need leg shackles? Was that necessary? And have you ever heard me in my life say, "Were leg shackles necessary?" I don`t think I`ve ever said that, but in this particular case --

(LAUGHTER)

GRACE: I think it was a little over the top. But hopefully she was afraid.

We`ll be back with Abbi`s father. And a miracle she is alive.

Everyone, very quickly, I want to thank you for your support of my first murder mystery, "Eleventh Victim." You made it a "New York Times" best-seller. It`s on stands and paperback. Portions go to Wesley Glenn to provide a home for the mentally handicapped.

And on their behalf and mine, I want to thank you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

R. OBERMILLER: She just has to come home.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: That 17-year-old Ohio girl is missing.

R. OBERMILLER: It`s just getting too hard for her not being here.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: And her parents are begging for her safe return.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her boyfriend Bobby Young is acting awfully strange.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Back to you, Ellie. What is the boyfriend charged with? Bobby Young.

JOSTAD: Right. Well, Bobby Young is charged with obstruction of official business, interference of custody, contributing to the unruliness of a minor and falsification.

GRACE: That might land him six months. Unleash the lawyers. James Elliot, city attorney, Warner Robbins, Penny Douglass Furr, Atlanta, defense attorney Randy Zelin, defense attorney, New York.

Jim Elliot, what about it? What can you really expect -- what kind of jail time can he do?

JAMES ELLIOT, JR., CITY ATTORNEY, Doesn`t sound like anything terribly serious to me, Nancy. And some in the panels may disagree that the age difference between the two is not significant. The problem is in most states --

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Jail time, jail time, jail time, Jim.

ELLIOT: Yes.

GRACE: What am looking at? What can I get, six months, a year maybe?

ELLIOT: Six months. I would think six months.

GRACE: Well, unfortunately, I`m going to have to agree with you. I wish it was a little bit more. What about it, Penny?

PENNY DOUGLASS FURR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t think they should get any jail time. I think they`re just teenagers who took off together.

GRACE: I didn`t ask you what you thought. I asked you what really he`s going to get.

DOUGLASS FURR: He`ll get probation.

GRACE: I know you don`t think --

(CROSSTALK)

DOUGLASS FURR: If anything, he`ll get probation and she will too.

GRACE: Yes. I know she will with her stellar record.

Randy Zelin, what about it? What is he looking at?

RANDY ZELIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Look, he`s looking at jail time --

GRACE: Can we keep him in the can a couple of nights to scare him?

ZELIN: I mean there`s no question he probably could use it. She could probably use it also so they`re both going together. And I think the judge is being practical. He could get jail time. It`s a misdemeanor. Should he? No.

GRACE: Jeff Gardere, weigh in.

JEFF GARDERE, PSYCHOLOGIST, HOST OF VH1`S "DAD CAMP": This is a situation of where this young girl was involved in teen rebellion. And it was the perfect storm in hooking up with a guy who was controlling her in a way that was very negative.

The parents must work with her.

GRACE: Dr. Jeff, he even told her what to wear to school.

GARDERE: That`s right.

GRACE: He told her not to go New York on a choir trip.

GARDERE: That`s right. So even though she`s 17 and he`s 21, it`s not a significant difference.

GRACE: How would you like to wake up to that across the bedroom for 15 years?

GARDERE: Well, absolutely. But there is a difference between a 21- year-old and a 17-year-old. She`s still a child. He`s an adult and he`s controlling her.

GRACE: Everybody, let`s stop and remember Army Captain Kyle Comfort, 27, Jacksonville, Alabama, served Afghanistan, awarded Bronze Star, Purple Heart, National Defense Service medal, Army Service ribbon.

Never met a stranger. Loved motorcycles, the New York Yankees, Alabama football, his dog, Ace, favorite band AC/DC, leaves behinds mother, Ellen, sister Karina, brothers, Kenny and Kevin serving the army. Widow Brooke, daughter Kimlin (ph).

Kyle Comfort, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially you. And a special goodnight from friends of the show Haley and Michelle.

Everybody, I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern, and until then, goodnight, friends.

END