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Nancy Grace
Couple Tries to Sell Baby for $25 to Strangers in Parking Lot/Possible Van Der Sloot Link to Missing Thai Girls Explored
Aired July 02, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Wal-Mart, famous for rollbacks. Everybody knows you can get a great deal at Wal-Mart, literally hundreds of thousands of items on the inventory list. One thing they`re missing for sale, a baby girl. That`s right. Live, Salinas, California, a dad and mom try to sell their 9-month-old baby girl at Wal-Mart.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-eight-year-old Patrick Fousek has been arrested for allegedly trying to sell his baby girl in a Wal-Mart parking lot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The asking price, 25 bucks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two women told cops Fousek asked to use their cell phone. They told Fousek how cute the little girl was, and he allegedly replied to offer to sell the child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The two women thought, you know, he was joking around.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But Fousek kept at it, persistently asking the women to buy the child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was insistent. He kept telling them, No, I want to sell you the baby.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Even at one point, Fousek allegedly tries to hand them the baby, grab a shopping cart and start his shopping.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The women said no, got a description of the parents` vehicle and called police.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police quickly hone in on Fousek and the child`s mom, Samantha Tomasini, the child in CPS custody, the couple behind bars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police refuse to make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot even after he admits he hid the body. Tonight, live Peru, Van Der Sloot kills again. Another girl meets him at a resort casino. Hours later, she`s dead, beaten, bloody, neck broken, partially clothed on Van Der Sloot`s hotel room floor.
After a massive manhunt, Van Der Sloot captured. Spine-chilling video of Van Der Sloot with 21-year-old Stephany just before she`s found dead. Bloody clothes from the murder found with Van Der Sloot on the run. We learn after beating her to a pulp and breaking her neck, he kicks back with a cup of coffee and Danish inches from the dead body.
Van Der Sloot high on pot and Pisco sours the night Stephany`s murdered. Van Der Sloot now declares he was framed by police, forced into a confession, that he`s the victim. The dead girl`s fractures to the skull, severe injuries to face and neck, and she was smothered, blood drenching the crime scene, the bedroom floor, the bathroom floor, the bed, the hallway. DNA under the dead girl`s nails, proving a death match with the hulking Dutchman. A major clean-up uncovered in that hotel room. Crime scene photos of the dead girl`s hands and feet covered in bruises.
Bombshell tonight. Already suspected in two girls missing from casinos, Bogota, now reports Van Der Sloot linked to missing girls in Thailand, the judge`s son accused of luring girls into prostitution, posing as a consultant for a modeling agency, promising a lavish lifestyle as models in Holland, all caught on video. As Van Der Sloot`s indicted in the U.S., reports Van Der Sloot wants a $1 million TV deal.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me -- 15,000 is nothing for me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is Joran Van Der Sloot responsible for the disappearance of missing women in Thailand?
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: OK, 15,000 is nothing for you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thai investigators reportedly opening up an investigation, looking for links between Van Der Sloot and the disappearance of young women involved in the sex trade in Thailand.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was offering them a job as models.
VAN DER SLOOT: Look what you have to do for that. Here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was trying to coax them into prostitution.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "The National Enquirer" quotes a Thai law enforcement source who says there are girls who went missing in Bangkok when Van Der Sloot was there.
VAN DER SLOOT: If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I would shake my ass!
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Everybody knows you can get a deal at Wal- Mart, literally hundreds of thousands of items on the inventory list. One thing they are missing for sale, a baby. That`s right, a dad and the mother try to sell their 9-month-old baby girl at Wal-Mart.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was outside the Westridge (ph) Wal-Mart that police say 38-year-old Patrick Fousek and his 20-year-old girlfriend, Samantha Tomasini, tried to sell their 9-month old baby girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He asked the ladies, asked them, Do you want to buy the baby?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The alleged asking price just $25.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says, Do you want to buy the baby for $25?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The child`s mother allegedly sitting in the car silently during the incident.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who`s going to say, Do you want to buy a baby, to strangers on the -- at a Wal-Mart? That`s preposterous!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joke or no joke, police went looking for the parents and their baby and found them at this apartment complex.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... the baby living in unhealthy living conditions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police say the baby was asleep, but the apartment was filthy, and mom and dad, according to police, were high on crystal meth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Selling their baby at Wal-Mart. To Mark Carbonaro, program director, KION Newstalk, joining us from Monterey. What happened?
MARK CARBONARO, KION NEWSTALK (via telephone): Well, apparently, the couple, Patrick Fousek and Samantha Tomasini, Nancy, along with Patrick`s twin brother, David, went to the Wal-Mart store that evening. And he was talking, you know, got out of the car, had the baby with him, and he was bantering with a couple of women in the parking lot there. And they told him how cute they thought the baby was. And he said, Well, do you want to buy the baby? You can have her for 25 bucks. And they thought he was joking. And -- but he became very, very insistent, and at one point, he even tried to thrust the baby into the arms of one of the women. And at that point, they decided...
GRACE: And Mommy -- and Mommy is sitting by, Mark Carbonaro, right?
CARBONARO: She`s sitting out in the car...
GRACE: She hears the whole thing.
CARBONARO: You know, she`s like a cigar store Indian, just sitting in the car with a mute look on her face. You know, and the twin brother is in there. as well. And so apparently, they call 911, Nancy. And they give a description of Mr. Fousek, the baby, the car, the license plate, and they made the police`s work easy for them.
I mean, thank God for these good citizens that went ahead and did that civic duty because they made the police job very easy. They came to the apartment a few minutes later on East Romie Lane, and they found the two of them, Mr. Fousek and Ms. Tomasini, high on crystal meth and the baby there in this, you know, fetid squalor of their apartment. And so Mom and Dad are now in jail, and the baby is in child protective custody.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. But now special guest Vanessa Chobanian, grandmother of the baby that was almost sold at Wal-Mart. Mommy and Daddy tried to unload the 9-month-old baby girl.
You know how many people would kill for a baby? They would do anything. They would pay all their money. They would give everything they`ve got to have a baby. And these two were selling their baby at Wal- Mart to a complete stranger. And when the stranger couldn`t give them $25, they tried to just put the baby on them and leave, leave the baby with some person in the parking lot. Well, thank God that person ended up being an angel who called police. The baby found in squalor, the mommy and daddy high on meth.
With me right now, a woman who cares very much about the little baby. Take a look at what happens to people on meth. With me right now, joining us out of Palo Alto, California, Vanessa Chobanian. This is the baby`s grandmother. Ms. Chobanian, thank you for being with us.
VANESSA CHOBANIAN, GRANDMOTHER: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for having me.
GRACE: Tell me about the little baby. First of all, you don`t need to give me her full name. I know the nickname is Peanut. So go ahead. Tell me about the baby.
CHOBANIAN: Oh, she`s the most beautiful baby in the world. I mean, just so physically beautiful. She has a bunch of dark hair, huge eyes, a little button nose and just the most beautiful smile. She`s always smiling. She`s always happy. She never cries. I mean, she is an absolute angel. We love her. I mean, I can`t express how much our family loves her and how much I love her.
GRACE: And look at her! Ms. Chobanian, we`re showing -- we can`t show the little baby`s face, so we blurred it out. But those were shots from father Patrick Fousek`s MySpace page, including the little Peanut, as you call her. She`s absolutely beautiful. And you know what? I know that I`ve got two right now, and I wish I had two more. I wish I had five more because with children, it just -- it changes your whole life.
What got into them! Selling the baby at Wal-Mart? Ms. Chobanian, what is wrong with them?
CHOBANIAN: I don`t -- Nancy, I don`t know if you know, but you know, I saw that baby pretty much every day until that baby was about 6-and-a- half months old. And my daughter physically assaulted me, and then after that, you know, they kept me from the baby. I know now in hindsight that, you know, it was probably to hide their drug use because prior to that, that baby was very well cared for. You know, if it had a dirty diaper, it was changed immediately. It was, you know, being breastfed, very well taken care of.
GRACE: Oh! Oh! Oh! Oh! Wait! Wait! You just gave me a chest pain. To Dr. Michael Arnall, board-certified forensic pathologist out of Denver. Dr. Arnall, Mommy -- no offense, Ms. Chobanian, but Mommy is a meth freak. And she`s breastfeeding? Doctor, is that a problem?
DR. MICHAEL ARNALL, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Yes, the baby`s going to get methamphetamine through the breast milk, and there`s a possibility of brain damage and heart damage from that methamphetamine.
GRACE: What would meth do to a little baby? This girl is 9 months old.
ARNALL: Well, methamphetamine is a very powerful drug, and it could harm the baby just the same as it harms adults.
GRACE: Joining us right now from Salinas, California, PIO of the Salinas Police Department, Officer Lalo Villegas. Officer, thank you for being with us. Tell us what happened when your people got to the Wal-Mart.
OFFICER LALO VILLEGAS, SALINAS POLICE DEPARTMENT (via telephone): Well, they approached the two women, and the two women basically told our officers that Mr. Fousek was trying to sell the baby for $25. They were definitely surprised. But Mr. Fousek was very insistent, wanting to sell the baby, and at that time, they figured out that this wasn`t a joke and called 911. They -- I mean, did an awesome job by giving our officers a description of Mr. Fousek and...
GRACE: Right.
VILLEGAS: ... Ms. Tomasini and...
GRACE: And you may notice in some of the video that the male perpetrator has gotten a little spanking behind bars. That`s courtesy of fellow inmates that found out he tried to sell his baby at Wal-Mart!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-eight-year-old Patrick Fousek has been arrested for allegedly trying to sell his baby girl at a Wal-Mart parking lot for $25. Two women told cops Fousek asked to use their cell phone. They told Fousek how cute the little girl was, and he allegedly replied to offer to sell the child for 25 bucks. The women laughed it off, but Fousek kept at it, persistently asking the women to buy the child. Even at one point, Fousek allegedly tries to hand them the baby, grab a shopping cart and start his shopping. The women call 911. Police quickly hone in on Fousek and the child`s mom, Samantha Tomasini, the child in CPS custody, the couple behind bars.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was outside the Westridge Wal-Mart that police say 38-year-old Patrick Fousek and his 20-year-old girlfriend, Samantha Tomasini, tried to sell their 9-month-old baby girl. The asking price, 25 bucks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You know, Lucy and I almost died during child birth, OK, and I would do it all over again to have the twins. Here`s Eleanor Odom on the set, who`s putting her daughter through college and would do it all over again, I know for a fact. Same thing with you, Peter, Alex Sanchez, all of us with children, that we would do it all over again.
Let`s hear your defense, Sanchez.
ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, I wonder why the parties are both being charged with the exact same offense. I can understand why he`s being charged with that offense of trying to sell the child...
GRACE: Put Sanchez up, please!
SANCHEZ: ... but why is she being charged? She wasn`t...
GRACE: Because she sat there and went along with it!
SANCHEZ: No. No. She was not out in the street trying to negotiate the sale of this child.
GRACE: She was about three feet away listening!
SANCHEZ: Right. But what did she do to act in concert to help sell that child?
GRACE: It was her baby!
SANCHEZ: Right. But what did she do...
GRACE: They went to Wal-Mart...
SANCHEZ: ... to participate in the sale?
GRACE: They didn`t go in there to get a good deal on frozen peas. They went there to get rid of their baby, and she went, and frankly, I think the brother should be charged, too. What about that, Peter Odom?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, how do you defend the indefensible, trying to sell this beautiful child?
GRACE: I don`t know. That`s your job. I don`t get paid to do that. You do.
PETER ODOM: But this is a story -- as you correctly point out, Nancy, in sort of the take on this story, this is a story about crystal meth. That is the absolute worst drug.
GRACE: No.
SANCHEZ: When people are in the grips of that drug...
GRACE: It`s not -- put him up!
SANCHEZ: When people are in the grips...
GRACE: This is not about...
SANCHEZ: ... of that drug...
GRACE: ... crystal meth!
SANCHEZ: It absolutely is.
GRACE: This is about a 9-month-old baby girl!
SANCHEZ: And this is about...
GRACE: Voluntary use of drugs or alcohol are not a defense, Peter Odom! Don`t even fix your mouth to say that!
SANCHEZ: It`s not a defense, Nancy, but...
GRACE: Yes, I know, so...
SANCHEZ: ... that`s what at the root of this.
GRACE: ... why are you saying it?
SANCHEZ: These people are in the grips of this drug, and they don`t care about anything else. They`ve become despicable because of the worst drug ever.
GRACE: Eleanor...
SANCHEZ: And this baby`s a victim of crystal meth.
GRACE: Eleanor -- I don`t think you`re Eleanor, Peter!
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Nancy, yes, there is crystal meth involved. But they tried to sell the baby for 25. Party to a crime, they can all be charged. And guess what? They can be charged with contributing to the delinquency of a minor...
GRACE: You know what?
ELEANOR ODOM: ... for having that baby...
GRACE: Eleanor...
ELEANOR ODOM: ... in a filthy house.
GRACE: I was wrong. I was wrong for grilling Odom and Sanchez. What we really need right now is a shrink, OK? Go ahead, Bethany. Hit it.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: OK. Parents who are severe drug addicts, what they do is they refuse to give the child to a loving family member who could take care of the child, like the lovely grandmother who`s on your show. No. What they do is they latch onto the child in an evil, pathological, possessive way, as if to prove that they`re not drug addicts, and then later, they barter the child for goods and services, whether it`s state funds, whether -- in this case, selling the drug for their next hit...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Dr. Bethany, guess how much one hit of meth goes for?
MARSHALL: Tell me.
GRACE: Twenty-five dollars Now, I was surprised by that because you can get a $5 hit of crack. But apparently, meth costs more. Marlaina Schiavo, New York, weigh in.
MARLAINA SCHIAVO, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, the crazy part about this story is that...
GRACE: Whoa! Whoa! The crazy part?
SCHIAVO: Another crazy part about this story, Nancy, is that the grandmother we have on the show tried to call CPS just 24 hours before they tried to sell this baby.
GRACE: Is that true, Vanessa?
CHOBANIAN: Actually, Nancy, I`m glad you came back to me. I need to clear something up.
GRACE: OK.
CHOBANIAN: You stopped when I said that my granddaughter was being breastfed. For the first 6-and-a-half months of her life, Samantha was not on crystal meth. Me and my grandma were going over there and seeing her every day. My daughter was a very healthy weight. She didn`t appear -- she had no signs of drug usage. That -- I was taking my granddaughter and her to the baby`s doctor`s appointments. The doctors were raving about how the baby was growing so fast, how much weight the baby was putting on. I mean, we saw...
GRACE: Well, what about the last 2-and-a-half months?
CHOBANIAN: I was kept from the baby. I was kept from the baby. What your psychiatrist, I believe, said is exactly what they did to me. They used that child. They held onto her and they used her as a barter -- bartering tool.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VAN DER SLOOT: If I could shake my ass for 15,000, I would shake my ass for 15,000!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... allegedly been caught on tape recruiting Thai woman to work in the sex industry in Europe.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did violate the law both in Thailand and the Dutch law, and that he can be prosecuted for that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot keeping his mouth shut for now as media reporting he`ll open up on camera for a million bucks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: One word. Freak! Joran Van Der Sloot now potentially linked to missing girls in Thailand. We know about Natalee Holloway. We know about Stephany Tatiana Flores in Peru. We know about two missing girls in Bogota in casinos. Now reports a possible link between the judge`s son, Joran Van Der Sloot, and young girls in Thailand, girls he allegedly tried to lure into the sex trade.
Dana, cue up that sound for me again of actual video of him trying to lure young girls into the sex trade. He posed as a head honcho of a modeling agency, complete with bogus business cards, luring them to a lavish lifestyle in Holland as a model. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, 15,000 is nothing for me. It`s nothing.
VAN DER SLOOT: OK, 15,000 is nothing for you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So 15,000 is nothing for her.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) but then we do overtime (ph). Yes, maybe we can do that (INAUDIBLE)
VAN DER SLOOT: OK. But look what you have to do for that. For here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for 15,000, I would shake my ass for 15,000!
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Confessed killer Joran Van Der Sloot under investigation for disappearance of young women, women he recruited for the sex trade in Thailand, girls missing in Bangkok while Van Der Sloot there.
Let`s go to Victoria Macchi, investigative reporter, joining us out of Lima, Peru. Right now, what`s the latest on Van Der Sloot in that Peruvian jailhouse?
VICTORIA MACCHI, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER (via telephone): Nancy, this is -- the latest from his judge -- or from his attorney is that they have filed another appeal. They are appealing the petition for a writ of habeas corpus on the grounds that his attorney, the defense attorney that is listed on his confession, Luz Marino Romero Chinchay (ph), wasn`t chosen by Joran, but in fact, was imposed on him, that she is in collusion with the Peruvian national police and that she didn`t properly represent him.
GRACE: More legal mumbo-jumbo! Joran Van Der Sloot now potentially linked to missing women in Bangkok!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "So I took my shirt and put it on her face pressing hard until I killed Stephany."
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Is he connected to more alleged crimes?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT, SUSPECT IN THE DISAPPEARANCE OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY CASE: And he offering you 15,000 bucks to dance.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A new report indicates police are looking to link Joran Van Der Sloot to even more missing women.
VAN DER SLOOT: I understand. You tell me that you have school to finish. I understand. And you can tell me, OK, after your school we talk about it again?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The "National Inquirer" reports Thai police are looking into women who vanished when Joran was in Thailand.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How long I have to dance for? One hour, two hours?
VAN DER SLOOT: No, like 10 hours a day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s too much.
VAN DER SLOOT: No, no, no.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "We were in her car, a black vehicle, when we were detained by a white car with two men inside wearing police uniforms and badges. They made us go into their car and they started asking for money or else. I offered about $1,000 but they refused it. And I offered $4,000 and they accepted it.
"Then one of them said to give them something to remember them by so I gave them one of my bracelets that I brought with me from Thailand and they left us. They had dark skin and they were always talking in Spanish but with the uniforms it`s hard for me to give an exact description. One of them was a lot younger than the other."
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Back to Victoria Macchi and Rupa Mikkilineni. Also with us Ellie Jostad.
Rupa, what about the reports of the missing Thai women?
RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s right, Nancy. You remember from the surveillance video that Peter De Vries took two years ago. Thai police were shown this video and they did nothing. They did not pursue charges against Joran Van Der Sloot two years ago.
Now, suddenly, they are looking at missing women in Thailand, in the Bangkok area, that could have gone missing around the same time that Joran Van Der Sloot was living there. Now if you`ll recall, Nancy, Van Der Sloot claims he had a legitimate business. A coffee shop, bread shop, pizza shop which he recently sold before moving back to Aruba when his father passed away.
GRACE: To Ellie Jostad, what was the set up? How would he try to lure these young women?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Well, the way that Peter De Vries described it is that these women would come in. They`d be told that they`d be going over to Holland. They`d work as either dancers, models, et cetera.
According to De Vries, what the real intention was, however, is as soon as they got there, got to Holland, away from their families, they had fake papers, then they would be forced into prostitution. They`d have to work in brothels.
GRACE: Out to the lines, Julie, New Jersey. Hi, dear.
JULIE, CALLER FROM NEW JERSEY: Hi, Nancy. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good. What`s your question?
JULIE: I become more and more disturbed. And my question, just how many of these Thai women are missing?
GRACE: I want to go back to you, Rupa. We have been told about two. Do you -- are there possible links to others?
MIKKILINENI: There could be, Nancy. Police are not saying. And we are hearing this from other media reports right now.
GRACE: Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son and a confessed killer, under investigation for the disappearance of young women he allegedly recruited for the Thai sex trade. He even went so far, didn`t he, Ellie Jostad, to give a phone number of a friend back in -- and I believe it was in Holland.
It was a bogus phone number for these women. If they dialed the number there would be an answering machine or a person there and then he tried to get another friend in on the deal and that friend alerted the Dutch media.
JOSTAD: Right, Nancy. Well, and another thing that he did that Peter De Vries learned in his investigation is that he actually used a name Murphy Jenkins. He got business cards printed out that said DND or DD Consultants on them, that he would hand out to these women as if it were a legitimate business.
GRACE: The business was a modeling agency or what?
JOSTAD: It just says DD Consulting on it. But I believe what they tell them is they`re going to be working in clubs. They`re just going to be working like a hostess type job.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, specialist in crimes on women and children. Michael Griffith, international attorney, criminal defense attorney joining us out of New York. Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta, Alex Sanchez, defense attorney, New York.
Will it ever end, Michael Griffith?
MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY/CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY (via phone): Nancy, I hope not because, you know, I`ve defended Americans all over the world. When he gets back to the United States, he`ll have another trial there for the extortion.
If there is a connection to Thailand, then if he gets out of the U.S. prison he`ll wind up in prison in Thailand if there`s a connection.
Nancy, it sounds like that this guy is a lawyer`s dream. It will never end.
GRACE: Michael Griffith, tell me a little bit about the jails in Thailand. We think the Peruvian jails are bad. What about Thailand?
GRIFFITH: Yes, I`ve been there, Nancy. I`ve been in two or three jails in Thailand. And I can tell you that even though Lurigancho is the worst I`ve ever been in, Thailand is a very tough place to go because it`s very, very hot. The guards are quite brutal. You need money to live there.
In fact, I represented a U.S. woman from Detroit there and I represented an 80-year-old man who was there for drugs. He was a merchant seaman. They are not nice prisons. And once again I don`t think that this Van Der Sloot, Nancy, will survive Lurigancho. He`s got big problems.
GRACE: Eleanor?
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: I agree, Nancy. And how often have we said a leopard doesn`t change his spots? Just look at Joran Van Der Sloot and how women end up missing when they`re around him. It`s got to be looked into. And he needs to be prosecuted for any and all crimes.
GRACE: Jennifer in New Jersey. Hi, Jennifer, what`s your question?
JENNIFER, CALLER FROM NEW JERSEY: Hi, Nancy. It`s so good to talk to you.
GRACE: Likewise.
JENNIFER: I just want to know, if Joran Van Der Sloot is going to be persecuted -- excuse me, prosecuted in Peru, when will he face the extortion charges in the United States? Or will he ever?
GRACE: How will that work, Alex Sanchez? And remember, everybody, the extortion case that Julie is talking about is a quarter million dollar plot hatched up by Van Der Sloot to try to sell the location of Natalee Holloway`s body to her mother Beth Twitty.
Go ahead, Alex.
ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: He may never be prosecuted for that extortion case. Look, this Peruvian murder case takes priority. He may end up spending many years in jail in Peru. And after all those years if the United States wants him -- to prosecute him, I guess they would extradite him and 15 years from now. And then try to prosecute him. I think that`s unlikely at this point.
GRACE: Peter Odom?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Right. After he`s done with his prison term in Peru which is a virtual certainty, he`s then going to be expelled from Peru back to his native country of Aruba or -- and then the United States might have a shot at him if there`s an extradition treaty. And if he`s extraditable. Very doubtful that those cases will ever go to court.
GRACE: To Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers."
Dr. Bethany, you just saw the video of him speaking to young girls. It`s playing there at the top left. That`s in Thailand. Now reports surfaced that some of the girls that he allegedly recruited for the sex trade have gone missing.
You`ve taken a look at the video. They don`t look as if they`re older than 17 or 18 years old.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": No. And this fits the profile of the serial killer. What do they do? They find women who are sexually available, vulnerable, disenfranchised, cut off from family support so that there`s no one there to protect them and then they prey on these women with a mixture of sexual excitement and contempt.
And we remember what the psychological evaluator in Peru said about Joran that he had willful disdain or contempt for women and that`s what I see towards these women. He`s laughing and joking and ha ha ha. But what`s really going on? Contempt? Homicidal intent? Something along those lines.
GRACE: Well, think about it. To you, Jay Salpeter, private investigator, former NYPD homicide.
Hay, the Thai is sex trade Bangkok. That would be a serial killer`s dream.
JAY SALPETER, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR, FORMER NYC HOMICIDE DETECTIVE: I`ll tell you history shows that in Peru the reason -- the only reason he was arrested is because we finally have a body. But this guy is good. If you don`t have a body, this guy will never confess, Joran.
The only reason he`s arrested there was because thank god forensically they were able to tie him into this crime. Otherwise he`s -- get the body first and then let`s see what happens. He`s not going to confess.
GRACE: Quickly to break to tonight`s case alert. Golf superstar Tiger Woods and wife Elin Nordegren reaching a divorce settlement and it`s pricey. Elin Nordegren allegedly scoring three quarter a billion dollars. Between $750 and $775 million. $750 million. The largest single celebrity divorce settlement in history.
Elin`s lawyer digging up Woods` hidden assets. Allegations he hid those assets.
Also landing her multiple properties in Florida and Sweden and physical custody of both children. Only price tag? Her silence. Nordegren barred from interviews and tell-all books even if Woods precedes her in death.
With Woods set to lose a chunk of his wealth, the golfing great also barred from bringing his, quote, "girlfriends" around the children.
As we go to break, happy birthday to Indiana friend, Mary Rose Engler, celebrating her 83rd birthday. She doesn`t look a day over 50.
From a family full of twins, eight sets on her side alone, Mary has five children, 12 grandchildren, 9 great grandchildren.
Happy birthday, Mary.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I didn`t want to do it. The girl intruded into my private life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I was explaining to her that five years ago I was accused in a case of a missing girl."
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Van Der Sloot`s mother, Anita, says he`s mentally ill.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "All of a sudden she hit me. I don`t know why."
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She says her son was supposed to be committed to a psych hospital but fled instead to Peru.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A new reports indicates police are looking to link Joran Van Der Sloot to even more missing women.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, $15,000 is nothing for me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joran was pretending he was the owner of a model agency.
VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000 is nothing for you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He produced false business cards and then he promised these girls a better life in Holland.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, 15,000 is nothing for me. It`s nothing.
VAN DER SLOOT: OK. 15,000 is nothing for you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.
VAN DER SLOOT: 15,000 is nothing for her. It`s nothing.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But then we do overtime. Yes, maybe we can do that like 15,000 --
VAN DER SLOOT: OK. But look what you have to do for that. For here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for 15,000, I would shake my ass for 15,000.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.
VAN DER SLOOT: And he`s offering you 15,000 bucks to dance. And I understand you tell that you have school and have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me, OK, after your school we talk about again?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. And how long I have to dance for? For one hour? Two hour?
VAN DER SLOOT: No, like, like 10 hour a day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s too much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "She was on the bed when I hit her with the right elbow with force and I think her head went backwards and hit the wall. Then she started bleeding and immediately I got on top of her and with both hands I started to strangle her, keeping her like that for a minute.
"Then I threw her to the floor but she was still breathing so I took the shirt I was still wearing and put it on her face pressing. Can`t remember how much time but she stopped breathing and I think that`s how I killed her.
"In my blind panic I signed everything but never knew what was written on them. I was very scared and confused during the interrogations and wanted to get away. I was tricked. I`ll explain later how it all happened. How exactly how this has gone I`ll tell you later. I was framed."
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Out to the lines, Claire in Connecticut. Hi, Claire.
CLAIRE, CALLER FROM CONNECTICUT: Hi, Nancy. It`s so good to talk to you. I love your twins. They`re so cute.
GRACE: Thank you. And thank you for calling in, dear. What`s your question?
CLAIRE: Well, I just want to know, is it true that Joran Van Der Sloot is getting marriage proposals behind bars?
GRACE: Well, I`m sorry to report, Claire in Connecticut, that it is true.
To Victoria Macchi, joining us from Lima, Peru. Victoria, he is in fact getting marriage proposals behind bars.
VICTORIA MACCHI, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER (via phone): Nancy, we`ve gotten mixed information on this. His lawyer says that the allegations that he`s getting the marriage proposals and he`s getting the letters are untrue. We`ve heard from the media, however, that he is in fact getting it. From prison sources they`ve said that he is sin fact getting these marriage proposals.
GRACE: OK. You know what? That`s just sick. What about it, Bethany?
MARSHALL: Because these women confuse power, love, and violence. All those states are one and the same. And sometimes they have abuse histories themselves. So in a way they think power and homicidal intent is sexy and it is sick.
GRACE: You know, Eleanor Odom, I`ve seen it many, many times where women fall for guys behind bars including Ted Bundy. You know there`s just -- I don`t understand it.
E. ODOM: Exactly. And, Nancy, if you pull sometimes the visitor logs for these men, you can just see who`s come to visit him and it`s mainly women. And sometimes even their girlfriends will bring their babies.
GRACE: And remember, Michael Griffith, the Menendez brothers? One of them actually got married behind bars. A woman left her husband and moved her daughter from another state to be closer to Menendez`s jail.
Michael, what about it?
GRIFFITH: They`re not my type, Nancy. But --
GRACE: That`s your comment? They`re not your type? Good to know. What about it, Alex Sanchez?
SANCHEZ: It`s disturbing to believe that some woman would be interested in a known criminal. By the way, Nancy, I don`t want you to get away with this one point which I think is very important.
Why would you put so much reliance on the Thai authorities? They`re so corrupt. They`re in bed with the people that own the brothels. Anything they say is suspect. So the fact that, you know, we`re broadcasting this informing is prejudicial to Joran Van Der Sloot.
GRACE: Put him up. OK. So, number one, I see him on video. I know that`s Joran Van Der Sloot trying to lure what appear to be underage women into the Thai sex trade.
SANCHEZ: The sex trade.
GRACE: And who do you want me to believe, Van Der Sloot, the confessed killer?
SANCHEZ: No, but -- no.
GRACE: Who I believe that I know he`s killed two women including an American girl?
SANCHEZ: No. But these Thai authorities are so corrupt --
GRACE: That`s my choice?
SANCHEZ: They`re so liars they`re taking bribes from these brothels.
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: I wouldn`t rely on what they have to say, Nancy.
GRACE: Has there ever been a criminal case you handled where you didn`t say the cops did something wrong or lied?
SANCHEZ: Many.
GRACE: Ever?
SANCHEZ: Many. When they`ve supported my client.
GRACE: There. There. That`s a yes-no. What about it, Odom?
P. ODOM: I didn`t see him killing anybody on that tape, Nancy. And to suggest that somehow because there are missing women and because he was trying to lure people on a sex trade that he`s responsible for killing them.
GRACE: No, that`s not what we said.
P. ODOM: That connection just hasn`t been made. That connection just hasn`t been made.
GRACE: We said that allegedly women that he tried to recruit are now missing.
P. ODOM: I know what the implication is.
GRACE: That`s a much bigger connection than women missing and he happened to be in the country.
P. ODOM: The implication is clear. And I think a little more is needed before there`s any evidence that he`s responsible for any missing women.
GRACE: You say that about every single case.
P. ODOM: Evidence is important, Nancy. You knew that as a prosecutor and you know it now.
GRACE: Yes?
P. ODOM: Evidence is the only thing that can be used to convict someone.
GRACE: Yes, evidence like the video I just showed you. Weigh in, Eleanor.
E. ODOM: You know, Nancy, this is typical of the defense. They want to blame the police. They want to say there`s no evidence because that`s all they have. But look, you can see with your own eyes what Joran Van Der Sloot is doing.
GRACE: To Dr. Michael Arnall, let`s talk about the Thai issue. If Thai authorities were to find the bodies forensically can they link him back this much later?
DR. MICHAEL ARNALL, BOARD CERTIFIED FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Yes, they - - they surely can. They can do swabs on those body the same as we do swabs. Swabs of the mouth and below the belt to determine whether the assailant left any DNA on that body.
GRACE: And now, to CNN Heroes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SGT. ALEXANDER REYES, U.S. ARMY: Baghdad ended up being a hell of a ride. I sustained a very severe blast injury. My life just came to a complete halt.
DAN WALLRATH, CNN HERO: How you doing? How`s everything? You look sharp today.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
WALLRATH: I`ve been building custom homes for 30 years. And one of the most important things for a family is a home.
I want you to read a sign for me.
REYES: Future home of Sergeant Alexander Reyes, United States Army.
WALLRATH: Congratulations.
Giving these folks a new home, that means the world.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just thank you. That`s all I can say.
WALLRATH: My name is Dan Wallrath. Five years ago I had a friend of mine call me. A friend of his, his son had been injured in Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the day after he graduated from boot camp.
WALLRATH: He showed me some picture. His son was a big, strapping marine. Then he showed me pictures of Stephen in the hospital. It just broke my heart.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stephen was wheelchair bound. We were going to have to remodel. I had no idea how I was going to pay for it. Dan just said, we`re going to take care of it.
WALLRATH: I remodeled that home. And I realized this is not an isolated case. And so I went back to my builder buddies and said we`ve got to do something.
We build homes for returning heroes from Iraq and Afghanistan. The houses are mortgage-free. It changes a whole family`s life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Welcome home.
WALLRATH: Gives them just a new start so that they can move forward. These young men and women are doing this for you and me. How can I not help them?
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Tonight we celebrate the Fourth of July, and we stop to remember men and women who sacrificed their lives for our freedom.
Let`s stop and remember retired Army Major Ed Freeman, 80, Boise, Ohio. A Vietnam, World War II and Korea veteran. A helicopter pilot during Vietnam. Flew unarmed under heavy fire to supply troops and rescue dozens of wounded soldiers.
Jason Burnett, 20, St. Cloud, Florida, killed Iraq. Awarded the National Service Medal, Iraq Campaign Medal, Seas Service Deployment ribbon. Loved mission trips with his church group.
Army Staff Sergeant Kyle Eggers, 27, Euless, Texas, awarded Bronze Star, Purple Heart, never met a stranger. Leaves behind parents Keith and Diane, sister Cristy, widow Jennifer, sons Kaidan, Tegan and Zane.
Army Captain Kyle Comfort, 27, Jacksonville, Alabama, served Afghanistan. Awarded a Bronze Star, Purple Heart, National Defense Service Medal, Army Service Ribbon.
Navy SEAL chief Adam Brown, 36, Hot Springs, Arkansas, served Afghanistan. Awarded the Bronze Star, Purple Heart, three Afghanistan Campaign Medals, two Global War on Terrorism Service Medals, two combat action badges. A Sunday school teacher.
Thanks to our guests, but especially to you for being with us. A special good night from the New York control room.
Good night, Bret, Dana, Squeaky, Evil, Elizabeth somewhere.
Everyone, as I say good night tonight, a special celebration this weekend for July 4th. Let`s not forget all of those who have served our country.
I`ll see you tomorrow night. 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
