Return to Transcripts main page

Nancy Grace

Kidnapped 4-Year-Old Found, Possible Abductor Dead

Aired July 07, 2010 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. A beautiful 4-year-old little girl playing in her own front yard with her brother, Mommy and Daddy just go in to make dinner, snatched in seconds. Mommy desperate, chases the kidnapper`s car, a dark sedan. But Mommy couldn`t catch it, the little girl gone.

Bombshell tonight. There is a God! Live, Missouri. After our broadcast last night, the baby, Alisa, found alive, 4-year-old Alisa spotted wandering alone in the dark at a closed car wash, her hair cropped short to look like a boy, 80 miles from where she was snatched, her own front yard. And at the moment, as we go to air, another bombshell. The perp, the perp that took the baby, identified and shot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police say Alisa Maier was found alive.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re told that she is in good condition.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Missouri police are searching for the man who snatched a 4-year-old girl from her front yard.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s a white male, possibly dark-skinned white male, short, dark hair, early 30s.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police won`t say exactly what she experienced in those 24 hours that she was missing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s unharmed. That`s what they say. I mean, I`m sure she`s harmed, but...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) information regarding this case. What we have right now is at approximately 4:30 this evening, this afternoon, we were -- officers were talking to an individual, actually approached an individual up in Lincoln County, in Hawk Point...

GRACE: We`re taking you live right now to a live press conference. The baby girl has been found, the perpetrator identified and shot.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... shot himself. At that point, he was transported for medical attention. I don`t know his condition at this time. I really do not have that information. I can tell you, though, one bit of more information. There was a dark-colored vehicle there in the -- at this residence, if you will. I can`t get into any more detail other than that. I know we released a lot of details about that car, such as wheel covers and loud mufflers and things like that. But right now, that`s at is considered evidence, that vehicle. But I will tell you it`s a dark- colored passenger car.

Rick, you have anything else you`d like to add?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you know, obviously, eight hours ago, we had a press conference and we said we were going to work very hard with a lot of different law enforcement agencies, and we have. And we`re still going to continue that investigation. This was an individual of -- a person of interest, call him a suspect. It`s an individual we wanted to talk to, and we can`t at this point, so our investigation is going to continue.

We need to get evidence from that vehicle, if there is any. We need to find out the actions and the whereabouts of this individual prior to him shooting himself. And we`re not going to stop the investigation just because one of the individuals we wanted to talk to shot himself. We`re still continuing this investigation. We still would entertain any leads or any information that someone wanted to call us, and it`s still the same number, at 889-2341.

QUESTION: Is this just coincidence that there`s a major case squad investigation going on into another homicide in the exact same town? Do you have any concern that maybe this guy had something to do with that, or is that just our concoction?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t think we`re ruling out anything at this time. Everything`s still on the table. Obviously, this investigation is still ongoing. I know it`s -- I know this child came up missing several days ago, but to be honest with you, we still got a lot of work to do here. We`re still pretty much at the foothills of this investigation. We`ll get to the top of the hill, but it`s going to take -- it`s going to take a little bit more time.

QUESTION: Can you...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everything`s still on the table.

QUESTION: Can you confirm that this Paul Sterling (ph) Smith is the person of interest you`re talking about?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I cannot confirm that.

QUESTION: Can you confirm that this person is a sex offender, whoever it is?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I cannot confirm that, either. I cannot individually confirm that through my independent knowledge of that. I really don`t know.

QUESTION: Can you talk about what led police to approach him at this location?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were there to talk to him about the abduction case.

QUESTION: What brought them to that point? How did they find him?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m not sure. Do you know why they -- why they...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, our investigation, actually, we received dozens and dozens of tips. And one of the tips gave us information on an individual driving the car that we thought we were looking for, and it was information that we thought was good. We had the address of the individual, so it was at that point that we sent officers up there to talk to him. Like I said, he was a person of interest in this investigation at the time the officers approached. It was at that time that he apparently shot himself.

QUESTION: Did they have any opportunity to talk to him, or did he just shoot himself right away?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My understanding is -- and like I said, they have a separate investigation going on up there in Lincoln County. But my understanding is, as the officers approached, this individual pulled out a gun and shot himself. So there was no conversation that I -- my understanding, at least.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, there -- as far as I know, as soon as they approached him, he pulled out a gun and shot himself. There was no confrontation or anything like that.

QUESTION: Was he inside the house, or was he already outside the house?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe he was outside...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... outside the house, near the vehicle.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And it`s still -- it`s still an active crime scene at this time. And we -- Lincoln County is up there investigating that incident, and they`re going to send us information. That`s why we can`t confirm anything at this time because, you know, we have to wait. We have to move slow on this to make sure we`re accurate if we release the information. And we do not have confirmation yet on this individual`s identity or his involvement with our original investigation.

QUESTION: Chief Hughes (ph), could we get you to step up to the mike for a minute? Can you give us your reaction to what`s transpired in last 48 hours in this case?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only thing that I would really want to comment on is that Alisa`s back and safe. I don`t want to say anything that would interfere with this investigation. That`s really all I can say about it.

QUESTION: You got to be thrilled that you may have already identified a primary suspect.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can`t speak to anything about the investigation. It`s ongoing.

QUESTION: Sergeant Milton (ph) (INAUDIBLE) you talk about the fact -- are you still looking for a dark-colored vehicle. Should the people still be on the lookout?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Definitely. Yes. Everything`s still on the table. We`re not -- we`re not saying this is our suspect. We`re saying he`s a person of interest. Therefore, we`ll take any tip, any lead, anything we have on anybody that has any information regarding that little girl`s abduction.

QUESTION: Can you recap the development in Lincoln County tonight?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To recap it, about 4:30, officers approached a residence where a dark-colored vehicle was parked, attempted to contact this person. This individual pulled out a gun and shot himself. That`s pretty much all we know at this time.

QUESTION: The vehicle, though, potentially, I guess, suspect vehicle or a match for the one being described since Alisa`s abduction.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I don`t know if it`s a perfect match, but I do know it`s a dark-colored vehicle. And that`s -- that`s all we put out originally was a dark-colored vehicle. So I don`t know if that means it`s dark green, dark brown or black, but it was a dark-colored vehicle.

QUESTION: What about the description of the man who shot himself? Was that a close match or somewhat match (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I don`t know. I didn`t see the guy. I don`t know. I don`t have a description of him, so I really can`t answer that.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don`t know that. You got to remember this is evidence. This vehicle`s evidence, so we`re not going to rush in there and start...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My understanding is the vehicle was quarantined, and the officers did not go inside the vehicle, did not start the vehicle, did not do any of that confirmation for us. We`re going to have to process that vehicle because, obviously, there may be some forensic evidence inside.

QUESTION: Were these county officers that made initial contact?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My understanding is that we called out and we had different groups going out to different locations, so I`m not sure which group of officers actually confronted this individual. But we had several leads, good leads. We had several teams out there, you know, trying to find several different individuals. So I`m not sure who the actual officers were. They weren`t singled (ph) as county police officers, but they may have been Lincoln County officers or...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... what agency they were from.

QUESTION: Can you tell us how many persons of interest you have in this case?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not right now, no.

QUESTION: More than one?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have good leads at this point. Like I said, this person was definitely someone we wanted to talk to. But right now, we don`t want to say he was the only one.

QUESTION: Did this person live where the shooting happened? Was that his residence?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, I`m not sure if that`s his residence or not. I believe it could have been, but I can`t speak on that for sure.

QUESTION: But it was at a residence?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was at a residence, yes, there in Hawk Point.

QUESTION: And was he working on the car at the time, when they came up?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know. I don`t know if he was working on the car.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) you`re saying this isn`t necessarily the suspect, a person of interest and there could be others?

QUESTION: You said they hadn`t been inside the car yet, I guess, to look and see if there was any trace.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think we`re assuming that at this point. It`s going to take a while to process that vehicle, to get it out of the crime scene and look at it. So I`m assuming they probably haven`t had time to really inspect the vehicle.

QUESTION: Can you tell us...

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: ... where the gunshot wound was?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know. I don`t know.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know that, either.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, I don`t know. Last we heard, he was not. He was being transported for medical attention. So whether he has deceased since then, I don`t know.

QUESTION: But it`s too soon to say that we should be thinking that this is over and resolved?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would say yes. I would say it`s too soon. I would say it`s definitely too soon. We need to make sure. We need to make sure everything -- all our -- all our -- you know, everything`s looked at and that we know for sure what`s going on here. But we don`t want people to stop calling in if they see something or if they hear something. Like they said earlier today at the news conference at 11:00, you know, we talked about if someone saw something, let us know. Let us know. It could really play an important part in this.

QUESTION: Did you give a time, what time you thought this happened?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Approximately 4:30.

QUESTION: At 4:30.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Approximately, yes.

QUESTION: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Anything else?

QUESTION: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s all we have.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Alisa and her family, quote...

GRACE: We are live at a press conference there in Missouri. That`s the St. Louis, Missouri, Police Department. You are hearing the latest. This little girl taken, taken from her front yard, 4-year-old Alisa -- miracle! Alisa found in the last hours wandering alone in the evening, shortly after our broadcast last night, at a closed car wash. The perpetrator had taken the time and the forethought to chop her hair off to look more like a little boy. You just saw video of her being taken into the hospital.

Let`s see that video again, Elizabeth. There you go -- little Alisa, looking just like a little boy, wandering alone at a closed car wash 80 miles from the spot from which she was taken, her own front yard. It is a miracle! Witnesses see that same dark-colored sedan pull up to the car wash, the girl gets out, and police are notified.

Straight out to Roy Harrison, Alisa`s grandfather. He`s joining us at their home, Louisiana, Missouri. Mr. Harrison, thank you for being with us. Tell us what happened.

ROY HARRISON, ALISA`S GRANDFATHER: I got a call in the evening, that night she was taken, a little bit after 8:00 o`clock. My daughter, Karen (ph), right here next to me, called me and said, I have a -- I just got a terrible call. Somebody`s taken Alisa. My heart went about through my throat.

We came down here. There was utter chaos for a while. People were trying to get things together. After a while, the law enforcement people got it going. They got the Amber Alert out, which is very important. All the law enforcement people were really working hard on it. Townspeople gathered up. It really was...

GRACE: Mr. Harrison, when did you learn Alisa had been found alive?

HARRISON: I learned that last night, right around 11:00 o`clock, I think, is when I got my call. And I called Alisa`s parents, Kimberly and Dave, and they verified it because they had been sent pictures from St. Louis (ph) County to make sure that it was her, and they identified her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They thought she was a boy because her hair had been cut short.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her hair was cut?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. Somebody that was scared of being caught and trying to hide.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just thankful -- thankful to God that she`s -- that he let her go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She is with her family, and from best I could tell, she`s in good shape.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... received a call from some individuals who reported seeing a young child, they believed to be a male child, in the old town Fenton area, near the Fenton car wash. Our officers responded there, and after conducting an interview with the child, realized this was indeed the missing child from Louisiana. The officer immediately conveyed the child to St. Claire (ph) Hospital here in Fenton, where the child was initially treated.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What we have right now is at approximately 4:30 this evening, this afternoon, we were -- officers were talking to an individual, actually approached an individual up in Lincoln County, in Hawk Point, Missouri, in reference to this particular missing person`s case, this abduction. As officers approached this individual, he pulled out a gun and shot himself. At that point, he was transported for medical attention. I don`t know his condition at this time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Last night around 10:00 PM, 10:45 PM, car wash, closed, dark, a dark sedan pulls up, about 80 miles from where little Alisa was snatched out of her own front yard. Her mother -- they couldn`t hold her back -- tries to chase the kidnapper. She didn`t catch him. Flash forward. The baby found alive. The perpetrator had taken the time and forethought to chop the girl`s hair off to make her look like a boy.

We just brought you the press conference live. I want to go out now to Rupa Mikkilineni, on the story. Rupa, how did they find this guy? Is it true he purchased some clothes. Were they clothes for little Alisa?

RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. Police aren`t saying specifically, as you heard in the press conference. But there are affiliate reports that indicate the tips -- and of course, you heard in the press conference that a tip led them to this individual.

But the tip that we`re hearing about from affiliate reports is that there was a purchase at a shop for clothing. And bear in mind, Nancy, this place, which is Hawk Point, is about 70 miles from Fenton. So this place is -- this perpetrator, if this is the man that kidnapped little Alisa, he was, at 9:45 PM last night at this car wash about 70 miles away. And then today, he was in Hawk Point, which is basically 70 miles -- it`s about an hour-and-a-half drive.

Now, apparently, this allowed them to track down some type of either vehicle or an address in Hawk Point, and they confronted him and he shot himself.

GRACE: So bottom line, Rupa, he did go and purchase clothes? I couldn`t hear you. Were they for the little girl or not?

MIKKILINENI: We don`t know. But what`s interesting is the family...

GRACE: Well, they had to be for the little girl because why would he suddenly, at a time like this, go and purchase clothes for himself? That doesn`t even make any sense.

MIKKILINENI: Right, and...

GRACE: Did he buy the clothes before or after the little girl was found?

MIKKILINENI: We don`t know the timing, but we do know that the little girl had a change of clothing on her. The man that kidnapped her, cut her hair and changed her clothing, Nancy.

GRACE: Cut her hair and changed her clothing. And hold on. I`m about to go to Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. From what I`m hearing, the guy`s name is Paul Sterling Smith. Now, that is what our affiliate has told us, 38-year-old Paul Sterling Smith. He is a convicted sex offender. One of those offenses, to my knowledge, is sodomy. We also know that he has just gotten out from behind bars on a drug offense.

Let me go now to Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. Ellie, I know this is all coming from our affiliate, but what do we believe right now? Who is this guy?

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. Well, our affiliate KMOV is reporting, as you said -- and let me read it right off of here -- that this is 38-year-old Paul Sterling Smith, primary suspect in this case. He`s a convicted sex offender, arrested -- or I`m sorry, released just last month on drug charges.

GRACE: Oh!

JOSTAD: Pleaded guilty in 1995 to sodomy, sentenced to 15 years in prison. They also say that at one point, he lived in an apartment in South St. Louis. Now, as you know, the location where Alisa was found was in the southwest suburbs of St. Louis. So he may be familiar with that area, if this is the guy.

GRACE: And Ellie, I did hear you right, he just got out last month on drugs?

JOSTAD: That`s correct. Just last month, according to the affiliate.

GRACE: Was that on a sentence or just an arrest?

JOSTAD: It`s not clear right now. It...

GRACE: So another...

JOSTAD: Yes.

GRACE: ... revolving door. Our affiliate telling us Paul Sterling Smith, 38-year-old convicted sex offender, took this girl!

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our investigation is going to continue. We need to get evidence from that vehicle, if there is any. We need to find out the actions and the whereabouts of this individual prior to him shooting himself. And we`re not going to stop the investigation just because one of the individuals we wanted to talk to shot himself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everybody`s smiling. Everybody`s happy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just -- I`m just -- now I can`t say nothing. I can`t even find words!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m going to pick her up and hug her and tell her I love her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At first, I had no sleep because I worried. And after that call, no sleep because I was too dang happy!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Every time I hear a phone ring, I think, They found her, they found her. And this time, it was true. So we`re getting Alisa back.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s unbelievable. God was watching over that baby.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can tell you, though, one bit more information. There was a dark-colored vehicle there in the -- at this residence, if you will. I can`t get into any more detail other than that. I know we released a lot of details about that car, such as wheel covers and loud mufflers and things like that. But right now, that`s considered evidence, that vehicle. But I will tell you it`s a dark-colored passenger car.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Our affiliates telling us the perpetrator is 38-year-old Paul Sterling Smith. He is a convicted sex offender. He had a 1995 sodomy conviction and just got out from behind bars last month. And oh, don`t worry. I don`t have to look up his rap sheet to tell you he got a reduced sentence. He wasn`t in for long. I already can tell you that right now because if he got 15 years in `95 and he just got out on a drug offense -- he was wandering the streets and cruising 4-year-old Alisa`s neighborhood when he stole her out of her front yard where she was playing with her 6-year-old brother.

He runs into the house -- Mommy and Daddy had just gone in to put dinner on the payable -- to say he took Alisa, his description amazingly accurate. Alisa found, praise the Lord, last night at a closed car wash, late at night, wandering around alone, her hair cropped short to make her look like a boy. She had a change of clothes with her.

We are taking your calls. Betty, Colorado. Hi, Betty. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, Nancy, thank you so much for taking my call. Melissa, my partner, and I watch you every single night. Quick kind of a two-part question.

GRACE: Yes, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Number one, is there a chance she was sexually molested in any way? And then what about the DNA, if they can trace that back to him or trace evidence with the cut hair?

GRACE: I`m sure that she has been tested at the hospital for sex molestation. We don`t have the results yet. We may never have them because she is a minor. As to DNA, the answer is, yes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SGT. AL NOTHUM, MISSOURI HIGHWAY PATROL: What we have right now is at approximately 4:30 this evening, this afternoon, we were -- officers were talking to an individual, actually approached an individual up in Lincoln County, in Hawk Point, Missouri, in reference to this particular missing persons case, this abduction.

As officers approached this individual, he pulled out a gun and shot himself. At that point he was transported for medical attention.

I don`t know his -- his condition at this time. I really do not have that information. I can tell you, though, one bit of more information, there was dark-colored vehicle there in the -- at this residence, if you will. I can`t get into any more detail other than that.

I know we released a lot of details about that car, such as his wheel covers and loud mufflers and things like that. But right now that`s considered evidence, that vehicle. But I will tell you the dark-colored passenger car.

Rick, you have anything else you`d like to add?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you know, obviously eight hours ago we had a press conference and we said we`re going to work very hard with a lot of different law enforcement agencies and we have. And we`re still going to continue that investigation.

This was an individual of -- a person of interest, call him a suspect. We -- it`s an individual we wanted to talk to, we can`t at this point so our investigation is going to continue. We need to get evidence from that vehicle if there is any.

We need to find out the actions and the whereabouts of this individual prior to him shooting himself. And we`re not going to stop the investigation just because one of the individuals we wanted to talk to shot himself.

We`re still continuing this investigation. We still would entertain any leads or any information that someone wanted to call us and still the same number at 889-2341.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: We are taking your calls live, but now to Carrie Doyle. This is Alisa`s aunt. Also with her, Roy Harrison. This is Alisa`s grandfather.

To you, Carrie Doyle, when did you first learn Alisa had been found alive?

CARRIE DOYLE, AUNT OF BABY GIRL, ALISA MAIER, FROM HOME WHERE GIRL SNATCHED FROM FRONT YARD: I would say I got the call around midnight. My youngest sister Sarah said a friend of hers said the information is going across the screen -- you know, the news, and she is very excited.

I mean, I ran completely out the front door, you know, saying, you sure, you know, and as soon as I was done, the next person in line I called was my dad to make sure he heard something.

GRACE: You know, you must have not really believed your ears when you first heard it because, do you know how many families out there with their child, their loved one missing? They --

DOYLE: Yes.

GRACE: They dream about that call. They actually physically dream about getting that call, about getting a call that there`s been a big mix- up, the baby is OK, the baby`s been found? But you got that call.

Joining us in addition to Carrie Doyle -- this is 4-year-old Alisa`s aunt -- is Roy Harrison. This is 4-year-old Alisa`s grandfather. They are braving the elements. It is pouring rain there in Louisiana, Missouri. And they are joining us tonight because Alisa has been found alive.

As we went to air tonight, in the last moments, the alleged perpetrator has been shot dead.

I want to go to Roy Harrison, Alisa`s grandfather. Tell me about the moment that you found out Alisa was alive.

ROY HARRISON, GRANDFATHER OF ABDUCTED BABY GIRL, ALISA MAIER, FROM HOME WHERE GIRL SNATCHED FROM FRONT YARD: Well, I got a call that -- from my daughter, who`s sitting right next to me, that they said that they found her.

I wanted to verify -- I couldn`t get a hold of any of the law enforcement because obviously they were very busy and working hard, but I called Dave and Kimberly, Alisa`s parents, and asked them and they said, yes, and it was her because they had taken some pictures of her and sent the pictures up here to Louisiana and show the pictures to them and you couldn`t miss the big brown eyes.

GRACE: How was it that she was discovered? What have they told you about the car wash, it`s 80 miles away, it was late at night, she was wandering around, her hair was cut short, she had on a change of clothes? Who -- who first spotted her?

HARRISON: Well, I don`t know who first spotted her. Apparently there were a couple of people right there at the car wash that had seen her get out of the car. That`s all I know.

Then the car took off. And they thought she was a young boy because the -- this person had cut her hair off, but then once the police officers got there, they realized that they had found Alisa.

GRACE: Everyone, joining us, Roy Harrison. This is Alisa`s grandfather. What are they telling you about this perpetrator, Mr. Harrison?

HARRISON: Well, what they`ve told me that he was a person of interest and they told me earlier when I talked to the highway patrol, they said that -- they relayed a message to me, actually, that he was a person of interest and they weren`t going to name him as an actual suspect until they had more evidence.

GRACE: And let me ask you think --

HARRISON: More substantial stuff.

GRACE: Yes. Is she -- is Alisa able to recount what happened to her?

HARRISON: She`s a bright, young girl. I`ve talked to the parents, Kimberly and Dave, on the phone and they said she has been talking to them a little bit. As to what she`s relaying to everybody, we don`t know.

GRACE: Yes.

HARRISON: They`re staying down there close to the headquarters they have down in St. Louis. Yes, in St. Louis now so that they`re -- they`re able to get people to her to talk to her.

GRACE: To Dr. Caryn Stark, psychologist, joining us out of New York.

Karen, a lot of times, psychologists, shrinks, psychiatrists will tell the parents don`t ask the baby questions. Why?

CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, because if you actually ask questions, you won`t get good answers out of a 4-year-old, Nancy. But it`s not true. What you need to do is tell a story. To do something that`s playful with her, and then you get better responses.

So if you`re talking about a little girl, somebody else who was taken away in a car, what could have happened that little girl? That`s how you do it.

GRACE: You know, Karen, when I would have child victims of a gamut of crimes, it doesn`t matter what, a lot of times we -- I would take them -- we`d go to my office and we would draw -- draw pictures and you wouldn`t come right out and say anything suggestive at all.

But you would just start talking to the child and draw pictures and kind of set up a scenario like you`re saying without asking them. And the story would unfold.

Let me ask you this, Caryn, everybody speculating was she molested, was she not molested? Bottom line is she`s alive, number one. That`s -- that`s the headline.

STARK: That`s right.

GRACE: But whatever occurred, whether she was molested or not molested, is there a chance that as she grows older that this will all fade away in her memory?

STARK: Well, it really does depend on how this experience was for her, Nancy. If she were not molested, I think that it would fade away. What she might remember, of course, is all the attention that is being paid to it.

She would have flashes, though. It wouldn`t be a memory where it would have a real beginning and a real end. If she were molested, there is a chance that she might have some flashes of that.

If she were younger than 4, I might say no. But 4, she might actually have some flashbacks.

GRACE: She may, but there is a chance that she may not, right, Caryn?

STARK: Yes.

GRACE: As time goes by?

STARK: It`s really hard to know. It`s really hard to know.

GRACE: If it`s handled the right way?

STARK: That`s most important part, Nancy. You`re absolutely right.

GRACE: OK, then tell me, how are you supposed to handle it? What`s the right way to handle it?

STARK: Is to turn it into a story or a play or a drawing like you said and give it a nice happy ending. And to turn it into something that she can absorb at this point as a good story, not a terrible story. So --

GRACE: I want to go back to Alisa`s aunt -- Caryn Stark, as always, thank you.

Dr. Stark joining us out of New York.

To Carrie Doyle. Carrie, I want to thank you for being with us tonight and last night for being with us and putting the word out to people about Alisa.

Carrie, what are they telling you --

DOYLE: I`m glad to be here.

GRACE: Yes. What are they telling you about this guy, this perpetrator that is now shot dead?

DOYLE: The only thing I know is -- I got the call, I was actually coming from St. Louis, actually, when I got the call from my husband. I was actually picking up Alisa`s great grandparents from California, bringing them to come visit and be with the family.

But my husband called me and he just said there was a suspect. He was either -- tried to commit suicide or he did commit suicide. I came straight to Louisiana, went to my aunt`s house, we went to my grandma`s and then they started talking about it a little bit more in the news.

So my information I`m getting is pretty much what you`re getting off from the news. I haven`t really had any contact of anybody telling me anything.

GRACE: Right.

Everybody, you`re seeing video beside Carrie Doyle there in the center of little Alisa being taken into the hospital. As you can see, her hair is cut short like a boy. She has on a change of clothes but the headline is she is alive.

As we go to break, happy birthday to tiny crime fighters, twins, Sonya and Savanna, celebrating their 3rd birthday today with a special as Tinker Bell. They love baby dolls, dress-up, "Dancing with the Stars," crafts, reading and reminding their mommy, Mindy, to turn on HEADLINE NEWS, HLN, at 8:00 p.m.

Happy birthday.

And thank you to Georgia friend, Hazel Wilson. At 90 years old she never misses the show. She loves her church, Mount Olivet Baptist. She loves the Atlanta Braves, spending time with four grandchildren and five greats.

Thank you, Hazel.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We received dozens and dozens of tips. And one of the tips gave us information on an individual driving the car that we thought we were looking for, and it was information that we thought was good.

We had the address of the individual, so it was at that point that we sent officers up there to talk to him.

Like I said, he was a person of interest in this investigation at the time the officers approached. It was at that time that he apparently shot himself.

NOTHUM: What we have right now is at approximately 4:30 this evening, this afternoon, we were -- officers were talking to an individual, actually approached an individual up in Lincoln County, in Hawk Point, Missouri, in reference to this particular missing persons case, this abduction.

As officers approached this individual, he pulled out a gun and shot himself. At that point he was transported for medical attention. I don`t know his -- his condition at this time.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Out to Evelyn in South Carolina. Hi, Evelyn.

EVELYN, CALLER FROM SOUTH CAROLINA: Hey.

GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?

EVELYN: My question is, I want to know, did they found the little girl in --

GRACE: Whoa. Turn off your TV, dear.

EVELYN: OK, I`m sorry.

GRACE: Or at least put it on mute. I mean I can hear it here -- thousands of miles away from South Carolina. What is your question?

EVELYN: I want to know did they find her in Missouri?

GRACE: OK. Out to Ellie Jostad. Ellie, exactly where was -- I know it`s 80 miles from her home.

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Right. That`s right, Nancy.

GRACE: Let`s see a map. Sorry. Go ahead.

JOSTAD: Yes. It was about 80 miles from her house. This was in suburban St. Louis, Fenton, Missouri, not very far at all. This is a suburban area. She was found in the parking lot of a gas station/car wash.

People thought it was a little boy out wandering by himself. That`s why the police were called. They quickly realized it was Alisa, however.

GRACE: You know what is a little odd? I`m going to unleash the lawyers. Susan Moss, family law attorney, child advocate in New York. Alan Ripka, defense attorney, New York. Carmen St. George, defense attorney, New York.

Susan Moss, I`m just wondering if her ordeal -- his initial plan was just starting because think about it. He altered her appearance to look like a boy. He bought another set of clothing so she would not be identified in the clothes in which she was kidnapped.

It sounds as if he was going to keep her around for a while. If he had just planned on attacking her and killing her, as is normally the case, he would not have gone to all the trouble of cutting her hair and changing her clothing.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY & CHILD ADVOCATE: And what worries me most is the fact that he cut her hair and, remember, this suspect was allegedly convicted of sodomy.

So I`m really worried about the true reason why he had cut her hair. Maybe it wasn`t just to keep her away from others and being discovered. Maybe it was for something more sinister.

But I think he knew he was going to be found so he put himself in the ground.

GRACE: You know, Sue Moss, as awful as a potential molestation -- will be -- would be for many of us that have been crime victims in cases that resulted in murder, you look at things differently.

And to me I know everyone is calling and e-mailing, was she molested, was she molested, the big headline is she is alive. And one day she`s going to realize how truly blessed she is to be alive.

Carmen St. George, sodomy, 1995, got a 15-year sentence. Just came out, the revolving door, on dope. Why was he cruising the neighborhood looking for little children?

You`re a defense attorney. Shed some light on it for me.

CARMEN ST. GEORGE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I`ve got to say that this is somebody definitely who was casing the neighborhood. He was looking for the scene, probably looking to see when she would be available, when she would not be around adults who might see her. And really kind of trying to find out when was the best opportunity for him to snatch her.

GRACE: To Alan Ripka, what do you think the judge that let him out or the jail that let him out on his drug offense is thinking about tonight? Oh, yes, they know the name, they recognize the face.

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, they sure do, Nancy. They`re sick to their stomach. The problem is --

GRACE: I don`t know about that. Because you know what, Ripka? It seems to me they`re always like, well, it`s not my fault. It`s nobody`s fault.

RIPKA: Well, you know --

GRACE: Nobody thinks, man.

RIPKA: You can`t jail people for life, Nancy. At the end of their day, it`s not their fault. They let someone out. They`re upset about it but you can`t jail them for life.

GRACE: Not their fault.

RIPKA: And at the end of the day, it`s the Amber alert that saved this girl`s life.

GRACE: Yes. Actually -- actually you can jail them for life. You can. A lot of jurisdictions, sodomy especially on a child carries a sentence of up to life, aggravated sodomy.

So, yes, as a matter of fact, Alan Ripka, in a lot of jurisdictions you can jail them for life. But in this case, they decided not to. And as a result, Alisa, 4 years old, was snatched out of her own yard. Thank God in heaven her family got the call last night that she is alive.

To Andrew J. Scott, what about it? Why wasn`t he behind bars for life?

ANDREW J. SCOTT, FMR. CHIEF OF POLICE, BOCA RATON, FL.; VP OF SCOTT- ROBERTS AN ASSOCIATES, LLC: You know, that`s the problem that law enforcement has always complained about, the correctional and justice system, is that the individuals that do the crime don`t serve all the time that they`re supposed to.

We see them come back out, commit these crimes and, Nancy, I`m just going to end this with, this is a storybook ending for law enforcement and the family. The child is returned safely. The suspect has shot and killed himself. It`s made life relatively easy for the entire system and the child`s back home safe.

So in our eyes, we go through this all the time, but it`s worked out for the betterment of everybody.

GRACE: To Dr. Gwenn O`Keefe, pediatrician, founder of Pediatricsnow.com.

Dr. O`Keefe, thank you so much for being with us. First of all, do you believe -- we`ve already talked to Dr. Caryn Stark. Do you believe that there is a chance, albeit slim, that this child will be able to go on and not remember what happened? Or do we want her to remember and deal with it? What`s your professional opinion?

DR. GWENN O`KEEFE, PEDIATRICIAN, FOUNDER AND CEO OF PEDIATRICSNOW.COM: You know, I feel similar to Dr. Stark but I think a lot depends on the intensity of the last 24 hours as well as what happens in the next few days and weeks and how the family copes with putting her back on a normal schedule and life.

Kids do very well if they can get back to their normal routine. And this family has through a very traumatic experience having this child taken from them. They are going to need a lot of community support and family support --

GRACE: Dr. O`Keefe, very quickly.

O`KEEFE: -- in helping them feel secure.

GRACE: What do you make of Alisa being released from the hospital so quickly?

O`KEEFE: I think that`s very reassuring. I think that they really feel comfortable with her physical exam and how she`s doing emotionally. So I think we can take that as a very good sign.

GRACE: I do, too.

O`KEEFE: And that bodes well for how she`s to do in the future.

GRACE: I do, too.

Everyone, as we go to break, we are taking your calls live. The headline, Alisa has been found alive.

And very quickly, I want to thank all of you for supporting my first novel, "11th Victim." You made a "New York Times" best seller. It has (INAUDIBLE) in paperback. And my proceeds go to Wesley Glen. They provide a home for the mentally handicapped.

And again, I have nobody to thank but you and the Lord above, of course. I hope you like the book.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re not saying this is our suspect. We`re saying he`s a person of interest. Therefore we`ll take any tip, any lead, anything we have on anybody that has any information.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: He shot himself dead. When a cop pulls up my driveway, I don`t shoot myself. Yes, he`s more than a person of interest. Let me just clue the police in on that.

Everybody, headline, Alisa, the 4-year-old baby snatched out of her front yard, she was out there playing with her brother. Her big brother, he was 6. Her parents had just gone in the house to put dinner on the table.

She`s been found alive at a car wash. Her hair cropped short to look like a little boy and a change of clothes.

I am now learning that the alleged perpetrator has a 1995 sodomy case on a 10-year-old. And in that jurisdiction, if the victim is under 12, it is a life sentence. So what was he doing walking around, cruising Alisa`s neighborhood?

I want to go back to Roy Harrison. This is Alisa`s grandfather. Tell me about your family`s reaction. Tell me what everybody`s saying. This is so rare for me that I get to ask a relative how happy are you?

HARRISON: We are ecstatic. I told people earlier that if I could do a back flip, I`d do that. But I`m afraid I`d hurt myself. When we get her back home and get the family together, we`re going to have this big barbecue, just have a good family togetherness. Get a lot of hugs and kisses. And we`re just -- I couldn`t be any happier.

GRACE: And Carrie Doyle, Alisa`s aunt, is with us. Again, I never get to ask this question. How happy are you, Miss Doyle?

DOYLE: Very, very happy. I -- like I said, when I was told, I ran out the front door. I don`t know where I was going but I ran out the front door. I was very excited. And I waited -- let my children sleep today and in a little bit -- because my youngest daughter was very, very upset over this whole ordeal.

Her and the two -- Blake and Alisa and my daughter are like three peas in a pod. But --

GRACE: Well, I`m so happy.

DOYLE: She was very happy that --

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: I hope you take a lot of pictures of them when they are back together.

Everybody, let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Adrian Avila, just 19, (INAUDIBLE), Alabama, served Kuwait. Awarded the Army Commendation Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terrorism Service Medal.

Smile lit up a room, passion for Army, he loved restoring cars. Leaves behind mother Donna, brothers Jonathan and Tristan, sister Alexis.

Adrian Avila, American hero.

Thanks to our guests and especially to you. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern, and until then, goodnight, friends.

END